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Author Topic: New invention of motion less generation of electric power  (Read 350961 times)

jan.kolar

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #240 on: September 28, 2009, 08:21:03 AM »
Added equation for Joule energy

jan.kolar

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #241 on: September 28, 2009, 09:24:58 AM »
Hi Jan,
how would you do this ?

Just using one one wire (one connector pole) only ?

Wouldn´t this only work with high voltage ?


Sorry i have not answered this question clearly in my previous posts. My guess is, that Ali charges first capacitor with positive-halfwave and second capacitor with negative half-wave. So both capacitors should have slightly differing potentials and maybe charges. Third capacitor serves like free-energy collector i mean.

hartiberlin

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #242 on: September 28, 2009, 11:35:36 AM »
Here is a better resolution diagram from Dr. Jeong, that he emailed me.
Enjoy !

Regards, Stefan.

jan.kolar

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #243 on: September 28, 2009, 02:17:13 PM »
Additional notes to how Ali's circuit might be functioning.
If you charge first capacitor with positive half-wave and second capacitor with negative half-wave  (both with the same capacitance), this can be compared to two identical bath tubes, one above the other. Voltage accross capacitors (i.e. water level in our analogy) is the same, but first capacitor has higher potential energy (first bath tub is in higher elevation so has higher gravitational potential energy).
One more note regarding DSP & complicated software that Ali is using. I think another reason (beside what i mentioned) for such a solution is to optimize the process of capacitor charging. If you have simple serial RC circuit and connect it to constant DC voltage source then energy dissipated in resistance in process of charging is the same as energy of electric field in capacitor 1/2CU^2. Regardless of how large is R (1ohm, 10ohm, 100ohm,...)! You can compute this using Kirchhoff laws. I have made such calculations few years ago. To optimize the process of charging it is necessary to increase source voltage gradually. Some notes about this can you find on beginning of this article
http://www.physics.princeton.edu/~mcdonald/examples/EM/fundaun_ajp_60_1047_92.pdf

This technique is used in modern integrated circuits to save energy.

Omega_0

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #244 on: September 28, 2009, 03:58:03 PM »
Hi folks

I am new at this forum. I have read all this thread and I am really curious if Ali's device is truly overunity or no. Sorry if my english is no perfect, I am from Slovakia.

I have some idea what this mysterious siphon effect could be. Imagine two capacitors with the same capacity C. Let both plates of both capacitors to be electrically neutral (i.e. number of positive and negative charges is the same). First capacitor is charged by moving some number of electrons from one plate to another. After that first plate has charge +Q and second plate has charge -Q. So the charge difference is 2Q. Voltage between plates then will be:
U1 = 2Q/C

Second capacitor will be initially charged by moving double amount of charges. So amount of charges at both plates will be -2Q and +2Q. Voltage between plates will be:
U2 = 4Q/C
Now comes important step. Imagine, that from some source we move charge -2Q to second plate. After this plate becomes electrically neutral. But first plate still contains charge -2Q, which creates potential difference:
U2' = 2Q/C (in absolute terms)

So if we use conventional voltmeter, these two capacitors will be indistinguishable. But if we connect positive pole of first capacitor with positive pole of second capacitor and negative pole of first capacitor with negative pole of second capacitor, there will be current flowing because of charge imbalances. So maybe not only voltage is important, but also potential! Remember, that Ali said, that his circuit must be powered with AC source with both polarities against neutral wire.

I'm sorry but its wrong. You could have tested it before posting.
You can't charge only one plate of a capacitor, the charge immediately appears on the other plate through induction.

The plate won't become electrically neutral, the second plate will immediately induce opposite charge in it, and the voltage will change. That's what capacitors do and that's how they work.

jan.kolar

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #245 on: September 28, 2009, 08:05:08 PM »
I'm sorry but its wrong. You could have tested it before posting.
You can't charge only one plate of a capacitor, the charge immediately appears on the other plate through induction.

The plate won't become electrically neutral, the second plate will immediately induce opposite charge in it, and the voltage will change. That's what capacitors do and that's how they work.

Yes, electrostatic induction will happen, but this effect only redistributes charge. It can't somehow magically create new charges from nothing. I think it is perfectly possible for one plate to be electrically neutral, for example by friction. See my explanatory diagrams.

the_big_m_in_ok

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #246 on: September 28, 2009, 08:26:20 PM »
Here is a better resolution diagram from Dr. Jeong, that he emailed me.
Enjoy !
Regards, Stefan.
Very good, hartiberlin.  That's a much better rendition.
But the questions arise in my mind:

What would be the effect of using 1:1 toroid transformers to replace the transformers on the right side of the diagram?

What would be the effect of replacing the 20 nanofarad capacitor with the spherical capacitor in Dr. Jeong's video that he says works?  Is there one in the diagram now?

--Lee

teslaalset

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #247 on: September 28, 2009, 09:34:31 PM »
OK, a nice puzzle for you:

1) charge C1 to +12V, C2 to +24V with common ground. C1 has equal capacity as C2.
2) disconnect C1 and C2 from each other and from ground
3) connect C1+ with C2- , resulting in 36V overall voltage
4) disconnect C1 and C2, what is the voltage across each C?
5) connect C- of either C to ground, whats the new voltage over C?

gotoluc

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #248 on: September 28, 2009, 11:00:29 PM »
OK, a nice puzzle for you:

1) charge C1 to +12V, C2 to +24V with common ground. C1 has equal capacity as C2.
2) disconnect C1 and C2 from each other and from ground
3) connect C1+ with C2- , resulting in 36V overall voltage
4) disconnect C1 and C2, what is the voltage across each C?
5) connect C- of either C to ground, whats the new voltage over C?

Hi teslaalset,

I did your puzzle test and I'm puzzle by not finding anything other then C1 and C2 being close to the same as when first charged (except for a small loss of voltage which is normal).

What are your test result showing you?  Also you're not very clear about the ground. Is this Earth Ground or electrical panel ground?  since I have read that these grounds are very different between Europe and North America electrical system.

Luc

teslaalset

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #249 on: September 30, 2009, 02:10:52 PM »
Hi teslaalset,

I did your puzzle test and I'm puzzle by not finding anything other then C1 and C2 being close to the same as when first charged (except for a small loss of voltage which is normal).

What are your test result showing you?  Also you're not very clear about the ground. Is this Earth Ground or electrical panel ground?  since I have read that these grounds are very different between Europe and North America electrical system.

Luc

Luc, I checked it myself in practice. You are 100% correct.
I meant electrical panel ground, but as you indicated it does not matter to connect to ground or not.
Thanks!

teslaalset

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #250 on: October 05, 2009, 09:21:56 AM »
Anyone heard any updated from Ali?
It's been too quiet for a while.

MasterPlaster

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #251 on: October 05, 2009, 11:02:20 AM »
Lets hope he has not been told who runs the world.

YeahRight

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #252 on: October 05, 2009, 01:47:36 PM »
My prediction:
He's probably busy making the new designs he told us about and later on when he tries
to close the loop he realises he was all wrong from the start and there is no overunity.
But of course we won't get to know about this, simply because he will continue to work on
his 'Siphon' to make it into overunity mode. This takes a lot of time and once he run out on
ideas to try, this thread is dead and buried and we will never hear from him again.

Not many people can swallow their pride and admit they were wrong.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2009, 03:12:20 PM by YeahRight »

jibbguy

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #253 on: October 05, 2009, 03:37:33 PM »
Lol yeah. I have conversations with some that still try to sell that LERN /Cold Fusion is all hogwash... Despite it now being accepted by the mainstream and verified by the Naval Research Lab.

I guess that knee jerk reaction just goes on in "perpetual motion"  ;D

YeahRight

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Re: New invention of motion less generation of electric power
« Reply #254 on: October 05, 2009, 04:03:25 PM »