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Author Topic: Lenz free generator  (Read 472048 times)

Offline VMP100

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #45 on: June 27, 2016, 10:57:42 PM »
Hey there Dieter!

I think we should just try to build it and test it instead of trying to understand it :-)

Found the file let me read it.

Best,
VMP

Offline dieter

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #46 on: June 29, 2016, 04:34:24 AM »
You're right! I think it was Einstein who said "50% is theory and 50% is experiment."
And Richard Feynman wrote a half a page of text to express: if the experiment doesn't validate the theory then the theory is wrong.

I find it extremly entertaining to see those highly educated, established people, having to discuss this question. Something that even a chimp understands immediately.

Well, nothing against Feynman, he just pointed out that some of his collegues would refuse to drop a theory only because they loved it so much, despite the fact that the theory was experimentally debunked already.

Like eg. Relativity Theory which could not integrate / was incompatible with the already known quantum theory.

Yep, build it. At least, it's easy to test for "Lenz-Freedom": with a certain RPM, you measure how long it takes the rotor to stop, first with an open, unconnected coil, and then with a shortened coil. If these times are the same (provided the coil is quite effective in current generation in this setup), then it's Lenz-free.

Offline darediamond

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #47 on: June 29, 2016, 05:54:45 AM »
Hi guys,


I'm glad to see something really productive being posted here.  I was thinking that rather building a completely different generator/motor that is lenz free,  it would be equally just as effective if we can attach a regular generator to a Bi-toroid transformer. The generator would not feel any more resistance under load than it would be without one. Of course, building a Bi-toroid transformer is difficult but easier than a completely new type of generator.


I do not think building a bitoroid track is hard if you are going to use powdered  carbonated iron, Resin and accelerator and catalyst.

Simply Get 5mm thick Veroo board or Plywood, Matt knife, Iron Ruler, Glue and with these items make a Splitted Mould which you would glue together and a Bobbing.

Most bitoroid Cores are Square in shape. So you just need to cut out the divide that Square into 2 when cutting making your mould. So this means you will have two separate c shapes cores which will be taped together after the whole assembling.


Madeo

Offline dieter

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #48 on: June 30, 2016, 10:54:38 PM »
That would require a functioning Thane Heins Bitorroid Transformer. Personally I haven't verified this principle, and what I've seen on tube etc. is contradicting.


Also, I am having problems with the principle because it expects the CEMF to take a path on which it will collide with an opposing flux (the other half of the CEMF). It may however be true that at a certain degree of saturation of the main core, the CEMF takes indeed the additional, outer path.


It's an interesting thought, but a lot of research work in the bitoroid business would have to be done beforehand.


Offline Here2njoy

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #49 on: July 01, 2016, 12:50:26 AM »
Speaking of Thane Heins he has resurfaced with another Youtube site  https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBslCeRonaXNJ0x_g_ZTEew

He seems to be posting a lot lately.

Cheers,

Offline i_ron

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #50 on: July 11, 2016, 05:47:59 PM »
Hi Dieter,


Here is my build of your first version:


The 'slugs' are cast iron, the magnets two 1/8th x 1 inch neos, the motion about 10 mm


The induced voltage is only 1.21 volts pk to pk


In the scope shot, channel A is a small air core coil to show normal induction (no slug) and to provide the trigger. note that normally the two channels would be 180 degrees out of phase but I have left one channel connected backwards to show the comparison better.


In channel A the peak voltage is when the magnet approaches the coil most closely.


In channel B the maximum voltage is when the slug approaches the coil/core. There is another peak when the slug approaches the magnet.


Unfortunately because of the large gaps the output is very feeble, to the point of being unusable as a practical device.


Four second video at: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQkmiot6_8w&feature=youtu.be


Ron






Offline i_ron

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #51 on: July 24, 2016, 12:17:02 AM »
Well, version two on the test bed/.


Just in round numbers, output 2.36 watts, prime mover increased draw 2.4 watts
so no free lunch here, mind you that is very efficient.


In effect it is a variable reluctance generator


Test conditions:


1750 RPM, 8 laminated slugs 12,5mm by 25 mm dia. laminated core. 8.39 volts AC no load, 4.14 volts over 7.2 ohm load.


Ron


Offline tinman

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #52 on: July 24, 2016, 03:50:58 AM »
Well, version two on the test bed/.


Just in round numbers, output 2.36 watts, prime mover increased draw 2.4 watts
so no free lunch here, mind you that is very efficient.


In effect it is a variable reluctance generator


Test conditions:


1750 RPM, 8 laminated slugs 12,5mm by 25 mm dia. laminated core. 8.39 volts AC no load, 4.14 volts over 7.2 ohm load.


Ron

Ron

Are you saying the P/in was 2.4 watts to the prime mover,and output was 2.36 watts?-or are you saying the prime mover power/in went up a further 2.4 watts?

If the P/in total is 2.4 watt's,and the output is 2.36 watts,then i suggest you calculate the power being dissipated by the motor it self-as waste heat,and also take into account the power being dissipated as waste heat by the generating coil it self-not just the electrical power out from the generating coil-->this is something many fail to take into account when making P/out measurements.


Brad

Offline i_ron

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #53 on: July 24, 2016, 04:52:40 AM »
Ron

Are you saying the P/in was 2.4 watts to the prime mover,and output was 2.36 watts?-or are you saying the prime mover power/in went up a further 2.4 watts?

If the P/in total is 2.4 watt's,and the output is 2.36 watts,then i suggest you calculate the power being dissipated by the motor it self-as waste heat,and also take into account the power being dissipated as waste heat by the generating coil it self-not just the electrical power out from the generating coil-->this is something many fail to take into account when making P/out measurements.


Brad


Sorry I thought "increased draw" was clear?


P/in is 44.4 watts no load. Under load this increased to 46.8 watts


What I was indicating is this is not Lenz. free as  claimed


Thanks for the come back though!


Ron
[size=78%] [/size]

Offline tinman

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #54 on: July 24, 2016, 05:12:49 AM »

Sorry I thought "increased draw" was clear?


P/in is 44.4 watts no load. Under load this increased to 46.8 watts


What I was indicating is this is not Lenz. free as  claimed


Thanks for the come back though!


Ron
[size=78%] [/size]

Ah ok.

The thing most do not realize is that if there is no Lenz/lorentz force,then there is no generation of power.

You actually have to do the opposite,and increase the lorentz force,but at the same time,you have to configure the geometry of the generator correctly.


Brad

Offline Dog-One

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #55 on: July 24, 2016, 05:27:04 AM »
Er___, seems I have heard this same thing someplace else.   Wonder where...?

 :)

Offline Dog-One

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #56 on: July 24, 2016, 07:06:07 AM »
It all has to start simple and work towards what you really want:
http://stomp.space/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Mag-Sweep.mp4

Offline i_ron

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #57 on: July 24, 2016, 05:16:10 PM »
Ah ok.

snip

You actually have to do the opposite,and increase the lorentz force,but at the same time,you have to configure the geometry of the generator correctly.


Brad


Brad, what configuration did you find that came closest to this?


This was just a little fill in project while I was waiting for turion to show us how he got 120 watts in and 800 watts out.


Thanks


Ron

Offline tinman

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #58 on: July 25, 2016, 05:12:40 PM »

Brad, what configuration did you find that came closest to this?


This was just a little fill in project while I was waiting for turion to show us how he got 120 watts in and 800 watts out.


Thanks


Ron

Some time back(years ago now) i made a device i called the L.A.G (lenz assisted generator).
Below is a picture of a larger version of that,that i am very close to finishing. There is 4600 turns of wire all up on that stator ::),and yes,it's messy and uneven--but it is only a proof of concept.
The larger version will be based on/around a 500 watt motor,and configured a little different.

When a load is placed on the two generating coils,it increases the magnetic field strength at the 4 poles. When this happens,you gain torque from the motor without any additional power being drawn from the source--in fact,my last model showed a large power decrease being drawn from the source,while an increase in both electrical and mechanical power was produced.

What i am basically doing,is using the increase in magnetic forces that would be seen in a transformer between the primary and secondary,when a load is placed on the secondary,and using those increasing magnetic forces to turn the permanent magnet rotor,where those permanent magnets-at the same time,induce a current in the generating coils,through the normal generating process.

When the primary coils switch on,the secondary coils(the generator coils) produce an apposing magnetic field to that of the primaries-at the pole pieces. This creates a bucking field,which pushes harder against the magnets on the rotor,and thus creates more torque from the motor,while dropping the input power down.

The switching is a push/pull switching arrangement,where for 1/4 of a cycle,the magnets are pulled toward the pole pieces,and the next 1/4,the magnets are pushed away from the pole pieces. This creates a very nice AC output from the generator coil's,that also includes a high voltage spike .

I just finished machining up the rotor tonight,so it's not to far away now from completion.


Brad

Offline ALVARO_CS

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #59 on: July 25, 2016, 06:00:43 PM »
I am modifying this old setup.
all 8 magnets N facing (bucking)

and I totally agree, Lenz assisting is the way, . . as much as possible  ;)
one voltage peak in between two peaks of current . . . what a challenge !!!

Alvaro