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Author Topic: Joule Thief 101  (Read 944454 times)

wattsup

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2160 on: April 22, 2016, 02:54:43 AM »
@tinman

Here is a simple idea for simple resonance tests with coils. Just call it a Pre-Primary coil (PP1). So you pulse PP1 to the resonance of the working Primary P1 while scoping the P1 and the Secondary (S1). This way you can now experiment with a primary in resonance without having to pulse it directly. One should soon realize that the secondary will require the most work, because getting any PP1 to resonate P1 will always be easy with an FG. But will S1 like it, that is the question and then how to help S1 like it more, that should be a better question.

In the standard primary pulse to secondary resonance losing game there could definitely be missing some interplay and I figure this would add to the play in a positive manner. So if PP1 can resonate P1 and P1 can impress an output to S1, how much did it cost to run PP1? Is it possible that in some instance it will cost less to pulse PP1 then what is produced from P1 to S1? hehehe

Then possible variations like two PP1's each on one side of the primary to dual resonate or one PP1 and 5 primaries all in resonance, or any other expansion would be good avenues to investigate.

Then the really fun parts would be looking if S1 will hinder PP1 when it is loaded or not loaded or even better, with a variable load because I think many of the problems stem from not having the right load level.

wattsup
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Magluvin

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2161 on: April 22, 2016, 03:14:53 AM »
Quote from: wattsup on April 22, 2016, 02:54:43 AM
@tinman

Here is a simple idea for simple resonance tests with coils. Just call it a Pre-Primary coil (PP1). So you pulse PP1 to the resonance of the working Primary P1 while scoping the P1 and the Secondary (S1). This way you can now experiment with a primary in resonance without having to pulse it directly. One should soon realize that the secondary will require the most work, because getting any PP1 to resonate P1 will always be easy with an FG. But will S1 like it, that is the question and then how to help S1 like it more, that should be a better question.

In the standard primary pulse to secondary resonance losing game there could definitely be missing some interplay and I figure this would add to the play in a positive manner. So if PP1 can resonate P1 and P1 can impress an output to S1, how much did it cost to run PP1? Is it possible that in some instance it will cost less to pulse PP1 then what is produced from P1 to S1? hehehe

Then possible variations like two PP1's each on one side of the primary to dual resonate or one PP1 and 5 primaries all in resonance, or any other expansion would be good avenues to investigate.

Then the really fun parts would be looking if S1 will hinder PP1 when it is loaded or not loaded or even better, with a variable load because I think many of the problems stem from not having the right load level.

wattsup

I think I get what you mean....

If we did get the pri ringing, loading the sec would change the pri freq (higher) by lowering the pri inductance. So say a resistive load if varied would vary the freq of resonance. So it would be that the sec should be first loaded then look for the new resonant freq?

Mags
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Pirate88179

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2162 on: April 22, 2016, 03:48:31 AM »
Quote from: poynt99 on April 22, 2016, 02:40:33 AM
Spot on with reference to?

btw, Lewin is good, but he gives at least one lecture where he unfortunately leads his students astray.

.99

Do you mean the one where he says that Ohm's law is wrong?  I was always wondering about that one.  I love his lessons but, he is the only one that has claimed this (to my knowledge) and, if correct, I would have thought it would have been pretty big news all over the world.


Bill

PS  I have watched over 30 of his lectures and have learned a lot from them.
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Dog-One

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2163 on: April 22, 2016, 04:29:19 AM »
Quote from: Pirate88179 on April 22, 2016, 03:48:31 AM
PS  I have watched over 30 of his lectures and have learned a lot from them.

Hope you didn't learn "too much", or you'll end up just like him, disgraced and erased:
http://tech.mit.edu/V134/N60/walterlewin.html

It's not good for educators to teach students to think, only to memorize and regurgitate.  Why if students could think, imagine what they might do, or build over a few weekends of their spare time.  No, no, we can't have that.  Breaking of the status quo is unacceptable behavior--zero tolerance.

On the other hand, if you really look into some of the physics Dr. Lewin gets in to, it's not hard to recognize what is actually possible.  Our limits aren't nearly as strict as one might think.  Just be prepared to be blacklisted or worse.  Probably best to just keep it to yourself and smile a lot.   :)  I'm pretty certain there are a few members of this forum that have learned a valuable lesson.
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MileHigh

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2164 on: April 22, 2016, 05:43:16 AM »
Quote from: Dog-One on April 22, 2016, 04:29:19 AM
It's not good for educators to teach students to think, only to memorize and regurgitate.  Why if students could think, imagine what they might do, or build over a few weekends of their spare time.  No, no, we can't have that.  Breaking of the status quo is unacceptable behavior--zero tolerance.

On the other hand, if you really look into some of the physics Dr. Lewin gets in to, it's not hard to recognize what is actually possible.  Our limits aren't nearly as strict as one might think.  Just be prepared to be blacklisted or worse.  Probably best to just keep it to yourself and smile a lot.   :)  I'm pretty certain there are a few members of this forum that have learned a valuable lesson.

I almost fell asleep reading through your two paragraphs because they are the oldest cliche in the book.  Open your eyes, you are living through an era where the pace of innovation and change and improvement is faster and more dramatic and more marvelous and exciting than it has ever been in the history of the world. They have discovered thousands of extrasolar planets, the James Webb Space Telescope will be launched soon, and in 10 years your cell phone will talk back to you like a person, shoot 4K video at 120 fps, and have four terabytes of on-board storage.  Don't be surprised if one-third of your energy comes from renewable sources and there will be solar panels that are ten times more efficient and you will see them everywhere, including on the roofs of electric cars. You are spouting out a ridiculous tired old cliche.
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tinman

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2165 on: April 22, 2016, 06:48:31 AM »
Quote from: poynt99 on April 22, 2016, 02:40:33 AM
Spot on with reference to?

btw, Lewin is good, but he gives at least one lecture where he unfortunately leads his students astray.

Which one was that?


Brad
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Dog-One

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2166 on: April 22, 2016, 06:51:24 AM »
Quote from: MileHigh on April 22, 2016, 05:43:16 AM
You are spouting out a ridiculous tired old cliche.

I'm a ridiculous, tired old man, so it comes with the territory.

Solar panels...

Yeah, that's the ticket.



Milehigh, you do live in Denver right?  The mile high city.

I should buy you a drink some day for being such a good sport, setting so many crazies on the path to enlightenment.
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tinman

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2167 on: April 22, 2016, 06:52:31 AM »
Quote from: Pirate88179 on April 22, 2016, 03:48:31 AM
.99

Do you mean the one where he says that Ohm's law is wrong?  I was always wondering about that one.  I love his lessons but, he is the only one that has claimed this (to my knowledge) and, if correct, I would have thought it would have been pretty big news all over the world.


Bill

PS  I have watched over 30 of his lectures and have learned a lot from them.

I think you mean the one where he said kishofs  law dose not hold,but ohms law always holds. This was in reference to non conservative  systems.


Brad
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Dog-One

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2168 on: April 22, 2016, 06:55:37 AM »
Quote from: tinman on April 22, 2016, 06:52:31 AM
I think you mean the one where he said kishofs  law dose not hold,but ohms law always holds. This was in reference to non conservative  systems.

Brad

Kirchhoff's law and Ampere's Law.  Yes, that was a doozie.  Knocked a lot of folks out of their comfort zone with that demonstration.

Imagine just placing your volt meter on the opposite side of your circuit and getting a different reading.  Crazy huh?  That shit never happens in the real world where you and I pay taxes.
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Pirate88179

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2169 on: April 22, 2016, 07:13:39 AM »
Quote from: tinman on April 22, 2016, 06:52:31 AM
I think you mean the one where he said kishofs  law dose not hold,but ohms law always holds. This was in reference to non conservative  systems.


Brad

No, it was Ohm's law.  It is even in the title of the lesson.

Bill
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Magluvin

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2170 on: April 22, 2016, 07:31:45 AM »
I would like to see that vid

Mags
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MileHigh

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2171 on: April 22, 2016, 10:21:13 AM »
A little musical interlude with some seriously mean lead guitar to inspire our friend Poynt99, and everyone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SFNW5F8K9Y

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Dog-One

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2172 on: April 22, 2016, 10:32:35 AM »
Quote from: Magluvin on April 22, 2016, 07:31:45 AM
I would like to see that vid

Mags

Sorry, my bad, it was Kirchhoff's law versus Faraday's Law.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUUMCT7FjaI

Go to the very end demonstration.

Be sure to tell your grandchildren about it--or solar panels, whichever you prefer.
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tinman

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2173 on: April 22, 2016, 11:38:45 AM »
Quote from: Dog-One on April 22, 2016, 10:32:35 AM
Sorry, my bad, it was Kirchhoff's law versus Faraday's Law.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUUMCT7FjaI

Go to the very end demonstration.

Be sure to tell your grandchildren about it--or solar panels, whichever you prefer.

Yes-that was the one i was thinking of--Kirchoff's law V Faraday's law.

I have not seen the one Bill is talking about regarding Ohms law being wrong--will hunt it down.


Brad
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tinman

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Re: Joule Thief 101
« Reply #2174 on: April 22, 2016, 12:10:38 PM »
Quote from: Pirate88179 on April 22, 2016, 07:13:39 AM
No, it was Ohm's law.  It is even in the title of the lesson.

Bill

Hi Bill

I cant find the video you are referring to.
This was the one i was thinking of,and it is the one where he shows kirchoff's law dose not hold,but Faradays law/ohms law always holds. It was in reference to non conservative fields.

From 34:50
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUUMCT7FjaI

Not sure if that was the one Poynt was referring to?.
Nor do i see how what Walter described and showed could be true in that demonstration.
If there is a potential of 1 volt across the inductor,then there is also a potential of 1 volt across both resistors at that instance in time---Poynt?.




Brad
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