Post by: powercat on August 26, 2009, 02:52:05 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvzSuSTRA2M
only one video on his Channel page
cat
Post by: powercat on August 26, 2009, 02:56:59 PM
this video shows the new invention of motion less generation of electric power it take 1.5 amps at 30 volts(45 watt) and produces 0.7amp at 220 volts (154watt) this device can be used to reduce your electri city bill slow down the meter this generator is world first solid state power generator please see the video and if you have any querries you can contact me on winsonali@yahoo.com if you wish to but one of these units for R&D purpose i will send you a unit imediatly i have already file the patent for any further question related to over unity , comparsion with magnacoaster vorktex , magnetic electric gererator, perpetual motion , tesla coil , high frequency or principal of bearden motionless generator please ask me i will send you details. the sole purpose fo sjowing this video is to promote free or low cost electricity you can reduce you electri bill upto 60% very easily
this power generation is based on my own theory of smart energy my email address is winsonali on yahoo
this unit can be directly connected to windmill and solar panels and this is a perfect solution for alternative energy
END
cat
Post by: hartiberlin on August 26, 2009, 07:39:36 PM
From the video, if it is not faked one can clearly see a power
amplification.
But he says, that he is using no magnets and no transformers,
so why does he call it a MEG ?
I have emailed him to come over here.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: jibbguy on August 26, 2009, 10:25:29 PM
What does it mean that he left the dimmer circuit (the white box) at the low power setting when disconnecting line power and connecting the device?
And what if he is using a much higher F to power the bulbs; and that could be why they are bright even at the low dimmer setting... And the meter can't read the higher F very well (because it was designed for "50 Hz")? That trick might work OK with incandescent lights, but not AC motors ;)
But anyway, in order to answer these questions properly, the wall meter needs to be inline with the line power input BEFORE the device not AFTER it... Not between the device & dimmer, and light bulbs as it appears to me to be in the video.
So it just could be a question of not doing his demo correctly for the attention of skeptics; or it could be a fraud. Another vid with a frequency meter or scope at the lights, and the power meter at the input to the device (BEFORE it not after it), should clear this up easily enough.
Post by: hartiberlin on August 26, 2009, 11:32:40 PM
Hmm, very interesting.
What does it mean that he left the dimmer circuit (the white box) at the low power setting when disconnecting line power and connecting the device?
Yes, he seems to feed his device the about 30 Volts phase triggered dimmer output AC.
Maybe he uses a rectifier in his device first to convert this to
DC and then process this DC voltage ?
I see some rectifier diodes at the left side of his unit.
Quote
And what if he is using a much higher F to power the bulbs; and that could be why they are bright even at the low dimmer setting... And the meter can't read the higher F very well (because it was designed for "50 Hz")? That trick might work OK with incandescent lights, but not AC motors ;)
Hmm, then the meter would probably show a lower frequency,cause it could not keep up...
Probably very unlikely..so he probably converts it back to 50 Hz in this case ?
Quote
But anyway, in order to answer these questions properly, the wall meter needs to be inline with the line power input BEFORE the device not AFTER it... Not between the device & dimmer, and light bulbs as it appears to me to be in the video.
No, the wall meter is before his device and after the dimmer , so it still reads a slow speed turning wheel, when he
runs his device.
Quote
So it just could be a question of not doing his demo correctly for the attention of skeptics; or it could be a fraud. Another vid with a frequency meter or scope at the lights, and the power meter at the input to the device (BEFORE it not after it), should clear this up easily enough.
Well, I agree, that it is a bit confusing and it needs better explanation and better audio quality.
Also scope shots would be great to see what is really going on.
Well from viewing it fullscreen you can only
see big caps some ICs and some (4 ?) power transistors or MOSFETs
on the board.
Also it seems that it still needs some external power supply
for the ICs as there is a black cable going to it from under the table.
This is not explained in the video but it is probably the power supply for
the ICs and switching circuits...
But a skeptic could argue, that the rest of the power comes from this cable...
Hmm...
We just need more information...
Post by: markdansie on August 27, 2009, 02:11:00 PM
Would be good to see if it can power a motor with the same results.
Mark
Post by: gyulasun on August 27, 2009, 03:04:16 PM
Looks really interesting.
From the video, if it is not faked one can clearly see a power
amplification.
But he says, that he is using no magnets and no transformers,
so why does he call it a MEG ?
I have emailed him to come over here.
Regards, Stefan.
Hello Stefan,
He does not call it a MEG he calles it a motionless generator (he does not include the "electromagnetic" word which the MEG has in the middle).
He has written an hour ago at his video link the following answer:
So how does this invention work ?
it works through software and follow a patern of switchinhg technology which boost the voltages from 30 volts to 220 volts but reduces current
during the process the the movement of electrons generates its own rersonance and a more power out comes out
the principal is some thing like negative resistor but the technique used is different
this is my own theory which i have converted into practical means
I hope he can come over to this forum and share some more, depending on his patent application...
rgds, Gyula
Post by: markdansie on August 28, 2009, 12:25:29 AM
I have been in email correspondence with the inventor.
He is very open about this. I am arranging for an engineer to go and check it out in the UK.
The wire going down powering the unit is 12 volts and runs at .25 amps (240MA)
The unit is scalable and been tested to 1000va so far with larger units planned.
I have no idea if this really works or not, or has been suggested it just tricks the power meter. Either way I would mind having one on my power meter.
if I get further updates and if the engineer checks it out I will inform you all
Mark
Post by: derricka on August 28, 2009, 03:57:35 AM
Hooking this circuit up to a wide bandwidth power meter, like a Clarke Hess 2330 Watt meter would be a great start. Lab grade meters such as these, are very tough to fool with unusual input waveforms or frequencies. Measuring DC power fed to an inverter of known efficiency, is another testing method. Anyway, hope to learn more about what is going on with this circuit.
Post by: hartiberlin on August 28, 2009, 04:01:34 AM
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?AudioUpdates
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: CTG Labs on August 28, 2009, 11:33:01 AM
This should be interesting! However, looking at the video, the 2 pin outlets, I would bet money that lab video was not filmed in the UK. Did he say that is where it was, or just where he is now?
Regards,
Dave.
hi all,
I have been in email correspondence with the inventor.
He is very open about this. I am arranging for an engineer to go and check it out in the UK.
The wire going down powering the unit is 12 volts and runs at .25 amps (240MA)
The unit is scalable and been tested to 1000va so far with larger units planned.
I have no idea if this really works or not, or has been suggested it just tricks the power meter. Either way I would mind having one on my power meter.
if I get further updates and if the engineer checks it out I will inform you all
Mark
Post by: markdansie on August 28, 2009, 01:02:54 PM
thanks for the audio. I agree with the general thoughts expressed by everyone re the testing. I have seen many people make the mistakes when it comes to testing energy in and out.
I do believe he is in the UK and I await his next email to have a visit organised by someone who knows how to measure input and output.
I will not speculate but history isnt on the side of this one.
will keep you updated.
Mark
Post by: markdansie on August 28, 2009, 01:24:33 PM
I found this quote from Bob Smith on another topic earlier this year. Please note the similarities in Ali's description on how his device works
2. Resonance
- which brings the frequency of oscillation in an inductor to a point where it not only multiplies its own input voltage at multiple harmonic levels, but becomes a kind of negative resistor or transducer of new ("outside") aetheric energy into electrical impulses.
(However, here the question arises: is this conventional "hot" electricity or "cold" electricity? [I would tend to think the latter]).
Post by: powercat on August 28, 2009, 02:28:37 PM
I enjoyed the audio. nice feature
in the video the guy says he is prepared to send a unit to anyone interested in testing,
though in your communications with him he is saying a generous donation is required ::)
He is also saying that he's invented a heater that uses 200 W and produces 1000 W heat,
hopefully he will be give you more information on the heater as well as the other unit.
all the best
cat
Post by: lltfdaniel1 on August 28, 2009, 02:41:14 PM
dear martin,
i do accept paypal
i will send you details of the packaging and instruction manual along with the device
i will send you the details shortly
if you wish to see the working unit you can see it i live in london we can arrange some time in this eway you can be comfortable before buying
winsonAli
Post by: powercat on August 28, 2009, 02:57:25 PM
Wow :o ;D
great work, now we are all very excited ;)
cat
Post by: fabver on August 28, 2009, 03:07:47 PM
Post by: lltfdaniel1 on August 28, 2009, 03:14:14 PM
Post by: powercat on August 28, 2009, 04:24:15 PM
doesn't that mean if the device doesn't do what he says it does you get your money back from
PayPal ?
cat
Post by: tinu on August 28, 2009, 04:45:00 PM
Post by: MasterPlaster on August 28, 2009, 05:30:00 PM
Post by: hartiberlin on August 28, 2009, 05:51:59 PM
DerrickA4mag:
@winsonal
Are you familiar with Power Factor? Most common electrical meters will give incorrect readings AC readings when current and voltage are significantly out of phase, or if power is being drawn at higher frequencies then the meter was intended to measure. I am just trying to establish your experience level with electronics, and if you are making a
fairly common (but understandable) measurement error.
winsonali:
i do know PFC very well both ACTIVE and PASSIVE this is the reason why i measure the input output current and voltages and establish the fact on the basis of those elements use of meter is to show the reduce billing
coming to the point that the load i have used in the video is purely resistive which exhibits a 1.0 PF(power factor so there is no distortion of phase and in our final design definilty we will include passive componenets to counter measure PFC issues
Post by: tagor on August 28, 2009, 06:03:58 PM
I wrote to him and asked to buy a device for evaluation and told him how I was going to test it but he did not write back. Either he is too busy or ....
yes
I write him to ask the same thing , no answer
@hartiberlin
can you ask him to test is device ?
and one of us can test it
or can we buy 2 , 3 ... protos for test ?
Post by: tagor on August 28, 2009, 06:07:25 PM
He is saying you can buy the device with PayPal
doesn't that mean if the device doesn't do what he says it does you get your money back from
PayPal ?
cat
but how to order it ?
do you know his paypal reference ?
Post by: powercat on August 28, 2009, 08:07:34 PM
I was only wondering about the PayPal rules.
lltfdaniel1 is the one who is in contact with him.
cat
Well this is from the inventor.
dear martin,
i do accept paypal
i will send you details of the packaging and instruction manual along with the device
i will send you the details shortly
if you wish to see the working unit you can see it i live in london we can arrange some time in this eway you can be comfortable before buying
winsonAli
Post by: powercat on August 28, 2009, 08:22:52 PM
I believe CLaNZeR is resident in the UK and would do a good job investigating the device.
Unfortunately my PM is not working ::) maybe you can contact him to see if he's interested.
cat
Post by: lltfdaniel1 on August 28, 2009, 08:47:58 PM
Stephan
I believe CLaNZeR is resident in the UK and would do a good job investigating the device.
Unfortunately my PM is not working ::) maybe you can contact him to see if he's interested.
cat
I live about 2 hours away from London..me being in bournemouth..i think clanzer lives nearer.
Post by: powercat on August 28, 2009, 08:56:55 PM
that sounds great lltfdaniel1 maybe you could team up and go together,
anyway my PM is not working so I can't contact clanzer
I think the sooner this device is verified the better
Cat
Post by: MasterPlaster on August 28, 2009, 10:36:28 PM
I just PM'ed you.
I live in the London and volunteering my services.
Dave (CTG-Labs) is also in London.
Post by: powercat on August 29, 2009, 05:22:09 PM
this is my first post on you tube i have got a very good response unfortunately i due to lack to resources i can't produce good qty at this moment
i haven't fixed any price coz its not yet ready for home or commercial user i was looking forward to give unit to like minded people for testing purpose free of cost, a donation for the cause may be appreciated any way i am in a difficult situation to select among very fine knowledgeable people to share the device i will respond to you very shortly END
Looks like one of best open invitation I have ever seen ;D
I hope you guys can get to together and visit winsonali soon
Cat
Post by: derricka on August 29, 2009, 10:04:02 PM
Post by: markdansie on August 30, 2009, 12:43:21 AM
appart from recieving the first email I have not heard from him since,
I have an engineer in London who we can use for testing as well , and am happy to contribute to the cost of any of you wanting to travel there or to purchase a unit for testing.
Mark
Australia
Post by: hartiberlin on August 30, 2009, 01:57:40 AM
answer again emails he wrote me.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: EMdevices on August 30, 2009, 02:21:54 AM
This device is fooling the meter, it's not free energy!
Somebody needs to be enlightened on how power meters work, but then their conscience might get activated. Stealing is not cool!
EM
Post by: CTG Labs on August 30, 2009, 10:57:36 AM
Lets not be so fast here!
Before he connects the device the frequency is normal.
When he does connect the device, the frequency is also normal.
THEN he removes the the device to show you again how dim the bulbs are on 30v and it is then that the frequency meter is off the scale.
So, if you go back to the moment he FIRST turns the voltage down to 30v, THAT is when the frequency needle goes up and the unit is not yet connected! (3 mins in).
In fact when he connects the unit, the frequency returns to normal.
Can it be his frequency meter does not like such low input voltage?
Regards,
Dave.
Why is the frequency meter showing two different readings?
This device is fooling the meter, it's not free energy!
Somebody needs to be enlightened on how power meters work, but then their conscience might get activated. Stealing is not cool!
EM
Post by: BEP on August 30, 2009, 01:59:25 PM
As such, it is a very dumb device. There is no fooling it. The 'fooling' is at the user side.
As supply voltage (also sensing voltage) ramps up the meter will swing from zero to off-scale then back to the line frequency reading. As voltage drops the meter will swing to off-scale then back to zero.
If this meter is a 120 or 220 volt meter then 30 volts would cause it to go off-scale or perhaps a bit less than full scale.
Not everything had a digital circuit in it.
Post by: markdansie on August 30, 2009, 02:05:53 PM
thanks for your observations.
What I ilke about this vs many other claimed OU projects as there is an opennes with the inventor and a willingness to both demonstrate and provide units.
Only time will tell if he has stumbled upon something that has eluded us for many years or their is something flawed that either he or us have not picked up in the measuring.
I hope you would be available to have a look at the device. If you like I am happy to Pay Pal a donation and have it shipped to you as I have the upmost respect for your efforts over the years.
Kind Regards
Mark
Post by: winsonali on August 30, 2009, 07:00:30 PM
1) this activity is taking place only when device is not connected and dimmer is set to its min value lets say 30 volts try this i your lab and you will find the same results
reason : these are very low cost meters and cannot cope with readings when duty cycle is very low to get 30 volts out of 220 volts through dimmer the duty cycle becomes 1:10 approx means actual voltage divide by 10. this meter is unable to sense proper frequency at this stage. Dimmers do not effect frequency they just play with duty cycle so the rms voltages goes down in simple terms average voltage goes down.
this situation has nothing to do with device. and
when device turns on it take the charge and frequency is adjusted through feed back controlled digital programed device so it stays 50 HZ with or without load
see the power of device what ever is happening at the input the out put is stable in terms of frequency and out put power
even at the moment the device needs lot of perfection which is only possible with feed back of such fine knowledgeable people on this forum
Post by: gyulasun on August 30, 2009, 07:52:14 PM
Welcome. How much more theory of your device could your share, beyond what you already mentioned at the youtube texts?
Thanks, Gyula
Post by: poynt99 on August 30, 2009, 08:28:50 PM
Coils are not required to perform power conversion. It can be done with capacitors as well, as I have shown on EF.
Most likely the only thing happening here is the power meter is being fooled. Do proper measurements and you may see something quite different.
.99
Post by: Omega_0 on August 30, 2009, 08:57:44 PM
Welcome. :)
Yes, that seems to be the correct explanation of behavior of the frequency meter. May be if you use a transformer with current limiter to bring the mains voltage down (instead of a dimmer), it will show right frequency. But thats a minor matter.
Main thing is, measurements... It can happen that some transient negative spikes or high frequencies are confusing the power meter. You need to remove it for the purpose of measurements and perform actual power measurements, to prove your claim.
You seem to be expert in electronics and have more than average knowledge about it, I hope you have a very useful invention here, overunity or not doesn't matter right now.
So the question is -
What is the RMS input power and RMS output power from your device ?
Post by: hartiberlin on August 30, 2009, 09:17:24 PM
I would say, that if you use a phase control dimmer like Ali
used and use it to reduce the 50 Hz sine frequency to reduce the
RMS to about 30 Volts and use this as the input for his "black box",
you just can not light up the lamps normally
to get them brighter again than the 30 Volts RMS would get them.
But Ali has done it to show them as bright as if he would power
them with 220 Volts.
Also the frequency meter suggests he is using 50 Hz when he powers the bulbs
with his device.
And as he posted he seems to convert the 30 Volts RMS phase cut controled sine wave
first to DC voltage and then uses his IC circuits to produce this
higher output 220 Volts 50 Hz sine wave again.
I am really curious what kind of effect he is using for it,
if he uses any kind of phase shifter circuit and quadrature modulation circuit
or something like this ???
As there seems to be no coils involved and just only capacitors, that seems
to be a pretty intelligent circuit...
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: EMdevices on August 30, 2009, 11:05:17 PM
Notice the voltage coil needs phase correction (since it's an inductor) and we want it to respond in phase with the voltage. It's possible to create an output device that will mess with the phases and cause the meter to not work properly, which is what this motionless generator "invention" is doing.
EM
Post by: winsonali on August 30, 2009, 11:52:37 PM
there are two coils
1 is voltage coil produce current lagging by 90 degree phase shifting to produce eddy current it works on ac only
2 is called current coils that is 3 turns in down coils that works as multiplier
if power factor distrubs it will give more reading and inceases electric bills that why in factories where they have induction motors they employ power factor capacitors to reduce electricity bill so producing distrubance in power factor increase meter speed rather slowing it down
if power factor is with in limits capacitor do not play any role but again cause electricity loses so an automatic powerfactor correction system is necassary to get the real power and apperant closer to get accurate billing
conclusion
A) powerfactor dose effect meter reading but always increases the speed it never reduces the speed real power = v * I/ pf and if power factor is one meter give accurate reading
B) if by just using a dimmer meter speed can be slow downed all enegy theives use this technique
and this is not known till yet only way to steal elec. power to cut the nuetral from meter and ground it but now a days all all power companies ground the meter in such a way that this effect is not working any more the only way to get enegy is by generating through any of the following means wind solar hydro... or the new techiques we are developing
i am preparing a docuement to establish testing procedure for the device i will send it to stefan and once we are agreed with inputs from experts we will conduct testing
regards Ali
Post by: FatBird on August 31, 2009, 12:50:52 AM
LOOK at the VERTICAL BEAM of LIGHT.
Notice that a CCD Video Camera picks up the OverUnity Cold Electricity AETHER VORTEX Spin when Light Bulbs are powered. Our eyes CANNOT see it in Person, BUT the Video Camera CCD CAN see it.
Notice that Floyd Sweet's VTA had the spinning vortex. SM's TPU had it, & now Winsonali's invention also has it.
PLUS, look close at Winsonali's CLOSE UP Photo & the actual Aether Vortex SPIN can be seen.
Absolutely Amazing!!!
.
Post by: BEP on August 31, 2009, 04:13:24 AM
Blow this off if I sound like I'm trying to burst your bubble:
When I saw this vertical bar I recognized it as indicating something about this device but not OU. If this indicates OU then all the eye burning, blue/Violet car headlights on newer cars are OU as well.
Google 'MTF' (Modulation Transfer Function). This is basically the inability of the CCD cell to perform its job of averaging pixel color. This can happen because the area color is changing rapidly (almost square-wave) or the light spectrum for the pixel is approaching the upper limits of the CCD camera.
Maybe it is an indication of OU. I don't know. It does tell me this device is probably applying a very high frequency to the bulb. Perhaps only as 50Hz modulation of a very high frequency carrier but their is high frequency there.
I see this in visible light, IR and 'other' types of digital cameras.
As far as the vertical streaks on the older videos.... probably just lens polarization of glare.
Hopefully I'm wrong.
BEP
Post by: markdansie on August 31, 2009, 04:46:31 AM
thank you for joining this forum
Mark Dansie
Post by: CTG Labs on August 31, 2009, 12:24:03 PM
Thank you for the generous offer, I would of course love to test this unit if it is possible!
Regards,
Dave.
@Dave,
thanks for your observations.
What I ilke about this vs many other claimed OU projects as there is an opennes with the inventor and a willingness to both demonstrate and provide units.
Only time will tell if he has stumbled upon something that has eluded us for many years or their is something flawed that either he or us have not picked up in the measuring.
I hope you would be available to have a look at the device. If you like I am happy to Pay Pal a donation and have it shipped to you as I have the upmost respect for your efforts over the years.
Kind Regards
Mark
Post by: markdansie on August 31, 2009, 02:10:40 PM
no problem at all. I will await Ali's next email to see if it is more convientient for you to test it at your labs or you travel to him. If you do have to travel to him I am happy to compensate you for your time and travel.
i will be calling him tommorrow (your Tuesday)
I am also looking at getting a second unit for testing in Australia
Kind Regards
Mark
Post by: markdansie on August 31, 2009, 02:20:57 PM
I just realised my email address was wrong here
Drop me a line anytime
markdansie@bigpond.com
Post by: winsonali on August 31, 2009, 04:43:04 PM
i need your suggestions for testing any further
the 50 hz discrepancy as discussed earlier fr. meter showing full scale at 30 volts or goes full scale as we lower the dimmer duty cycle, this effect is due to dimmers duty cycle and device has got nothing to do with it, dimmers do not alter frequencies.
to use device with batteries or solar panel we have to convert them into A/C first before feeding to device
one thing more device require 12 volts to operate its circuit at 250 milli amps
now i need suggestion from all experts ,on testing points and procedures
in the video i have only used bulbs but while testing device we have used fan as well to check use of inductive load as well
in the description i have written what loads we are using
Post by: fabver on August 31, 2009, 04:53:37 PM
can you use 10 AAA battery as input power and light a 100W 220Volt light bulb for 10 min and put a video on youtube ?
Post by: CTG Labs on August 31, 2009, 04:54:38 PM
Thank you for information. So from this we can see that the output is also sine wave, the device does not output square waves or some such?
I wonder if you could use a 12v battery and an AC inverter with dimmer on the input? This way we could see plain DC input power?
Then on the output we can measure across known resistive load, or perhaps rectify and filter to DC and measure across resistive load so we can read only DC levels to make the measurements clearer, just to elliminate any possible power factor or meter tricking?
Of course, we can really say that no measurement is enough in this kind of research with the ultimate question being, does it run itself in a closed loop or perhaps by using two batteries, one to run one to charge with auto-relay switching circuit to swap them.
Are you able to show oscilloscope shots of the input and output using current shunts, etc?
Of course it would also be helpful for us to see the circuit diagram, but not sure how you feel about releasing that as yet?
As you have no coil, no transformer, I wonder how you get sine waves out? You have a bridge rectifier and 3 large electrolytic caps with several mosfets so I would have thought to see some pulsed signals on the output? How the voltage is stepped up to 220v and made in to sine waves with this!
Regards,
Dave.
Post by: EMdevices on August 31, 2009, 05:42:40 PM
Watt-Meter Characteristics
The mechanical watt-meters obviously have an aluminum disk that spins under the influence of the torque generated from the interaction of the two primary eddy currents,
1) the "voltage" coil induced flux in the disk, and
2) the "current" coil induced flux in the disk.
These two fluxes, and the eddy currents they produce in the disk, interact with each other and produce a torque on the disk proportional to the product of the in-phase components of V and I, which gives the real power flowing into the load.
Now, there is also a magnet dampener, which provides a retarding force on the disk, and it's force is proportional to the velocity of the disk. All these forces balance out to result in the correct rate of turn of the disk.
By observation, and common sense (hopefully) it should be obvious that this device has a low frequency response characteristic. For example the disk can't accelerate too fast, it has a lot of rotational inertia, the voltage and current coils have large inductances so they don't do well with high frequency (high of a voltage drop across them, v = L di/dt)
Now, as we hopefully all know, impedance matching is preformed at a particular frequency, since the inductance and capacitance reactances depend on it. So, if you change the frequency you render the meter inaccurate and ineffective.
However, the most important point is the fact that a DC current through the "current" coil won't induce eddy currents in the disk and it too renders the device inaccurate. This is a key concept. If we draw current from the device synchronized with the AC waveform on only one polarity, then we will have an average DC current flowing through the meter which won't be recorded. The DC current will in fact break the disk just like the magnet dampener. This I believe is the trick to this device.
Just to get you thinking here's a diagram I made of the possible connections. Like I said before, this is not free energy, just fooling the meter. If that's what you want to do then by all means explore this technology, but I don't think it's ethical.
EM
Post by: winsonali on August 31, 2009, 05:45:23 PM
my basic aim when designing this device was to cut down the energy bills for home user never give a second thought of ultimate other uses which i am exploring over here
use of 10 aaa batteries or giving feed to do self buck boost i have not tried
as all of you guys know this is not complete yet and i am doing more and more research
the diagram i have posted is to just show how i have tested the input output voltages and currents
any further development converting DC into AC then using it will increase the span of time
although we have to do it to use it with solar panel i am financially stuck so no further research is affordable at this stage until and unless i find some source of income or get some donations by providing some units to other people working in the same field risking all my work could go away but this is what is fate any way its just a matter of time i will get this thing up and running.
do you remember war of currents DC vs AC or edison vs tesla many technologies are underway but some time i wonder why they are not there in the market
fruit for thoughts how i have done this try to develop a syphon in electronics you can do what i have done.
Post by: winsonali on August 31, 2009, 06:15:35 PM
1 = there is no fooling with meter reading i have eliminated power meter in my testing diagram
2 = No DC is feeded into power meter input is AC output is AC in circiut i have DC for control
3 = turn off all lights in your home and put one dimmer and a light turn the dimmer to full scale so bulb will be in full bright condition and check (after the dimmer) frequency , voltage and current then note meter speed
Now
turn the dimmer to min. scale and check frequency , voltage and current then note meter speed
you will find
meter is moving slow , voltage is very low , current is also low....
now after dimmer if you put my device you will get in output full voltages(220) and appropriate current as per load on 50 hz so there is no fooling with the meter i am not sending any signal back to meter or nor i am using DC voltage with meter .
one thing more if i feed 220 volts AC directly to my device it makes 2000+ volts and destroy load and it self i have gone through this many times
i respect your knowledge in metering devices i my self have developed a web based multi tarrif power meter for client and during designing it was measure issue how to identify electricity stealing ,
i hope you know better then me that these power meter are very accurate devices and hard to be fooled around feeding low frequency or high frequency is not simply possible, think of live wire communication devices they cannot effect meter reading now shortly you will see LAN operations over live wires they donot effect meter readings as well.
i tell you one thing i am an expert in designing mechanical aspects of life in electronics ask me to design anything i will do that in my system i have designed a siphon in electronics every metal wire have free electrons available find a way to align them you will be able to produce energy.
Ali
Post by: EMdevices on August 31, 2009, 06:43:50 PM
I am not saying you input DC current through the watt-meter, please don't misunderstand, what I am saying is that a DC current results when you synchronously load and unload your device. This average DC current fools the meter.
If you say that you have eliminated the watt-meter then that is great and you might have something more interesting then. I suggest you use an oscilloscope, that way we can see the full waveforms and we can do our own calculations of power flow.
Also, I'm not sure what you mean by a "siphon" in electronics, can you explain?
EM
Post by: winsonali on August 31, 2009, 07:24:29 PM
i do understand that SMPS (switching mode power supplies DC converters) in computers, badly effect power factor thats why the european union put a ban on chinese power supplies until and unless they are properly certified for PF close to 0.9 min. when a PF changes meter reading go faster because realpower = V * I /pf for example if voltages are 220 ad current is 1 amp the power is 220 watt when pf is 1 now if pf is 0.5
lets see what happens real power = 220 *1 /0.5 = 440 watts so if pf is changed you will pay more not less and pf more then one is not possible
if PF is low power companies become in trouble coz then they have to transfer more current to meet the real power then apparent power so they put penalties if power factor is below 0.8
i am an ex proffessor from an engineering university and have very clear vision of electronics and mechnical systems
220 volt coil in meter is parallel connected called activator magnet it can only make path for magnetic field so if there is no load it won't coz movement on disk even voltages are applied
current coil is called multiplier so disk only move when current flows so in this way it acts as power = V* I
what is siphon
if you want to get some fuel out of motor bike tank you put a pipe in it and suck it from other end then the fuel will start flowing to a lower destination but it will fly up in pipe for transition time this is called siphon i have develop this method in electronics and handling current in this way.
amazingly i got success my concepts are different from all other people working in this area
i have some other inventions as well but will show them after the successful trials of this one.
Ali
Post by: EMdevices on August 31, 2009, 08:02:35 PM
the power factor is P/S = |cos th|, where 'th' is the phase angle between the current and voltage, as you probably know. S is the complex or apparent power, and P the real power. Having a PF = 1 means the voltage and current are in phase, which means that our load is purely RESISTIVE.
The reason the electric companies want all devices to have as high a PF as possible is so that there won't be looses in the network due to the extra useless reactive currents that flow. This has nothing to do with how much they charge you, you still get charged only for real power (within the accuracy of your watt-meter of course) For example, if you have a low PF due to a capacitive load, you will still be charged the correct amount, but the currents will be a lot higher then they need to be due to the reactive current that flows back and forth.
I now see what you mean by a siphon, thanks.
EM
Post by: winsonali on August 31, 2009, 08:30:00 PM
thanks for this explanation please explain a little bit more about how PFC units in factories and other places reduce your electricity bills and normally defined that you can save upto 30% of your bill by employing power factor correction units.
thanks and regards
Ali
Post by: EMdevices on August 31, 2009, 08:37:36 PM
let's not get carried away with the power factor discussions.
You demonstrated a video with a watt-meter. I am telling you that you can fool the watt-meter with high frequency switching. Are you telling me you don't use switching? Also, have you tested your device with another type of power meter? I suggest you use an oscilloscope to see the instantaneus voltage and current.
regards,
EM
Post by: winsonali on August 31, 2009, 09:04:43 PM
you are right we shouldn't get ourselves involve in power factor issue
all the discussions are related to increase our knowledge base so please don't get offended
what i means to say that "-According to you -If high frequency can fool watt meter then 80% of devices in our homes use SMPS that use high frequency switching
in our test for device we will not use watt meter for sure.
as far as oscilloscope shots are concerned we will do it
what we need testing procedure to establish fairly the results of the device i hope you can help us in this and send us step by step procedure for testing my device
Ali
Post by: EMdevices on August 31, 2009, 09:43:54 PM
take a look at my diagram. This is very simple to do. Just make sure you use a high wattage resistor for your application. If you don't have a calibrated load resistor, then do the same to the output, i.e. use a series resistor to measure current, in addition to the voltage.
Just post the oscilloscope shots and we can calculate the power ourselves.
One comment about SMPS supplies, they have a rectifier bridge, and current flows on both the positive and negative cycles, then there is usually a choke to suppress the high frequency currents from traveling back out to the grid, so if they're designed correctly they won't put out a lot of interference. But if you just connect and disconnect a capacitor at a high frequency to the line, and especially if you do it on only one polarity, you will have an average DC current flow. This will be able to pass through the induction watt-meter and it won't be accounted for. "Free energy", no not really, just fooling the meter.
EM
Post by: hartiberlin on August 31, 2009, 10:15:22 PM
do you claim, that ALI´s device can fool the triac in the
dimmer circuit ?
Do you claim, that although the dimmer is set to 30 Volts chopped AC
Ali´s circuit is somehow "electronically" opening longer the TRIAC in his
dimmer circuit ?
I guess this is the only way I would see that his circuit could "jam" back the dimmer
and the meter won´t show it ?
So then the only way to measure it right would be the way to feed
ALI´s circuit with a pure 30 Volts DC input source.
Then use an analog input current meter directly at the 30 Volts DC source ( e.g. battery)
and after the input current meter go to lowpass filters
before going into ALI´s input circuit.
This way any RF from the input might now disturb or jam back the input
current meter cause it is filtered via the lowpass filter.
So we can measure pure DC input power by just multiplying Volts x Amps.
This would be the best input power measurements.
Surely the best and most accurate and easiest output power measurement
would also be a DC measurement.
So it would be preferred to use a brigde rectifier and a charge cap and
measure this way across a load resistor pure DC output power levels.
The charge cap needs to be big enough, so there will be no ripple from
the 50 Hz at the load resistor.
So if Ali could do these measurements, maybe using 2 x 12 Volts batteries
in series as the input, he might get a much better power measurement setup
that is more reliable.
Regards, Stefan.
P.S. The siphon effect sounds very exciting and I wonder how this will
work for electrons ?
Please post more infos, if you can.
Many thanks.
Post by: gyulasun on August 31, 2009, 10:18:31 PM
I am sure you are careful but let me notice to use 1:1 mains isolator transformer for the oscilloscope or a 220V/30V transformer for your device to defend you equipment from braking down when connect the ground test probes of the scope to the mains input of your device.
STEFAN: Ali's device needs 30V AC input, doesn't it? He wrote it in Reply #50..
rgds, Gyula
Post by: hartiberlin on August 31, 2009, 10:27:33 PM
Hi Ali,
I am sure you are careful but let me notice to use 1:1 mains isolator transformer for the oscilloscope or a 220V/30V transformer for your device to defend you equipment from braking down when connect the ground test probes of the scope to the mains input of your device.
YES, BE VERY CAREFUL when measuring without a 1:1 mains isolator transformer.
I also blew up a fuse when I forgot this once and it made a real loud bang and spark
and could have killed me...!!!
Quote
STEFAN: Ali's device needs 30V AC input, doesn't it?
rgds, Gyula
Well, as I have seen rectifier diodes and big caps at the input of his
circuit, I guess it could also work with pure DC input ?
I am still only guessing...
Ali is this right ?
As far as the TRIAC outputs only phase chopped AC it would
be surely wiser to first rectify this to DC get a more stable input signal...
to work from on..
but I surely don´t know, how ALI´s circuit works yet....
Post by: gyulasun on August 31, 2009, 10:30:29 PM
Post by: winsonali on August 31, 2009, 11:26:44 PM
if i just feed directly 220 volts the out put will be 2000 volts +
i have blown many circuit while testing
to create siphon effect A/C supply is required
simple testing can be carried out by putting multi meter at 30 volts input line and a tongue tester to measure the current at the same time.
then test the output in the same way
it will be all clear in a min.
i am going to include inductor in the input to suppress the PF issue and remove the watt meter for testing purpose
Post by: EMdevices on September 01, 2009, 01:10:09 AM
Another thing, induction watt-meters are not designed to handle DC, it is strictly an AC instrument. So if we get a average DC current to flow, it is apparent it will not register correctly.
To answer your question, he doesn't "fool" the triac, whatever that means, all he has to do is only let current flow during one polarity only. So when the AC waveform goes positive it will be off untill the triac turns on based on the phase, etc.., then he can perform quick boost conversions, a rapid pulse train, then as the AC voltage waveform decreases in positve voltage and is about to change polarities, he stops the boost conversion (which won't work anyway in reverse), he just waits till the AC input waveform is positive again, and starts all over. So, conversion happens on only the positive cycles of the chopped AC input waveform. This represents a DC current which won't register properly in the meter.
EM
Post by: hartiberlin on September 01, 2009, 01:55:32 AM
during the positive polarity wave , when the TRIAC conducts during the rest of the chopped
positive wave ?
How do scamming devices work, that reverse the turning of the Wattmeters
in principle , I wonder then ?
(Okay, it is not relevant to this thread, but maybe would help to understand
this device even more ?)
Post by: EMdevices on September 01, 2009, 03:30:01 AM
To answer your Ali question, yes, you got it, that's what I'm saying.
EM
Post by: markdansie on September 01, 2009, 03:44:46 AM
I will leave EM, Stephan and Dave to discuss with you ways of measuring and debate the explanations. they are far more qualified than me in these areas (if I had 10% of their knowledge I would be blessed)
However one things puzzles me, it is a question I ask when assessing any device that claims to generate or amplify energy. That is where is the extra energy comming from?
In the case of Black Light Power and the research at Rowan University, I can see how they have found a way to harness the conversion of hydrogen into a power source (they use a catylst to shrink the spin orbit of the electroton) and it is explainable.
However in your case I am not sure how you explian the extra energy being generated.
For instance we can turn mechanical work into electricity at lets say 90% efficency. We can turn that electricity back into work at say 80% efficency . That give us a loss of 28% overall. It is reasonable to asume we can recover a percentage of those losses by many means. But to go up by 400% needs explaining.
I mean no offence in anyway asking these questions in a simplistic way.
Mark
Post by: Goat on September 01, 2009, 04:51:03 AM
Please take no offense on the following suggestion.
Open a Paypal account with a donation button so I can donate to your cause. If you have a prototype for other people here on the OU site to test I would be glad to donate some of my funds towards a test project.
Regards,
Paul
Post by: winsonali on September 01, 2009, 06:07:25 AM
The suggested circuit posted by EM is a simple DC to DC converter commonly available
they do not increase energy, the coil acts as unipolar transformer and back EMF generates an increase in elevated voltages stored in cap. and released after words highly freq. switching results in ripple free supply.
These type of circuits are commonly available from market place.
Net metering is the next issue discussed by fellows in net metering you have to inform power company. a feed back voltages to grid from DC to DC converters are not possible.
its also very clear from the video that its uncut and original so there is no possibility of any hidden battery or coil
EM definitely a very intelligent person and trying to understand the working principle of the device but with an approach to find flaw, hidden gimmickry in device just like a magicians trick.... and its all natural ,when Tesla told everyone about AC current all DC lovers went against him its all written in history
a coil's back EMF/or transformer is not siphon coz transformer can step up or step down voltages, siphon is a one way phenomena, fruit for thoughts....
i think we should concentrate on practical demo where things unfold automatically rather then speculation
i am a practical result oriented person
for EM and others I have not carried out any synchronized switching with grid or switching in only one polarity
i am seriously thinking to develop a DC operated circuit as well
Post by: winsonali on September 01, 2009, 06:21:02 AM
====So how does this invention work ?
it works through software and follow a pattern of switching technology which boost the voltages from 30 volts to 220 volts but reduces current
during the process the the movement of electrons generates its own resonance and a more power out comes out
the principal is some thing like negative resistor but the technique used is different( i call this siphon)
this is my own theory which i have converted into practical means
a summary of my theory says;
electrons are present in every metallic body the can be aligned through various means
once they are aligned means they have attained potential difference the aligning force is directly proportional to the power,
the aligning forces are categorized in 2 different sub sets
1 motion less /solid or liquid state
2 magnetic or moving coils
my method falls under category number 1
where a further details can be sent to serious peoples
Post by: markdansie on September 01, 2009, 06:51:12 AM
Thanks for posting what you did to Stepan (I already had read that)
I have found over many years that my role is to ask the obvious dumb questions. Often understanding is burried in simplicity.
I guess the key is as you stated you are increasing voltage but reducing current. So is the overall energy available on your output is the same? Ie 30 volts at 7.3 amps say (220 watts) vs say 220 volts at 1amp (220 watts). Am I missing something here?
So is it possible at this stage to explain the increase in overall energy if what I stated above is not correct. If you syphon something you are just moving it from one place to another but not adding to it as you do
Mark
Post by: winsonali on September 01, 2009, 07:23:58 AM
"you are increasing voltage but reducing current"
REPLY:always remember you can provide voltage to some load but the current is defined by the load it self
explaining further: in a 220 volt socket you can plug 1000 watt heater it will draw 4 to 5 amps
at the same time if you put 100 watt bulb it will draw 0.5 amps approx.
so voltage is provided , current is the drawn from the line according to the load.
in watt meter voltage coil only open the path for magnetic flux but current coil make the movement to see how much wattage is being consummed.
in my device i am providing it 30 volts
when we conduct a test of 160 watt at output source of our device it was giving us 220 volts at 0.7 amps approx.
and when we check the current at the input the voltages are 30 volts at 1.5 amps
RESULTS:
input = 30 *1.5 = 45 watt (in a simple approach not going in complexity at the moment)
output = 220 * 0.7 = 154 watt (you see amps gone down from 1.5 to 0.7 this is very natural)
Now with in the device the switching is in a very specific way, causes a resonance and more charges aligning themselves then in a conventional manner
telling you truly when i was conducting these tests i was knowing that charges are there but they are not in flow and i have to find a way to make them flow or convert them as workable PD(potential difference )
mechanical example of situation: you have bath tub full of water the top is open water cannot flow out from top if you make a whole in bottom of the tub it will flow (natural) now i have to make water flow from top. if i can do the same in electronic means what i have achieved is creating PD with non aligned electrons.
i am in the middle of writing the thesis about my theories and there practical conversions so i will not discuss these concepts any further until i arrange to publish them
i am not saying that i am a very intelligent man but i am learning as well an argument for argument will waste our own time rather then a simple practical output if my device is working and have potential soon it will be there in market its just a matter of time
i think my idea to givel the unit for R@D purpose to get hold of some funds as donation to noble cause to further carry out research was not a good idea
coz according to my professional ethics i will not give unit to any one until he is satisfied and knows what he is getting
and people around me are not able to digest the new concept here, i should carry on my work and take it to a completion level
strange enough no body asked me ,what is the next level in development if its working why not i start producing it
the difficulties;
the behavior of the unit is purely like a generator you off load it, the voltage rises we need to develop an AVR
loads like air conditioners turns on the compressor and turns off this could seriously effect the process, an instantaneous response to load variation is required to be incorporated with in device
device cannot work without load it will destroy it self (resonating frequency) we need to include dummy load to balance the device and harness the appropriate output according to current dissipation.
if output load increase from the capacity of input source the unit destroy it self
things are not so simple as it seems, a lot more work is required before the device is ready for market
i posted the video on you tube when i saw magna coaster video, i did wrong i should complete the device by burning more of my own fuel to reach the destination , rather then giving people half cooked device i think i should get hold of some project to make enough money to complete my unit then sky is the limit.
thanks to everyone
Ali
Post by: markdansie on September 01, 2009, 07:49:49 AM
thank you for your patience and explanation.
what time is a good time to phone in GMT time. If you are in England at the moment you are either up very early or very late.
Kind Regards
Mark
Post by: robbie47 on September 01, 2009, 09:45:21 AM
Thanks for all this information and sorry to ask you even more questions. This is too fascinating to only watch and read ;)
I have following questions for you so we all can better understand what your circuit and software actually does:
- What is the range of the switching frequency of your circuit?
- You mentioned in your video that no transformer or coil is used in your circuit. How can you obtain resonance even if you apply a pure resistor load like a light bulb? Does the coil of the Wattmeter play a role too?
Post by: exnihiloest on September 01, 2009, 10:44:52 AM
...
i am in the middle of writing the thesis about my theories and there practical conversions so i will not discuss these concepts any further until i arrange to publish them
i am not saying that i am a very intelligent man but i am learning as well an argument for argument will waste our own time...
Hi Ali,
Then why have you rendered public your experiment?
As in such claims of extroardinary results, the usual problem are measurement errors (if not a scam), imho the first thing to do before writing the theory is to let duplicate the experiment by others to confirm the results. This implies to release a accurate schematics that any electronics engineer could use. It would avoid wasting of time in blah.
Post by: winsonali on September 01, 2009, 11:04:17 AM
please do not get offended by all means i didn't mean to hurt anyone
i have discussed every thing very openly and have also mentioned where i am stuck, i have to finish the working by myself. well scams, measurement errors , tricking the meter , wrong theories , they all have one simple answer a complete product.
Post by: robbie47 on September 01, 2009, 11:52:21 AM
If you need help from an experienced electronics engineer but want to take it offline, just PM me.
Post by: winsonali on September 01, 2009, 11:57:41 AM
the LC circuit is one of the method to generating frequency, the other way is digital oscillator i have develop a digital circuit with feed back control you can see multiple capacitors in circuit this is where we are storing charges as a water tub and through siphon the level is raised to new voltage levels remember destination is going to be a lower level then initial start up otherwise it won't work
in our test i will not use watt meter the video was to show a lay man that less energy is consumed
for technical peoples measurements and numbers are good enough to establish results.
regards
Ali
Post by: robbie47 on September 01, 2009, 01:27:12 PM
Is the output frequency 50Hz with sinus wave shape or square wave shape?
Post by: hartiberlin on September 01, 2009, 01:50:43 PM
sounds like you use the principle to load 2 caps in parallel and then switch
them in series, so you double the voltage, more like voltage doubler circuit.
Normally current just halves, so the power stays the same, but maybe you invented
some kind of strange MOSFET controlled switching frequency, that raises
the switching frequency
with some kind of feedback loop, so more charges in the caps are transfered to the
higher voltage potential ?
But what when you run out of electrons from the bigger first cap ?
I still don´t understand the Siphon effect.
Your example with the bathtub sounds logical, but does not make much sense
to me, cause in this case you might get only a potential energy difference for maybe
50 cm when you draw the water over the top
instead of in the bottom of the bath tube.
But if you would make a Siphon like using a hose and put the hose from under the bathtube
water surface first 3 Meters higher and then going from there
lower than the lower bathtube exit hole, you will definately draw first the water 3 Meter higher
and then the water goes over the top in the 3 meter higher hose and then will flow
down the rest of the hose to the output of the hose, which is lower than the upper
water level.
Now if you have found a trick how to trap some of the water there at 3 Meter higher level
and build there a storage before it is going down and keep sucking up more water higher
than goes down at the other side and thus get more and more water to the 3 Meters top,
this would be interesting.
So now the question is, how do you do this Siphon effect electronically with Electrons.
As it is your secret you will probably not tell us yet.
Well, maybe the best solution would be to design it this way, that you
really use a 12 Volts or 3 x 12 Volts battery in series= 36 Volts DC input power
source, so you can show it with a better measurement DC power input.
P.S: Did you also try it with a 220 Volts to 30 Volts AC transformer as the input
or just only with the TRIAC dimmer circuit ?
I hope this is not related to the Meter-Triac jamming as
EMdevices has suggested, so better just try it without this
meter and without the TRIAC dimmer circuit by just using
a 220Volts to 30 Volts AC transformer for the input and
measure then using a scope with a shunt for power input.
Post by: Omega_0 on September 01, 2009, 03:41:30 PM
in our test i will not use watt meter the video was to show a lay man that less energy is consumed
for technical peoples measurements and numbers are good enough to establish results.
regards
Ali
Winson Ali,
That's a very good decision indeed. As suggested by someone earlier, the best way is to feed from a DC source and measure input DC power. Use an inverter to feed your device.
At the output, rectify the output and again measure the output power in a resistive DC load.
That's it ...
Any more theoretical speculation is not necessary at this time. If these measurement results are overunity, you will have unlimited finances to proceed. Please take a break from the forum, if you need time.
Post by: hartiberlin on September 01, 2009, 03:43:07 PM
Again at the example with the bathtube:
If you would arrange the hose above the bathtube at 3 Meters height
for example of 100 loops of the hose , then you would
have a lot of water up there 3 Meters over the bathtube at the start when you
suck the air out of the hose and not much water had run down the hose yet.
So the question is, if sucking the air out of the hose uses less energy than the potential
energy of the water 3 Meters higher in the 100 loops of the hose ?
If the answer is YES , you could make a valve into the hose and
shut it up, when the whole 100 loops are full of water and have
that potential of water do more work, when it is released and
will fall down in the gravity field.
Post by: allcanadian on September 01, 2009, 05:24:12 PM
Quote:
"Now with in the device the switching is in a very specific way, causes a resonance and more charges aligning themselves then in a conventional manner
telling you truly when i was conducting these tests i was knowing that charges are there but they are not in flow and i have to find a way to make them flow or convert them as workable PD(potential difference )"
Congratulations on your success, I think you understand the dilema you find yourself in as well, LOL. How do you explain something so obvious, so basic to people who have no conception of what you are talking about without giving everything away? I was building these circuits many years ago and they work very well but there are bottlenecks or rather limitations which I am sure you are aware of. You have made a very good first step getting past this current-centric perception everyone seems to be stuck in and I think you will really enjoy where this will lead you. For the record this is not a new concept---it is a very old one and the issues you are having concerning conversion were resolved by Nicola Tesla in his early patents.
Regards
AC
Post by: robbie47 on September 01, 2009, 05:38:42 PM
I was building these circuits many years ago and they work very well but there are bottlenecks or rather limitations which I am sure you are aware of.
Allcanadian, can you post some more details of the circuits that you tried earlier?
Post by: hartiberlin on September 02, 2009, 11:37:59 AM
how ALI´s digital oscillator with resonance works ?
Does he have some kind of CCD chain switched by Mosfets
with a positive feedback loop ?
Does he have the bulb load inside the positive feedback loop,
so the charges are raised in potential and can flow back from the output of the CCD chain to the
lower potential at the input of the CCD chain ?
If you compare it with an Audio delay echo unit, where they have also CCDs
for the delay line, if you feed back too much audio into the input,
then there is a resonance and the delay line will work like an oscillator..
He said, it always needs to see a load and I guess it must be something like this,
otherwise there would be no "siphon" effect.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: robbie47 on September 02, 2009, 01:37:06 PM
Post by: hartiberlin on September 02, 2009, 03:01:06 PM
line feedback loop and this tells me that it must be something like the principle of
an audio Echo CCD unit, that has a positive feedback loop and goes into oscillation.
This is also the only way I see a "Siphon" effect could work.
Ali now wants to design a unit that can be powered by pure DC input power
from a 12 Volts battery or a solar panel.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: FatBird on September 02, 2009, 03:06:45 PM
Thank you.
.
Post by: robbie47 on September 02, 2009, 04:55:03 PM
Stefan, did you see my post on Page 5 of this Thread, regarding photos of the Spinning Aether? If not, PLEASE do because of its IMPORTANCE!!!
This is caused by over exposure of the camera sensor.
Some explanation can be found here:
http://www.dallmeier-electronic.com/it/prodotti/cameras/da-tenere-in-conto/ccd-vs-cmos.html (http://www.dallmeier-electronic.com/it/prodotti/cameras/da-tenere-in-conto/ccd-vs-cmos.html)
The bright light causes the sensor to saturate and causes the vertical bars in the movie.
Even when he hasn't yet connected his device and connects the board directly to the wallplug this effect is visible.
It has nothing to do with a secret energy source being visualized.
Post by: winsonali on September 02, 2009, 06:16:50 PM
i am a scientist and have worked on various project in starting of this year(2009) one of my friend ask me to develop a UPS /inverter with extended backup power operating on 12volt battery coz power cuts are too much now a days in his country
i give him an idea that just like if you are driving a car on a highway on staright road you can save fuel by just neutral the car for some time and get it back on gear after some time due to inertia car will remain in movement for some time
like wise we can use the hysteresis curve (retentivity of magnetic force) in transformer in the same way, we can call it magnetic inertia. I develop the circuit and its working the backup of the same 1KW UPS extended by 60 % now its operating for 6 hours before it use to last in 4 hours this is a good product for solar panels as well
the same friend ask me to develop voltage stabilizer in low cost that was only possible if i some how finish the use of transformer from the stabilizer
so i thought of siphon and designed the stabilizer which can increase the voltage without transformer so we can save the cost of transformer. copper is getting expensive day by day.
i developed the stabilizer successfully
while we conduct tests we realize that the input voltages are 30 at 1.5 yielding 220 with 0.7 amps
i was not at all designing any thing related to over unity or perpetual motion but the efforts for some thing else turned into what we have now
even if we do not think of any thing else this device can work as a transformer less A/C voltage stabilizer by all means
Ali
Post by: robbie47 on September 02, 2009, 09:32:30 PM
What kind of input is that? Is it 12 V DC?
Post by: winsonali on September 02, 2009, 09:40:05 PM
Post by: Goat on September 03, 2009, 02:07:54 AM
hi mark,
"you are increasing voltage but reducing current"
REPLY:always remember you can provide voltage to some load but the current is defined by the load it self
explaining further: in a 220 volt socket you can plug 1000 watt heater it will draw 4 to 5 amps
at the same time if you put 100 watt bulb it will draw 0.5 amps approx.
so voltage is provided , current is the drawn from the line according to the load.
in watt meter voltage coil only open the path for magnetic flux but current coil make the movement to see how much wattage is being consummed.
in my device i am providing it 30 volts
when we conduct a test of 160 watt at output source of our device it was giving us 220 volts at 0.7 amps approx.
and when we check the current at the input the voltages are 30 volts at 1.5 amps
RESULTS:
input = 30 *1.5 = 45 watt (in a simple approach not going in complexity at the moment)
output = 220 * 0.7 = 154 watt (you see amps gone down from 1.5 to 0.7 this is very natural)
Now with in the device the switching is in a very specific way, causes a resonance and more charges aligning themselves then in a conventional manner
telling you truly when i was conducting these tests i was knowing that charges are there but they are not in flow and i have to find a way to make them flow or convert them as workable PD(potential difference )
mechanical example of situation: you have bath tub full of water the top is open water cannot flow out from top if you make a whole in bottom of the tub it will flow (natural) now i have to make water flow from top. if i can do the same in electronic means what i have achieved is creating PD with non aligned electrons.
i am in the middle of writing the thesis about my theories and there practical conversions so i will not discuss these concepts any further until i arrange to publish them
i am not saying that i am a very intelligent man but i am learning as well an argument for argument will waste our own time rather then a simple practical output if my device is working and have potential soon it will be there in market its just a matter of time
i think my idea to givel the unit for R@D purpose to get hold of some funds as donation to noble cause to further carry out research was not a good idea
coz according to my professional ethics i will not give unit to any one until he is satisfied and knows what he is getting
and people around me are not able to digest the new concept here, i should carry on my work and take it to a completion level
strange enough no body asked me ,what is the next level in development if its working why not i start producing it
the difficulties;
the behavior of the unit is purely like a generator you off load it, the voltage rises we need to develop an AVR
loads like air conditioners turns on the compressor and turns off this could seriously effect the process, an instantaneous response to load variation is required to be incorporated with in device
device cannot work without load it will destroy it self (resonating frequency) we need to include dummy load to balance the device and harness the appropriate output according to current dissipation.
if output load increase from the capacity of input source the unit destroy it self
things are not so simple as it seems, a lot more work is required before the device is ready for market
i posted the video on you tube when i saw magna coaster video, i did wrong i should complete the device by burning more of my own fuel to reach the destination , rather then giving people half cooked device i think i should get hold of some project to make enough money to complete my unit then sky is the limit.
thanks to everyone
Ali
Sorry guys for the long quote I screwed up there...but I think Ali touches on a lot of good points.
Ok so the device is maybe not ready for prime time but the principles involved are none the less interesting.
@ Ali
Could you feed the 12 Volt input to the device and run a 12VDC/120VAC or 220VAC inverter for the 30VAC on the circuit and get the motionless generator to produce the 220 * 0.7 = 154 watt you mentioned earlier?
If you can run the device on only the 12 Volt battery and show OU on a single battery as far as I/P vs O/P then you'd convince everyone on this thread, I think!
Regards,
Paul
Post by: robbie47 on September 03, 2009, 09:28:08 AM
I think many of us are willing to help you out with remaining problems.
If you want us to help you with this device you need to explain some more details of your converter, I am afraid.
Otherwise you will get a lot of scattered questions.
Post by: winsonali on September 03, 2009, 10:35:11 AM
I made good friends over here on this forum all of them are working for a single cause to provide fossil fuel less energy ,energy that do not contribute to entropy a clean air for breathing at last green should prevail the era for fossil fuel should finish war for oil resources should come to an end
all this is possible with free energy
Paul i have started working working on DC based unit it involve a technical aspect, that my unit takes only supply with +ve and _ve say +12 volts then -12 volts in same wire (true A/C) other wire should be a neutral return path, otherwise we will not be able to achieve siphon
any way i think i have open a new door for acquiring energy
any body on forum looking forward to design any mechaical aspect of life in electronics can ask me and i will do it
thanks
Post by: FreeEnergy on September 03, 2009, 10:44:49 AM
i have started working working on DC based unit it involve a technical aspect, that my unit takes only supply with +ve and _ve say +12 volts then -12 volts in same wire (true A/C) other wire should be a neutral return path, otherwise we will not be able to achieve siphon
can you post pictures/images/photos/videos for better explanation?
Post by: FatBird on September 03, 2009, 02:23:17 PM
Please consider selling a Schematic & Parts Layout to your unit. We the buyers WILL AGREE to PROTECT the Privacy of your invention.
The advantage to you is:
1. Your invention will be protected.
2. You will receive money to further your research.
3. We buyers can PAY YOU instantly online thru PayPal.
4. Our feedback of ideas back to you can help you improve your unit.
5. Your Utube Video and Postings here on OVERUNITY, PROVE the invention is YOURS.
6. After you receive each payment, you would only need to email 2 or 3 pieces of paper to each Buyer (schematic, & Parts Layout).
Thank you for your consideration.
.
Post by: robbie47 on September 03, 2009, 11:58:17 PM
Is the Patent Application already public?
Post by: winsonali on September 04, 2009, 10:30:20 AM
1 =it requires software to run the device until ad unless i also provide you guys with software everything will remain useless
2 = to provide proper measurement of input ad out put we have concluded that a DC input phase is very much required
3 = i have started working on DC input section once its done then any complexities of AC input will be resolved
4 = this device primarily intended to use as voltage stabilizer rather then so it can be used as energy saving voltage stabilizer
Ali
Post by: robbie47 on September 04, 2009, 12:21:02 PM
Can you indicate how we can contribute any further to your technology in this forum?
I have the impression you do not want to reveal anymore details than you already did.
If that is the case it maybe useful to close this discussion thread and move on.
Post by: minde4000 on September 04, 2009, 05:39:21 PM
@ Ali,
Can you indicate how we can contribute any further to your technology in this forum?
I have the impression you do not want to reveal anymore details than you already did.
If that is the case it maybe useful to close this discussion thread and move on.
Right on robbie47. Inventor made it clear in several posts how he wants to share this and help humanity... Turned out not to be the case... When asked - no blueprints no software. Why he is here for then?..
Minde
Post by: markdansie on September 04, 2009, 06:07:34 PM
i am sure in his own good time the project will help humanity. why does he have to share it with you at this stage.
So you try and make him feel guilty. There are many ways thsi project can help humanity but in the first intance he might need to look after his own family and needs
Just my thoughts
mark
Post by: exxcomm0n on September 04, 2009, 07:52:35 PM
Besides looking out for the intellectual property angle, there is the issue that this is still very much in its alpha stages and verification of the phenomenon using DC as opposed to AC for good measurement analysis has not yet been done.
I can sympathize with winsonali not wanting to state that this is a proven technology or release more details until it has been proven. There have been many grandiose claims made at on time or another on OU that have been proven to be misinterpretation of measurement results, a misunderstanding of physics, or an outright scam and the posters of these claims are not treated the most kindly after such a discovery.
Double and triple checking personal results (with the good recommendations already posted in this thread) before allowing replication information to be posted might be wise.
That said, I can understand the wishes of the open source FE community to know more specifics about the device as the theme of the site is open source and winsonali should understand that the request for additional data about the device is not going to stop.
Sharing the design info of the device and the software after successful retesting would be a good thing for replicating the effect and validating the claim though. It's even led to design improvements at times.
Post by: robbie47 on September 04, 2009, 10:37:32 PM
The attached circuit is able to multiply the input voltage to any desired level after the right switch sequence is applied and ignoring 'old school' theories on currents and charges. The big question is where does the increased current come from. Is it the 'siphon' effect?
[edit] actually SW2 can be left out or closed during the whole switch sequence
Post by: markdansie on September 04, 2009, 11:23:35 PM
Ali was invited here as our guest. I am not sure where you have the right to demand his IP at this stage. We were hoping he would share some information. Is this how you treat guests, invite them in to your house then hold a gun at their head? When some one is invited as guest at a club or conference that does not mean they then have to share everything with you.
I think this is quiet sick and you owe Ali and appology. You are to say the least disprespectful.
I would suggest Stephan or whoever invited him here to appologise on OU.coms behalf and take some sort of disiplinary action.
You are sick, very sick and I have recommended to Ali not to post here anymore.
I am also considering the future of my input. Some of you are very selfish to the extreme and pretend your here for humanatarian purposes and just want to line you own pockets.
Sham Shame Shame.
Without Regards
Mark
Post by: DreamThinkBuild on September 04, 2009, 11:31:08 PM
Your drawing reminds me of a Marx generator on a smaller scale. Charge the caps in parallel then dump across the load in series. Fun part is coming up with the high speed switching.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marx_generator
Post by: robbie47 on September 04, 2009, 11:44:37 PM
I am not sure where you have the right to demand his IP at this stage.
Mark, I just asked for it, I did not DEMAND it.
His comment to his you-tube posting says:
this video shows the new invention of motion less generation of electric power it take 1.5 amps at 30 volts(45 watt) and produces 0.7amp at 220 volts (154watt) this device can be used to reduce your electri city bill slow down the meter this generator is world first solid state power generator please see the video and if you have any querries you can contact me on winsonali@yahoo.com if you wish to but one of these units for R&D purpose i will send you a unit imediatly i have already file the patent for any further question related to over unity , comparsion with magnacoaster vorktex , magnetic electric gererator, perpetual motion , tesla coil , high frequency or principal of bearden motionless generator please ask me i will send you details. the sole purpose fo sjowing this video is to promote free or low cost electricity you can reduce you electri bill upto 60% very easily
this power generation is based on my own theory of smart energy my email address is winsonali on yahoo
this unit can be directly connected to windmill and solar panels and this is a perfect solution for alternative energy
Post by: mtec on September 04, 2009, 11:45:00 PM
Best explanation so far...
THE FINAL SECRET OF FREE ENERGY
1993 T. E. Bearden
http://www.cheniere.org/techpapers/Final%20Secret%209%20Feb%201993/indexold.html
Post by: robbie47 on September 05, 2009, 12:15:26 AM
Where does the energy come from?
Best explanation so far...
THE FINAL SECRET OF FREE ENERGY
1993 T. E. Bearden
http://www.cheniere.org/techpapers/Final%20Secret%209%20Feb%201993/indexold.html
Can you be a bit more specific? What chapter, paragraph are you refering to in this particular case?
Post by: DreamThinkBuild on September 05, 2009, 02:21:29 AM
http://www.electricstuff.co.uk/marxgen.htm
http://www.electricstuff.co.uk/marxthree.html
Post by: Judges on September 06, 2009, 03:39:47 AM
Just my thoughts,,,,,,,,,,,,,errrrrr,feelings.
What if a new person with a gift shows up here?
How would we treat him?
This thread needs to be turned around or ended.
I can control what I look at on my end>
I will accept that option for now.
Logged: Saturday evening,central Texas,September 5, 2009
Time (Central Standard)8:34PM
Close
Post by: FatBird on September 06, 2009, 05:34:50 PM
The behavior of the unit is purely like a generator you off load it, the voltage rises we need to develop an AVR. Loads like air conditioners turns on the compressor and turns off this could seriously effect the process, an instantaneous response to load variation is required to be incorporated within device.
Device cannot work without load it will destroy it self (resonating frequency). We need to include dummy load to balance the device and harness the appropriate output according to current dissipation. If output load increase from the capacity of input source the unit destroy itself. Things are not so simple as it seems, a lot more work is required before the device is ready for market.
====================================================
Ali,
Above, you mentioned you need to get some flaws out of your Device before you sell it. MOST of us BUYERS WANT to BUY it AS IS WITH THE FLAWS so we can HELP YOU further your research. Please consider selling a KIT which includes a Schematic, Programmed IC, and a Parts Layout. We the buyers WILL SUPPLY THE REST of the PARTS. Plus, we Buyers AGREE to PROTECT the Privacy of your invention.
The advantages to you are:
1. Your invention will be protected.
2. You will receive money now to further your research.
3. We buyers can PAY YOU INSTANTLY online through PayPal.Com
4. Our feedback of ideas back to you can help you improve your Device.
5. Your Utube Video and Postings here on OVERUNITY, PROVE the invention is YOURS.
6. After you receive each payment, you would only need to Snail Mail one Programmed IC, and Email 2 or 3 pieces of paper to each Buyer (schematic, & Parts Layout).
7. As a suggestion, perhaps $45 per Kit would be fair. The $45 should be Out The Door and include Postage & Handling. 100 Buyers times $45 will give you $4,500 to help your research.
8. Some Buyers ONLY want a Schematic and Parts Layout. Maybe you could sell (Email) those 2 pieces of paper for $30. 100 Buyers times $30 will give you $3,000 more to further your research.
9. Plus, after you improve your Device, you can come back here to OverUnity & SELL your Improved Schematic and Parts List..
Thank you for your consideration.
.
Post by: winsonali on September 08, 2009, 05:58:54 AM
i respect your offer and value your suggestion
i am currently developing the DC input source for the unit
once that unit is complete we can satisfy the skeptics of its possible use with windmill and solar panel.
all those who are in touch with me and giving me good ideas i will send them a complete unit for no cost as a gentle man promise.
thanks and regards
Post by: tinu on September 08, 2009, 11:39:27 AM
My apologies but I don’t think I get it right…
You claim a non-trivial OU rate (assuming that would be such a thing as a “trivial OU rateâ€!) and then it seems you send the readers hunting ghosts (shiphon etc) and/or you find various excuses instead of doing the only one thing that matters, which is path no.1 bellow, of many false paths (2-5 that I could count so far) brought forward for a doubtful purpose (I suppose) as long as they are conditional to 1 and subsidiary to ‘the cause’:
1. All you have to do is nothing else but closing the loop! I understand you’ve fried many units so it shouldn’t be a problem to build&use two or more of them on that purpose. Come on now: dummy loads is piece of cake and I think 220V-30V transformers exist for some time as well as 12VDC-220VAC converters… ;)
Maybe you can shed some light on the issue. Why it hasn’t been done yet?!
2. Money and family care are of concern? Not any longer after the point 1 above is proved. Sponsorships and donations will flow to you beyond anyone’s imagination and without you to have to oblige in any way. Why is it then discussed inhere, prior to 1?!
3. Intellectual property is an issue? But there is no real need to divulge anything in a ‘black-box’ approach, as needed for point 1 above. Just let a tiny bulb lighting and ‘the box’ producing some heat, all from a 12V capacitor kick-start on 24h basis… Hmmm… would anybody need something else?!
4. Scientific recognition is what would satisfy you? Make point 1 above happen and even if you write that electricity is made out of little spaghetti ‘shiphoning’ out of something, it will still be published; no matter what you do, for such an experimental accomplishment you have real chances for Nobel.
5. Humanitarian concerns?! Ha! Again a marginal issue at your fingertip once point 1 is proven real.
Last but not least, I’m afraid that showing the proof of point 1 is not optional, my friend. It’s not for the ‘skeptics’ either but it’s fully implied by what’s been claimed already. Once you or anyone else claim that a device generates energy (which you had), decoupling it from its known power source has to be done sooner or later, pretty much like a solar panel or a wind turbine does not need to be plugged into an outlet to function.
So, I apologies again but this thread doesn’t make sense at all in my mind… or if it makes a sense that would be toward the same one as for each and every other OU-claims in the past…
Can you really change that or not? That’s the question!
If yes, how and when?
And in doing it, what is you need from us?
Best regards,
Tinu
Post by: robbie47 on September 08, 2009, 12:32:25 PM
Just like Tinu and many others, I was looking for clear indications whether you would allow us to replicate your findings.
That is why I asked very direct questions. I did not mean to be hostile or skeptic, but I am cautious.
Too many incorrect claims have passed in this forum earlier in time.
I hope you can understand our cautiousness.
I also realize that difference in cultures may play a role when people post in this forum.
What seems to be very rude in some cultures is perfectly normal behavior in other cultures.
If you feel offended, please do express it so we understand.
It would be helpful if you could indicate how you would like to go ahead after you finished your DC module.
Again, I respect your way of working to promote your finding although I can't understand why you promote it this way.
Post by: winsonali on September 08, 2009, 01:32:23 PM
how to proceed many people asking me many things
what ever i posted on you tube was very much uncut and original video
lately what friends working with me are asking a DC unit
so i am completing this, although i am a bit confused how to take it further too many things at the same time too many questions
lets give me some brief time to overcome this
its not basically funding , its not family care , its not getting some thing in your hand
its all about life
Ali
Post by: robbie47 on September 08, 2009, 02:07:32 PM
its not basically funding , its not family care , its not getting some thing in your hand
its all about life
Thanks Ali, that is somewhat of a relieve to us.
I can imagine you are under a lot of pressure.
So, we need to respect that and allow you to work on your DC version first before anticipating on next steps.
Post by: minde4000 on September 08, 2009, 05:03:42 PM
I hope I really do this time it will not be the case.
Great work Ali
Regards Minde
Post by: winsonali on September 09, 2009, 12:18:35 AM
i have just posted my video after some skeptics ask few basic question to be cleared and this time the device is examined by CEO of k-9 electronics Glen Darrien in working
the details of the video are as under
this video is in continuation of my previous video of world's first operating motionless electric generator,
in response to my last video i have several question i have answered those questions as well as shown amperes, In this video the voltage coming from grid are 250 so when we get the dimmer to the lowest level the output was 49 volts so out put from the electro gen become 338 volts my device needs only 30 volts to reach to 220 volts each 1 volt increase means 10 volts in out put
at the input this time we have placed a 60 watt bulb which is representing the input power when the dimmer is low its out put is very dim and when we feed this low power to genie the output from genie become very high but this bulb remains very low showing a low input and high output
regarding calculation although is not as simple as that but its good for approximation
input to genie is 2.7 amps at 49.8 volts so its 49.8 * 2.7 = 134.46 watts
output from genie 1.33 amps at 338 volts so its 338 * 1.33 = 449.54
please see the video in the last video the third wire i have shown clearly
the new bulb added at input was required by one of the examiners of the product and this shows the input remain low when genie makes high output
Post by: minde4000 on September 09, 2009, 01:46:07 AM
Minde
Post by: winsonali on September 09, 2009, 01:48:39 AM
Post by: minde4000 on September 09, 2009, 02:01:30 AM
Post by: EMdevices on September 09, 2009, 02:48:29 AM
I see only one video under your name at www.you-tube.com, where did you post the second one? (P.S. ok I just read the above comments, I'll wait)
I watched your first video again, and listened to what you say and also what you just wrote, and I have a few more comments:
1) Your input stage to your device seems to be a VOLTAGE MULTIPLIER using only capacitors and diodes, it uses 3 capacitors (seen in the video) to increase the voltage by a factor of 8=2 x 2 x 2 This is the ideal multiplication factor when no current flows, but if current flows due to a load, the multipliers have a % regulation factor, and the output voltage drops somewhat from this maximum voltage. These voltage multipliers don't need inductors, like you claim in the video. Here's a link for the interested folks: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voltage_multiplier
2) From you performance ratings (30 V input to 220 V output, and 49 V input to 338 V output) I see you have failed to provide voltage regulation, like your friend asked you too. Voltage regulation means you maintain the output voltage at the desired level despite fluctuations in input voltage or load.
3) Good look with your DC input design. This should be easier to prove if its free energy or not.
EM
Post by: winsonali on September 09, 2009, 03:29:22 AM
this is the link of my new video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoAmtkHkDzI
Post by: minde4000 on September 09, 2009, 03:34:18 AM
Minde
Post by: winsonali on September 09, 2009, 03:49:36 AM
thank you for encouragement yes i also think DC input will clearly explain the behavior
Post by: winsonali on September 09, 2009, 05:20:48 AM
this is the new link on you tube
;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoAmtkHkDzI
Post by: gotoluc on September 09, 2009, 06:37:43 AM
thank you for taking the time to make this new video. Great work my friend :)
I'm really looking forward to your DC version. I would like to help you. I don't know if you need any suggestions for a circuit that changes DC to true AC but the circuit I attached was designed by user name Groundloop to use components I had on hand (4013 and IRF640) and has worked very well for my tests. You can use other MOSFET's then the 640 if you wish and the 4013 is a flip flop. I'm not sure how much current this circuit can take but that may depend on the FET's. The IR2103 you can get on ebay and other model of IR21 series also work.
If you need more details please don't hesitate to ask.
Luc
Post by: EMdevices on September 09, 2009, 06:40:16 AM
thanks for the new video. Here's my comments:
You do not have a pure sine wave going out of the dimmer into your device. Your instruments will not be accurate. You really need to look at the waveform with an oscilloscope.
Is your output a pure sine wave?
EM
Post by: robbie47 on September 09, 2009, 09:42:19 AM
1) Your input stage to your device seems to be a VOLTAGE MULTIPLIER using only capacitors and diodes, it uses 3 capacitors (seen in the video) to increase the voltage by a factor of 8=2 x 2 x 2 This is the ideal multiplication factor when no current flows, but if current flows due to a load, the multipliers have a % regulation factor, and the output voltage drops somewhat from this maximum voltage. These voltage multipliers don't need inductors, like you claim in the video.
EM,
I found exactly the same as you stated.
Since Ali mentioned he has a feedback in his circuit, the maximum factor 8 is not relevant anymore.
In my suggested circuit (Reply #108) you see that feedback. I replace the diodes by switches so there can be some form of output control. The very big question is of course how such circuit can become in a state where amplification of both current and voltages occur. I guess we need to go back to Tesla's findings unless Ali would have a more practical hint ;)
Post by: winsonali on September 09, 2009, 10:06:51 AM
""You do not have a pure sine wave going out of the dimmer into your device. Your instruments will not be accurate. You really need to look at the waveform with an oscilloscope.''
I value your knowledge and all suggestions, A knowledgeable person just like you, suggested the same point and asked me to put a bulb at input as well if my instruments cannot measure them accurately then the bulb can reflect input on actual so i did the same the results are in front of you.
my output is pure AC with 50 hz output
it operates all kind of loads inductive and resistive
but i am sure that when dc input will be ready its going to be the best result we can get
i love all the forum members and there support
Ali
Post by: winsonali on September 09, 2009, 11:21:59 AM
thank you for encouragement
i do need your advise on DC input version
these kind of circuit are usually not available inverters they give output o both wires although they are AC but we need grid type of supply
Ali
Post by: MasterPlaster on September 09, 2009, 12:28:12 PM
i do need your advise on DC input version
these kind of circuit are usually not available inverters they give output o both wires although they are AC but we need grid type of supply
@Ali,
Do you mean the output of the inverter must be Sinusoidal?
Also, how much current is required?
Post by: Ergo on September 09, 2009, 01:23:54 PM
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=7241.msg178700#msg178700
Ali, please make sure you take measurements in Joules energy (input vs output in Joules).
One Joule is one watt-second. Forget about lamps in series to show any overunity. It will fool you.
This was the mistake of Tommey Reed. He had to face his ignorance the hard way when
he realized he lacked the necessary "know how" in measurement techniques.
Good luck / Ergo
Post by: FatBird on September 09, 2009, 03:07:34 PM
GREAT UTube Video. Please don't waste time on the Skeptics. Skeptics are NEVER, EVER satisfied.
There are about 100 Buyers ready to buy your GENIE (or the plans) RIGHT NOW FOR CASH, through PayPal.com, or whatever means you prefer.
Why not GRAB SOME MONEY RIGHT NOW to fund your research, and worry about the skeptics Next Year.
.
Post by: gotoluc on September 09, 2009, 03:40:16 PM
the circuit I shared will give you True AC (not chopped DC like Inverter) however it will be square wave. If for some reason it needs to be sine wave then I think a 1/1 transformer should work.
Before we continue, can you do one more simple test. This test will eliminate the possibility that your device is fooling the utility meter. Simply use one light bulb in Series at 220v AC input (pre dimmer or variac) and use the same wattage bulbs on output. If you can light 2 or more bulbs on the output of the same wattage as the input series bulb and the input series bulb stays dimmer then the output bulbs then your device is an extraordinary find. Please also do a new video of this test as this will put the utility meter fooling discussion to rest.
Thank you for all your sharing and your time
Luc
Post by: Ergo on September 09, 2009, 03:43:36 PM
GREAT UTube Video. Please don't waste time on the Skeptics. Skeptics are NEVER, EVER satisfied.Anything else than a confirmed working self runner isn't proof on overunity.
Skeptics will always be satisfied when a real working "self running closed loop" system is presented.
There are about 100 Buyers ready to buy your GENIE (or the plans) RIGHT NOW FOR CASH, through PayPal.com, or whatever means you prefer.You sound precisely like the typical "Free Energy scammer" yourself......
Why bother selling something that is not confirmed working if the purpose isn't scamming people?
Post by: robbie47 on September 09, 2009, 03:47:39 PM
This will cause unnecessary discussions.
Please, keep this thread as clean as possible.
Post by: Omega_0 on September 09, 2009, 04:30:21 PM
input to genie is 2.7 amps at 49.8 volts so its 49.8 * 2.7 = 134.46 watts
output from genie 1.33 amps at 338 volts so its 338 * 1.33 = 449.54
This calculation is obviously not correct. You can multiply voltage and current only if they are pure DC. I guess you know that.
For other waveforms, you must take the duty cycle into account and for a sin wave, take only RMS vaules of voltage and current.
As you said, DC measurements will settle this, but if you wish to show the non-DC power measurements, you will need an oscilloscope.
Anyway, much better than the household power meter, thanks a lot :)
Post by: mscoffman on September 09, 2009, 05:24:34 PM
Hi Ali,
the circuit I shared will give you True AC (not chopped DC like Inverter) however it will be square wave. If for some reason it needs to be sine wave then I think a 1/1 transformer should work.
Before we continue, can you do one more simple test. This test will eliminate the possibility that your device is fooling the utility meter. Simply use one light bulb in Series at 220v AC input (pre dimmer or variac) and use the same wattage bulbs on output. If you can light 2 or more bulbs on the output of the same wattage as the input series bulb and the input series bulb stays dimmer then the output bulbs then your device is an extraordinary find. Please also do a new video of this test as this will put the utility meter fooling discussion to rest.
Thank you for all your sharing and your time
Luc
Good to excellent idea!
A slight improvement in your suggestion though, use LED bulbs rather than
incandescent light bulbs. Led bulbs are much more efficient something
like 85% rather than 5% light vs IR infrared EMF and heat. So LED bulbs
will broadcast more energy more completely away from the unit under test.
Final users of the energy sources will want some of each kind of energy but
currently power companies don't distinguish between these kinds and this
causes a lack of user comprehension.
Incandescent light bulbs are called "negative-resitances" by formal
scientific community because they conduct more electrical current
when they are cold then when they are hot. Please Google something
called the "Wein-Bridge" oscillator circuit, that uses a small incandescent
light bulb as an active circuit element to help understand this.
This may be good for unregulated voltage sources because incandescents
tend to adjust their wattage to a more constant value in deference
to ohms law, but bad if you want to know precisely how much wattage
is being delivered at any time from constant or pulsing sources etc.
For example you could have the same incandescent light output from
a bulb at a lower voltage and it setting at a higher current and a
bulb at a higher voltage but having adjusted itself to a lower current.
The problem is that the adjustment towards a constant wattage
can help stabilise a dynamic system, but is only approximate.
:S:MarkSCoffman
Post by: robbie47 on September 09, 2009, 05:25:06 PM
I noticed that in the first video you posted you are very specific with the plug orientation when you plug in your unit. It looks like it matters what position the neutral connection is in.
I also noticed that you are taking care of this in Video #2.
Can you explain why?
Also, can you confirm that there is no common neutral in your setup?
Post by: mscoffman on September 09, 2009, 05:52:34 PM
@ Ali,
Also, can you confirm that there is no common neutral in your setup?
I'll let Ali speak for himself, cause I don't know his device, but any
device with an inline transformer could be drawn like this. That
is what I assumed he was showing. A common neutral input/output
circuit would then be optional.
:S:MarkSCoffman
Post by: robbie47 on September 09, 2009, 06:55:52 PM
anydevice with an inline transformer could be drawn like this.
:S:MarkSCoffman
Mark, according to Ali there are no coils or transformers used in his device.
Post by: FatBird on September 09, 2009, 07:35:19 PM
Who the "F" are you, Fatbird? Richard Willis perhaps?
You sound precisely like the typical "Free Energy scammer" yourself......
==========================================
Fine, if that's how you appreciate me trying to help us Buy a working unit, I will go away.
Let's see how much good you can do.
.
Post by: Ergo on September 09, 2009, 10:01:59 PM
Fine, if that's how you appreciate me trying to help us Buy a working unit, I will go away.
Let's see how much good you can do.
If you really belive one should sell a "REAL WORKING FREE ENERGY" unit to any bidder
on eBay for some small change, then you are out of your mind.
Once having found the Holy Grail of humanity, he better make sure he doesn't sell it loosely
over an eBay auction. That would render any serious reputation completely worthless.
The only right way is to confirm the OU effect is by several serious test & approval offices.
Then he should write an article on the functionality and have it published in long-established magazines.
This will make the OU device quickly replicated by the scientific community and positively
confirmed (if the device is for real).
Least but not last:
Ali will be written into the history books and on his way to Stockholm to collect his Nobel Prize.
To believe anything else is just childish comprehension... ::)
Post by: wattsup on September 10, 2009, 12:49:40 AM
Regarding the diagram you put up, shouldn't the output bulbs be in series given his higher voltage?
Post by: gotoluc on September 10, 2009, 01:26:33 AM
@gotoluc
Regarding the diagram you put up, shouldn't the output bulbs be in series given his higher voltage?
Yes, I thought of that wattsup but wanted to keep it simple for now. However, this could be one way he could deal with the higher voltage output but we don't know what voltage rating his switching Capacitors can handle, so better stick with what works for him.
Luc
Post by: robbie47 on September 10, 2009, 10:48:58 AM
Instead of the batteries, 3 capacitors and a power source are applied?
Some corresponding text from PesWiki:
'Classic' Tesla Switch
The Tesla Switch creates a pulsed current flow between four 12v, Lead-acid batteries in an array (in the anticipated system, three such arrays operate together, or 12 batteries in all). Through some mechanism of radiant energy entrainment, net energy is captured within the battery system in this process. The rate of entrainment charging adjusts itself to the external load being drawn from the batteries; the greater the discharge to load, the faster external energy is captured from the active vacuum. The switching rate also determines the rate of charge, and must be kept in a range (20cps to 800cps, TBD) which, in relation to the [then] load, does not damage the batteries from excessive charge
N.B. I am not saying the Tesla switch is proven technology
Another interesting site on tesla switches by John Bedini: http://www.icehouse.net/john1/tesla.html (http://www.icehouse.net/john1/tesla.html)
Maybe I am wrong but I see some similarity with Ali's siphon explanation as well with one of Bedini's pictures from that site
Post by: spoondini on September 10, 2009, 03:13:02 PM
Amazing to see that someone has potentially materialized the concept, exactly when I found the overunity board. Serendipity.
Hat's off to you Ali!
Post by: lltfdaniel1 on September 10, 2009, 03:44:59 PM
Just a thought: has Ali's technique something in common with the testla switch method?
Instead of the batteries, 3 capacitors and a power source are applied?
Some corresponding text from PesWiki:
'Classic' Tesla Switch
The Tesla Switch creates a pulsed current flow between four 12v, Lead-acid batteries in an array (in the anticipated system, three such arrays operate together, or 12 batteries in all). Through some mechanism of radiant energy entrainment, net energy is captured within the battery system in this process. The rate of entrainment charging adjusts itself to the external load being drawn from the batteries; the greater the discharge to load, the faster external energy is captured from the active vacuum. The switching rate also determines the rate of charge, and must be kept in a range (20cps to 800cps, TBD) which, in relation to the [then] load, does not damage the batteries from excessive charge
N.B. I am not saying the Tesla switch is proven technology
Another interesting site on tesla switches by John Bedini: http://www.icehouse.net/john1/tesla.html (http://www.icehouse.net/john1/tesla.html)
Maybe I am wrong but I see some similarity with Ali's siphon explanation as well with one of Bedini's pictures from that site
Well all overunity systems share this method..it causes a water hammer cavity effect in the circuit and draws energy from the vaccum.
There have been people who shorted the circuit at the same time who got higher volts then that was used to power it.
Post by: tinu on September 10, 2009, 08:26:15 PM
The concept of the electricity 'siphon' has been twirling in my head for about 3 years now. It's what brought me to this board in the first place.
Amazing to see that someone has potentially materialized the concept, exactly when I found the overunity board. Serendipity.
Hat's off to you Ali!
How about the concept of RC time constant (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RC_time_constant) for a charging capacitor using a single diode, where R is the resistance of a diode in direct conduction (extremely small –fraction of Ohm) and C is probably several thousands micro-Farads?
How about the response of a mechanical device (power-meter) to the saw-tooth kind-of waveform when charging the said capacitor with momentarily current of maybe hundreds of amperes (current that decay very fast in comparison with the 50Hz which is the ‘reference of the meter’ by its design) and followed by a very large pause (during which the capacitor is slowly discharged onto a load with Rload of hundreds of Ohms - much larger that that of the diode, thus the time-constant is much larger; the power-meter sees no current during this time because the way setup works)?
How about the response of an ammeter designed for sinusoidal currents when facing the same kind of signal? (For practical purposes the signal may be treated as one with extremely low duty cycle if it helps picturing it; a guesstimate figure for the duty cycle may be around 0.5-1%)
Regarding the replies following the second movie, I vote for a bulb in series with the “genieâ€. Or even better, a (non-electronic) ballast used in fluorescent lamps that is already built as a nice coil designed for limiting current in 50Hz and that comes in various available sizes.
Definitely the voltage is what is said to be. But current is very far from it.
Probably even a 50A rapid fuse may reveal surprises. ;)
Best regards,
Tinu
Post by: hartiberlin on September 11, 2009, 01:08:45 AM
I have seen your new video and it is great !
Would you like to apply for the overunity price and thus open source
your invention ?
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: hartiberlin on September 11, 2009, 01:25:01 AM
at :
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=7987.0;attach=37705
The questions remains, how exactly the 50 Hz sine output waveform is formed...
As it seems to use only 3 big caps I wonder how the switching is done, so it is getting
a feedback and a selfrunning 50 Hz oscillator this way ?
Well, if I should fake a video, the second video still leaves the possibility for a fake,
as one could fake the 12 Volts AC to DC converter this way to just have a 220 Volts cable inside
there and no 12 Volts power supply. ( well I guess we still suffer from the Mylow "bug")
So scopeshots would be needed to see all the details and as EMdevices correctly said,
the dimmer circuit could jam the ac current measurements.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: winsonali on September 11, 2009, 02:04:19 AM
the video is very original and uncut , and there is nothing fake in it nor i want any money from any one as i mentioned previously i am burning my own fuel to reach the destination
nothing is fake i am bit silent right now coz concentrating on DC input and here is the first proper use of the genie , i will apply for the over unity price once i complete the device now i am more interested in completion of the device rather then talking....
note: pictures are modified for illustration purpose only not for any commercial purpose
Post by: hartiberlin on September 11, 2009, 02:39:09 AM
I wonder, why the output voltage is just 338 Volts as this
voltage is exactly the sqrt(2) value of 240 Volts AC from the UK,
(peak value the 50 Hz sine wave)
so it could also be the DC voltage from a bridge rectifier.
But ALI you say it is 50 Hz AC at the output ..
Hmm..
A Voltage multiplier would give only about 100 Volts from the 50 Hz dimmer
input you show, but how would this feedback then loop up and amplify up exactly to 338 Volts AC ?
This is puzzling me and as 338 Volts is exactly the peak value of the 240 Volts UK gridline
voltage, and I have seen a few diodes at the input circuit, I wonder,
if it is not just 338 Volts DC from the 3 caps ?
I would be pretty convinced if you would show us your
circuit powered by a 9 Volts transistor battery for 10 Minutes
running all these 3 output lamps, instead of the 12 Volts AC/DC adaptor...
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: hartiberlin on September 11, 2009, 02:53:09 AM
1. The 12 Volts AC/DC adaptor would be just a 240 Volts AC cable,
no transformer inside, so the power for the lamps could
be drawn through this cable.
This (hidden) input would go to a bridge rectifier which would
charge up 3 big caps to the peak value 338 Volts.
2. The claimed input cable from the dimmer circuit is
just a control voltage cable to switch a relay switch to put the
DC voltage power from the 3 caps onto the output cable.
3. What is also not shown is the dependence of the dimmer input voltage
to the output voltage. Normally, one would show, how the output voltage would
change, if the dimmer voltage is changed a bit, but this is not shown.
Only the fixed output voltage of 338 Volts is shown...
Hmmm....
So again,
after having Mylow faked his motor I would really wish
we could see this circuit NOT powered by a (not measured) 12 Volts AC/DC converter
but from a small 9 Volts transistor battery that could not run the 3 x 60 Watts lamps for so long...
Post by: winsonali on September 11, 2009, 06:30:38 AM
1 in first video the voltages from line coming were 220 when i reduce it to min value of dimmer i get it down to 30 volts that become 208~210 volts why the the sq doesn't work there? in first video
2 in 2nd video the voltages from line coming are 250 when i reduce it to min value of dimmer i get it down to 49 volts that becomes 338~341 volts
i have clearly mentioned that i need 30 volts in my circuit, if you multiply this by 7 you will get the same result 7 * 30 = 210(watch first video and look at multimeter its 208~214) and 7 * 49 = 343. the factorial in my circuit remain between 7 to 8.
so if some thing i am playing then why these similarities i have developed some thing with proper knowledge and designing capabilities
there are no relays in the circuit,no transformers as you put 12 volts, circuit starts working and zero crossing polarity checker section of the circuit start its operation this stage must be operative before input sampling voltages from dimmer.
coz circuit is not yet in its final stage we are using external 12 volts this is simple converter i was using with my wifi router from Netgear.
well i will not blame you for your comments and considering videos as fake, you are a human
every body has right to think in his own way
its just the matter of time with my own resources i will complete the device in proper product.
wish you best of luck
Ali
Post by: tinu on September 11, 2009, 09:50:49 AM
Hi again,
At a closer look I see the dimmer in the second movie is different from the one used in the first movie. (Well, I see the whole setup is different but apparently its parts are the same: power-meter, frequency-meter etc.)
Is it possible that during testing the genie, dimmers keep getting fried so in the second movie you felt a new&different /maybe more powerful/ dimmer shall be used?
If yes, is it possible that they fail due to excessive currents, as it results from my previous post?
Can you let us know what is the rated power of the dimmer(s) you use?
If the genie takes 150W or so and delivers in excess of 450W, can you use a dimmer rated at max 400W or less?
A DC version would be interesting but again, we’d ran into “a la Bendini†(please do not correct ;)) issues regarding current spikes. So I suggest again introducing into the actual setup any kind of device-limiting-current series connected with “the genieâ€, be it a mere bulb or ballast and/or the use of a low-power rated dimmer. It would take little efforts on your side to clear the issues about the real currents the genies draws from the mains, issues that I’ve raised last evening.
Best regards,
Tinu
Post by: hartiberlin on September 11, 2009, 11:30:05 AM
Thanks for the additional infos.
Why is your grid line voltage 250 Vots AC ? Did the UK recently raise the voltage to this level ?
Many thanks.
Post by: forest on September 11, 2009, 03:02:49 PM
Does it have any sense ?
Post by: spoondini on September 11, 2009, 03:29:23 PM
It would seem that capacitors and switches would be the primary tools for such a 'siphon'. I've had no success in real experimentation, but I also don't have background or tools associated with the sophisticated switching technology Ali claims to have.
My own 'mental experiment' would indicate that it is possible to achieve OU, COP>1, using such a technique. But 'mental experiments' are fairly meaningless in the real world unless you're a Jedi Knight. If it's so simple in my head, why hasn't anyone succeeded? Someone on this board commented that we tend to get stuck on ideas because of their inherent beauty regardless of whether the beautiful idea is actually true. The logical part of me thinks this is just a fantasy. The dreamer in me watches each new 'breakthrough' in OU truly wanting to believe it's real. Especially when someone uses my magic buzzword of 'electricity siphon'.
Ali - I'm anxiously awaiting further news/verification with regard to your motionless power generator ('The Ali Siphon'). I would love to test a unit personally. If it's real, I am in a position to help you get millions of these units produced and distributed globally.
Post by: lltfdaniel1 on September 11, 2009, 03:32:50 PM
Forest - That's exactly what I envision with an electricity siphon. Unlike Ali, I can't claim I've had any success actually building one. I figure we live in a world full of electrons and conductive material - if a positive charge can be maintained at low or no power then electrons will be pulled in from the ground. Of course they will simply rebalance the charge and stop the process, unless of course you can divert them (using switching technology?) to the load right before they reach ground 0 (the positive charge).
It would seem that capacitors and switches would be the primary tools for such a 'siphon'. I've had no success in real experimentation, but I also don't have background or tools associated with the sophisticated switching technology Ali claims to have.
My own 'mental experiment' would indicate that it is possible to achieve OU, COP>1, using such a technique. But 'mental experiments' are fairly meaningless in the real world unless you're a Jedi Knight. If it's so simple in my head, why hasn't anyone succeeded? Someone on this board commented that we tend to get stuck on ideas because of their inherent beauty regardless of whether the beautiful idea is actually true. The logical part of me thinks this is just a fantasy. The dreamer in me watches each new 'breakthrough' in OU truly wanting to believe it's real. Especially when someone uses my magic buzzword of 'electricity siphon'.
Ali - I'm anxiously awaiting further news/verification with regard to your motionless power generator ('The Ali Siphon'). I would love to test a unit personally. If it's real, I am in a position to help you get millions of these units produced and distributed globally.
Nikola tesla and many others failed at this point i'm afraid.
At least this guy is open about it..from what i have studied voltage is alot faster then current and if you switch quickly it draws power from zpe/ambient.
I think it is best if ali went for the overunity prize for some money this sort of stuff has to be open source i'm afraid.
What i would do is get a 30 volt battery and measure the amps and then run a motor that requires more wattage and then measure the horsepower.
Post by: spoondini on September 11, 2009, 03:37:27 PM
You would think we now have one hell of an advantage over Tela as he was limited to 19th and 20th century tools.....
Post by: spoondini on September 11, 2009, 03:45:34 PM
I would proceed with validation amongst this community, then proceed to raise substantial capital (you've got to have the contacts).
Post by: lltfdaniel1 on September 11, 2009, 03:46:49 PM
Post by: winsonali on September 11, 2009, 04:25:43 PM
you are right, all the sciences are same if some thing happening in physical world say we through a ball on the wall it will back fall.
this is also happening in molecular /atomic world but we can't see it ,mankind blessed with wisdom and vision developed sensor to see those activities
like wise siphon is possible , like my device
mechanical advantage (chain pulley system) like i created extended back time UPS using hysteresis curve as an advantage and switch the system only at right times
Tesla is my mentor a genuine thinker
we need to think out off box , if you can explain electricity mechanically you can treat it like that , just think
one thing more i have developed many more things, coz you are a genuine thinker i can give you a a clue i have developed a machine that works with 2 dimensional forces X and Y and your result is Z
the Y force is gravity going towards earth
the X force is earth magnetic force around the earth
use it together and you will be able to wonders
i am not saying i am perfect but trying to do things, if any forum member is looking to develop something i can do that for him as a project
Ali
Post by: robbie47 on September 11, 2009, 05:11:31 PM
@Ali,
i am not saying i am perfect but trying to do things, if any forum member is looking to develop something i can do that for him as a project
Ali
I don't want to be rude, but aren't we trying to participate in your Genie project already?
It seems that you keep the doors shut on that one.
You are perfectly entitled to do that, but why are you now challenging forum member to do projects with you?
Post by: hartiberlin on September 11, 2009, 05:13:17 PM
can you please let us know, how many capacitors you are using
in your switching circuit ?
Are you only using these visible 3 big caps or do you also have smaller
caps that you use to switch back and forth for the principle to work ?
Are there really no coils at all also no chokes inside your circuit ?
Many thanks.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: spoondini on September 11, 2009, 06:58:00 PM
Going to take a logical leap from your clue:
Since gravity (X) is moving in one direction, and the earth's magnetic field is moving in another direction (Y), the sum X+Y is Z.
If I use a purely mechanical analogy, a ball thrown in a vaccum is moving horizontally at 5 m/s (electrical energy) and accelerating towards the ground at 9.8 m/s^2 (gravity). Utilizing only the electical potential energy (horizontal movement) would limit us to collecting the energy of decelerating the ball by 5 m/s * mass of the ball. The real total potential energy of the moving ball is both the horizontal deceleration potential, and the ball's height from earth * 9.8.
Are you implying that in typical circuits, we only collect the kinetic energy of moving electrons (horizontal movement) without collecting the potential energy of the electrons gravitational pull towards the earth?
If that's the case, it can't be very much energy we're missing out on. I can't recite the math accurately, but in high school physics we did some calculations showing the relative weightings of electrostatic vs gravitational forces inside an atom, and with various electrostatic reactions. Gravity was always a negligible force in comparison with electrostatic forces. That's why it's often referred to as the weakest of the three forces, and not really taken into account.
Even if you harnessed the entire gravitational potential of the electrons passing through your genie - I would not expect to get measurable OU as you have demonstrated.
Can you please elaborate?
Post by: hartiberlin on September 11, 2009, 10:28:18 PM
just had a Skype call with Ali and the Genie circuit is really
much more complicated than I thought.
He is using a DSP for the processing and makes several
computations between taking samples from the input dimmer output.
So it is all pretty complicated and he will soon make a new
video and explain more and I will let him explain it.
I also had a bad WLAN connection, cause I am not at home right now and only
understood each 2nd word only.
So I hope Ali will soon share more knowledge of his device.
He also has 2 more interesting devices and I will let give him
the honour to introduce them.
Many thanks again to Ali and I am looking forward to see his
groundbraking devices.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: teslaalset on September 13, 2009, 03:34:51 PM
Regarding your DC implementation:
You indicated that a normal DC to AC converter can't be used because a neutral from a grid is needed.
When I look into normal DC to AC conterters they indeed use a output transformer.
But can't you just connect one of the secondair connections to the primary connection that usually is connected to a neutral grid line?
See attached example circuit indicating my suggestion by the red connection at the transformer.
Post by: derricka on September 15, 2009, 05:00:26 AM
You can make the connection as you show with your circuit, but it may not work with all inverter units (circuits), as some may have extra feedback circuitry that already violates the transformer isolation, as your addition would do. Most modern inverters would use MOSFETs and PWM circuitry to better approximate a true sine wave output, and feedback helps maintain a proper sine shape under varying load conditions. While most of the better inverters would retain true isolation, even with feedback, you can't assume they all do. Your idea is good, but you should know or check your specific inverter circuit before proceding.
Post by: teslaalset on September 15, 2009, 09:09:59 AM
@ teslaalset
You can make the connection as you show with your circuit, but it may not work with all inverter units (circuits), as some may have extra feedback circuitry that already violates the transformer isolation, as your addition would do. Most modern inverters would use MOSFETs and PWM circuitry to better approximate a true sine wave output, and feedback helps maintain a proper sine shape under varying load conditions. While most of the better inverters would retain true isolation, even with feedback, you can't assume they all do. Your idea is good, but you should know or check your specific inverter circuit before proceding.
Absolutely correct.
I think Ali is knowledgeable enough to understand all this.
Thanks for pointing out though.
Post by: teslaalset on September 16, 2009, 09:13:00 PM
Anyone had any contacts with Ali last few days?
Post by: spoondini on September 16, 2009, 09:36:47 PM
Post by: minde4000 on September 16, 2009, 09:41:14 PM
Ali could keep public here up to date on whats going on not thats he has to but.. time will tell I guess. He said he would share.. :)
Minde
Post by: hartiberlin on September 16, 2009, 11:43:37 PM
that he would take samples via his DSP from the input each 10 milliseconds
or so and then has 40 computations time for taking the next sample from the input.
In these 40 instructions ( computations ) he would charge up the other cap like an
"image" of the other cap and then he told something like a^2 + b^2 or (a+b)^2 or
something like this , I did not understood what he meant by it , maybe somehow the
shadowing of charges inside the caps and thus maybe electrical induction
influence charge generation ??
the connection was pretty bad, so I did not fully got it, what he meant.
He said, he uses a DSP with ADC and DAC converters and maybe his DSP is also
producing the 50 Hz Waveform via an external Power DAC and the Supply Voltage for
the DAC is just using the multiplied input voltage ?
I really wonder, how he produces the 50 Hz waveform from the chopped phase input signals.
He said, with the ADC he can trigger the DSP on the zero point crossing, so he
knows, when the input goes through zero.
Maybe he uses this to generate a new 50 Hz signal based on the zero crossings ?
With DSP code you can do lots of things, so it seems this is pretty complicated all
and will depend mostly on the software.
But it would be good, if we would know the basic effect behind his "? charge-imaging-shadowing ?"
effect, so this could also be tried with simpler switching circuits, not just via a DSP only...
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: FatBird on September 17, 2009, 01:34:30 AM
Thank you for posting and sharing what you know about Ali's Unit.
Could you please ask him what value the 3 Caps are (voltage rating and how many microfarads).
Thank you very much sir,
.
Post by: Mk1 on September 17, 2009, 08:57:50 AM
Post by: robbie47 on September 17, 2009, 10:50:42 PM
This is the core of it all.
It would really help if Ali would explain first how he is doing that.
The next thing to know is what kind of switches he is using.
Are they FETs or Triacs?
Post by: winsonali on September 18, 2009, 12:59:58 AM
stefan have given you the right idea about how the unit is working the switching cannot be more simple otherwise i would have done it the negative edge is very much required to produce high voltages without below zero voltages my unit will not work
i am now a days very busy in further developments sorry for late response
Ali
Post by: hartiberlin on September 18, 2009, 09:28:29 AM
but is using capacitors instead of a Resistor network ?
So it would be a C2C network of caps ?
So, when it is just 4 bits parallel DAC he just needs only 4 electronic switches to
switch 4 different big capacitors.
For a staircase sine wave he will then have 16 staircase steps which would
be okay to approximate the sine waveform.
Okay, this is just a guess and I don´t know, if he is doing it this way,
but I ponder, how he is generating his 50 Hz waveform at the output...
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: teslaalset on September 18, 2009, 12:18:21 PM
Then you need only one switching element.
Some DSP's support sinus PWM output functions because the embedded DA converter consists of one a bit output that requires an external capacitor.
The DSP monitors output wave shape en amplitude by taking samples from the load and than adjust PWM switch that transfers energy from local buffer(s) to output.
There may be two local power buffers, one with a positive voltage, one with a negative voltage.
One will do, when you first reverse + and - poles of the internal power buffer once you need to change the polarity of the output voltage.
To save components one can also leave the output capacitor out and connect the PWM switch directly to the load.
Post by: EMdevices on September 19, 2009, 06:46:38 AM
you don't have to build a DC input for your device, just go buy a cheap 12 Volt inverter (100 Watt or so) and use that to create your 220 V AC that goes to the dimmer.
If you really get 5 times more power output from your device, or whatever you claim, the insertion loss of the inverter should be insignificant, so just measure the DC power input to the inverter and the AC power output to the light bulbs and you will prove to us it works as claimed.
Just an idea,
EM
Post by: MasterPlaster on September 19, 2009, 10:40:54 AM
Post by: spoondini on September 19, 2009, 04:30:59 PM
How long will the genie output 5x the input power?
Post by: neha9243 on September 19, 2009, 06:29:26 PM
the method of DC input to the inverter and then dimmer to genie and o/p of jenie to bulbs will clear all the doubts
Post by: Omega_0 on September 20, 2009, 03:43:32 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EB-jWfzkz_E
Post by: teslaalset on September 20, 2009, 05:39:13 PM
Interesting presentation on "self energy" of capacitors:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EB-jWfzkz_E (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EB-jWfzkz_E)
Omega, that might be a very essential finding for this thread.
Could be one of the missing links here.
According to Stephen, Ali used terms like (a+b)^2 in his Skype conversation.
Look to the energy formula in Eue Jin Jeong's video......
Also, in Eue Jin Jeong's youtube video he mentioned a Forced Harmonic Oscillation. Another resemblance?
Post by: Omega_0 on September 21, 2009, 10:04:45 AM
Lets see what Ali has to say on this.
Post by: hartiberlin on September 21, 2009, 10:56:31 AM
Please also study his website at www.dipoleantigravity.blogspot.com
Post by: MasterPlaster on September 21, 2009, 01:56:17 PM
Have you invited him to join the forum?
Post by: EMdevices on September 21, 2009, 06:36:32 PM
Interesting presentation on "self energy" of capacitors:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EB-jWfzkz_E
Interesting Bullshit, that's my opinion.
EM
Post by: PaulLowrance on September 21, 2009, 07:22:40 PM
but someone in this thread just recently posted a youtube video that contains valuable research that should *never* be lost.
So far, every time I mention the details of my research that has now crossed paths with the science outlined in this youtube video in addition to the work of Marcus Reid, someone tells me either in a public forum (another forum) of in private that my health is now at risk! Hopefully the admin at this forum will not allow such personal attacks.
A EE, by profession, that has verified my diode claims started a new method for testing my diode claim by means of using a piezo element. This EE was shocked that at while using specialized instruments, in this case an Electrometer, that the piezo it self produces DC current & voltage. And yes, this EE placed the piezo in a shielded chassis. For over a month I've verified this myself!
The break through in my research is that the link between my research and various others is the built in electric potential! The diode has an intense build in field at the junction. The piezo has a permanent electric field due to dipole alignment. Same goes for Electrets.
I'm copying that youtube video. Lets make sure this science never vanishes again!
Lets start a new thread on this topic. I'll do it.
PL
ps, contact me in private for further discussion. Thanks!
Post by: the_big_m_in_ok on September 22, 2009, 01:24:28 AM
Ok here is the video posted by winsonal@cat
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvzSuSTRA2M
only one video on his Channel page
cat
Is there a wiring schematic for this circuit?
--Lee
Post by: the_big_m_in_ok on September 22, 2009, 01:25:42 AM
Ok here is the video posted by winsonal@cat
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvzSuSTRA2M
only one video on his Channel page
cat
Is there a schematic for this? I can see three large capacitors on the left side of the unit in the video.
--Lee
Post by: hartiberlin on September 22, 2009, 11:26:58 AM
the circuit of Dr. Jeong is here on his blog,
unfortunately a bit small in resolution...
http://www.dipoleantigravity.blogspot.com/
I emailed him to come over here.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: spoondini on September 22, 2009, 01:34:32 PM
Post by: powercat on September 22, 2009, 01:55:20 PM
@cat
Is there a schematic for this? I can see three large capacitors on the left side of the unit in the video.
--Lee
Hi Lee
if there was a schematic I would have posted it
@all
I take it that nobody has visited Ali ?
Hi Ali
are you still okay with someone from this forum visiting you in London and viewing your device ?
cat
Post by: PaulLowrance on September 22, 2009, 07:37:00 PM
Post by: PaulLowrance on September 22, 2009, 07:42:00 PM
This is so wrong. There is no proof of anything.
Just some crappy formulas and mysterious music to make it cool.
If you belive in this type of videos then ask yourself why it
is shown at youtube instead of being carefully tested and
evaluated by the right "skilled people" before the information
is released together with serious backing of validated data.
If really working then there would be strong economical interests
to make money on this and keep it from being publicly available.
As usual there is a sick & twisted mind behind this worthless crap.
Wrong place for this thread, right? Here's a new thread -->
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=8082
Paul
Post by: the_big_m_in_ok on September 24, 2009, 01:44:33 AM
Hi LeeHey cat,
if there was a schematic I would have posted it
I saw the video, which was relatively straightforward. The spherical capacitor might make a difference compared to other systems, as well as the "cold cathode" device(s), which I heard little of.
Otherwise, the Electret effect should account for Dr. Eugene's claims. And, his papers seems to be well received by all but the academic community.
--Lee
Post by: raldski_RnD on September 24, 2009, 08:35:19 AM
Im new in this forum and have read most of the responses. We are interested in knowing more about your device but I remember going back to the earlier posts from this forum about measuring and verifying the input and output power.
Regardless of what technology you are using in your device, may it be switch-mode technology, resonance, capacitive or inductive circuit or whatever kind, a power meter reading will accurately prove that your findings of over-unity are correct. Is it ok if you can show us measurements of apparent power, reactive power, and real power in the input and output of your device.... or just power, current, and power factor. Whether its DC or AC output or input, it wont matter. That's just about it, the data that is needed for conclusion. For industry standard, I suggest using Power Analyzer from Hioki, Fluke and Voltech.
Like I said, we hope you really found something, and if not, I hope you wont stop trying. ;)
Regards
raldski_RnD
Post by: Lucian Stefan on September 26, 2009, 10:01:55 PM
Post by: gyulasun on September 27, 2009, 12:54:53 AM
See in the attachament un true motionless electric generator. The inventions is from 1975 and there a lot of documents to be posted about this, but they are bigger than 300 or 1100 Kb...
Hi Lucian,
You can upload up to 5MB files to the Download section here:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=downloads
see the Category Names in the middle of the page and feel free to upload the files.
rgds, Gyula
Post by: the_big_m_in_ok on September 27, 2009, 05:08:30 AM
See in the attachament un true motionless electric generator. The inventions is from 1975 and there a lot of documents to be posted about this, but they are bigger than 300 or 1100 Kb...@Lucian Stefan
You're quite correct in what you claim for the invention in the PDF.
The inventor(s) were French, and what others had analyzed was that iron was being transmuted to a different isotope with surplus electrons being harvested.
I would have to search for the Internet reference, which was old.
Re-edit, try this:
http://www.rexresearch/meyernmr/meyer.htm
(This will give you more information than the post above. It worked the first time I tried it, but the second time, Comcast gave my an error that 'rexresearch' had an unknown page. The correct address was still on the browser address bar and it worked.)
--Lee
Post by: gyulasun on September 27, 2009, 10:32:44 AM
Re-edit, try this:
http://www.rexresearch/meyernmr/meyer.htm
(This will give you more information than the post above. It worked the first time I tried it, but the second time, Comcast gave my an error that 'rexresearch' had an unknown page. The correct address was still on the browser address bar and it worked.)
--Lee
Hi Lee,
From your above link, the .com suffix is missing from the rexresearch's end.
Here is it again, correctly: http://www.rexresearch.com/meyernmr/meyer.htm
rgds, Gyula
Post by: powercat on September 27, 2009, 11:13:47 AM
Are you guys saying that this document contains the secret of how Ali's device works ?
Unfortunately Google translator was unable to translate the document.
cat
Post by: gyulasun on September 27, 2009, 11:40:14 AM
Hi Gyula & Lee
Are you guys saying that this document contains the secret of how Ali's device works ?
Unfortunately Google translator was unable to translate the document.
cat
hi cat,
From my part, no I am not saying that. I don't know yet how Ali's device works.
I think Lucian Stefan just wanted to show what HE thinks to be THE motionless electric generator, that is all. I chimed in only to correct the mistake in the url link Lee showed.
Here is a link on learning some more on the Meyer (French inventor) device:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=4333.0
rgds, Gyula
EDIT: Google cannot translate text which is included in a picture embedded in a html or similar web page, this is the reason.
However if you look at the Meyer patent at the European Patent Office, then there is a free machine translation service there. See this link leading to the Description part of the FR2680613 patent text:
http://v3.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/description?CC=FR&NR=2680613A1&KC=A1&FT=D&date=19930226&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP and if you click on the yellow icon 'Translate this text' , then you will receive the computer translation English text from the French one in a newly opening page. Similarly, other French patents involved here can also be translated this way.
Post by: Lucian Stefan on September 27, 2009, 11:43:28 AM
I know the content of rex research file, because... I posted it there.
You can find there also an old article of "Science et Vie" no.700/Jan. 1976 (when Michel Meyer was 22 Yo.). In the experiments described there he used copper as extraction material with the apparently efficiency of 30-40 and the real efficiency less than 10^-6.
There are also another documents and studies about the same principle.
In the attachament, the cover of Science et Vie no. 700/January 1976, the interesting article at pag.42-45, at "Physique" box.
Post by: powercat on September 27, 2009, 12:03:42 PM
can you please be more accurate and specific with the information you post
can you only post information related to this thread and ideally in English.
If you read through this thread you would have noticed the inventor Ali has said that he uses no coils in his invention.
Please only post relevant information to this thread
cat
Post by: Lucian Stefan on September 27, 2009, 12:11:26 PM
the coils are not moving parts ; a device with coils is also "motionless"...
I hope.
Post by: powercat on September 27, 2009, 12:28:48 PM
Ali said his invention has no coils, moving or not moving ,he said no coils
I am only trying to keep this thread on topic.
Anyway it is looking like your information is going down well on another thread
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=8073.msg202494;topicseen#msg202494
so please if you can figure out how Ali's device works let us know your thoughts ;)
cat
Post by: powercat on September 27, 2009, 12:48:14 PM
hi cat,
From my part, no I am not saying that. I don't know yet how Ali's device works.
I think Lucian Stefan just wanted to show what HE thinks to be THE motionless electric generator, that is all. I chimed in only to correct the mistake in the url link Lee showed.
Here is a link on learning some more on the Meyer (French inventor) device:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=4333.0
rgds, Gyula
EDIT: Google cannot translate text which is included in a picture embedded in a html or similar web page, this is the reason.
However if you look at the Meyer patent at the European Patent Office, then there is a free machine translation service there. See this link leading to the Description part of the FR2680613 patent text:
http://v3.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/description?CC=FR&NR=2680613A1&KC=A1&FT=D&date=19930226&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP and if you click on the yellow icon 'Translate this text' , then you will receive the computer translation English text from the French one in a newly opening page. Similarly, other French patents involved here can also be translated this way.
Thank's Gyula
Having read the translation my understanding of it still leaves a lot to be desired :P
It has been a while since we heard from Ali, I hope all is good with him
cat
Post by: Lucian Stefan on September 27, 2009, 02:44:30 PM
Now I have to see the scheme "so I can pronounce a verdict".
His device has two supply cables- one (white cable) which supply the panel with lamps, and one which goes under the table in the left side. The device has three capacitors and electric resistance. Ali pretend that the device generates a supplement of energy...
Well, the energy is not an abstract thing- there are several forms of energy. First of all- we have to determine THE SOURCE and THE FORM OF ENERGY. The so-called "O.U. devices" are in most cases collectors of free energy,- from vacuum, from atmosphere (the free electric charges), from soil and atmosphere, from the electric charges which drives in the molecular structure of the extraction material, etc, etc. I don't see what could be the supplementary SOURCE in case of Ali.
I see a capacitors device conected through two cables, which apparently make a supplement of power in the circuit. I don't like how the scene was filmed, the camera operator of shooting avoiding to show all the scene from appropriate distance, not only the table surface at the same angle. The circuits with capacitors could make impulses of voltage, but for supplementary power IT NEED TO BE a supplementary source, doesn't matter what kind of source- the vacuum, the cosmic radiation, the solar wind, the free electric charges from air and soil, the "maverick" electrons inside the molecules, etc. Moreover, Ali doesn't describe clear the circuit he used- so, we cannot know if this device has or not coils; if it has electric resistences or fuses, to be sure it has windings (coils).
I post the informations about Michel Meyer because his device is not a fake, it is explained scientifically and could give at output 30-40 more power than it consumes. The Meyer converter uses the property of atoms to be oscillating systems, the electrons (orbitals) being the oscillating parts of atom. Through resonance phenomenon, the atoms eliberates electrons- so it appears a supplementary flow of electrons and hence additional power. The principle was been tested by another independent persons in another countries, including Romania.
I did only some remarks on the film shown by Ali - I'm waiting the scheme to see the work principle and to determine THE SOURCE of additional energy.
Post by: markdansie on September 27, 2009, 03:04:46 PM
Just to clear up some confusion you said:
"The type of Moraru Engine which I have "replicated" , produces 117 times more energy than it consumes, and my model is not the most improved made by Moraru... "
Then in a latter post you said you diD not measure your device with instruments?
Just for your information , Ali has generously allowed his device to be tested by a qualified physicist and electrical engineer who are assisting him with advice and accurate measurements. This is a testament to Ali's belief and honesty. I am wondering given your statements above if you would be willing to have your device tested? I might add that Ali has been offered support by many good people and so far no one has attempted to suppress the technology.
Once again markdansie@bigpond.com
Kind Regards
Mark
Post by: Lucian Stefan on September 27, 2009, 03:25:57 PM
Nicolae Moraru was been inventor and scientist, professional research-engineer. About Ali, I not wish to delete your hopes or your private beliefs. Assuming that there is an invention, if Mr. Ali wish to publish his invention, he is free to do it. Ask him his wonder device and you'll have the O.U., isn't it ? Simple.
Moraru Magnetic Engine is not to be published; Nicolae Moraru didn't published, I keep his desire. The only public patent is the RO 109405 and I have already post it.
Post by: markdansie on September 27, 2009, 03:54:34 PM
Hi, firstly my appollogies for not expressing myself well.
I was referring to your replication. Are you willing to have that tested ?
Your Quotes:
"For me, it is simple to use their documents and my small demonstration device.
"The type of Moraru "Engine which I have "replicated"
In the case of Ali, time will tell, but at least he is working with others on establishing correct measuring procedures.
Kind Regards
Mark
Post by: teslaalset on September 27, 2009, 03:55:24 PM
They have a resonance frequency at several 10KHz where they act as very low resistors. e.g. a few tens of an ohm.
An example of a replacement diagram for these capacitors is attached.
The leakage resistor is normally a few 10K ohm, which is bypassed in case resonance.
The coil value is normally a few tens of nanoHenries
Since it looks like Ali uses 3 big electrolytical capacitors, there will be three different frequencies that correspond to these three capacitors, due to tolerances. Maybe he uses this some how.
Post by: tagor on September 27, 2009, 06:33:57 PM
Hi,
I know the content of rex research file, because... I posted it there.
You can find there also an old article of "Science et Vie" no.700/Jan. 1976 (when Michel Meyer was 22 Yo.). In the experiments described there he used copper as extraction material with the apparently efficiency of 30-40 and the real efficiency less than 10^-6.
There are also another documents and studies about the same principle.
In the attachament, the cover of Science et Vie no. 700/January 1976, the interesting article at pag.42-45, at "Physique" box.
you can read this article here ( in french )
http://franckvallee.free.fr/localhost/plain/content/download/137/535/file/Science%20&%20vie.PDF
i spoke a lot on this in this thread , in french
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=4744.msg99000#msg99000
but in this thread , in english
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=1310.msg93301#msg93301
a lot of replicators , but ...
nothing ... no OU ...
Post by: tagor on September 27, 2009, 06:50:24 PM
Hi Lucian Stefan
Ali said his invention has no coils, moving or not moving ,he said no coils
I am only trying to keep this thread on topic.
Anyway it is looking like your information is going down well on another thread
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=8073.msg202494;topicseen#msg202494
so please if you can figure out how Ali's device works let us know your thoughts ;)
cat
you are right
this is not Ali's device
this off topic
Post by: tagor on September 27, 2009, 06:56:23 PM
See in the attachament un true motionless electric generator. The inventions is from 1975 and there a lot of documents to be posted about this, but they are bigger than 300 or 1100 Kb...
I am french
I know this invention
but
have you ever seen a such invention working ?
"science et vie" is a very very very bad reference
Post by: the_big_m_in_ok on September 27, 2009, 07:10:15 PM
@Lucian Stefan
You're quite correct in what you claim for the invention in the PDF.
The inventor(s) were French, and what others had analyzed was that iron was being transmuted to a different isotope with surplus electrons being harvested.
I would have to search for the Internet reference, which was old.
Re-edit, try this:
http://www.rexresearch/meyernmr/meyer.htm
(This will give you more information than the post above. It worked the first time I tried it, but the second time, Comcast gave my an error that 'rexresearch' had an unknown page. The correct address was still on the browser address bar and it worked.)
--Lee
Sorry, typo above,
correct Web address:
http://www.rexresearch.com/meyernmr/meyer.htm
Post by: Lucian Stefan on September 27, 2009, 07:10:38 PM
Unfortunately, you are doing a confusion. I know very well what I am talking- the article that you are talking about is from "Science et Vie" no. 698 of november 1975 and it is about Pr. Valle and its theory of "synergetics". Another principle, another thing.
I've never said that "Meyer generator" schould be the same with the "Ali's generator". In the attachament the cover of "Science et Vie" no. 698/nov. 1975 and the content of this revue.
Post by: Lucian Stefan on September 27, 2009, 07:30:14 PM
Quote
have you ever seen a such invention working ?
Talking about Michel Meyer's two patents,- No. I haven't made it. There was two engineers in Romania, in the '80th- they claimed that the Meyer's resonant generator should work. I repeat- I haven't made it myself but in the theory of this generator I don't find anything wrong. So I believe that claims. Two or three years ago, I have contacted "Science et Vie" asking about this article of S.V. no. 700 of January 1976- they told me that was the only article about Meyer and it was not a joke, the young physicist (that time) Meyer making several demonstrations even at the magazine's editorial, with the control devices of other physicists. That time, Meyer obtained his first patent but the text has been censored. More recently, in 1995, Meyer obtained another patent somehow similar in the matter of principle applied.
I haven't replicated any Meyer's generator. I just know that in Romania in the middle '80th two engineers did it and they claimed the device woked. That's all.
Post by: Lucian Stefan on September 27, 2009, 07:31:59 PM
http://www.rexresearch.com/meyernmr/meyer.htm
It is not necessary to give me that link, because I am the author of the rex research article...
Post by: tagor on September 27, 2009, 07:51:33 PM
I've never said that "Meyer generator" schould be the same with the "Ali's generator". In the attachament the cover of "Science et Vie" no. 698/nov. 1975 and the content of this revue.
if you want to speak of this device go on this thread :
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=4333.msg84558#msg84558
a lot of replication , nothing working
Quote
Note that "science et vie" is a popularization publication not very serious. "Renaud de la Taille" was an enthusiastic journalist but has not a solid scientifical background
Post by: Lucian Stefan on September 27, 2009, 08:22:40 PM
ia lot of replication , nothing working
Do not confuse those comments with "replications"; the replications are made in the laboratories with recording equipment, by people who know better what to do, how to do, etc. -those comments in the forum is something else.
So, the correct answer is : a lot of comments, nothing working. Yes, indeed !
Post by: jan.kolar on September 27, 2009, 08:42:49 PM
I am new at this forum. I have read all this thread and I am really curious if Ali's device is truly overunity or no. Sorry if my english is no perfect, I am from Slovakia.
I have some idea what this mysterious siphon effect could be. Imagine two capacitors with the same capacity C. Let both plates of both capacitors to be electrically neutral (i.e. number of positive and negative charges is the same). First capacitor is charged by moving some number of electrons from one plate to another. After that first plate has charge +Q and second plate has charge -Q. So the charge difference is 2Q. Voltage between plates then will be:
U1 = 2Q/C
Second capacitor will be initially charged by moving double amount of charges. So amount of charges at both plates will be -2Q and +2Q. Voltage between plates will be:
U2 = 4Q/C
Now comes important step. Imagine, that from some source we move charge -2Q to second plate. After this plate becomes electrically neutral. But first plate still contains charge -2Q, which creates potential difference:
U2' = 2Q/C (in absolute terms)
So if we use conventional voltmeter, these two capacitors will be indistinguishable. But if we connect positive pole of first capacitor with positive pole of second capacitor and negative pole of first capacitor with negative pole of second capacitor, there will be current flowing because of charge imbalances. So maybe not only voltage is important, but also potential! Remember, that Ali said, that his circuit must be powered with AC source with both polarities against neutral wire.
Post by: the_big_m_in_ok on September 27, 2009, 09:25:50 PM
It is not necessary to give me that link, because I am the author of the rex research article...Sure, I agree. It's just that others may not have the information, and some of this whole site is archival in nature.
"More .PDFs" and my own patent thread in the "Extracting electricity from the atmosphere" forums come to mind at once.
--Lee
Post by: teslaalset on September 27, 2009, 09:56:51 PM
I have some idea what this mysterious siphon effect could be.
Imagine, that from some source we move charge -2Q to second plate. After this plate becomes electrically neutral. But first plate still contains charge -2Q, which creates potential difference:
U2' = 2Q/C (in absolute terms)
So if we use conventional voltmeter, these two capacitors will be indistinguishable. But if we connect positive pole of first capacitor with positive pole of second capacitor and negative pole of first capacitor with negative pole of second capacitor, there will be current flowing because of charge imbalances. So maybe not only voltage is important, but also potential! Remember, that Ali said, that his circuit must be powered with AC source with both polarities against neutral wire.
Jan, that is an interesting approach.
If I combine this charge imbalance with the non-ideal behaviour of Elco's there must be an natural oscillation when connecting two of such capacitors.
By switching the connection at very specific time slots you can move charges and keep the capacitors unbalanced.
Post by: hartiberlin on September 27, 2009, 10:09:27 PM
Now comes important step. Imagine, that from some source we move charge -2Q to second plate. After this plate becomes electrically neutral. But first plate still contains charge -2Q, which creates potential difference:
U2' = 2Q/C (in absolute terms)
Hi Jan,
how would you do this ?
Just using one one wire (one connector pole) only ?
Wouldn´t this only work with high voltage ?
Quote
So if we use conventional voltmeter, these two capacitors will be indistinguishable. But if we connect positive pole of first capacitor with positive pole of second capacitor and negative pole of first capacitor with negative pole of second capacitor, there will be current flowing because of charge imbalances. So maybe not only voltage is important, but also potential! Remember, that Ali said, that his circuit must be powered with AC source with both polarities against neutral wire.
Hmm, don´t you think that there will really be flowing charges, although
both voltages of both caps will be the same ?
Can somebody please try this ?
I am currently in Austria and can´t experiment right now.
If there will be flowing really a current then this really could be an effect
that Ali is using and maybe charging this way the 3rd cap up with more voltage and charges,
if he puts both caps in series.
Many thanks for these interesting ideas.
Post by: forest on September 27, 2009, 10:24:39 PM
It's essential to have capacitors which can be charged by induction ,that means if one terminal is connected to source of HV positive second is charged by induction,pulling electrons from other capacitor.
The effect is pulling electrons from ground while generating on each spark gap discharge high frequency oscillations. If there is a path between both capacitors to dump such oscillation to third capacitor, it will be charged at a very fast rate. The end is inverter which drain third capacitor at slower rate (for example 50hz).
Seems it's one of the method of using radiant electricity in one kind of OU devices. BAsed on Tesla patent from 1901 for example 0685957 -Apparatus for the utilization of radiant energy
Post by: markdansie on September 27, 2009, 10:48:23 PM
Hi, firstly my appollogies for not expressing myself well.
I was referring to your replication. Are you willing to have that tested ?
Your Quotes:
"For me, it is simple to use their documents and my small demonstration device.
"The type of Moraru "Engine which I have "replicated"
In the case of Ali, time will tell, but at least he is working with others on establishing correct measuring procedures.
Kind Regards
Mark
Post by: jan.kolar on September 28, 2009, 08:05:11 AM
Hi Jan,See my uploaded file for preliminary scheme. Two loads are equivalent for elevation in Ali's example with bath tub.
how would you do this ?
Just using one one wire (one connector pole) only ?
Wouldn´t this only work with high voltage ?I think principle should work independently of voltage. But maybe high voltage is needed for measurable effects, i dont know at this moment.
Hmm, don´t you think that there will really be flowing charges, although
both voltages of both caps will be the same ?
Some notes to work of Ali. I think DC unit is not necessary for testing overunity. Even if power unit will be DC, current flowing from source can have alternating components (f > 0Hz) when making fourier analysis (maybe high frequency spikes). So we need quality hf ampermeter with true rms, ideally high frequency oscilloscope to see shape of curves. I also noted that control system is powered with 12V, 0.25A (i cant see videos because i have only mobile internet). This power input should also be measured with the same method to convince all sceptics.
Post by: jan.kolar on September 28, 2009, 08:21:03 AM
Post by: jan.kolar on September 28, 2009, 09:24:58 AM
Hi Jan,
how would you do this ?
Just using one one wire (one connector pole) only ?
Wouldn´t this only work with high voltage ?
Sorry i have not answered this question clearly in my previous posts. My guess is, that Ali charges first capacitor with positive-halfwave and second capacitor with negative half-wave. So both capacitors should have slightly differing potentials and maybe charges. Third capacitor serves like free-energy collector i mean.
Post by: hartiberlin on September 28, 2009, 11:35:36 AM
Enjoy !
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: jan.kolar on September 28, 2009, 02:17:13 PM
If you charge first capacitor with positive half-wave and second capacitor with negative half-wave (both with the same capacitance), this can be compared to two identical bath tubes, one above the other. Voltage accross capacitors (i.e. water level in our analogy) is the same, but first capacitor has higher potential energy (first bath tub is in higher elevation so has higher gravitational potential energy).
One more note regarding DSP & complicated software that Ali is using. I think another reason (beside what i mentioned) for such a solution is to optimize the process of capacitor charging. If you have simple serial RC circuit and connect it to constant DC voltage source then energy dissipated in resistance in process of charging is the same as energy of electric field in capacitor 1/2CU^2. Regardless of how large is R (1ohm, 10ohm, 100ohm,...)! You can compute this using Kirchhoff laws. I have made such calculations few years ago. To optimize the process of charging it is necessary to increase source voltage gradually. Some notes about this can you find on beginning of this article
http://www.physics.princeton.edu/~mcdonald/examples/EM/fundaun_ajp_60_1047_92.pdf
This technique is used in modern integrated circuits to save energy.
Post by: Omega_0 on September 28, 2009, 03:58:03 PM
Hi folks
I am new at this forum. I have read all this thread and I am really curious if Ali's device is truly overunity or no. Sorry if my english is no perfect, I am from Slovakia.
I have some idea what this mysterious siphon effect could be. Imagine two capacitors with the same capacity C. Let both plates of both capacitors to be electrically neutral (i.e. number of positive and negative charges is the same). First capacitor is charged by moving some number of electrons from one plate to another. After that first plate has charge +Q and second plate has charge -Q. So the charge difference is 2Q. Voltage between plates then will be:
U1 = 2Q/C
Second capacitor will be initially charged by moving double amount of charges. So amount of charges at both plates will be -2Q and +2Q. Voltage between plates will be:
U2 = 4Q/C
Now comes important step. Imagine, that from some source we move charge -2Q to second plate. After this plate becomes electrically neutral. But first plate still contains charge -2Q, which creates potential difference:
U2' = 2Q/C (in absolute terms)
So if we use conventional voltmeter, these two capacitors will be indistinguishable. But if we connect positive pole of first capacitor with positive pole of second capacitor and negative pole of first capacitor with negative pole of second capacitor, there will be current flowing because of charge imbalances. So maybe not only voltage is important, but also potential! Remember, that Ali said, that his circuit must be powered with AC source with both polarities against neutral wire.
I'm sorry but its wrong. You could have tested it before posting.
You can't charge only one plate of a capacitor, the charge immediately appears on the other plate through induction.
The plate won't become electrically neutral, the second plate will immediately induce opposite charge in it, and the voltage will change. That's what capacitors do and that's how they work.
Post by: jan.kolar on September 28, 2009, 08:05:08 PM
I'm sorry but its wrong. You could have tested it before posting.
You can't charge only one plate of a capacitor, the charge immediately appears on the other plate through induction.
The plate won't become electrically neutral, the second plate will immediately induce opposite charge in it, and the voltage will change. That's what capacitors do and that's how they work.
Yes, electrostatic induction will happen, but this effect only redistributes charge. It can't somehow magically create new charges from nothing. I think it is perfectly possible for one plate to be electrically neutral, for example by friction. See my explanatory diagrams.
Post by: the_big_m_in_ok on September 28, 2009, 08:26:20 PM
Here is a better resolution diagram from Dr. Jeong, that he emailed me.Very good, hartiberlin. That's a much better rendition.
Enjoy !
Regards, Stefan.
But the questions arise in my mind:
What would be the effect of using 1:1 toroid transformers to replace the transformers on the right side of the diagram?
What would be the effect of replacing the 20 nanofarad capacitor with the spherical capacitor in Dr. Jeong's video that he says works? Is there one in the diagram now?
--Lee
Post by: teslaalset on September 28, 2009, 09:34:31 PM
1) charge C1 to +12V, C2 to +24V with common ground. C1 has equal capacity as C2.
2) disconnect C1 and C2 from each other and from ground
3) connect C1+ with C2- , resulting in 36V overall voltage
4) disconnect C1 and C2, what is the voltage across each C?
5) connect C- of either C to ground, whats the new voltage over C?
Post by: gotoluc on September 28, 2009, 11:00:29 PM
OK, a nice puzzle for you:
1) charge C1 to +12V, C2 to +24V with common ground. C1 has equal capacity as C2.
2) disconnect C1 and C2 from each other and from ground
3) connect C1+ with C2- , resulting in 36V overall voltage
4) disconnect C1 and C2, what is the voltage across each C?
5) connect C- of either C to ground, whats the new voltage over C?
Hi teslaalset,
I did your puzzle test and I'm puzzle by not finding anything other then C1 and C2 being close to the same as when first charged (except for a small loss of voltage which is normal).
What are your test result showing you? Also you're not very clear about the ground. Is this Earth Ground or electrical panel ground? since I have read that these grounds are very different between Europe and North America electrical system.
Luc
Post by: teslaalset on September 30, 2009, 02:10:52 PM
Hi teslaalset,
I did your puzzle test and I'm puzzle by not finding anything other then C1 and C2 being close to the same as when first charged (except for a small loss of voltage which is normal).
What are your test result showing you? Also you're not very clear about the ground. Is this Earth Ground or electrical panel ground? since I have read that these grounds are very different between Europe and North America electrical system.
Luc
Luc, I checked it myself in practice. You are 100% correct.
I meant electrical panel ground, but as you indicated it does not matter to connect to ground or not.
Thanks!
Post by: teslaalset on October 05, 2009, 09:21:56 AM
It's been too quiet for a while.
Post by: MasterPlaster on October 05, 2009, 11:02:20 AM
Post by: YeahRight on October 05, 2009, 01:47:36 PM
He's probably busy making the new designs he told us about and later on when he tries
to close the loop he realises he was all wrong from the start and there is no overunity.
But of course we won't get to know about this, simply because he will continue to work on
his 'Siphon' to make it into overunity mode. This takes a lot of time and once he run out on
ideas to try, this thread is dead and buried and we will never hear from him again.
Not many people can swallow their pride and admit they were wrong.
Post by: jibbguy on October 05, 2009, 03:37:33 PM
I guess that knee jerk reaction just goes on in "perpetual motion" ;D
Post by: YeahRight on October 05, 2009, 04:03:25 PM
LERN /Cold Fusion
You mean "LENR - Low Energy Nuclear Reactions"
http://peswiki.com/energy/Directory:Cold_Fusion
Post by: teslaalset on October 05, 2009, 04:39:12 PM
Post by: jibbguy on October 05, 2009, 05:03:55 PM
Post by: YeahRight on October 05, 2009, 05:57:31 PM
When reported it was replicated over and over by universities but it is so extremely
hard to successfully run a cold fusion setup. And I'm not yet sure the new progress
really is cold fusion or just some other reaction behaving very similar to cold fusion.
I keep a tight track on progress reports and so far I have not seen any rock solid
evidence on a successful cold fusion result. (Being replicated and confirmed that is)
If I'm wrong on this please direct me to a successful cold fusion experiment that is
replicated and confirmed by validated universities or other serious research groups.
Post by: jibbguy on October 05, 2009, 06:52:06 PM
Find them yourself, They certainly exist ;) Do something besides sneer for once.
You cant pull that shit here, these are highly regarded professors with impeccable records for scientific accuracy... They make naysayers blowing bubbles out of their ass look like stuttering retards.
If you "don't like it" that they have verified the effect over a hundred times, and that it also removes radiation from nearby metals that are radioactive, or that it can transmute elements (lol show us a law of Chemistry that accounts for that), too friggin bad, and frankly, no one cares.
We've had it with the likes of you.... Show us something besides "no", or bugger off.
Post by: tagor on October 05, 2009, 06:57:05 PM
I don't believe there have been any suppression involved in the case of Cold Fusion.
When reported it was replicated over and over by universities but it is so extremely
hard to successfully run a cold fusion setup. And I'm not yet sure the new progress
really is cold fusion or just some other reaction behaving very similar to cold fusion.
I keep a tight track on progress reports and so far I have not seen any rock solid
evidence on a successful cold fusion result. (Being replicated and confirmed that is)
If I'm wrong on this please direct me to a successful cold fusion experiment that is
replicated and confirmed by validated universities or other serious research groups.
now there is a lot of replication and easy to replicate
but with a lot of money for the component
and very little money for the experimenters !!
Post by: teslaalset on October 05, 2009, 08:11:55 PM
Cold fusion is discussed elsewhere in this forum
Thanks.
Post by: YeahRight on October 05, 2009, 09:25:35 PM
I asked you to direct me to a validated study of cold fusion and you behave like a 12 year old puberty boy.
I looked through the so called evidence you refer to and there is still no validated and confirmed
reports on 100% working cold fusion without the slightest doubt. You seem to believe cold fusion is
an everyday science 'working good' at this moment and confirmed with real proof and data. ::)
You should respond nicely when asked for evidence but instead you react erratic just like a FE fanatic.
Here's one of the latest CF reports but this is still not evidence, just hopes based on early test results.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5j2QobOQnlULUZ7oalSRUVjnlHjng
But this report doesn't matter as long as no others can replicate the process in a repeatable way.
Lol there are over 120 successful Studies and Papers of them (last year when i checked anyway, prolly more now). Why direct you there, so you can just piss on them with absolutely nothing to back you?
Find them yourself, They certainly exist ;) Do something besides sneer for once.
You cant pull that shit here, these are highly regarded professors with impeccable records for scientific accuracy... They make naysayers blowing bubbles out of their ass look like stuttering retards.
If you "don't like it" that they have verified the effect over a hundred times, and that it also removes radiation from nearby metals that are radioactive, or that it can transmute elements (lol show us a law of Chemistry that accounts for that), too friggin bad, and frankly, no one cares.
We've had it with the likes of you.... Show us something besides "no", or bugger off.
Post by: jibbguy on October 05, 2009, 10:08:01 PM
Why waste time on this? I won't ;) Ive done the research, published my findings a year before the Navy announcement or Sixty Minutes program. If you haven't seen it, too friggin bad, im not the "JibWiki". I am always glad to post links for those legitimately interested in learning.. But as i said before, you can bugger off now for all i care... Go make a new forum name maybe and re-invent yourself as someone that is worth listening to, cause you've shown us what you are with your first posts here (those that haven't seen them yet, forum "Search" his name and read them).
Rudeness comes to those who deserve it. Lol you guys always act shocked when someone won't take your crap online. And it's always hilarious, when these "people" who come on with the ad hominem and derision attacks, try the "how terribly rude" complaints when they get it thrown back at them: Only done more effectively ;)
This forum is for study and learning of shared interests, and if you come here to piss on us, YOU WILL GET WET, because thats what happens when you piss up a rope.
Post by: YeahRight on October 05, 2009, 10:52:16 PM
If you are so sure of Cold Fusion evidence, then you better hand over some real proof to support
your claims. Unless you can do that instead of all the whining, then there is no real proof.
C'mon. Give me some real proof on 100% certified cold fusion. This is the only thing I ask from you.
I bet you can't do this!
Post by: jibbguy on October 05, 2009, 11:20:32 PM
Besides, there is nothing we could post that wouldn't get attacked as "crap", because that is what you do. Now, that certainly wouldn't change any minds around here, but, that is the case nonetheless.
So forget it. I've got a better idea:
You explain to us, with research and links, why 120 Peer-Reviewed Published Papers.. Nearly ALL of them done outside of the U.S., on successful replications of LENR (thats the number as of 2008, there are more now)... "Are crap and don't prove anything".
http://www.lenr-canr.org/FilesAlphabetical.htm
Have fun.
Post by: hartiberlin on October 05, 2009, 11:37:36 PM
Please post comments about cold fusion into this topic thread.
Thanks.
Regards, Stefan. (admin)
Post by: YeahRight on October 05, 2009, 11:38:25 PM
I'll have a look and give my verdict on eventual cold fusion success.
Post by: mscoffman on October 06, 2009, 05:06:18 PM
Great. Lot's of reading. ;D
I'll have a look and give my verdict on eventual cold fusion success.
Here is the best one;
http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/StringhamRcavitationb.pdf
If you can understand what he is talking about, each sentence says
something important...and...he is not saying "maybe". Extra heat
energy actually begins to interfere with his experiment. This
is real deal, except he doesn't talk about the details of the
physics, nor does he talk much about the full range of target
materials in this paper.
:S:MarkSCoffman
Post by: YeahRight on October 06, 2009, 08:31:45 PM
There is a great need for lots of more progress before the final decision can be made.
Now, the end of CF talk. Let's return to Ali's motion less generation of electric power.
Post by: FatBird on October 12, 2009, 01:50:09 AM
Anything new?
What are you presently working on????
.
Post by: hartiberlin on October 15, 2009, 02:22:28 AM
Stefan,
I am settled in my new lab better equiped and have developed some advance version of genie once I will complete this part I will apply for over unity price
Ali
Post by: minde4000 on October 15, 2009, 03:16:02 AM
Thanks for heads up Stefan.
Minde
Post by: YeahRight on October 15, 2009, 12:00:56 PM
Post by: FatBird on October 15, 2009, 01:22:34 PM
THANK YOU VERY MUCH for all of the Hard Work you have done on Overunity to bring the best inventions and inventors forward.
.
Post by: teslaalset on October 15, 2009, 01:51:13 PM
Well Ali is at least testing our patience....
Post by: forest on October 15, 2009, 03:30:00 PM
Post by: YeahRight on October 15, 2009, 04:08:38 PM
I'm wondering. Maybe there is a possibility to charge electrolytic capacitor without consuming current. Just do it much faster then relaxation time as explains Bearden ? What do you think ?
Post by: MasterPlaster on October 15, 2009, 05:58:44 PM
Post by: jan.kolar on October 15, 2009, 10:02:34 PM
em devices:realpower = V * I/pf. I must say that this is not true. Correct formulas are following
i do understand that SMPS (switching mode power supplies DC converters) in computers, badly effect power factor thats why the european union put a ban on chinese power supplies until and unless they are properly certified for PF close to 0.9 min. when a PF changes meter reading go faster because realpower = V * I /pf for example if voltages are 220 ad current is 1 amp the power is 220 watt when pf is 1 now if pf is 0.5
lets see what happens real power = 220 *1 /0.5 = 440 watts so if pf is changed you will pay more not less and pf more then one is not possible
if PF is low power companies become in trouble coz then they have to transfer more current to meet the real power then apparent power so they put penalties if power factor is below 0.8
i am an ex proffessor from an engineering university and have very clear vision of electronics and mechnical systems
220 volt coil in meter is parallel connected called activator magnet it can only make path for magnetic field so if there is no load it won't coz movement on disk even voltages are applied
current coil is called multiplier so disk only move when current flows so in this way it acts as power = V* I
what is siphon
if you want to get some fuel out of motor bike tank you put a pipe in it and suck it from other end then the fuel will start flowing to a lower destination but it will fly up in pipe for transition time this is called siphon i have develop this method in electronics and handling current in this way.
amazingly i got success my concepts are different from all other people working in this area
i have some other inventions as well but will show them after the successful trials of this one.
Ali
apparent power = V * I
realpower = V * I * pf, where pf = cos(fi), fi is phase angle between current and voltage.
reactive power = V * I * sin(fi)
V and I are rms values of current and voltage.
I must agree with EMdevices that you get charged only for real power. This is how it function in slovak & czech republic and I think also in another countries. According to law PF must be in range <0.95;1>. This is particularly important for big electricity consumers. If their powerfactor is less then 0.95, they can be charged up to 50 million czech korunas which is almost 2 million euros! I think that similar law is established in Slovak republic because we lived many years in common state.
That throws bad light on winsonali and his "expert" knowledges.
Post by: teslaalset on October 15, 2009, 11:19:00 PM
Post by: allcanadian on October 16, 2009, 02:15:02 AM
Quote:
"I must agree with EMdevices that you get charged only for real power. This is how it function in slovak & czech republic and I think also in another countries. According to law PF must be in range <0.95;1>. This is particularly important for big electricity consumers. If their powerfactor is less then 0.95, they can be charged up to 50 million czech korunas which is almost 2 million euros! I think that similar law is established in Slovak republic because we lived many years in common state.
That throws bad light on winsonali and his "expert" knowledges."
No, it throws bad light on your knowledge, you may want to research power factor. In power plant operations reactive loads are not a real issue as electronics handle any corrections and the reactive load is spread over a large area of consumption--the power grid. Medium and light consumers (you) however can have drastic reactive load swings locally, every time an inductive load comes on line the power factor changes drastically. An average installation may have a steady PF near 0.8-0.95 however if any motor,transformer etc... comes on line the PF goes to 0.4-0.6, I know this as fact as I spend many hours near industrial electronic power monitoring equipment. Ali is also perfectly correct in stating cheap DC/DC converts have a horrific PF and I have seen measured efficiencies near 50%. There is also the "dirty power" issue due to poorly designed (cheap) input power sections on electronics and the large scale move from transformers to DC/DC buck/boost converters. This dirty power is basically harmful high frequency RF(radio frequency) which can turn most of your house wiring into a low power short range RF transmitter, again I measured my house for RF and I know this as fact.
Maybe you newbies should check your facts first,lol.
Regards
AC
Post by: jan.kolar on October 16, 2009, 10:13:53 AM
realpower = V * I/pf this is what Ali has written. If this was true, then purely reactive element, for example high quality capacitor, should have realpower approaching infinity:
realpower = V * I/cos(90) = infinity!!!
This is obviously not true, because capacitor as purely reactive element has zero realpower:
realpower = V * I * cos(90) = 0
This is correct formula.
Post by: jan.kolar on October 16, 2009, 10:24:14 AM
No, it throws bad light on your knowledge, you may want to research power factor. In power plant operations reactive loads are not a real issue as electronics handle any corrections and the reactive load is spread over a large area of consumption--the power grid. Medium and light consumers (you) however can have drastic reactive load swings locally, every time an inductive load comes on line the power factor changes drastically. An average installation may have a steady PF near 0.8-0.95 however if any motor,transformer etc... comes on line the PF goes to 0.4-0.6, I know this as fact as I spend many hours near industrial electronic power monitoring equipment. Ali is also perfectly correct in stating cheap DC/DC converts have a horrific PF and I have seen measured efficiencies near 50%. There is also the "dirty power" issue due to poorly designed (cheap) input power sections on electronics and the large scale move from transformers to DC/DC buck/boost converters. This dirty power is basically harmful high frequency RF(radio frequency) which can turn most of your house wiring into a low power short range RF transmitter, again I measured my house for RF and I know this as fact.
Maybe you newbies should check your facts first,lol.
Regards
AC
I agree with you that PF is not always near 1 in typical household, but its impossible by compensating PF get your electricity meter slow down. If this would possible then shops would be full of “magic†boxes that can reduce your billing by several tens percent. I dont know about something like this happening.
Post by: broli on October 16, 2009, 02:59:46 PM
Post by: allcanadian on October 16, 2009, 05:37:21 PM
Quote
I agree with you that PF is not always near 1 in typical household, but its impossible by compensating PF get your electricity meter slow down. If this would possible then shops would be full of “magic†boxes that can reduce your billing by several tens percent. I dont know about something like this happening.Most often the difference between the possible and impossible amounts to nothing more than knowledge and understanding. Inductance acts like the mass on a pendulum displaying the property of momentum. Do a little experiment for me and yourself. Attach a mass(inductance) in between two springs(capacitance) or elastic bands then attach one end of this apparatus to a wall or doorknob. Now, hold the other end of the spring and start pulling and releasing the spring so that your pull/release is in time with the motion of the mass, this is resonance---note the frequency of your pull/release. Now double the weight of the mass and try it again, you will find the frequency has changed. In order to keep the frequency at it's original value of the smaller mass you will have to pull harder and faster on the larger mass---extra work. The power grid in North America is locked at 60Hz so you cannot change the frequency, when inductive loads are attached that are not resonant at 60Hz extra work(current) is required just like in our little experiment. Instead of doing extra work you can change the stiffness of your springs(capacitance) to compensate for a changing mass(inductance), the resonant frequency of the load can then be matched to that of the source (resonance), this is PF of 1. The reason few people utilize PF correction equipment is because it involves high power/high speed electronics usually, this is very expensive. The fact of the matter is most people are ignorant to the facts or they just don't give a damn, ask your self why almost nobody here understands what PF is or how it works? I have one simple rule----- If I don't understand something--anything, I research and experiment until I do. Very simple concept.
Regards
AC
Post by: jan.kolar on October 16, 2009, 05:42:11 PM
"The velocity of the siphon is thus driven solely by the height difference between the surface of the upper reservoir and the drain point. The height of the intermediate high point, hB, does not affect the velocity of the siphon."
Its strange that Ali is so emphasizing analogy with mechanical systems:
"mechanical example of situation: you have bath tub full of water the top is open water cannot flow
out from top if you make a whole in bottom of the tub it will flow (natural) now i have to make
water flow from top. if i can do the same in electronic means what i have achieved is creating PD
with non aligned electrons." (September 1, 2009, 7:23 AM)
"we need to think out off box , if you can explain electricity mechanically you can treat it like that" (September 11, 2009, 4:25 PM)
I dont know about mechanical perpetuum mobile or overunity device based on siphon effect. If Ali's analogy is valid then no problem for him to build also mechanical device with closed loop running indefinitely.
Post by: jan.kolar on October 16, 2009, 06:35:41 PM
@jankolarMost often the difference between the possible and impossible amounts to nothing more than knowledge and understanding. Inductance acts like the mass on a pendulum displaying the property of momentum. Do a little experiment for me and yourself. Attach a mass(inductance) in between two springs(capacitance) or elastic bands then attach one end of this apparatus to a wall or doorknob. Now, hold the other end of the spring and start pulling and releasing the spring so that your pull/release is in time with the motion of the mass, this is resonance---note the frequency of your pull/release. Now double the weight of the mass and try it again, you will find the frequency has changed. In order to keep the frequency at it's original value of the smaller mass you will have to pull harder and faster on the larger mass---extra work. The power grid in North America is locked at 60Hz so you cannot change the frequency, when inductive loads are attached that are not resonant at 60Hz extra work(current) is required just like in our little experiment. Instead of doing extra work you can change the stiffness of your springs(capacitance) to compensate for a changing mass(inductance), the resonant frequency of the load can then be matched to that of the source (resonance), this is PF of 1. The reason few people utilize PF correction equipment is because it involves high power/high speed electronics usually, this is very expensive. The fact of the matter is most people are ignorant to the facts or they just don't give a damn, ask your self why almost nobody here understands what PF is or how it works? I have one simple rule----- If I don't understand something--anything, I research and experiment until I do. Very simple concept.You have quite a good vision of what PF is. You are right that more power is needed if electric circuit is not compensated. But this more power is almost immediately returned to grid. Its like short-term loan. This part of electric power is called reactive power and as I know it is not measured by conventional electric meters. Check this:
Regards
AC
Post by: jan.kolar on October 16, 2009, 06:51:40 PM
Real power represents the losses on resistors in circuit that are transformed to heat + mechanical power (if you have electric motor).
Post by: winsonali on October 17, 2009, 01:12:21 PM
i am now settled in my new premises and now up and running once again
i will be posting new video showing use of digital watt meter/hour that can show us exactly the watt frequency and power factor
after limiting the input current and putting a digital watt meter hour on input and output has given a difference of 80 watts gain
input is 96watt what device is taking and out put is 176 watt going out from device
i will post the video shortly
results are good and i have got another project to do not related to alternative energy but very interesting jamming digital video reception producing water marks that are not visible with naked eyes but if a camera takes video or snap it will appear and will distort picture. this new project is a new jewel in my research carrier
thanks every body
Post by: teslaalset on October 17, 2009, 03:37:20 PM
Looking forward to see your 3rd video on power amplification.
The company I work for has done quite some research on your new project and obtained some essential results and patents. If you are interested in their technology just PM me, I can arrange some info on that.
To be honest it's quite hard to understand why you pay attention to new subjects while your power amplification project seems so important for the world.
Post by: jan.kolar on October 17, 2009, 04:27:50 PM
Why had OU factor decreased from 3.4 to 1.8 (i am not saying this is not good result anyway)? Is this because of inverter losses? You also said (indirectly) in one of your previous posts that your invention do not contribute to entropy (September 3, 2009, 10:35 AM). Currently i know only one such device and this is heat pump (if i neglect energy needed for compressor). Is your device converting ambient heat to electricity?
Post by: spoondini on October 17, 2009, 04:41:58 PM
Looking forward to the next video - we are all incredibly curious as to how your device works.
Post by: neha9243 on October 17, 2009, 04:51:10 PM
neha9243
Post by: FatBird on October 22, 2009, 02:57:15 PM
How soon are you going to claim the O/U Prize? We members are anxious to see your Open Disclosure unit. Please post soon.
Thank you.
.
Post by: winsonali on November 03, 2009, 02:23:09 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sqmq9i-tos
i have added additional circuits to limit the current and changed in software the results are very different but i am working hard to complete the new unit just after new year as soon as my other project will be finished i get enough funds that i can put on this project
the next target is "self running unit" taking input 36 volts DC once operative batteries will be removed and it will run at its own
thank you for the support of everyone here
i don't mind what others say, but 2 units were installed one on electric heating unit 1000 watts and other one is on a refrigerator on both installation it is working and saving electric bill
the device is good as a transformer less voltage stabilizer with built-in energy saving capability.
But once again my target is self running Unit.
Thanks
Post by: FatBird on November 03, 2009, 03:07:22 AM
Suggestion: Why don't you RELEASE your ORIGINAL FIRST UNIT now and CLAIM your $5,000 REWARD. There are several benefits:
1. Your $5,000 REWARD can help your research.
2. You will HELP THE WORLD by releasing your invention.
Thanks Ali,
.
Post by: hartiberlin on November 03, 2009, 03:27:39 AM
looks very good !
Do you power with the 140 Watts of input power also
the left dim light bulb and your Genie circuit?
Thanks that you turned the dimmer pot in the video, so
one could see, how the Genie responded to varying input voltage levels.
Why do you work on a different project, when this project is so important for the world
and the energy needs
and the other project will delay that so much ?
Why don´t you publish the older design or at least
tell us, how the cap charge siphon effect is working ?
All will know, that you are the inventor and if they will
build their own power supplies based on this you will
probably get many donations from happy users..
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: EMdevices on November 03, 2009, 04:19:46 AM
What is the model number of your digital watt meters?
EM
Post by: WattBuilder on November 03, 2009, 09:17:21 AM
Amazing! :D
Howard
Post by: homersimpson on November 03, 2009, 02:06:04 PM
new video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sqmq9i-tos
i have added additional circuits to limit the current and changed in software the results are very different but i am working hard to complete the new unit just after new year as soon as my other project will be finished i get enough funds that i can put on this project
the next target is "self running unit" taking input 36 volts DC once operative batteries will be removed and it will run at its own
thank you for the support of everyone here
i don't mind what others say, but 2 units were installed one on electric heating unit 1000 watts and other one is on a refrigerator on both installation it is working and saving electric bill
the device is good as a transformer less voltage stabilizer with built-in energy saving capability.
But once again my target is self running Unit.
Thanks
Hi,...
I saw your video, and I saw: input is 49Vx5.1A=250W - output is 244Vx0.78A=190W
Am I missing something?
Thanks.
Post by: winsonali on November 03, 2009, 03:24:56 PM
these meters are true RMS and show exact power consumed over a complete cycle
the input device getting peak 5.0 amps for only micro seconds and only for 49 volts rms and voltage and current are in same phase if we distribute the power for over all cycle it will give you real power(meter showing) on each cycle so these readings are correct
i want to post oscilloscope wave forms but that will take more time for explaining
the end result is
where i have installed 2 units we are consuming less electricity bills the device can be used as transformer less, coil less or solid state voltage stablizer with energy saving feature
countries where we have power fluctuations this is low cost and energy saving device can be used with aircons and reduce electricity bills
yes one thing more this time we have switched the input and output such that when device is taking input the output is in transactional phase (shifting from negative to positive or positive to negative more or less on zero) so when input is coming, there is no out flow when output flow is through (we block the input section) no input is coming so it looks like it collect a bucket of charge, close the input door, process it through output and return to input again. We are not taking any input when output is open for flow.
i am still working and have targets to achieve.
a very interesting thing i put a "coil with permanent magnet in side" before input without changing any thing and the power was so high that every thing blow up in blink of an eye
on investigation the positive side of output was blown and same as input was damaged where positive input is seperated after zero detection
but when i just flip the coil connection and magnet inside it this time negative side blow up
i need to work a lot now
Ali
Post by: teslaalset on November 03, 2009, 03:38:11 PM
yes one thing more this time we have switched the input and out put such that when device is taking input the out is in transactional phase so when input is coming there is no out flow when out flow is through no input is coming so it looks like it gets a bucket of charge close the input door process it through output and and return to input again but it never take the input when output is open for flow
Thanks for some more information, Ali.
Would it be possible for you to explain the above via a diagram or a drawing?
It is very confusing only reading your text.
Post by: spoondini on November 03, 2009, 04:18:05 PM
Post by: hartiberlin on November 04, 2009, 12:19:42 AM
I think it is not good to use any digital meters over here,
cause they are probably just made for normal sine waves and
not for chopped dimmer outputs.
well at least Icould imagine, that the current readings
also takes samples from the momentary highest values,
but the power reading calculates into the cos phi phase angle and
thus shows less power input.
It would be required to show us scope shots of the input current and input voltage
with dimensions and also show the output voltage as an additional scope shot.
Then we could say, what is really going on in this circuit...
Otherwise I will never trust digital meters in these pulse circuits.
Well, I hope that it is not just jamming ALI´s home metering system and
thus save him the electrical bill.
It would be good, if Ali could post some scope shots.
Many thanks in advance.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: winsonali on November 04, 2009, 01:01:48 AM
Post by: hartiberlin on November 04, 2009, 03:19:08 AM
looking forward to see another video soon.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: markdansie on November 04, 2009, 03:40:27 AM
You could learn a lesson from Ali. He was kind enough to allow another member of this forum and a retired physicist to visit and test his original device. Using oscilloscopes they were able to explain to Ali where his measurements were possibly flawed because of the meters he was using and what he should use and how to test. The device was a very well built, and certainly would have tricked power meters provided by utilities. To Ali's full credit, rather than argue the point he went into building circuts to address the issues raised and I believe is making great progress. he embraced the advice and is developing solutions.
Hats of to Ali as he listened to people with the experience and qualifications to assist him. Ali himself is a brilliant man and a very original thinker with honesty and integrity.
I look forward to when he is ready to have these people visit again to confirm what he is working on now. There is no hurry and all will happen in good time.
The cost of this assistance was $0. We have also put in place that once certain criteria are met virtually unlimited funding and resources through a humanitarian organisation for Ali to continue his work.
I guess my point Mr Wattbuilder is to listen to those with the experience to help you and address concerns raised like Ali has rather than your ignorant buried in the sand approach. Help is there if you need it and can be arranged. Just arguing the point will get you now where and refusual to do tests that will either confirm or bust your theories in not the way of progress.
Once again ,hats of to Ali for his humility, generosity and honesty.
Kind Regards
Mark Dansie
Post by: teslaalset on November 04, 2009, 09:17:24 AM
Mark you should read the charter of this forum again.
We discuss things openly here and try to get as much people involved in understanding and solving issues.
What you are attempting to do all the time is shielding off information from other forum members. Where is the information of the people you organized to visit Ali? Sorry, I can't find it.
You indicated earlier your honest intension; I am not convinced yet. You at least make the impression that you have a double agenda.
By sharing information the risk of loosing knowledge is much lower. We have seen people disappearing at very crucial moments here at the forum too often. Besides, integral knowledge of all active forum members is much higher than that of single persons.
Buy a mirror and look at it. The picture is not as pretty as you think it is.
Post by: markdansie on November 04, 2009, 09:48:36 AM
That is a good point you raise. Like I have always said I need to be placed under scrutiny as well.
In this case and most others I leave it entirely up to the owner or the inventor of the technology to release reports conducted by my associates. It is their decision. In some cases they also need advice on ways to move forward the technology.
In many others(if not most) I have to sign an NDA. If that is the case I am not at liberty to disclose reports, test results or findings.
You criticism is valid, and I accept that.
However I often act as a person who puts people in contact with other people who can help them with no strings attached. This was the case with Ali. We also in some instances offer assistance in other ways depending on the desire of the inventor.
A lot of people come here kite flying or post video's on you tube to create interest, often seeking funds. Where I believe I do add some value to the forums is in that my experience in travelling the world and researching technologies can challenge those with purposes that are not always ethical.
For every technology you see here there are many others that never reach public forums, and wish to remain private for a variety of reasons, more often than not they do not want attention.
However I applaud your questioning of my motives and can not offer a simple answer, hopefully the above goes some way of explaining my position.
I also do not want to embarrass people who are genuine if they have made mistakes in testing or evaluating data. In many case they go away and continue with their projects. In many cases they attack the messenger.
In Ali's case he took the test data and proceeded to address the issues and has made his progress public. I applaud this and this is a demonstration of my no strings attached approach.
In other case people require funds for further research or to commercialise there intellectual property. I have always offered my services freely if that is the case.
There is an ongoing debate which is the fastest way for people to recieve benefit from new technologies. In some cases its open source in others its private equity funding. In my opinion it depends on the project.
Kind Regards
Mark Dansie
Post by: teslaalset on November 04, 2009, 10:00:46 AM
Would be interesting to know who else is behind all the kindness.
Business travelling is not for free as we all know.
Post by: winsonali on November 04, 2009, 10:56:46 AM
Teslaalset:
circiut: This time we have switched the input and output such that when device is taking input the output is in transactional phase (shifting from negative to positive or positive to negative more or less on zero) so when input is coming, there is no out flow when output flow is through (we block the input section) no input is coming so it looks like
it collect a bucket of charge,
close the input door,
process it through output(feed back looping)
and return(program pointer) to input again.
We are not taking any input when output is open for flow.
a very interesting thing i put a "coil with permanent magnet in side" before input without changing any thing and the power was so high that every thing blow up in blink of an eye
on investigation the positive side of output was blown and same as input was damaged where positive input is seperated after zero detection
but when i just flip the coil connection and magnet inside it this time negative side blow up
this means i can get more power if i use permanent magnet based coils in input. this is a sort of device using electromagnetism for current amplification. still working
MARK:
Thankyou for your comments and i acknowledge that due to mark i have learned a lot and in my progress his his role is pivotal.
what i think about Mark as people have different hobbies and interest, his goal and aim in life is to help people working hard in alternative energy. and for this purpose he spend money and time.
i am thankful to everyone here on the forum.
Ali
Post by: markdansie on November 04, 2009, 11:49:02 AM
There is no simple answer to your question.
Sometimes I have funded myself, sometimes when in a country on other business I take the opportunity to visit inventors, and evaluate projects. Other times I have been funded as a consultant by different companies and sometimes potential investors.
However normally through building up a network of friends and different people with different expertise in many countries through other forums, associations or shared interest, we tend to do a lot of work as volunteers. In the Case of Ali who is in the UK, through another association of mainly volunteers the people were nearby and offered to assist as they had an interest in similar projects.
Many associates I have never met but we keep in contact via email, phone skype and newsletters. If you like, its a very informal network I have developed over the years.
I tend not to travel as much nowdays, my busiest year was 2006 with 45 flights. They were a mixture of my own and other companies.
So I think the best answer is in somecases I work professionally on behalf of others but in most cases its a network of volunteers with like minded interests. If they want something checked out in Australia or NZ I do it for them as a favour or visa versa.
I know it all sounds confussing but there is nothing sinister.Have I profited to date...the answer is no and I would estimate I am down many thousands of dollars of my own money.
As you said when I look in the mirror I am far from perfect. But my motivation is simple, to leave a better world for my children.
I have made and lost many fortunes over the years, strangely enough money doesn't interest me. However one has to live also.
Kind Regards
Mark
Post by: teslaalset on November 04, 2009, 12:15:57 PM
I am questioning this because I think there are mainly 3 kind of people active in this forum:
1) people that want to share and solve new energy solutions in the open for free,
2) people that want to earn money out of potential inventions before others do (and try to suppress open innovation)
3) people that want to cover up new energy inventions as fast as possible for economical or political reasons.
Apart from those there are a lot of people that just want to interfere and clutter up discussions.
Initiators in this forum should be very aware of this.
Most of them are smart enough to know that already.
Post by: Omega_0 on November 04, 2009, 02:21:30 PM
If you see most of the posts here (including mine) advise against using digital or conventional AC meters, he seems to ignore all of them and insists on "improving" the design instead. What use are improvements when the original itself is so doubtful ?
He always says that this device "saves" electricity bills. Does that imply OU or power production ? No ... obviously.
It will cost something to produce scope shots, if he has no scope, but DC measurements costs nothing. If he is incapable he can get it tested by someone else. Whats stopping him from getting some NDAs signed ?
Once he has it tested and OU confirmed, he will be sitting on a mountain of money, no doubts about that. But one has to wonder after all these months ....
I suspect this is going the way of all other claims and my hopes are not very high about this.
Post by: winsonali on November 04, 2009, 03:11:42 PM
please read the old posts all the answers are there if things are so simple things must have been done by everyone here. my system needs below zero voltages to generate siphon effect. a simple DC input will not work here we need alternating currents..
is a design requirement
i know there are many highly knowledgeable and qualified people. There advices are very valuable for me
if you know any device that slow down the meter for resistive loads please inform me i would like to see how that works or any article that exhibits the process which can slow down the meter i really want to know what is the process they use please don't refer PFC for induction motors they don't effect resistive loads.
also i am not claiming any thing i am just a learner , some how i have developed a new transformerless, coil less , AC voltage stabilizer. may good for third world countries only....
regards
Post by: FatBird on November 04, 2009, 07:00:44 PM
1) people that want to share and solve new energy solutions in the open for free,
2) people that want to earn money out of potential inventions before others do (and try to suppress open innovation)
3) people that want to cover up new energy inventions as fast as possible for economical or political reasons.
I TOTALLY AGREE, especially your NUMBER 3.
I just did a Yahoo search on DEAD SCIENTISTS, & got OVER 51 MILLION sites about it!!! So you are right on the money!!!
.
Post by: Omega_0 on November 04, 2009, 09:26:06 PM
Omega:
please read the old posts all the answers are there if things are so simple things must have been done by everyone here. my system needs below zero voltages to generate siphon effect. a simple DC input will not work here we need alternating currents..
is a design requirement
I hope you are not that dumb. DC measurements don't mean you operate your device on DC. You missed the point of it all ?
DC power measurement means that you start with a DC power source as input, measure the DC volts and amps, convert that to AC, feed your device with that AC, generate AC power, convert that back into DC and measure DC volt and amps at the output. In this way you get the most reliable measurements. Calorimetric measurements are next step after that.
You call it "stabilizer" now , instead of power saver ? Now I highly doubt you have anything.
Post by: allcanadian on November 04, 2009, 10:56:48 PM
Quote
I hope you are not that dumb. DC measurements don't mean you operate your device on DC. You missed the point of it all ?DC has issues as well but if paralleled caps are added to smooth the DC usually you can get pretty accurate readings. I would agree that AC measurement is flawed when the signal is distorted.
DC power measurement means that you start with a DC power source as input, measure the DC volts and amps, convert that to AC, feed your device with that AC, generate AC power, convert that back into DC and measure DC volt and amps at the output. In this way you get the most reliable measurements. Calorimetric measurements are next step after that.
You call it "stabilizer" now , instead of power saver ? Now I highly doubt you have anything.
Post by: winsonali on November 04, 2009, 11:06:36 PM
oh i got it now i never give it a second thought that we can do this
convert AC into DC
then measure there the power
convert into AC again
feed it to genie
ok thats a good way of checking
really i am dumb that its so simple and i didn't get it? ( some times things are in front of you and you can't see them)
i call it stabilizer to avoid unnecessary arguments of OV, a lot of scams are out there claiming energy saving i didn't want to be in the same line.
I prefer to start finalizing the product as voltage stabilizer so i can start manufacturing and selling it in near future we will market this product in third world countries. if some body use our line conditioner , digital stabilizer and can save electric bill without tempering the power meter i am more then happy
what ever the circuit i designed it has uniqueness
or may be you are right i didn't have anything, circuits like this are available from electronic kit shops
all those people argued to me so far have offered some thing to me in terms of learning because the ideas are backed with some knowledge i don't mind what ever you are saying i haven't done anything in last three months, oscilloscope needs money, DC measurements are cheap , if something is there i am sitting on mountain of money......
well one thing is for sure, soon i will send circuit diagram to some of the members of this forum .... who i found to be very honest and looking for humanity...like teslaalset, Fatbird, robbie...... this may help them in some of there projects
i am waiting for the links of article or paper discussing methods that can effect power meters (slowing down)
1 = In every home we are using dimmers for lights, are they fooling power meters?
2 = Power meter cannot read loads with chopped AC is it true?
3 = digital power meters are not accurate when the load is chopped AC? (every home have dimmers for fan or lights)
4 = Disc meters is an old technology can be fooled with high frequency?( all computer power supplies use high frequency)
try this at home a very simple test
use a dimmer get the power to lowest level where it glow the bulb at min.
take the power meter reading
connect in parallel a step up transformer and connect a bulb to it where it glows again with full brightness
take the power reading if goes slow then all your assumptions are right and if it goes faster then think i must have developed something good...
you are thinking logically
if i have something why i am still no where? don't worry i have achieved some good mile stones...
thanks and regards
Ali
Post by: teslaalset on November 04, 2009, 11:14:15 PM
One measuring the input power consumption, the other measuring the power consumed at the output (between output of the genie and the light bulbs)
At the end I, as a consumer, would be interested in my energy bill.
For now my energy bill is depending on such traditional power meter.
This basically is already shown in Ali's first video.
The only thing missing is a power factor meter at the input. This would complete the setup.
Post by: aaron5120 on November 05, 2009, 05:18:08 AM
Maybe the most simple way to prove energy gain is to use two traditional energy meters as used in Ali's first video ( the one with the turning wheel moved by eddy currents)I see WinsonAli is a honest person, and his actitude is humble when getting confronted with skepticism. He will make it eventually to finish his endeaver. I look forward to being able to purchase one of his Genies when they are on the market. Me too, in my country, we are dependent on the disc meter to pay our untility bill! If there is anything that can help me and my clients to save on the electricity bill then, that Genie is a good genie.
One measuring the input power consumption, the other measuring the power consumed at the output (between output of the genie and the light bulbs)
At the end I, as a consumer, would be interested in my energy bill.
For now my energy bill is depending on such traditional power meter.
This basically is already shown in Ali's first video.
The only thing missing is a power factor meter at the input. This would complete the setup.
Right on, Ali. Go ahead. We are with you.
Post by: robbie47 on November 05, 2009, 09:32:13 AM
convert AC into DC
then measure there the power
convert into AC again
feed it to genie
ok thats a good way of checking
But that would require a DC to AC converter.
If I remember well you indicated that your genie can not cope with such device because you need a real neutral connection point. Right?
well one thing is for sure, soon i will send circuit diagram to some of the members of this forum .... who i found to be very honest and looking for humanity...like teslaalset, Fatbird, robbie...... this may help them in some of there projects
Looking forward for the diagrams, much appreciated in advance!
Post by: jan.kolar on November 05, 2009, 10:55:00 AM
i am waiting for the links of article or paper discussing methods that can effect power meters (slowing down)
Here it is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_meter#Tampering_and_security
Quoting some essential lines from this source:
"Rectified DC loads cause mechanical (but not electronic) meters to under-register. DC current does not cause the coils to make eddy currents in the disk, so this causes reduced rotation and a lower bill.
Some combinations of capacitive and inductive load can interact with the coils and mass of a rotor and cause reduced or reverse motion."
Compare this with what EMDevices said somewhere at the beginning of this thread. And there are also ways how to fool digital wattmeters. Every digital wattmeter has its bandwith. Lets say its 1MHz. Then sample frequency must be minimum of 2 MHz (Nyquist theorem). The consumed power is calculated in this way: (see attachment - N must be sufficiently large for nullifying effect of coils & capacitors in circuit.). So if spectrum of input signal contains components with frequency >1 MHz, the digital wattmeter data will be distorted. We cant judge if this is the case with Genie because we dont have circuit diagram, also osciloscope shots would be helpful. Analyzing informations from last video it seems that output voltage and current readings are RMS and PF close to 1 (because U*I = 245 * 0.78 = 191.1W which is very close to wattmeter reading around 185W) because of pure resistive load. High current on input (5.07A) is probably caused by reactive components in circuit (i.e. capacitors).
My view is that we deal with some sort of measurement error. Compare subsequent lowering of OU factor when using precisely measurement devices (154/45 = 3.42; 176/96 = 1.83 and now only 185/140 = 1.32).
Post by: winsonali on November 05, 2009, 11:30:22 AM
70% of the home appliances use SMPS where we have first a coil and capacitor to address PFC issues then we have a full wave DC rectifier which further switched on frequencies like 25KHZ to 40 KHZ and then down steped to required DC level
every thing is here capacitor , coils , DC load , but they do not cause to slow the disc meter down , or they do not tricked the digital meter...... please don't say this that designer try to prevent power meter slowing effect.
try this at home use IN4007 diodes make a bridge and connect to a 100 watt bulb you will see the meter will run more faster then when it was running directly (may be some extra energy consumed in DC rectification) but for sure the meter will not run slow in any condition
if you want to use high frequency in any device you have to convert it to DC first now i leave everything to your imagination ..........
Robbie: you are right in my device we need to provide both negative and positive line in one phase so we need to design a circuit that can convert DC into such AC when ever i will get some time i will do that.
Next target is obviously self running unit
i have to go now for some days out coz i have things to do may not be available on forum but will remain in touch on emails
thanks and regards
Post by: robbie47 on November 05, 2009, 11:37:49 AM
I share you thoughts on a possible measurement flaw.
I looked again to the first demo video. What is shown is the below circuit if I am not mistaken.
The light bulb right behind the dimmer is showing dimmed light, but this indicates only that low voltage is applied. The actual amount of consumed current can not be concluded this way.
So, I guess what we really want to know is the real RMS input current.
Because only in the chopped voltage time slots current is consumed, the current waveform is also chopped. To measure this with a true RMS meter is tricky because these have been designed to cope with full sinus periods presumably.
Best way to know the current consumption is to put a 1 Ohm power resistor in series with the input power line and then measure the voltage using an oscilloscope. (carefull with the neutral!)
From the shape and the amplitude of the measured current the true RMS current value can be calculated.
To confirm a Power Factor of 1.0 in parallel the input voltage shape (and phase) should be measured with the same oscilloscope, e.g. channel B, while measuring the power of the 1 Ohm resistor. Be very carefull with the way you connect the probes!!
Post by: jan.kolar on November 05, 2009, 12:03:49 PM
Post by: winsonali on November 05, 2009, 12:05:58 PM
it may be due to reading flaw that meters are running slow, digital meters cannot read accurately chopped inputs
the causes are defined in wiki pages, DC loads mis lead meter readings, chopped AC loads mislead meter reading,
high frequency mis lead meter reading .....
every SMPS have DC load and high frequency, every induction motor have coils and capacitor they increase meter speed not slowing them down.
;) i accept there is flaw in power meter readings and there is nothing in my circuit. This is a simple step up function for voltage.
i am happy with your conclusions
if my product can stabilize AC and can contribute electric bill reduction in all legal way i am happy
Post by: jan.kolar on November 05, 2009, 12:12:28 PM
To confirm a Power Factor of 1.0 in parallel the input voltage shape (and phase) should be measured with the same oscilloscope, e.g. channel B, while measuring the power of the 1 Ohm resistor. Be very carefull with the way you connect the probes!!
PF = 1.0 on input is very improbable based on input voltage & current measurements and probable device elements (capacitive circuit). Regarding measurement technique as I said in my previous message if Ali would open-source his invention this could be quickly resolved.
@Mark
Why your experts dont use their measurement techniques and publish their results? I think that Ali is playing with us double-face game.
Post by: robbie47 on November 05, 2009, 12:16:03 PM
I don't think Ali plays a game. He is learning what is happening.
We help him reflecting his results.
p.s. this circuit was already posted in reply #63 of this thread,I found out after posting this one.
Sorry, the honour goes to EMdevices.....
Post by: jan.kolar on November 05, 2009, 12:21:48 PM
every induction motor have coils and capacitor they increase meter speed not slowing them down.
Coils and capacitors dont change meter speed because these are reactive elements. They dont consume real power. You get charged only for real power i.e. for example resistive losses on windings of coil and mechanical power output.
Anyway i appreciate your work to bring new energy solutions. Every attempt to solve our energy crisis is welcome.
Post by: winsonali on November 05, 2009, 12:37:12 PM
i changed the circuit and software multiple times and avoid current input through when output is flowing
this coz a change in behavior of circuits continuously
i am on improvement track there is no double face what ever i have created , developed have its own value and its a complete solution for stabilized AC output which operate only from 40~ 50 volts
this is a required product in third world countries...
i really don't care, if my product is safe in operations and i get compliance as a CE approved product
i am happy....
you people are so intelligent that in blink of an eye you can figure out what is going on.....
i simply asked do you have any thing like this with you please present....
Post by: winsonali on November 05, 2009, 12:43:24 PM
some very senior member from the forum asked me if they can visit and test the device
my response to him was welcoming and i am willing to show them. Stefan knows about it
At first place there were problems due to switching overlapping between input and out, current spikes were generating and now i have controlled them by technique posted earlier (isolated input and output through software) with the passage of time i am perfecting them...
some other people are schedule to see the device over the week end, some are already testing on street lights , refrigerators and heaters.... they all are under 1000watts at the moment.
its a worldly thing and some matter of time when product will be ready .....
this is my last post of the day i am going out now
Post by: markdansie on November 05, 2009, 02:10:22 PM
The tests conducted were done professionally and it was agreed that the results would remain confidential prior to testing. We were there not to prove Ali right or wrong but to assist in progressing the project. After testing Ali immediatley went to work to develop solutions to questions raised and purchased more professional equipment. He is a very honest person and not all things are as black and white as they seem. I have every confidence that he will progress this much further in the next few weeks.
@Mark
Why your experts dont use their measurement techniques and publish their results? I think that Ali is playing with us double-face game.
Kind Regards
Mark
Post by: jan.kolar on November 05, 2009, 03:20:43 PM
The tests conducted were done professionally and it was agreed that the results would remain confidential prior to testing. We were there not to prove Ali right or wrong but to assist in progressing the project. After testing Ali immediatley went to work to develop solutions to questions raised and purchased more professional equipment. He is a very honest person and not all things are as black and white as they seem. I have every confidence that he will progress this much further in the next few weeks.
Kind Regards
Mark
But what is reason for publishing halfway results? I cant say with certainty after seeing video if its overunity or no. Why Ali dont tell all the details regarded testing? For example type of measurement device used and wiring scheme? Maybe the measuring instrument is constructed only for low-frequency appliances. Why such crucial details are being concealed? I have interest to learn something new but its impossible with such approach. Some informations from Ali are inconsistent. Analyzing output data it seems that voltage & current are RMS values but Ali said that 5A on input is maximum value of input current (Quote: "the input device getting peak 5.0 amps for only micro seconds"). So what are these devices really measuring? RMS or peak value?
I accept his decision not to say everything but why is he visiting public forum like overunity.com? If he has no interest to open-source his invention he shouldnt come here because concealing informations is against spirit of this place.
Post by: winsonali on November 05, 2009, 03:41:26 PM
if i haven't been here i wouldn't have learn so much
i will pass the benefit to everyone let us make our end completed as i have mentioned previously i will send the schematic to some of the forum members soon i will add you name in the list as well this is learning and sharing
Mark you have made me reach to this level
thanks
Post by: allcanadian on November 05, 2009, 03:55:42 PM
Quote
Ali is only muddlying water nothing more. Maybe his device is ingenious but i dont believe on overunity. He has not answered the main question: Where this additional energy should be coming from? I dont accept his analogy with siphon because this phenomenon is very well understood by science, no energy gain here. If he would made plan of his device public then experienced members of this forum with apparatus needed could quickly confirm or refuse overunity effect.
You seem to be making an awful lot of assumptions considering you have no idea what Ali is doing? I believe Ali is here because he wants to share his progress with others so we all might learn in the process, right or wrong his effort is a noble one. Let's address your question---"Where this additional energy should be coming from?", The first mistake is assuming their is extra energy. If I have a car and I modify the engine to get 20mpg above factory specifications, have I gained energy? No, I have improved the efficiency and wasted less fuel, this is not a gain-- it is less losses and there is a difference. Let me put it to you this way, conventional domestic AC wastes almost 100% of the energy transferred--- what you consider as 100% efficiency is in fact closer to 2% efficiency because you have continuously discharged the source. Even a cave man knows better than this,lol, do you think a cave man would light a fire(create a potential difference) take some heat then throw water on it---then re-light the fire/pour water on it and repeat this cycle? I have a very good idea what Ali is doing as I have been building circuits along these lines for quite a while and he is correct with his siphon analogy. James Clerk Maxwell once said--- we can view the forces we measure in a mechanical sense and in this respect I mean to be taken literally. I think the reason you have no idea what Ali is doing is because you will not consider his perspective, to understand his thoughts on this matter.
Regards
AC
Post by: jan.kolar on November 05, 2009, 04:24:46 PM
Let's address your question---"Where this additional energy should be coming from?", The first mistake is assuming their is extra energy. If I have a car and I modify the engine to get 20mpg above factory specifications, have I gained energy? No, I have improved the efficiency and wasted less fuel, this is not a gain-- it is less losses and there is a difference. Let me put it to you this way, conventional domestic AC wastes almost 100% of the energy transferred--- what you consider as 100% efficiency is in fact closer to 2% efficiency because you have continuously discharged the source.
Laws of science are verified by long-term practical appliances. Where is this unknown huge bulk of energy many times more than we are using every day? Point to the equation in electrical theory that you think is wrong? Why this flaw has not manifested as some anomaly in laboratories all around the world? Transfer of electric energy from source to load is described by Poynting vector ExH. To make H there must be electric current flowing from source.
Post by: quarktoo on November 05, 2009, 05:57:16 PM
The laws of science are a house of cards that are going to collapse when people figure out that acceleration converts mass into the atomic energy contained within the mass and that is how all free energy devices work.
I don't know if this device works or how, but I wish the inventor well and thank him for sharing his information openly. That is something that I can support and the type of person I would want to help.
Post by: winsonali on November 12, 2009, 01:49:17 AM
i was working and finalizing the independent and self running unit where you need not to have a dimmer
this is a new unit please do not mix this with genie
i have developed a model which can produce electric power without inter crossing the magnetic field
in a generator motor most of the power consumed is due to the inter crossing magnetic fields if you require more current means more power full magnetic field and this means more mechanical energy required to inter cross the polarities to generate current
i have successfully achieved the method of generating electric power without inter crossing the magnetic fields my method is in initial stage i have just produced 1volt 500 milliamps with very small size of this new device once i will produce 30 to 40 volts that will be feeded in genie to produce 240 volts through that device
My question and help needed is
to produce electric power i am using non magnetizeable material in a magnetic environment
if any one can send some links to magnetic properties of materials (like alloys of aluminium , zinc and brass etc) so i can make use of some more better material for my experiments
please send me links, if you have knowledge of any device of this type that produce electricity through a magnet without inter crossing the magnetic fields
Post by: hartiberlin on November 12, 2009, 02:46:06 AM
sounds great.
Is this already 0.5 Watts of power or does the voltage drop,
if you draw 500 milliamps of current ?
Exactly for what parameters of the materials are you looking for ?
For the conductivity or permeability or what exactly ?
Many thanks.
Post by: teslaalset on November 12, 2009, 09:13:34 AM
My question and help needed is
to produce electric power i am using non magnetizeable material in a magnetic environment
if any one can send some links to magnetic properties of materials (like alloys of aluminium , zinc and brass etc) so i can make use of some more better material for my experiments
Ali, maybe below link is what you want?
http://www.tpub.com/content/NAVFAC/hdbk419a_vol2/hdbk419a_vol20181.htm (http://www.tpub.com/content/NAVFAC/hdbk419a_vol2/hdbk419a_vol20181.htm)
Have you thought about possible Eddy Currents that may effect your device?
Eddy Currents may cause extra loss in case you move non magnetic metals in static magnetic fields, or use static non magnetic materials in moving magnetic fields.
In particular cases it helps using materials in thin layers (laminated) to decrease losses caused by Eddy Currents.
Post by: wattsup on November 12, 2009, 02:21:22 PM
I have followed your video and a good part of this thread. I like the basic idea of your device.
I am assuming that the operation of Genie's main circuit is DC as you say 40 volts. So why not just run it with 4 x 12vdc x 7amp batteries and do away with the 240AC feed requirement, then show your demo with rising, falling or steady battery voltage. If the voltage drops, refine it. If it does not drop, bingo. Or show two demos, one with 48vdc batteries driving a number of lamps at very low brightness without the genie showing how fast the voltage drops on the batteries. Then another demo with the genie showing the lamps very bright and battery voltage not dropping at all or not as fast.
This will get the main point across to both high level and most importantly low level techs (like me) to quickly understand it.
The batteries could also give you a place to land any flyback, should there be any in your system.
The problem with running AC and a watt meter is that people will always say the harmonics created by the Genie is tricking the watt meter readings. This would not be the first time. Only once your device can operate with an easy to show DC feed, that people will then accept the AC feed via a step down transformer and an AC to DC bridge rectifier.
Also, if you plan to make another video, maybe consider speaking a little slower, try pronouncing your words fully and it will not look like you are trying to sell the next Miracle Knife or ShamWow Towel. In such a video you are not speaking to your local friends but to the world. The aim of any such video is viewer comprehension so please take my comment as only a constructive criticism.
As for your request for suggestions on non magnetizable material, if it has to be a metal, of course aluminum would be the first to look at but what about titanium?
I am a fan of what you are doing and would consider purchasing a genie device when it is available to test it out and then buy some more afterward.
All the best.
Post by: winsonali on November 13, 2009, 09:19:58 AM
Yes i was looking for the same information you have given...thank you
in all generators one part is always stationary.
I was basically designing input section of genie without a dimmer with AVR capability then i think about using permanent magnet in a transformer that experiments failed and i saw number of patents dating 1954, to 1978 and i also review Tom Beardom's MEG i realize something is not right in this method and i developed this new technique of using magnetic field with out inter crossing and produce good use able electric power. These are really new lines of working with magnetic fields this involves highly precise sensing circuits and software
Few results of my experiments raised these questions
1) what is the speed of magnetic lines
1A) what is the frequency of magnetic lines.
1B) what is the resonant frequency of any magnetic material.
1B) an aluminum wire coated with silver offer good conductivity(current travel on surface area), but eddy current is highly reduced
2) why a stationary magnet do not produce eddy current or electro magnetic current in a coil which law define this part?
3) an air core coil when in operation produce and offer electronic characteristic showing blocking AC current, exhibiting current lagging , LC circuit acts like pendulum , but it don't attract metal as a magnet until and unless it has some permeable material experiencing its current flow
in my experiments i am developing methods for reducing the eddy current loses, inter crossing of magnetic forces even then you can generate good amount of electric current
these are really new lines of working with magnetic field This involves highly precise sensing circuits and software
Wattsup:
thank you brother for your support.
in my circuit we are siphoning current we require negative current below zero and positive current as well just like in a single phase line due to this reason we cannot directly feed DC current into genie
i listen to every one very patiently and don't mind what they are saying i take good knowledge from there discussions
all the above discussion is coz may be some one out there working in the same area can give me good advice or by looking at my work can improve his own work in either way we are helping a community looking for developing green energy
i will send unit free of cost to you before releasing in market coz every single word of support and knowledge is a contribution toward development
a simple question to everyone this is leading towards new concepts
why we use aluminium disk in a power meter?
Post by: hartiberlin on November 13, 2009, 02:29:51 PM
why don´t you use 2 x 12 Volts Batteries in series for your input
and use one battery for the positive input and one battery for the negative
input ?
This way you have positive, ground=connection of both batteries in the center
and negative potential.
So where is the problem ?
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: winsonali on November 13, 2009, 04:20:23 PM
DC batteries always generate zero or positive
they never have below zero level, inverted polarities do show on meters -ve pole but they are reverse polarity not below zero level
we need negative and zero
Post by: FatChance!!! on November 13, 2009, 04:27:10 PM
The center point between two batteries in series is always 0V compared to +12V and -12V.
AC is nothing but positive and negative polarities shifting around a center point.
If you don't get this then I seriously doubt you have reached any overunity in your device.
Post by: jan.kolar on November 13, 2009, 04:39:33 PM
Ali said: "this is a new unit please do not mix this with genie"
If you have found some new principle that could be used for energy generation then this should go to the new thread. Stefan can you give your opinion?
Post by: hartiberlin on November 13, 2009, 04:45:19 PM
This is where you are wrong Ali.
The center point between two batteries in series is always 0V compared to +12V and -12V.
AC is nothing but positive and negative polarities shifting around a center point.
If you don't get this then I seriously doubt you have reached any overunity in your device.
Yes,you are right,
that is what I meant.
The centerpoint is 0 Volt and then you have
+12V and -12V.
That should be okay to design a working unit.
Otherwise Ali could already have used a 12 Volts DCto 240 Volts AC inverter-converter
and used this as his input and use at the output a 240 Volts AC to 12 Volts DC power supply.
If there really is this high gain, what he claims, then this would already run selflooped...
Ali, why don´t you try to show us such a setup ?
Post by: winsonali on November 13, 2009, 05:33:44 PM
so i am trying to understand what they are saying the below figure may be explaining some reference points
changing the polarities of a DC battery we cannot change the zero reference and they cannot go below zero.
magnets and current produce through magnets have capability to generate below zero reference
transformers use electro magnetic waves , generators use electro magnetic waves
i have expanded my area of research in this new realm
Post by: wattsup on November 13, 2009, 06:50:54 PM
@winsonali
Maybe consider using a 12vdc battery running an inverter to supply your Genie. Anything to get off the regular grid will enable you to have a specific point of reference compared to your output, without having to use a watt meter, looking at a counter turning and then counting seconds, etc. That's not a good way.
But are you absolutely sure that you cannot just tap into your Genie circuit directly where the DC is required and simply use a battery bank?
Added;
Regarding measurements, the following is a good guideline. It is a long read but it is full of information that may be useful to you at this critical stage.
http://nzdl.sadl.uleth.ca/cgi-bin/library.cgi?e=d-00000-00---off-0hdl--00-0----0-10-0---0---0direct-10---4-------0-1l--11-en-50---20-about---00-0-1-00-0-0-11-1-0utfZz-8-00&a=d&cl=CL3.41&d=HASH86f8f67512ed24374cd21f.24
Post by: winsonali on November 13, 2009, 07:58:58 PM
thanks for understanding
i am just working for the input of genie the output of genie is just like any inverter so it can not be feed backed
i have tried all only possibility with out a dimmer is a transformer based circuit then we can feed back. Everything in this world has its limitations
during the course of developing that input feed i decided to try different things so i am doing this and i hope with the support and knowledge base coming from forum and my own ingenuity i will achieve the target soon. Some adverse comments from member of the forum is the price of knowledge we are gathering
still i am thirsty for my quest regarding magnetic fields and their effects
Post by: winsonali on November 13, 2009, 08:04:19 PM
thankyou once again this link is very usefull and full of knowledge
others should also read that link
Post by: FatChance!!! on November 13, 2009, 09:19:45 PM
What the hell are you guys talking about. Since when is a center of two series batteries a zero point. Maybe in your dreams. If DC was so alike AC then Tesla would have been out of business since day one. In AC both outputs fall to zero at the same time, then go back up to maximum on the reverse side and so on. There is no positive and negative. lolYou are wrong and I'm sorry to shatter your missconception on AC vs DC with a midpoint.
Using two batteries or any other DC source where you are shifting the polarities by electronics
will create an output just as you say where "both outputs fall to zero at the same time".
The midpoint mentioned is simply the level where the output meet each other when they have fallen.
This is regular knowledge and produced by all analog amplifiers in every TV or Stereo.
The shape, rise/fall time determines whether the AC is categorized as Sinus, Square or Triangular wave.
The simplest way to create AC from a single DC source (no midpoint) is using a bridge connected
power amplifier where the input is 60Hz and 180 degrees shifted sinus from a frequency generator.
Then connect your device right between the outputs and you have your own AC source that is
totally adjustable both in frequency and voltage.
Post by: jan.kolar on November 13, 2009, 09:33:11 PM
What the hell are you guys talking about. Since when is a center of two series batteries a zero point. Maybe in your dreams. If DC was so alike AC then Tesla would have been out of business since day one. In AC both outputs fall to zero at the same time, then go back up to maximum on the reverse side and so on. There is no positive and negative. lol
I think we should recapitulate some basic theory of electromagnetism. We should distinguish between electric potential and electric voltage. These are two different things. If we are talking about electric potential then we should know that choice of place with zero potential is arbitrary!!! So it doesnt matter if we choose zero potential in central, bottom or top wire. Electric voltage which is potential difference will be the same in all three cases. I agree with FatChance!!! and Stefan that if we want negative&positive voltage at the same time then reference point should be in center (provided that we are using two 12V batteries). The negative voltage we obtain in bottom wire is principally the same we could get from grid (neglecting that AC is time dependent and changes polarity 50 times per second). No new quality if we use negative voltage from grid its the same as from battery.
Post by: winsonali on November 13, 2009, 11:22:54 PM
i wish this knowledge will lead the power supply manufacturers and they stop using 79XX as negative regulators and circuit designer start using this techniques as mentioned in earlier posts
Post by: winsonali on November 14, 2009, 12:02:00 AM
Post by: Groundloop on November 14, 2009, 12:20:06 AM
If you want +9VDC and -9VDC with a common ground then here is how you do it.
Groundloop.
Post by: tinu on November 14, 2009, 12:23:45 AM
OMG! :o
Is it so?!
Why did you turn the second battery up-side down?! Is it lead-acid? Be aware, it may leak on the floor etc. ;)
Wouldn't be better to keep it the way producer recommends? ;D
Ali, Ali, I don't get how possibly you could master electronics the way you do if a simple AC signal slips through your fingers!
Post by: winsonali on November 14, 2009, 01:07:31 AM
Post by: Groundloop on November 14, 2009, 01:14:07 AM
If you want to run your circuit from a battery(s) and need 230VAC clipped via a triac dimmer
then use a true sinus 12 (or 24) volt unit that converts the battery voltage to a true sinus
AC voltage. Connect a triac dimmer on the output of the converter and you have what
you want.
Groundloop.
Post by: winsonali on November 14, 2009, 01:22:23 AM
the main problem i am facing is when i try to produce grid like power out put
from transformer we can easily produce +ve and -ve DC supply now the main thing is to combine them on single wire with on and off period of 50 HZ but for 2 milli seconds only during each cycle when we turn on NPN mosfet to pass +ve volts it also go to PNP mosfet for negative supply and that blow up immediately
i am working and will solve the issue shortly well thank you for your help.
Post by: Groundloop on November 14, 2009, 01:29:29 AM
Can you make a drawing of you problem? A drawing makes it easier for me to understand
what your problem is. I may be able to help.
Groundloop.
Post by: allcanadian on November 14, 2009, 02:15:43 AM
Post by: wattsup on November 14, 2009, 02:22:01 AM
So in essence you are pulsing in reversing polarity at 50hz with 2mS on time per cycle. If you are switching this on one wire, would you not then need the same switching on the other end of your circuit in reverse otherwise you are just making a short circuit. Unless if the shorting is desirable.
If anyone here can help you it is most certainly @groundloop. You can count yourself lucky for him to extend a helping hand.
Post by: quarktoo on November 14, 2009, 02:57:35 AM
http://www.mcmanis.com/chuck/robotics/tutorial/h-bridge/
Kind of reminds me of hydrocars claiming a free energy device after he discovered that you could charge a cap and the increased voltage would make a light bulb work.
Post by: hartiberlin on November 14, 2009, 05:19:49 AM
why don´t you use such a waveform ?
It can be easily generated from a few CMOS
parts or a GAL programmable logic from
6 x 12 Batteries as the source all in series.
Then you would have a + 36 Volts pulse, zero Volts
and -36 Volts pulse.
Would that be okay ?
See attached graphics:
Post by: Groundloop on November 14, 2009, 10:45:37 AM
Here is a proposed circuit that will make a chopped sinus signal at the output.
Regards,
Groundloop.
Post by: CompuTutor on November 14, 2009, 11:13:16 AM
Post by: Groundloop on November 14, 2009, 11:31:57 AM
Thank you for your comments.
The 4N35 opto coupler has one IR led and one enlarged base IR sensitive transistor inside.
The transistor can be linear controlled by the IR led. See the attached image from the data sheet.
The output of my analog H-Bridge will be a copy of the input signal, providing the amplitude to
the IR LEDs has the correct level so that the opto coupler transistor is controlled as a linear device.
Regards,
Groundloop.
Post by: CompuTutor on November 14, 2009, 11:48:12 AM
I was referencing both Stefan's and your schematic and waveform contributions.
I missed your nick as I was scanning down the page was all,
thought I was reading another Ali post.
I have emptied my above post to correct that.
Sorry 'bout that.
Post by: Groundloop on November 14, 2009, 11:57:29 AM
No problem, I always get my two big coffee jars before logging in to this forum. :-)
So, do you think my circuit can produce the needed wave output? I was thinking that the
control input could be a micro controller (connected to an A/D converter) generating the
needed wave input for the bridge.
Regards,
Groundloop.
Post by: CompuTutor on November 14, 2009, 12:19:33 PM
And you didn't use a floating +/- supply,
just a single-ended one.
All a matter of (Ground) reference really anyway.
So the mean average of the output would be half the supply voltage.
Or to put it Ali's way: "not below zero volts"
I agree though, we need a diagram of what he is feeding to help him more.
I'm going back to bed, lol.
Post by: Groundloop on November 14, 2009, 12:26:36 PM
If his circuit has just a two wire input then all you need is a single supply.
I agree that we need some drawings from Ali to be able to help him more.
(Have a good night sleep. :-)
Groundloop.
Post by: winsonali on November 14, 2009, 01:59:18 PM
the cmos IC's can be used for Ac conversion but they have limited power output
the circiut designed by ground loop is basically flip flop AC which changes the positive and zero between 2 wires this technique is used in SMPS inverters and they work very fine but there is no below zero reference in there.
consider a magnet with N and S terminal and the forces are balanced in the center
this can be replicated in a center tip transformer this is why they can produce below zero reference
try to understand the harmonics of AC cycles are more then the harmonies produced through DC converted to AC this is because the DC works in only one quadrant and electromagnetic Ac works in 2 quadrants
Ac is just like a wheel with a rotating center axis and DC is just like a square block of wood
Batteries can only produce DC coz there is no way to transfer charges in ionic medium with nill polarity that is some thing between anode and cathode
negative supplies are rarely used now a days there were normally used in valve circuit
The negative supply are good for high power RF PA
the easiest way for my circiut is use of opamp with dual supply as comparator this gives me out put on single wire but here the problem is we need an op amp with dual supply that can handle 5~10 amps
this is not a normal requirement so manufacturers do not produce such devices off the shelf
well on the other hand a triac can handle heavy currents
i have developed a new circuit and right now i am designing its PCB
well while i was using transformer for the input section i though its a good idea to test some new method i review the use of PM in transformer and my finding were just like other members of this forum there is some thing missing in that technique
recently based on my own theory i manage to develop electric current without inter crossing the magnetic field the result is 1 volt with some good current
these experiments lead me to many question in order to improve the process the question i posted in my last posts
i will repost those questions in next post
please do not consider that i am diverting direction of discussion we all know the problem of intelligent people that ideas always clouded our minds and quest of perfection is the enemy of work completion.
Post by: winsonali on November 14, 2009, 02:07:23 PM
Quote
I was basically designing input section of genie without a dimmer with AVR capability then i think about using permanent magnet in a transformer that experiments failed and i saw number of patents dating 1954, to 1978 and i also review Tom Beardom's MEG i realize something is not right in this method and i developed this new technique of using magnetic field with out inter crossing and produce good use able electric power. These are really new lines of working with magnetic fields this involves highly precise sensing circuits and software
Few results of my experiments raised these questions
1) what is the speed of magnetic lines
1A) what is the frequency of magnetic lines.
1B) what is the resonant frequency of any magnetic material.
1B) an aluminum wire coated with silver offer good conductivity(current travel on surface area), but eddy current is highly reduced
2) why a stationary magnet do not produce eddy current or electro magnetic current in a coil which law define this part?
3) an air core coil when in operation produce and offer electronic characteristic showing blocking AC current, exhibiting current lagging , LC circuit acts like pendulum , but it don't attract metal as a magnet until and unless it has some permeable material experiencing its current flow
in my experiments i am developing methods for reducing the eddy current loses, inter crossing of magnetic forces even then you can generate good amount of electric current
these are really new lines of working with magnetic field This involves highly precise sensing circuits and software
its time for brain storming
Post by: Groundloop on November 14, 2009, 03:57:25 PM
>>the circiut designed by ground loop is basically flip flop AC which changes the positive
>>and zero between 2 wires this technique is used in SMPS inverters and they work
>>very fine but there is no below zero reference in there.
I do not agree with you. The circuit I have designed can generate a signal that is
like your chopped up sinus input. Providing the circuit has an input as described in
the drawing. It has nothing to do with a basically flip flop AC. The circuit is analog
and can be controlled so that the output is a analog sinus.
Does your circuit use a two wire input or not?
BTW: My nick is Groundloop!
Groundloop.
Post by: winsonali on November 14, 2009, 09:43:31 PM
may be i have used the wrong term FLIP FLOP my knowledge is not so good in electronics as yours or others on the forum i am just learning
In your circuit the timing sequence of each Opto coupler can be set and we can get any desired frequency and duty cycle so it means we can develop variable RMS voltage regulator through software and just getting the feed back loop in we can adjust load and current as well ......
so you are right i have designed the same type of circuit using IRF 3205 which is 55 volts 110 amps
lets see what results comes out when i will get the PCB
thanks
Post by: Groundloop on November 14, 2009, 11:17:13 PM
Could you PM me an email address I can reach you on?
I have a lot of designs that may help you in your research.
Groundloop.
Post by: powercat on November 14, 2009, 11:38:31 PM
With all the fantastic work Groundloop has done over the years, I don't know why he is not an elite member yet
cat
Post by: winsonali on November 15, 2009, 01:25:32 AM
email address winsonali@yahoo.com
Post by: winsonali on November 17, 2009, 07:39:48 PM
Tesla win the war of currents
nature has created one type of current that is DC produce through chemical or light or even thermocouple
man created or simulated AC current to use it for ease and portability
my next video shortly show all forum members the self running unit....
Post by: teslaalset on November 17, 2009, 08:35:02 PM
Any details on the output yet?
Looking forward to your new video.
Post by: winsonali on November 17, 2009, 09:27:21 PM
yes i am almost there
i am replacing dimmer input with my own new creation
i named it charge particle accelerator it produce spikes of high current in vacuum tube in the presence of static magnetic field
this new approach will define resonance of magnetic field and oscillation produce due to charge of the particle in vacuum tube
this oscillation causes gain in energy of charges and movement perpendicular to the magnetic field at the exit we collect it and convert it in use able form by genie. Genie has capability to collect energy in very short intervals of time in micro second and can convert it in use able form that 50 hz 220volts on continuous basis
with new input we will be collecting burst of energy from CPA (charge particle accelerator ) on very small period of time i am working day and night to accomplish the task my mind is extremely busy i cant sleep
Post by: minde4000 on November 17, 2009, 09:28:29 PM
Minde
Post by: teslaalset on November 17, 2009, 10:08:16 PM
teslaalset:
this new approach will define resonance of magnetic field and oscillation produce due to charge of the particle in vacuum tube
this oscillation causes gain in energy of charges and movement perpendicular to the magnetic field at the exit we collect it and convert it in use able form by genie.
Sounds like you found out how Tesla was able to run the electric car. He used vacuum tubes for that as well to compose a power unit that drived his car.
Post by: Nihilanth on November 18, 2009, 04:47:25 AM
my next video shortly show all forum members the self running unit....Do you mean you will show it power itself? :o
Post by: hartiberlin on November 18, 2009, 04:51:14 AM
looking forward to see your new device !
Many thanks in advance.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: FatBird on November 18, 2009, 05:26:50 PM
http://www.MyFreeCopyright.com
Thank you Ali for trying to HELP the WORLD out of its energy crisis.
.
Post by: winsonali on November 18, 2009, 07:09:06 PM
thanks i really need this encouragement
Ali
Post by: FatBird on November 18, 2009, 11:23:10 PM
Abslolutely Amazing!! This is DEFINITELY NOT a "reflection" into the camera lens!!
LOL
.
Post by: CTG Labs on November 19, 2009, 01:56:10 AM
Post by: WattBuilder on November 20, 2009, 08:37:56 AM
Winsonali,
Great to see you made some progress.
As for your Genie I can image the use of it in many industrial applications.
Companies are all ways looking to save energy consumption on their equipment and it can be the deciding factor to get the contract over their competitors.
Currently there are companies who are selling energy saving capacitor like devices to factories and even to homeowners.
Sound like you have a great product. You should do very well.
Stay focus. :)
Cheers
Howard
Post by: jan.kolar on November 20, 2009, 09:49:49 AM
Winsonali,
Great to see you made some progress.
As for your Genie I can image the use of it in many industrial applications.
Companies are all ways looking to save energy consumption on their equipment and it can be the deciding factor to get the contract over their competitors.
Currently there are companies who are selling energy saving capacitor like devices to factories and even to homeowners.
Sound like you have a great product. You should do very well.
Stay focus. :)
Cheers
Howard
Majority of companies selling energy saving capacitors are scammers. In some special cases capacitors can save a few percent of bill but this has nothing to do with overunity. All can be understand using standard theory of electricity. By reducing reactive power you are bringing down line losses in your house. You are mixing 2 different things. More information on http://en.allexperts.com/q/Electrical-Engineering-1356/2009/1/Energy-saving-capacitor.htm
Post by: winsonali on November 20, 2009, 11:18:25 AM
generic details can be found over here
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_factor_correction
most of good manufacturer have those capacitors in there units no need to use them extra ordinarily
these capacitor do not increase the voltages from 40 to 240volts
watt builder:
thank you for encouragement we can understand the painful process of development especially when you are doing at your own. we are riding in the same boat. at least we have enough courage and capability to put our knowledge in working models. failure is for myself only, success everyone will enjoy.....experts opinion bring worth and knowledge hidden in their experience of years.
negative or personnel non professional comments just ignore them.
can you send me some useful links i need mechanical energy conversion formula's linear force vs circular movement and i think its your field
Ali
Post by: BEP on November 20, 2009, 12:36:38 PM
You can have the same effect by shooting your car headlights, if they are the newer 'near UV' lights.
Google 'MTF' (Modulation Transfer Function). This is basically the inability of the CCD cell to perform its job of averaging pixel color. This can happen because the area color is changing rapidly (almost square-wave) or the light spectrum for the pixel is approaching the upper limits of the CCD camera.
.... It does tell me this device is probably applying a very high frequency to the bulb. Perhaps only as 50Hz modulation of a very high frequency carrier but their is high frequency there.
....
Post by: winsonali on November 20, 2009, 02:24:35 PM
Quote
experts opinion bring worth and knowledge hidden in their experience of years
very simple question to all forum member
mechanical converted to electric energy by magnetism(electro + permanent)
it means they are from the same origin they speak same mother language
Now
1) if DC batteries are connected in series, that perform addition(1.5V+1.5 V=3V), what happen if we connect magnets in series?
2) 2 DC batteries 12 volts and 6 volts connected in parallel ? voltage level remain same but current increases,what if we get magnet aligned in parallel?
thanks
Post by: wattsup on November 20, 2009, 02:26:47 PM
In one of your previous posts you said "comparator" and that made me think about a device I used to sell in the 80's called an Electronic Power Factor Controller. We had models able to control up to 200hp motors. The device basically senses the load on a motor and provides only the power required to run the load requirement by cutting out a portion of the sinewave. The three patents on this is located here and may give you some ideas on how to better use Triacs. The NASA folder holds the original patent that was then licensed to manufactures at the time, but I seem to see know it is completely forgotten. I should have held on to my last units.
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Companies/Cynex%20Manufacturing%20Corporation/
Post by: Nihilanth on November 21, 2009, 10:17:22 AM
can you send me some useful links i need mechanical energy conversion formula's linear force vs circular movement and i think its your fieldYou're planning on implementing mechanical parts into your device? :(
Post by: winsonali on November 22, 2009, 12:26:07 AM
Post by: CompuTutor on November 22, 2009, 05:08:13 PM
.....a device I used to sell in the 80's called an Electronic Power Factor Controller.....
On that...
Is there currently a company
or brand on the market now
that you can recommend?
(Less then 2-HP motors)
Sorry for the off-topic question,
it was thrown out there though.
Post by: winsonali on November 22, 2009, 06:44:23 PM
a magnet either permanent or electro has nothing to do with electricity generation its just a property of materials to attract like materials and the reason is polarization this means it has fixed exit and entry points .
the mechanical analogy is, if you have cup of tea and you want to mix sugar in it, now you will use a spoon if you just put the spoon in the tea it will not do any thing, to mix the sugar you need to stir spoon this means you have transfered the ME energy in system
like wise a magnet can not induce current in a coil just by keeping it near to the coil, it will transfer ME energy in coil when you move the magnet this means ME is transfered in electricity and the media used for transfer of energy is magnet.
magnets work as carrier of energy waves from ME to EE also, EE to EE ( open loop transformers, charges travelling in vacuum ) mean while if we intercept these waves and modulate them on another field you will get added energy of magnetic property.
the important thing is charges travelling should posses less energy then intercepting field force in vacuum.
mechanically this is not easily possible because you need 120,0000 RPM for proper modulation but thanks to modern power electronics we can simulate this in electronics
Post by: teslaalset on November 22, 2009, 07:54:12 PM
a better understanding of Ac current can be visualized by this animation
Tesla win the war of currents
nature has created one type of current that is DC produce through chemical or light or even thermocouple
man created or simulated AC current to use it for ease and portability
my next video shortly show all forum members the self running unit....
Is there any progress on you new video, Ali?
We are all quite curious and looking forward....
Post by: winsonali on November 22, 2009, 08:15:11 PM
in my last post i have given a clue how i am doing electricity generation
Post by: gyulasun on November 22, 2009, 08:53:36 PM
very simple question to all forum member
mechanical converted to electric energy by magnetism(electro + permanent)
it means they are from the same origin they speak same mother language
Now
1) if DC batteries are connected in series, that perform addition(1.5V+1.5 V=3V), what happen if we connect magnets in series?
2) 2 DC batteries 12 volts and 6 volts connected in parallel ? voltage level remain same but current increases,what if we get magnet aligned in parallel?
thanks
Hi Ali,
Nobody reflected on your questions so I try to answer them.
1) if you connect two magnets in series like NSNS I think you get a stronger magnet, about twice as strong if they are of the same strength each. Their Bloch wall will develop in the middle of their full length as if you had manufactured the double length magnet immediately, instead of the original "half" length
2) if you connect two magnets in parallel then normally you have to use soft iron yokes to guide the repel poles so that you could handle the parallel closeness, this way you can also add up the fluxes of the individual magnets, see Joe Flynn's parallel path technology for instance.
One notice on connecting a 12 and a 6V battery in parallel: you cannot do this directly because the higher voltage battery will be loaded very heavily by the lower voltage one and the former gets discharged very soon and the latter will be heavily overcharged. Normally such parallel battery combinations have no much sense, and even in case of similar voltage batteries a series diode is used with each battery to prevent any harmful influence on each other.
rgds, Gyula
Post by: teslaalset on November 22, 2009, 09:07:48 PM
during my recent working i have established this fact
a magnet either permanent or electro has nothing to do with electricity generation its just a property of materials to attract like materials and the reason is polarization this means it has fixed exit and entry points .
the mechanical analogy is, if you have cup of tea and you want to mix sugar in it, now you will use a spoon if you just put the spoon in the tea it will not do any thing, to mix the sugar you need to stir spoon this means you have transfered the ME energy in system
like wise a magnet can not induce current in a coil just by keeping it near to the coil, it will transfer ME energy in coil when you move the magnet this means ME is transfered in electricity and the media used for transfer of energy is magnet.
magnets work as carrier of energy waves from ME to EE also, EE to EE ( open loop transformers, charges travelling in vacuum ) mean while if we intercept these waves and modulate them on another field you will get added energy of magnetic property.
the important thing is charges travelling should posses less energy then intercepting field force in vacuum.
mechanically this is not easily possible because you need 120,0000 RPM for proper modulation but thanks to modern power electronics we can simulate this in electronics
What kind of vacuum are you actually using?
Vacuum tubes? Can you mention a type number?
Your cryptic description reminds me also of light travelling at different speeds in air, glass, water....
Post by: winsonali on November 22, 2009, 09:44:21 PM
in my experiments i have got these results
2 magnets in series means single magnet of the same strength as single one just the length is increased
adding 2 batteries of 6 volts and 12 volts you are right we need to protect the low voltage battery from over charging
in new devices various channels are operating producing different voltages we need to collect all spikes and produce collective energy.
Post by: forest on November 22, 2009, 10:11:06 PM
when we use all energy available in primary - both electric and magnetic part converting to one kind then on clever made secondary we can multiply primary power many times
i'm not sure about that but it seems quite possible that electric power has both magnetic and electric components and both are equal and opposite exactly like Don Smith states
the key is to move both components from primary to secondary and secondary becomes a disruption of ambient field which respond to equal power all around which can be collected in multiply
Post by: gyulasun on November 22, 2009, 11:01:52 PM
gyluasun:
in my experiments i have got these results
2 magnets in series means single magnet of the same strength as single one just the length is increased
adding 2 batteries of 6 volts and 12 volts you are right we need to protect the low voltage battery from over charging
in new devices various channels are operating producing different voltages we need to collect all spikes and produce collective energy.
Ok on your series magnets, I can accept that because personally I have not tested it (only the parallel case), sorry for this, and I answered what I read on different forums, probably those writing the double flux for the series case did not test it correctly before or were mistaken.
I can imagine though that the flux of two seriesly joined magnets may become a little more concentrated at the ends but this multiplier cannot be the double value of one magnet but a value between 1 to 1.4 maybe.
rgds, Gyula
Post by: winsonali on November 22, 2009, 11:16:45 PM
Quote
'm not sure about that but it seems quite possible that electric power has both magnetic and electric components and both are equal and opposite exactly like Don Smith states
you are right electric power have both component magnetic properties and electrical but they are not opposite to each other
copper is not attracted towards magnet, make a coil and supply power to it without any core inside coil ,you will see it will show magnetic property by attracting iron pcs
on the other hand take a magnet pure and check with you multi meter you will find high resistance in magnet although it is made up of iron.
magnetic and electric charges are not opposite to each other
please check the voltages produce when you move a magnet over the coil you will find they start as magnet move towards the coil and finishes as magnet go away from coil, if they were opposite they should behave vice versa
Post by: jan.kolar on November 23, 2009, 09:25:19 AM
Post by: winsonali on November 23, 2009, 03:21:47 PM
more light on this subject will be an addition in my knowledge base
Post by: winsonali on November 23, 2009, 04:41:47 PM
The magnetron is a fairly efficient device. once they are released in passive environment its up to us how many multiple channels we create to receive energy, just like in a radio station number of receiver are not limited they follow I^2 R formula for there intensity
i have already developed method for collection of energy from spikes of short intervals.
No body thinks out of the box everybody is going toward conventional method this is the new method i have developed and will shortly show the video, these postings are my proof of this method invented by me
we are courageous enough that we are doing some thing beside lip service and we are doing at our cost if its a failure is mine but success every one will enjoy.
Post by: forest on November 23, 2009, 06:01:20 PM
Looks like you have something similar to what Steven Mark found investigating Tesla method. Acceleration of electrons.
Post by: winsonali on November 23, 2009, 07:49:53 PM
Tesla did his work and showed transfer of energy, last bit to collect and reuse energy is still missing, may be deliberately and his lab was put at fire,
i am developing methods to harness energy from spikes in channels of one to many format(1 source many collectors), here we need to understand passive mediums and active mediums
analogy and example of my method if a radio walkie talkie transmit signal at 5 watt in vhf band it can be received in an area of 1km
now its intensity is limited by area not number of receivers you can have 100s of receivers in that area and everyone will receive equal signal
this example is not good for heating system coz heat does not travel on electromagnetic waves.
Post by: winsonali on November 23, 2009, 08:41:18 PM
i have just gone through Steven Mark TPU for the first time after you mention his name in your post
i couldn't go in details coz its a very long thread but by looking at the circuit diagram i want to give my opinion may be i am wrong
this is high frequency air core transformer with feed back and trying to collect BEMF directly through termination points.
this method will blow MOSFETs and will not give you stable results. this kind of circuit were usually used in transformer coupling radio amplifiers in valve ACDC radios.
in this method all activities are taking place in active zone i really don't know how well it have performed
with my experience you need controlled isolated passive zone for parallel processing of energy collectors.
Post by: forest on November 23, 2009, 10:29:44 PM
forest:
i have just gone through Steven Mark TPU for the first time after you mention his name in your post
i couldn't go in details coz its a very long thread but by looking at the circuit diagram i want to give my opinion may be i am wrong
this is high frequency air core transformer with feed back and trying to collect BEMF directly through termination points.
this method will blow MOSFETs and will not give you stable results. this kind of circuit were usually used in transformer coupling radio amplifiers in valve ACDC radios.
in this method all activities are taking place in active zone i really don't know how well it have performed
with my experience you need controlled isolated passive zone for parallel processing of energy collectors.
I think TPU is rather 1 to 3 active transmitters collecting and converting kicks into continuous current (Tesla method) and 1 to 3 passive receivers - curious transformers which really accelerate small DC bias enlarging current . The same for Hubbard coil , the same for Kapanadze device , the same for Don Smith one of devices, the same for Hendershot and many others. You are mislead thinking that Tesla didn't perfected the output conversion stage - he did it but never said plainly about it. His magnifying transmitter patent proves this.From here , extra coil become antenna but he was not sending EM waves but pure conduction current. Yet your comparison still apply - one transmitter many receivers.
Post by: winsonali on November 23, 2009, 10:53:23 PM
thanks for explanation its very good this is why we say knowledge comes by discussion i was not knowing these things and devices of don smith or steven mark.....some times you stuck in some issues and going through the experiences of others you get good ideas
my method is totally different i am just writing firm ware for the final procedures
Tesla is my mentor.
Post by: gravityblock on November 23, 2009, 11:50:03 PM
I see that this thread is leading nowhere. Ali, how can you talk about magnetic charges? No one has ever seen magnetic monopole and according to classic electrodynamical theory they dont exist. If you discovered magnetic monopole then you deserve Nobel prize.
Magnetic monopoles detected in a real magnet for the first time, http://www.physorg.com/news171209923.html Also, according to the article they interact in the same way as electric charges.
There are several theories that predict the existence of monopoles. You must be holding to the classic electrodynamical theory of being correct and the other theories are wrong. How closed minded is this? LOL
In this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-dbGUcnFaI&feature=channel , you can see the magnetic monopoles when the lines of flux are disconnected from each other.
When the field lines are connected to each other then there is a return path which creates a dipole because it's connecting two poles. When they're not connected, then there is no return path for the flux, which is a monopole because it's only connected to a single pole. Without monopoles, you can't have a dipole. Monopoles carry the magnetic fields which creates a dipole. In the video you can see how the monopoles carry the magnetic fields. These monopoles are the "virtual photons" that physicists theorize about.
Read the article and study the video, then you will realize the article and video fit perfectly together.
GB
Post by: winsonali on November 24, 2009, 02:43:16 AM
nice video and very informative article
in my experience when you move magnet over a coil its the speed of your movement that determine the voltage and current induced
in the coil Higher speed doesn't effect in any way the magnetic filed (nor it increase nor it decreases).
to get mechanical accuracy above 10,000RPM (150HZ) is pretty scary for a machine in continuous operation
the success is in solid state power generation
for this purpose EE must be released from its active zone to passive zone where it can move freely and then recaptured in active zones on multiple channels this will give us extra power generation then input
a very interesting behavior in SMPS we increase the switching frequency from 10 Khz to 300 Khz we get very good current rating and good supply but its not overunity coz it remains in active zone when we increase load on output secondary coil of transformer induce higher FLUX then primary coil at this moment primary coil start consuming more current to balance the power level this is an active zone
now if we lit a bulb of 100 watts the power remains same no matter how many things receive the light this is a passive zone
when a radio starts transmission at 5 watt its power doesn't change no matter how many receiver starts receiving the signal.
Post by: gravityblock on November 24, 2009, 03:51:48 AM
I'm impressed how you don't let baseless or uninformed statements such as jan.kolar to re-direct your thoughts on what your observing in your experiments. Keep up the good work.
GB
Post by: Nihilanth on November 24, 2009, 09:18:36 AM
In this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-dbGUcnFaI&feature=channel , you can see the magnetic monopoles when the lines of flux are disconnected from each other.Those aren't monopoles.
when a radio starts transmission at 5 watt its power doesn't change no matter how many receiver starts receiving the signal.One could use a single tuning fork to resonate with multiple other tuning forks, getting the same output for however many tuning forks there are. A bunch of PZT tuning forks would be a rather noisy overunity device. :P
Post by: teslaalset on November 24, 2009, 09:40:01 AM
for this purpose EE must be released from its active zone to passive zone where it can move freely and then recaptured in active zones on multiple channels this will give us extra power generation then input
Hi Ali, can you explain what you mean with 'release from its active zone to passive zone'?
Maybe you can give an example?
Thanks!
Post by: forest on November 24, 2009, 09:59:53 AM
Post by: gravityblock on November 24, 2009, 10:25:42 AM
Those aren't monopoles.
They are magnetic fields. You can clearly see the monopoles carrying the magnetic fields when they are reconnecting to each other. Just watch the two ends of the disconnected field lines connecting to each other, which connects the poles to form a dipole.
A dipole field is made up of two poles. A monopole field is made up of 1 pole. Where the field lines connect there is a zero point. The monopoles being this zero point and connecting the two fields together. I can show you a video of energy coming out of this zero point if you like. The energy that is released are the magnetic charges and are not electrical charges.
Monopoles can be viewed as magnetic charges which carries the magnetic fields and connects the poles together forming a dipole field.
Please send me a PM if you want to discuss this. I don't want to distract from the topic of this thread.
GB
Post by: jan.kolar on November 24, 2009, 10:55:47 AM
when a radio starts transmission at 5 watt its power doesn't change no matter how many receiver starts receiving the signal.Ali, Ali you have not heard about law of energy conservation? Yes you can have 100s of receivers but signals on input antennas are very small typically microvolts. Also there is feedback between receiver and transmitter similar to coupling between secondary and primary side of transformer (Lenz law).
Regarding the so called magnetic monopoles i dont believe these are true monopoles. According to wikipedia article div B = 0 so classical theory is valid. Its similar to monopole in appearance but thats all not saying that this discovery was not confirmed by independent researchers. Popular press trying to attract readers.
Post by: winsonali on November 24, 2009, 12:30:32 PM
process of PM manufacturing is based on cooling the material slowly/naturally in magnetic environment
once it is cooled to ambient temperature that magnetic force remain there for years
very simple you cannot define the relationship between energy required to make a permanent magnet and force available through that magnet over the years how you will explain law of conservation of energy here.
lets take a look at ohms law:
V directly proportional to current
V=I R (R = ratio adjuster for proportionality)
now if something has constant resistance it will dissipate constant power in other words
if resistance is constant then power will be constant provided you are not changing voltage.
now
P=V*I
or v = P/I (remove the constant power)
V is inversely proportional to I
the above statement is true means how many calculations were wrong
mathematics is the poetry of science writing it correctly is an art
laws are man defined there could be flaws in them but they are mostly correct.
now this is my theory..
once any energy released from its active zone to its passive zone it moves freely and travel in all directions can be experienced equally in a certain area without losing its powers.
Post by: winsonali on November 24, 2009, 12:32:58 PM
Quote
One could use a single tuning fork to resonate with multiple other tuning forks, getting the same output for however many tuning forks there are. A bunch of PZT tuning forks would be a rather noisy overunity device.Nilihanth:
this is the most perfect example of forces behavior in passive medium.
Post by: winsonali on November 24, 2009, 02:50:03 PM
Quote
Hi Ali, can you explain what you mean with 'release from its active zone to passive zone'?teslaaset:
Maybe you can give an example?
active zone is the medium where you can apply effects by interfering and mixing of signals
for instant with gain control you can increase or decrease the power of a transmitter but once the energy released in passive zone you cannot do anything with it
in air infinite radio electromagnetic fields are present you can feel them but cannot alter them until and unless you capture them in active zone.
Post by: gravityblock on November 24, 2009, 09:46:43 PM
According to wikipedia article div B = 0 so classical theory is valid.
div B = 0 is derivable from the Biot-Savart's law.
If a true monopole exists, then div B is no longer zero and a Coulomb-like term would have to be added to Biot-Savart's law, but Biot-Savart's would still give the B field of a current.
The end results would be the same weather we account for the monopole or not in B-S law.
div b = 0 does not mean monopoles do not exist!
Post by: Nihilanth on November 25, 2009, 03:13:46 AM
this is the most perfect example of forces behavior in passive medium.Thank you. Joke-devices aside, what exactly are you hinting at? Am I correct in assuming it has something to do with capacitor or inductor resonance?
Post by: gravityblock on November 25, 2009, 04:56:29 AM
Electric charges follow the path of a wire which will always remain in the active zone.
Magnetic charges can enter the passive zone since they don't have to follow the conductor, they will follow the electromagnetic waves which propagate through space and can be picked up by many collectors in the passive zone to complete the energy transfer. As the receivers collect the magnetic charges, the magnetic charges will be replenished from the magnetic fields propagating through space without affecting the source since the source isn't using any net current. The source only requires a voltage to extract energy from the zero point field.
Please correct me where I am wrong Ali. I look forward to the video of your latest device.
Post by: exnihiloest on November 25, 2009, 08:57:21 AM
...
process of PM manufacturing is based on cooling the material slowly/naturally in magnetic environment
...
Bullshits.
PM are made at room temperature from magnetic materials placed in pulsed magnetic fields generated from coils powered with capacitors banks.
Post by: exnihiloest on November 25, 2009, 09:40:35 AM
Magnetic monopoles detected in a real magnet for the first time, http://www.physorg.com/news171209923.html Also, according to the article they interact in the same way as electric charges.
...
There are serious doubts about this article. The extremity of a long solenoïd (L >> r) carrying a current is similar to a magnetic monopole. We can guess that pyrochlore-lattices provides such long chains. Without confirmations from independant teams we can discard this pseudo-discovery.
Post by: jan.kolar on November 25, 2009, 10:00:10 AM
Bullshits.
PM are made at room temperature from magnetic materials placed in pulsed magnetic fields generated from coils powered with capacitors banks.
Ali do you know what hysteresis curve is?
Post by: CompuTutor on November 25, 2009, 02:45:14 PM
Ali, Ali you have not heard about law of energy conservation? Yes you can have 100s of receivers but signals on input antennas are very small typically microvolts. Also there is feedback between receiver and transmitter similar to coupling between secondary and primary side of transformer (Lenz law).
If it was that easy,
then TV and radio would have viewer/listener meters
instead of nielson programming rating boxes...
I for one would gladly show them I block each and every commercial
so they would see that ancient business model doesn't work anymore
(No matter how much louder than the programming they make them!).
however sympathetic vibration is a huge deal with this whole thing.
Surely no one disagrees with that?
I mean, are we sure that Tesla wasn't simply setting up a sympathetic vibration with his amplifying tramsmitter so our enviroment (Earth/ionosphere) could easily tap what has always been there in the first place?
< 8) Sits and awaits the flames from the usual Tesla nay-sayer's >
Post by: CompuTutor on November 25, 2009, 02:50:16 PM
100 % agreed with micro volts at antenna
process of PM manufacturing is based on cooling the material slowly/naturally in magnetic environment
once it is cooled to ambient temperature that magnetic force remain there for years
Bullshits.
PM are made at room temperature from magnetic materials placed in pulsed magnetic fields generated from coils powered with capacitors banks.
Actually, your both right.
Just depends what material your magnetizing,
and what you want from it after it is made.
Both processes are valid and still currently used.
Post by: wattsup on November 25, 2009, 03:06:30 PM
100 % agreed with micro volts at antenna
process of PM manufacturing is based on cooling the material slowly/naturally in magnetic environment
once it is cooled to ambient temperature that magnetic force remain there for years
very simple you cannot define the relationship between energy required to make a permanent magnet and force available through that magnet over the years how you will explain law of conservation of energy here.
So if you calculate the energy required to make let's say a 1 Tesla Permanent Magnet, then take that magnet and stick it under a horizontal metal plate then add a 1 pound piece of iron to it, then next to this you take an electromagnet that can produce 1 Tesla and stick it under another identical horizontal metal plate and add an identical 1 pound piece of iron to it and measure the energy expended to hold the electro magnet and 1 pound weight in place until the PM losses its power to hold it's piece of iron, we should see that the energy used to make the PM is far less then that expended by the electro magnet.
Would that show overunity, or, would it simply show the difference in inefficiencies of one method over the other given our present state of knowledge. You see, if you find a way to charge the PM in a much more efficient manner, that would tip the scale more in favor of the PM. Inversely, if you find a way to hold that electro-magnet by using a much more efficient recirculating circuit, it would sway the favor to that one.
I personally think that from the beginning, with Faraday and Maxwell, their published measurements already included some overunity provided directly by the ether that is everywhere in space. They just did not know it at the time and all technology has followed in that direction ever since. And, we have never been able to produce an etherless environment to test these otherwise.
But imagine if at that pivotal moment both declared that all electrical systems encompassed let's say 80% of actual applied energy and 20% coming from the ether to both help convey electrons in a conductor, provide the lattice to produce magnetic fields, quench or fill the voids created by expanding and collapsing magnetic fields and provide the medium for these fields or waves to travel in the universe, then or perspective of overunity versus the laws of conservation would not be the same. There is just no way of knowing this because even doing tests in a vacuum will not remove the ether from that space. Maybe in a black hole but who wants to go there. lol
If on the other hand we knew about this overunity presence that is all around us, we would have been working on ways to increase the 20% side and decrease the 80% side, knowing that the 20% phenomenon is in fact a reality. Whereas today, those that believe there is the existence of an omnipresent ether energy are looked upon as crazy wishful thinking madmen.
Post by: winsonali on November 25, 2009, 04:04:33 PM
Quote
Bullshits.
PM are made at room temperature from magnetic materials placed in pulsed magnetic fields generated from coils powered with capacitors banks.
very simple answer
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permanent_magnet#Magnetic_materials
Ferromagnetic materials can be magnetized in the following ways:
Heating the object above its Curie temperature, allowing it to cool in a magnetic field and hammering it as it cools. This is the most effective method, and is similar to the industrial processes used to create permanent magnets.
there are other method as well
My knowledge is not very good and far more less then other forum members but my temperament and determination to do some thing is very high.
The point is not in how we make magnets
1) the point is amount of energy consumed in making PM vs amount of energy it will release over the years
2) about ohms law any object with fixed resistance consume fixed power until you do not change voltages
so once again here v=IR or v is directly proportional to current where R is constant
now p = v*I or v = p / I and when resistance is constant it will consume constant power so here v is inversely proportional to I
i am working to develop methods for under standing and using passive zones where you cannot change the shapes and power of the signal.
look guys its not necessary that what ever i think is right i am trying to convert my brain waves into practical means failure is mine success everyone will enjoy.
Post by: winsonali on November 25, 2009, 04:08:45 PM
Quote
If on the other hand we knew about this overunity presence that is all around us, we would have been working on ways to increase the 20% side and decrease the 80% side, knowing that the 20% phenomenon is in fact a reality. Whereas today, those that believe there is the existence of an omnipresent ether energy are looked upon as crazy wishful thinking madmen.
wattsup:
very well said this is where we need to do brain storming a single small clue may lead the change in our living style.
Post by: winsonali on November 25, 2009, 04:41:55 PM
i will invite senior selected members of this forum after completion of my current work
but here is some more brain waves might help understanding combination of electrical charges and magnetic fields
for wave propagation in passive zone we need at least quarter of the size of wave length
if you make a transformer equal to the quarter of the wave length of frequency you will get passive power in active zone that is 1 to many format without power lose there are many mechanical analogies for this...
Post by: gravityblock on November 25, 2009, 05:47:11 PM
Call the article pseudoscience if you like. Articles submitted for peer review are dismissed by the powers that be and are never published if it's not in there best interest. Same thing with patents being rejected for "National Security and other similar reasons".
Gravity is a monopole force that works in attraction mode only. A magnet and metal piece is a monopole force that works in attraction mode only. There's evidence all around us that point to monopole forces.
The knowledge we have of the universe is very small. There are a lot of inconsistencies with our currently accepted theories. We only have theories on what gives matter it's mass, thus the LHC looking for the theoretical higgs boson which makes up the higgs field. 97% of the known universe appears to be missing, thus the dark energy/matter.
Currently accepted theories says what we're trying to do on this forum is not possible, even though it is very far from being complete and accurate without all the inconsistencies. Maybe if they looked into the direction of the impossible instead of only looking into the directions of what they consider possible, then we may have more complete and accurate theories. So, why do you look to them for all the answers. This forum should be based on fringe science based on observations of others and thinking outside the box.
Actually there is no such thing as a "North or South Pole" according to wikipedia. It says North and South Poles should only be used as a reference point for the different ends of the magnets. You really have to read between the lines in what is published anywhere including academic books in universities..
A static charge has no magnetic field, but when it moves it does have a magnetic field. I will assume the static charge has a magnetic charge and has nothing to reach out to and the monopole field stays inside the charge. When the electric charge moves, the monopole charge lags behind by 90 degrees. This causes the monopole field to reach out to the other side forming a dipole field. This is the reason for the magnetic charges carrying the magnetic fields.
A possible reason for electrons inducing their own magnetic fields is due to them having a magnetic charge or a monopole field contained within them. Physicist has yet to figure out how electrons induce their own magnetic fields, so we are left to assume. We haven't been able to do this by using a dipole field, so a monopole field is a good candidate. This is my best assumption based on linking observations together. It is better to assume and try to prove those assumptions correct with experiments, than to make no assumptions and do nothing.
Go take your currently accepted incomplete inconsistent non-pseudoscience somewhere else. It will do us nothing here "as is". It should be used as a guide only in addition to fringe science and theories in order to piece the entire puzzle together.
Post by: forest on November 25, 2009, 06:40:01 PM
GravityBlock:
i will invite senior selected members of this forum after completion of my current work
but here is some more brain waves might help understanding combination of electrical charges and magnetic fields
for wave propagation in passive zone we need at least quarter of the size of wave length
if you make a transformer equal to the quarter of the wave length of frequency you will get passive power in active zone that is 1 to many format without power lose there are many mechanical analogies for this...
Give us those analogies please. I still cannot grasp the idea behind 1/4 wavelength :-[
Post by: gravityblock on November 25, 2009, 06:51:14 PM
Post by: jan.kolar on November 25, 2009, 07:16:48 PM
for wave propagation in passive zone we need at least quarter of the size of wave length
if you make a transformer equal to the quarter of the wave length of frequency you will get passive power in active zone that is 1 to many format without power lose there are many mechanical analogies for this...
A few years ago i calculated conditions in simple circuit with transformer and RC elements on primary and secondary side. At first I have used classical differential equations, nothing strange happened. For the second time I have used differential equations with time delay between primary and secondary. These types of equations are quite difficult to solve so numerical methods are used extensively. Result was that secondary current rised to infinity. I checked all my calculations and found no error. But trying to decreasing time delay lower and lower current waveform was always different than classical solution (not accounting any time delay). So i dont know what would happen in reality when delay between primary and secondary is increased...
Another though occured to me in this context. Hungary man named Janos Vajda suggested way how to get energy from wave fields. The key is that energy density in any point of field is proportional to square of intensity. So after interference of two waves there can be energy gain or even energy loss (it all depends on frequencies of waves and phase differences). Dont know if this principle was practically used in some type of device. More info here : http://www.zpelabs.com/zpelabs/hungarian/studyexp.htm
Post by: jan.kolar on November 25, 2009, 07:33:18 PM
A static charge has no magnetic field, but when it moves it does have a magnetic field. I will assume the static charge has a magnetic charge and has nothing to reach out to and the monopole field stays inside the charge. When the electric charge moves, the monopole charge lags behind by 90 degrees. This causes the monopole field to reach out to the other side forming a dipole field. This is the reason for the magnetic charges carrying the magnetic fields.
A possible reason for electrons inducing their own magnetic fields is due to them having a magnetic charge or a monopole field contained within them. Physicist has yet to figure out how electrons induce their own magnetic fields, so we are left to assume. We haven't been able to do this by using a dipole field, so a monopole field is a good candidate. This is my best assumption based on linking observations together. It is better to assume and try to prove those assumptions correct with experiments, than to make no assumptions and do nothing.
Post by: jan.kolar on November 25, 2009, 07:40:12 PM
for wave propagation in passive zone we need at least quarter of the size of wave lengthYou must go to higher frequencies for your device be small enough. Grid frequency 50 Hz has wavelength about 6000 km. High frequencies demands another materials for coil core with narrow hysteresis curve.
if you make a transformer equal to the quarter of the wave length of frequency you will get passive power in active zone that is 1 to many format without power lose there are many mechanical analogies for this...
Post by: winsonali on November 25, 2009, 10:04:49 PM
thank you for your input regarding current calculations please send me more details i am interest to know your experiment and calculation method
i am using 2.4Ghz ISM band frequency and enclosed in a vacuum tube this vacuum tube is surrounded by coils
the vacuum is producing a passive medium and 1/4 wave length making a complete cycle as active zone on 4th propagation, loads are connected as per the frequency we require when the cycle is completing it deliver no reversing power. it is more like a high frequency modulation but once we convert them in our required form we are happy happy.
just think in a transformer the center core is replaced with a vacuum tube.
although i am not supposed to give the above information but its in the interest of everyone so i am putting it up.
Post by: winsonali on November 25, 2009, 10:23:07 PM
Now we need to just proof our brain waves with practicals.
please be prepare to visit me and see the work by yourself i will be more then happy to share my work with you.
Post by: EMdevices on November 26, 2009, 06:13:23 AM
EM
Post by: exnihiloest on November 26, 2009, 11:20:46 AM
Ali, Ali you have not heard about law of energy conservation? Yes you can have 100s of receivers but signals on input antennas are very small typically microvolts. Also there is feedback between receiver and transmitter similar to coupling between secondary and primary side of transformer (Lenz law).
...
Not exactly. When the hertzian wave quits the antenna, energy from the transmitter is radiated and becomes independant of the transmitter. The energy is carried by the electric and magnetic fields of the electromagnetic wave.
Then energy can be recovered from the EM field by receivers. The recovered energy can be no more than that radiated from the transmitter. Your are right when you say that receivers needs only an infinitesimal part of the radiated energy, so in practice we can put as many receivers as we need.
But there is no feedback. There is feedback only in the near field zone (i.e. at a distance of the order of the wave length). In the near field, transmitter and receiver act as generator and charge, connected to a primary repectively secundary of a transformer, and Lenz law applies like you said. Nevertheless this case is not the usual case in which radio transmitters are used.
At a distance of several wave lengths and beyond, the wave constitute an independant electromagnetic wave which is no more related to the source. The receivers can recover some pW to mW from these waves and the rest of energy is radiated in space or wasted in the resistance of bad conductors like the soil.
In any case, energy is conserved. The energy provided to the transmitter is radiated and available in the EM field, with the constraint that when receiver antennaes are near one another they cannot recover as much energy as if they were alone. The field in space near a receiver antenna is reduced due to the energy used by the receiver or wasted in its input resistance, and taken from the ambiant field (every one can verify it by placing 2 AM radios near one another with ferrite antennaes tuned to the same frequency). Thus we see that even from a theoretical viewpoint a huge number of receivers multiplied by the energy that each one gets, could never exceed the radiated energy.
Post by: exnihiloest on November 26, 2009, 11:48:28 AM
@exnihiloest:
Call the article pseudoscience if you like. Articles submitted for peer review are dismissed by the powers that be and are never published if it's not in there best interest.
...
Hi gravityblock
I agree with you. Generally we can trust the most part of articles in peer reviews.
I have not talked about "pseudo-science". This article is real science but it is far from having given proof of a discovery.
I just mean that in this particular case of magnetic monopole, which contradicts all that we knew, more evidence is needed (confirmation by other teams) and particularly because the confusion is possible between a monopole and one end of a long dipole. I discussed this subject on a usenet group with persons having a solid background in physics, and all were very doubtful for the same reason. Imho it is too early to conclude.
Post by: jan.kolar on November 26, 2009, 12:03:27 PM
jankolar:I translated my old document to english. Attached are also MATLAB scripts, C programs and files for simulation program PSPICE (i used old program for DOS dont know if old scripts are compatible with new windows versions). It is only mathematical game, didnt try it in reality. Problem in practical realisation is that when going to higher frequencies simple model of transformer as inductance (possibly with resistance and capacitance of winding) is no longer valid. To be correct we must use distributed model of circuit i.e. decompose all parts of real circuit into infinitesimal small parts. Each inifinitesimal part can be substituted by some wiring of RLC elements. The result for circuit as whole is acquired by integrating equations for such inifinitesimal small parts.
thank you for your input regarding current calculations please send me more details i am interest to know your experiment and calculation method
Post by: exnihiloest on November 26, 2009, 12:18:45 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permanent_magnet#Magnetic_materials
Ferromagnetic materials can be magnetized in the following ways:
Heating the object above its Curie temperature, allowing it to cool in a magnetic field and hammering it as it cools. This is the most effective method, and is similar to the industrial processes used to create permanent magnets.
...
Well I agree that "bullshits" was a bit excessive word, nevertheless we are not in the 19th century, not even in the 20th.
Industrial processes for modern materials (ferrites, NdFeB, alnico) doesn't heat the materials over the curie point. They proceed as I said, by placing them in strong fields.
You can even buy such magnetizer (at least for alnico and magnets not too strong).
Post by: forest on November 26, 2009, 02:38:37 PM
I feel , it must be connected to magnetic field, maybe it's 1/4 of the period of oscillations in LC resonant circuit when energy is completely stored with magnetic field ?
Can you point me to the articles explaining exactly what is happening in LC circuit at resonance ? And I mean where is the energy in each part of period of oscillation , not just equations.
Post by: gravityblock on November 26, 2009, 05:01:25 PM
Something similar to this thread maybe, http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=8354.0
The thread could be way off from what Ali is trying to do, just throwing out possibilities.
Post by: jan.kolar on November 26, 2009, 06:52:10 PM
Can you point me to the articles explaining exactly what is happening in LC circuit at resonance ? And I mean where is the energy in each part of period of oscillation , not just equations.In resonance circuit behave as pure resistive (mathematicaly this can be expressed as imaginary_part(impedance)=0) even when containing inductors and capacitors. So there isnt phase shift between current and voltage. Energy of magnetic field of inductor is cyclically transformed to energy of electric field of capacitor and vice versa. So energy source supplies only losses in circuit.
Post by: winsonali on November 26, 2009, 09:16:53 PM
hi welcome back
after completion of genie circuit we are replacing dimmer from genie input
as a replacement of dimmer i am developing a power supply to provide 40 volts in both polarities on the same line with very low duty cycle. during this process i have develop this new method for power transformation its a transformer where center pole is replaced with as vacuum tube. i am trying to use the properties of passive zone actively. once this section is completed we can make a self running unit.
Forest:
1/4 wave length means completion of one quadrant
magnets create a fields in vacuum but have no frequency so they act like a, living black hole, for there like materials and try to absorb them if you change there polarities quick enough it will create moving charges and if these charges provided proper gate they leave there active zone to passive zone
proper gate means a conductor equal to the wave length of frequency or 1/2 or 1/4, on each 1/4 wave length energy change its direction
at 1/4 wave length one end of conductor act as negative pole and 2nd end become positive pole and vice versa so every 1/4 time of the frequency a wave dissipate it self and enter in vacuum.
conventional transformers never complete this level so they receive a kick back BEMF.
Post by: wattsup on November 27, 2009, 03:51:42 PM
What about this tube?
http://www.purco.qc.ca/ftp/Solid%20State%20Components/Tubes/
Click on the the 6d4.pdf.
Post by: winsonali on November 27, 2009, 07:24:16 PM
wonderful i never knew about such things before
the concept here is almost as i am using with one difference that we are using coils around tube to catch EMF due to high frequency at the closest possible proximity.
you can develop your own Vacuum tubes use glass tube and seal the end using epoxy put a rubber valve in it and suck the air out.
my experiments are going well and just finishing the last bits and pcs how wonderful it could be if overunity.com can host videos as well.
Post by: wattsup on November 27, 2009, 08:06:49 PM
wattsup:
wonderful i never knew about such things before
the concept here is almost as i am using with one difference that we are using coils around tube to catch EMF due to high frequency at the closest possible proximity.
you can develop your own Vacuum tubes use glass tube and seal the end using epoxy put a rubber valve in it and suck the air out.
my experiments are going well and just finishing the last bits and pcs how wonderful it could be if overunity.com can host videos as well.
Yes I realize that is what you are doing. Why the hell not. With all that tube plasma activity, there is bound to be some potential to capture around it, in what form I do not know. lol, but as that coil will get loaded, it may then effect the tube function itself.
Post by: forest on November 27, 2009, 09:30:52 PM
http://web.archive.org/web/20061019065302/www.altenergy-pro.com/device07.htm
Post by: winsonali on November 27, 2009, 10:28:40 PM
yes concept is close enough but we are using proper wave length in passive mode.
Post by: winsonali on November 27, 2009, 11:12:24 PM
i have a factory where we are producing inverters the inverters that i have designed my self has extended time for battery life if a normal 200amp lead acid drop voltage from 13.8 to 8.8 in 4 hours my designed inverter give you six hours
why and how ?
i am using the factor of lose in transformer as valuable source means hysteresis curve causes loses we are using that as a benefit and switch the Mosfet's with a difference of time that recovers residual magnetic field.current loses are less and time automatically extended
like wise in this system i am completing wave length and here the component of hysteresis is not present if we think the same as mechanical analogy means this system has no reversing magnetic field in a motor so you get only forward drive.
some results i am sharing here for the purpose of analysis
In my inverter of 1 Kwatt if there is no load it draw 0.35amps at 12 volts where as the output is always stay at 220volts , other inverters consume 2.0 amps when there is no load
when we increase load, the secondary coil induce its own EMF in the core, to maintain the balance of power , the primary core starts consuming current Now if we develop some how a system where the change in secondary coil cannot effect the primary coil we will get a lose less system. this is only possible if we capture the EMF in its passive mode in a glass vacuum tube with maximum efficiency. this is my theory i have to proof it with practical
Mechanical analogy
in all motors you have reversing force called lenz force if some how you reduce or eliminate this reversing force means you got more efficient motor.
Bedini's and Joseph Newman's motors are working designs but they cannot sustain load both of them are working on BEMF
this is the problem of understanding BEMF is not energy create is the reversal of unused energy in coil. so they smartly used this energy to charge the other battery but there source energy is consumed, to get the work done they need to put more energy.
you can say the same applied to your system as well
no, i have extra energy
Why? and where?
when the energy cross the boundary of the active zone to passive zone all energy in the same frequency zone present in the air join the game just like in a LC tunning circuit and give you extra power in multiples of 1 to many format.
i wish this system should complete on as soon as possible and this knowledge may lead to many others to produce this energy device. i am putting all this on the forum by purpose (if something happens with me) so technology should not stop and continued by all means many other brains are working they can also get the idea may be they can put there input. and even they remember me in there prayers its enough for me.
the same pattern was in the mind of Tesla but he was looking for ionospheric energy.
Post by: forest on November 27, 2009, 11:48:57 PM
Now bear with me, I'm not EE - in Mhz range you have EM radiation all over the place from circuit which is wasted energy. Is that correct ?
Tesla said that he never used high frequency, because he wanted conserved electrical energy in LC circuit without EM wasted, yet his output always contained coil of low induction which generated at least hundreds of khz.
I see no other explanation except a few possibilities:
1. There is possibility to use multiply of 1/4 wavelength and also a divisions which means secondary can be short
2. Tesla found another method to put something on secondary to go into passive zone without having 1/4 wavelength , something like antenna which small in size yet electrically 1/4 wavelength was fulfilled.Is that possible ?
3. He was misleading us and really used high frequency at output to get to passive zone,yet in essential places in circuit he used low frequency (<30khz) to accumulate energy.
Seems that the energy put into passive zone by device is reflected back by ambient source at the same level of power. That's my comprehension of Tesla method though it may be completely wrong.
Post by: wattsup on November 28, 2009, 12:31:14 AM
I would say very high mhz but most probably in the ghz range.
@winsonali
I am still confused about this active and passive modes.
Can active and passive zones also be equated to Tesla's use of damped and undamped waves and his favor of damped waves that can become recycled, whereas undamped waves can only travel into total consumption zones or passive zones.
Now in one of your three Genie videos you show that input is about 160 watts and output is about 440 watts over those three light bulbs. So why not just light one bulb and send the rest back to the source and loop it? It seems to me that you already have the answer. Or is the Genie limited to certain non-inductive loads that can react to the output frequency of the device thus dissipating the output energy and not letting any of that output stifle the drive circuit.
I am curious if in your patent you are actually stating any reference to overunity? If so, do you think the Patent office will accept this as such?
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on November 28, 2009, 12:42:13 AM
forest...for not being an EE, you seem to have a broad base of knowledge.
Something occurred to me when you wondered is Tesla was purposely misleading.
I wonder if you just reversed his 'directions' wherever possible, would that be the key to truly understanding his patents ?
Regards...
Post by: forest on November 28, 2009, 01:13:36 AM
forest...for not being an EE, you seem to have a broad base of knowledge.
Something occurred to me when you wondered is Tesla was purposely misleading.
I wonder if you just reversed his 'directions' wherever possible, would that be the key to truly understanding his patents ?
Regards...
How so ? I don't understand you. Do you state that Tesla has spoken using some code and we should read it "in reverse" ? I don't think so.
Entering into passive zone means unidirectional transfer of energy - nothing is lost ,nothing is reflected back. Now, that require ambient background as a carrier. This is how I understand it and I feel it's not far from truth.
Imagine a swing and you on it.Then somebody is trying to stop swing and you have to work harder to sustain oscillations. This is active zone and lenz law and the person trying to stop swing is the load.Resonance is destroyed.
Now imagine that you have magic ball in hands.Whenever you are at the top position of swing you throw that ball away by using swing kinetic energy nothing more.Just before the peak, the 1/4 of period of oscillation.Resonance is not interrupted, ball is thrown away and accidentally you may even got a force back which strengthen amplitude of oscillations.
Ball is now in passive zone and can make work around. Look , because it is now unidirectional energy transfer. Of course that magic ball has to be recreated now. This is not overunity yet. This is 100% efficient system with unidirectional energy transfer.
That's why I said at start that pushing total energy of primary into secondary makes difference. Whenever you have unidirectional energy transfer you have efficient system and half-open gate to overunity systems.
Post by: forest on November 28, 2009, 01:23:49 AM
Post by: winsonali on November 28, 2009, 01:30:51 AM
Genie has an output just like an inverter where both wire show live currents means if you take a tester and check the source with ground you will find both the wires are active.but when you check the same thing at main source in you home you will get one live wire and one return on one live wire you will get both -ve and +ve due to this reason e cannot feed back genie during process of testing i with the help of a physicist and electronic engineer discover high current spikes in genie and now we have recovered that problem by adjusting switching timing this has changed a lot of results, Now all this effort i am putting in to developing a method or power supply which can work same as live wire and give you output then i can re loop the output and produce self running system.
Forest:
i am using 2.4 GHZ in ISM band with no return to ground
always remember if you get spark or flair in any electrical transmission it means it is high voltage not high current and this high voltage is unable to get the proper exit from conductor so it is coming out with pressure and huge lose. if its a proper gate means antenna of proper wave length it will convert into EM waves and it will not make an spark or plasma.
well i have to proof my concept with practical which i have achieved up to an extent
difference between active and passive zone is very big.
and example of passive zone.
one thing more if you have room with mirror from all sides and you lit the light bulb you will find a lot of brightness and increased luminescence does it means you have increased the power.
Now if the same room is painted black you will find a lot less brightness as well as low luminescence
another example when you go out in sun light at a normal temperature of lets say 30 degree centigrade it will not burn you for example on beaches you can find hot babes taking sun bath..
now if you take a small lens and focus the reflection of sun on a wood or paper it will burn.
its up to us how we observe things and can use them in our daily life.
Tesla has his vision and i have mine lets see . .. now i have to proof myself with practical by completing this system.
in my next post i will put the brochure of my inverter.
Post by: winsonali on November 28, 2009, 01:49:20 AM
Quote
means unidirectional transfer of energyno this is not uni-directional its omni directional.
i must say you have broad vision by putting the example of swing...
the amount of energy required to create a PM and the amount of force it will release in years is itself an example of a method where you initiate a process and it will last for long. we are trying to find that method to produce electric charges in the same manner.
now you discuss lens force, every body give definition of lens force but never give the reason
lens force is the force produce in opposite direction when a current flow occurs in a conductor.. this is observation not the reason if we find the reason we can control it
now i want you to explore the reason then i will give my analogy.
Post by: winsonali on November 28, 2009, 02:29:13 AM
watch this video and see how much power you can transfer through RF
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on November 28, 2009, 02:45:16 AM
" How so ? I don't understand you. Do you state that Tesla has spoken using some code and we should read it "in reverse" ? I don't think so. "
Not all in reverse, maybe just in one area or two.
" Entering into passive zone means unidirectional transfer of energy - nothing is lost ,nothing is reflected back. Now, that require ambient background as a carrier. This is how I understand it and I feel it's not far from truth. "
As you described in your swing analogy, which is very helpful with people at the entry level, forming a new ball is the key.
I just need a better understanding of component properties and interactions.
Thanks for taking the time.
Regards...
Post by: forest on November 29, 2009, 12:08:46 PM
I'm not EE and I don't understand Lenz law source but I have a felling that it is simple a manifestation of Newton third law. Action vs reaction. Always apply for interconnected things
Example : two magnets, pull one the second will react
Someone could see transformer as two magnets but here we have a problem - we still don't know exactly what electricity is.
But I like Don Smith interpretation that this is like EM wave - has two faces : electrical and magnetic, flip-flop , turn one and the other will jump out.
Then transformer could be : E-M: M-E two dipoles (M- magnetic, E-electric) in two wires. Connect load to E
of secondary ,which pull this second dipole and the magnetic part of it will rise (because as Smith says E and M are equal and opposite like in dipole), this magnetic part of secondary will now affect magnetic part of primary due to Lenz law (or Newton action vs reaction law).
This is rough idea, sorry if that is completely wrong but I like it.
Post by: gravityblock on November 29, 2009, 08:26:53 PM
In a generator, the opposition is against the Mechanical Energy. In a motor, the opposition is against the Electrical Energy.
Almost every generator and motor would run at or above unity if the two weren't coupled together.
Since the passive zone is not coupled to the active zone, then this should be a path to OU.
Action vs. Reaction applies to interconnected things as you mentioned Ali. If they're not coupled or interconnected, then the opposition force of lenz doesn't apply.
Post by: winsonali on November 29, 2009, 10:01:04 PM
there are three conditions
if you take magnet close to a iron piece it will attract regardless of polarity
if a magnet face opposite directions attraction occurs
, and similar direction repulsion occurs.
in a motor a coil winded on a core , the magnet attract core material and stop in front of it, to make a move we create electromagnet that can offer repulsion so the magnet go away from there, now more powerful electromagnet means more powerful powerful motor.
In a motor we require first enough force that can equate PM force then what ever force above that we generate will make a through in rotation.
so basically there is nothing esp the force required to overcome the force of attraction between core and PM is called lens force and this is the only element that have a tendency to stop a motor.
Now we can generate an air core motor that will run but can never be very powerful like Joseph Newman he has developed a motor with air core half part is receiver, half is dissipating power but when you apply load on them they will fail .
Bedini's motors are working motor why his system is failed?
when the magnet appears in front of the coil it generate a voltage peak sensed by the circuit and transistor switches on to make a EM so it can create a mechanical through, smart thinking ,
but he forget one thing the same peak is also induced in EM winding he has to put double EE to overcome the induced voltage peak. so its all failed nothing esp. less efficient
the only way the motor can be very efficient is double Electro magnets firing in proper sequence , and this how latest motors are designed. but they also consume 2 powers one for rotor and other for stator so its equal to bedini's motor
In squrill cage motors the cage itself become secondary winding of the transformer.
Now where science is at this moment its at its peak in these systems if you think out of the box then possibly you get new output.
in my next post i will define four ways of EE production.
we are not far away when we discover a method for EE just like a magnet
once you pass material through a process it become PM and retain its status for years same as we will process in such a way that once EE starts its production it will retain its process for years.
Post by: forest on November 29, 2009, 10:15:29 PM
http://www.tfcbooks.com/tesla/nt_on_ac.htm
if we could make thousand of such small oscillators we could make it eficient and self+sustaining
Post by: winsonali on November 29, 2009, 11:05:31 PM
these are very interesting things i never knew about this stuff
Post by: forest on November 30, 2009, 08:39:37 AM
forest:
these are very interesting things i never knew about this stuff
you can be shocked but I'm reading and reading Tesla article from 1919 year and it's become obvious that Tesla denied existence of Hertz waves as shown by Hertz experiments ! In fact if he was correct we are using his system not Hertz one, and using it not the way Tesla planned.
I'm very confused. Either there is possibility to use radio transmitters to produce Tesla-waves instead of EM waves or Tesla-waves are actually what is transmitted but all radio devices are intentionally spoiled to show only a small incoming energy part.
What can be SURE based on Tesla honesty - he proved that his oscillators produce "longitudinal oscillations akin to sound waves in ether" not EM "transverse oscillations of ether" - so not like light rather like conduction current through space !
Read it and you will be astounded : http://www.tfcbooks.com/tesla/1919-05-00.htm
Post by: forest on November 30, 2009, 08:48:31 AM
"I hope that I have been clear in this exposition – in bringing to your attention that what I show here is the system of the day, and is my system -- only the radio engineers use my apparatus to produce too much of this electromagnetic energy here, instead of concentrating all their attention on designing an apparatus which will impress a current upon the earth and not waste the power of the plant in an uneconomical process.
Counsel
You say radio engineers put too much energy into the radiating part. What, as a matter of fact, according to your conception, is the part of the energy that is received in the receivers in the present system?
Tesla
That has been investigated. Very valuable experiments have been made by Dr. Austin, who has measured the effects at a distance. He has evolved a formula in agreement with the Hertz wave theory, and the energy collected is an absolutely vanishing quantity. It is just enough to operate a very delicate receiver. If it were not for such devices as are now in use, the audion, for instance, nothing could be done. But with the audion, they magnify so that this infinitesimal energy they get is sufficient to operate the receiver. With my system, I can convey to a distant point millions of times the energy they transmit."
Ok,then we are using radio transmitters incorrectly.The only reason why we have a radio is the invention of vacuum tubes and then transistors for magnification of feeble signals. What a shame and waste of power !
Post by: onthecuttingedge2005 on November 30, 2009, 09:01:39 AM
I have never seen that phenomonom directly because I have never had access to a Super Electromagnet of that strength. I have heard that we can acheive up to 900T pulsed for less than a second but the device destroys itself in that brief moment like it was a box of dynomite. nobody at all is allowed to be in the room when they charge it up or they would die.
Post by: jan.kolar on November 30, 2009, 11:48:22 AM
I remember a lecture done on Tesla strength almost two decades ago, they said that at or above 13T some forms of matter began to act like liquids instead of solids. but 13T was the beginning of that magical tesla number.In magnetic resonance imaging field strength used is commonly 1 - 2 T. Negative effects on human body are not recognized but attention must be held to remove all iron things apart because in field of this enormous strenth they would be accelerated like bullet from rifle. Of course another situation is with alternating magnetic fields.
I have never seen that phenomonom directly because I have never had access to a Super Electromagnet of that strength. I have heard that we can acheive up to 900T pulsed for less than a second but the device destroys itself in that brief moment like it was a box of dynomite. nobody at all is allowed to be in the room when they charge it up or they would die.
Post by: onthecuttingedge2005 on November 30, 2009, 07:58:18 PM
In magnetic resonance imaging field strength used is commonly 1 - 2 T. Negative effects on human body are not recognized but attention must be held to remove all iron things apart because in field of this enormous strength they would be accelerated like bullet from rifle. Of course another situation is with alternating magnetic fields.
at 13T and above I think that unlike Iron even Pepto Bismal in the body would be a deadly interaction with such a field strength.
at around 100T it wouldn't matter because every element in your body would be influenced terminally. Paramagnetic, Diamagnetic, Ferromagnetic, ferrimagnetic, Anti-ferromagnetic, and so on would be highly effected.
Post by: winsonali on December 01, 2009, 01:53:15 AM
only thing left is power regulation
because their is only one coil that is the secondary coil is present in the system so it will get the maximum power now either i have to create different tappings or some other digital format like change in duty cycle to control output power
Post by: Nihilanth on December 01, 2009, 02:12:16 AM
Post by: winsonali on December 01, 2009, 03:13:03 AM
Instead of trying to quantify gravity in terms of discrete packets of energy (quanta) to make it comply with the standard model, Evans took the opposite approach, He succeeded in describing the standard model in terms of geometry. In the Evans Grand Unified Field Theory (now called Einstein Cartan Evans (ECE) Theory - MWE), particle exchange is not the fundamental unifying factor. Instead, for each force there is a specific curvature of spacetime or spacetime geometry. The resulting equations can be applied to any area of science and engineering. The impact on the computer, transportation, medical, power, and manufacturing industries will ultimately be as profound as the discovery of fire."
Post by: winsonali on December 01, 2009, 03:20:50 AM
When well connected scholars put forward something they receive awards
when we say something we are asked for proof practical demonstration....
at our own cost
Post by: winsonali on December 04, 2009, 01:12:44 AM
now a new problem to solve
Post by: FatBird on December 04, 2009, 02:03:43 AM
.
Post by: winsonali on December 04, 2009, 05:17:15 AM
thanks i will send you some scope shoots and related graph
but i figure it out as the current increases on load beam of wave reduces in size and moves to ward the center i think is due to magnetic field generation due to secondary coil
even then the power is good up to 700 watts may be this will define its limit
so for more power we need to add move tubes.
Post by: gravityblock on December 04, 2009, 07:20:02 AM
It's as if there are two streams of energy flow that separate when a magnet is present and re-combines when the magnet is removed. Where the energy streams enter and exit the tube, you can still see the two different streams separated. Anyone else see this?
GB
Post by: forest on December 04, 2009, 12:13:18 PM
Post by: winsonali on December 04, 2009, 07:32:19 PM
in my case the situation is inverse may be coz i am using high frequency modulation for the purpose of
flow of current from active mode to passive mode and then on particular time change the direction of flow by changing ground reference in other wards swap the ground and live so we get the change of direction
the new formula i have figure out is current I is directly proportional to frequency f(swap) where as the base frequency remains same.
just think you have high frequency all the time but you change its ground reference with 50 hz
so base frequency used for transfer of energy from active mode to passive mode remains same and its direction is changing only
analogy: means in other words you have magnetic field changing its direction all the time and according to Faraday's law rate of change of flux is directly proportional to voltage same effect is taking place but the main component is changed from voltage to current.
i am driving the new equation to satisfy this situation and i think a swamping frequency of 6 HZ is enough to produce require voltages when there is no load but when you increase the load you need to increase the swapping frequency to keep the same level of voltage
i believe leading in this experiment is the clue of how to convert active energy from dead energy of magnet.
Post by: winsonali on December 04, 2009, 08:06:16 PM
it requires to setup new directions for electric power generation.
we are getting very close.
Post by: forest on December 04, 2009, 08:12:38 PM
i think i Got the key why other MEG's didn't work although they have flux and its varying in magnitude but if its not generating any advantage of that flux is due to the invisible factor that is taking place
it requires to setup new directions for electric power generation.
we are getting very close.
is that flux which you modulate , oscillating like AC or unipolar like DC ? one polarity only or both ?
Post by: winsonali on December 04, 2009, 08:32:02 PM
very good question using signal processing technique i have generated AC frequency surmounted with on DC so it has its base in positive direction so we have both components in the signal and surely it goes to ground and when you are changing grounds means you are changing the flux direction.
this experiment have given me new light its wonderful and this has answered various question.
especially
what is mutual inductance
why since years permanent magnets used in transformers could not play a positive role.
why other MEG setups failed.
The key is every body use fixed frequency or change duty cycle to get the power output
but the formula is if you have fixed flux in your system you have to change the frequency to get the adjustment of loads.
i am happy happy.
Post by: forest on December 04, 2009, 08:54:41 PM
resistive load ? inductive load ?
what you have described remains me resonant circuit with load being a part of it.It's possible to make such circuit but extremely difficult to sustain resonance all the time because of changing characteristics of load.
Post by: winsonali on December 04, 2009, 09:03:14 PM
load could be anything resistive inductive capacitive what ever it does not make any difference on principal that i am talking about coz in raw form 6 hz cannot be used to match the standards this will be converted to 50 hz AC after all
Post by: FatBird on December 04, 2009, 09:39:56 PM
http://video.google.es/videoplay?docid=167210479374903373#
http://video.google.es/videoplay?docid=167210479374903373#docid=6398496868568110910
Thanks.
Post by: winsonali on December 04, 2009, 11:02:46 PM
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Hans_Coler_Magnetic_Power_Apparatus
please watch this video it will explain a little bit about Hans Coler device
i think the device in real but the technology is not provided in the market so far.
Post by: winsonali on December 05, 2009, 04:55:08 AM
i have quite new results with my experiments
Is there any body who can guide me about
1) where to present the technical paper for review of peer groups.
2) how to address the scientific societies about the new concepts
3) patents do cover products, working principles , do they register the scientific concepts and there related experimental results.
Post by: Nihilanth on December 05, 2009, 01:18:12 PM
All I know is that you might want to try to find a patent attorney. Try the yellow pages.
Post by: powercat on December 05, 2009, 01:38:17 PM
Getting a patent on a free energy device will never work, too many people will try and stop you,
a very dangerous road to go down.
Open source is the only way,if you open source you will become famous and save the world.
I was hoping that you were going to enter the OU.com competition ???
cat
Post by: winsonali on December 05, 2009, 01:52:08 PM
its not about patenting its all about public information and putting it upfront for use by many
i want to put this work to scientific society and the new law that i have develop due to these experiment. I am thankful to over unity forum members that supported me in this also i have figure out number of discrepancies in existing physics laws especially Ohm's law and unidimensional description of magneto mechanical force(lens law) , and magneto field effect on combined state of magneto electric arc , passive mode description and techniques of cross over between two states(active and passive) of operations and there differences , advantages and disadvantages
My claim will be the most power full work of ......... i have to proof it, i will show my self running unit shortly.
so if any one can guide me which scientific societies to be sent the details for review of my work. and where to present this new work so it can be registered at least in my name as well as public information not some big company information.
Post by: gravityblock on December 05, 2009, 02:35:20 PM
so if any one can guide me which scientific societies to be sent the details for review of my work. and where to present this new work so it can be registered at least in my name as well as public information not some big company information.
This would be a good place for your work to be peer reviewed. The scientific societies will have no choice but to acknowledge, accept, and publish your work after it is public knowledge and proven to work by others. Your work will be registered in your name for all to see, since the device can be named after you.
You need to be compensated for your hard work, time, and money invested in your experiments. I am sure people will freely donate to you after receiving such a wonderful gift and you will feel really good about yourself for helping so many people. Present it here by entering into the OU contest, at least consider it. From what I hear, there will be or has been a device submitted claiming OU. OU is being closed in on from all sides on this forum from what I see. It doesn't matter who's device we use, OU is OU. What does matter, is being able to learn from and improve on it.
The powers that be, control what is published in the peer review journals, so even if submitted......it doesn't stand a chance of being published. Just my thoughts on this.
GB
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 05, 2009, 04:25:50 PM
The very best way to secure ownership of concept is to have someone who is intelligent and trustworthy review your information and once they understand the concept, have them sign and date the information.
Then simply send it to yourself by registered mail, and keep it in a safe place unopened...there is your proof of concept.
Regards...
Post by: wattsup on December 05, 2009, 04:41:10 PM
Firs of all, I wish to confirm that just the way you talk, explain and discuss of such matters of OU, I knew you had something special and that you were really thinking out of the box as some others here are doing.
But, peer review what. Free energy. They will say it is not possible, that you are a crazy nut and to not bother them. Only when the mass has replicated, tried and tested will any possible other venues take any form of interest. The only other party that will have interest is those that will buy or freeze your patent to put it in Forgetsville. You are better off going to the public first and let the peer reviewers run after you when their time is right. Why should you waste energy trying to convince scientists with, dare I say industrially and politically closed minds, when the simplest is to let the people know and make the moves for you. In any case, once it is public domain, some students in most all University engineering classes will take it up so fast that all this work will be done for you and not by you.
Then, trying to keep the secret to then make and sell units is like trying to sell drugs to the maffffffia. Very unhealthy when you are a small single man fighting against all the outer forces.
The best advise for now is these;
1) Make a copy of your paper, put it in an envelope and mail it to yourself by registered mail. Then when you receive it, never open it. Keep it sealed should you require proof of first discovery. Make another copy and give it to a trusted lawyer (very hard to find these days - lol).
2) Don't try to patent a free energy device since it will not pass, and if it does, you will then require investors, business plan, you will be surrounded by greedy people, and eventually, they will block the company and put the device on hold. In any case trying to make money with such a device, since it will be the first one, you can rest assured that it will become obsolete within 2-3 months because others will have improved on it or taken the base theory and developed newer and better theories with devices to show for it, as it should be. You are better off giving the information freely and to become one of the "Fathers of the OU effort", then to become obsolete very quickly. This way you can provide your consultation services and help many many companies start to build and sell the device so that no one can then stop you.
3) If your main device is a complicated method that can only be made by a few, then send a copy of your paper to them or a copy of the device and ask them to build and/or test it.
4) If you can simplify the theory in a way that most all OUers can quickly understand with no misunderstandings so they can implement a simple build and testing by more people, then this is the best advice. Like OU must multiply the input for more output, you must do the same thing and provide the input to as many as possible and get as much as possible output from many people at the same time. This will protect you and make any effort of the bigger powers to stop it as pointless, useless, and actually counter productive to their public interests.
We can give you endless examples of very very smart inventors that made something very exceptional with worldy impact potential that just went after the secretive mode, investor mode, patent mode, to never be able to talk about their device again. Jack Hildenbrandt had an OU motor, he held the secrets, patented it, but now he is gone to the ever after because of a sickness and we have not heard from the patent status again. SM with his TPUs. Nice videos, he had investors and now he is forced to shut up for the rest of his life. Joseph Newman has a special motor/generator but will not give out the secret and has tried on his own for the last 3 decades and he continues blaming everyone else but himself. Tesla was the master of all such works and even he was quashed so many times by the money brokers.
The only way is the public way. The free way. The easy way. All it takes is that one special human being that can see beyond his immediate hunger or desire for wealth, to then reap the biggest rewards anyone on Earth can hope for and that is "a thankful and renewed world that will endlessly acknowledge him as the seed that changed the world". This in itself should be enough. Everything else, money, gratitude should be secondary on your importance list since this will come as it happens, when it happens and should money be the main focus of your true intentions, then you will simply fail like the rest. So do it while the doing is good.
Tonight, if I find OU in one of my devices, I will do as above and also publish it immediately here. At the same time I will make two or three copies of the device and send it to some trusted members for their confirmations. Once that is done there is no stopping it.
Best of luck.
wattsup
Post by: winsonali on December 05, 2009, 05:35:16 PM
you are 100% right
i will definitely invite some members of the forum to come and see the device by them self and then we will decide what to do i am not looking for investors at all i already have a factory involve in manufacturing of smart inverters so finances are not a problem the unit itself is a selling item so no need to put some one on your neck.
so i have taken your advice very seriously.
Post by: EMdevices on December 05, 2009, 06:12:01 PM
1) Try IEEE journals, they are peer reviewed
2) Address the societies by submitting a paper for the next symposium. (be prepared for tough questions)
3) Yes, it covers all that.
My advice, start with a paper and submit to a journal. If all goes well you can move on from there. I'm sure some people here can help provide feedback, the scientific community is very ridged, if you don't speak their lingo you won't get too far !
EM
P.S. oh, and whatever you do, don't mention FREE ENERGY, you'll be laughed right out the door !
So are you claiming free energy now? I glanced at a few of your posts and I don't see anything to answer this question, closing the loop should be easy if there is free energy there. If I were on a panel reviewing your invention, that's the first thing I would ask.
hi all,
i have quite new results with my experiments
Is there any body who can guide me about
1) where to present the technical paper for review of peer groups.
2) how to address the scientific societies about the new concepts
3) patents do cover products, working principles , do they register the scientific concepts and there related experimental results.
Post by: jan.kolar on December 05, 2009, 07:02:40 PM
Post by: lwh on December 05, 2009, 08:23:47 PM
1) where to present the technical paper for review of peer groups.
In the first instance, present your initial drafts of it here in public, or to a select few of the people here and in your private life whose opinion you respect. It may well be that they can help you make the document/s more presentable and understandable before you present them to other 'peer groups' who might be less forgiving.
2) how to address the scientific societies about the new concepts.
If you do as recommended in 1), and your claims are found to be valid, word will spread and members of, or people who are more familiar with, those 'scientific societies' will become aware of what you have. At this point you may find people who are willing to give you more precise information about, or even help you with, formally addressing such societies with your information.
But, at this point too, you may encounter the first signs of resistance from the 'establishment' in regards to your discoveries. Do not expect to be accepted, and do not waste precious time and peace of mind trying to be accepted. If you are, that's all well and good, but there are more important things for you to do. Don't be distracted by the politics of scientific discovery, just discover and share your discoveries with those who can appreciate them. If it turns out that's the scientific establishment, so be it, but don't expect that sort of recognition, not when dealing with the sort of discoveries you're making.
3) patents do cover products, working principles, do they register the scientific concepts and there related experimental results.
Even if they do (and I'm not sure they do), if you just want to get a patent so your concepts and results are formally recorded somewhere, there are much better alternatives than going through the patent process.
These are just my (considered) opinions, not statements of fact. If you don't find them helpful, just dismiss them.
Les.
Post by: FatBird on December 06, 2009, 12:28:55 AM
There are HUNDREDS of stories on the Net describing how they will SILENCE YOU. Unfortunately, the PTB (Powers That Be) will NOT allow anything to interfere with their TRILLION DOLLAR per year Petroleum Business.
Here is the last known message from SM, the inventor of the TPUs. His mistake was taking his TPU to the University of California for APPROVAL from the SCHOLARS and PROFESSORS in the PHYSICS and ELECTRONICS Dept. Read it and see what his reward was!!!!
SORRY for this BAD NEWS, BUT I am just trying to help you out sir. The worst thing you can do is to try and patent anything overunity.
Dear L- - - - - - ,
I have some very important things to tell you. First. My attorney left several messages for me over the last week. I finally called him on Friday and he informed me of the fact he needed to set up a meeting with me in his office in as soon as possible and that I needed to be prepared to meet with someone from the federal government.. I was shaken to the bone! He also told me that I was not to mention my future meeting to anyone including the following: Paul, anyone with UEC, anyone on the Internet including you, my family, the press, or anyone in the communication business, my elected representatives and etc. It sounded as though he was reading a list off to me. He said that, he was. I told him i was a little scared to show up. He said that he understood my fear but it would be in my best interest to get into his office Monday and he would do his best to protect me. I asked him what i needed to be protected from? He said he had to respond to the authorities about their concerns regarding my possible breaking of federal laws.
He said that the charges could be very serious against me and he needed to keep things from getting out of hand.
He told me that he convinced them (the federal authorities ) that I was not intentionally breaking any laws or going against their wishes in any way. He assured them that he would get me into his office for them to talk to and they would see for themselves that I am a nice little guy who would never knowingly break the law. So off i went this morning to my attorneys office in hopes of not getting arrested and placed into prison. I don't think I would like prison, L - - - - - -.
The first thing there I was taken into a room by my attorney and told what not to say to the Feds. Also, I was told what to do if I was arrested, etc. So I was fully scared to death!!! Next, I was taken into the meeting. Therein was my attorney and his secretary with note pad in hand. I was introduced to three gentleman in business suits. One was from the FBI, ( Federal Burrow of Investigation ), one was from the Atomic Energy Commission of the federal government and the other
was from the Federal Department of Justice, Washington DC. I now had to go to the bathroom at this moment of my life more then ever!!!
I sat down and listen to the man from the FBI remind me that I had been given a document from the federal government several years ago informing me of the fact that I no longer had control of my power technology because it had been deemed to be in the interests of the American people for it to remain in the control of federal authorities and that I was not to talk about it directly with other people, especially nationals of foreign countries without permission from the folks in
Washington DC. He also reminded me that to do so would be breaking the law and committing a federal offence, which is a big thing here in America. He went on to tell me that he was there in official capacity as an investigator from the FBI to see if i had indeed broken the law. Why had I broken the law? Because I had been discussing my technology with other people without the permission of the folks in Washington DC. I asked them how they knew that I had spoken to people about my technology and they told me that: First of all, it was not MY TECHNOLOGY. I had no rights concerning it at all. It is under the control of the federal government for the benefit of the people of the United States.
Second, The ownership of the technology is highly questionable.
Third, Do not play games with us Stephen, you know we know that you have been discussing the technology with anybody who will listen! They further accused me of deliberately posting information on the Internet. I said that I absolutely had not! The man from the FBI said that i had been collaborating with a foreign gentlemen in Australia to post information and therefor had been involved in a conspiracy to dispense information which is against the law for me to
do. Then he pulled out a rather large stack of papers which turned out to be copies of everything posted Internet wise about my technology for the last ten years or whatever. Then my attorney interjected and they got into a long discussion which I didn't listen to very much. I was looking at the man from the Atomic Energy Commission and noted he had a kind face. He smiled at me and we began to talk. He told me that he admired my work very much. He told me that he thought of me as a fellow scientist. He told me that as scientists we had an obligation to protect people from our findings or things we discover if they may be generally harmful to them or the public at large.
He told me that it was the duty of conscientious scientists to keep the black genies in the bottles so as not to harm society any more then necessary. He mentioned the Atomic bomb and how much better the world would be if it never had been invented, right? I said , right! He went on to discuss my technology in detail and reminded me of the destructive capability when the devices reach harmonic perfection. I told him that was a good analogy, or way of putting it. He told my that he didn't think I wanted to be responsible for giving out information making it possible and moreover inevitable that someone would make a big crater of a hole where their house used to stand with resulting death of themselves and possibly their families and neighbors too. He finally finished up with, And for God sake, with the terrorists hunting for weapons of mass destruction, why on earth would you want to hand them something like this to use to kill perhaps many millions of people? Do you think Moslems are not interested in this technology? They have a lot of oil so they would be interested in it for another reason wouldn't they Stephen? I agreed with him and told him I hadn't thought of it in that perspective before.
I told them all that I wasn't trying to do anything wrong at all. I didn't realize the implications of the possible results of talking to you about the technology. I told them that you were an engineer and interested in the scientific possibilities of the discovery only. The agent from the FBI said that I had no real way of knowing who you were and what you might actually be up to did I? I agreed with him. He said that they read everything going into and out of your computer wether or not anything is posted on that web site we guys like so much... He said that the Australian government was allied with the United States regarding this matter and that the Australian authorities would deal with you as need be. However, lets hope it does not become necessary shall we? Yes of course I said? I said, I never meant to get into trouble with this.
I told them I just felt bad because of all the nasty things people were saying about me and that i starting talking to you and you said that you would try and tell the straight story about me and the technology. I have a right to defend my self don't I? The answer was, NO! I am not entitled to defend myself. What i need to do is, to feel good about doing the right thing. I need to do what my government tells me is good for me to do. I need to develop pride in making the correct decision to keep quiet about technology that may hurt other people or even help terrorists to kill many, many others. I was told that With knowledge comes responsibility!!! I told them I never intended to do anything wrong. I was sorry. I asked them to please forgive me and not to put me in prison. They said they could prefer charges against me at any time but are
reluctant because of my well meaning attitude as displayed during the meeting.
They told me that It would be a good idea if I told you to post information saying that I had no intention of revealing anything about my experiments or how the demonstrations were accomplished to the extent that they convinced so many people of their authenticity. That the demonstrations were more for amusement then anything else and that I am making it very clear that I never intended to convince the public at large. People attempting to duplicate anything they have seen in my demonstrations will not be able to do so and should not try. I asked them if I had their permission to tell you about today and they said yes of course. So........... that is what happened to me today. How was your day L- - - - - -
Sincerely,
SM
Post by: winsonali on December 06, 2009, 01:41:18 AM
just i can say OMG
i am seriously thinking about every possibility
Post by: exxcomm0n on December 06, 2009, 06:31:31 AM
Most of the advice of the former posts is logically sound and a good place to start but they are forgetting a few things.
The cost of 100's of millions now to protect future multiple trillions is just simple good business practice. They (whomever "they" may be) will spend it to protect future earnings or 'national security'.
Do not underestimate the lengths they will go to protect their money.
1.) There is safety in numbers.
Don't just send just _1_ registered letter to yourself, send many to trusted associates (this part assumes you have reasonable faith in a significant group of people) as well and have them not open/deposit in a safety deposit box/include the plans in (open) source code software/hide the plans in a picture file on a published web site(s)/ establish a private torrent of the plans (to become public at a moment you choose to publish it)/ etc.
Not just _1_ working device.
Have as many people as you can trust build the device in as many countries as you can before you announce it and have them announce it at the same time.
It's easy for an established scientific community to hide _1_ device that proves modern accepted principles incorrect, but difficult to hide multiple devices that are in geographically diverse locations.
Again, do this not in just _1_ country, but in many.
The legal system in _1_ country may be corrupt to the point that even the safe guards you use could be circumvented, but if it is in many countries it is too widely spread to be hidden or stolen easily.
2.) Make the plans as simple and as low cost as you possibly can.
Leave it to the scientists to debate the possibility of your discovered concepts working.
Leave it to the "layman" (reasonably adept technician) to build it and see that it is truly more output than input.
He'll tell his buddy and help him build it too!
If he's at poverty level he has nothing to lose and everything to gain in providing for his family by building it for personal use.
A scholar can convince a student that a concept is impossible, it a LOT harder to convince someone USING a device they built that it doesn't work.
Just _1_ device that can do what you propose opens the minds of so many that they break the bonds of what they've learned is possible and start pushing the envelope in ways we haven't even imagined yet.
3.) Contact the Free Software Foundation about GPL licensing.
They are the only group I know of that is interested in the complete dissemination of knowledge for the public good and the proper accreditation of those that discover that knowledge.
4.) Have as much in place and ready for announcement to the public as possible in place.
As much as you may try, this may leak out before you're absolutely ready giving a large corporation a chance to steal it/patent it/ destroy it, but if it's all over the world by the time they say they own it, it is hard to believe any claim they might make.
5.) Send a device to Stefan AND the Nobel Peace Prize committee (http://nobelpeaceprize.org)
Don't worry about how you can profit now, worry how you can profit later when the concept is "free" and YOU, the originator of the device can build a company to make a better one.
I don't mean to scare you, I mean for you to be the best prepared to give a gift to the world and enjoy what it will make possible.
Post by: Nihilanth on December 06, 2009, 08:58:35 AM
I have a right to defend my self don't I? The answer was, NO! I am not entitled to defend myself. What i need to do is, to feel good about doing the right thing.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaa9iw85tW8#t=4m22s
You have the right to do whatever the hell you want to do & everyone has the right to retaliate. Nothing, human or otherwise can change that.
I need to do what my government tells me is good for me to do. I need to develop pride in making the correct decision to keep quiet about technology that may hurt other people or even help terrorists to kill many, many others. I was told that with knowledge comes responsibility!!!No, you don't NEED to do what anyone says you have do do. No matter what they may be called, or how ever many people are in it, no group has the power to make you do things unless you agree to it. By the sound of it their only real means of controlling you is through fear, so thats all the more reason NOT to listen to them. THEY are the terrorists.
Any technology that MAY hurt other people MAY ALSO save thousands of lives and improve the world we live in a thousand fold! With knowledge does come responsibility, but when you share that knowledge with others it becomes their responsibility as well & no one is responsible for anyone elses actions. We are all responsible for our own. Think of all the things that might not exist today if Alternating Current did not exist. Now think of how few of those things are used to harm, and how many are used to make your life better. The more advances made in technology, the fewer uses are for violence.
The more widely available the information is & the more people know how to replicate a free energy device, the less an individual can be threatened. If it truely works, and the more easily it can be made, the more it will spread. If everyone knows it, the origional inventor can't be silenced by big brother/business, because there isn't anything left to silence.
Post by: aaron5120 on December 06, 2009, 01:01:09 PM
The inventor deserves his name to be remembered, and the effect being discovered deserves to be named after the inventor himself.
This community (Free Energy Forum) is destined to host this kind of events and also we are here to provide all kind of support( be it economical, social, technical,etc) to someone who indeed has something useful to share with all the humanity. 2012 is near, we do not have much time to prepare ourselves for the worst to come. Let us hurry up.
I am all ears, Winsonali, if I can be of any help to you.
Post by: forest on December 06, 2009, 01:48:27 PM
Post by: jan.kolar on December 06, 2009, 03:02:25 PM
1) I reviewed all compilations about TPU device - no equations that describe this device!!! It reminds me Tom Bearden theories. Few years ago I got free book from him. Very thick book but man rarely could find some equation if any for his new "super theory". How is it possible? Because its all bullshit. Engineers must comprehend language of mathematics - without it they could not design such amazing things like computers or cars or bridges and so on. Mathematics is language of science. How do you want to construct electric generator if you dont know output power, current, voltage? Without it you cant calculate overvoltage protection, overcurrent protection, correct cooling, diameter of wires, parameters of RLC elements, size of final unit and so on.
2) Do you think that oil will be forever with us? Do you not see oil prices rising in last years? I dont think so and oil companies know this even better. The earlier we find replacement for fossil fuels the best for world. What would be reason for concealing this technology? Oil companies can make money on this like they made money from extracting oil for last 150 years.
Post by: winsonali on December 06, 2009, 07:30:42 PM
the development process of all inventions is as follows
NEED the mother of invention
first observation
then imagination
then valuation experimentation involvement of mathematics
rules formation
need full filled, job accomplishment
father of invention scientist
i will not rule out fatbird observation but now a different situation
jon kolar is right, alternative energy source is required and it is their need too so now they will occupy you or your technology coz they like to remain in their status,once if we go in their hands the common man will not be able to get benefit,he has to pay what he is paying now, our goal is to benefit common man , every man , and for every body.
regarding other inventions.
SM' TPU machine is seemingly unthoughtful and setup is hard to be fake production.
here is a bit clue of his machines operations i am not sure but this patent document match perfectly.
INKOMP from Bulgaria is also progressing and a lot many people working but not showing there work soon it will open and you will get
another source of energy.i am one of those people working and have achieved some level yet to prove myself. In my work a proper mathematics and calculations are involved.
Post by: mtec on December 08, 2009, 06:39:20 AM
Post by: mtec on December 08, 2009, 07:35:53 AM
PEACE1
Post by: aaron5120 on December 08, 2009, 10:27:42 AM
According to a guy named "TheGuru2You", if the Meissner circuit is connected to the control coils of Flynn 's circuit, the apparatus will create flipping flux in the both sides, thus generating HF AC (600VAC, 0.1A several hundred KHz approx.)in the lateral coils alternatively.
The guy said the device is supposed to generate power by the flux from the 2 permanent magnets, using a small quantity of power (12VDC 0.2A) for the switching. No video of the prototype provided.
The Flynn principle is well known already. I wonder if Winsonali is aware of this kind of arrangement for power generation.
Post by: itanimuLLi on December 08, 2009, 09:39:28 PM
Post by: winsonali on December 09, 2009, 12:14:54 AM
i have selected the course of action as per advice and its going to benefit for all and i just finishing the software for output regulation its very difficult to deal with fixed gauss system as you need to vary frequency with output rise and fall to accommodate and produce linear voltage and meet proper current requirement.
Post by: pcjunkie on December 09, 2009, 04:34:22 PM
Post by: plengo on December 10, 2009, 12:07:02 AM
i am in the middle of packing up the device properly and will post the video very shortly.
i have selected the course of action as per advice and its going to benefit for all and i just finishing the software for output regulation its very difficult to deal with fixed gauss system as you need to vary frequency with output rise and fall to accommodate and produce linear voltage and meet proper current requirement.
THANK YOU winsonali!!!
I will be one of the first to promptly help you financially to my potential (even though that may not be much but something of substance at least for my budget), once your project is publicly exposed and replications starts.
It is from people like your kind (a great kind) that humans progress in life! You are already being honored just by this simple act of selflessness of yours.
THANK YOU.
Fausto.
Post by: gotoluc on December 10, 2009, 05:55:15 AM
Luc
Post by: kalakaflaca on December 10, 2009, 06:32:14 AM
My first post just to congratulate Ali for so great work!!..Ali you are just to become the man of the century like Newton, Copernicus, etc for so progressive ideas to benefit the human race..since you are humble and not asking money nor personal benefit your rewards will be great and your heart will be full of joy all days of your life.
what a historic moment..a new light for this world is at hand!
God bless you man!!
Post by: winsonali on December 10, 2009, 05:08:42 PM
welcome to this forum i hope i fulfill the need to the commons up to my best level.
probably next week the unit will be ready for demonstrations.
Post by: FatBird on December 11, 2009, 01:57:09 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXIWAipEvjQ&feature=related
http://plugandsave.com/exclusive-area.html
.
Post by: winsonali on December 11, 2009, 04:12:59 AM
this video explain the above video in a better way with digital meter
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMZjWkbF9bQ&feature=related
Post by: ramset on December 11, 2009, 05:00:05 AM
This world needs a few changes,And definitely more people like you!!
Thanks
Chet
Post by: winsonali on December 13, 2009, 10:35:42 PM
Now coming to the technical part of the post the essence of the post is
1) DC cannot demagnetize core very easily.
2) DC when come across with closed loops it retain the field for more time then in open loop.
3) either of loops input or output both make same effect on core.
it is very helpful for other people reading these posts.
when i jump in this post i put forward the same thing that until and unless the power generation unit is reversing its polarities you cannot produce electricity.
in making my genie working i have not used any coils or transformers.
the sine wave we are using is not by choice, is by early designs there is no harmful effect on electrical devices operating under square wave reversing alternative current, if they are operating through DC i mean almost 90% device use DC conversion to operate for example computers televisions etc etc. even DC motors.
now if you see the picture i am putting you will under stand what is effective area under curve is same as effective area under square wave.
i have developed inverter based on this switching techniques and i have 2 hours extra backup in my system at 1000 VA.
i have gone through with various patents involving PM in transformers and try to understand why and where they have conceptual differences.
flynn charles MEG will not work as a generator but works as a parallel path magnet field.
i will be posting my next video early next week, video for the self running unit.
Post by: winsonali on December 13, 2009, 10:39:00 PM
Post by: gotoluc on December 14, 2009, 12:24:55 AM
thanks for sharing this technique :)
Would one not use a ferrite core transformer considering the frequency is basically 42KHz?
The only difference I see is pauses between and polarity shifts.
Good idea ;)
Luc
Post by: winsonali on December 14, 2009, 01:01:11 AM
the ferrite core works on the principles as per faraday laws
v = N d B/dt
means voltage is directly proportional to rate of change of flux 42 KHz means in other words/ mechanical analogy
a generator working on 2520000 RPM
now in this case the benefit is you need less number of turns , higher current, less spikes low value of capacitor to provide dc conversion notch filing gaps of wave form. The ferrite core can lose its value of B very quickly or its BH curve is very steep and vertical. so you cannot get the fly wheel effect
for example mechanical analogy
if you use a 250 gram wheel on a motor top you will get low momentum but if you use 2 kg wheel you will get high momentum and that will store more kinetic energy then light weight one.
some times it is desired to use light weight wheel and some times it is required to use heavy weight wheel it depends on requirement.
now 99% percent books will say that the CRGO( cold roll grain oriented ) core is not siutable for high frequency such as 20KHz they are siutable for 50 hz to 100 hz or some times 400HZ thats all
here this is misunderstanding and this is the biggest advantage when they refer 50 to 400 hZ means core cannot return to neutral position faster then this frequency so any attempt to get it back or reversing the polarity faster then the prescribed values will heat the core and do nothing but loses.
Now understand what we are doing we switch the magnetic field in one direction and then with in mill seconds turn it off, the flux retains there the output will get the same effect but you have turned off your supply now before the core starts going back you pushed it again so you are getting the fly wheel effect but the out put is same and with each and every switching you will get BEMF going into battery again.
in ferrite core you do switch the frequency in reverse direction every time or if you have single direction switching you tend to reverse the magnetic flux to min during off period so you didn't get any advantage.
SMPS were designed to reduce the size of supply and they are complex circuits and serving there purpose very well otherwise you can imagine a computer power supply can be bigger then the computer itself. due to high current requirement.
the above technique will increase the time of your inverter twice and very use full for solar panel or windmills.
if you need one unit i can send you the normal weight of a UPS for a 1000VA is 12KG.
the technique of BEMF collection involve smart switching and turns off the main supply during BEMF collection.
Post by: winsonali on December 14, 2009, 01:26:20 AM
one thing just imagine if you remove the counter weight from a piston in petrol engine what will be the effect on engine performance
equivalence in electronics
collection of BEMF in capacitor or battery.
remember bemf is not a energy generation, its reversal of unused energy during switching cycle.
Just think if you remove fly wheel from the engine gear box what will be the effect. Fly wheel provide smooth power during the gear shifting period and works as smoothing effect between power loading and unloading on engine
equivalence in electronics
use of high storage capacitors in supply's initial phase guarantees the smooth power output during transition period of switching cycles.
Post by: allcanadian on December 14, 2009, 03:46:11 AM
What Ali has demonstrated is perfectly correct, in fact all modern boost converters use this very process to increase efficiency. The inductance is switched faster than the natural resonant frequency of the core material, in this way the current on the output "appears" continuous because the current never stops completely. In this case the source charges the inductance for one portion of the cycle and the inductance acts as a source in itself in the next portion of the cycle. If the magnetic field is allowed to collapse completely then the inductive circuit is referred to as a flyback converter if the magnetic field is not allowed to collapse completely then it is referred to as a boost converter.
Regards
AC
Post by: gotoluc on December 14, 2009, 03:55:19 AM
thanks for taking the time to post all this information.
Here is an interesting effect I just found a few hours ago while studying generator coil effects and possible solution to prevent Lenz Law in generator coils.
I have tested the coils in this flipped arrangement on a motor turning a magnet wheel and they produce just as good of output if not better then in normal mode but with next to no Lenz Law effect.
Link to video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTykNjDD0CM
Let me know what you think.
Luc
Post by: MileHigh on December 14, 2009, 05:05:29 AM
I looked at your clip. When you flip one of the coils around then the two coils cancel each other out. That is why you are feeling hardly any force when you move the magnet by the pair of coils.
There is no point in building a generator like this.
MileHigh
Post by: gotoluc on December 14, 2009, 05:27:33 AM
Luc,
I looked at your clip. When you flip one of the coils around then the two coils cancel each other out. That is why you are feeling hardly any force when you move the magnet by the pair of coils.
There is no point in building a generator like this.
MileHigh
Hi MileHigh,
I thought this could be the case, so after I found this effect I tested the coil on a motor that is turning a 10" Lexan disk to about 1,500 RPM which has 8 of 1" X 1/8" N42 Neo's counter sunk and epoxied in a north south alternating pattern.
First I connected one coil to a 1 Ohm load and 60uf motor cap and approached the coil to pickup the best voltage on the load which was 1.30vac. I then added the coil to get no Lenz effect and retested using the same load and got it to 1.20vac with the coil at about the same position. I'm doing this by hand so at this time I don't have accurate results but it looks very promising to me.
The video below demonstrates a prior test (not the same as I just described) but should give you an idea of how I tested it. Just keep in mind that I used a 1 Ohm and not a 10 Ohm like in this video.
Link to Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebybImidcFY
I hope you can find the time to replicate and help spread the news.
Luc
Post by: winsonali on December 14, 2009, 08:26:51 AM
VERY GOOD VIDEOS
Mile high is right the effects are canceling each other in first clip so you are not getting any magnetric feild.
the next video you are making just insert metal in side the core so that it is not coming out of copper wire you will get high voltage very good current and at the same time the shielding effect will prevent lenz force a lot.
i have done this test recently but i was using 2 dics and 5 magnets on each side and then the coil in between
i was getting 56 volts and i used simple roof hanging fan motor and i was continuously switching t on and off there was not at all any effect on the speed with or without load there is a key in my setup i have shield the south pole in north pole and even you move the disc by hand they keep on moving like a flywheel and produce output till it stops and never exerted any braking force i am posting the pictures it might help you. I didn't continue this setup as i was working on Motionless electric generator so i keep this project for my next task to built a self running fan which can provide air as well as light a energy saver for free. this product is best for villages where there is no electricity at all
Post by: FatChance!!! on December 14, 2009, 08:55:58 AM
Hi MileHigh,
I thought this could be the case.
First I connected one coil to a 1 Ohm load and 60uf motor cap and approached the coil to pickup the best voltage on the load which was 1.30vac. I then added the coil to get no Lenz effect and retested using the same load and got it to 1.20vac with the coil at about the same position. I'm doing this by hand so at this time I don't have accurate results but it looks very promising to me.
There's nothing remarkable by this.
The reason for the coils not completely canceling each other is due to them not having the same flux cutting through the wires.
One coil is further away from the magnet and isn't getting less current induced than the closest one.
You might have found some anomaly here, but I'd bet the reason is more likely you missing out on some important issue
regarding coils and magnetic induction "know how". The lesser Lenz is interesting though.....
I wish you the best and will continue to read this thread with great interest.
Post by: aaron5120 on December 14, 2009, 09:01:55 AM
gotolucWinsonali,
the ferrite core works on the principles as per faraday laws
v = N d B/dt
means voltage is directly proportional to rate of change of flux 42 KHz means in other words/ mechanical analogy
a generator working on 2520000 RPM
now in this case the benefit is you need less number of turns , higher current, less spikes low value of capacitor to provide dc conversion notch filing gaps of wave form. The ferrite core can lose its value of B very quickly or its BH curve is very steep and vertical. so you cannot get the fly wheel effect
for example mechanical analogy
if you use a 250 gram wheel on a motor top you will get low momentum but if you use 2 kg wheel you will get high momentum and that will store more kinetic energy then light weight one.
some times it is desired to use light weight wheel and some times it is required to use heavy weight wheel it depends on requirement.
now 99% percent books will say that the CRGO( cold roll grain oriented ) core is not siutable for high frequency such as 20KHz they are siutable for 50 hz to 100 hz or some times 400HZ thats all
here this is misunderstanding and this is the biggest advantage when they refer 50 to 400 hZ means core cannot return to neutral position faster then this frequency so any attempt to get it back or reversing the polarity faster then the prescribed values will heat the core and do nothing but loses.
Now understand what we are doing we switch the magnetic field in one direction and then with in mill seconds turn it off, the flux retains there the output will get the same effect but you have turned off your supply now before the core starts going back you pushed it again so you are getting the fly wheel effect but the out put is same and with each and every switching you will get BEMF going into battery again.
in ferrite core you do switch the frequency in reverse direction every time or if you have single direction switching you tend to reverse the magnetic flux to min during off period so you didn't get any advantage.
SMPS were designed to reduce the size of supply and they are complex circuits and serving there purpose very well otherwise you can imagine a computer power supply can be bigger then the computer itself. due to high current requirement.
the above technique will increase the time of your inverter twice and very use full for solar panel or windmills.
if you need one unit i can send you the normal weight of a UPS for a 1000VA is 12KG.
the technique of BEMF collection involve smart switching and turns off the main supply during BEMF collection.
I understand perfectly your analogy about the advantage of using the B-H characteristics of the cores for your own benefit in power switching systems. The area within the B-H curve is the hyterisis loss for signal processing, and in audio aplification, the more symmetric, and the more narrow the area, the better for reducing THD and distrotion losses. But in our case, we are dealing with power generation and convertion, so now the area of the hyterisis and its horizontality is advantagous for Winsonali.
When we are switching power over 20KHz, choosing expensive audio amp. transformer cores for Ali's design is not a good option, due to the core's B-H characteristics. The conventional Silicon Steel laminates will do, because of the B-H hyterisis area and its curve inclination.
The J. Flynn parallel path principal I think, if choosing the right core material, and the right switching frequency, and using BEMP recovery technics, would be a nice conventional generator, though it is not a No Lenz one.
Post by: aaron5120 on December 14, 2009, 09:28:11 AM
GOTOLUC:I think shielding one of the poles of the magnet will probably reduce the flux density lines by half. The magnets seems to be of Audio speakers origin. And they are shielded by MuMetal covers.
VERY GOOD VIDEOS
Mile high is right the effects are canceling each other in first clip so you are not getting any magnetric feild.
the next video you are making just insert metal in side the core so that it is not coming out of copper wire you will get high voltage very good current and at the same time the shielding effect will prevent lenz force a lot.
i have done this test recently but i was using 2 dics and 5 magnets on each side and then the coil in between
i was getting 56 volts and i used simple roof hanging fan motor and i was continuously switching t on and off there was not at all any effect on the speed with or without load there is a key in my setup i have shield the south pole in north pole and even you move the disc by hand they keep on moving like a flywheel and produce output till it stops and never exerted any braking force i am posting the pictures it might help you. I didn't continue this setup as i was working on Motionless electric generator so i keep this project for my next task to built a self running fan which can provide air as well as light a energy saver for free. this product is best for villages where there is no electricity at all
Some hard numbers must be gethered to figure out whether this configuration will be efficient for power genration. Maybe in the case of a conventional generator setup, a weakened Lenz response will also reduce the output of the generator, despite there is no visible drag for the rotor.
Post by: winsonali on December 14, 2009, 10:42:32 AM
the magnetic shield is not the conventional one ,i have greatly increased the magnetic lines by covering south pole inside the north pole.
Post by: winsonali on December 14, 2009, 10:56:25 AM
here is the wave shape this is the method where non of the magnetic field are crossing each other and producing lens force free electric power even with fly wheel effect
non of the magnetic crossing in there motion no braking force just electric power generation.
the only problem is this is not conventional power it comes with spikes so we need to do more work.......
Post by: Kator01 on December 14, 2009, 12:26:46 PM
figure 4 I think is relevant in teh shieling you did - I guess:
http://www.leevalley.com/shopping/Instructions.aspx?p=54198 (http://www.leevalley.com/shopping/Instructions.aspx?p=54198)
Regards
Mike
Post by: hartiberlin on December 14, 2009, 05:12:51 PM
Wow Ali,Hi Luc and Ali,
thanks for taking the time to post all this information.
Here is an interesting effect I just found a few hours ago while studying generator coil effects and possible solution to prevent Lenz Law in generator coils.
I have tested the coils in this flipped arrangement on a motor turning a magnet wheel and they produce just as good of output if not better then in normal mode but with next to no Lenz Law effect.
Link to video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTykNjDD0CM
Let me know what you think.
Luc
I see Luc has the same waveform as Ali
on his scope, when he just uses the side of his coils.
That is the right waveform but as the second coil
gets later the induction, it will probably not cancel Lenz´s law.
One trick to cancel a lot the Lenz law is to
short out on/off the coils very fast, when the magnet passes
by. ( at least 20 Hz shortout/open circuit rate, could be done with a buzzer relay
using a selfrunning relay( like doorbell relay ringer circuit) with using the
additional relay switches)
This generates very high BackEMF spikes and these can be collected
via graetz bridge rectifier and cap.
When the coil is shorted out the Lenz drag is fully there and will
drive a current through the coil, but as soon as the coil
is opened it will generated a high voltage spike due to the stored
energy inside the coil and this could be captured.
And as the magnet ismoving on during this moment it
will make the induction voltage even higher and thus
the extracted spike energy gets bigger, but it will have no
drag during this moment.
So all in all you could reduce at least the Lenz drag by half and
have additionally a huge BackEMF collected spike energy output
rectified in the cap as DC voltage energy.
ALso you MUST use mechanical switches for
the best effect to take place.
Electronic switching is not good for it and it depends
on the contact materials used, what spike energy you can
get.
Best is to use graphite-copper for the contact material points.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: winsonali on December 14, 2009, 05:40:14 PM
you reach to the core of the solution
Quote
i was continuously switching t on and off there was not at all any effect on the speed with or without load there is a key in my setup i have shield the south pole in north pole and even you move the disc by hand they keep on moving like a flywheel and produce output till it stops and never exerted any braking force i am posting the pictures it might help you.
here i have done the switching very fast to get the proper cancellation of any lens force as well as braking effect
i used 10 coils in my setup very good output one coil in middle of magnets and one facing magnets. the collective output is converted to DC and then it is available uninterrupted
10 coils non moving mean no lose over slip ring or carbon brush
10 coils 5 magnets mean very high integration of phase cutting in other words
lets say 1500 RPM speed this is very easily achievable.
10 coils * 5 magnets * 3 ( 3 phases on each magnets NS - SN - NS )
this means actual RPM ( rate of change of flux) is 1500 * 10 * 5 * 3 = 225000 / 2 RPM
in simple words 5 magnets have three phases crossing 10 coils in one round well you can assume the rate of change of flux and resulting effect on voltage and power.
Post by: hartiberlin on December 14, 2009, 05:45:56 PM
many thanks for your latest pics and explanations.
to clarify:
Is the picture:
about your Genie or your coil-loudspeaker-magnet setup ?
P.S. Joe Newman is also using this principle.
He is opening the coil several times per revolution and collects the BackEMF
into a cap or into fluorescent tubes..
Post by: winsonali on December 14, 2009, 05:51:32 PM
to get more power through this setup just use a cycle wheel put as many magnets as possible double the numbers of coils may be in a bicycle wheel you can easily fit 24 magnets and like wise 48 coils now assume what power you can get.
remember me in your prayers and enjoy ;)
if you need electronic controller for this setup just ask me i will send you details
Post by: gotoluc on December 14, 2009, 05:54:19 PM
Coil with no load:
http://i944.photobucket.com/albums/ad290/gotoluc/GeneratorCoiltest1a.png
same Coil with 10 Ohm load:
http://i944.photobucket.com/albums/ad290/gotoluc/GeneratorCoiltest1b.png
Post by: winsonali on December 14, 2009, 06:00:34 PM
you are going in the right direction
i have just posted the setup for 24 magnets and 48 coils
let me finish my genie self running then i have a lot to show you guys
1) Energy saving electronics IRON with 84 watts only you can get heat equal to 1000 watt power.
2) resonating water heater no gas needed turn the tap on and get hot water min lose of energy
Post by: aaron5120 on December 14, 2009, 06:05:26 PM
for allWinsonali,
to get more power through this setup just use a cycle wheel put as many magnets as possible double the numbers of coils may be in a bicycle wheel you can easily fit 24 magnets and like wise 48 coils now assume what power you can get.
remember me in your prayers and enjoy ;)
if you need electronic controller for this setup just ask me i will send you details
Your magnet shielding seems to be genial to me. Why I did not think the option out before!
I habe been trying to shield one of the poles of magnets, but they always get weaker fluxes. Now I will try to build a 5 magnet-10 coils setup and get the figures.
Will you be so kind to provide me details of the electronic controller for this setup? Many thanks and keep on your excellent work. You have a brilliant mind!
Post by: gotoluc on December 14, 2009, 06:12:27 PM
thank you for your encouragement, help and most of all sharing this knowledge.
Soon the less fortunate of the world will smile ;D as there is hope!
I will do this till my last berth or the energy control is over.
Luc
Post by: hartiberlin on December 14, 2009, 06:46:07 PM
same Coil with 10 Ohm load:
http://i944.photobucket.com/albums/ad290/gotoluc/GeneratorCoiltest1b.png
But this one was also with a cap in parallel, right ?
This makes not much sense,
just use a buzzer relay or a mechanical on off-switch wheel
to shortout/opencircuit the coils
and use a graetz bridge across the coil with a cap to collect the energy from the
BackEMF. This will get you the most output and the least
Lenz law drag.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: gotoluc on December 14, 2009, 07:15:43 PM
But this one was also with a cap in parallel, right ?
Regards, Stefan.
Yes Stefan, that scope shot the cap is in parallel and also with the 10 Ohm load.
Luc
Post by: hartiberlin on December 14, 2009, 07:51:26 PM
Yes Stefan, that scope shot the cap is in parallel and also with the 10 Ohm load.
Luc
So you just made an LCR parallel tank circuit, that is dependent on the resonance frequency
of the LC components and thus only efficient at the exact resonance frequency, that your
rotor would have to match...
So better use the BackEMF chopping technique I exlained in my previous posting.
This will also greatly reduce any I^2R losses in the coil´s windings, if you
switch below 1/5th of tau= LxR of the coil.
Many thanks.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: winsonali on December 15, 2009, 05:36:55 AM
i will send you the details of the electronic circuit as well as the micro-controller
i wish best of luck for you
where ever you need my help jut email me.
Post by: FatBird on December 17, 2009, 07:26:40 PM
If you are actually able to patent your device, at a cost of several thousand dollars, and it is indeed free energy, you will never get it to market because the powers that be will step in and take it in the name of "national security" which is in actuality the security of the big oil companies, or you will discover that some major company has a patent just like yours which just happens to have cleared the patent office days before yours did, so now yours cannot be patented. This applies no mater WHAT country you live in because every country needs oil.
Your surest course to make money is to release your information here, have it verified and duplicated by others around the world so it can never be lost or patended out from under you. Then sell your plans or kits on the internet and list the people here who have verified that it is a working viable unit. The "Water-for-Gas" guy has made over a million with a crappy product in exactly this manner. If you ask the people on this forum I am sure they would tell you that they are willing to pay for something that is proven to work Many people who could build it themselves would STILL pay for a kit or instructions because it would be simpler than taking the time to buy all the parts and assemble it.
I am really tired of people who come to these forums with a purpose other than to disclose exactly what they have so that others can test or duplicate their results and further the cause of energy research. Why would they say they have something and not disclose exactly what it is and how it works? Why not just keep their mouth shut? Would they post videos of themselves eating a huge meal so that the people out there who have no food can watch and suffer? Are they so desperate for attention that they come here so others will beg them for little scraps of information? To all of you who would do this, I say share, or shut up and go away. Either tell us exactly how to do this step by step so even a beginner can duplicate it, or hold your silence. My mother always told me that unless I had enough of something to share with everybody it was impolite to eat it in front of them. Some of you should have had a mother like mine. The world needs this kind of information, people are dying for lack of it. If money is the only issue, it should not be one because I have shown you exactly how to make money with an idea like this, and if you have a conscious, you will do the right thing. Don't say you have given us all the pieces and all we have to do is put it together. Put it together for us. You will not only make millions, you will make history and your name will always be remembered. What more could you ask for?
EXCELLENT ADVICE David. It is soooo pertinent to this Thread that I want to post your statement here.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=6734.msg215481#new
.
Post by: winsonali on December 18, 2009, 07:16:12 AM
the quote you posted is based on reality
examples:
black ligth power they got there patent for there powder and cancelled with in 2 years as it was revealed that it can used for power production. and there are many examples like this
getting attention by posting on forums is not the target..... the target is to share knowledge with everyone give your views and receive there views.these are free forums any body can come and post there views either based on knowledge or misconception.
and you never know who those people are .... its better to choose the way which serves the purpose in best way rather then trying to make everyone happy.
Not every experiment can be done in a small capacity i give you an example
i reduce the core requirement from the transformer by coating silver on FE304 base alloy you cannot do at home nor you do experiments of this nature at home. the upper layer carries the current the lower layer carries the magnetic field nothing more precise is possible.
now if some one is capable to understand the technical language can imagine what i have described free of cost.
selling kits or selling any thing is not my area i do project for companies and hand over them the entire solution, so i am afraid i will not sell any kits i will give knowledge and those capable will enjoy the work.
proof of product .. the proof of product is not in successful replication .. it is in customer satisfaction when we produce some product then customers using them they will speak by themselves.
just an example Gotoluc was working on lens free generator i saw his video what ever knowledge i was having based on my own practical experiments and related device i posted honestly with full details. and that is a 100% working unit. and i did this some time back this is knowledge sharing as gotoluc put forward his experiments honestly i did the same.
nali2001 is posting his work very honestly
so my brother what ever energy solution will come now will not be an easy thing cos everything easily possible has already been done. I have seen more then 100 patent documents based on permanent magnet and transformers and sort of MEG non of them are in working condition but they are patented documents.
how do i know they are not working ... because we can't find any device based on those designs or like them. end of story they are not working so they are not in market.
i reviewed each design and after going in details i rejected them as i can see design failures as a knowledge base i was looking forward to put that information to forum members and review them with there knowledge and we could reach to some results. but no body is interested in scientific reasoning.
conclusion.
the latest system i have developed is complete and self running it is running through DC taking 36 watt in and 80 watt AC out and when we re-inject the power a 40 watt bulb runs without any external source. this is verified by some very good people and i have been advised not to put this video until and unless i submit the patent document otherwise it will be considered advertised before registration and evidence will be attached for rejection of document.
i am not listening to the advise i am just looking to increase the power to some substantial level and will post the video and then concept. but remember this is not so easy to be copied it is a really complicated device.
most important i will not use this forum for commercial purpose what ever i will post will be free knowledge.
if forum members suggest that i should post the video of current setup then i will do that immediately.
Post by: markdansie on December 18, 2009, 07:59:01 AM
@ DBowling Said:
If you are actually able to patent your device, at a cost of several thousand dollars, and it is indeed free energy, you will never get it to market because the powers that be will step in and take it in the name of "national security" which is in actuality the security of the big oil companies, or you will discover that some major company has a patent just like yours which just happens to have cleared the patent office days before yours did, so now yours cannot be patented. This applies no mater WHAT country you live in because every country needs oil.
Not true......there is plenty of ethical companies with the political and financial clout to get projects running.
Mark
Post by: ramset on December 18, 2009, 08:13:51 AM
We are a fellowship of men seeking to change our world.
I can tell that you will do the right thing
God bless you and yours
Chet
Post by: aaron5120 on December 18, 2009, 12:52:48 PM
I just sent e-mails to your personal mailbox here in Overunity.com
Please have a look at them, many thanks. I have questions there for you regarding the margnet coil generator setup.
Aaron5120
Post by: Spider on December 18, 2009, 01:14:24 PM
For what its worth, I personally would like to see your video very much :)
Spider
Post by: winsonali on December 19, 2009, 07:54:56 AM
this is the most perfect parallel path magnetic arrangement any motor designed on this concept will be free of lenz force. this cannot work as generator
Post by: Nihilanth on December 19, 2009, 08:41:37 AM
Post by: aaron5120 on December 19, 2009, 09:55:31 AM
hello ALL,Hi Winsonali,
this is the most perfect parallel path magnetic arrangement any motor designed on this concept will be free of lenz force. this cannot work as generator
This setup has already been patented by Jack Hildenbrand, who passed away this year soon after getting his patent granted( it was in March).
His patent number is US7453341 for your reference.
The design is almost the same. Jack had been sharing his invention here for 3 years. You may find his thread in the Magnet motor section. I was trying to replicate the Hildenbrand valve, but some technical issues hindered the advancement so far. I think your invention is better. And I am currently making the core for the Flynn Parralell path generator. Not a Lenzless gen though.
Thanks for your contribution anyway, Ali.
Post by: winsonali on December 19, 2009, 11:14:17 AM
the patent is 1959 i have just adjusted the core
the only techniques is calculating the flux path and resistance to flux path due to air gap if you are capable to balance in between them then you do this other wise no chance
the gauss of permanent magnet will effect the current consumption of your coil
you need proper switching to handle the flux path
this can only be used as an efficient motor or heavy duty non clamp able lifters where you turn of the magnetic field to release weight
Charles Flynn generator will not work as they are not changing the field direction after few second the core will be energized in one direction and you will not get any output.
Post by: winsonali on December 19, 2009, 11:17:46 AM
the schematic include has a display of 2 * 20 to display to show frequecny ,output voltage, current and RPM
Post by: aaron5120 on December 19, 2009, 01:57:39 PM
aaron here is the schematic diagram of magnetic generator this can handle power upto 3000VAHello Winsonali,
the schematic include has a display of 2 * 20 to display to show frequecny ,output voltage, current and RPM
Many thanks for this great controller circuit. I am taking a first look at the schematics, and have a few questions for you, sorry to keep bothering you with so many questions, please bear with me! ;)
1) There is a battery connection in the circuit. May I ask what this battery is for? And what Voltage and AH (in case it is a rechargeable one)does it has?
2) There are 10 coils and 5 magnets, Can you please elaborate how is the way the generator coils are to be connected between them( in parallel or in series, or individually) and which is opto for controlling the switching? Does it need to be located in the rotor's shaft?
3) I see 2 channels L and H. Are they outputs of the controller?
4) The neutral is not the ground in the circuit. So where does this neutral come from?
5) Does the AC in connect to the coils input?
6) And the AC out connect to the socket? Then 3000VA of power will be in 220VAC?
7) Where to select the different display functions of the IC AT89C52 ?
08) The outer magnet collar of your magnet setup----you first shield the inner magnet with a Mumetal collar, then did you custom make the outer magnet collar to host the shielded magnet? What is the specs or important parameters to look for for the outer magnet collar?
9) For 10 coils of 50VA each of pick-up power, Is it all-right to use AWG 25 magnet wire to wrap 550 turns with an air core of say 20mm diameter for each pick-up coil?
10) I suppose the magnet rotor is going to be moved by an DC motor, is that right? So how can I adjust the RPM of the rotor speed?
11) What is G1 terminal for?
Regards,
Aaron
Post by: smithandwes on December 19, 2009, 02:46:01 PM
Post by: winsonali on December 19, 2009, 03:24:29 PM
i am very happy that you are serious in my generator i will send you a detailed reply on your email address
just for now
you collect the voltages generated from all coils in one capacitor bank after converting to DC then you can use them.
AT 89c52 i have programmed it so it can sense the AC in and ac OUT FREQUENCY and many more things switching input out load selection and each stage is separated by opto coupler.
thank you for your information regarding US7453341 patent.
i think both Flynn and Hildebrand use the patent information dated 1959 and developed there technologies on them
the motor based on PM switching technology will be lens free and the generator i have developed is also lens free combining them you can get extra energy.
may be you can think ... why i am not working on this any more? ....
coz the new technology i have developed is far more superior then this and requires no moving parts
just waiting for right circumstances to display the new technology.
i will send you programmed controller to complete the circiut
Post by: winsonali on December 20, 2009, 08:16:06 AM
the DC input in circiut is coming from this picture
it will be monitored by software and Duty cycle will be changed to adjust the load and voltage
aaron i have a vision world needs a new concept we need to develop devices that can handle magnetic flux just like we have capacitor, inductors, diodes , transistors to handle electric current we need to develop the devices to handle the flux this will be new concept and will perform better then what we have now
i will develop first magneto-cell, a cell that will generate electric power just like a magnet generate flux.
vision is the first step towards destination.
Post by: Nihilanth on December 20, 2009, 08:41:53 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5nae_I_Mus
Post by: wings on December 20, 2009, 09:50:11 AM
It looks like Steorn has been a few steps ahead of Gotoluc:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5nae_I_Mus
with toroidal coil they using vector potential effect?
Post by: Nihilanth on December 20, 2009, 11:36:05 AM
Post by: aaron5120 on December 20, 2009, 03:24:11 PM
aaronMany thanks WinsonAli,
the DC input in circiut is coming from this picture
it will be monitored by software and Duty cycle will be changed to adjust the load and voltage
aaron i have a vision world needs a new concept we need to develop devices that can handle magnetic flux just like we have capacitor, inductors, diodes , transistors to handle electric current we need to develop the devices to handle the flux this will be new concept and will perform better then what we have now
i will develop first magneto-cell, a cell that will generate electric power just like a magnet generate flux.
vision is the first step towards destination.
I await for your e-mail reply to the questions, and many thanks for the connection schematics for the coils.
I know this is a mechanical solution and you have a far more superior one which is solid states. But I am satisfied even with a mechanical solution humbly, because when one does not have anything, anything that can meet the needs in a less refine manner can be accepted with gratitud.
I wonder where I can send you the money for the programmed IC?
Anyway, a thousand thanks for the help.
Second thing: if I need to build more than one generator, for my friends, should I purchase more programmed ICs from you?
Regards,
Aaron
Post by: winsonali on December 20, 2009, 03:32:15 PM
just send me the address i will send you the programmed IC there is no cost for IC
if you are seriously working towards solution its my responsibility to support you.
Ali
Post by: ramset on December 20, 2009, 03:40:41 PM
Dream,vision, reality
Chet
Post by: aaron5120 on December 21, 2009, 05:02:42 AM
aaronHello Winsonali,
just send me the address i will send you the programmed IC there is no cost for IC
if you are seriously working towards solution its my responsibility to support you.
Ali
I have already sent you my address. Please check your personal mail box here in the Overunity Forum.
Thank you for your help, may God bless U.
Aaron
Post by: winsonali on December 21, 2009, 07:16:26 PM
i have dispatched the IC to your given address
enjoy ;)
Post by: EMdevices on December 22, 2009, 07:05:36 AM
This type of motor is nothing new and it is not over unity by any means. It is just an unconventional motor that never found acceptance due to it's poor performance (weak torque, low efficiency). I get sick of all the people who think they have something or discovered something amazing and in reality they expose how little they know. These guys might want to read up on steeper motors, they have a hell of a lot more TORQUE
I see some of you talk about breaking Lenz's Law and I think most people have the wrong impression about what it is. All lenz's law states is that the polarity of the voltage induced by the changing magnetic field is OPPOSING the applied voltage, it is simply analogous to the inertial force that always acts against the applied force. Without inertia you would not build up momentum or energy, same with electricity. If you don't have this effect it means you're not building up a magnetic field, which contains energy. Some people build bifilar coils and claim they have broken Lenz's law, when in reality they have a poor coil with less inductance. I'm telling you guys, if you want free energy, look for free SOURCES OF ENERGY, instead of wasting precious time on stupid notions like "breaking lenz's law"
Extracting energy out of a magnet is another story. A magnet attracting to a magnetic material has just produced energy, but now what? How can you demagnetize it and pull it away and then magnetize it again but not have to put the same energy into it, which you will have too inevitably (as the magnetic field increases the current in the coil flows against this opposing potential hence power flows into the magnetic field , or v*I) Have fun with that one.
@winsonali
Did you succeed in setting up a closed loop system that works? Is that what you said in a previous post? I personally don't believe it. It is obvious why from your other posts, you have nothing and are just dangling worthless notions, just like I suspected long time ago. If you had a WORKING closed system you would be jumping up and down with excitement, or perhaps I misjudged you, perhaps you have free energy machines running in every corner of your lab, so what's another free energy closed loop system?, ahhh, who cares....
Better stick to the business of making SMPS, it's quite lucrative.
EM
It looks like Steorn has been a few steps ahead of Gotoluc:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5nae_I_Mus
Post by: winsonali on December 22, 2009, 08:13:09 AM
i am fully agreed with your explanation regarding lens force
regardless of formula and description of lens force here is the reason of so called lens force
when a rotor moves in a static PM the first force encounters is the force of attraction between magnet and core material regardless of polarity .... this can be reduce by properly balancing the mechanical margins equally in 360 degree but cannot be fully finished .... they are just like invisible brakes.
when you move rotor mechanically to produce electric power the winding in the rotor starts getting voltage due to changing field now this makes the rotor a polarized electro magnet.....
each time the direction of the magnet aligned as the facing pole's inverted pole direction another greater force of attraction become active(this is lens force) ....now you need move power( against lens force) to keep it moving to achieve required voltage without load.
One new phenomena takes place when we connect load to generating rotor coils. the coils starts flowing current and become more heavily magnetized...we need more force to maintain the RPM to get proper voltage at consuming current.....( i see this as increasing duty cycle in electronics)
the above description is mechanical force ... same are present in electrical as well
the KEY to understand
this is with my own experiments i called this effect "MDFGR" mutual dynamic field gate resistance if we control this effect we can simply convert the magnetic field in electric field.
what this effect is when magnetic lines passing through a current carrying conductor which is not magnetically permeable this effect force the material to to aligned atomic poles in the direction of external field flow as a result this changes the structure and gates of electronic arrangements and due to this reason the resistance of the material dynamically reduces and it starts consuming more and more current.
this phenomena is applicable to those materials which are good electrical conductor but poor magnetic conductor.
i have recently developed the formulation of an FE3o4 based alloy with some coating that wire will give you the same effect as core based coils but there will be no core required so we have reduced the greater mechanical force hindrance without lossing the efficiency
a lot of technical work is present with me and results of technical works are registered with backup videos.
the circular disk magnets facing each other can produce more power then conventional generators. there is a key don't get the power until and unless it is at the peak and stop taking the power instantly once you fill the power bucket. as i have done in genie.
Em devices :
i really want to share the new device with you which is self running now just waiting for right time...
all the easy possible power generation methods are already in use with there efficiency what ever method will come up now will be out of the box and not in the existing lines.
for me a solid state generator is more preferable so i am concentrating on them rather then mechanical solution but i have studied all mechanical power generation techniques very well.
Post by: winsonali on December 22, 2009, 09:24:24 AM
Quote
@winsonali
Did you succeed in setting up a closed loop system that works? Is that what you said in a previous post? I personally don't believe it. It is obvious why from your other posts, you have nothing and are just dangling worthless notions, just like I suspected long time ago. If you had a WORKING closed system you would be jumping up and down with excitement, or perhaps I misjudged you, perhaps you have free energy machines running in every corner of your lab, so what's another free energy closed loop system?, ahhh, who cares....
Better stick to the business of making SMPS, it's quite lucrative.
EM
for your above quote i can just say one simple thing
"Time will reveal what i have"
posting on over unity doesn't mean that i don't have anything, you are also here... ;)
so yes i am jumping in my lab what ever i have achieved is remarkable.
i am not fishing for any investor i am self sufficient, the unit is now self running that makes it self selling as well if i just starts selling it to my family members and friends ( this is there right to enjoy this at first hand) and there friends i cannot full fil the orders, secondly these are the people so close to me that i cannot runaway from them at all.( this doesn't mean that i will not go commercial)
the success of the product is not IN "if you can replicate it" the success is in customer/user satisfaction what it described it is doing
any way
i know one thing i have far more less knowledge then you have...
and i don't want to waste the time by giving explanations( other then technical)
i want to give and share my knowledge thats all, The members of the forum are my technical friends i am sharing with them.
by the way what do you think about steven marks device wasn't that working? if yes so we are here....
Post by: aaron5120 on December 22, 2009, 09:36:51 AM
the KEY to understandVery interesting and revealing insights, Winsonali.
this is with my own experiments i called this effect "MDFGR" mutual dynamic field gate resistance if we control this effect we can simply convert the magnetic field in electric field.
what this effect is when magnetic lines passing through a current carrying conductor which is not magnetically permeable this effect force the material to to aligned atomic poles in the direction of external field flow as a result this changes the structure and gates of electronic arrangements and due to this reason the resistance of the material dynamically reduces and it starts consuming more and more current.
this phenomena is applicable to those materials which are good electrical conductor but poor magnetic conductor.
i have recently developed the formulation of an FE3o4 based alloy with some coating that wire will give you the same effect as core based coils but there will be no core required so we have reduced the greater mechanical force hindrance without lossing the efficiency
the circular disk magnets facing each other can produce more power then conventional generators. there is a key don't get the power until and unless it is at the peak and stop taking the power instantly once you fill the power bucket. as i have done in genie.
I guess then, the external ring magnet (that enclose the shield and inner magnet) is a ceramic one with a silver coating? Because it is easier to make a ferrite disk with silver coating than to make a ferrite alloy wire with silver coating, not to say silver or gold coated wires are very expensive in the audio industry!
Now I understand the switching time for the disk magnet coil generator setup, it should close the circuit at peak voltage and after filling up the capacitor, it shoud open circuit to avoid Lenz drag or whatever opposing force then arised.
The controller is a switching circuit for filling up capacitors.
Please Winsonali, can you elaborate more on the making of the outer disk magnet with respect to the inner magnet, and whether the coils need special wires for preventing the Lenz effect to arise?
many thanks for your explanations in advance! ;)
Post by: winsonali on December 22, 2009, 11:50:10 AM
here is more information and why this setup is better then conventional methods also i have mentioned how to wind the coil in this way it will reduce magnetic resistance and give you smooth output
also i have mention the MOSFET on / off times for load collection
Post by: tinu on December 22, 2009, 12:25:34 PM
"Time will reveal what i have"
... the unit is now self running
...
Well, this is again one HUGE statement!
Such statements can not go by without reacting, even in a forum like this one.
Time will tell indeed but so far time rejected all statements of this kind…
So, here we are again. You know me by know; I usually either highlight the potential (universons, blazelabs etc) or try, in good fair, to correct the errors (often measurements errors –case with ‘the genie’) or I portray the whole picture in irony where there is no other hope (Tseung et all, Milkovik etc) or plainly slap into the face of ordinary liars (i.e. magnetic motor of Bedini etc) .
How should I react now, after reading that you have a self runner?!
(How should anyone reacting after hearing about such an accomplishment?! ???)
Since you hesitate in posting the evidences (which I can fully understand why), I wait like everyone else for your future steps. So, I look forward open-minded and kindly ask you to try avoiding choosing a wrong road ahead. Even if you are onto something, there are good chances you screw everything up.
I kindly suggest you plan your proofs rigorously. At the current stage of OU (non-existent ;)), making a proof that OU exists would make a great difference. If you’re willing to partially or fully disclose, that would be GREAT but even if you do not want to disclose a thing, a solid proof of OU would still help. Can you make it? Can you produce and deliver solid proofs that you have achieved OU even without disclosing the substance of your invention?
If you can do that, I offer to help if necessary, by testing the device and by publishing the results. I have no problems in signing also a NDA if you need one signed. I’ll buy the device for testing (actually I’d like to have 2 devices for testing) and I’ll bear all necessary expenses. I also fully accept you do not need me during testing (during the preparation of proofs) but irrefutable proofs following your statement still need to be produced in a reasonable timeframe. In case they do not show up, I regretfully will conclude you have nothing and it would then be reasonable for you to withdraw your claim/statement.
Comments, pls?
Do you consider the above fair?
If so, expectations and associated timeframes?
Best regards,
Tinu
Post by: winsonali on December 22, 2009, 12:58:02 PM
fully agreed with you some of the people have already seen the device and some very good members are due to come to see the demonstration very shortly
i have planned everything and have acquired the place for factory here in Northampton where we will be manufacturing them and i am doing all this at my own...
when you say error in measurement genie is now working through DC supply no more dimmer so the chances for error reduced greatly and due to DC input i am capable to feed the output back.
one or 2 devices are not at all problem once the unit is ready for sale any number you can get.
during this period what ever knowledge i have i am discussing and learning more everyday and i think most of member of the forum are far more knowledgeable then me you can go through with my posts they are all weightless and without knowledge.
Post by: wattsup on December 22, 2009, 01:43:54 PM
tinu
when you say error in measurement genie is now working through DC supply no more dimmer so the chances for error reduced greatly and due to DC input i am capable to feed the output back.
Does the DC input now mean you have bypassed the AC input step downing and rectification?
Good move. That is the only way to simplify your device for future "Show and Tell". lol
I would like to ask you the same question I asked others about their device to give members here the idea on the level of complexity.
So, how many stages or steps does your device require to function as it does. This includes major steps and side steps. I mean it is surely not a 1 step power in/power out. My guess 7-8 minimum.
Post by: wattsup on December 22, 2009, 02:06:26 PM
Regarding the drawing you show above of the winding which is simple bifilar, may I suggest instead 3 to 4 bifilars twisted 6-10 turns per inch then wound.
During passage through a coil, you have magnet to iron core relation but you also have magnet to energized coil relation as load is increased. The above will reduce the out bound coil field hence the magnet to coil relation and increase amperage output.
Post by: winsonali on December 22, 2009, 02:35:49 PM
the setup of the mechanical generation is100 %working unit and a very efficient one i develop this for third world countries where they need fan attaching this kind of generator with fan will give power to run other appliances getting extra power lower cost and they need air through fan in any way
about coil i don't know about bifilar but i did it to produce equal and opposite mag field when coil consume current.
whatever will come up now for energy solution is not that easy it is very complex as you know i was working on DC input for genie i have completed that section. and also load balancing in the final stage.
there are more sensors and quite complex switching....
now coming to multiple stages i have not given 2nd though about that i am working on unified PCB and its smt layout and planning for final design once i will complete that work then i will think about these things.
Post by: EMdevices on December 22, 2009, 09:34:46 PM
do you know why you don't have a closed loop running system, because they are not possible, given your configuration, it would be perpetual motion, an impossibility.
On the other side, if you found a source of free energy, then you would understand it, but I don't see it from you. A bunch of pulses imitating a sign wave is not free energy.
don't deceive yourself, because I'm not.
I appreciate your sharing and exploring, but please don't make claims you can't substantiate. Words are cheap on this forum.
EM
Post by: aaron5120 on December 23, 2009, 04:05:32 AM
aaronMany thanks for this information, WinsonAli. They are very important for me in order to replicate the Mechanical Generator.
here is more information and why this setup is better then conventional methods also i have mentioned how to wind the coil in this way it will reduce magnetic resistance and give you smooth output
also i have mention the MOSFET on / off times for load collection
One last thing I want to consult is the shape of the external magnet (See the attachment), is it a ring magnet, with a perforated hole in the centre, or is it a cup magnet that masks the whole shield and inner magnet? And which is the material used for it, ceramic or NeFeB? If it is a NeFeB, a grade 40 will do? How thick the external magnet should be in order to accomplish the compression job?
Thanks for your help, Ali. And congratulations for achieving self-running of your Solid State Genie! ;)
Aaron5120
Post by: winsonali on December 23, 2009, 10:28:01 AM
i can understand your point of view as i can see your posts on TPU many years of work but no results
any way for me your are very respected and have very good knowledge. i have developed some thing different you will see soon... a small story
In a village there was no rain for long time all wise and elderly man decided to pray for blessing of GOD and gathered next morning in a ground all wise and elderly man came bare handed only one young boy came with an umberalla and rain coat.....
Lesson to learn..... only the young boy have believe in what he was......
may be i am the young boy believing in my hard work
arron:
the attached picture will help you you don't need 2 magnets the arrangement you provide sheilding and central magnet..
more power full magnets means more current......
Post by: aaron5120 on December 23, 2009, 04:24:23 PM
arron:Hi Winsonali,
the attached picture will help you you don't need 2 magnets the arrangement you provide sheilding and central magnet..
more power full magnets means more current......
Often the most elegant solution ends up being the most simple one. I must conceed that your solution is brilliant, and yet very simple!
Thank you very much , Winsonali, and my hat's off to your good self.
I will proceed to order the magnets and to make the iron shields now.
Best Regards,
Aaron5120
Post by: neha9243 on December 23, 2009, 04:26:23 PM
I am fully agree with you. keep the good work .
neha9243
Post by: neha9243 on December 23, 2009, 04:42:12 PM
all the best and keep the good work
neha9243
Post by: aaron5120 on December 24, 2009, 12:30:16 PM
aaronHi Winsonali,
here is more information and why this setup is better then conventional methods also i have mentioned how to wind the coil in this way it will reduce magnetic resistance and give you smooth output
also i have mention the MOSFET on / off times for load collection
Regarding the magnet pole setup I came up with a question and would like to have you clarification:
According to your magnet pole setup as per first attachment, the poles are alternating, that is N-S-N-S-N- etc, in order to regauge the coil and produce AC current in the pick up coils. The waveform you show in the picture confirmed that.
But according to the photos taken, the disks contains 5 disk magnets(see attachment 2), so they will be: N-S-N-S-N. But then the last one will repeat as N-N after going one round of 360 degrees.
Should not be it necessary to have minimum 6 disk magnets in each wooden disks instead of 5 magnets?
Please clarify this point, as it is very important for the replication, thanks!
aaron5120
Post by: allcanadian on December 25, 2009, 11:03:26 AM
Quote
"I see some of you talk about breaking Lenz's Law and I think most people have the wrong impression about what it is. All lenz's law states is that the polarity of the voltage induced by the changing magnetic field is OPPOSING the applied voltage, it is simply analogous to the inertial force that always acts against the applied force. Without inertia you would not build up momentum or energy, same with electricity. If you don't have this effect it means you're not building up a magnetic field, which contains energy. Some people build bifilar coils and claim they have broken Lenz's law, when in reality they have a poor coil with less inductance. I'm telling you guys, if you want free energy, look for free SOURCES OF ENERGY, instead of wasting precious time on stupid notions like "breaking lenz's law"
I do not think it is a waste of time as any time we examine something or seek knowledge about it we learn something new and when we learn enough we gain an intimate understanding of what in fact it really is, this is called evolution. As well your statements would seem to hold to the conventional view when it should be obvious that few if any who have accomplished extraordinary things hold this view, we could say they were very unconventional in their thinking. As far as "stupid notions like breaking lenz law" is concerned, it is in fact a very easy thing to do when you understand "what" it really is. Consider your statement---"All lenz's law states is that the polarity of the voltage induced by the changing magnetic field is OPPOSING the applied voltage"---, when a magnet approaches a coil there is no applied voltage only induced voltage, when a changing(motional) permanent magnetic field induces a voltage in a coil there is no opposition until a current flows and produces a magnetic field in opposition to the motional one. It should be obvious that the induced voltage has little to do with Lenz Law until this induced voltage is allowed to flow as an electric current producing an opposing magnetic field. I wonder what might happen if instead of inducing a current in the coil we could store the induced voltage as an electric field to which Lenz law does not apply?. In fact this is what many inventors have done, they store energy as an electric or capacitive field and release this stored energy out of phase with the passing magnet on a rotor. As you can see this is not a conventional way of doing things and this is why it works, Lenz Law is not a "LAW" it is a theory upheld by repetition --- of doing the same things over and over. The world is not flat and it does not revolve around you, machines heavier than air can fly and this silly notion of breaking Lenz Law is in fact quite easy to understand but it depends on two things--- knowledge and perspective.
Regards
AC
Post by: winsonali on December 25, 2009, 01:25:59 PM
sorry for a late response i was out for one day
all the magnet pairs up and down acting as DC cells connected in parallel
so it doesn't make any difference what polarity coming next, one cell is complete to provide high rate of change of flux
in conventional systems you have once north then you need a south to effect change of flux
if you see in my setup each pair is offering proper change of flux with very high rate of change in center this gives you perfect voltage and current peak and at this time you open your load and close it before change of polarity
all potential power is converted into DC stored in capacitor and then we are making AC through software
so its really upto you how many magnets you use 3 ,4 ,5 ,6 or any number
enjoy ;)
Post by: winsonali on December 25, 2009, 01:40:11 PM
i am impressed by your understanding and perception of operating system.
regarding lens force:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pl7KyVIJ1iE
see this video and you will find the answer
i am collecting power and storing them in capacitors and releasing them as per requirement
although this is not my main system when you will see my final system you will be very happy
Post by: winsonali on December 25, 2009, 02:00:26 PM
in response to your message your question was very good and i would like to share the answer with everyone i hope you don't mind this..
Question: in my system how we are making lenz force free system.
the main voltage collection is taking place only when the coil is in the center its not necessary that you wind bifillar coil you can wind normal coil
the power is only collected when the peak is at the highest level and stopped before it passes to the next pole so coz no current is flowing during and after the change of flux so we don't experience any other magnetic field to oppose our speed and operating and momentum.
this is all about switching at proper time
2 things are important over here
1) Magnetic fields are changing but not crossing each other, so we are getting free movement.
2) switching allow us to avoid unnecessary current flow from coils all the time.
lens force / opposing magnets field are completely avoided in this system
this is not an over unity system its very efficient system.
i have plans to develop this device and attach with fans in third world countries so when they are using there fan to get air they will get free energy without losing the efficiency of system.
Post by: winsonali on December 25, 2009, 02:14:14 PM
Quote
ome people build bifilar coils and claim they have broken Lenz's law, when in reality they have a poor coil with less inductance. I'm telling you guys, if you want free energy, look for free SOURCES OF ENERGY, instead of wasting precious time on stupid notions like "breaking lenz's law"
allcanadian:
allcanadian i think Em devices have some serious misconception about bifilar and lens force and although he have very good knowledge
first regarding bifilar
i have attached a picture to explain how this system works
regarding lenz force is nothing but a phenomena if you understand how it is working you can avoid it just like gravity now machine they fly and break there gravity force lift up in air
its upto you what you are designing and what is destination.
Post by: jan.kolar on December 25, 2009, 04:04:47 PM
all potential power is converted into DC stored in capacitor and then we are making AC through software
Ali, to charge the capacitor, current must flow! You cant charge capacitor without current so there isnt way how to circumvent Lenz law.
U = 1/C * integral(i dt)
Post by: winsonali on December 25, 2009, 04:22:37 PM
in a linear field all the forces are in equilibrium and will only oppose exit if you try to eject from the field
so before we enter in the 2nd field we release the load there many coils producing current that load switch to another coil.
Post by: winsonali on December 25, 2009, 04:27:35 PM
welcome back after a long time i saw your post
happy new year and mery Christmas
Post by: jan.kolar on December 25, 2009, 05:31:04 PM
jan.kolarThanks. I wish you the same.
welcome back after a long time i saw your post
happy new year and mery Christmas
Post by: Ken the Great on December 26, 2009, 12:11:40 AM
Make the system a closed loop system.
Show us that video.
Post by: infringer on December 26, 2009, 02:02:02 AM
Its xmas have a heart for humanity!
Take Care and thanks for sharing.
Post by: winsonali on December 26, 2009, 06:37:56 PM
there are many people working on magnets
is there any simple low cost method to calculate the power of magnet?
Post by: wattsup on December 26, 2009, 06:42:00 PM
Some devices rely on motive movement, others on the recirculating spin (TPU) while devices like his I would classify as a "Peak Wave Harvester".
When you look at a regular pulse wave form, you start at zero, go to maximum, then go back down to zero. If you do this 3600 times per minute, you are in the motive range. If you do this 200,000 times per second, you are getting very fast pulses, but you are still working with the zero to maximum to zero sweeping. So you still have 80% to 95% of the total wave form that is far below the maximum point. So now, if you do this in the giga range and manage to disregard the up and down slopes and only harvest the peaks, that is something very interesting indeed and this is definitely a new way of collecting power as long as what is cut or disregarded can be stored elsewhere and re-used to increase the overall efficiency. Electronic power factor controllers are a few steps away from this since they encompass the wave cutting ability but only in the motive frequency range and only based on meeting the applied load. @winsonali has taken this to the next level which is great and very encouraging.
So I don't see why anyone here should spend his time trying to push the guy. He already confirmed that the technology is saved in good places and he seems to know what he is doing. He does not show any signs of the "I am God" syndrome, a rare attribute indeed, nor does he show any signs of being surrounded by greedy or ignorant people. So all in all I really think he has a good handle on the situation and he takes a level headed approach combined with a fantastic work ethic. I would have total confidence in his ability to both further his tech and also know when it is the right time to release it. Yes, yes the sooner the better is always the first hope, but, I personally would rather he take the time he needs to make it right and all we can do here is offer the support, the encouragement and the knowledge that he has people here he can rely on should he require it. We cannot do more than this at this stage. Again, having such a complex device would make it very difficult and confusing for a real open source development. So I would say to @winsonali, keep on truck'in and know that there are guys here to cover your back should you need it.
Post by: wattsup on December 26, 2009, 06:54:53 PM
I just posted the above a few minutes after your question so I did not see it.
You may want to expand on your question since you can measure field strength from the mag field itself versus distance from the magnet or from the holding capacity of the magnet. There are many ways to do it without actually requiring the real field strength in Tesla, but as a point of comparison to other magnets or coil fields.
I remember @otto had measured the field of his ECD unit a good while ago but can't remember the device he made to do it. But he was able to plot out the field I think up to 6 feet above his unit with his device.
Post by: teslaalset on December 26, 2009, 07:31:55 PM
hello all
there are many people working on magnets
is there any simple low cost method to calculate the power of magnet?
Ali, merry Christmas.
If you mean force, you might try the program Femm to simulate forces. It can give a pretty good indications.
I am pretty familiar with Femm, so if you need some help with it, let us know.
p.s. it's freeware, simulating in pseudo 3D (2D + indicated depth of the setup)
Post by: winsonali on December 26, 2009, 09:48:29 PM
wish you and your family happy year and Merry Christmas
wattsup thank you for your understanding
you are 100% right when a sine wave starts from zero almost up to 20% you get very low power and vice versa so its really an understanding when to take load in consideration, until and unless you are not analyzing wave form in you r circuit you cannot do this
just think can you make a harddisk in your home like wise this is a fairly complex system but you do understand how the system is working
once system is available everybody will enjoy and we will get low entropy and carbon emissions.
Post by: winsonali on December 26, 2009, 10:17:29 PM
aaron:
i have explained a little bit how you can get the max power and efficiency
please see the attached picture
Post by: aaron5120 on December 27, 2009, 03:56:25 AM
wattsup:Hi Winsonali,
aaron:
i have explained a little bit how you can get the max power and efficiency
please see the attached picture
Seanson's greeting to you and your esteemed family!
Many thanks for your efforts in clarifying the wave switching issue in the magnet=coil setup. In light of your most recent explanation, let me see if I understood the information. The coil enters the center zone(the iron cylinder center) of the Disk magnet pair and the controller circuit switches the coil "on" to extract the peak power, then switch "off" for leaving the center zone. You use the outer zone( the own magnet surface which has an opposite polarity comparing to the center zone)) to demagnatized the coil in order it can leave the magnet pair without drag.
Therefore, the special magnet shield setup can save the energy required to demagnetize the leaving coil in order to overcome the attraction force.
Am I right? The solution is brilliant and simple.
So how could the controller circuit know when to switch on and when to switch off? Using hall effect probe, or using one of the numerous opto-coupler to trigger the switching?
Thanks for sharing your technology, Winsonali.
aaron5120
Post by: winsonali on December 27, 2009, 01:02:21 PM
we don't need any hall effect sensors in our circuit
we are sampling wave shape in software we have an ADC and a DAC in software developed to monitor wave shape as we cross a certain voltage on middle coil we turn on load Mosfet and as it goes down a certain level we close the load so you are not very much concerned about magnetic field
using hall effect sensors is not good practice for open loop magnetic circuits you will not find them in various high end solutions coz they can receive effects from environment RF emissions and a lot more but induce voltage is the target and as well as 100% end product sensing PD and controlling is the best solution
Post by: nightlife on December 27, 2009, 11:39:34 PM
Post by: aaron5120 on December 30, 2009, 11:13:07 AM
aaron:Hi Winsonali,
we don't need any hall effect sensors in our circuit
Now I understand what your programable IC does in the controller circuit after your explanation. Thank you for the information.
I already got 10 pieces of grade 5 ceramic disk magnets (see attached picture of it). Their dimensions are: OD 81.5mm, ID 40mm, thickness 15mm.
I will get the iron shield (see another attachment)made with the base diam. 80mm, thickness 4mm, and centre rod diam. 36mm( to be 2mm smaller at each side of the ID of the magnet), and 17mm long( 2mm longer than the thickness of the magnet.
Please confirm the dimensions of the shield if they are all right. Many thanks!
Post by: Nihilanth on December 31, 2009, 11:16:23 AM
Post by: EMdevices on December 31, 2009, 11:48:46 PM
Happy New Year to all,
EM
Post by: nightlife on January 01, 2010, 10:02:22 PM
This sounds like what is done here. The energy used is being switched back and forth requiring very little energy to keep keep switching because the energy is not being allowed to escape. It directs the energy in one direction and then back in the opposite direction and then over again and so on. Very little energy is lost and much movement is created. Kind of like dumping a cap into a coil and then dumping the coil back into the cap. Each move creates an opposite magnetic field and the field is created for very little cost after the first amount of energy is applied.
Post by: EMdevices on January 01, 2010, 11:28:30 PM
the "genie" is a lot more simple then it is made out to be. The fast switching represents a high frequency that is filtered by the watt meter, which is designed for 60 Hz. The "extra energy" is not free energy, but rather it is energy that is not being recorded by the meter under these fast switching conditions. Ali is so full of it, when he says he has "closed loop" operation, I don't belive him at all, unless perhaps he means something totaly different by the expression "closed loop".
EM
Post by: gotoluc on January 02, 2010, 02:08:45 AM
Ali is so full of it, when he says he has "closed loop" operation, I don't belive him at all, unless perhaps he means something totaly different by the expression "closed loop".
EM
Hi EM,
so far I see Ali as being a genuine person and helpful in sharing what he can at this time.
Fact is:
Your assessment if Ali's possible method or circuit is not FACTUAL since Ali has not shared his circuit yet :-\... your assessment is based on how you believe Ali maybe doing it.
I don't get involve in debate with members but when you say someone is full of it without the FACTS ???...this is a negative comment based on your personal belief!... so don't you think it's possible that you could be full of it?
This is for you to think ::) about!... like I said (I don't get involve in debate) I'm only interested in putting my energy in alternative free energy solutions to freely help those in need.
Many people don't realize that the mass of the World's population is living in poverty and are totally helpless. We are not!... so working together is the only way we can change this World to a better place :)
Sincerely
Luc
Post by: Nihilanth on January 02, 2010, 12:15:38 PM
Post by: neha9243 on January 02, 2010, 01:18:07 PM
Ali keep it up and do not waste your valuable energy and time to answer such silly quetions. Keep the good work
Post by: winsonali on January 02, 2010, 09:24:56 PM
thank you for your support when we read a post we can get some thing adding in our knowledge and reject all foolish comments
i have no technical hindrance in showing my new device i am just waiting for proper time soon we will see the system working
i just want to add a little comment "its easy to do lips service its difficult to perform practically" those who think that they can slow down meter by high frequency don't talk do it and show us." all SMPS power supplies use high frequecy they never slow down the power meter ;)
Post by: ramset on January 02, 2010, 09:43:14 PM
Quote:
Many people don't realize that the mass of the World's population is living in poverty and are totally helpless. We are not!... so working together is the only way we can change this World to a better place :)
End quote
Truer words are hard to find.
And I hope this year will be the !st to see this happen.
Chet
Post by: nightlife on January 02, 2010, 10:22:49 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXIWAipEvjQ&NR=1
This is their website.
http://www.plugandsave.com/
Post by: gotoluc on January 02, 2010, 10:47:28 PM
I found this which may explain a lot about what is going on here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXIWAipEvjQ&NR=1
This is their website.
http://www.plugandsave.com/
Hi nightlife,
I have seen this video before. What bothers me is, he turns on the light and the meter is hardly moving. As he starts explaining how the meters dial works it starts moving faster then when he first turned on the light ???
Look at the video closely and you will see the dial is behaving strangely :-\
I think his device is just offering filtration and maybe a basic power factor correction.
Luc
Post by: nightlife on January 03, 2010, 01:22:48 AM
I did notice the meter was not acting right and it made me think it was a hoax back when I first seen it and I still think it is a hoax. The interesting part is the talk about the spiking volts that are wasted. Couldn't those spikes be captured and stored into caps and then dumped back into the system as controlled wattage? Could that be what has been done by Ali?
Post by: winsonali on January 03, 2010, 01:27:41 AM
i am only taking a small fraction of input voltage 10% to 15% and then regenerating them in proper cycle while doing this a complex software sensing ans switching is taking place.
but now the product is far more better then the old one you will see soon.
Post by: EMdevices on January 03, 2010, 04:46:51 AM
Quote
but now the product is far more better then the old one you will see soon
Ok, that's better Ali, saying that it's "far more better" is within the laws of physics, but saying that it's running in "closed loop" is just ridiculous.
Also, you implied in an earlier post that SMPS should fool the watt meter as well but they don't. I ask you what's the input stage of a SMPS supply? Rectification and filtering (of ripple) is the answer. This filtering suppresses the high frequency from being leaked out. In your system you don't have that from what you revealed. So don't expect the powermeter to register this high frequency loading and unloading.
@Luc,
read carefully what Ali has posted and what he is claiming before taking sides. The fact is:
1) he has claimed "closed loop" operation, and
2) he already revealed how he does his switching.
This forum is too crowded with the ignorant masses who would believe anything, Not me. I know BS when I see it. If that bothers you perhaps it's time to think more criticaly before believing anything people say on these forums.
EM
Post by: nightlife on January 03, 2010, 07:10:09 AM
I feel it best to sit back, ask questions and look for ways to utilize what is being said and or done. We all know that you can not make something from nothing but considering all the energy that is around us and everything is made of energy, it is possible to tap into it and utilize it for our needs.
Think of all the energy needed to create iron, iron is a product of energy and energy can be extracted from iron if we only knew how to do it. That goes for everything that is something which would be everything within our solar system.
We can never produce energy, we can and do only capture what is released from things that is made up of energy.
Post by: nightlife on January 03, 2010, 07:25:10 AM
Think about all the energy that is one Atom. If we could extract that energy from just one Atom, we could utilize it to power many things. Everything is radiant including an atom. The radiance is energy that is released. Everything recycles energy by absorbing and releasing it. If it didn't, it wouldn't be anything. It has to be something if you can touch it, see it, hear it, smell it, taste it or breath it.
Please keep this in mind when addressing possible ways of capturing what flows naturally.
Post by: Nihilanth on January 03, 2010, 08:03:11 AM
Ok, that's better Ali, saying that it's "far more better" is within the laws of physics, but saying that it's running in "closed loop" is just ridiculous.This is Overunity.com what were you expecting, discussion of corn ethanol as a fuel? ::)
Post by: markdansie on January 03, 2010, 09:22:21 AM
A scope always tells the real story. There are may ways to trick power meters.
I have to say some good things about Ali, he was offered some assistance in person by a a couple of well qualified people who showed him what was happenning with a scope hooked up to his device. To his credit he took that advice and has continued to work on his project knowing the minimum standards required when testing.
Ali will be demonstrating to these individuals again in the near future (if all goes well) and we will have some professionally tested results. The ulimate test however is to close loop it and to run it long enough to take into account any energy that may be stored in the caps. This may occur at a latter date.
Although no one has demonstrated overunity to date there remains some interesting work in cold fusion and fractional hydrogen studies. We can only hope, but these are explained within the normal laws of physics.
Kind Regards
Mark
Post by: winsonali on January 03, 2010, 11:20:32 AM
thanks for your support forget the negative thinking of some one, you can see all there posts are empty in terms of knowledge they can just saw this is not possible this is possible.... there is no hope of thinking out of box for them this is the reason why they are not able to do anything since long time.
once again i have no technical hindrance, i am just waiting for proper time more appropriate some documentation i am equally eager to show the device to all of you.
Mark is right 2 very qualified and honest people are due to visit me in coming weeks
other then this once i will open the doors every one is welcome to see demonstration.
Post by: winsonali on January 03, 2010, 12:12:10 PM
Belief:
i have firm belief in over unity, why?
when we manufacture a permanent magnet we put the energy in it to align the domains once and then for next 10 ~ 15 years the magnet will remain permanent magnet if not improperly used . the amount of energy released in 10 years are far more then that of energy required to create it.
so this is undeniable fact.
Thinking out of box:
to create something you need to think out of box if your mind is crowded by biased approach you will never be able to think for new concepts.
law of conservation of energy says energy is constant it can not be created or destroyed it can change its forms.
In many religions this is the law of GOD , GOD is one , he will never die,he didn't born, he is everywhere .....
so in science energy is GOD...
yes and it can change its forms and it can do wonders
observation is the key of success , getting help from others expedite the process , discussing your achievement is your reward
i know i am talking too big but it is only possible when i have something...
and one thing more i am not after money i have committed to a Christian NOG for 100s of units for Africa free of cost
Post by: ramset on January 03, 2010, 03:09:24 PM
God's been doing OU a long time
Even his bugs can make'" miracles " happen
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKPrGxB1Kzc
Chet
Post by: winsonali on January 03, 2010, 05:24:53 PM
wonderful video
Post by: hartiberlin on January 03, 2010, 05:35:33 PM
maybe , before you post your new video,
you can already post a few scopeshots of the input current on a shunt resistor
and the output voltage on an incandescent bulb ?
That would really help and start to build up more interest in your device.
Many thanks in advance.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: forest on January 03, 2010, 06:41:55 PM
Ali
God's been doing OU a long time
Even his bugs can make'" miracles " happen
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKPrGxB1Kzc
Chet
Medium is the key. It can't happen in air.
Post by: jan.kolar on January 03, 2010, 06:46:39 PM
Post by: gotoluc on January 03, 2010, 07:02:43 PM
take my advice and don't waste your time and energy to answer posts that mention laws of physics.
You will never satisfy these mind sets. You answer one question and it will create perpetual infinite questions that in the end won't solve anything.
Don't fall for their trap. Just ignore their posts and they'll eventually leave. Answer one and many more will come. They are not experimenters, they use this forum for their entertainment and to show off their educational knowledge.
Luc
Post by: forest on January 03, 2010, 07:26:24 PM
Post by: aaron5120 on January 04, 2010, 04:08:15 AM
I have posted in days ago the dimensions of the magnetic shield for the disk ceramic magnets for your approval. Please take a look at it, and tell me if it is ok to proceed to mechanize the soft iron pieces, thank you!
It is located in digest #42, with pictures.
Aaron5120
Post by: winsonali on January 04, 2010, 09:09:12 AM
that is perfect go ahead
gotoluc:
i have seen your videos on resonance and other videos they are very informative and practical, your work is not only spreading knowledge but helping in understanding concepts.if you see Tesla all the time played with his resonance circuits he understand the key of resonance and impedance so most of his invention are around resonance + impedance you are going in right direction
Post by: gotoluc on January 04, 2010, 06:08:03 PM
3 years ago I knew next to nothing of electricity and its effects. My way of learning is very different of the standard teaching techniques used in schools, which by the way I had to drop out at 16 since I couldn't follow. I've tough myself what I know today by visual observation and physical experimentation.
Reading Patents and scientific papers for me is also not useful :P maybe my dyslexia has something to do with it. I just find myself rereading over and over ??? but if I see a device working I can understand it very quickly and quite often suggest ideas that may even help to improve it.
Taking the time to make these video demonstrations I may also help others who learn this way. I also find it much easier to explain then writing about the experiment.
I'm explaining this to help others know me a little better and understand my background which is not Science or Schooled.
My interest to research Free alternative energy solutions came because of my frugal lifestyle. 15 years ago I pull myself out of the capitalistic rat race when I understood that exploiting Mother Earths natural resources for greed (profit) and control will only cause grief when the Eco system starts to break down. I couldn't lie to myself and continue to be part of this mass cancer to the World, so I drastically change my way of life.
People are so brain washed by the schooling and advertising that being successful is about having the most money (profit), material or position that they lost the ability to be Human (Awareness)
My hopes is to find a free energy device (not for the capitalists) but more for the poor of the World which is the mass. They would better receive (appreciate) it and hopefully would teach them the value of freely sharing so that eventually everyone can be equal and responsible.
These are my hopes for this troubled World.
Luc
Post by: winsonali on January 04, 2010, 07:03:46 PM
very good thoughts
just to share
do you know what is the reason for more drastic earthquakes and sonamie kind of earthquake under sea
the reason is
the OIL under the earth works as a shock observer and provide smooth transformation of earth layers
we are on daily basis getting that oil out of it so a small jerk cause big impact
all of us should work hard to produce earth friendly energy
about me i am by profession a scientist and research is my bread and butter.
i will post my video of self running unit this week
just waiting for some documentation as a proof of my invention
we will all get benefit of the device
i gladly invite you to visit me in UK and we will see what we can do as a team
aaron i also working seriously i will invite him as well
Ali
Post by: jan.kolar on January 04, 2010, 09:22:41 PM
do you know what is the reason for more drastic earthquakes and sonamie kind of earthquake under seaI dont believe that we have more earthquakes than in the past. Earthquakes are as old as the humankind only people didnt know in history about quakes in distant areas because they didnt have phones, internet and so on. If you are scientist than you should prove this kind of announcement by relevant statistics.
the reason is
the OIL under the earth works as a shock observer and provide smooth transformation of earth layers
we are on daily basis getting that oil out of it so a small jerk cause big impact
Ali
Post by: winsonali on January 05, 2010, 01:15:03 AM
Quote
more drastic earthquakes
not more number of earthquakes ;)
Post by: gotoluc on January 05, 2010, 03:43:05 AM
I live in Canada. I could fly trough London for a visit when I next go to India.
I agree with you 100% on the effects of oil pumping. In the future they will look back on this as a shameful and ignorant period.
What ever non Loving action (greed, power, war, control, etc.) done by man in this World will create Reactions. These are lessons to teach the correct way. If one chooses to ignores these lesson (which most do as they don't understand or chose to ignore this basic Universal principal) and continue to do the same, then it will come back again and again to serve you more lessons to the point you will have to deal with it or it will shut you down. This dynamic happens on all levels, individual, group, nation, specie and Galaxy.
By ignoring the lessons and man's growing sickness for more wealth, power and control (cause) has destroyed so much in the past 100 years that it may take much more time then that to even stop the effect.
I take full responsibility since I am of this World and will do everything I can to help bring change. However, the more others understand and work at this for the good of ALL the sooner the task will be done :)
Love ALL Serve ALL for a better World
Luc
Post by: ramset on January 05, 2010, 03:58:35 AM
Hopefully its contagious.
Chet
PS
" Love ALL Serve ALL for a better World"
I believe that would work
Post by: gotoluc on January 05, 2010, 05:39:25 AM
Luc
Thought for the Day
January 5th
In this creation, wisdom is enveloped in ignorance. So long as the lamp is burning, there will be a shadow beneath it.That is just inevitable. So too, when the flame of illusion is burning, the shadow of ignorance persists, right underneath! However, the Knowledge of Self destroys the ignorance and makes wisdom shine, just as sunrise illumines the whole world and confers peace and well-being. To attain this result of peace, effort is super critical. The mind is conditioned to good or bad, by the environment. The reformers of today do not strive to transform the qualities of people. They are trying to bring about equality in economic matters, in outer life. Improving economic status alone will not bring about lasting peace. Lasting peace can only be obtained, when character is molded and developed. There is an urgent need to reform the character through the Knowledge of the Self. This reform alone will bear fruit, the fruit of peace and eternal bliss.
Post by: nightlife on January 05, 2010, 08:34:13 AM
You are supplying the unit with an undisclosed amount of wattage. We need to know exactly how many volts and amps are put in as well as exactly how many volts and amps are put out.
Watching the video it shows you turning down the voltage but yet the amp meter is pegging out. That tells us that you are not turning down the power, you are only coverting the power from 110volts to 30volts. Then you show 220 volts coming out of the unit and the amp meter showing a number that I can not read but is still considerably lower then the pegged out amount. This tells me that the wattage used is about the same if not more. I am sorry but no extra energy is being created. At least not with what you have shown us.
30volts X 100amps = 3000 watts in.
220volts x 10amps = 2200 watts out.
This tells me that you lost about 800 watts by using your unit. Please note the number used for amps are assumed based on the action of the amp meter. If you could give us a better view of the amp meter readings, I could give you a more accurate calculation.
I may be wrong because I am not the brightest and if am, please explain what I did wrong.
Post by: winsonali on January 05, 2010, 10:37:35 AM
in all the videos i have shown input current
and in final video i have done some corrections and due to this the power advantage reduced highly
the effect you are describing is in fact a good concept and this happened with me in beginning when i have improper switching it draw extra current but with properly designed system it takes far less current
in my new design i have isolated the input and out put through solid state means. We reduced the dimmer to lowest possible duty cycle and collect what ever we require during this period.
now the system is operating with DC so there are no doubts.
just wait for new video of self running system.
Post by: nightlife on January 05, 2010, 11:06:48 AM
I look foward to watching your new video.
Post by: winsonali on January 07, 2010, 02:26:12 AM
during the quest for the alternative energy i have just competed another product
i will be posting video of self running unit over the week end
here is a little bit details of my new product
Post by: gotoluc on January 07, 2010, 03:27:03 AM
This will help researchers as I don't think there is anything like it on the market. USB on top of that makes it compact.
Great stuff. When is it available to buy?
Luc
Post by: winsonali on January 07, 2010, 10:16:47 AM
i have just started sales yesterday available from .com and ebay.co.uk just search
now i am looking for strategic partner world wide
4 channel USB oscilloscope will be ready within this month
these are going to be very useful instruments for research
Post by: gotoluc on January 07, 2010, 04:15:16 PM
You know what I would dream of having... is a USB interface that from a software you would be able to control up to 4 mosfet's at different frequencies, pulse width or sequence times for experiments. It would also be great to have full isolation (not common ground) between the switches. If you could also include sensors for controlling the switches to magnetic peaks that would be an amazing bonus.
I think something like this would be a hot item.
I'll look on ebay for your device.
Luc
Post by: FatBird on January 07, 2010, 05:17:07 PM
Yeah, I would like to BUY one of those too.
.
Post by: winsonali on January 07, 2010, 11:08:47 PM
adding 4 outputs for mosfets is just a matter of 5 minutes
we can add 4 couplers and isolate them from input
any thing you like to control through PC just ask and you will get
thats why i was telling you we can work as team
Post by: FatBird on January 07, 2010, 11:57:51 PM
How about considering selling some of your OLD GENIEs in KITS, OR Working Units?
There are many of us that like your OLD GENIEs & would like to buy some.
Thank you.
Post by: winsonali on January 08, 2010, 01:32:39 AM
brother i have to support my research as well and these things they just came as i need them and they are very expensive so i developed them now i will give some one rights to produce them even if you wish you can communicate with me on my email
just think that i have not given the link where i am selling them, i want to make my self clean in this regard no commercial activity on this forum just sharing knowledge and telling everyone means i am just sharing and this may help you as well in your research
about kit for genie
yes i can think but not in the form of kit but complete device but its on later stage
just waiting for few things to be completed and i promise at least i will send one unit free of cost to you.
Post by: Kator01 on January 08, 2010, 01:33:39 AM
here are the facts.
http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/recenteqsww/index.php?old=world.html (http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/recenteqsww/index.php?old=world.html)
Regards
Kator01
Post by: gotoluc on January 08, 2010, 05:08:01 AM
gotoluc:
adding 4 outputs for mosfets is just a matter of 5 minutes
we can add 4 couplers and isolate them from input
any thing you like to control through PC just ask and you will get
thats why i was telling you we can work as team
That's great ;D Ali
When can I get one like I described above?
I look for your ebay listing and could not find it ??? could you post a link? I'm sure Stefan would not mind as this is something that could help researchers.
I'm ready to work with you but I don't know what I could do to help you as you are way more knowledgeable then I am :P
Anyways let me know if there is anything I can do to help. My email is: gotoluc@yahoo.com if you wish to contact me directly.
Thanks for your time and sharing.
Luc
Post by: teslaalset on January 09, 2010, 08:41:21 PM
I am doing a lot of experiments switching capacitors and now I am building a universal switching unit including a microcontroller to do my experiments much faster.
Presently I use Hexfets IRF540N for fast switching high currents.
I encounter some problems in switching off these FETs fast enough.
(they need ~700ns to switch off, while according their datasheet it should be possible to switch much faster, ~60ns).
What switching components do you use? Can you share some details ?
Post by: hartiberlin on January 09, 2010, 09:00:30 PM
nice device.
Maybe you can offer an Affiliate Partnership Sales Programm for this device,
then we can include some advertisement for your unit over here.
Yes, would be nice, if you could also implement a few ports on this device
to generate needed pulses for some coil switching devices
like a Bedini or Newman Wheel or TPU control frequencies.
Many thanks.
Regards, Stefan.
Post by: winsonali on January 09, 2010, 10:40:55 PM
Quote
I encounter some problems in switching off these FETs fast enough.
(they need ~700ns to switch off, while according their datasheet it should be possible to switch much faster, ~60ns).
yes its a very simple thing i am using IRF 740 or 840 and the capacitors are 330 UF 400 volts
but the time for switching is based on residual charges if you connect 2 parallel path Mosfet you can ensure fast switching by cross over timing
the Mirco-controller you are using is also an important factor now i am using FPGA quite complex but very power full.
i will open source the genie circuit once my new device is on the screen all those people who have this thinking that high frequency can fool the meter they are wrong.
i am trying to up load my new device probably 2 moro you will be very happy to see the new Winson Charge Accelerator. this is the name of the new device.
Mosfets are very nasty elements they blow up very quickly, don't forget to put 10 k resistance to ground on gate pin it will keep it always low level and it will not go in floating stage and once you applied voltage to gate, put 1 K so you will get 1:10 ratio divider and the current will be limitise and protect the Mosfet to an extent
this is my experience when you directly connect mosfet and source jumps from high to low the tri state condition applies this is the period when most of the mosfet blow up coz a source to drain current is flow and the gate came in floating stage any thing can happen to blow so connecting a high resistance to ground will always deter the floating stage.
Post by: winsonali on January 09, 2010, 10:57:16 PM
please advice me how to go about your suggestion the best thing is all the forum members can enjoy a liberty to get it programmed as they need it
i will be posting my new video either 2 moro or on Monday at the latest the name of the new device is winson charge accelerator. i hope every one will enjoy it.
Post by: teslaalset on January 09, 2010, 11:21:09 PM
yes its a very simple thing i am using IRF 740 or 840 and the capacitors are 330 UF 400 volts
but the time for switching is based on residual charges if you connect 2 parallel path Mosfet you can ensure fast switching by cross over timing
the Mirco-controller you are using is also an important factor now i am using FPGA quite complex but very power full.
i will open source the genie circuit once my new device is on the screen all those people who have this thinking that high frequency can fool the meter they are wrong.
i am trying to up load my new device probably 2 moro you will be very happy to see the new Winson Charge Accelerator. this is the name of the new device.
Mosfets are very nasty elements they blow up very quickly, don't forget to put 10 k resistance to ground on gate pin it will keep it always low level and it will not go in floating stage and once you applied voltage to gate, put 1 K so you will get 1:10 ratio divider and the current will be limitise and protect the Mosfet to an extent
this is my experience when you directly connect mosfet and source jumps from high to low the tri state condition applies this is the period when most of the mosfet blow up coz a source to drain current is flow and the gate came in floating stage any thing can happen to blow so connecting a high resistance to ground will always deter the floating stage.
Yes, I have already experienced a lot of blowing up FETs. I guess that's part of the research. Thanks for your advise on the gate protection.
What exactly do you mean by
Quote
2 parallel path Mosfet you can ensure fast switching by cross over timing?
Are you saying to connect two FETs parallel, so gate1 to gate2, source1 to source2 and drain1 to drain2?
Post by: gotoluc on January 10, 2010, 01:55:35 AM
one of two email reply's to you has come back twice as "Delivery Failure"
Did you receive any replies from me?
Thanks
Luc
Post by: neha9243 on January 10, 2010, 08:34:41 AM
many thanks and salute to your great work for whole mankind.
neha9243
Post by: winsonali on January 10, 2010, 10:32:46 AM
may be the reply address is ali@wintrac.co.uk
please send me emails at winsonali@yahoo.com
i am no more using wintrac domain
Post by: winsonali on January 10, 2010, 10:37:45 AM
thanks sure everyone will enjoy this vidoe
and up coming device
Post by: forest on January 10, 2010, 10:39:31 AM
yes its a very simple thing i am using IRF 740 or 840 and the capacitors are 330 UF 400 volts
but the time for switching is based on residual charges if you connect 2 parallel path Mosfet you can ensure fast switching by cross over timing
the Mirco-controller you are using is also an important factor now i am using FPGA quite complex but very power full.
i will open source the genie circuit once my new device is on the screen all those people who have this thinking that high frequency can fool the meter they are wrong.
i am trying to up load my new device probably 2 moro you will be very happy to see the new Winson Charge Accelerator. this is the name of the new device.
Mosfets are very nasty elements they blow up very quickly, don't forget to put 10 k resistance to ground on gate pin it will keep it always low level and it will not go in floating stage and once you applied voltage to gate, put 1 K so you will get 1:10 ratio divider and the current will be limitise and protect the Mosfet to an extent
this is my experience when you directly connect mosfet and source jumps from high to low the tri state condition applies this is the period when most of the mosfet blow up coz a source to drain current is flow and the gate came in floating stage any thing can happen to blow so connecting a high resistance to ground will always deter the floating stage.
winsonali
Is that a circuit of two mosfets in opposite directions like in image I attached ?
Post by: Nihilanth on January 10, 2010, 11:57:25 AM
How much output have you managed to get out of your self-running device thus far?
What are the cost estimates of the completed device, components and manufacturing?
How large is the device?
If you could answer some of these, I'd greatly appreciate it.
Post by: Earl on January 10, 2010, 01:40:22 PM
edit: home page for Super Video Converter is:
http://www.erightsoft.com/SUPER.html
Current version SUPER © v2010.build.37 (Jan 2, 2010)
one download location:
http://www.filehippo.com/download_super/
here are some comments from another thread:
I use Super like Stefan has suggested:
http://download.cnet.com/3001-2194_4-10277613.html?spi=9c02d478042d76a42f60c92869355434
Capture Full DV to computer, after edit (if needed) use Super to convert for Youtube upload. Make sure video is not more than 10 minutes.
Settings for Super, "output container" select: avi, "output video codec" select: H.264/AVC, "output audio codec" select: mp3.
Video scale size select: 320 x 240, [correction 720x576 for PAL]
aspect: 4:3,
frame/sec: 23.976, [correction: 25 frames/sec]
bitrate: 1008, [correction: 5000 to 8000 KBits/sec]
options: check mark in Hi quality box
Audio sampling Feq: 22050, Channels: 1, Bitrate: 96
Right click where you drop video and select where you want the converted file to be saved before you start and then drop or right click to select the video to be converted.
This will make a great quality file that will be just under 100mb and very compatible with Youtube codec so not too much loss will happen when they convert it.
Hope this helps. Luc
Luc,
it is 25 frames/sec in Europe, but 23,976 is for cinema movies only taken (shot) with old real film cameras.
For NTSC DV video source (interlaced TV video) keep 29.97 frames/sec, if you are in a PAL country like Europe keep 25 frames/sec.
Keep the original video frame size like 720x480 for NTSC or 720x576 for PAL and better go with about 5000 to 8000 KBits/sec for the videobitrate.
Then the video will be much clearer...
Youtube will Re-encode it anyway again to FLV format with their own settings, so it is important to upload the video already with a high quality.
Many thanks. Looking to see the real deal. Regards, Stefan.
Regards, Earl
Post by: gotoluc on January 10, 2010, 04:39:37 PM
gotoluc
may be the reply address is ali@wintrac.co.uk
please send me emails at winsonali@yahoo.com
i am no more using wintrac domain
Yes Ali, that is the problem.
I'll resend to the yahoo account.
Luc
Post by: gotoluc on January 10, 2010, 04:57:24 PM
the only correction that is needed in my suggested specifications is to use 25 frames/sec if you are in a country that is 220vac/50Hz grid. Other than that the other parameters will give a very good result for the file size. Using larger formats as others has suggested will make a very large file and take 5 or more times to upload and in the end the quality difference would be hardly noticeable.
I've been doing videos for years now on Youtube and tried it both ways and never saw a quality advantages of uploading a huge file. However they have recently made some changes for HD so it could be possible to obtain a slightly better quality then what I have been using but this would need to be tested. I was thinking of starting a topic to do these tests and compare the result in order to help new users use the best video settings to get a quality video without using a huge amount of upload bandwidth.
Anyways, Ali has already done videos so I don't think it will be a problem for him.
Luc
Post by: Earl on January 10, 2010, 11:42:17 PM
using the resolution as suggested by Harti results in 4 times the number of pixels, which makes a big difference in quality when watching the video on a local copy.
The quality of what Utube shows on the Web is of no importance. What is important is how the video looks after downloading and watching a *local* copy.
The only reason to be concerned about file size is if you have a modem connection, or have a very long line to the ADSL DSLAM. An average ADSL or cable connection can handle large video uploads. Codecs like DivX, mp4, and h.264 have qood quality and high compression factors. The upload runs in the background and the computer can still be used for other things. Tony, as a computer programmer, might have half a dozen computers, so upload time may not play any role at all.
Without having high quality videos, the Mylow saga would have lasted much longer. Lower quality videos simply do not show the details. As we know, a video is worth a million words and the replicators need as high a quality as reasonably possible.
I am confident that Tony knows his stuff and can provide quality videos.
One other aspect to consider is not letting Utube transcode to another format by uploading to mediafire.com where the video file can be downloaded without any conversions. Mediafire is an excellent site to store videos and easy to download from.
An additional advantage of using mediafire.com is that it forces people to download the file to a local copy in order to watch it. There is no single-point failure and having the video spread around the globe to local copies is a definite advantage in getting the word out.
Regards, Earl
Post by: gotoluc on January 11, 2010, 12:56:18 AM
The results will surprise you and maybe help save bandwidth for your next video.
I took the time to make this topic to help people save time, so please don't post your personal opinions.
Luc
Post by: Earl on January 11, 2010, 03:06:17 PM
Luc>
For anyone believing that you can better video quality on YouTube by using lager video size and bitrate then I recommended you please have a look at this topic: http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=8628.msg221312#new
Earl>
"getting better video quality on YouTube" is not sufficiently precise. If you mean watching a video in a Web browser, no serious researcher gets info watching YouTube this way. They download the video with maximum possible resolution and study it via a local high resolution copy. This is why it is important to upload in the highest possible resolution. With ADSL or Cable connection and h.264 compression, upload time is not a major factor to consider.
Luc>
The results will surprise you and maybe help save bandwidth for your next video.
Earl>
I am not surprised at all. I am well aware of h.264 video compression since roughly 6 years. The profi video compression experts consider h.264 to be a very good compression, perhaps the best at present. I use h.264 respectively x.264 video compression daily when telecommunicating with programs such as SIP-Communicator and Linphone.
Luc>
I took the time to make this topic to help people save time, so please don't post your personal opinions.
Luc
Earl>
I will no longer post my opinions about your opinions on the thread that you started. I will, however, continue to post my opinions about your opinions on other threads.
1- videos to help replicators are particularly interesting if the device is a mechanical, non-solid-state apparatus. With explanation videos, the higher the resolution, the better. If tens of thousands of people can upload 1080p high res movies to YouTube, why should OU.com members stay with insane resolution of only 320 x 240 ? You are NOT helping by advising people to use the ridiculous 320 x 240 resolution.
2- In the case of solid-state devices, with no moving parts, it is questionable that videos are better than high-resolution photos. A 6 to 12 Mpx still photo, appropriately cropped, is a million times better than a crappy QVGA YouTube movie. The photographer, and the photographer alone, decides how much to resample in size, and how to crop in oder to reach the best compromise between image size and quality.
I do not believe it is in the interest of FE research to show children's movies at 320 x 240 stored on YouTube, when high-quality still photos and hi-res h.264 compressed videos can be easily up- and downloaded at another service, such as mediafire.com
It is in the interest of mankind to require a mandatory download in order to watch a FE video or still photos. This generates local copies all over the planet. Supporting the watching of videos on YouTube without a mandatory download is not in the interest of the FE movement. It only takes a millisecond to remove a video from YouTube.
Regards, Earl
Post by: Nihilanth on January 14, 2010, 11:37:14 AM
Post by: aaron5120 on January 15, 2010, 04:25:52 AM
Where's the video? :(It's coming! Be patient. Mr. Winsonali has promised us, he will deliver at due time.
Post by: aaron5120 on January 16, 2010, 03:18:51 AM
The soft iron concentrators for the mechanical generator are ready and have been put in place over the magnets. Please see attached photos. The wooden bases for the magnets and the pick up coils will be ready within a few days.
I am awaiting for the controller IC you kindly sent me several weeks ago, which still has not arrived yet. I wonder if it was being sent be air mail?
Post by: FatBird on January 18, 2010, 02:35:22 AM
Please post one of your OverUnity Devices & collect the money.
PLEASE HELP THE WORLD in its Energy Crisis.
The WORLD needs you.
.
Post by: tomd000 on January 18, 2010, 09:50:26 AM
Post by: FatChance!!! on January 18, 2010, 04:37:20 PM
with convincing evidence on his so called overunity capable contrapment.
::)
Post by: Nihilanth on January 19, 2010, 01:31:19 AM
Post by: the_big_m_in_ok on January 22, 2010, 02:03:37 AM
He was last signed in yesterday (18th) but hasn't posted since the 10th. That's never a good sign.I commented the same as well: He did it once before, but he returned last time, didn't he?
I thought his video was interesting, but I just didn't see a wiring diagram in the replay.
--Lee
Post by: Nihilanth on January 22, 2010, 02:26:14 AM
On another note, I just realized that since his "syphon" method determines the resonance of the circuit it's working with, it might be a great power supply for an efficient electrolyzer. Resonance was the key to Bob Boyce's electrolyzer from what i've read.
Post by: hartiberlin on January 22, 2010, 05:37:12 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PU5TtVq9LEc
;D ;D ;D
The power company will hate you for owning this device... ;D ;D ;D
How do they manage to spin the meter backwards ?
Is it just a cos Phi manipulation via capacitors ?
Post by: Kator01 on January 24, 2010, 12:58:26 AM
I do not know if it works if you do not place it directly beside the meter.
lets assumeyou have a linelength of 10 meter away from the power-meter you will have additional
inductivity involved.
On the website ( scroll down to the middle) :
http://www.boondee.net/electric-power-saver/b4-88.html (http://www.boondee.net/electric-power-saver/b4-88.html)
they decribe the box has to be placed as close as possible to the breaker-switch-control-panel. Do they mean " the fuse-panel" ?
The subject is also discussed at ATS here :
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread395990/pg1 (http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread395990/pg1)
Kator01
Post by: infringer on January 24, 2010, 02:27:51 AM
I guess I need to know weather this device is legal...
I thought about purchasing one of these as well.
http://cgi.ebay.com/18KW-Power-Energy-Saver-Electricity-Save-up-35-money_W0QQitemZ250499538058 (http://cgi.ebay.com/18KW-Power-Energy-Saver-Electricity-Save-up-35-money_W0QQitemZ250499538058)
Cheap investment low risk...
Post by: FatBird on January 24, 2010, 02:44:03 AM
It is just a 5uf 450 VAC Capacitor directly across the wall outlet that is for Power Factor Correction.
.
Post by: infringer on January 24, 2010, 03:12:42 AM
The power factor of an AC electric power system is defined as the ratio of the real power flowing to the load to the apparent power,[1][2] and is a number between 0 and 1 (frequently expressed as a percentage, e.g. 0.5 pf = 50% pf). Real power is the capacity of the circuit for performing work in a particular time. Apparent power is the product of the current and voltage of the circuit. Due to energy stored in the load and returned to the source, or due to a non-linear load that distorts the wave shape of the current drawn from the source, the apparent power can be greater than the real power.
In an electric power system, a load with low power factor draws more current than a load with a high power factor for the same amount of useful power transferred. The higher currents increase the energy lost in the distribution system, and require larger wires and other equipment. Because of the costs of larger equipment and wasted energy, electrical utilities will usually charge a higher cost to industrial or commercial customers where there is a low power factor.
Linear loads with low power factor (such as induction motors) can be corrected with a passive network of capacitors or inductors. Non-linear loads, such as rectifiers, distort the current drawn from the system. In such cases, active or passive power factor correction may be used to counteract the distortion and raise power factor. The devices for correction of power factor may be at a central substation, spread out over a distribution system, or built into power-consuming equipment.
Post by: hartiberlin on January 24, 2010, 03:14:48 AM
just a cap is a shame,
can you please test it with a power meter,
if the cos Phi power factor when connecting CFLs
goes up from around 0.6 to at least 0.95
just with this cap ?
But the Bondee box does contain many more parts:
see video:
http://video.yahoo.com/watch/590740/2869218
But it is probably illegal in western countries, so I would
not advice using it.
Just only device that just try to bring the CosPhi
power factor to always be 1 instead of just 0.5 or so...
(Mostly when you use inductive motors)
Post by: FatBird on January 24, 2010, 03:51:02 PM
just a cap is a shame, can you please test it with a power meter, if the cos Phi power factor when connecting CFLs goes up from around 0.6 to at least 0.95 just with this cap ?
================================================
I would be glad to do that but I don't have a meter that reads PF.
Sorry.
.
Post by: CompuTutor on January 25, 2010, 07:26:46 AM
I can tell you with great certainty that IS NOT
just a power factor correction unit.
Yes, power correction units have additional components,
they have an IC, and a bank of power components on heatsink.
Dedicated single IC examples:
http://www.fairchildsemi.com/whats_new/pfc.html
http://www.irf.com/product-info/smps/fs8383.html
http://focus.ti.com/paramsearch/docs/parametricsearch.tsp?family=analog&familyId=406&uiTemplateId=NODE_STRY_PGE_T
These switch in and out of circuit large capacitors at the feedpoint,
based on the overall misalignment of load to line (Power Factor).
This unit has only a couple on small electrolytic's (A top),
and medium sized ones at the other end (Vid bottom.).
Those are polarity sensitive components that are not
the type needed to apply to a line as power correction.
There is a complete lack of regular capacitors in it...
I do see what would be needed to make a buck supply.
The whole lead/lag aspect of connecting an inductive load
to a supply line that is in itself and inductor (Really long feed)
can never end well.
But convention has been on individual motors to supply a "Run" cap
to offset the inductance to bring the load more in sync with the sine.
The idea of a buck supply filling the empty gap
in the lagging waveform is novel.
But it would be the size of a fridge if you tried to make one.
If someone wants to buy it,
I'll reverse engineer it.
Board layout, schematic, and theory
all on a silver platter if you wish!
I'll do it for free even. :)
Now if you asked my if I could make a buck circuit to spin
a faraday disc power meter backwards with only a light bulb load.
An have it fit in that box...yeah, thats do-able...LOL.
Just think phase lead instead of phase lag.
Note 1:
Edited to remove yet more of those pesky capital "A" intrusions
that replaced a whole word...
This time all instances of the word "Vid" were replaced...
Note 2:
I had to edit the edit (Note 1) to replace the word "Vid" in it too...
Note 3:
OK, this is getting fustrating.
Both the instances in the above post,
and in the above "Note 1" changed back
when I wrote "Note 2"
Look, if you see an "A" in this post guys,
replace it with "V I D" (Spaces on purpose...)
Post by: CompuTutor on January 25, 2010, 07:53:12 AM
now that I got rid of all the "A" replacements.
I closed all, cleared cache, and rebooted.
For both "Note 1", and "Note 2" edits.
Post by: mscoffman on February 03, 2010, 07:24:38 PM
signal frequency bandwidth limits. Going outside
that bandwidth can probably produce anomalies.
But I can say, I disapprove of attempting to steal
power from anyone.
:S:MarkSCoffman
Post by: Nihilanth on February 03, 2010, 07:51:03 PM
Seeing his "Charge Accelerator," if it can infact be self-sustaining will be well worth the wait when he posts a video of it. I only hope that his delay is due to progress being done, rather than due to being inconvenienced.
Post by: FatBird on February 03, 2010, 08:45:25 PM
My guess is that when the MIBs saw he had a Self Running Unit, they paid him a VISIT!!!
I sure wish he would have RELEASED the details of his invention a long time ago and HELPED THE WORLD!!!!
.
Post by: markdansie on February 03, 2010, 09:02:05 PM
MIB only exist in your immagination or at worst the USA.
Mark
Post by: WilbyInebriated on February 03, 2010, 09:05:34 PM
Hi Fatbird,only? wow, you sound like quite an authority... have you any evidence to back up your claim?
MIB only exist in your immagination or at worst the USA.
Mark
Post by: FatBird on February 04, 2010, 02:05:35 AM
wow, you sound like quite an authority... have you any evidence to back up your claim?
====================
@ markdansie
MIB only exist in your immagination or at worst the USA.
Mark
=============================================================
Please take the time to read about the HUNDREDS of KILLED inventors so you can WAKE UP & WISE UP!
Why stay IGNORANT?
.
Post by: FatBird on February 04, 2010, 02:06:36 AM
.
Post by: FatBird on February 04, 2010, 02:07:22 AM
Are you guys awake yet?
.
Post by: Nihilanth on February 05, 2010, 12:17:15 AM
Also, I'm not saying he's dead, I'm not saying that inventors don't get killed, I'm just saying I think he's been gone for about a month before, and that's about as long as I'm giving this topic before I stop checking it. That's about all.
Post by: teslaalset on February 05, 2010, 07:29:19 PM
John Bedini seems to have something that looks like a power amplifier by using switched capacitors:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_otwA-00To&feature=sub
Post by: Paul-R on February 06, 2010, 02:47:59 PM
only? wow, you sound like quite an authority... have you any evidence to back up your claim?Check out that guy's last couple of dozen posts and then make up your mind what he is about. You could start with this:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2794.5145
and ask the questiuon: "What purpose was served by the posting of that post?
Post by: FatBird on February 07, 2010, 06:41:05 PM
Mark
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2794.5145
=========================================================
I sure hope he isn't a Troll.
For those that don't know what a Troll is, they:
1. Troll around Free Energy Forums to discourage good ideas.
2. Try to discredit good honest inventors that try to help the world.
3. Try to get inventors to chase insignificant rabbit trail ideas to waste time.
4. Trolls are generally paid by Big Oil CORPORATIONS so nothing interferes with their HUGE profits.
5. Try to cause anger and fights to get people discouraged and to fight with each other so they give up and go away.
.
Post by: wings on February 07, 2010, 07:03:46 PM
It is REALLY, REALLY, REALLY SAD to not see Ali here anymore.
My guess is that when the MIBs saw he had a Self Running Unit, they paid him a VISIT!!!
I sure wish he would have RELEASED the details of his invention a long time ago and HELPED THE WORLD!!!!
.
Ali here :
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/DC-static-magnetic-feild-gauss-tesla-meter-oscilloscope_W0QQitemZ250559574280QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxq20100107?IMSfp=TL100107215001r29369
strange that also SteornLab offer a similar device:
http://www.steorn.com/steornlab/hall-probe/
???
Post by: baroutologos on February 08, 2010, 07:45:58 PM
Its like yogis air-lifting...
Post by: markdansie on February 09, 2010, 01:35:41 AM
You ask what I have built that is OU. The answer is simple...nothing. There is a reason for that, I have never found anything that can be replicated that produces OU or has been tested that shows OU. Now that doesnt mean it can't be done, in fact I think it can. The real work is being done not in public forums but networks that are not so public.
Then there is the cost of the OU. Will it be economical? We have already reached the point where the cost to install the PV systems costs more than the cells.
I will give you a hint...Fractional hydrogen might lead to something.
PS no MIB's have been sited for a while. Your speculation re ALi is comical. yes many of us are in contact with ALi and when he has something worthwhile or is ready to show he will. There is no suppression...in fact quite the oppersite. There have been many offers made to support and take his work further.
Kind Regards
Mark
Post by: pese on February 09, 2010, 03:17:41 AM
@ Ali (if you're still alive ;))
John Bedini seems to have something that looks like a power amplifier by using switched capacitors:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_otwA-00To&feature=sub
Hi,
posibly i give an little help (i seen your cideo-clip)
If you use som big electrolydtics the source voltage.
values 10.000 or better 20.000 mf (uf) so, you can see
also an stable value output current on the dispaly on the power supply . and also the "electronic inverter that load your batteries
wil also work "in stable condition) an you (and all) can better
understand , that "miracle" ...
G.Pese
Post by: Nihilanth on February 11, 2010, 09:23:25 AM
There is no suppression...in fact quite the opposite. There have been many offers made to support and take his work further.So long as progress is being made, I'm happy. But I'd still love to hear some of the details. :D
Post by: neha9243 on February 18, 2010, 04:27:46 PM
www.winsonali.com
Post by: ramset on February 18, 2010, 04:51:51 PM
Thanks !
This should be interesting! The boy has "skills" ;D
www.winsonali.com
Chet
Post by: Nihilanth on February 19, 2010, 05:44:43 AM
It's great to see that he applied for a patent. :D
Post by: Kator01 on February 19, 2010, 05:18:58 PM
although it is very impressive there remains one question :
Why was the power-meter-reading below the three output-bulbs not shown close enough when genie was engaged ?
We have to believe his calculations.
Regards
Kator01
Post by: FatChance!!! on March 18, 2010, 08:37:20 AM
Overunity is difficult to obtain, if not impossible, according to mainstream physics of today.
So how come this guys solves one OU problem after another like it was regular development?
In every second post he magically solves stuff that would render a Nobel prize overnight!!!
His progress reminds me a lot of the Magnacoaster guy who solved & posted in the same manner.
And Magnacoaster was such a bad scam it was easy to detect. And now ALI is gone from publicity.
Research and Development takes time, a lot of time, and I strongly believe that any guy solving
problems like ALI or Magnacoaster is the sign of a scammer and his imaginary mind inventions.
Well, that's it. Take it or leave it!!!!
Post by: exnihiloest on March 18, 2010, 11:31:00 AM
My five cents....
Overunity is difficult to obtain, if not impossible, according to mainstream physics of today.
So how come this guys solves one OU problem after another like it was regular development?
...
They dream that they solve or have solved OU problems when they have nothing but fruitless imagination.
The problem is that they speak about their dreams as reality. They see OU in conventional results of experiments because their belief is such that they wrongly interpret what they observe.
Instead of doubting and working, they prefer have fun by jumping like goats, shouting "eureka, eureka, I got it, see my youtube video, here is ma gift to humanity, look at me, I'm a god" :D
And when you say them: "not OU here, you are observing classical experimental results, your measurements are not correct for the following reasons and the obvious proof if that you can't loop the system for getting a self-running machine...", they and their uneducated followers reply that their delusional explanations are better than yours (which are what laws of physics say according to what we observe). They accuse you to troll around Free Energy, to discredit good honest inventors, or to be paid by oil companies to discredit their awesome invention. ;D
Among free energy, there are serious and valuable people but not many. There are many more ignorants, bigots, scammers and bad "inventors" who are not inventive at all. Their noise causes wasting of time for debunking their bullshits. Their proofless and blind promotion of OU is counterproductive, discredit the domain, and prevent us to detect and check good ideas and works of valuable and more modest people.
Post by: FatChance!!! on March 18, 2010, 11:57:41 AM
They dream that they solve or have solved OU problems when they have nothing but fruitless imagination.
The problem is that they speak about their dreams as reality.
They see OU in conventional results of experiments because their belief is such that they wrongly interpret what they observe.
.......
Best reply on ignorance and crackpots so far.... ;D
I hail you and your enlightened straight mind as sane and logic. 8)
Keep up the good spirit and avoid crackpots and suchlikes.
They do not worth any serious attention!!!
Post by: Red on March 28, 2010, 06:20:11 PM
In case and point
Each action has a reaction.
With electronics and electrical field theory there is always more than one reaction, Tesla knew that 100 years ago.
Now if you include random inputs for "elsewhere" and materials propagation of energy, mass, electron spin up and spin down then all sorts of outputs - reactions begin to chain from one simple action. It is more than reasonable to achieve demonstrated "over unity" where a simple input is overshadowed by the resulting output however which way that output is achieved or sourced.
Literal over unity is not possible but getting something to work in a state of over unity, so long as its made from something that does something OU is more than achievable.
What do you thinks keeps you sitting in your chair or makes stuff go down? 6 billion years..
In 300 years time humans will look back at this thread and ROFL
Post by: e2matrix on March 29, 2010, 12:44:49 AM
Post by: listener191 on November 25, 2010, 08:34:17 PM
Refer to attached Fluke Corporation patent. Example uses 3 caps so according to the formula say 30V rms input x .3535 = 84.86V peak to peak
AC output voltage peak to peak is 2 x (N+1) x input voltage so... 2 x(3+1)= 8 .... 8 x 84.86V = 678V peak to peak ... 678 x .3535 = 239V rms
Post by: listener191 on November 25, 2010, 09:57:54 PM
Post by: listener191 on November 29, 2010, 08:47:55 AM
Post by: forest on November 29, 2010, 04:46:17 PM
Post by: listener191 on November 30, 2010, 09:24:43 PM
Is this related to charging capacitors in parallel and discharging in series ?
Yes, the patent describes a scheme by which three electrolytic caps are used to multiply the input DC by charging them in parallel (but in a sequence) then progressively stacking them in series to obtain a 16 x 1.25ms stepped (800 Hz clock) output approxiamating a sine. The process consists of two half sines repeated but with the second half sine, the load polarity is reversed to obtain a negative half sine.
The three caps triple the input and when switch B is closed the multiplication is effectively x 4 as the input volts are added to the three caps total. The input could be chopped to obtain voltage amplitude control.
This scheme appears to be 90% of Winsonali's device. A good starting point for experimentation. Feeding back some output before polarity reversal would cause output voltage to progressively increase. This could be controlled by chopping the DC input at variable high frequency. Of course the exact configuration of Winsonali's device is not known.
Post by: forest on November 30, 2010, 09:45:39 PM
Post by: listener191 on November 30, 2010, 10:06:44 PM
Yes,that's possible but quite complicated (probably needs a microcontroller)
Well the basic scheme I am building is using 4000 CMOS, so it is not so compact as a micro controller. The floating drivers for the series MOSFETS are a little more complex. I have a scheme using a capacitive coupled floating DC supply for each driver. The drivers are opto isolators (photo transistor). A better choice would be photovoltaic couplers, as they develop their own DC for driving the MOSFET gate and this would be simplest arrangement. Winsonali had difficulties in this area, due to lack of hard MOSFET turn on. I have kept away from bootstrap dedicated driver IC's, as they are too fragile for experimentation. I thought I would get the basic scheme working as a voltage controlled sine generator and then explore from there.
Post by: gyulasun on November 30, 2010, 10:11:26 PM
Normally voltage multipliers do not increase output power but voltage amplitude. Have you considered this?
Sorry to ask this but unless you know a trick or two you would not get extra output I am afraid.
Post by: listener191 on November 30, 2010, 10:18:18 PM
I would expect this device not to be any more efficient than this (at best), but I want to explore what Winsonali was referring to as resonance within his circuit. Of course building this in stages is required to realise this.
Post by: winsonali on December 04, 2010, 10:13:50 AM
i have used the same technique in developing energy saving fan this video is an exhibition where we have displayed the energy saving
the voice in video is bit distrubed and i have no information regarding this an on my website i am still researching in the same area
Post by: FatBird on December 05, 2010, 12:06:33 AM
Thanks.
.
Post by: FatBird on December 05, 2010, 12:18:22 AM
But I checked your Web Site, but you don't have any E-Fans for sale.
How can we buy some?
Thanks.
.
Post by: listener191 on December 16, 2010, 11:15:25 AM
What is the patent application number for your charge accelerator please?
I have search all European and U.S. patent applications and I cannot find any reference to the device by name (or variant on same), or AC voltage stabilzer (regulator), your full name, or Winson Technolgies Ltd (PVT)
Thanks
Post by: MT on January 19, 2011, 11:51:37 PM
Idea presented in the patent is tempting. Have a USB experimental board with 8 open collector outputs but all share same ground. So some OCs can be used on couple of switches but definitelly not on all. Floating switch was already suggested, can somebody present a viable design working on a OC input? Have no experience in this. Quick search
gave opto-isolated transistor drivers 4N25. Seems those cannot be used directly but can drive a IRF MOSFET right? This means also a power supply is needed per switch to drive gate of MOSFET correct?
MT
Post by: MS1969 on August 25, 2012, 09:00:51 PM
Did you ever receive any replies from this post in 2009?
I am going to attempt to build this (Meissner/Flynne) unit - the Meisnerr circuit is so simple and so powerful - it's a self adjusting, resonant circuit which is perfect for combining w/ the Flynne design(s) or others. Such a simple concept. I assume you saw theguru2you's YT vid on this? I have the Meissner circuit running - it's so simple and amazing to see it on the oscilloscope as it automatically adjusts frequency and voltage due to the changing environment of whatever it's charging.
I wonder why your images are not showing on your post, when you search for this post - but they are on the thread - kinda strange.
Anyways, can you please not reply here as I am not on here much and send to msrdotws@gmail.com ? I'd appreciate hearing back from ya.
Thanks!
Mike