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Author Topic: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM  (Read 1218669 times)

futuristic

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #870 on: December 31, 2009, 12:47:10 PM »
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void109

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #871 on: December 31, 2009, 12:48:10 PM »
Resonant Frequency

Last post, promise!  I wanted to split these notions into separate messages since they had different related subjects.

Again, to be up front, I'm very new to most of this - learning as quickly as I can stuff information into my head.  And I wont shirk my duties with the ugly maths part of the learning curve!

Can you achieve saturation of a ferrite material with less current if you're hitting your coil with voltage tuned to the coils resonant frequency?  My scope wont be here for a week, and my excitement has left me impatient for answers. :)

I hope these questions aren't off topic too much, they are with steorn orbo replication in mind, and I'm hoping either their answers will help other replicators in their work, or at least let others with like thoughts dismiss them and stay on task.

Happy New Years
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void109

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #872 on: December 31, 2009, 12:50:47 PM »
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vince

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #873 on: December 31, 2009, 02:55:28 PM »
@ Exnihiloest

Actually the coils ARE wound around the toroid. The wall inner coils you speak of were removed and only the inner toroid coil remains. I have 4 of theses coils of varying sizes and they all have an  inner wall winding and also around the ring.

In the original experiment that I did the magnet was attracted by the ring and then released when energized. There is no push from the toroid.

Vince
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Groundloop

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #874 on: December 31, 2009, 03:43:40 PM »
All,

Do you remember the circuit drawing I posted back on page 55? I have started to build
it and will test the circuit. The two toroid ferrite core coils are glued to a center ferrite core.
The worst part is done (winding the two toroids) and now I have to wind the generator coil.

Alex.
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fleubis

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #875 on: December 31, 2009, 03:56:44 PM »
Quote from: Groundloop on December 31, 2009, 03:43:40 PM
All,

Do you remember the circuit drawing I posted back on page 55? I have started to build
it and will test the circuit. The two toroid ferrite core coils are glued to a center ferrite core.
The worst part is done (winding the two toroids) and now I have to wind the generator coil.

Alex.

Someone asked about the Rodin coil. This coil is an air-core item, but think of its implications in this design.

James
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Groundloop

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #876 on: December 31, 2009, 04:05:55 PM »
@fleubis,

My attempt is to try to make a solid state Orbo design. It has nothing to do
with a Rodin coil. So I do not understand your comment at all. My coils are
not air core. I use Ferrite as cores.

Alex.
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fleubis

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #877 on: December 31, 2009, 04:35:51 PM »
Quote from: Groundloop on December 31, 2009, 04:05:55 PM
@fleubis,

My attempt is to try to make a solid state Orbo design. It has nothing to do
with a Rodin coil. So I do not understand your comment at all. My coils are
not air core. I use Ferrite as cores.

Alex.
@Alex
My point is that a Rodin coil may work in place of the toroids in your design due to their strong magnetic field, however I have not built one on a ferrite core yet. Just food for thought.
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Staffman

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #878 on: December 31, 2009, 05:02:50 PM »
Quote from: Groundloop on December 31, 2009, 03:43:40 PM
All,

Do you remember the circuit drawing I posted back on page 55? I have started to build
it and will test the circuit. The two toroid ferrite core coils are glued to a center ferrite core.
The worst part is done (winding the two toroids) and now I have to wind the generator coil.

Alex.

I think this is going to be interesting. Good Work!

I'm wondering if Pulsed DC or AC will be better for the input? The output would be pulsed DC anyway correct? I'm thinking that AC would be better to desaturate the core completely so the magnetic fields would pass through easier. Someone please let me know if I'm thinking wrong. Thanks.
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Groundloop

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #879 on: December 31, 2009, 05:14:08 PM »
@fleubis,

OK, now I understand you. Maybe try that later on.

@Staffman,

I will use a mosfet switch to control both toroid coils.
The output should be pulsed DC or something. Don't
now yet.

Alex.
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wings

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #880 on: December 31, 2009, 05:33:30 PM »
Quote from: Groundloop on December 31, 2009, 03:43:40 PM
All,

Do you remember the circuit drawing I posted back on page 55? I have started to build
it and will test the circuit. The two toroid ferrite core coils are glued to a center ferrite core.
The worst part is done (winding the two toroid) and now I have to wind the generator coil.

Alex.

Nice device.....
from my side I have run my motor with single small toroid, reed and a fan rotor but ...too far to have low current.

From the second picture it seem that you have put the magnets inside not outside the toroids, the central part is the ferrite where you have to wind the output coil ?

with a single magnet (apart the toroid) it is close to the Kunel device see the following document.

http://www.intalek.com/Index/Projects/Patents/DE3024814.pdf

the Kunel ring design is also nice

lot of information on similar devices :

http://www.intalek.com/Papers/Handout3.pdf



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Groundloop

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #881 on: December 31, 2009, 05:54:59 PM »
@wings,

No, the magnets is not there yet. The magnets will be on the outside of the
toroids as shown in the drawing. I have seen the Kunel device and also tested
it some time back. I did not find any ou in the Kunel device.

Alex.
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Omega_0

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #882 on: December 31, 2009, 06:38:08 PM »
A simple mechanical switching method is shown here for those who don't want to mess with mosfets and circuits :)

Cut a triangle shape out of metal sheet (copper or any other) and glue it on a CD or disc of plastic/wood. Attach it to the rotor above or below it, it should rotate with rotor. Use two/four triangles if you have two/four coils.

Use an unshielded multi-strand mains wire as contacts to be placed above the CD on a support. Support should not rotate and should be fixed to shaft or something. One contact should be fixed near the center which will be return path.

You can vary the duty cycle by simply placing the other contact near or far from the center (0-100% on-time is possible). You can vary the phase by simply rotating the disc relative to the rotor by the amount of angle you need.

You will need a pot in the circuit to vary the current and a shunt for meters/scope. The disadvantage here is that it will spark if you are using high voltage. Advantage is that you don't need reed/hall effect sensor or opto sensor and complicated circuits.
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plengo

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #883 on: December 31, 2009, 08:41:34 PM »
When I think about the induced magnetic polarization in the toroid but no voltage induced on it  I become very puzzled why is that. Can someone explain or show where I can learn about that one effect?

One thing that comes to my mind about the rotor being attracted by the core of the toroid but once the toroid is energized and no longer there is an attraction by the rotor magnet, is the concept of a "magnetic diode".

It sounds like one can induce a magnetic flux on the toroid core from the rotor magnet but no voltage or current generated on the toroid at the same time that, a current and voltage on the toroid creates enough polarization on the core to avoid being attracted by the rotor's magnet.

It is like one way induction only.

I must be mistaken by my understanding of this effect.

Fausto.
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neptune

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Re: STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM
« Reply #884 on: December 31, 2009, 09:48:58 PM »
The way I think of it is this. When the toroid is energised , all the magnetism is contained
inside the core which forms its own tight closed magnetic circuit. Any relationship between the unenergised core and an external magnet is a very poor relation with an open magnetic circuit [5mm airgap] If this concept proves to be overunity ,then we may think of it as a "magnetic transistor" rather than a diode.{smal power controlls larger power] Not  very hi-tech answer, but may help you .
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