@ All:

One of the ideas I am playing with involves the bifilar coil, but shaped in a circular configuration.  Not like the TPU but almost.  This shape could be about 300 degrees around as opposed to 360.  Like a circle with a small piece missing.  We could then place these into the ground in a horizontal position instead of vertical.  What advantages there might be I can only guess at this point.  I was also thinking that one could "stack" these in a series connection that might actually work. (Think about stacking these on yet another iron center core.....like horseshoes around a stake)

The rotation of the magnetic fields in the stacked position might actually build upon and feed off each other.  Then again, they may actually cancel each other to some degree.

Just some free thinking here.  I will build several in the near future.

Bill

Bill
 Sounds interesting

I am courious  about  why   you plan to leave a piece of the   toroid open


gary

Gary:

The way I see it, and of course I am just guessing,  I don't want it to be a continuous coil as I believe it will "short" itself on the core. (the core ends essentially touching each other as in a complete circle)  I am picturing a coil like we have built but, bend it into an almost complete circle such that the "top" end of the core almost but does not touch the "bottom" end.

Think of it like this:  If we built 4 coils in our regular construction style (straight) and laid them down on the ground in a square shape so the cores ends all touched each other, I don't think this would work and this would be essentially what you would have with a continuous circle. (does this make any sense?)

The main thing I am going after is to direct the magnetic fields into an almost circular pattern whereby they could then be stacked, and positioned to "tune" the magnetic filed by rotating each layer individually.  An afterthought was to add yet another large iron core into the center of the stack itself.  So you would have the circular core with the bifilar windings all surround another iron core intersecting at 90 degrees. This may or may not help, it was just a thought.

In looking over my "explanation" here, it sounds confusing even to me. (and I wrote it)  I will try to make up yet another very crude sketch and post it for your thoughts.  I am leaving for work now but will get to it when I can.

This all might be a bunch of nothing.  I just thought it might be a way to concentrate the magnetic fields and add a slight "tuning" ability to them.

Bill

Here is a very crude, quick sketch.  I'll make a better one later....hopefully.

Bill

Bill

I don't know  if the  core in the center  will help

It is my understanding that  one of the  things that makes a  toroid  work well is that   if it  is wound carefully pretty much all the flux stays in the core .


I think  it would  be interesting  to test  coils like that in the same ways you  tested  rods  in the  ground
If the  energy currents in the earth get  transfered  into  the   core  they may get amplified   by the windings .



gary

@ Gary:

Yes, I am hoping for something like that to happen.  As for the center core, as I said, it was just an afterthought that comes under the heading of ....hey, what if.....?  I have no basis to think it will do anything positive and it might have the opposite effect, or none at all.  I guess I am looking for that breakthrough and, well, you know how it is, no crazy idea is left without consideration.

When my Dad passed away, I received his very expensive and sensitive Omega meter.  It also tests thermocouples as well.  I am hoping to be able to pick up subtle changes in output when rotating the different layers of coils in relation to their gaps.  Maybe the gaps all need to be lined up, or maybe staggered 180 degrees, or maybe something other than that.  Maybe none of it will make any measurable difference at all.  I just want to find out.  Thanks.

Bill

Sounds  interesting

I would think that   the coils should  be   able to pick up  earth currents  better than   rods


gary

Gary and all:

Here should be a picture of another related design idea that I will try first.  The parts are easier/cheaper to locate.  If nothing else, this design allows for a greater overall mass to be placed in a smaller space.  There is nothing adjustable in this design as of yet but, I am hopeful that the total mass will drive up the mA output while utilizing less space than the straight coil design.  We will see.  Any thoughts?

Bill

Bill

I  don't  have any idea if that would  make a  better coil
It  does  look  like it would be very hard to wind .
   

I have also  been thinking  of how to get the most  bang for the buck

Toroids  are interesting    they  seem to   concentrate  the  magnetic flux .
What  about making  a toroidal  stubblfield  coil ?
The  core could be made of  iron  wire .

Of  course ....... that  wire should be  insulated  to prevent  eddy currents .
SO ......we would have  in effect a core of iron magnet wire ...........why not  keep the ends out   and  see  if  any current  developes in the core itself ?   .............Or what happens when the core is pulsed .
It may  open  whole  new possibility's 

I have did a little  testing
If I  am right shellac  was one of the original  insulators used for magnet wires .
I have tested a  little  wire .
I used  a 3 pound  coil  of  rebar tie  wire .
The coil of wire can be laid on its side and " rolled " in place  with a  shallow tray of  shellac  next to it .
It is  a real pain  to try to do long lengths   like this ...
 
I have  some ideas for  a semi- auto  coater .....not sure when I can get to it

The  rebar tie  wire   comes  slighttly  oily ......the  shellac l doesn't seem to mind  the oil

The insulation seems to be good .......and  farily tuff .......
haven't checked it  for  high voltage yet .


gary

Gary:

The only problem I see with using shellac for insulation is that it will not pass water like the cotton will.  The moisture is part of the key I think.  Otherwise, we could just use regular plastic insulated wire which we all agree would be sooooo much easier to wind.

Yes, winding the spring would be a super pain in the a** but worth it if it does anything good.  If it doesn't, I am going to be pissed!!!! Ha ha ha.

Bill

Bill

The  windings  would  be insulated  with cotton
Only the  core windings would  be shellac 


gary

Hi fellow winders  ,

Bill and Gary, I like both of your ideas.

I think the compound Stubblefield coil is worth a try.

I also think shellac is a great thought.

I think shellac is going to be interesting with high voltage. and it is alcohol solved so it will combine well enough with the oil so that oil won't be a problem.

I remember 2 water related things about shellac.

1- shellac makes a great water vapor barrier for first coat of paint in the north east.

2- when my mother shellaced the coffee table the shellac would always absorb enough water from the rim of a glass that there would be a ring. The ring would eventually fade, I think as the vapor evaporated.

I knew some violin makers that were testing what they thought to be ancient varnish. They were using linseed oil that had been allowed to polymerize for a while sitting in the sun in a window for 2 years etc.

Linseed oil has interesting properties when it comes to water too.

@Storre:
Did you have any luck with your nc reed switches? anything at all?


I may not contribute for a while, but I am still looking. I am building a ferro-cement greenhouse dome this summer and it is a lot of work. And while I plaster the cement I am thinking about e's and m's and HHO a little too.

thank you all,

jeanna

@Bill
Here is a link to info from a guy who made a working device in a style that sounds like what you were describing yesterday.

http://www.angelfire.com/ak5/energy21/hanscoler.htm

Hans Coler is his name.

go for it.!!

--
(Gary- I am making the greenhouse dome out of ferrocement in an attempt to hold some thermal mass. It shouldn't get over heated as all glass greenhouses do, and in the winter it should keep the sun's warmth for a longer time than glass.

I will have the windows directed to pick up more winter than summer sun.)
-------------
@ Storre,

I would like to ask you to try something I cannot do with my smaller coils.

If there is a spark gap that can flash a spark between the 2 wires called 10 then I think the natural resonance of the coil will come alive and the coil will produce an oscillation.

I tried this on my hollow coil. It had a fairly long set of wires but they were thin. I could never see a spark, but if the frequency is too high, and it may be, then it would be there but ubdetectable by my eyes etc. and without an oscilloscope, I cannot see it with an instrument.

My digital multimeter gives a hint that it may be there.

Anyway, since your coil is made of long and fattish wires, I am asking you to perform the experiment I cannot do (unless I invest in more wire.)

BTW, did you make a large secondary for that coil?

thank you,

jeanna