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News announcements and other topics => News => Topic started by: ramset on August 26, 2015, 02:37:49 PM

Title: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on August 26, 2015, 02:37:49 PM
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation.html?

Seems intriguing ??

thanks for looking and commenting

Chet K
 

 
 
 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: poynt99 on August 26, 2015, 03:42:10 PM
I'm curious what this NDA is all about.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: gravityblock on August 26, 2015, 04:44:15 PM
I'm curious what this NDA is all about.

He's more than likely hiding behind the NDA, and using the NDA as an escape goat for not posting any design drawings, images or to reveal any other so-called "privileged construction details".  Smoke and mirrors!

Gravock
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Cherryman on August 26, 2015, 04:49:41 PM
I'm curious what this NDA is all about.


Why?  What does it matter?... An NDA is just that: Non disclosure agreement.
Go to a juridical forum and discus it there.
Better, don't talk about it at all, those things do more harm then good. And we do not want to raise trouble for the poster.


The focus here should be on the design and replication.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Cherryman on August 26, 2015, 04:55:29 PM
He's more than likely hiding behind the NDA, and using the NDA as an escape goat for not posting any design drawings, images or to reveal any other so-called "privileged construction details".  Smoke and mirrors!

Gravock


Sure, lets judge first and think later.



Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: gravityblock on August 26, 2015, 05:40:29 PM

Sure, lets judge first and think later.

No, I thought first, then I made the appropriate decision to question the authenticity of the claim according to the possibility of him hiding behind a so-called NDA.  It is you who has not thought first, which opens yourself up to the possibility of being bamboozled and hoodwinked!

Gravock
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: gravityblock on August 26, 2015, 05:51:27 PM

Why?  What does it matter?... An NDA is just that: Non disclosure agreement.
Go to a juridical forum and discus it there.
Better, don't talk about it at all, those things do more harm then good. And we do not want to raise trouble for the poster.

The focus here should be on the design and replication.

The description he provided in the OP along with his subsequent postings in that thread would definitely be sufficient to be in violation of any NDA.  Thus, the NDA is B.S. along with his claim, a false claim in which he can't support with drawings, photos, videos, etc.

Gravock
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on August 26, 2015, 06:19:05 PM
Here we have an issue
I always try to give a man the benefit of the doubt whenever he is  "giving freely"

I never look a gift horse in the mouth.,.

Perhaps a discussion about content instead of context would be more appropriate here??

Respectfully
Chet K
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: gravityblock on August 26, 2015, 06:25:41 PM
Here we have an issue
I always try to give a man the benefit of the doubt whenever he is  "giving freely"

I never look a gift horse in the mouth.,.

Perhaps a discussion about content instead of context would be more appropriate here??

Respectfully
Chet K

Or, should we say a discussion on the lack of content.  No design drawings, no construction details, no photos, no videos, no reference links, etc.  <----- How is this 'giving freely' and how is this 'content'?

Good luck with this!

Gravock
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on August 26, 2015, 06:57:15 PM
"good luck with this"

Yes that works too ....

  For those who are interested in this brutally simple presentation ?

Macks latest comment
QUOTE
""For now, picture this. We have a 2 pole rotor and the attraction is balanced to the repulsion. You can rotate the rotor by hand and feel very little or no cogging. You stick a ramp at one side of the attracting stator magnet. As the attracted rotor magnet comes under the influence of the ramp it accelerates. As it accelerates toward the stator magnet, it also gains inertia. The stator magnet also attracts, but the stator magnets attraction is being neutralized by the repelling magnets at the opposite side of the motor. The rotor inertia carries the rotor magnet fully under and slightly past the attracting stator magnets center line. At this same instant, the rotor magnet at the opposite side, 180 degrees away has traveled slightly past the center line of the repelling stator magnet, which is now doing its job and preventing the attracted rotor magnet from being dragged back under its attracting stator magnet. The rotor is free wheeling at this point. Inertia continues the rotation until the rotor magnets come under the influence of the next set of ramps and the cycle repeats.

Mack """
END QUOTE
from here
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation.html?


Chet K
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: DreamThinkBuild on August 26, 2015, 07:39:26 PM
Hi Chet,

Thanks for the update. I whipped up a quick interpretation from MadMack's last post of using just two pairs of magnets. Could be wrong but may give a starting point.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: gravityblock on August 26, 2015, 10:03:16 PM
Hi Chet,

Thanks for the update. I whipped up a quick interpretation from MadMack's last post of using just two pairs of magnets. Could be wrong but may give a starting point.

Here's another variation.

Gravock
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on August 26, 2015, 10:03:29 PM
Demand to see a working prototype! Of course there isn't one to see.
But anyone with experience in these matters can see that the descriptions don't describe anything that would actually work.

"But like an internal combustion engine, various things have to be precisely tuned for it to work."
This is a false analogy... because we have seen working examples of ICEs, we know the tuning parameters and they make sense. Not so for this "sincere gentleman's" magic magnet motor. There is no working prototype, no coherent theory of operation, and plenty of history of similar systems that don't work.

And before people start insulting me.... PROVE ME WRONG by showing a working prototype, even inside a black box with only the output shaft shown driving a load. Do that, then you can insult me all you like. I'll not be holding my breath though. 

What kind of NDA prevents that, but allows all these claims and detailed descriptions of the _idea_? None that I've ever seen, and I've seen and signed a few in my time.  NDA means "non-disclosure agreement". What part of "non-disclosure" is difficult to understand?
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: MWestland on August 27, 2015, 12:11:48 AM
Anyone who says they can't share schematics or drawings, and then proceeds to tell HOW to build something is someone who has a half assed idea and is too CHEAP to build it themselves. Of course that's MY opinion. It would be nice if this is for real, and there are some on the other forum who are attempting to replicate, but without clear instructions, there's not much chance they would be successful even if it were for real.  I guess we will just have to wait and see what comes of this, but I won't get too excited until things are made much more clear.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on August 27, 2015, 12:16:43 AM
Tinsel
If I were to write a sentence ...and the sentence were some part of an NDA ,my obligation to secrecy COULD be as small as the period at the end of the sentence.

you use too broad a brush and ass-u-me way too much[as it applies to the NDA comment].

For myself I am just paying attention ,with appreciation.

Mack is a Smart fellow with a level head and some really cool ideas.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: lumen on August 27, 2015, 01:39:08 AM
I usually suspect claims of operation when one talks of requiring some fine adjustment or difference in field strength to just get it to operate.
If there was a way to get a magnet motor to operate then with the powerful magnets today, it should operate very well and the fine adjustment would need not be so fine. Those words are claims of failure.
 
 
 
 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on August 27, 2015, 03:22:14 AM
Tinsel
If I were to write a sentence ...and the sentence were some part of an NDA ,my obligation to secrecy COULD be as small as the period at the end of the sentence.

you use too broad a brush and ass-u-me way too much[as it applies to the NDA comment].

For myself I am just paying attention ,with appreciation.

Mack is a Smart fellow with a level head and some really cool ideas.

Then he should present his ideas as ideas, instead of pretending to have the "secret" -- under NDA yet! -- which will save the world. But of course we know that he _does not_ have any working self-running prototype. He may have simply fooled himself by having a flywheel that turns for a long time on good bearings, that he thinks could be developed and "tuned" to self-run... or he may be cynically manipulating people like you who always see the best in people. Either way, he does not have a design that will self-run, and I'm not the only one telling you this.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Paul-R on August 27, 2015, 06:09:02 PM
Hi Chet,

Thanks for the update. I whipped up a quick interpretation from MadMack's last post of using just two pairs of magnets. Could be wrong but may give a starting point.
If this is what it is (page 1, #10), then it is a reworking of Paul Sprain's patent or the Takahashi motor on Bearden's site.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: DreamThinkBuild on August 27, 2015, 07:01:34 PM
Hi Paul,

Yes it's pretty similar to the Takahashi motor, the neutralization is altered from electromagnet to neutrally balanced magnets.

Hi Gravityblock,

Thanks, haven't seen that design before. There are a lot of patents that have variations on the theme. Don't want to go off topic though. Attached is one that has fixed magnets with a spoked soft iron rotor. The spokes become polarized by the fixed magnets and pull down the magnetic ramp(N) where they neutralize with the opposite pole at the exit.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on August 28, 2015, 02:11:13 PM
Mack added some comments
from here http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-2.html (http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-2.html)
Mack
 Quote
 Hi guys,

Sorry I couldn't get back before now. Dave, Turion, seems to have the best grasp of this so far. Chet,[**Note DTB's schem being referred to 1st one] the ramps in the concept picture you posted have two problems. They are way too long so the rate of change is very little, which kills the torque. The second problem, which we haven't touched upon yet, is that each ramp in that picture connects two stator magnets. You have to take magnetic induction in the ramps into account. Having a stator magnet touching at each end of the ramp turns the ramp into a bar magnet with strong NS poles, and interferes with things. We want the ramp close to or touching only one magnet at the end of the ramp like the Bedini drawing. Remember that the flux always takes the path of least resistance, so as a rotor magnet passes a stator magnet you need a space before the beginning of the next ramp. The distance of this space varies with magnet strengths but a rule of thumb is a minimum of 1.5 to 2 times the gap between the rotor magnet and the ramp, at its widest point. In my 8 pole motor, with magnets every 45 degrees, the ramp length was about 30 degrees. Yours may be a little different.

Magnet shunts. Dave, I believe I said you do not want to shunt the attracting magnets the way the Bedini picture shows. Remember how I said that as a rotor magnet is accelerating towards an attracting magnet, the repelling magnets at the opposite side were neutralizing the pull of the attracting magnet? A shunt on the repelling stator magnet similar to the Bedini drawing will kill some of this neutralization and add to the torque. You only need the neutralizing action of the repelling magnets after they pass their center lines. Any neutralizing affect you can eliminate before that point is beneficial. Likewise reducing back drag attraction on the attracting set, with a shunt on the other side of this magnet from its ramp, can also benefit. I can not provide details on the shape of the shunts or any spacings they may have. Look at the Bedini picture for ideas. Too big of a shunt will make things worse.

Guys, the 2 pole rig is not a good motor. Think of it as 2 poles of an 8 pole motor. It's best used to figure out how to balance the forces and develop the ramp design and shunts. Use short ramps like you would have on an 8 pole motor. What you want to shoot for is the most acceleration along the ramp and past the stator poles. It's much easier to see and measure the results with 2 poles. When you have the best results you can get, then add and tune two more poles at a time until it's a complete motor. When the second set of poles are added you may end up tweaking the ramp length to get the optimum spacing.

Mario, the rotation of my magnets was not 45 degrees. The exact angle depends on the rake of the ramp so you may want to try between 30 and 45 degrees.

One more point tonight. My motors were not complete self starters. They had dead spots. They needed a start just like a gas engine and a small flywheel also helped.

T-1000, I did the concept builds more than a year ago and those are long gone. My NDA prohibits making public any images or demonstrations related to the design anyway and I will not risk that. I'm skating on the edge as it is.

Mack From here
Post # 36
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-2.html (http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-2.html)

Chet
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on August 28, 2015, 04:58:24 PM
Tinsel
I must say something here ,you state that people get nasty with you because of your comments.
why is it not obvious to you that "Your" comments would be considered by most readers "nasty" or "first blood" in most barrooms across planet earth ?
I always treat a man as if I'm sitting across the table from him and give him the benefit of the doubt ,If I were to say what you just wrote about my guest [basically a lying manipulative conman]we would most likely be finishing the conversation off with somebody getting a knuckle sandwhich instead of a cheeseburger.
 
I prefer cheeseburgers whenever possible  :o ...and no I will not bet you "yet" [a cheeseburger bet]

respectfully
Chet K

PS
thx for all the comments and input
on this one.
 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on August 28, 2015, 05:29:01 PM
Tinsel
I must say something here ,you state that people get nasty with you because of your comments.
why is it not obvious to you that "Your" comments would be considered by most readers "nasty" or "first blood" in most barrooms across planet earth ?
I always treat a man as if I'm sitting across the table from him and give him the benefit of the doubt ,If I were to say what you just wrote about my guest [basically a lying manipulative conman]we would most likely be finishing the conversation off with somebody getting a knuckle sandwhich instead of a cheeseburger.
 
I prefer cheeseburgers whenever possible  :o ...and no I will not bet you "yet" [a cheeseburger bet]

respectfully
Chet K

PS
thx for all the comments and input
on this one.

Hey, I call them as I see them. The "gentleman" in question is claiming to have the Big Secret and is acting like he actually has (or HAD, now they are "long gone") a working prototype, but he refuses to show it due to some "NDA". Yes, I'm calling him out. He should PROVE HIS CLAIMS, or stfu. I know that what he has described will not work to produce a self running permanent magnet motor, and because I know this, I believe he is another one like we have seen here before, claiming to have what he does not have in order to stir up a following, or hoping that someone else will solve his last little problem and come up with a self runner that he can't make himself. That doesn't fit into the "gentleman" category in my book. But consider just how easy it would be to PROVE ME WRONG. All he has to do is to show a video of a Black Box with a shaft sticking out of it, turning and turning and turning, and allow someone like you to sign an NDA and see the inner guts, and certify to the rest of us that it is indeed working as represented.

Ever play poker? Do you get into a fistfight when someone calls your bluff?  I want to see the cards, that's all.  You can turn the issue around and call me an inconsiderate bastard troll if you want to, but that won't change the FACTS: someone is claiming to have something that would literally change the world and turn Physics on its ear, but isn't willing to provide proof of it -- yet he wants to hold court and discuss it.  And I know why he won't provide proof: he cannot, because he doesn't have any proof. His design is just a concept, and one that has been disproved many times over already.

When someone sits at my table and looks me in the eye and proceeds to lie to me... well, let's just say that he won't be invited back.  Unless we are playing poker and he is bluffing, which is part of that game. Bluffing is NOT part of this Free Energy game, though. Or at least it shouldn't be. If he has a concept that he is trying to test and develop, fine, all I can say about that is that it won't work. If he actually has a selfrunning prototype, that's fine too, if he can demonstrate it. I can, or you can, or Mark Dansie can make him rich, while at the same time starting a whole new branch of physics. If he is only _pretending_ to have a self runner, and is giving us the runaround, that is NOT fine and I'll be as aggressive as I can be in my efforts to expose the false claim.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: shylo on August 29, 2015, 12:15:47 AM
If he offsets the balance it will stick at the stronger point,unless the inertia is stronger than the unbalance, but I think it will still find balance.
I can make a magnet climb 16 inches but the attraction at that height locks it up solid, it won't drop.
Levers can cause movement ,but getting it to loop  is the hard part.
I hope Mac is right and I'm wrong.
artv
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: poynt99 on August 29, 2015, 03:38:25 AM
TK,

I'm not taking sides or inferring anything, but what IF Mack's story is true. What IF he has or had a self runner, but sold out and now can not disclose its inner workings? Is that not a possibility?

It is a bit odd however that he seems to be providing a fair number of clues, and if I was the NDA holder, I might be a little weary right about now.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on August 29, 2015, 03:46:48 AM
TK,

I'm not taking sides or inferring anything, but what IF Mack's story is true. What IF he has or had a self runner, but sold out and now can not disclose its inner workings? Is that not a possibility?

It is a bit odd however that he seems to be providing a fair number of clues, and if I was the NDA holder, I might be a little weary right about now.

.99:

I believe that is exactly what TK was talking about here.  Of course, he can speak for himself.  I too have signed NDA's and if I even mentioned ANY part of what was being protected by the NDA on a public forum, all hell would break loose.  Just disclosing the idea itself could indeed be a violation of the NDA depending upon its wording.

Just my 2.365 cents.

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: poynt99 on August 29, 2015, 04:00:37 AM
Mack says this about his NDA:

Quote
My NDA prohibits making public any images or demonstrations related to the design anyway and I will not risk that. I'm skating on the edge as it is.

If that is what the NDA really states, then describing it in words would be permitted.

Not a very good NDA imo.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on August 29, 2015, 04:10:53 AM
Mack says this about his NDA:

If that is what the NDA really states, then describing it in words would be permitted.

Not a very good NDA imo.

True.  If that is indeed in the language then...it might make sense.  I wonder if publishing the actual NDA is a violation of the NDA?

I suppose it depends on what it says, ha ha.

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: gravityblock on August 29, 2015, 07:04:28 AM
I think Mack is a victim of a scam.  The photos and videos were more than likely a hoax from the trickster, which the trickster used to convince Mack to buy into.  The NDA is protecting the scammer, IMO.  I seriously doubt the NDA holder, is a little weary right about now.  As long as Mack doesn't release any visuals, then nothing can be connected to the trickster, and his identity will be safe.

Did you know you can search by image on google (http://www.google.com/search?tbs=sbi:AMhZZit2hP82a-RxRp8MUCb2cjbIkhTdfAiy7qGd05FPxV-ggls613Z8YXzxUt5sFVlXUIQKuELK5-rUGWolU-_1Y6IqfuDatU5mp_1rdnQjo28q-27hCcvT8jEeFGQm9gpTflIVSUwW6B-t8hdIXRix9wY9XAL6A9E9ZyIGhyWYFPYbrk6WlFzhnD0nA7HGiJSsG0vDLqNLU0Cdv16Ixgaiialnu8dV33voyUA-BhGqOHlUuGxgeRr4ikgn-SaEo8oyaiFMqEkAM5mImpuMdTIL6IXALgFQhblswFQ2Vb2PtoBFhZ4V3JAh9i46O-DGDZZ8aggSSNzN4jY2NIzOIG508s8cscw0MJVigbbEiQUzLrbHeoTgWMpAiHD9MLS8BcNWReKQWsPUZIaZCmsU_19uVtcpfwandliW_1NCYcSIfwZAN32s_1eVLzYu2fFd1fzwqXRqhRdk4zf9PITVeMr_1l0lEmKQ1Eo6io4IIObyNVsjMCclcEzqzWs_14jmXK2zT8Ry4Ip2L6HmbWgWbz21vM9Fk3DZIFJ2hNuTshDpgRbOtDiDkf7lu8UKeSfFxRDzYTXWtzgM4f0E6NKGf1yGOnryVYN3Ir_184UkXByHg7OcjeO2A_1zy3Dzz2Bwmp2VaEv5K_1M5Emj74TLK23YVNPqG7YgMYcl3Top3by5EaCOQGSjqfVlnbES2w6J8vVKOmJhc9FOjcRUrTKSIi1DgfLin5A_1S8kmIN6MRbgUZjU3FSdo0ZHXCNGr5njPvL4VVoh6cFdLoq1vC2-FB15Wmu_1TvGtwuNRY5UgCFxGAV4vogndFYjdL2Lb21pSi_1vF-8Gc66qI7I3aguOaYUpAiHniBXVOGr_1wIWlRARLL6A8mQQgyd1lfJaHgqy0Lp_1l68XCHISpRTohdB56BJgd25yMqbYPcjr9tpX9mveRxuRwx957BRUx82UpaW-7XY3nIW2u4sMBkG1IUz1ZZjIAOJSDJFatvbzMjVHGYCvwWi3c2XLD0tfbjABmV4cyrvTxTqCtRiHaaEM6fO_1iwE8IYyTk_1_1Nm9-ajxQRAlwqZ5GTxArhgbCn_12pkvy-eyI_1hBAAvOj_1q4tv65Zb3fEvh8wWLSqrC_17tR1ln4o5vmEWBMfasQmiEntVzKv7UKpoYjUTqtsUCgvid4TZfPFePbQxmEqkAyg6k0Y9oy7CR4NnwLR-HwbR7_1C6C4Vzhs4PqeUGq-DK7YlUcwyydbBlzi-Wn69FM_1I42G-uEH4DHL9tIar6JtB-YxHnDmn1xzJTUehOQtSJCykQOvUbmtstiwXlrp0FX40Fjn5spUmD51rfAp6HlkVoFo_1aT1iRWK2m7Zbh-bPsS6rAULOHaB2Fog8KbudXm958N_1sCWoN_1ivSOKmMxNk46hd0gjsZi_1YQMpXOyj2Mm149Xqs5aXwBPyMPVNDuKpjDRucjzaWu1e8zco7LayNxEF1WXrPCLUfp2TQbwIAS0seMuVLSuUPuVhxROmlV2bbtv253LIrfml2hwq-mci2i-3cSrrensBrCnib2CE5643ItqSNDZEZ8c7V3&hl=en)?  <----- Below is a picture of Lisa Haven, and the link is doing a search on that picture.  Google returned the correct name of the person, and even returned visually similar pictures of her, as we see in the search by image example above.  In google, select images, then drag and drop pictures into the search box.  Or, click on the camera icon inside the search box and paste the image url or upload an image.  I've given up one of my research techniques.

Gravock
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on August 29, 2015, 07:34:49 AM
I think Mack is a victim of a scam.  The photos and videos were more than likely a hoax from the trickster, which the trickster used to convince Mack to buy into.  The NDA is protecting the scammer, IMO.  I seriously doubt the NDA holder, is a little weary right about now.  As long as Mack doesn't release any visuals, then nothing can be connected to the trickster, and his identity will be safe.

Did you know you can search by image on google (http://www.google.com/search?tbs=sbi:AMhZZit2hP82a-RxRp8MUCb2cjbIkhTdfAiy7qGd05FPxV-ggls613Z8YXzxUt5sFVlXUIQKuELK5-rUGWolU-_1Y6IqfuDatU5mp_1rdnQjo28q-27hCcvT8jEeFGQm9gpTflIVSUwW6B-t8hdIXRix9wY9XAL6A9E9ZyIGhyWYFPYbrk6WlFzhnD0nA7HGiJSsG0vDLqNLU0Cdv16Ixgaiialnu8dV33voyUA-BhGqOHlUuGxgeRr4ikgn-SaEo8oyaiFMqEkAM5mImpuMdTIL6IXALgFQhblswFQ2Vb2PtoBFhZ4V3JAh9i46O-DGDZZ8aggSSNzN4jY2NIzOIG508s8cscw0MJVigbbEiQUzLrbHeoTgWMpAiHD9MLS8BcNWReKQWsPUZIaZCmsU_19uVtcpfwandliW_1NCYcSIfwZAN32s_1eVLzYu2fFd1fzwqXRqhRdk4zf9PITVeMr_1l0lEmKQ1Eo6io4IIObyNVsjMCclcEzqzWs_14jmXK2zT8Ry4Ip2L6HmbWgWbz21vM9Fk3DZIFJ2hNuTshDpgRbOtDiDkf7lu8UKeSfFxRDzYTXWtzgM4f0E6NKGf1yGOnryVYN3Ir_184UkXByHg7OcjeO2A_1zy3Dzz2Bwmp2VaEv5K_1M5Emj74TLK23YVNPqG7YgMYcl3Top3by5EaCOQGSjqfVlnbES2w6J8vVKOmJhc9FOjcRUrTKSIi1DgfLin5A_1S8kmIN6MRbgUZjU3FSdo0ZHXCNGr5njPvL4VVoh6cFdLoq1vC2-FB15Wmu_1TvGtwuNRY5UgCFxGAV4vogndFYjdL2Lb21pSi_1vF-8Gc66qI7I3aguOaYUpAiHniBXVOGr_1wIWlRARLL6A8mQQgyd1lfJaHgqy0Lp_1l68XCHISpRTohdB56BJgd25yMqbYPcjr9tpX9mveRxuRwx957BRUx82UpaW-7XY3nIW2u4sMBkG1IUz1ZZjIAOJSDJFatvbzMjVHGYCvwWi3c2XLD0tfbjABmV4cyrvTxTqCtRiHaaEM6fO_1iwE8IYyTk_1_1Nm9-ajxQRAlwqZ5GTxArhgbCn_12pkvy-eyI_1hBAAvOj_1q4tv65Zb3fEvh8wWLSqrC_17tR1ln4o5vmEWBMfasQmiEntVzKv7UKpoYjUTqtsUCgvid4TZfPFePbQxmEqkAyg6k0Y9oy7CR4NnwLR-HwbR7_1C6C4Vzhs4PqeUGq-DK7YlUcwyydbBlzi-Wn69FM_1I42G-uEH4DHL9tIar6JtB-YxHnDmn1xzJTUehOQtSJCykQOvUbmtstiwXlrp0FX40Fjn5spUmD51rfAp6HlkVoFo_1aT1iRWK2m7Zbh-bPsS6rAULOHaB2Fog8KbudXm958N_1sCWoN_1ivSOKmMxNk46hd0gjsZi_1YQMpXOyj2Mm149Xqs5aXwBPyMPVNDuKpjDRucjzaWu1e8zco7LayNxEF1WXrPCLUfp2TQbwIAS0seMuVLSuUPuVhxROmlV2bbtv253LIrfml2hwq-mci2i-3cSrrensBrCnib2CE5643ItqSNDZEZ8c7V3&hl=en)?  <----- Below is a picture of Lisa Haven, and the link is doing a search on that picture.  Google returned the correct name of the person, and even returned visually similar pictures of her, as we see in the search by image example above.  In google, select images, then drag and drop pictures into the search box.  Or, click on the camera icon inside the search box and paste the image url or upload an image.  I've given up one of my research techniques.

Gravock

Wow!  Thanks for the tip.  I thought I was pretty good at using google but, I just learned something I did not know.

Thanks.

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on August 29, 2015, 11:58:12 AM
I think Mack is a victim of a scam.  The photos and videos were more than likely a hoax from the trickster, which the trickster used to convince Mack to buy into.  The NDA is protecting the scammer, IMO.  I seriously doubt the NDA holder, is a little weary right about now.  As long as Mack doesn't release any visuals, then nothing can be connected to the trickster, and his identity will be safe.

Did you know you can search by image on google (http://www.google.com/search?tbs=sbi:AMhZZit2hP82a-RxRp8MUCb2cjbIkhTdfAiy7qGd05FPxV-ggls613Z8YXzxUt5sFVlXUIQKuELK5-rUGWolU-_1Y6IqfuDatU5mp_1rdnQjo28q-27hCcvT8jEeFGQm9gpTflIVSUwW6B-t8hdIXRix9wY9XAL6A9E9ZyIGhyWYFPYbrk6WlFzhnD0nA7HGiJSsG0vDLqNLU0Cdv16Ixgaiialnu8dV33voyUA-BhGqOHlUuGxgeRr4ikgn-SaEo8oyaiFMqEkAM5mImpuMdTIL6IXALgFQhblswFQ2Vb2PtoBFhZ4V3JAh9i46O-DGDZZ8aggSSNzN4jY2NIzOIG508s8cscw0MJVigbbEiQUzLrbHeoTgWMpAiHD9MLS8BcNWReKQWsPUZIaZCmsU_19uVtcpfwandliW_1NCYcSIfwZAN32s_1eVLzYu2fFd1fzwqXRqhRdk4zf9PITVeMr_1l0lEmKQ1Eo6io4IIObyNVsjMCclcEzqzWs_14jmXK2zT8Ry4Ip2L6HmbWgWbz21vM9Fk3DZIFJ2hNuTshDpgRbOtDiDkf7lu8UKeSfFxRDzYTXWtzgM4f0E6NKGf1yGOnryVYN3Ir_184UkXByHg7OcjeO2A_1zy3Dzz2Bwmp2VaEv5K_1M5Emj74TLK23YVNPqG7YgMYcl3Top3by5EaCOQGSjqfVlnbES2w6J8vVKOmJhc9FOjcRUrTKSIi1DgfLin5A_1S8kmIN6MRbgUZjU3FSdo0ZHXCNGr5njPvL4VVoh6cFdLoq1vC2-FB15Wmu_1TvGtwuNRY5UgCFxGAV4vogndFYjdL2Lb21pSi_1vF-8Gc66qI7I3aguOaYUpAiHniBXVOGr_1wIWlRARLL6A8mQQgyd1lfJaHgqy0Lp_1l68XCHISpRTohdB56BJgd25yMqbYPcjr9tpX9mveRxuRwx957BRUx82UpaW-7XY3nIW2u4sMBkG1IUz1ZZjIAOJSDJFatvbzMjVHGYCvwWi3c2XLD0tfbjABmV4cyrvTxTqCtRiHaaEM6fO_1iwE8IYyTk_1_1Nm9-ajxQRAlwqZ5GTxArhgbCn_12pkvy-eyI_1hBAAvOj_1q4tv65Zb3fEvh8wWLSqrC_17tR1ln4o5vmEWBMfasQmiEntVzKv7UKpoYjUTqtsUCgvid4TZfPFePbQxmEqkAyg6k0Y9oy7CR4NnwLR-HwbR7_1C6C4Vzhs4PqeUGq-DK7YlUcwyydbBlzi-Wn69FM_1I42G-uEH4DHL9tIar6JtB-YxHnDmn1xzJTUehOQtSJCykQOvUbmtstiwXlrp0FX40Fjn5spUmD51rfAp6HlkVoFo_1aT1iRWK2m7Zbh-bPsS6rAULOHaB2Fog8KbudXm958N_1sCWoN_1ivSOKmMxNk46hd0gjsZi_1YQMpXOyj2Mm149Xqs5aXwBPyMPVNDuKpjDRucjzaWu1e8zco7LayNxEF1WXrPCLUfp2TQbwIAS0seMuVLSuUPuVhxROmlV2bbtv253LIrfml2hwq-mci2i-3cSrrensBrCnib2CE5643ItqSNDZEZ8c7V3&hl=en)?  <----- Below is a picture of Lisa Haven, and the link is doing a search on that picture.  Google returned the correct name of the person, and even returned visually similar pictures of her, as we see in the search by image example above.  In google, select images, then drag and drop pictures into the search box.  Or, click on the camera icon inside the search box and paste the image url or upload an image.  I've given up one of my research techniques.

Gravock

Which photos and videos do you mean?

And who is Lisa Haven?
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: gravityblock on August 29, 2015, 12:24:46 PM
Which photos and videos do you mean?

And who is Lisa Haven?

The photos, videos, design drawings, etc. that Mack can't release for being in violation of his "so-called" NDA.  If he was scammed, then he was more than likely shown photos and videos to fraudulently convince him of the authenticity of the device.  However, this doesn't mean Mack himself has any photos, videos, design drawings, etc.

Lisa Haven is an avid research analyst.

Gravock
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Paul-R on August 30, 2015, 04:27:07 PM
Hey, I call them as I see them. The "gentleman" in question is claiming to have the Big Secret and is acting like he actually has (or HAD, now they are "long gone") a working prototype, but he refuses to show it due to some "NDA".
.
The bottom line is that our open source work and commercial NDA attitudes don't mix.
.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on September 01, 2015, 09:15:23 PM
Mack has added a reference for reading [Daniel Davis ??]


http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-3.html

please have a look
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on September 02, 2015, 03:41:20 AM
"Sometimes if you have nuttin nice to say its better to not say anything at all" [Quote from "Thumper" ]

here is a fellow who is more action than Talk ,Member  Turion from Energetic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQbpTtBfZX8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmG0ZXgTIhA
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dbowling on September 02, 2015, 04:10:38 AM
ramset,
Those are my videos you posted. I am not saying this works. But I am seeing some interesting things here. I will be spending a lot more time with it before I jump to any conclusions either positive OR negative. Too early for me to judge. I haven't even got it balanced yet.


Dave
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on September 02, 2015, 04:58:53 AM
You are wasting your time, money and creative juices.

You should demand to see some evidence of a working prototype from the claimant, before you do anything else.

And of course you will never see such evidence. As time goes on and the discussion continues, you will begin to question the whole "NDA" story as well.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dbowling on September 02, 2015, 05:18:03 AM
No, what I SHOULD do is take the time to decide for myself whether or not there is anything to this. I'm not taking HIS word that there is, and I'm not taking YOUR word that there isn't. I will say that the NDA story sounded fishy to me from the word go, but that's neither here nor there. I will investigate this because I have a mind of my own, and there was enough different about his explanation from what I have seen before to interest me. Why in the WORLD would you want me to stop right now? The only person with anything to lose here is me, and it's just time that I enjoy spending on this kind of stuff. Every single part I used was already in my shop, so it hasn't cost me a penny so far. l will prove it to my own satisfaction, or disprove it and video it for everyone to see. There are too many people who spend all their time here arguing that things cannot possibly work rather than spend a couple hours to see for themselves because they believe they already know. What I have ALREADY seen has given me some understanding of the relationships between magnets and what happens when you change the orientation between bodies of like polarities, so I am learning new things every step of the way. You can't put a price on knowledge. Whether this works or NOT, and I'm NOT saying it will, I have learned a few things that I can apply in other situations.


Dave
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: SoManyWires on September 02, 2015, 11:05:47 AM
No, what I SHOULD do is take the time to decide for myself whether or not there is anything to this. I'm not taking HIS word that there is, and I'm not taking YOUR word that there isn't. I will say that the NDA story sounded fishy to me from the word go, but that's neither here nor there. I will investigate this because I have a mind of my own, and there was enough different about his explanation from what I have seen before to interest me. Why in the WORLD would you want me to stop right now? The only person with anything to lose here is me, and it's just time that I enjoy spending on this kind of stuff. Every single part I used was already in my shop, so it hasn't cost me a penny so far. l will prove it to my own satisfaction, or disprove it and video it for everyone to see. There are too many people who spend all their time here arguing that things cannot possibly work rather than spend a couple hours to see for themselves because they believe they already know. What I have ALREADY seen has given me some understanding of the relationships between magnets and what happens when you change the orientation between bodies of like polarities, so I am learning new things every step of the way. You can't put a price on knowledge. Whether this works or NOT, and I'm NOT saying it will, I have learned a few things that I can apply in other situations.


Dave

well said.

nothing works, when nothing is built.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Cherryman on September 02, 2015, 11:31:03 AM
No, what I SHOULD do is take the time to decide for myself whether or not there is anything to this. I'm not taking HIS word that there is, and I'm not taking YOUR word that there isn't. I will say that the NDA story sounded fishy to me from the word go, but that's neither here nor there. I will investigate this because I have a mind of my own, and there was enough different about his explanation from what I have seen before to interest me. Why in the WORLD would you want me to stop right now? The only person with anything to lose here is me, and it's just time that I enjoy spending on this kind of stuff. Every single part I used was already in my shop, so it hasn't cost me a penny so far. l will prove it to my own satisfaction, or disprove it and video it for everyone to see. There are too many people who spend all their time here arguing that things cannot possibly work rather than spend a couple hours to see for themselves because they believe they already know. What I have ALREADY seen has given me some understanding of the relationships between magnets and what happens when you change the orientation between bodies of like polarities, so I am learning new things every step of the way. You can't put a price on knowledge. Whether this works or NOT, and I'm NOT saying it will, I have learned a few things that I can apply in other situations.


Dave


Excellent statement !
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on September 02, 2015, 02:21:39 PM
Dave
I forgot who you were  :-[

Sigh... Too much data in my small skull....

But I must add ,I'm happy to have been reminded [your a cool Guy]

Chet K
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on September 02, 2015, 05:11:08 PM
Of course you are free to waste your time and money however you like. I just think it's a damned shame, that's all. This very same story has been repeated time and time again, with someone claiming some effect and getting others all excited about it, when the original claimant can't even produce the effect claimed him(her)self. This is a tremendous source of ego gratification to the original claimant, and not much else.

Here's a great example:
www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/11885-my-asymmetric-electrodynamic-machines-95.html#post218245 (http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/11885-my-asymmetric-electrodynamic-machines-95.html#post218245)

That thread is _still_ going on today, and not a single Joule of excess energy has been produced, but many people have wasted lots of time and money. No self runners, no powering of one's home or shop, but mounds and piles of blown components and heavy doorstops not good for anything... except UFOPolitics's ego.
Other examples can easily be found, such as the FTW QEG scam, and EMJunkie's erroneous claims based on ignorance and false measurements.

Go ahead, Dave, work on this "sincere gentleman's" system to your heart's content. Nothing I can do or say will be able to prevent you. But I guarantee you will never achieve a self runner or produce any excess energy from permanent magnets -- not only because sound physics precludes it, but also because even the original claimant hasn't got what he claims to have had at one time.  But at least it will keep you off the streets. 

Be sure and report your findings here!
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dbowling on September 02, 2015, 08:03:40 PM
Thanks TinselKoala,
Glad I have your permission Don't know what I would do without it.


I just DO NOT understand it. I thought these sites were places for folks to bring their ideas so others could replicate and prove or disprove the claims, and perhaps even make contributions. Instead every idea that is brought here is ripped to shreds by the naysayers without giving it half a chance.


Personally, I have a REAL problem with folks who come on the sites and claim to have something without showing at MINIMUM a half assed working model, because that usually means they had some wet dream about something and want others to go to the effort and expense of building it, and I have NO USE for those people. None. Zip. Nada. But if someone shows a working model and believes they have something, I believe we owe them the courtesy and respect of at least replicating before we rip it to shreds. And perhaps giving them the chance to show us where the error was in our construction.


If we can't do that, we might as well just post a big banner on the front page of this site that says "THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS COP>1" and close the site down.


My home base has pretty much been Energetic Forum, simply because there are more people there I have working relationships with and communicate with outside the forum. But THAT forum has been taken over by people who do nothing but post YouTube videos and theorize about why things can't work or should work.


NOBODY builds anything anymore. It's a damn shame. People might learn a thing or two that isn't in the textbooks. And it isn't that I believe the textbooks are wrong. I just believe they don't tell the whole story. They do NOT explain some of the things I have seen.


Dave
[size=78%] [/size]
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on September 02, 2015, 09:51:40 PM
David
I have an opinion on this lack of experimenters .
TeslaTronics
this may not mean anything to you.. however we had Loads of experiments here in years past and lots of sharing and
contributions from many different members and then one day some Punk From Jersey [TeslaTronics] took the combined work
of all those members here and claimed it as his own and did a fund raiser ,did very well for himself.....

Not so well for the rest of us...

while it is just one silly example it shined a very brite light on a very big issue here , and oddly it really shouldn't be an issue at an open source web site however
IT IS AN ISSUE !!

"SOME" people have no conscience and really would steal candy from a baby ,and laugh all the way.

and when you realize that there are those out here reading this who would steal and lock you out of your own ideas [and everybody else too]
it is like a bucket of ice water to this whole open source process ,

IT SUCKS !!

however I was speaking with Jim Boot today about that very topic and He said Russ G had some fool proof way of keeping Dirtbags Like Teslatronics from harvesting the work of many as their own...
perhaps he will add some comments here.??

however I must add my own experiences here ,recently it became quite obvious that Patenting or business ventures associated with a true free energy devices will never be aloud to fly in this world.

going to the patent office or any government authority to insure your Rights to an over unity invention is like handing a very big man a stick to beat you with

So its open source or nothing at this time..





 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dbowling on September 02, 2015, 10:47:08 PM
Steal from me all you want. If you make some money off my ideas but I do not, it does not matter to me as long as the IDEAS get out there. We should not let the actions of a few prevent this research from going forward. What goes around comes around. Someone who would do what that individual did has a black place where their soul should be, and they will never find true happiness. I, on the other hand, wake up so happy with my life every day that I probably annoy people around me.
I had a couple new ideas based on what I have seen with this simple machine, and while it may or may not be a working device, it has given me two very different directions to explore. BOTH of which should be interesting, and one of which I can't find ANY research on at all on the internet, which leads me to believe I may have really stumbled onto something. If I get a prototype to work, I will let you know.


Dave
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on September 03, 2015, 02:34:42 AM
David
I have to say you are definitely the right stuff, there is no pillow quite as comfortable as a clear conscience and doing the right thing.
not always an easy road to travel.

as to my new friend Indegent I'm not sure if I should laugh cry or call my proctologist ....I hope you can turn that sloppy word salad into some cogent thought or true blue insult worthy of this forum and all the nasty potty mouth children who have gone before you ?




Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Jimboot on September 03, 2015, 03:35:23 AM
Quote from: ramset link=topic=15996.msg460227#msg460227 date

however I was speaking with Jim Boot today about that very topic and He said Russ G had some fool proof way of keeping Dirtbags Like Teslatronics from harvesting the work of many as their own...
perhaps he will add some comments here.??

however I must add my own experiences here ,recently it became quite obvious that Patenting or business ventures associated with a true free energy devices will never be aloud to fly in this world.

going to the patent office or any government authority to insure your Rights to an over unity invention is like handing a very big man a stick to beat you with

So its open source or nothing at this time..
Just got this from Russ, I haven't looked into it yet but seems promising. http://www.defensivepublications.org (http://www.defensivepublications.org)
I'll also be publishing his slides from the tesla tech conference as soon as I find them
Here 'tis http://open-source-energy.org/rwg42985/russ/Tesla%20Tech%20ExtraOrdinary%20Technology%20Conference/Russ%20Gries%20Tesla%20Tech%20ExtraOrdinary%20Technology%20Conference%202014.pptx

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Jimboot on September 03, 2015, 03:43:34 AM
Btw Dave you just won the "top bloke" award.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tak22 on September 03, 2015, 06:25:18 AM
Absolute Certainty Is Not Scientific (http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052970204630904577058111041127168)

Quote
How about a little agnosticism in our scientific assertions—and even, as with Richard Feynman, a little sense of humor so that we can laugh at our errors and move on? We should all remember that Feynman also said, "If you think that science is certain—well that's just an error on your part."

Science attempts to apply some of the following criteria:

1. Skepticism of unsupported claims
2. Combination of an open mind with critical thinking
3. Attempts to repeat experimental results.
4. Requires testability
5. Seeks out falsifying data that would disprove a hypothesis
6. Uses descriptive language
7. Performs controlled experiments
8. Self-correcting
9. Relies on evidence and reason
10. Makes no claim for absolute or certain knowledge
11. Produces useful knowledge

I went to OU-Land for the rides, but all I got was the T-Shirt .....
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on September 03, 2015, 11:54:00 AM
Dave said,
Quote
Personally, I have a REAL problem with folks who come on the sites and claim to have something without showing at MINIMUM a half assed working model, because that usually means they had some wet dream about something and want others to go to the effort and expense of building it, and I have NO USE for those people. None. Zip. Nada. But if someone shows a working model and believes they have something, I believe we owe them the courtesy and respect of at least replicating before we rip it to shreds. And perhaps giving them the chance to show us where the error was in our construction.

But that is exactly the situation here. Or rather on EF, since the "sincere gentleman" hasn't posted his claims here himself.  He has presented not even a "half assed working model", in fact he hasn't really presented anything new or different at all. Just some verbal descriptions.

Dave also said,
Quote
NOBODY builds anything anymore. It's a damn shame. People might learn a thing or two that isn't in the textbooks. And it isn't that I believe the textbooks are wrong. I just believe they don't tell the whole story. They do NOT explain some of the things I have seen.

That clearly isn't true. In the first place, lots of people DO build things... even I do, on occasion, build things that people have claimed do this and that, in order that I might see for myself just what they do and why they do it. I even have one or two YouTube videos documenting my builds of these kinds of things.

In the second place, if you do not talk about the "things you have seen" you might miss the "textbook" explanations that somebody else might be aware of. Have you read "all" the textbooks? Do you understand, for instance, everything that appears in Beer&Johnston's Statics and Dynamics textbook? How about Fundamentals of Thermodynamics? Or Circuits, Devices and Systems? Perhaps you simply have noticed certain aspects of an experimental demonstration that _you_ don't understand, but are in fact covered in detail in one or the other of the textbooks you haven't read?




Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on September 03, 2015, 12:01:11 PM
Absolute Certainty Is Not Scientific (http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052970204630904577058111041127168)

Science attempts to apply some of the following criteria:

1. Skepticism of unsupported claims
2. Combination of an open mind with critical thinking
3. Attempts to repeat experimental results.
4. Requires testability
5. Seeks out falsifying data that would disprove a hypothesis
6. Uses descriptive language
7. Performs controlled experiments
8. Self-correcting
9. Relies on evidence and reason
10. Makes no claim for absolute or certain knowledge
11. Produces useful knowledge

I went to OU-Land for the rides, but all I got was the T-Shirt .....

So... I have a hypothesis that if I simply flap my arms hard enough, I can fly, or at least slow my descent enough to survive jumping off the top of a 10 story building. After all, birds do it.

Yet, my knowledge of physics tells me in _certain, and absolute_ terms that this isn't actually true, that the aerodynamics are wrong and the power-to-weight ratio is insufficient and lots of other reasons why it won't work.

What do you think... should I perform the experiment anyway? Based on the claims of someone on a forum who claims to have done it but won't provide any evidence because of his "NDA"?

I'm sure there are lots of people reading this who would like me to perform the experiment... and fail. But my absolute and certain knowledge that it _will_ fail prevents me from wanting to waste my time-- even though I might learn something interesting on the way down. "My goodness, look at how my T-shirt flutters in the wind! That's not explained in any textboo....." SPLAT!!!
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: SoManyWires on September 03, 2015, 12:08:53 PM
So... I have a hypothesis that if I simply flap my arms hard enough, I can fly, or at least slow my descent enough to survive jumping off the top of a 10 story building. After all, birds do it.

Yet, my knowledge of physics tells me in _certain, and absolute_ terms that this isn't actually true, that the aerodynamics are wrong and the power-to-weight ratio is insufficient and lots of other reasons why it won't work.

What do you think... should I perform the experiment anyway? Based on the claims of someone on a forum who claims to have done it but won't provide any evidence because of his "NDA"?

I'm sure there are lots of people reading this who would like me to perform the experiment... and fail. But my absolute and certain knowledge that it _will_ fail prevents me from wanting to waste my time-- even though I might learn something interesting on the way down. "My goodness, look at how my T-shirt flutters in the wind! That's not explained in any textboo....." SPLAT!!!

lol.
you do make valid points with the many helpful posts using comical laymans terms.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on September 03, 2015, 01:51:59 PM
meat wings and magnets.....are you being sincere ??

HHMMm  I'm fairly certain your Meat wings would not save you in your experiment, we surely do know enuff about Meatwinged scientists and flying,[probably more to learn about Meathead scientists on another day]
However comparing Meatwinged scientists and Magnets ??

We surely Don't hold the keys to magnetism [huge understatement] and comparing the two in the same breathe or sentence as it applies here is at best silly...and at least "insincere", which would make the whole thing "ungentlemanly".[**Note I'm writing the book ...[b]The Ungentlemanly things that insincere Meatheaded knuckledragging scientists that think they can fly may suggest] still working on that tittle ??

 I know you can't read "all"at Energetic so your wings are clipped a bit with what goes on there ,nor can you search thru Macks many contributions in other topics, However Mack did mention some olde Book and perhaps your input on that would be helpful ?
and to be clear we do have a member here that witnessed magnets doing work [the Wesley Gary effect]
so old books are good and old expeiments in those books should not be dismissed.

respectfully
Chet
PS
and here we have some thoughts on the subject of motion and change and how we truly don't know all
there is to know about this place and what makes it tick

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YkWiBxWieQU&feature=youtu.be
thx to Jim Boot for the link.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: DreamThinkBuild on September 03, 2015, 09:11:47 PM
Hi Dave,

Thanks for sharing. Another option for adjusting the magnet field is with Giron. Shielding though is a bit of a misnomer as it is more of modulation of the field. Where the field will disperse in iron, Giron focuses it which actually makes it harder to get by as a sticky point unless multiple layers are used depending on magnetic strength.

I tried this with my last build although I could reduce the cogging with about 4 layers of Giron sheet it created an attraction which balanced out the repulsion so no net gain. Attached is pictures of a spiral ramp with one gate. The base is north facing, when the rotor is in attraction it will climb up the spiral in repulsion it will go down the spiral.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: minnie on September 04, 2015, 12:44:33 PM



   I listened to the Wallace Thornhill thingy and found it rather sad.
 I'd like to know what anyone else thought about this lecture.
 Looking into it a bit I came across Brian Koberlein, now there is
 one patient fellow.
    I don't have any particular ideas myself but I have the feeling
 that there's still along way to go before the mysteries of the universe
 fully understood.
              John.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Jimboot on September 04, 2015, 05:22:46 PM


   I listened to the Wallace Thornhill thingy and found it rather sad.
 I'd like to know what anyone else thought about this lecture.
 Looking into it a bit I came across Brian Koberlein, now there is
 one patient fellow.
    I don't have any particular ideas myself but I have the feeling
 that there's still along way to go before the mysteries of the universe
 fully understood.
              John.




I actually find the lectures quite exciting. The universe is alive with electricity
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dbowling on September 04, 2015, 05:35:07 PM

Here's the latest video. I couldn't get it to balance with the ROUND neos, so switched to the rectangular ceramics. I got the magnets at Lowes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-MsoDl7KFI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-MsoDl7KFI)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dbowling on September 05, 2015, 01:02:35 AM
     And here it is with the ramps added.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ilft5GDovJ0[/font][/size]
I haven't fine tuned them yet, but I can see they pull the magnet into the stator. The attraction of the ceramics is pretty weak though.
 
And here is where the book we were directed to comes into play, especially the pages that we were pointed to on the EF web site posting. Tuning the ramps so that they do what we want them to do. Without that part of it, doesn't matter how many magnets and ramps I put around the circle, it isn't going to work. And maybe it won't work anyway. But I'm going to find out for sure! Pssst! If it DOES work, nobody tell TinselKoala!
 
Hmmm, I’m headed to Australia in a month or so. Wonder if that’s where he’s from, with that name? It’s such a SMALL country I’ll no doubt bump into him the minute I get off the plane!
 
Dave
 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Jimboot on September 05, 2015, 12:27:11 PM
     And here it is with the ramps added.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ilft5GDovJ0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ilft5GDovJ0)[/font][/size]
I haven't fine tuned them yet, but I can see they pull the magnet into the stator. The attraction of the ceramics is pretty weak though.
 
And here is where the book we were directed to comes into play, especially the pages that we were pointed to on the EF web site posting. Tuning the ramps so that they do what we want them to do. Without that part of it, doesn't matter how many magnets and ramps I put around the circle, it isn't going to work. And maybe it won't work anyway. But I'm going to find out for sure! Pssst! If it DOES work, nobody tell TinselKoala!
 
Hmmm, I’m headed to Australia in a month or so. Wonder if that’s where he’s from, with that name? It’s such a SMALL country I’ll no doubt bump into him the minute I get off the plane!
 
Dave
If you're coming to Melbourne love to catch up
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dbowling on September 05, 2015, 03:36:24 PM
Jimboot,
I'll have to check with the wife. She's the mastermind behind this adventure. I'll tell you one thing...before we started talking about this trip, I had always thought of Australia as a little island in the ocean. But when you start to look at DISTANCES between cities there, I have come to realize just how freaking big that "little island" is. It's about the SAME size as the United States. I had NO idea. I guess I have just led a sheltered life, either that or I never paid attention in Geography class! That's far more likely. And what an AMAZING country. I'm not looking forward to 14 hours on an airplane to get there, but I am looking forward to the destination.


Dave
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: poynt99 on September 06, 2015, 02:02:39 AM
http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Geography/Land-area/Square-miles
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Jimboot on September 06, 2015, 04:04:35 AM
Jimboot,
I'll have to check with the wife. She's the mastermind behind this adventure. I'll tell you one thing...before we started talking about this trip, I had always thought of Australia as a little island in the ocean. But when you start to look at DISTANCES between cities there, I have come to realize just how freaking big that "little island" is. It's about the SAME size as the United States. I had NO idea. I guess I have just led a sheltered life, either that or I never paid attention in Geography class! That's far more likely. And what an AMAZING country. I'm not looking forward to 14 hours on an airplane to get there, but I am looking forward to the destination.


Dave
Yeah don't try to do it all in one trip! You must do Uluru and the great barrier reef both of which are 1000s of km away from me. If you do the reef catch a sea plane out there.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: PIH123 on September 06, 2015, 05:18:40 AM
Worked in Sydney for two years  (best 2 of my life) and took many trips.

I would highly recommend Kakadu NP if you are in the Darwin NT area.
It is a cross between African savanna and a tropical rain forest with some amazing waterfalls (look up JimJim falls for example)
Hot as hell, but the scenery and wildlife best in the world for such a concentrated area.
Crocs, Water Buffalo, Eagles, Roos, you name it.
Less than 4 hours outside Darwin City center, which is just a stones throw in Aus terms.

If you are staying in Sydney, a trip to the Blue Mountains is a must.
I solo climbed (no rope) the three sisters in Katoomba.
Northern Beaches are also a must.


Pete
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Jimboot on September 06, 2015, 09:10:37 AM
Has anyone tried a steel over the stator mags and taking advantage of the neutral zone? I'll give it a try when I'm back on the bench but rather than trying to direct the flux why not flip it at the right moment? Just a thought. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OSXbG2BmUw
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on September 12, 2015, 02:53:31 PM
David
I hope your home made it thru the fires.. [last we heard you were not certain ?]
It is hard to grasp that kind of loss? ,but gladly you and family are safe .

updates here

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-8.html?s=de1e34f84c4288082785bb31897c40a3

thx

Chet
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on September 12, 2015, 04:31:00 PM
That's hilarious! Now UFOPolitics is involved, posting page after page of his instructions. This is the guy that claimed "Overunity galore" from his motor build years ago (December 2012):

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/11885-my-asymmetric-electrodynamic-machines-95.html#post218245

and has carried on just about the longest "put-on" thread ever, with thousands of dollars spent, dozens if not hundreds of expensive NTE mosfets blown out, and not a single Joule of energy produced over what is used to power the motor builds. Now up to nearly 7900 posts, on 264 pages. Now he's telling other people how to build a permanent magnet motor that _he himself_ cannot build.

Have fun, people. You are wasting your time, just as all those people who followed UFOPolitics in his "asymmetric electrodynamic machine" thread have wasted their time and money. But it is certainly your time and money to waste. In 2 1/2 years from now... will UFOPolitics still be telling you how to make something he can't make himself? If history is any judge, he will be. And you _still_ won't have any magic magnet motor that spins on its own. Every second, every cent, that you spend on this project is time and money wasted, that you could use for better projects that might have a hope of success. Or on helping someone who is in need. Or even just spending it on your own family.

Have you ever seen anybody do _actual_ tests that can determine if changes or additions to a build actually help or hurt? Anybody besides ME, that is?

First you have to establish a baseline rundown condition. Take your rotor with its magnets but NO STATORS/ramps/etc.  and figure out how to supply a constant, repeatable starting impulse to the rotor. Either spin it up to a known RPM, or provide a known amount of energy to it by use of a falling weight on a string, or something like that. Time the length of time it takes for the rotor to spin down to a stop when given your starting impulse. Do this several times and take an average of the times so that you have a good idea of the actual time it takes to spin down. Now start adding your stator magnets, ramps, etc. in a logical progressive manner, and repeat the rundown tests at each stage. Do ANY of your modifications result in a longer rundown time than you got with just the bare rotor? Huh? DO THEY? You don't even know, unless you actually DO THE TESTING and do it properly. If your added stator structures actually help, then clearly the rundown times from your standard starting impulse should be longer than what you got with your rotor-only tests. RIGHT? Or, conversely, you can compare your fully-populated rotor containing magnets, with one that has inert blocks of the same weight instead of magnets. But who is actually doing these kinds of tests, to see if adding parts or adjusting them in any way actually helps towards getting longer rundown times?

Have you ever seen anybody do this kind of testing of a magnet or gravity motor?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMIsABzDkw0



Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dbowling on September 12, 2015, 05:37:43 PM
TinselKoala,
I test my rotor in the following fashion. With magnets mounted, I have a small directional "fin" (It is angled so aerodynamic from one side, but catches air from the other side.) I mount onto the rotor against which I can blow compressed air. I speed the rotor up slowly to a specific rpm. For me that is 1800, since it is a number I use on a number of other kinds of tests. By adjusting the air pressure slowly, I can get the rotor DEAD ON at 1800 rpm. Then I turn the air off and time how long it takes to come to a complete stop. I do this several times so I can get an average. I call this my "run down time" for want of a better term. Your method with the string and weight might not work with stators and ramps and such in the way, so this is what I use since it can be used no matter what I mount around the outside of the rotor.


Now, as to what I have seen with this build. I tried two magnets on my rotor ONLY, to get my baseline. I balanced  the two magnets on the rotor with the two magnets on the stator as the instructions called for. I was happy to note that this did NOT impact the run down time which is what was claimed. This took a while. In fact, when I first tried it with round neo magnets, I was NOT able to get it to balance. There was always a sticky point. So I went to square ceramics. I was able to balance it with those. Then I tried it with square neos and was able to get it to balance with those. Others have been able to get it to balance with round neos, or at least that is what their videos show, but I have NOT, so that is what I am reporting. I will not try again with round neos as it was too frustrating. I added two ramps...one at each stator. With the two ramps mounted I saw an increase in speed as the magnets approached the ramps. However, the increase in rundown time was so slight I cannot statistically justify even calling it an increase...yet.  These were slightly curved ramps, but they did not have the recommended bend on one end. I had yet to make that modification. My next step WOULD have been to mount all the magnets on the rotor. I will be unable to do further testing for the time being as I have been evacuated from my home because of the Butte fire in California, and will probably lose my hose, as ten houses on my street  are now showing as in the burn area of the fire. So for now I'm stuck at a friends house watching movies all day. Hard life.


By the way, I was one of those that built a small modified UFO motor when he first came on the scene. I did indeed see that you could collect some of the generated power from the motor through the second set of brushes, but at low voltage the motor had NO torque, so further experimentation did not interest me. I can get as much OR MORE out of a motor by running it between potential differences, and it still has all the torque it is supposed to. So this is not a case of the blind leading the blind. I have seen what UFO has posted, but I concentrate on what the original discloser had to say, except in those cases where he affirms something someone else has said. And I keep good notes so I KNOW what he has said. I have seen too many threads go down the wrong road because someone stepped in to "contribute".


Dave
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on September 12, 2015, 06:27:00 PM
Good for you, I'm glad you are taking a scientific approach. Not many people do. Don't forget that the magnet fields may also affect your bearings; that's why I used completely non-metallic bearings in the example test I showed above. To "smooth out" random errors you should take data on at least ten or twenty rundown trials in each condition and get an average (mean) and standard deviation of the values.

I'm very sorry to hear about your house and the fire problem. Let's keep fingers crossed and hope that the outcome is not too bad for you and your neighbors.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Jimboot on September 13, 2015, 02:02:58 AM
Good luck for the house Dave, love your attitude.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on September 13, 2015, 10:52:35 AM
Tinsel
You probably have before ...
however I forgot ?? [I have a vague recollection of it being a teaching Video of sorts]
can you explain this Vid ?

Vid was NOT AUTHORIZED For use and I removed it.
very sad to read about Mark E !!

thx

Chet
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on September 13, 2015, 02:02:18 PM
I'm in no mood to discuss trivia at the moment... I just read Mark Dansie's report about MarkE.

I can tell you these things:

The device was originally designed by Overconfident, who died of a brain tumor (malignant melanoma) several years ago.
The video was put up on YouTube to prove a point to Omnibus and was taken down after only being up for 27 minutes, as soon as Omnibus had seen it.
All copies of the video available on YT are unauthorized, plagiarized and many have been altered in various ways. Someone copied it without permission in the 27 minutes it was up and reposted it and it's all downhill from there.

The device is now lost, but you know where it may be (even if you don't realize it).
 
Teaching? Yes, undoubtedly. Did anyone learn anything from it? I certainly did.
"If what you think you are seeing appears to violate some physical law or principle, examine your assumptions...."

Out of respect for the memory of Overconfident, I really don't want to discuss it further. It was done to death back in the day, anyhow.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on September 14, 2015, 10:19:36 PM
Mack is adding some more insight into his thought process or "M.O." of the Motor.
a posted link http://www.physicsclassroom.com/class/vectors/Lesson-3/Resolution-of-Forces

from here

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-9.html

 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on September 25, 2015, 01:51:44 PM
Things are rolling along at the thread ,
09 PM 
MadMack
Quote
 
Ladies and gentleman, I am now the recipient of a CEASE AND DESIST demand specifically citing this forum thread and all other public or private venues. Since everything I have discussed is prior art or general design advice I refuse to do so. My so called partners may have control of a specific motor design but they do not own the knowledge I have. I have not revealed any information specific to the patent application that was supposed to be filed “for our mutual benefit” before now.

Here is some straight to the point information: The ramp splits earlier than my drawing shows. In my side view, where the ramp approaches the rotor at a severe angle and then levels off, that is roughly the middle point of the fork spread. In other words, by the time the ramp reaches that leveling off point the split is almost half as wide as it gets. And with a 1/2” square stator magnet face, the gap between the forks is about 1/4” wide at that point. If you scale it out you will see that the angle formed by the V of the forks is roughly 16 to 18 degrees. In my top view, about 8 degrees for each fork measured from the horizontal center line of the stator magnet.

As the distance between the forks widens, the distance between the forks and the rotor magnet decreases, mostly due to the arc of the rotor travel, and this helps cancel the back drag caused by the angle between the two forks.

The function of the ramp is to provide the “power stroke” as Ufo says, then as the ramp continues toward the stator magnet, to at least maintain the rotor speed until the ramp's attraction to the rotor can be dissipated as much as possible, leaving the two magnets as the sole attraction mechanism, again as much as possible. This function is what must be accomplished with this ramp. Period, the end.

Rue,
We are not canceling magnetic poles, we balance the force applied to the rotor by two sets of magnets at separate points. Later we will alter that balance at advantageous points in the rotation so the magnet sets can aid the rotation.

BroMikey,
Eddy currents circulate parallel to the rotor shaft, so the laminations are 90 degrees to the shaft to limit the circulation. Exactly the same as in an electric motor. No need to read between the lines here.
BTW you do have the view labels reversed in post 320.
You asked earlier about the rotor material, it sounds to me like you would be the expert there. I just asked my plastic supplier for a strong, dimensionally stable nylon that was easily machinable and he sold me a material that fit the bill. Sorry I don't have the invoice and I don't remember the exact type of nylon but I got it from Sabic Polymershapes.

Cristian,
Quote:
the air gap between the ramp and the magnet on the side up - down and the thick of the ramp, as a general rule? 

I'm not exactly sure what the question is. The air gap is a variable, it depends on the strength of the magnets and how you decide to terminate the forks. The gap is a fraction of the stator magnet width. The cross section area of the ramp should be at least the same as the rotor magnet. The forks, at least half that at the beginning of the fork and less at the end of the fork. The point is to carry all the lines of flux of the rotor magnet until you wish to diminish the attraction between the rotor and ramp at the stator magnet, and there is more than one way to accomplish that. K&J Magnetics has information on the thickness of iron it takes to contain all the lines of force for their magnets.

Randy & Wantomake,
I used a 1/4” x 1” mild steel ramp for my initial tests. If it becomes too magnetic, heat it to a dull red & let it slowly air cool.

@Everyone,
If any of you are having excessive difficulty balancing more than two pole sets and ramps together, the motor can be divided into multiple rotors and stators on a common shaft. I'm not advocating doing this, just pointing out the possibility.

I hope I have answered all the questions that have been asked of me. If I have overlooked anyone, please repost and I will try to address the question.

Come on you guys! Some of you are so close to finishing this 2nd step I'm bouncing in my seat with anticipation.

Best Regards to all,

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-12.html

Thx
Chet K
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on September 25, 2015, 03:17:28 PM
Quote
I am now the recipient of a CEASE AND DESIST demand specifically citing this forum thread and all other public or private venues.

Title: Mad Macks magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 02, 2015, 03:14:47 PM
The fellows are really working together on this one .

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-14.html?s=994b2ee3d02a08c0dfb47a19d66b3a8f

Thanks for looking .

Chet
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 02, 2015, 09:09:22 PM
That's hilarious! So UFOPolitics has abandoned his "asymmetric motor" which, according to him in December of 2012, made "Overunity Galore"!!! But, as everyone now knows, doesn't work as he claimed for so long in his nearly never ending thread.... and now he's telling everyone just how to build this thing! Which also will never work, and which is getting to be more and more like Minato's designs every day.

Well, at least it will keep them off the streets... until the next blowhard false claimant comes along and suckers them in with "sincerity" and false claims of having had--- some time ago--- some kind of thing that "worked" but for some reason can't show it working today.

Nobody is afraid of lawsuits, or visits from the Men In Black, over there either. So they don't actually even believe the stories themselves.

Eventually they'll get to some configuration that has all forces balanced out, and they'll give it a spin by hand and it will spin for a while and come to a stop... and they'll claim "IT'S WORKING but still stops for some reason!!" But they'll never compare to a "null" version with the same rotational inertia but no magnets... which would of course spin for the same, or even greater, length of time given the same starting impulse. Look, UFOPolitics, when asked to produce a video of a Working version, made a _cartoon_!!

Hey... why not just continue working on the Ainslie OU heater claims, which she is attempting to bring back from the dead? Or is Err-on too embarrassed to try that one on again?

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on October 02, 2015, 10:19:44 PM
MadMack may have a working magnet motor.  Unless proven otherwise I will give him the benefit of the doubt.  But that thread has turned into a circus.  First Bro. Mikey starts polluting it with every video he can find about magnet motors.  Then Dufo joins in with his constantly changing ideas about how it is supposed to work.  It is almost impossible to have a real working thread on that forum because of all the pollution of wild ideas.

I do believe OU is possible because of some of the things I have seen.  I know that idea is not popular on this forum but I just wanted to make it clear that while I am not opposed to the idea of a magnet motor I do think that thread is a lost cause.  I did build the basic rotor and got the two stator magnets to balance like Mack said they would.  But when Dufo showed up I dropped the project because I knew with him involved it was going nowhere.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 03, 2015, 02:19:09 AM
Tinsel
Geeze I hate when this happens...[quite embarrassing actually]....My crystal Ball is in the shop for calibration again so Obviously I am unable to double check your prophesies and visions....

so I will just have to be content with My fallback position of gratitude and appreciation for what the Boyz are doing.

however I must comment on one of your observations [which also leads me to believe that your crystal ball may also be in need of calibration.???]

specifically your comments on MIB's and nefarious types , you seem to be implying that they are not to be taken seriously here or elsewhere ,like Pink unicorns or the stuff of fairy tales ?
 You are aware of course that TinMan was recently visited by these types and I also suffered some odd interruptions and consequences at the same time [we were in correspondence at the time].

so I must add that I do believe in Fairies and Mib's and can honestly say I don't know what to think about all the past claims of suppression that have been taken as lore in these forums and elsewhere...

@Citfta ,Not certain if your comment on Overunity was tongue in cheek or serious

most here are quite certain that Overunity is a reality however to be honest there is no such thing....
its all perspective on a new energy source that has yet to be discovered.

sort of like saying there is no such thing as perpetual motion, in a universe which is in perpetual motion at every conceivable level....
of course some would say that's perspective too.

?

respectfully

Chet




   
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 03, 2015, 04:46:03 AM
Well, consider this. There are two separate issues here. One is whether or not the MiBs/Lawyers are active in suppressing stuff, and the other is whether or not the Mack's Magnet Motor under discussion will ever or has ever worked as claimed.

So there are four possible states of affairs, and I ask you to consider whether or not what is happening in that thread (and some others we know about) is consistent with any of them.

1. There are no MiBs/Lawyers, and there is no possible working Magnet Motor as claimed and Mack and "Dufo" are full of hot air.
2. There are no MiBs/Lawyers, and Mack is sincere, he is telling the truth and has a self-running Magnet Motor just as described.
3. The MiBs/Lawyers are active and will sue you and shut you down if you get close to building a self running Magnet Motor or other OU device, but there is no possible working Magnet Motor as claimed and Mack and "Dufo" are full of hot air.
4. The MiBs/Lawyers are active and will sue you and shut you down if you get close to building a self running Magnet Motor or other OU device, and Mack is sincere, telling the truth and has a self-running Magnet Motor just as described.

So, pick one of the four possibilities and then reconcile your choice with what is going on in the EF thread (and those others we know about.)


Just so you know, I believe TinMan's report of the "tea and biscuits" meeting (an aviation term) but I don't think that your (Chet's) outages had anything to do with it, they were just coincidences.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 03, 2015, 06:15:31 AM
Well
I would really [REALLY} like to believe that they didn't toast my computer and shut down my Long distance phone service
in one night ,woke up to a Dead Putor and a phone recording that said "sorry no long distance provider has been chosen for this number"???
only been using it for ten years....?
then I get a bill for 1200.00 dollars and they still cannot tell me who shut down my long distance service and generated this bill ?
I was only able to make local calls ?

I'm still waiting for an explanation ,the girls I get on the phone as well as their bosses honestly seem perplexed and absolutely stupefied by the whole thing ,its gone off to some head office for an audit and "final decision"  ??

yeah I would really like to believe its a coincidence....

Tooo many odd things going on Lately

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on October 03, 2015, 12:17:44 PM
Well, consider this. There are two separate issues here. One is whether or not the MiBs/Lawyers are active in suppressing stuff, and the other is whether or not the Mack's Magnet Motor under discussion will ever or has ever worked as claimed.

So there are four possible states of affairs, and I ask you to consider whether or not what is happening in that thread (and some others we know about) is consistent with any of them.

1. There are no MiBs/Lawyers, and there is no possible working Magnet Motor as claimed and Mack and "Dufo" are full of hot air.
2. There are no MiBs/Lawyers, and Mack is sincere, he is telling the truth and has a self-running Magnet Motor just as described.
3. The MiBs/Lawyers are active and will sue you and shut you down if you get close to building a self running Magnet Motor or other OU device, but there is no possible working Magnet Motor as claimed and Mack and "Dufo" are full of hot air.
4. The MiBs/Lawyers are active and will sue you and shut you down if you get close to building a self running Magnet Motor or other OU device, and Mack is sincere, telling the truth and has a self-running Magnet Motor just as described.



I believe there is a 5th possibility.  Mack is sincere and Dufo is full of hot air.  I say this because several times in that thread Mack has had to correct info posted by Dufo.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 09, 2015, 09:02:32 AM
it would seem Mack has given a thumbs up to UFO politics rendering/ Build.

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-17.html

thx for looking.

Chet K

Ps
David
I hope your having a good time in OZ
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 09, 2015, 10:28:07 AM
That page is going to look _really_ hilarious in a week, a month, and a year, when UFOPolitics is still telling people how to build Mack's motor and nobody, not him, not Mack, not BroMikey... none of them... are able to get their contraptions actually to run themselves. Or even get their rotors to spin longer than they would spin, without any magnets or ramps at all.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 09, 2015, 04:15:21 PM
I see a definate direction and no contradictions from Macks original postings on this,
Continuity all the way thru.....

UFO has built a nice tunable rig of exceptional quality !

he has A nice kick coming out of the gate and Mack has Been quite specific in the need for  multiple gates/ramps
To manifest a self run.


I declare a cheeseburger challenge on this one ...plus a magnum chaser for dessert (the Carmel peanut butter one)

I like my cheesburger medium rare with extra cheese......the magnum will be  fine right out of the box

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on October 09, 2015, 04:52:25 PM
That page is going to look _really_ hilarious in a week, a month, and a year, when UFOPolitics is still telling people how to build Mack's motor and nobody, not him, not Mack, not BroMikey... none of them... are able to get their contraptions actually to run themselves. Or even get their rotors to spin longer than they would spin, without any magnets or ramps at all.

It already is hilarious.

Quote wantomake

Quote
Ufopolitics,
You did it old friend!!!

I'm so glad to see that baby spin. My dream of seeing a real magnetic motor has come true.

I've been looking for materials to build a vertical machine to use with my 1/2" magnets. I noticed your tines are longer and thinner which makes since to not have too much steel causing back drag. Half the battle is designing a way to adjust the ramps and stators.

Man that's a wonderful thing to see.

 ??? ::)
here is the video wantomake is all excited about.
DUFO(<--,i like that knick name lol) says in the vide-just a few more adjustments and it !WILL! run-it's amazing  ;D

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FaIttbSld5o&feature=youtu.be
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on October 09, 2015, 04:54:09 PM
I see a definate direction and no contradictions from Macks original postings on this,
Continuity all the way thru.....

UFO has built a nice tunable rig of exceptional quality !

he has A nice kick coming out of the gate and Mack has Been quite specific in the need for  multiple gates/ramps
To manifest a self run.


I declare a cheeseburger challenge on this one ...plus a magnum chaser for dessert (the Carmel peanut butter one)

I like my cheesburger medium rare with extra cheese......the magnum will be  fine right out of the box

Excellent idea
Im off to the shop. :D
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 09, 2015, 09:58:41 PM
I see a definate direction and no contradictions from Macks original postings on this,
Continuity all the way thru.....

UFO has built a nice tunable rig of exceptional quality !

he has A nice kick coming out of the gate and Mack has Been quite specific in the need for  multiple gates/ramps
To manifest a self run.


I declare a cheeseburger challenge on this one ...plus a magnum chaser for dessert (the Carmel peanut butter one)

I like my cheesburger medium rare with extra cheese......the magnum will be  fine right out of the box

Why do you never see people testing in the way that I have described and even illustrated, long ago? I know why and so do you. A comparison test with just the rotor and its magnets, with the external ramps removed, will turn _longer_ when started with the same starting impulse, than it will with the external ramp contraptions installed. 

Come on UFO, you have the ability and the nice build to test PROPERLY. Why don't you do it?

I know why, and so do you.

Here's the TKChallenge to all you magnet motor builders.

1. Find a way to start your device with the _same starting energy_ each time, as I have illustrated in my Mondrasek videos, for example using a known weight dropped through a known distance ( E= mgh ) or an accurate tachometer so you can start timing from an exactly known rotor RPM.
2. Establish a "baseline" rundown time, taking the average of several rundowns of an INERT system, that is one with no stator ramps and the rotor magnets replaced with inert bits of metal or clay of the same weight and position.
3. Compare the time it takes for the rotor to run down to a stop in each case:
3a. the "baseline run" with all rotor magnets replaced with inert weights of the same weight and no external ramps;
3b. the rotor with its magnets installed but no external ramps;
3c. and the full setup with magnets and ramps and anything else you want to add.

For proper data, each condition should be run several times, like 10 or 20 times, and the average of the times taken as the rundown time for that condition. This should take care of random glitches and timing errors and allow one to do actual simple statistical analyses.

I'll bet a cheezburger that the baseline condition will produce the longest rundown times, showing that magnets and external gadgets only take away, not add, any energy to the system.

It would probably take UFOPolitics all of an afternoon to set up and perform these PROPER CONTROL EXPERIMENTS and obtain some real useful data. Will he or anyone else do it? Let's wait and see, shall we?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMIsABzDkw0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMIsABzDkw0)

Come on people, if you want to TEST something, do it properly, by taking real data, comparing the effects of a controlled energy input on various configurations of your devices. Get "mister hand" out of the picture and get some actual NUMBERS, and some actual COMPARISONS going on.  Or are you just afraid of what you might find out by proceeding scientifically ?


(And as far as contradictions in Mack's statements.... what about the NDA, what about the "cease and desist order" ? Those are really inconsistent with what he's been posting, aren't they?)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 09, 2015, 10:25:19 PM
Quote from: TK
Eventually they'll get to some configuration that has all forces balanced out, and they'll give it a spin by hand and it will spin for a while and come to a stop... and they'll claim "IT'S WORKING but still stops for some reason!!" But they'll never compare to a "null" version with the same rotational inertia but no magnets... which would of course spin for the same, or even greater, length of time given the same starting impulse.

Tinsel
Geeze I hate when this happens...[quite embarrassing actually]....My crystal Ball is in the shop for calibration again so Obviously I am unable to double check your prophesies and visions....

(snip)
respectfully

Chet




 

Well, it has been seven days since we posted that, and nobody has yet done the simple null rundown testing that I suggested.... just as I predicted.

They will avoid doing any testing that has the potential to reveal that their work is in vain. 

How long do you think it would have taken UFOPolitics to make a groove in the outer edge of his rotor and use a dropped weight-on-a-string, instead of Mister Hand, to start his rotor with a known and repeatable starting impulse? How long to take baseline rundown data on a null (no magnets) rotor?

These are very simple tests I'm suggesting and they definitely DO have the potential to show whether or not any changes are adding or subtracting from the running of the device. 

So why isn't UFOPolitics doing them? How is it possible to know if any changes are working, if you don't have a valid baseline for comparison, and you are using Mister Hand to spin your rotor? Why isn't anyone actually _answering my questions?_ 

I know why and so do you.

Why, it even almost seems that nobody really wants to _prove me wrong_ with solid data, repeatable tests and simple statistics (taking averages and standard deviations of a set of repeated trials.) I guess it's just too much trouble....
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: minnie on October 09, 2015, 10:49:13 PM



      UFO. and the Prony Brake.
      Damn good username though!
     
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: shylo on October 09, 2015, 10:51:17 PM
Tk , Whats the point in doing all those testes?
UFO's video show how after the initial spin it begins to slow and is about to come to rest, before he grabs it and stops it.
I've built hundreds of designs , they have always found a point of balance or they lock up.
Even if it will continue to rotate as soon as you put a load on it , it will change the whole arrangement of the balancing act.
I hope they prove me wrong, I just can't see it.
When is gravity stronger than magnetism , when is magnetism stronger than gravity?
artv
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: minnie on October 09, 2015, 11:14:58 PM



 Best to keep UFO's testes out of it!
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 09, 2015, 11:39:19 PM
Tinsel
sooo you feel one Gate is all you need to test this ? It would seem a logical assumption

I do agree with your test protocol as a stand alone example for measuring a given systems input and output, but I feel it is inappropriate to try to fit this build into _your_ frame of reference for these motors [magnet motors] and how to build them..

And to state the profoundly obvious..you [like the rest of the planet] have no actual experience on How to build a working magnet motor.

  Although one  member here [ Verpies] has seen and measured a working Wesley Gary system.. and I feel it is completely plausible that Mack has built a Rotary version,  I must add that  based on Grahams work with "that" system,  getting "There"[a running motor] from "Here" [where UFO is at the moment] will be quite maddening IMO.

Also,  asking UFO to do a rundown test on this motor in its present state would be like doing a rundown test on a half built [or less] recip with the plugs in ???

Mack has repeatedly stated the criteria for this to work....and he has not varied from that path or changed any details ..and we ain't there yet .

I have nothing but Gratitude for these researchers and their efforts.
link to page  http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation.html

respectfully

Chet K

PS

I think I will touch base with Shawn on this one [CLanZner] .

PPS
its a Double Cheeseburger Now ...





 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 10, 2015, 12:15:37 AM
Tinsel
sooo you feel one Gate is all you need to test this ? It would seem a logical assumption
Are you pulling my leg, deliberately missing the point, or something?
With this kind of system, where you are making changes to see if the changes help or not, how are you supposed to tell, besides making good comparisons to a known and repeatable baseline? Do you just spin it by hand, and go, "See, it's working" even when it can be seen to come to a stop? How consistent can your hand spin be, especially when you have something at stake, like your precious theory?
Quote

I do agree with your test protocol as a stand alone example for measuring a given systems input and output, but I feel it is inappropriate to try to fit this build into _your_ frame of reference for these motors [magnet motors] and how to build them..

you [like the rest of the planet] have no actual experience on How to build a working magnet motor.
I have a lot of experience building and testing _claimed_ working magnet motors, probably as much or more than anyone posting here. I won't bore you with all the various videos I've produced along those lines, nor will I give details of the years I spent actually getting paid to test things like that.
But just for fun here's one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdrhC1UdDyM

You can take my advice on how to test these things or not, it's up to you. You can also re-invent the wheel if you like, but here's a tip: A square wheel doesn't roll nearly as well as a round one. How do I know this? Because..... comparison testing against a baseline shows it is true.

Quote
While one  member here [ Verpies] has seen and measured a working Wesley Gary system.. and I feel it is completely plausible that Mack has built a Rotary version,  I must add that  based on Grahams work with "that" system,  getting "There"[a running motor] from "Here" [where UFO is at the moment] will be quite maddening IMO.

Also,  asking UFO to do a rundown test on this motor in its present state would be like doing a rundown test on a recip with the plugs in ???
Have you ever seen an old VW engine running on just one cylinder, with  three spark plugs removed? Sure you have. Now add another plug, on the opposite side. Does it run better, or not? How do you know? Now take out all the plugs. Does it run better now? How do you know? You know, because you spun it with the starter motor and all plugs removed... and it didn't run. Add one plug and it lopes along miserably.... but at least you KNOW FOR SURE that adding one plug made a big difference.

Quote

Mack has repeatedly stated the criteria for this to work....and he has not varied from that path or changed any details ..and we ain't there yet .

I have nothing but Gratitude for these researchers and their efforts.

respectfully

Chet K

PS

I think I will touch base with Shawn on this one [CLanZner] .

PPS
its a Double Cheeseburger Now ...

Mack still has not produced ANY EVIDENCE that he has ever had what he claims to have had. In other words, except for the money part, he is doing exactly the same thing that HopeGirl and the Robitialles have done. He's making claims without producing evidence, and he's suckered a lot of talented people into wasting their time. And he's come up with some mighty large inconsistencies: to wit, the "NDA" and the "Cease and Desist Order" that he seems to be totally ignoring by continuing to post and to provide "information".

Go ahead, my challenge still stands. Using proper experimental methods, show that _any_ addition or improvement produces a longer runtime than a simple, bare rotor without magnets (but weights in the same place as magnets)  or external ramps will produce. Without doing the tests, you have no basis for comparison and you are simply waving your hands in the air. (By "you" I mean those people who are actually building things of course.)

In a week, a month and a year from now, there will be NO selfrunning magnet motor coming out of this. Mark my words well, and I will accept an apology (and a cheezburger) when the landlord finally calls "time" on this one.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 10, 2015, 12:34:53 AM


      UFO. and the Prony Brake.
      Damn good username though!
     

In the test arrangement I have described several times now, the air and bearing resistances are a repeatable load on the system. It's a built-in "Prony Brake" without adding any complicating parts.  There may be some change in bearing resistance as magnets pull in various ways, but a properly adjusted bearing system should not suffer much from this effect. It's good to use ceramic, nonmetallic bearings of course but those are pretty expensive and may be hard for some workers to find.

My hypothesis is that magnets, ramps and etc. can only add drag to the system, and can never provide a non-cancelling thrust that will propel the rotor. The way to test this hypothesis is to use a repeatable starting impulse to the rotor, so that the _same amount of energy_ can be given to it, over and over, and to use the rundown time, with the air and bearing resistances as the repeatable load, as the variable of interest.

If you have a good baseline measurement of a system that you know is inert, can't produce any noncancelled thrust, then you can know if any changes add drag, or add thrust, by simply timing the rundown and comparing to the baseline.  I propose doing stepwise measurements at each change, but if someone wants to test a full build against a baseline measurement of a blank inert rotor, that's fine with me. But TEST AGAINST A BASELINE, don't just sit there pushing with your hand and going "oh wow look at that".

If you have good data on the "blank" rundown time, and you add magnets and a ramp, and the rundown time is now shorter.... did the additions produce any thrust? If adding one ramp, or two balanced ramps, doesn't produce any thrust, but only adds drag, why would anyone suspect that adding another ramp would reverse this drag and produce thrust?

Look, all somebody needs is a weight on a string, a stopwatch, and pencil and paper to record the results (and a calculator to crunch the numbers from repeated trials). Think of how easy it would be to _prove me wrong_ if any changes actually added noncancelling thrust to this system.  UFO could do it in an afternoon, since his rotor clearly only takes a few seconds to run down for each trial (not ten minutes or an hour like some of my test builds take.)

ETA: From the Description in the YT video I linked above:
Quote
The rundown graph may be downloaded from
http://www.mediafire.com/?uwlbxuwz4fw
The control condition graph (no stator, keepers on rotor mags) is
http://www.mediafire.com/?zzgtomvn4vo
The motor drive power is precisely the same for both conditions.

I'll define here a C of P (coefficient of performance) for magnet motors.

CoPMM = (rundown time in exp. condition) / (rundown time in control condition) .

So a CoPMM over unity would be, well, ...OverUnity.
And anything else, not.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 10, 2015, 01:59:33 AM
Tinsel
the analogy to a recip was not  about running it on  one cylinder with fuel ,it is my opinion that a run down test of a system like this which according to the claimant requires multiple components to work in synchronicity in order to manifest a "self runner"or gain , it would be like doing a rundown test on an unfinished recip with no fuel or other prerequisite components in place.,

a worthless exercise at this stage IMO.

Yes I have spoken with many experimenters that were convinced their systems would work if only somebody would build it [somebody else]
here we have a person claiming he has built this and it works as advertised, and I know you cannot read his other contributions in many different threads at energetic ,so it is hard for you to get a feel for him beyond this awkward thread with an NDA issue.

regarding an apology should your prophesy come true ,that would infer I am insulting you in some way?
you should know I am not attempting to insult in any way.

and on that note I would hope we could keep all correspondence here free of insult and nasty innuendos.
I feel it is improper for such a group to engage this way.
we have a finite amount of resources [people who can and will build] and an infinite amount of possibilities.

just one mans opinion.
and a gentlemen's bet with benefits.... :o

respectfully
Chet K 



 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 10, 2015, 03:19:07 AM
Well, it seems then that according to you, the only valid test would be to compare "not running at all".... that is, just sitting there +without+ any help from Mister Hand ... and "running on its own" --- again, with no involvement of Mister Hand at all. Fine, but that makes no sense to me since we always see just what is shown in UFO's video: Mister Hand pushing the thing at various rates with various forces and from various starting positions, making the claim that "it's almost there....." . Which is nonsense. And of course, if a build doesn't run itself, it's not a complete build by definition, so can't really be tested. Right?  (insert facepalm here.)

Quote from: ME
If you have a good baseline measurement of a system that you know is inert, can't produce any noncancelled thrust, then you can know if any changes add drag, or add thrust, by simply timing the rundown and comparing to the baseline.  I propose doing stepwise measurements at each change, but if someone wants to test a full build against a baseline measurement of a blank inert rotor, that's fine with me. But TEST AGAINST A BASELINE, don't just sit there pushing with your hand and going "oh wow look at that".

There is one _real_ reason why people don't want to do the simple tests I'm proposing. They are afraid of what they will find.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: allcanadian on October 10, 2015, 03:33:21 AM
@TK
Quote
There is one _real_ reason why people don't want to do the simple tests I'm
proposing. They are afraid of what they will find.
If they found Zipon's that would be bad because everyone knows they can't be measured unless your a mentalist educated in the black arts. Rosemary was riding a unicorn when she took her measurements... but that's another story altogether.
AC
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on October 10, 2015, 03:57:43 AM
Hey TK
Can you post that video of the steel ball rolling around the track,and it sped up slightly when you placed magnets around the track :D
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 10, 2015, 05:29:28 AM
Hey TK
Can you post that video of the steel ball rolling around the track,and it sped up slightly when you placed magnets around the track :D

Are you sure you're remembering that right? Cheese helped some but what really did the trick was the serrano peppers....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFAkGuV3QGE

Just kidding    :o     .... do you perhaps mean this one?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CKf5dUBmIU

Here's the final version:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4num28k4EnA


For some reason Mark E. really liked this particular apparatus and demonstration series of mine. I miss him and his input greatly.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 10, 2015, 08:18:57 AM
UFOPolitics is a real jewel, isn't he? Back in December of 2012, he announced "Officially Overunity Galore" and cited his measurements: "130/25a , 240 Ac 50 Amps...input 36v/33 A..."

Quote
Officially Overunity Galore...    Good News Guys...got It!!
 
 Overunity Galore...meccalte, Once That Is Excited Is Running Like A Charm!!
 
 130/25a , 240 Ac 50 Amps...input 36v/33 A...
 
 It Is Beautifuul!!...lovely Feeling To Let You Know...get Ready...i Will Be Here Till My Morning.
 
 Regards To All
 
 
 Ufopolitics

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/11885-my-asymmetric-electrodynamic-machines-95.html#post218245
(You may need to scroll down to find the "Officially Overunity Galore" post.)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 10, 2015, 09:13:22 AM
Gathering Stones ??

unless you know otherwise ...we are talking about the work of Mad Mack here,

a sincere gentleman who says this works as advertised and has had this running ,Not spinning with a timepiece and sweaty fingers crossed but "RUNNING" with gain.

please stay on topic ,if you want to hold public investigations of random individuals and their past claims and events we can dedicate a section to that ,we could call it
"Public Stoning" or something like that, personally I have learned to stay away from such, it can be a VERY SLIPPERY SLOPE !!
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on October 10, 2015, 05:08:30 PM
Gathering Stones ??

unless you know otherwise ...we are talking about the work of Mad Mack here,

a sincere gentleman who says this works as advertised and has had this running ,Not spinning with a timepiece and sweaty fingers crossed but "RUNNING" with gain.

please stay on topic ,if you want to hold public investigations of random individuals and their past claims and events we can dedicate a section to that ,we could call it
"Public Stoning" or something like that, personally I have learned to stay away from such, it can be a VERY SLIPPERY SLOPE !!

Chet:

Marijuana is illegal in my state so, a public stoning is out of the question.

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 10, 2015, 05:13:01 PM
Chet, here are some solid predictions from me.

Today is the 10th of October.

In one week, that is, the 17th of October, there will be no self-running magnet motor coming from these people. But UFOPolitics and Mad Mack will still be telling everyone that they know how to build a self running magnet motor.

In one month, that is, by the 10th of November, there will be no self-running magnet motor coming from these people. But UFOPolitics and Mad Mack will still be telling everyone that they know how to build a self running magnet motor.

In one year, that is, by the 10th of October 2016, there will still be no self-running magnet motor coming from these people. By then Mad Mack will have faded off the radar, and UFOPolitics will have found some new "overunity" project that he "knows" how to make but cannot actually make.

Mark my words. These are my predictions. Every second spent on that project is time wasted, every cent spent on it is money wasted.   



Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 10, 2015, 05:22:36 PM
Gathering Stones ??

unless you know otherwise ...we are talking about the work of Mad Mack here,

a sincere gentleman who says this works as advertised and has had this running ,Not spinning with a timepiece and sweaty fingers crossed but "RUNNING" with gain.
But he has provided ZERO PROOF or evidence that this CLAIM is true. He has, however, said that he is under an NDA and has received a "Cease and Desist" order.... neither of which have prevented him from Disclosing or have made him Cease or Desist. How "sincere" is that.... if a person won't honor the spirit of the documents he's signed and ignores the threatening letters from lawyers? There are only two alternatives. Either the NDA and C&D orders are bogus, in which case he isn't telling the truth and certainly isn't sincere, or they are real and he's dishonoring them by continuing to disclose and "help" people build what is someone else's protected information ... in which case he's certainly not trustworthy or sincere.
Quote
please stay on topic ,if you want to hold public investigations of random individuals and their past claims and events we can dedicate a section to that ,we could call it
"Public Stoning" or something like that, personally I have learned to stay away from such, it can be a VERY SLIPPERY SLOPE !!

UFOPolitics has chosen not to be a "random individual"... he's telling people he knows how to build something he can't build himself. And as his OWN POSTS show, he is either gravely mistaken and won't admit it... or he's just another blowhard false claimant who tells "porkies" to whomever will sit still for it and bow down to his superior knowledge.
Title: Are you an academic, TK?
Post by: MadMack on October 10, 2015, 08:57:23 PM
TinselKoala

I'm glad you're privy to the details of my NDA agreement. Regardless of what you think I have not violated the letter of that agreement. As for the spirit of the agreement I have adopted the same spirit as the other signatories. If they had honored the true spirit of the agreement we wouldn't be here. And for your information the cease and desist was a demand, not an order, which I refused both publicly and privately. You read my refusal, yet you ignore that. The motor I am helping others with is not the one under restriction and the individual bits of information I have discussed is prior art. You seem to be blissfully unaware of that while you conduct your rant.

The actual motor is in the possession of my so called partners and I no longer have so much as a shed and hand tools to build anything with.
If you don't like that, tough. Get over it.

Mack
Title: Re: Are you an academic, TK?
Post by: PIH123 on October 10, 2015, 11:47:27 PM
TinselKoala

I'm glad you're privy to the details of my NDA agreement. Regardless of what you think I have not violated the letter of that agreement. As for the spirit of the agreement I have adopted the same spirit as the other signatories. If they had honored the true spirit of the agreement we wouldn't be here. And for your information the cease and desist was a demand, not an order, which I refused both publicly and privately. You read my refusal, yet you ignore that. The motor I am helping others with is not the one under restriction and the individual bits of information I have discussed is prior art. You seem to be blissfully unaware of that while you conduct your rant.

The actual motor is in the possession of my so called partners and I no longer have so much as a shed and hand tools to build anything with.
If you don't like that, tough. Get over it.

Mack

Mack,

TK has often claimed to have a pink unicorn in his back yard.
But he has never offered any REAL evidence for such.

So he may not be the best judge of anything.
Otherwise he would be a certain millionaire.
After all, I could make more money than that from tours,
if I had a REAL pink unicorn in my back yard from just preteen girls alone.

I think he is BS'ing, but that is just me.
But I cannot offer evidence that he does not have what he claims.
So the easiest way for him to get credibilty with me, would be to offer ANY proof.
I don't care what form it takes, but just bloviating about his pink unicorn,
is pretty lame on his part.


 

So, Why don't you just go an post a PDF or a JPG or any format really of that NDA or the Cease and Desist order.
It can't possibly be against  the NDA to show the NDA, so just go right ahead.

Man, he is going to look like such a jerk.


Showing other evidence, such as your claimed magnet motor can wait a little,
and will be so much more worth while once you have PROVED the minutea.
After all, spending 20 to 80 pages on minutea is the norm around here.



And, what fun would it be if you were to be
a "sincere gentleman teaching us crap"
(just like EMJ, the "robber"tailles, wayne etc)
if you couldn't get a couple of hundred pages going,
just like the others.


And Ramset,  Really !!!!.   Again !!!!!
Title: Re: Are you an academic, TK?
Post by: TinselKoala on October 11, 2015, 12:10:53 AM
TinselKoala

I'm glad you're privy to the details of my NDA agreement. Regardless of what you think I have not violated the letter of that agreement. As for the spirit of the agreement I have adopted the same spirit as the other signatories. If they had honored the true spirit of the agreement we wouldn't be here. And for your information the cease and desist was a demand, not an order, which I refused both publicly and privately. You read my refusal, yet you ignore that. The motor I am helping others with is not the one under restriction and the individual bits of information I have discussed is prior art. You seem to be blissfully unaware of that while you conduct your rant.

The actual motor is in the possession of my so called partners and I no longer have so much as a shed and hand tools to build anything with.
If you don't like that, tough. Get over it.

Mack
Are you an academic, TK? (http://overunity.com/15996/a-sincere-gentleman-sharing-a-magnet-motor-build-nda-issues/msg462829/#msg462829)
Oh, so this is about _me_ now, and not about your claims? Fine.

Preserved for the record. Now let's cut to the chase, since you have decided to address me personally.

There is absolutely ZERO chance that you and the people you have duped will ever produce a self-running permanent magnet motor. ZERO.  And you cannot even Prove Me Wrong.  Go ahead and try. You cannot do it so you WON'T EVEN TRY, by posting any proof that your claims are true. So you can call me whatever names you like, you can disrespect me all you want... believe me, many other people than you have done it... But can you or anyone else list the times that I have been WRONG about the various fakers and frauds that I have spoken out against?

In one week: There will be No self running PM motor from YOU or anyone else.
In one month:There will be No self running PM motor from YOU or anyone else.
In one year: You'll be gone, people will be bored with you and there STILL will be no self running PM motor from YOU or anyone else.

Go ahead... PROVE ME WRONG !! You cannot !!

(Am I an academic? Not any more, my University affiliations are in the past. But I'm still a scientist, a researcher, and I'm a BUILDER of things that WORK, and a person who is interested in promoting the TRUTH and exposing the blowhard false claims like the famous "Official Overunity Galore" to which I have referred above.)

Now pardon me, I have to go feed my herd of Pink Unicorns. If I can find them.... they are invisible, you know, and the FACT that you can't see them proves they exist.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 11, 2015, 12:16:18 AM
"As for the spirit of the agreement I have adopted the same spirit as the other signatories. If they had honored the true spirit of the agreement we wouldn't be here."

But Mommy, the other kids are all doing it.... so it must be OK...   

 :'(
 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: MadMack on October 11, 2015, 12:29:35 AM
Quote
So, Why don't you just go an post a PDF or a JPG or any format really of that NDA or the Cease and Desist order.
Really? As if that would prove anything to the likes of the people here. Do you understand the difference between public and private?
Quote
But Mommy, the other kids are all doing it.... so it must be OK...
C'mon TK. Is that the best you can come up with?
This thread is nothing but a personal smear. Not one post has been made that scientifically refutes any part of what I have posted publicly about the motor design.

Don't worry. This thread seems to be fully capable of generating a hundred more pages of crap without my help.

Mack
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 11, 2015, 12:33:21 AM
well
so far I only see one person "asking" for some one to call him names and asking to be disrespected ?????? ,I had not noticed much childish behavior and Mommy calling or silly Pink unicorn banter from anyone else here ?

Yeesh......

double Yeeeesh.......



Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: shylo on October 11, 2015, 12:34:45 AM
Hi Mack,
There has to be more to it than just ramps, right?
Even with pivoting ramps they find balance, and if you use springs on the pivoting ramp it locks.
Is there more to come, there must be.
Thanks artv
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on October 11, 2015, 01:48:15 AM
I can honestly say that I have not seen TK's pink unicorns.  This is consistent with the fact that they are invisible so, if that is
not proof, I don't know what is.

Bill
Title: Re: Are you an academic, TK?
Post by: tinman on October 11, 2015, 03:53:13 AM
TinselKoala

I'm glad you're privy to the details of my NDA agreement. Regardless of what you think I have not violated the letter of that agreement. As for the spirit of the agreement I have adopted the same spirit as the other signatories. If they had honored the true spirit of the agreement we wouldn't be here. And for your information the cease and desist was a demand, not an order, which I refused both publicly and privately. You read my refusal, yet you ignore that. The motor I am helping others with is not the one under restriction and the individual bits of information I have discussed is prior art. You seem to be blissfully unaware of that while you conduct your rant.

The actual motor is in the possession of my so called partners and I no longer have so much as a shed and hand tools to build anything with.
If you don't like that, tough. Get over it.

Mack

Ahh
That there be the !get out of jail! free card,when DUFO and the rest of them come up empty handed.
But But -thats not my motor-thats why it dose not work----->but my design dose work.

 ::)

Maybe some sort of different design may show some interesting result's.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhLlI8gclZQ
Title: Re: Are you an academic, TK?
Post by: MadMack on October 11, 2015, 05:14:22 AM
Are you an academic, TK? (http://overunity.com/15996/a-sincere-gentleman-sharing-a-magnet-motor-build-nda-issues/msg462829/#msg462829)
Oh, so this is about _me_ now, and not about your claims? Fine.

Preserved for the record. Now let's cut to the chase, since you have decided to address me personally.

There is absolutely ZERO chance that you and the people you have duped will ever produce a self-running permanent magnet motor. ZERO.  And you cannot even Prove Me Wrong.  Go ahead and try. You cannot do it so you WON'T EVEN TRY, by posting any proof that your claims are true. So you can call me whatever names you like, you can disrespect me all you want... believe me, many other people than you have done it... But can you or anyone else list the times that I have been WRONG about the various fakers and frauds that I have spoken out against?

In one week: There will be No self running PM motor from YOU or anyone else.
In one month:There will be No self running PM motor from YOU or anyone else.
In one year: You'll be gone, people will be bored with you and there STILL will be no self running PM motor from YOU or anyone else.

Go ahead... PROVE ME WRONG !! You cannot !!

(Am I an academic? Not any more, my University affiliations are in the past. But I'm still a scientist, a researcher, and I'm a BUILDER of things that WORK, and a person who is interested in promoting the TRUTH and exposing the blowhard false claims like the famous "Official Overunity Galore" to which I have referred above.)

Now pardon me, I have to go feed my herd of Pink Unicorns. If I can find them.... they are invisible, you know, and the FACT that you can't see them proves they exist.
TK,
I addressed you personally? Well so what? Isn't that what you have been trying to goad me into all along?

Now, why did I suspect you were an academic. Because you appear to exhibit the behavior of entrenched academia. But, I'm sorry you feel insulted by the title of academic, I wasn't aware that it was considered an insult or disrespectful. As for insults, it is you who have heaped these pages with vitriol.

You say you are a scientist experienced with magnet motors so why don't you PROVE __scientifically__ that any part of my design or theory is incorrect? With your claimed credentials and experience you should be eminently qualified to do so.

Go ahead... YOU WON'T because YOU CAN'T.

@Tinman,
Really, you of all people. The motor I am assisting with IS mine but it's not the one under restriction.
Is that clear enough?
Title: Re: Are you an academic, TK?
Post by: tinman on October 11, 2015, 11:35:54 AM


@Tinman,
Really, you of all people. The motor I am assisting with IS mine but it's not the one under restriction.
Is that clear enough?

Me of all people?. ???
Anyway-so the motor you are helping with-->is it a design that will self run?,or is the one under NDA the only one that will self run?.

I dont mean to sound negative,but when UFOpolotics is involved,there is usually an !over unity galore! machine that is way under unity. Then,being a part of Arron the rookies forum,we will all be watching out for the book of secret's on magnet motors-->only $39:95.

I am a believer of an all magnet motor being probable,as anything with a flow is capable of producing a force.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Jimboot on October 11, 2015, 01:08:47 PM
I can see both sides of the argument here but PIH pretty well sums it up for context.


We've all been through this many times and replication takes time energy resources. So a lot of us require a high burden of proof from the claimant. From my perspective I have played with a few things on the bench because of my interest in the neutral zone effect from a previous project. I was under no delusion though that I was building a pink unicorn, rather that I was being given clues on how to catch one.  It's my decision whether I consider that to be a worthwhile endeavor.



Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: forest on October 11, 2015, 01:21:34 PM
I posted on both energeticforum and overunityresearch old patent application from 1913 describing in detail a working imho magnetic motor. It give more chances to build working device then a many pages talk here or there, simply because somebody paid in time and money to patent it. Surprisingly people are not interested ! What a strange social technic is attracting people to make something without any slight proof of success, yet the described in detail but old machine is worthless for them ..... ????

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on October 11, 2015, 01:24:25 PM
I posted on both energeticforum and overunityresearch old patent application from 1913 describing in detail a working imho magnetic motor. It give more chances to build working device then a many pages talk here or there, simply because somebody paid in time and money to patent it. Surprisingly people are not interested ! What a strange social technic is attracting people to make something without any slight proof of success, yet the described in detail but old machine is worthless for them ..... ????

Could you post it here forest?

Cheers
Title: Re: Are you an academic, TK?
Post by: hoptoad on October 11, 2015, 01:26:02 PM
Ahh
That there be the !get out of jail! free card,when DUFO and the rest of them come up empty handed.
But But -thats not my motor-thats why it dose not work----->but my design dose work.

 ::)

Maybe some sort of different design may show some interesting result's.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhLlI8gclZQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhLlI8gclZQ)
Very interesting video Tinman. Certainly a different approach to testing an enhancement of a system through magnets. Love your outside the box thinking.


Cheers and thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: forest on October 11, 2015, 01:39:10 PM
Could you post it here forest?

Cheers


Of course ! Only you (plus some few others) can understand the simplicity and genious of this construction. It's not easy to build, and not very efficient due to mechanical ratchet device.
I have no ability to build it, but if you can and make it please let me know.
Patent (application) attached. The key theme I spotted is the different construction, adding additional axis of freedom to movement.I guess it may work due to Newton laws ! - imho - if you have a two massive wheels , one running in one direction and second running in opposite direction attached to the same shaft cleverly then the total sum of momentum is zero!


Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 13, 2015, 04:05:52 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtMZpDSCFEI&feature=youtu.be

from here

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-19.html

thx for looking and commenting.

Chet K
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: hoptoad on October 13, 2015, 04:32:12 AM

Of course ! Only you (plus some few others) can understand the simplicity and genious of this construction. It's not easy to build, and not very efficient due to mechanical ratchet device.
I have no ability to build it, but if you can and make it please let me know.
Patent (application) attached. The key theme I spotted is the different construction, adding additional axis of freedom to movement.I guess it may work due to Newton laws ! - imho - if you have a two massive wheels , one running in one direction and second running in opposite direction attached to the same shaft cleverly then the total sum of momentum is zero!
Indeed. I can understand why many here, including myself will not attempt to build this. It looks like it requires a fair degree of mechanical aptitude and machining resources. Most people here, including myself, are more likely to build things that are electronic and not mechanical in nature.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on October 13, 2015, 06:23:46 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtMZpDSCFEI&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtMZpDSCFEI&feature=youtu.be)

from here

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-19.html (http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-19.html)

thx for looking and commenting.

Chet K

This is the same mistake almost everyone makes with these things..."Well, it does not work with one stator, so I will add another.." and so on.  IF this design would ever work, it would only need one stator.  He could add 20 of them and it will still not work.  He is simply adding more sticky points.

That is a nice looking build though. I'll say that for him.

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: forest on October 13, 2015, 07:57:26 AM
Very true.  ;D
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 13, 2015, 08:58:46 AM
No, I disagree. And that's why I've advocated the stepwise testing against a blank, inert system consisting of the rotor with nonmagnetic weights instead of magnets and no stators.

Timing the rundown from a known starting impulse or RPM will allow you (or would allow ME, at least) to calculate the actual power dissipation of the blank rotor. Then adding the magnets and one stator and repeating the rundown time would allow the experimenter to see whether the single stator/magnet arrangement added a little drag, or a little thrust. It's possible that you only would get a small amount of thrust (added power) from a single stator, not enough to make it keep running but enough to offset _some_ of the power dissipation of the blank system. The rotor would take longer to run down in that case .  Add, say, six stators, all adding their slight amount of thrust (power), and perhaps they would be enough to more than offset the power dissipation of the blank rotor, and the device would speed up until bearing friction and windage again matched the added power and the thing would run along at a constant speed. Each stator would not be enough on its own but a number of them might add together to make the desired effect.

However the reverse is also true.... if an individual stator adds _drag_ instead of thrust, or does nothing (neither adds power nor dissipates it) then adding more of the same will only drag you down faster ( or do nothing) . But without doing the actual comparison testing against a blank system, you'll never know. Pushing around with Mister Hand, changing things because it doesn't continue to run, is just a waste of time and doesn't produce any Real Data that allows for making valid conclusions about whether or not your stator design is going to work or not. It's comical, to think that the experimenters might be missing the "correct" design entirely because they aren't making any real, valid, comparison tests against the blank system.

It's even more comical, since one reason they aren't doing this is _because the suggestion comes from me_.  An hour's worth of actual testing would tell them instantly whether or not their stator designs are helping (adding some power) or hurting (only adding drag), even with testing just a single stator and comparing against the blank inert system. 

Of course we know that there is no possible added thrust from any stator configuration they can come up with... and since actual testing would demonstrate this, they are not doing it, out of fear of what they might find.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on October 13, 2015, 11:35:11 AM
No, I disagree. And that's why I've advocated the stepwise testing against a blank, inert system consisting of the rotor with nonmagnetic weights instead of magnets and no stators.

Timing the rundown from a known starting impulse or RPM will allow you (or would allow ME, at least) to calculate the actual power dissipation of the blank rotor. Then adding the magnets and one stator and repeating the rundown time would allow the experimenter to see whether the single stator/magnet arrangement added a little drag, or a little thrust. It's possible that you only would get a small amount of thrust (added power) from a single stator, not enough to make it keep running but enough to offset _some_ of the power dissipation of the blank system. The rotor would take longer to run down in that case .  Add, say, six stators, all adding their slight amount of thrust (power), and perhaps they would be enough to more than offset the power dissipation of the blank rotor, and the device would speed up until bearing friction and windage again matched the added power and the thing would run along at a constant speed. Each stator would not be enough on its own but a number of them might add together to make the desired effect.

However the reverse is also true.... if an individual stator adds _drag_ instead of thrust, or does nothing (neither adds power nor dissipates it) then adding more of the same will only drag you down faster ( or do nothing) . But without doing the actual comparison testing against a blank system, you'll never know. Pushing around with Mister Hand, changing things because it doesn't continue to run, is just a waste of time and doesn't produce any Real Data that allows for making valid conclusions about whether or not your stator design is going to work or not. It's comical, to think that the experimenters might be missing the "correct" design entirely because they aren't making any real, valid, comparison tests against the blank system.

It's even more comical, since one reason they aren't doing this is _because the suggestion comes from me_.  An hour's worth of actual testing would tell them instantly whether or not their stator designs are helping (adding some power) or hurting (only adding drag), even with testing just a single stator and comparing against the blank inert system. 

Of course we know that there is no possible added thrust from any stator configuration they can come up with... and since actual testing would demonstrate this, they are not doing it, out of fear of what they might find.

Oh come now TK,even when people do carry out careful testing with and without the magnets in place-(even going as far as adding weights that equal the weight of the magnet that will be placed in that position during the second half of the test),and show a positive result,they get comments like this : Next, we'll learn how _springs_ can "do useful work".

If not the magnets doing useful work,then maybe magic?.
No magic in this one TK,and easily replicated-by those that stick to design parameters,and dont go off on there own tangent,and then wonder why they didnt get the same result's.
Things are often designed the way they are because they work-yea?,and when you deviate from that design,there is every chance that it wont work.

Anyway,things are what they are,and i can achieve the same results over and over again-just by adding the magnets. The same go's for say a solenoid engine,where a solenoid with a steel cylinder is used,and a steel slug for the piston. Remove the steel cylinder,replace with say a nylon one,and replace the steel piston with a magnet,and you will get much more power out for the same power in-while maintaining the same heat output from the solenoid coil-so where did the extra energy come from?.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhLlI8gclZQ
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on October 13, 2015, 11:53:00 AM
Here is something to think about. There is no electric motor in the world that is as efficient as one that uses PM's as 1 half of the desired magnetic field-none. The reason is that motors without PM's need to use power in order to create  the whole desired magnetic fields in order to work.

So remember-DC PM motors are the most efficient in the world to date.
I would say that that is pretty useful  ;)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Grumage on October 13, 2015, 04:48:54 PM

Dear All.

My " tangential " approach !!    ;)

Look before you leap !!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XK3vYAIjd7s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_zbggaXR7k

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMGcFtH18hE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bp8_iVQIYwE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hn17OKYr_SU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIpCVLvieq0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-vrwzcZmBw


Cheers Grum.
 

 
 
 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on October 13, 2015, 08:35:05 PM
Mack,

I left the Erroneous Forum because of your thread about the magnet motor and one other thread.  When I first saw your thread I thought you might possibly have something.  I try to always keep an open mind.  I have never successfully made a magnet motor but that doesn't mean it is not possible as far as I am concerned.  I even posted some pictures in your thread showing how to find the exact center of a disc and how to mark it so you could be more accurate in mounting your magnets.

Then the two buffoons of the Erroneous Forum show up and try to totally derail your thread.  I have to admire the way you keep bringing it back on track.  However the fact you encouraged them led me to believe you are not serious about really sharing a working magnet motor.

I was a member of that forum for several years.  I attended the first energy conference with several members of that forum.  A couple of years ago Dufo showed up with his bait and switch tactics telling everyone he knew how to build a better motor.  I gave him the benefit of the doubt but I spent most of my career working on motors and can spot BS about motors pretty quickly.  It soon became apparent that if anyone actually started questioning any of the technical aspects of his claims they would be ridiculed instead of answered.

Bro. Mouthy has learned well from Dufo.  Anytime anyone tries to ask technical questions about the Gerard Morin claims Mouthy follows that with ridicule and slander.

I got totally tired of being harassed for asking questions so I left.

My question to you is:  If you really want someone to take you seriously, then why are you encouraging those two?  You have had to correct Dufo's pretty CAD pictures over and over because he thinks he know more than anyone else.

I hope I am wrong, but at this point I see no hope that anyone will ever see a working magnet motor from your thread.  I mean no disrespect to you but I see the company you are associating with and that is not encouraging.

Sincerely and respectfully,
Carroll
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: shylo on October 14, 2015, 03:04:40 AM
Hi Carroll,
Do you think or have you seen "magnetic shunting" is it possible?
Other than winding a coil around said magnet and pulsing it to create an opposite field?
Also alot of people use FEMM but I don't believe it is capable of giving true results.
Ramps and trying to shield magnetic fields , there's gotta be something more.
TK, If I start my single magnet at TDC from a balance point, let it go and rotates 350* ,then add some steel at 350*, repeat now the magnet travels 365*, is that considered a gain?
artv
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on October 14, 2015, 03:26:19 AM
Hi art,

No I haven't seen any magnetic shunting.  I am open to the idea that it is possible.  That is an idea I want to try for my own version of a magnet motor.  I have been really busy lately with travel and getting a house ready to sell.  As soon as I get some time I want to try some of Mack's ideas.  I already know that what he told us about being able to cancel the rotor magnets with the proper placement of the stator magnets does work.  I am not going to dismiss Mack or his ideas without at least making an effort to verify his claims.  I just don't feel like wading through all the foolishness that has now overtaken his thread on the EF.  So if he adds anything new please pass it along and I will try it.

Later,
Carroll
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: MileHigh on October 14, 2015, 04:27:02 AM
Quote
Anyway,things are what they are,and i can achieve the same results over and over again-just by adding the magnets. The same go's for say a solenoid engine,where a solenoid with a steel cylinder is used,and a steel slug for the piston. Remove the steel cylinder,replace with say a nylon one,and replace the steel piston with a magnet,and you will get much more power out for the same power in-while maintaining the same heat output from the solenoid coil-so where did the extra energy come from?.

"Proof that Magnets CAN do useful work"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhLlI8gclZQ

So what do we see in your clip?  You have some kind of solenoid motor that is optically triggered and makes a drum spin.  Then you swap out some of solenoid parts for magnets and then the drum spins at roughly the same speed but the current consumption is about half.

So does that mean that magnets can do useful work?

Absolutely not, magnets are still dead as proverbial doornails.  They can not do useful work.

So how do you explain what is happening in the clip?
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 14, 2015, 04:35:22 AM
(snip)
TK, If I start my single magnet at TDC from a balance point, let it go and rotates 350* ,then add some steel at 350*, repeat now the magnet travels 365*, is that considered a gain?
artv
You might think so, but it's the "wrong" experiment. Ask yourself why it doesn't just keep on rotating if it actually has travelled 365 degrees. You are misleading yourself by performing a "Confirmatory" experiment rather than one that could potentially disconfirm your idea.

Try this. Remove your "single magnet" and replace it with a simple chunk of lead or modelling clay of the same weight. Keep your added steel in place. Now use some reliable and repeatable method to spin up your rotor with a known input of energy, or to a precisely known RPM, and time the rundown time. Do this several times and take the average, so you smooth out random errors from the data. Then replace the magnet and repeat the process with the same energy input or precise RPM and time the rundown time. Again, take the average of several trials. Which condition takes longer to run down?

Or, do the same kind of thing comparing the rotor with magnet but _no_ steel at 350 degrees, with the full system including the added steel. Which takes longer to run down?

The steel is attracted by the magnet, both as the magnet approaches the steel and as it moves away. But this interaction is symmetrical and should neither add nor subtract energy from the system. However, the moving magnet will cause eddy currents in the steel, which _do_ subtract energy from the motion of the magnet and dissipate it as heat. So the presence of the steel should actually cause the system to run down faster (take less time to come to a stop) than the "blank" control runs with either no magnet or no steel in place. (All this assumes good bearings that aren't affected by the asymmetrical loading caused by the design. If the bearings have too much play... that will be yet another loss mechanism and cause even shorter rundown times.)

The key is figuring out some way to provide that repeatable starting input without interference or help from Mister Hand (who after all knows what you are trying to "prove" and will help you out, even without you knowing it).  A weight-drop pulling a string wrapped around the rotor or its axle, as I showed in the "Mondrasek" video linked earlier, is one way. Using air-blast and a precise tachometer is another way but not as simple as the weight on a string. It is just not possible to do the precise starting impulse with your hand alone.

I hope you do the experiment I suggested, and report your results here. A video would be nice as well.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on October 14, 2015, 06:27:24 AM
So what do we see in your clip?  You have some kind of solenoid motor that is optically triggered and makes a drum spin.  Then you swap out some of solenoid parts for magnets and then the drum spins at roughly the same speed but the current consumption is about half.

So does that mean that magnets can do useful work?

Absolutely not, magnets are still dead as proverbial doornails.  They can not do useful work.

So how do you explain what is happening in the clip?

Solenoid motor?
Not sure what ypu watched MH, but my setup uses a DC PM motor for the mechanical rotation. The only thing I change is the counter weight for 1fixed permanent magney, and 1 permanent magnet on the controll are. We then spin the DUT up again to find that with the PMs installed, the DC motor now requires less current at the set voltage, meaning that the motor is now spinning faster for less power input. The only change we made was adding 2PMs to the system.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: MileHigh on October 14, 2015, 06:50:28 AM
Solenoid motor?
Not sure what ypu watched MH, but my setup uses a DC PM motor for the mechanical rotation. The only thing I change is the counter weight for 1fixed permanent magney, and 1 permanent magnet on the controll are. We then spin the DUT up again to find that with the PMs installed, the DC motor now requires less current at the set voltage, meaning that the motor is now spinning faster for less power input. The only change we made was adding 2PMs to the system.

Sorry I watched the clip yesterday and now I recall seeing the vertical axis DC motor.  Yes, you added the magnets and the power consumption went down.  The real question is were the magnets doing useful work or was something else happening?
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: MileHigh on October 14, 2015, 07:35:03 AM
Brad:

Okay, I thought of an easy way to get my point across.   We will just use imaginary power consumption figures:

Setup without magnets:  4 watts power consumption
Setup with magnets:  2 watts power consumption

So, the question is did the magnets do useful work?

You are saying the magnets did do useful work, implying that they are a source of power.  I am saying that is not the case.

Here is the crux of the matter?   What is the actual output of the device?  Let's say that the mechanical power required to overcome the bearing and air friction to make the drum spin is the actual output and anything that is not the actual output is simply electrical power turned into waste heat power.

Here is the key point that you are not considering:  The actual mechanical power required for overcoming the bearing and air friction is only 0.2 watts.  In many setups it's very difficult or sometimes nearly impossible to make this measurement.

<<<< Sidebar:  The best measurement technique for an amateur experimenter to estimate this actual mechanical power needed for keeping a rotor spinning at a given RPM is the spin-down technique.  I am only aware of TK doing this measurement.  If you want to up your game, and this applies to all people that make some kind of spinning rotor device, then you should figure out how to make this measurement.  Even if it is only +/-20% accurate, that is a hell of a lot better than no estimate at all. >>>>

Now, with that knowledge, let's look at the numbers again:

Setup without magnets:  4 watts electrical power consumption
Actual mechanical power output:  0.2 watts
Efficiency: 5%

Setup with magnets:  2 watts power consumption
Actual mechanical power output:  0.2 watts
Efficiency: 10%

Do you see, adding the magnets only improved the efficiency of the setup so that it went from 5% to 10%.  The magnets did ZERO WORK, the only thing they did was change the efficiency of the setup and nothing else.


Here is what you would have to see for "Proof that Magnets CAN do useful work:"

Setup with magnets:  0.18 watts power consumption
Actual mechanical power output:  0.2 watts
Efficiency: 111%

Do you see what's happening with the numbers?  We are imagining that you have a setup with a motor that is 100% efficient overall to start with, and then you add magnets and the magnets themselves "CAN do useful work" and they CONTRIBUTE 0.02 watts of mechanical power to the system.

The problem is that when you do an experiment where you add magnets and see better numbers that NEVER happens.   What you actually see is something like this:

Setup without magnets:  4 watts electrical power consumption
(Actual mechanical power output:  0.2 watts - YOU CAN'T REALLY SEE THIS AND YOU CAN'T REALLY MEASURE THIS)
Efficiency: 5%

Setup with magnets:  2 watts power consumption
(Actual mechanical power output:  0.2 watts - YOU CAN'T REALLY SEE THIS AND YOU CAN'T REALLY MEASURE THIS)
Efficiency: 10%

When you add magnets to a setup and see better numbers all that you are really doing is making the setup more efficient and reducing the waste heat production.  You are NEVER showing "Proof that Magnets CAN do useful work."

Please think seriously about this example.  It does not matter that the numbers are hypothetical, it's the concept that you need to understand.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: sm0ky2 on October 14, 2015, 07:36:49 AM
Solenoid motor?
Not sure what ypu watched MH, but my setup uses a DC PM motor for the mechanical rotation. The only thing I change is the counter weight for 1fixed permanent magney, and 1 permanent magnet on the controll are. We then spin the DUT up again to find that with the PMs installed, the DC motor now requires less current at the set voltage, meaning that the motor is now spinning faster for less power input. The only change we made was adding 2PMs to the system.

adding a secondary magnetic field to or near a PM motor, effectively alters the magnetic field within the motor.
generally the drop in current-draw is associated with a decrease in available torque per rotation.
the motor is spinning less powerfully, therefore consumes less current, at the same voltage level

This I discovered after careful analysis of a motor/flywheel combination, then attaching a magnet and repeating.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on October 14, 2015, 11:11:19 AM


Quote
adding a secondary magnetic field to or near a PM motor, effectively alters the magnetic field within the motor.

The two small magnets used in the DUT are no where near enough to the DC motor to effect it at all.

Quote
generally the drop in current-draw is associated with a decrease in available torque per rotation.
the motor is spinning less powerfully, therefore consumes less current, at the same voltage level

This makes no sense at all. If the motor (DC motor) is supplied with a fixed voltage,the only way to increase or decrease the current draw from that motor is to increase or decrease the load on that motor. How did you come up with-the motor becomes less powerful,and thus draws less current?-when it has a fixed available voltage.

Quote
This I discovered after careful analysis of a motor/flywheel combination, then attaching a magnet and repeating.

This tells me you screw'd up the !already placed in the correct position! magnetic fields of the motor.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on October 14, 2015, 11:22:31 AM
Brad:

Okay, I thought of an easy way to get my point across.   We will just use imaginary power consumption figures:

Setup without magnets:  4 watts power consumption
Setup with magnets:  2 watts power consumption

So, the question is did the magnets do useful work?

You are saying the magnets did do useful work, implying that they are a source of power.  I am saying that is not the case.

Here is the crux of the matter?   What is the actual output of the device?  Let's say that the mechanical power required to overcome the bearing and air friction to make the drum spin is the actual output and anything that is not the actual output is simply electrical power turned into waste heat power.

Here is the key point that you are not considering:  The actual mechanical power required for overcoming the bearing and air friction is only 0.2 watts.  In many setups it's very difficult or sometimes nearly impossible to make this measurement.

<<<< Sidebar:  The best measurement technique for an amateur experimenter to estimate this actual mechanical power needed for keeping a rotor spinning at a given RPM is the spin-down technique.  I am only aware of TK doing this measurement.  If you want to up your game, and this applies to all people that make some kind of spinning rotor device, then you should figure out how to make this measurement.  Even if it is only +/-20% accurate, that is a hell of a lot better than no estimate at all. >>>>

Now, with that knowledge, let's look at the numbers again:

Setup without magnets:  4 watts electrical power consumption
Actual mechanical power output:  0.2 watts
Efficiency: 5%

Setup with magnets:  2 watts power consumption
Actual mechanical power output:  0.2 watts
Efficiency: 10%

Do you see, adding the magnets only improved the efficiency of the setup so that it went from 5% to 10%.  The magnets did ZERO WORK, the only thing they did was change the efficiency of the setup and nothing else.


Here is what you would have to see for "Proof that Magnets CAN do useful work:"

Setup with magnets:  0.18 watts power consumption
Actual mechanical power output:  0.2 watts
Efficiency: 111%

Do you see what's happening with the numbers?  We are imagining that you have a setup with a motor that is 100% efficient overall to start with, and then you add magnets and the magnets themselves "CAN do useful work" and they CONTRIBUTE 0.02 watts of mechanical power to the system.

The problem is that when you do an experiment where you add magnets and see better numbers that NEVER happens.   What you actually see is something like this:

Setup without magnets:  4 watts electrical power consumption
(Actual mechanical power output:  0.2 watts - YOU CAN'T REALLY SEE THIS AND YOU CAN'T REALLY MEASURE THIS)
Efficiency: 5%

Setup with magnets:  2 watts power consumption
(Actual mechanical power output:  0.2 watts - YOU CAN'T REALLY SEE THIS AND YOU CAN'T REALLY MEASURE THIS)
Efficiency: 10%

When you add magnets to a setup and see better numbers all that you are really doing is making the setup more efficient and reducing the waste heat production.  You are NEVER showing "Proof that Magnets CAN do useful work."

Please think seriously about this example.  It does not matter that the numbers are hypothetical, it's the concept that you need to understand.

Well we could take a walk down the garden path i guess,or we could look at it for what it really is-that being--> When a set voltage is supplied to a brushed DC motor with a load on that motor,the only !!only!! way to decrease the current input (without changing the configuration of that motor),is by reducing the load on that motor. As the load on the motor dose not change throughout the test(the load being the rest of the DUT),then a second energy source must be provided to that load,so as to lift some of that load from the DC motor driving that load. The only thing we did was add the two PM's to the DUT,and i even went as far as fitting a counter weight that was the same weight as the PM that was to replace it. So we added the two PM's,and our current draw to the prime mover dropped by around half. As the supply voltage was a fixed amount,and the current dropped by half,this means we are now using half the power we were before the PM's were added.

The way i carried out the experiment was very accurate,and the same results were had time after time.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 14, 2015, 02:36:52 PM
The Boss found an interesting Movie ??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lks8N-_dQLs&feature=youtu.be
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: DreamThinkBuild on October 14, 2015, 06:53:46 PM
Hi All,

Here is an interesting magnetic spring.

US6232689 - Energy extracting mechanism having a magnetic spring

https://www.google.com/patents/US6232689
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: MileHigh on October 15, 2015, 01:07:19 AM
Well we could take a walk down the garden path i guess,or we could look at it for what it really is-that being--> When a set voltage is supplied to a brushed DC motor with a load on that motor,the only !!only!! way to decrease the current input (without changing the configuration of that motor),is by reducing the load on that motor. As the load on the motor dose not change throughout the test(the load being the rest of the DUT),then a second energy source must be provided to that load,so as to lift some of that load from the DC motor driving that load. The only thing we did was add the two PM's to the DUT,and i even went as far as fitting a counter weight that was the same weight as the PM that was to replace it. So we added the two PM's,and our current draw to the prime mover dropped by around half. As the supply voltage was a fixed amount,and the current dropped by half,this means we are now using half the power we were before the PM's were added.

The way i carried out the experiment was very accurate,and the same results were had time after time.

But if you look very carefully at what I posted it fits exactly into the scenario that you describe.   It fits exactly.

Somewhere there is a clip where someone adds a big external magnet to a running motor and the motor speeds up but the power draw stays the same.  That's the same deal one more time, adding the magnets gave the motor more torque and made it more efficient such that it did more "useful work" for the same input power.   You can't make every motor with giant magnets.  There are design goals for size, weight, and cost.  So adding the big external magnet to the motor is not an "improvement" if you have size as an important design goal.

In your experiment the "true output" of your setup is buried in the waste heat power.  Adding magnets did nothing more than improve the efficiency and reduce the waste heat power.  The magnets themselves remain as dead as a doornail and don't contribute even a nanowatt of power to the setup.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on October 15, 2015, 02:21:35 AM
No, I disagree. And that's why I've advocated the stepwise testing against a blank, inert system consisting of the rotor with nonmagnetic weights instead of magnets and no stators.

Timing the rundown from a known starting impulse or RPM will allow you (or would allow ME, at least) to calculate the actual power dissipation of the blank rotor. Then adding the magnets and one stator and repeating the rundown time would allow the experimenter to see whether the single stator/magnet arrangement added a little drag, or a little thrust. It's possible that you only would get a small amount of thrust (added power) from a single stator, not enough to make it keep running but enough to offset _some_ of the power dissipation of the blank system. The rotor would take longer to run down in that case .  Add, say, six stators, all adding their slight amount of thrust (power), and perhaps they would be enough to more than offset the power dissipation of the blank rotor, and the device would speed up until bearing friction and windage again matched the added power and the thing would run along at a constant speed. Each stator would not be enough on its own but a number of them might add together to make the desired effect.

However the reverse is also true.... if an individual stator adds _drag_ instead of thrust, or does nothing (neither adds power nor dissipates it) then adding more of the same will only drag you down faster ( or do nothing) . But without doing the actual comparison testing against a blank system, you'll never know. Pushing around with Mister Hand, changing things because it doesn't continue to run, is just a waste of time and doesn't produce any Real Data that allows for making valid conclusions about whether or not your stator design is going to work or not. It's comical, to think that the experimenters might be missing the "correct" design entirely because they aren't making any real, valid, comparison tests against the blank system.

It's even more comical, since one reason they aren't doing this is _because the suggestion comes from me_.  An hour's worth of actual testing would tell them instantly whether or not their stator designs are helping (adding some power) or hurting (only adding drag), even with testing just a single stator and comparing against the blank inert system. 

Of course we know that there is no possible added thrust from any stator configuration they can come up with... and since actual testing would demonstrate this, they are not doing it, out of fear of what they might find.

Well, of course you are right...this is exactly what I meant.  You are the one that showed those run down tests during the Mylow saga.  Everyone should do that to establish a base line...just as you suggested.

What I was trying to say was that if one stator does not add anything except additional drag compared to your baseline testing, then adding 10 of them will not improve it, only make it worse.

I learned this from working on a "gravity" motor 10 years ago using fluid in pvc tubes on a bicycle wheel.  One tube did not work, so I kept adding tubes and finally, I accidentally designed a really great braking system using 8 tubes, ha ha.  You could give that wheel a really good spin and it would stop in about 1.5 revolutions.  Had I performed your base line test, I could have quit after adding the first tube and saved a lot of time.

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 17, 2015, 11:27:19 PM
another replicator sharing his build
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDfJFIxmSr0&feature=youtu.be

from here

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-20.html

thanks for looking

Chet K
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: CANGAS on October 18, 2015, 12:37:20 AM
Well, of course you are right...this is exactly what I meant.  You are the one that showed those run down tests during the Mylow saga.  Everyone should do that to establish a base line...just as you suggested.

What I was trying to say was that if one stator does not add anything except additional drag compared to your baseline testing, then adding 10 of them will not improve it, only make it worse.

I learned this from working on a "gravity" motor 10 years ago using fluid in pvc tubes on a bicycle wheel.  One tube did not work, so I kept adding tubes and finally, I accidentally designed a really great braking system using 8 tubes, ha ha.  You could give that wheel a really good spin and it would stop in about 1.5 revolutions.  Had I performed your base line test, I could have quit after adding the first tube and saved a lot of time.

Bill


Ha ha ha. Reminds me of a time 15 or 20 years ago when I did a similar ritual of establishing a baseline etc. It was a gravity wheel using solid weights (44 caliber lead balls for a 1851 Navy Colt). When I changed the weight configuration it self-braked much faster than the original configuration. A brisk spin-up and stop in 1 1/2 revs.

Wasn't looking for a novel brake.

CANGAS 190
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on October 18, 2015, 12:48:55 AM

Ha ha ha. Reminds me of a time 15 or 20 years ago when I did a similar ritual of establishing a baseline etc. It was a gravity wheel using solid weights (44 caliber lead balls for a 1851 Navy Colt). When I changed the weight configuration it self-braked about 2 or 3 times faster than the original configuration. A brisk spin-up and stop in 1 1/2 revs.

Wasn't looking for a novel brake.

CANGAS 189

Neither was I but I sure found one.  This shows the importance of TK's rundown tests.  Of course, I was doing this long before I even heard of TK.  Maybe I should have attempted to make a breaking device and by accident it might have kept spinning?

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: CANGAS on October 18, 2015, 02:54:04 AM
Neither was I but I sure found one.  This shows the importance of TK's rundown tests.  Of course, I was doing this long before I even heard of TK.  Maybe I should have attempted to make a breaking device and by accident it might have kept spinning?

Bill


Perhaps there is a market niche for a new kind (or two) of braking device.  8)

CANGAS 194
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 18, 2015, 12:20:18 PM
another replicator sharing his build
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDfJFIxmSr0&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDfJFIxmSr0&feature=youtu.be)

from here

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-20.html (http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-20.html)

thanks for looking

Chet K

Has it been a week already Chet?

http://overunity.com/15996/a-sincere-gentleman-sharing-a-magnet-motor-build-nda-issues/msg462829/#msg462829

And still no self-running magnet motor FROM ANYONE.

And in a month, there still won't be. And in a year.... still none.


And Mack, you are utterly wrong about not being "scientifically refuted." Not a single person on your "team" has done the SCIENTIFIC tests I have proposed, illustrated by example, made testable scientific hypotheses about, etc. Nobody "over there" even knows how much power their rotors dissipate under various conditions. Dozens and dozens of magnet motors using your same basic ideas have been tested over the years and have always come to a stop _faster_ when they are fully outfitted, than when they are tested with just a blank rotor. Until you or someone else proves otherwise, these tests solidly and fully _refute_ you and your claims.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on October 18, 2015, 01:38:35 PM
Has it been a week already Chet?

http://overunity.com/15996/a-sincere-gentleman-sharing-a-magnet-motor-build-nda-issues/msg462829/#msg462829

And still no self-running magnet motor FROM ANYONE.

And in a month, there still won't be. And in a year.... still none.


And Mack, you are utterly wrong about not being "scientifically refuted." Not a single person on your "team" has done the SCIENTIFIC tests I have proposed, illustrated by example, made testable scientific hypotheses about, etc. Nobody "over there" even knows how much power their rotors dissipate under various conditions. Dozens and dozens of magnet motors using your same basic ideas have been tested over the years and have always come to a stop _faster_ when they are fully outfitted, than when they are tested with just a blank rotor. Until you or someone else proves otherwise, these tests solidly and fully _refute_ you and your claims.

Ok-so i went and read the whole thread-->it is quite the comedy fest over there :D
DUFO now seems to be a top notch physicist,and full bottles in quantum physics. Next we'll have a particle accelerator being constructed over there,and there'll be black holes galore  :o
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: MadMack on October 19, 2015, 10:40:13 PM
...
And Mack, you are utterly wrong about not being "scientifically refuted." Not a single person on your "team" has done the SCIENTIFIC tests I have proposed, illustrated by example, made testable scientific hypotheses about, etc. Nobody "over there" even knows how much power their rotors dissipate under various conditions. Dozens and dozens of magnet motors using your same basic ideas have been tested over the years and have always come to a stop _faster_ when they are fully outfitted, than when they are tested with just a blank rotor. Until you or someone else proves otherwise, these tests solidly and fully _refute_ you and your claims.
TK,
Putting words in my mouth that were never uttered and claiming that uncited tests from other failed designs refute me and my work. How unprofessional. Do you understand that we are still working with components so there is nothing to do any of your tests on? When we reach the motor stage then you can get your tests. Then they will be both useful and appropriate, not before.

And I challenged YOU, knowledgeable scientist that you are, to prove my design or theory false.
We're still waiting....
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 20, 2015, 09:48:52 AM
TK,
Putting words in my mouth that were never uttered and claiming that uncited tests from other failed designs refute me and my work. How unprofessional. Do you understand that we are still working with components so there is nothing to do any of your tests on? When we reach the motor stage then you can get your tests. Then they will be both useful and appropriate, not before.

And I challenged YOU, knowledgeable scientist that you are, to prove my design or theory false.
We're still waiting....
1. You are wrong that "there is nothing to do any of (my) tests on". You and your builders need to do -baseline rundown- tests on their rotor assemblies, even to the point of knowing the actual power dissipation of their rotors. If you don't know how to do this, I refer you to my various videos on the topic. Like this one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJavCZX_-PI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJavCZX_-PI)
And we all know that you and your builders will _never_ "reach the motor stage", by which you presumably mean a self-running permanent magnet motor.

2. Your "theory" is considered to be false because it contradicts the principles of Conservation of Energy and Conservation of Momentum. It is up to YOU to show otherwise, and until you do, the standard interpretation of magnetic fields as conservative still holds. You and your builders have never actually formulated a real "theory" anyway, and certainly have not tested any real hypotheses that may have been generated by it. I have shown how to generate and test real scientific hypotheses, but since they have the potential to _disprove_ your theory, neither you nor any of your builders will actually perform the necessary experiments.

3. I cannot even test your full design because you have never told exactly what it is. NDA, remember? However I have tested _many_ similar designs to what you have shown, and frankly, I see nothing new or even particularly interesting in it. Angled magnets, ramps, balanced and unbalanced configurations, etc. have all been tried for many years by many people and none of them has ever actually shown a benefit over the inert baseline system. And none of your builders are having any luck either, even with your... and UFOPolitics... help.

4. You and your people would never accept anything that I do, anyway, because you are all running on faith, rather than evidence-based science. Remember that UFOPolitics has had a thread running for nearly 3 and 1/2 YEARS, where he claimed "Officially Overunity Galore" three years ago, but has actually never produced a single Joule of energy over what it takes to run his motors.... and some of the people who are working with you now are the same ones he had in thrall for all that time. Many others built his designs with his advice at every step and found.... nothing, but spent lots of money and time to find it. And now you are essentially repeating the same folly, and you even have his help! This is hilarious.

5. It is _always_ up to the claimant to prove that their claims are _true_. No amount of outside experimentation that is unsuccessful would be accepted by people who believe that your unsupported claims are true. You make an extraordinary claim that would turn conventional physics on its ear, but you provide absolutely no evidence that your claims are true. This is faith, religion, not science. Prove your claims first, and _then_ get people to replicate them. Anything else is simply dishonest, pseudoscientific misconduct.

6. Nobody has ever given any coherent reason why my proposed tests are invalid or inappropriate or unscientific ... because they aren't.


And in another week, month and year, there will STILL be no self-running magnet motor coming from you or any of the people in your cult at EF.

Just think of how easy it would be to prove me wrong. But you cannot.... so you try to turn the issue around and ask _me_ to do your work for you. You are following the "free energy" false claimant script to the letter. Perhaps you are new to this field, but some of us have quite a bit of experience in the matter and you can take my word for it... we've seen it time and time again and the results are always the same. If you think you are any different... then PROVE IT. But you cannot.

Go ahead, perform the basic rundown tests on your rotor without magnets (but equal weights in their place), or encourage your builders to do so. Then you will be able to see that _all and any_ of your additions like ramps, angled magnets etc. only cause further braking, and none actually add the least bit of energy to the system.  Why not, what have you got to lose? Are you perhaps afraid to do it? Or do you _already know_ that I am right about this, perhaps?



Putting words in your mouth that you never uttered? SO you didn't post this, then?
Really? As if that would prove anything to the likes of the people here. Do you understand the difference between public and private?C'mon TK. Is that the best you can come up with?
This thread is nothing but a personal smear. Not one post has been made that scientifically refutes any part of what I have posted publicly about the motor design.

Don't worry. This thread seems to be fully capable of generating a hundred more pages of crap without my help.

Mack

You actually have more critics in your thread on EF than you do here. They are telling you that your ramps and whatnot are creating drag, not adding thrust, just as I have done.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 21, 2015, 12:10:35 AM
The "motor without a camshaft" is a pitiful strawman, and only shows that you don't understand the basics of what you are trying to do. Let me run it down for you.

You have a rotor that dissipates a certain amount of power as it spins down from some push --- which so far your friends are only doing with Mister Hand, hence variable input and not repeatable consistently. You and they don't even know how much power your rotors dissipate!

You are making additions and changes that are supposed to add energy to the rotor's spin. Maybe the additions aren't perfect "yet" so maybe they only add a little bit of energy, less than that which is required to make it self run yet. But you don't even know this, because you have not done the right experiments to establish a baseline power dissipation for comparison. You seem to think that when you have everything just right, you'll give it a spin and it will keep going, and you don't have to test anything scientifically until you achieve that. Then why are your friends bothering to spin _any_ of your systems by hand when you know already that the "motor" isn't complete? That's just silly, since you've said that testing before a complete motor is made is useless. Or did I put those words into your mouth too?

Your friends are making changes that are supposed to have some effect. I am telling you that these changes are only adding drag, or doing nothing, to your rotor spins. And no matter what changes in ramps, magnet angles, etc. this will continue to be true. Test it and find out! You dare not, because your faith will be challenged by your findings. Meanwhile you and they continue your fiddling about. But in another week, nobody will have a working motor. In another month, still nobody will have one. In a year... same thing. No working magnet motor will come out of your "designs", whether or not you follow my test suggestions. But by following my suggestions, perhaps _someone_ will begin to see the light and will stop wasting their time, creativity and money on these claims of yours that are simply not true. Just as many people who originally believed UFOPolitics' claims of "Official Overunity Galore" have given up and stopped spending money on those false claims -- because they _tested_ properly and scientifically and didn't find any overunity in their rewound motors and kludged-up driver circuits.

I'll check back in a week, and remind you again. And in a month. And, if I live that long, in a year, when you and your friends will _still_ not have anything that will support your claim of having made a working magnet motor.

Go ahead and prove me wrong! You cannot, because your claims are false.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d22CiKMPpaY
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: MadMack on October 21, 2015, 06:30:25 PM
I researched your online history in this forum and a few others going back several years. The majority of your posts serve to ridicule and repress ideas, experiments, and basic research on controversial concepts toward free energy.
 
You are following your standard book of play here. The same methods and even the phrases you like to use can be seen throughout numerous threads in multiple venues, even on YouTube.

So now I know what your purpose is I am through wasting time on you. Go right ahead and continue your efforts to discredit and undermine what I am trying to accomplish. It will have no affect.

To everyone reading this.
Don't accept my word for this. Skim through all of the posts made by Tinselkoala on this forum, then Google different energy forums along with that member name. See it for yourself.

Adiós
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: minnie on October 21, 2015, 10:20:55 PM



    Poor old MadMack doesn't seem to like the truth.
    Simple for you to make Tinsel look daft MadMack,
    just come up with a working device.
            John.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: PIH123 on October 22, 2015, 04:37:04 AM
Adiós

Say it ain't so. You're not leaving are you.


EMJunkie did that.

He came here to "Teach" us (just like you).
Then he left.
But thankfully, he came back.
Then ran away.
Then came back.
Then chickened out.
Then came back.
Then when danger reared it's ugly head, he bravely turned his tail and fled (holy grail)
etc ........................


Not sure of the current status (whether he is back or not), but it doesn't matter.
His thread is almost 400 pages and still without a working device.
It doesn't take much around here.


Hang in there MadMack, you can do this.
You have an NDA and a "cease and desist" order on your side,
so you don't have to show any silly schematics / results / theory like EMJ at least "tried" to do.

Good luck. 1000 pages !!!!!!!!!
I am rooting for you

Pete 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 22, 2015, 07:56:34 AM
Hmmm
I have to say on the subject Of EMJunkie
I honestly have no idea why he does what he does[ refuses testing or public investigation ]

I find it funny that Brad's very thorough  investigations are happening in a thread where there has never been an investigation of EMJunkies initial claim or anything ??[at least that I am aware]
not even a black box investigation ??
ZERO Zilch NADA ??
it is the Elephant in the room over there and all credibility goes Bye bye for Chris ,Not so at all with Brad
he knows how tricky these things can really be and how easy a simple transformer can run you around in circles if you don't know what you're looking at.
IMO opinion Brad is taking Chris to school ...which is a good thing,  he actually helps us all.


On this Topic
  I am quite aware of the implications to a persons life for signing an NDA as well as breaching assumed confidences .

But to be completely honest ...

I am just grateful to the fellows building this and publicly sharing their findings and hard work ,I hope they can maintain their sanity.
Few things can be as daunting as Magnets and all the minutia which happens when you try to put them together to do work.

makes herding cats look like a dream job ...

I also think it is quite arrogant to assume you have seen it all and know it all when it comes to things you have actually never seen or known...such as a working Magnet motor.
Oh I forgot...Its impossible ??
NAHH,  I'm not buying that.

Just one mans opinion..

respectfully
Chet K

PS
 I am completely rooting for Macks replicators to find something unusual
thread here
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-21.html
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: cristopalba on October 22, 2015, 04:49:54 PM
Hi everybody

<<<<<<I am completely rooting for Macks replicators>>>>>

    -you know some original model, to call me I replicator? I know of none

<<<<<to find something unusual
thread here
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-21.html>>>>>>

     -Where he is looking at you in the written text in English or Spanish Comment.  Good to know for the next time
Excuse me, still do not know how to use the disclaimer
  regards.   cristian alba
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: EMJunkie on October 23, 2015, 11:14:23 AM
Say it ain't so. You're not leaving are you.


EMJunkie did that.

He came here to "Teach" us (just like you).
Then he left.
But thankfully, he came back.
Then ran away.
Then came back.
Then chickened out.
Then came back.
Then when danger reared it's ugly head, he bravely turned his tail and fled (holy grail)
etc ........................


Not sure of the current status (whether he is back or not), but it doesn't matter.
His thread is almost 400 pages and still without a working device.
It doesn't take much around here.


Hang in there MadMack, you can do this.
You have an NDA and a "cease and desist" order on your side,
so you don't have to show any silly schematics / results / theory like EMJ at least "tried" to do.

Good luck. 1000 pages !!!!!!!!!
I am rooting for you

Pete


PHIffle, you're a Dick!!!

Using names to and making idiot comments like you do, behind peoples back, proves it!

By the way, we have had several devices shown on the thread I created from another user that clearly demonstrated Excess energy gains... But your IQ inhibits you realizing what's right in front of your nose!

I have met many idiots in my time, you, PHIffle, are perhaps the utmost top ranking!

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: EMJunkie on October 23, 2015, 11:22:13 AM
Hmmm
I have to say on the subject Of EMJunkie
I honestly have no idea why he does what he does[ refuses testing or public investigation ]

I find it funny that Brad's very thorough  investigations are happening in a thread where there has never been an investigation of EMJunkies initial claim or anything ??[at least that I am aware]
not even a black box investigation ??
ZERO Zilch NADA ??
it is the Elephant in the room over there and all credibility goes Bye bye for Chris ,Not so at all with Brad
he knows how tricky these things can really be and how easy a simple transformer can run you around in circles if you don't know what you're looking at.
IMO opinion Brad is taking Chris to school ...which is a good thing,  he actually helps us all.


On this Topic
  I am quite aware of the implications to a persons life for signing an NDA as well as breaching assumed confidences .

But to be completely honest ...

I am just grateful to the fellows building this and publicly sharing their findings and hard work ,I hope they can maintain their sanity.
Few things can be as daunting as Magnets and all the minutia which happens when you try to put them together to do work.

makes herding cats look like a dream job ...

I also think it is quite arrogant to assume you have seen it all and know it all when it comes to things you have actually never seen or known...such as a working Magnet motor.
Oh I forgot...Its impossible ??
NAHH,  I'm not buying that.

Just one mans opinion..

respectfully
Chet K

PS
 I am completely rooting for Macks replicators to find something unusual
thread here
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-21.html


Chet K - Rather disappointed in your comments also!

To be honest I really did expect a bit more from you!!!

Well, I always have said, "I try to learn something every day", and Brad is about the only one on this entire forum that does any work! All the Douche Bags that claim to know everything are in fact the farthest behind!!! Its an Arrogance thing!!!

I have about 6 Names in my head right now that are the only Elephants in the Room Chet K, and you've just been added to the list Pal!

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 23, 2015, 11:27:01 AM
I researched your online history in this forum and a few others going back several years. The majority of your posts serve to ridicule and repress ideas, experiments, and basic research on controversial concepts toward free energy.
 
You are following your standard book of play here. The same methods and even the phrases you like to use can be seen throughout numerous threads in multiple venues, even on YouTube.

So now I know what your purpose is I am through wasting time on you. Go right ahead and continue your efforts to discredit and undermine what I am trying to accomplish. It will have no affect.

To everyone reading this.
Don't accept my word for this. Skim through all of the posts made by Tinselkoala on this forum, then Google different energy forums along with that member name. See it for yourself.

Adiós

Be sure and list all the times I've been _wrong_ about magnet motor builders in my judgements while you are doing all this googling.  This forum "and a few others"? Why don't you list those other forums, with some links that support your contentions? Why don't you list some things that I've tried to "repress" that turned out to be worthwhile and true? When have I ever tried to stop _actual scientific experimentation_? When have I ever discouraged _proper measurements_ and _proper control experiments_?  I know the answers to these questions. Do you?

In another week, month and year there will STILL be no self-running magnet motor coming from you or any of your "replicators".... as cristopalba says... replicators of what?? You've shown no evidence that your claims are true.... because you cannot, because they aren't.

Go ahead and prove me wrong. You cannot. Google me all you like, do you think that will help you to prove me wrong when I say that you don't have what you claim, you never have had, and that your friends are wasting their time? I laugh at you. And in a week, while you are googling away, I'll still be laughing. And in a month, and in a year, I'll be the one still laughing, not you. Google away! But you don't have a working magnet motor, you never have had, and none of your friends will be able to make one, with or without your "help".

And it's "effect" not "affect". Hey, you can waste _your_ time all you like, by trying to build something that you can demonstrate. I've got nothing against that.  But when you use your false claims to sucker other people into wasting _their_ time and creativity and money, that's when you cross the line from being a "sincere gentleman" into being an outright False Claimant. And if someone gives you material support because of your claims, like they did for Mylow, for instance... then you become a Fraudster on top of that.

Come on, google away.... but the only way you and your cultists will be able to PROVE ME WRONG is to produce some evidence that your claims are true... but you cannot. And you know it, which is why you are running away instead of refuting me with facts, proper experimental data and actual demonstrations of your own. Adiós! But you'll be back.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on October 23, 2015, 11:30:22 AM

Chet K - Rather disappointed in your comments also!

To be honest I really did expect a bit more from you!!!

Well, I always have said, "I try to learn something every day", and Brad is about the only one on this entire forum that does any work! All the Douche Bags that claim to know everything are in fact the farthest behind!!! Its an Arrogance thing!!!

I have about 6 Names in my head right now that are the only Elephants in the Room Chet K, and you've just been added to the list Pal!

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org

You have still provided NO EVIDENCE that your "overunity" and "free energy" claims are true. Because you can't! You don't even know how to use your own test equipment properly. Add names to your list all you like, it won't help you to prove your claims. After all.... your claims of "free energy" from your coil arrangements (which are not unusual and appear in just about every modern power supply)  are simply false.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: massive on October 23, 2015, 11:35:51 AM
Howard Johnson dedicated a large chunk of his life to magnet motor design and successfully got a patent.

"Energy from the vacuum part 4" DVD shows his linear motor and the possible thrust when designed correctly

http://www.energyfromthevacuum.com/Disc4HoJo/index.html

http://freeenergynews.com/Directory/Howard_Johnson_Motor/1979Paper/

magnet motors are definitely a reality and acheivable BUT .....itd take a super dedicated researcher or team


All the best of luck


Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: EMJunkie on October 23, 2015, 11:36:41 AM
You have still provided NO EVIDENCE that your "overunity" and "free energy" claims are true. Because you can't! You don't even know how to use your own test equipment properly. Add names to your list all you like, it won't help you to prove your claims. After all.... your claims of "free energy" from your coil arrangements (which are not unusual and appear in just about every modern power supply)  are simply false.

TK, I told you I was not going to provide you with any measurement data. Yet you and the other Idiots still sit on your High Horse and Complain!!! All you and the other Idiots want is a free breakfast! Not to have to think, not to have to work... We are not your Slaves you pompous Old Git!!!

I gave the forum a Concept.

Some took the concept and learnt from it...

You, TK, Known all over the world as a CIA Troll, Stamped your Feet and had a big cry baby!!!

Hahaha, you can never get away from the Reputation of CIA Troll you old Douche Bag!!!

TK, I have an Idea, how about replicate Brads RT, he gave you how many videos with instructions.... Oh that's right, you did, and CANT!!!

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org

P.S: To the owner of this Thread, sorry for venting on this thread! Don't put up with the Goon Squad, Complain to Stefan! It does work!!! Oh look at that, its "ramset" Chet K...
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: MileHigh on October 23, 2015, 11:48:55 AM
Magnet motors turn up like clockwork and they are all dead as door nails because of a few simple facts.

But wow, from the EF thread this clip is amazing:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNOhuYaU1WI

That has got to be the spookiest and most atmospheric magnetic motor clip I have ever seen!  It's like it is right out of the movie "Saw" or something.  Or it's a Walking Dead magnetic motor dead alive!

Positively creepy and just in time for Halloween.  The motor is infected with the malevolent spirit of Howard Johnson.  It's the demon seed of Mylow coming back to get you.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 23, 2015, 12:37:40 PM
Chris
You fiddle while Rome burns ,the only reason your thread has activity is due to honest hardworking experimenters looking for the truth.
specifically Brad at this point ,...he understands completely that you run looking for adversary and people willing to knock your claims
it is the only way to rule out error in your work [unless you have something running on nothing ...with gain].

cartoons, jokes,  insults and make believe CIA enemies [here] get old pretty quickly.

you started a topic with a definite claim ...now you fill it with other peoples claims and seem to fall away from your own ,refusing any sort of evidence whatsoever but insisting we believe you and waste countless hours of time Looking for an effect you won't even describe ??

quite true you don't see any replicators in "your" thread ,you can tell yourself its because their lazy....

if that's what floats your boat.

but I believe you must have made an error and are too proud to admit it ,your personality seems more inclined to insult than helping humanity ,you take too much delight in this [insult] and seem much more interested in _that_ then helping others understand what you claim to have.

Pointing to Gunderson's work or the work of others is not good enuff

how about pointing to your own work?

Brad asked you yesterday to show "anything" and your response is to imply he is doing good ???
doesn't even make sense??


Chet K

 



maybe you should have a good look in the mirror



Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: EMJunkie on October 23, 2015, 01:27:02 PM
Chris
You fiddle while Rome burns ,the only reason your thread has activity is due to honest hardworking experimenters looking for the truth.
specifically Brad at this point ,...he understands completely that you run looking for adversary and people willing to knock your claims
it is the only way to rule out error in your work [unless you have something running on nothing ...with gain].

cartoons jokes  insults and make believe CIA enemies [here] get old pretty quickly.

you started a topic with a definite claim ...now you fill it with other peoples claims and seem to fall away from your own ,refusing any sort of evidence whatsoever but insisting we believe you and waste countless hours of time Looking for am effect you won't even describe ??

quite true you don't see any replicators in "your" thread ,you can tell yourself its because their lazy....

if that's what floats your boat.

Chet K

 



maybe you should have a good look in the mirror.


Chet K - Good thread, shame it is now the Home of the Goon Squad!

EDIT: Frustrated Rant Removed...

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 23, 2015, 01:36:05 PM
Chris
I am not sure what you are trying to say here but you seem quite passionate about it.

as far as goon squad ?? your a much better fit with the jokesters and funny boys than myself.



but I must say if you think you can play Brad like a lap dog


Good luck with that :o
-----------------------------------------------------------

Chets Quote to Chris above

Brad asked you yesterday to show "anything" and your response is to imply he is doing good ???
doesn't even make sense??

end quote


Chet K
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: EMJunkie on October 23, 2015, 01:42:41 PM
Chris
I am not sure what you are trying to say here but you seem quite passionate about it.

as far as goon squad ?? your a much better fit with the jokesters and funny boys than myself.



but I must say if you think you can play Brad like a lap dog


Good luck with that :o
-----------------------------------------------------------

Chets Quote to Chris above

Brad asked you yesterday to show "anything" and your response is to imply he is doing good ???
doesn't even make sense??

end quote


Chet K

Chet K, how about you suggest to Brad, create his own Thread and show his work there, see if he is in awe of your God like presence and does as you command?

I am sure he will turn around and tell you, he is a big boy and can make decisions for himself! Unlike you!

I already know you are "Not Sure" and that you "Don't Understand", I am sorry, I can not help with these issues!

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 23, 2015, 01:52:03 PM
That's a nice "sideways" response .

you fancy yourself a teacher??

teach.

or go back to posting funny stuff , insults, current events and weather reports ??

its up to you.

Chet K
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: EMJunkie on October 23, 2015, 01:54:15 PM
That's a nice "sideways" response .

you fancy yourself a teacher??

teach.

or go back to posting funny stuff and insults ??

its up to you.

Chet K


I am a Student of Life Chet K...

An Explorer...

Seems you are not!

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 23, 2015, 02:00:31 PM
Well you have definitely mastered Humor

can we move on??

Chet K
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: PIH123 on October 23, 2015, 04:41:32 PM
I honestly have no idea why he does what he does[ refuses testing or public investigation ]

I find it funny that Brad's very thorough  investigations are happening in a thread where there has never been an investigation of EMJunkies initial claim or anything ??[at least that I am aware]
not even a black box investigation ??
ZERO Zilch NADA ??


I totally agree with that sentiment.

And it is precisely why I would put MadMacks device in the same category.


TK has offered a very reasonable and SIMPLE method for baseline testing, which would take minutes to do.
All replicators have the ability with almost no cost (maybe the price of a piece of string) to do this.

Yet none have (or ever will).


This is the elephant as far as I am concerned.



And I also agree with what you say about Tinman. A good honest experimenter / replicator.

Pete
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 23, 2015, 05:33:40 PM
A spin down test,  or input over output  is self evident to a true builder .

 IT IS NOT SOME HOLY REVELATION... How else could you possibly guage results ??








Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: massive on October 23, 2015, 09:39:03 PM

Has anyone seen the "Energy from the vacuum " part 4 DVD ??????????????

http://www.energyfromthevacuum.com/Disc4HoJo/index.html

DVD is Howard Johnson himself talking and demonstrating his linear motor and magnetic thrust in his house, 2005

none of this is youtube



Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 24, 2015, 03:32:23 PM
massive
I was unaware of any such movie from 2005

here is an unusual statement from your link



Howard Johnson writes:
 
 

QUANTUM MECHANICAL MOLECULAR ENERGY
 
 

This is stimulation of high molecular energy by shaded pole electron spins that produce powerful parallel spins releasing high energy discharges when they revert to their original anti-parallel spin state.
 
   This lasts only one to three hundredths of a second and is ten thousand times stronger than the direct magnetic interaction

-------------------------------------------------------

would be nice to see those vids !!

Chet
 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: sm0ky2 on October 24, 2015, 05:36:52 PM
Has anyone seen the "Energy from the vacuum " part 4 DVD ??????????????

http://www.energyfromthevacuum.com/Disc4HoJo/index.html

DVD is Howard Johnson himself talking and demonstrating his linear motor and magnetic thrust in his house, 2005

none of this is youtube

Looks like a nice vid, I don't have $30 to give to Tom's empire right now, but it might be worth the watch.


To chet::

H.J. uses a lot of terminology he coined himself. The effect, however, is a real scientific occurrence. 
The natural state of a magnetic material, radiates a magnetic field of a given strength.
When two magnets interact, the shape and density of this field changes.

In certain configurations, field density can become greater than the magnetization energy of the material in localized areas.
This can cause a temporary field interaction with an exponentially greater field strength than the combined fields of the two magnets.
the "rest state" of a magnetized material is balanced, in terms of electron interaction. They don't compete with each other for orbital space.
When you distort the field, this balance is no longer possible. Now, two passing electrons are occupying less space. This means the field they create will be more intense.
[xEv/c^2]/(volume) +/- a quantum factor and some variables that don't "really matter" here.
the closer the electrons get to each other, the greater the energies of the interactions.
bottom line is, the more you compress the field (with a factor of the materials properties), the more "magnetism" is produced in the compressed region.

There is a give and take, the shape of the field becomes asymmetrical, and field density is not a linear gradient, there are weak areas, and strong areas.
the strong areas are what H.J. studied. and specifically, the moment of maximum field intensity.

What Howard figured out was that he could use magnets of one type to compress the field of a small piece of a much stronger type of magnet,
and obtain much greater field maximums
 for instance, using ceramic ferrite to compress the field of samarium cobalt

Now, when you have fields that are "partially compressed", and you bring a 3rd, moving  magnet into play -
  the changes in field intensities can cause a motive force on the 3rd magnet.

This is most easily demonstrated in Howard Johnson's linear gate, here two opposing fields are placed a distance apart, and a 3rd opposing magnet is introduced.
at each junction along the tracks, the field compresses in one direction, then releases in the other, pushing the roller-magnet along
it is only "linear", because the force is equal on both sides of the round roller balls. the actual force-vector is an arc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6F9I5OiSTE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6F9I5OiSTE)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: massive on October 24, 2015, 10:05:12 PM
people unconsciously give $30 to the oil empire without a second thought .

broadband , TV guide , biscuits , news papers , snack food ....list goes on of pointless consumerism , it takes very little effort to hurl $30 into the vacuum

The DVD is interesting but you have to be aware he is 80 odd years old in 2005 . his life experience via WW2, the secracy surrounding that generation , his unconventional path choice and the opposition from established theory

at the end of the day the MAGNETS DO THE TALKING in the demonstrations , proof he was right even before he begun in 1945

he was into spintronics before everyone else caught up

Beardens products are expensive when converted to NZ $
I use dial up and anything else to  save some pinga's , I consider the DVD a good purchase and  good evidence

so if someone says they are going to make a permanent magnet motor , I know that they certainly can , I just dont know HOW

as for the DVD , I have give it 5 stars .... recommended 8)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on October 24, 2015, 10:47:22 PM
SmOky2
in your vid  here  >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6F9I5OiSTE

the sides can move in and out [we see them do this]
does it still work if they are held firm , thank you for your comments and insight on this topic ,they are greatly appreciated.

thx for sharing ,and to be clear for persons unaware,  Smoky doesn't play games [slopes and such].


@Massive , we are discussing how to legally and respectfully post certain vids here[for educational purposes]
just the " Educational parts".
and below I repost a link you shared here ,which also mirror's SmOky2's comments on the "Arc"
and which has some familiarity with Mack's design.

link http://freeenergynews.com/Directory/Howard_Johnson_Motor/1979Paper/


thx
Chet
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on November 12, 2015, 08:28:09 PM
Cristian Is sharing some progress
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-23.html?s=927734f83e0c117ce117e3f833d519d0

Mack if you read here please let us Know how your doing ?
thx
ChetKremens@gmail.com
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on November 13, 2015, 11:02:11 PM
And another week... or is it three weeks... go by and there is _still_ no working magnet motor coming from Mack or any of his builders. And in another week, another month, another year, there will _still_ be no working magnet motor coming out of those efforts.

Come on people, why can't you get your act together and REFUTE ME?

I know why, lots of other people know why, and even you faithful builders are beginning to know why too. It's hilarious to me that you won't even perform the actual, valid, scientific tests I've proposed, because "I" proposed them.


(By the way, builders.... the best, inexpensive, easy to find ball bearings and matching shafts are available in the Helicopter parts section of your Local Hobby Shop, for the 450 and larger sized conventional helicopters like the TRex etc.  And the lowest friction (for the light loads of your typical rotor application) will be obtained from these bearings if they are _absolutely clean and degreased_ with MEK and then blown out with compressed air. The bearing grease seals, shields and any grease or oil will just add more drag.)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: CANGAS on November 14, 2015, 05:34:50 AM
Excellent advice, Tinselk!

The marvelous little internal combustion engines for model cars, boats, and, air craft can be persuaded to cough up their very lovely crankshaft bearings also, which are also very good for low friction bearings.


have a nice day
CANGAS 196
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on November 22, 2015, 08:33:05 AM
And _another week_ goes by without any working magnet motor from the guru Mack and his disciples. And it has even been nearly a week since anyone has even bothered to post on the thread at EF. Are they all busy sitting in their workshops watching their magic magnet motors spinning away perpetually?

Somehow... I doubt it.

And in another week, month, year from today.... we will see the same thing: No working magnet motor from Mack or his believers.

You have been hoaxed, people, by a "sincere gentleman" who didn't even have to show you _anything at all_, much less a faked YouTube video.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: sm0ky2 on November 22, 2015, 07:59:48 PM
SmOky2
in your vid  here  >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6F9I5OiSTE

the sides can move in and out [we see them do this]
does it still work if they are held firm , thank you for your comments and insight on this topic ,they are greatly appreciated.

thx for sharing ,and to be clear for persons unaware,  Smoky doesn't play games [slopes and such].

thx
Chet

ahh, yes that's just cause I had them sitting loosely on the floor.
 H.J.'s original demonstration the linear rails were secured firmly on a wooden track.

the operating principal is what I was trying to show there.
It is the same magnetic function that is performed by the Tri-Force and other such "magnetic gates"
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on November 30, 2015, 11:17:35 PM
Has it been _another week_ gone by already? Yes, it has, and still no self running magnet motor from Mack or any of his builders at EF.

In fact the whole Mack thread has even dropped off the first page at EF, as people like BroMikey are working on other things now.
Nobody has even bothered to comment on their "progress" in two weeks or more.

Yes, I'll keep reminding you lot that in a week, a month, and a year there will _still_ be no self running magnet motor from Mack or anybody else trying to build something from his false claims and bogus "design". But will the builders admit defeat, will they acknowledge that I am right and have been right _all along_ and _yet again_ ? Not very likely... as in all religions, when the prophecies don't come to pass they will just move the goalposts again. Well, let's wait another week (month, year) and see what happens.

You have been hoaxed, people, and your guru the "sincere gentleman" Mack himself has already left the building, with his perfect exit strategy in place. And he didn't even have to show you a fake motor!

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on December 01, 2015, 09:56:23 PM
It is very chilly in here...
Who  turned off the heat ?? (Stefan and his belt tightening stuff...I told him that LED convection heater was a scamm,.

Tinsel,
 I,m not feeling the love over here... Don't you know we don't know it all ?

MACK went in for a surgery and has not been heard from..
I sincerely appreciate you keeping the spot warm for him..
Sincerely

Chet
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: shylo on December 01, 2015, 10:02:18 PM
I think were close but what I've seen so far will find balance.
Maybe Mack hasn't given the final clue yet.
just saying artv
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on December 02, 2015, 01:41:03 AM
we shall see ....?

In the mean time here is one of the MACK builders and some info on magnetism he Sincerely wants to share.

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20331-enlightened-magnetism-full-proof-ken-wheelers-theories.html?

part one of the Movie series here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etaYzqtEnDw&feature=youtu.be
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on December 02, 2015, 02:11:16 AM
we shall see ....?

In the mean time here is one of the MACK builders and some info on magnetism he Sincerely wants to share.

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20331-enlightened-magnetism-full-proof-ken-wheelers-theories.html?

part one of the Movie series here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etaYzqtEnDw&feature=youtu.be

Ohhhhh dear Chet-->really :o UFOpolotics.
His video clearly shows you !once again!  just how clueless he is in what he is doing,and what he is seeing in his results. He shows nothing more than a magnetic field varying in time-the very thing needed to create an EMF across an inductor-be it that single turn copper plate,or the multi turn coil.

The magnetic field changes in time in regards to the position of the coil when he drop's the steel core on top of the magnet. Once again DUFO shows nothing out of the ordinary. In fact,i cant believe he dosnt understand as to why the spike is the same when he turns both the magnet and coil over.

Next video,he will turn his scope upside down ,and show us how the spike is now inverted.
UFOpolotice clearly belongs at energetic forum :D


Brad
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on December 02, 2015, 02:45:20 AM
I have to agree with Brad on this.  Dufo is very much a self proclaimed expert about everything.  Over and over he posted his pretty CAD drawings on Mack's thread.  And over and over Mack had to correct what Dufo was claiming.  I am still undecided about Mack and after the holidays I want to get back to work on trying some more of his ideas.  I have already seen that some of what he has told us is true.  But as far as Dufo, watching anything he posts or writes is a waste of time.  He has a proven track record of failures.  Just check out his assy  motor thread.

Carroll
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Jimboot on December 02, 2015, 03:23:03 AM
Excellent advice, Tinselk!

The marvelous little internal combustion engines for model cars, boats, and, air craft can be persuaded to cough up their very lovely crankshaft bearings also, which are also very good for low friction bearings.


have a nice day
CANGAS 196
The best I have found are out of VCR tape heads

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 02, 2015, 08:54:09 AM
It is very chilly in here...
Who  turned off the heat ?? (Stefan and his belt tightening stuff...I told him that LED convection heater was a scamm,.

Tinsel,
 I,m not feeling the love over here... Don't you know we don't know it all ?

MACK went in for a surgery and has not been heard from..
I sincerely appreciate you keeping the spot warm for him..
Sincerely

Chet
We don't know it all, that's for sure, but there are some things we _do_ know for sure, and I know for sure that Mack and his "self running magnet motor" are fakes and will never yield a working item.
 
I don't object to people doing research. What I do object to is being told lies, and I object to other people being suckered in by liars and the lies they tell.

What is your evidence that Mack went in for a surgery? Oh... that's right... Mack told you this.

When someone who has a track record of truth, verifiable demonstrations and good performance like some people we know, I'll believe them when they say they are ill, hurting and/or in the hospital.

When someone makes outrageous unsupported claims from the very beginning, leads a bunch of well meaning people down a garden path for months, and then disappears with some excuse or other... I'll put as much faith in that convenient excuse as I do in the rest of what he's posted.

That thread has now dropped off the first page on EF's table of contents, and the main proponents, BroMikey and UFOPolitics, are spending time doing other things now. A reasonable person might draw some conclusions from those facts.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 02, 2015, 09:03:33 AM
Ohhhhh dear Chet-->really :o UFOpolotics.
His video clearly shows you !once again!  just how clueless he is in what he is doing,and what he is seeing in his results. He shows nothing more than a magnetic field varying in time-the very thing needed to create an EMF across an inductor-be it that single turn copper plate,or the multi turn coil.

The magnetic field changes in time in regards to the position of the coil when he drop's the steel core on top of the magnet. Once again DUFO shows nothing out of the ordinary. In fact,i cant believe he dosnt understand as to why the spike is the same when he turns both the magnet and coil over.

Next video,he will turn his scope upside down ,and show us how the spike is now inverted.
UFOpolotice clearly belongs at energetic forum :D


Brad

Exactly. UFOP is showing his ignorance and is actually _confirming_ the conventional viewpoint, as others are telling him in that thread. He has tried to construct a demonstration that "proves" Kenny's theory, rather than designing a true experiment that could potentially disprove it. And he has failed even in that.

Wheeler's ideas are fanciful art, or rather cartoons, nothing more. Have any of the Believers actually put his "heat emitting overunity" bismuth ball-plus-magnet into an insulated container with a thermometer to see if the temperature rises yet? That simple little experiment has the _potential_ to prove him wrong yet again, and the Believers cannot withstand any such challenges to their faith.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on December 02, 2015, 02:37:14 PM
here is a man showing why the shape Mack utilizes in his ramps can be quite tempting in the possibility department...
got this from Mark Dansies site

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=youtube+magnet+rolling+on+narrow+triangle+metal+a+simple+magnet+ramp&view=detail&mid=C282B6872F6A1B508DEBC282B6872F6A1B508DEB&FORM=VIRE1
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 02, 2015, 11:38:01 PM
here is a man showing why the shape Mack utilizes in his ramps can be quite tempting in the possibility department...
got this from Mark Dansies site

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=youtube+magnet+rolling+on+narrow+triangle+metal+a+simple+magnet+ramp&view=detail&mid=C282B6872F6A1B508DEBC282B6872F6A1B508DEB&FORM=VIRE1 (http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=youtube+magnet+rolling+on+narrow+triangle+metal+a+simple+magnet+ramp&view=detail&mid=C282B6872F6A1B508DEBC282B6872F6A1B508DEB&FORM=VIRE1)

Actually it's Yet Another video showing simply that magnets are attracted to metal, with Mister Hand first placing the magnet at a location where magnetic potential energy is high and releasing the magnet so it can travel to a place where MPE is low.

Guess what: you can put a weight on a table, then push it off and let it fall to the ground. The weight moves from a position where gravitational potential energy is high to one where it is lower, and work must be done to move it back again to where the energy is high (back onto the table). You get out what you put in, minus losses.
Or hold a magnet a small distance away from a block of iron and release it and watch it jump over and stick to the iron. Big deal! Whoopie!  Make a video and claim that it is "quite tempting"! Because it is exactly the same phenomenon that is demonstrated in that video. Again, you get out what you put in, minus losses.

There is _no_ configuration of ramps, stators, whatever, that will result in putting energy IN to a rotational system like the "Mack Motor" alleged design, and the proper experimental testing that I have been advocating will show this to be true, quite easily. All will only add drag (or in the best case do nothing), and will make the rotor come to a stop faster when its initial starting energy is used up. And that is exactly why none of the Believers will actually do (or rather _report_) the testing -- they are afraid to acknowledge that their entire premise is simply wrong and that their Guru has duped them. But you can bet your bippy that they are each discovering this fact on their own in their own ways, which is why that thread has dropped off the front page and the builders have moved on to other things.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on December 03, 2015, 03:06:47 PM
well
magnets climbing vertically against gravity .. while carrying a spinning paperclip ..does give me pause to contemplate the "what ifs"
and also the fact that Macks ramps are more or less EXACTLY this shape ..

Mack did say "think in three dimensions ' not two ,

gives pause for thought IMO.

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=youtube+magnet+rolling+on+narrow+triangle+metal+a+simple+magnet+ramp&view=detail&mid=C282B6872F6A1B508DEBC282B6872F6A1B508DEB&FORM=VIRE1

Chet
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on December 03, 2015, 03:25:51 PM
well
magnets climbing vertically against gravity .. while carrying a spinning paperclip ..does give me pause to contemplate the "what ifs"
and also the fact that Macks ramps are more or less EXACTLY this shape ..

Mack did say "think in three dimensions ' not two ,

gives pause for thought IMO.

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=youtube+magnet+rolling+on+narrow+triangle+metal+a+simple+magnet+ramp&view=detail&mid=C282B6872F6A1B508DEBC282B6872F6A1B508DEB&FORM=VIRE1

Chet

No,no,no Chet-nothing out of the ordinary happening there.
But the one below will be a little harder for the guru's to dismiss.
How will they explain acceleration of a mass that can actually leave the gate at the end of the run?.

This one starts at a stand still,rolls up hill,and exit's the gate.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNijcXPcTs0
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on December 03, 2015, 04:06:02 PM
If there are any of you that are working on the magnet motor idea I have suggestion for you.  TK has insisted we need a way to test what we are doing.  While I don't disagree with that, his idea for a test is not really a good test in my opinion.  I think I have found a better way to test your magnet motor ideas.   The first thing you need is a small DC motor with nice smooth bearings and low drag from the brushes.  Mount your rotor of your magnet motor on the shaft of the DC motor.  When you think you are getting close to a successful build then power up the DC motor with as low a voltage as you can use to get it to keep rotating.  If you have an ammeter in series with the DC motor you can easily see if any changes are an improvement or not.  If you hit the winning combination your DC motor will then become a generator and the current will reverse proving you have made a successful magnet motor.

Carroll
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 03, 2015, 04:21:16 PM
No,no,no Chet-nothing out of the ordinary happening there.
But the one below will be a little harder for the guru's to dismiss.
How will they explain acceleration of a mass that can actually leave the gate at the end of the run?.

This one starts at a stand still,rolls up hill,and exit's the gate.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNijcXPcTs0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNijcXPcTs0)

Oh come on. In each trial, Mister Hand places the magnet roller in a place where it is Drawn In to the first gate. That is, it is being placed in a position of stored MPE. Except of course for the trial that begins at about 2:19 (after a couple of _failed_ starts), where you can clearly see that he actually _pushes_ the roller along to get it started.
These things do not work!
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 03, 2015, 04:27:34 PM
If there are any of you that are working on the magnet motor idea I have suggestion for you.  TK has insisted we need a way to test what we are doing.  While I don't disagree with that, his idea for a test is not really a good test in my opinion.  I think I have found a better way to test your magnet motor ideas.   The first thing you need is a small DC motor with nice smooth bearings and low drag from the brushes.  Mount your rotor of your magnet motor on the shaft of the DC motor.  When you think you are getting close to a successful build then power up the DC motor with as low a voltage as you can use to get it to keep rotating.  If you have an ammeter in series with the DC motor you can easily see if any changes are an improvement or not.  If you hit the winning combination your DC motor will then become a generator and the current will reverse proving you have made a successful magnet motor.

Carroll

I've suggested at least two valid ways of testing. Your suggestion is similar to my second method: Use a motor or other power source (I prefer a blast of compressed air since it is a non-contact method) to spin your rotor up to a known measured RPM, remove the power, and time how long it takes to come to a stop from that RPM. A variation is to spin the rotor up faster than some reference RPM, remove the power and start timing as the rotor slows past your reference RPM.
Obviously this requires some precise measurements: time, and speed. I've shown how to do this in a different setup using Arduino to "do it all": the Arduino records "lap time" for a ball rolling around a track and also computes the kinetic energy of the ball from its speed and its mass. This method could be easily adapted to a turning rotor to give the data that you need to tell if any changes actually improve (add energy during each rotation) or hurt by adding drag.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on December 03, 2015, 10:03:54 PM
Hi!
"These things do not work"
It's the truth...
Sorry ;)

You sound like a broken record.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: seychelles on December 04, 2015, 05:21:32 AM
SO EDEGEN WHAT BRILLIANT IDEAS HAVE YOU BROUGHT FORWARD
SINCE YOU HAVE BEEN BORN.. WHY JUST CRITICIZE OTHER PEOPLE CONTRIBUTIONS
COME WITH YOU OWN IDEAS OR MAYBE PUSH FORWARD SOME OTHER PEOPLES
IDEAS THAT WILL BE GREAT,, THANKS MATE..OR IF YOU WANT ME TO PROVE TO YOU
THAT IT WORK PLEASE PUT YOUR MONEY WHERE YOUR OPINION IS.. SEND ME SOME BUCKS
AND I WILL GUARANTY YOU I WILL DELIVER..
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: shylo on December 05, 2015, 12:18:10 AM
free energy is impossible
you gotta put something in to get something out
But if if you can put 1 joule of work in, and get 2 joules out ,or better than 1,
now your talking
artv
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on December 05, 2015, 09:02:04 AM
Well
I know I didn't pay for any of the stuff around here?
look at that beautiful ocean and that nice warm Sun.... Blue skys stuff growing everywhere... all you can eat...

"the Universe the ultimate free Lunch"

@Indegent
Did somebody give you a bill for all of this ??

??

nothing but gratitude over here...

Chet
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 08, 2015, 02:47:36 AM
Has it been _another week_ gone by already? Yes, it has, and still no self running magnet motor from Mack or any of his builders at EF.
--------

And another week goes by.....    :'(
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: kiwi3 on December 14, 2015, 09:29:27 AM
I have followed these threads of free energy/overunity for years and am amazed at how the naysayers outnumber the cando's manyfold.
I am intrigued why this is.
Mad Mack says a magnet motor is possible.
TK says it is not
So why should we believe TK and not Mad Mack ?

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 15, 2015, 11:21:42 AM
And another week goes by.....    :'(

And another week goes by.....   :-[

My how time flies when you are building self-running permanent magnet motors... or rather..... _NOT_ building them.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Paul-R on December 15, 2015, 04:18:32 PM
free energy is impossible
you gotta put something in to get something out
But if if you can put 1 joule of work in, and get 2 joules out ,or better than 1,
now your talking
artv
You miss the point. The extra energy gets put in, but not by you. (A photocell connected to a motor would appear to be free energy back in the Middle Ages).
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Nink on December 15, 2015, 04:23:37 PM
And another week goes by.....   :-[

My how time flies when you are building self-running permanent magnet motors... or rather..... _NOT_ building them.

He built a self running permanent magnetic quad copter and it flew away.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 17, 2015, 03:15:31 AM
It's the damn MIB again.  Those guys are really starting to be a pain.

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 17, 2015, 06:27:39 AM
Now I'm really ROFLing!  The great Mack builder BroMikey has just posted two links to two copies of the same video of a "working magnet motor"  that someone else just posted to YouTube.

There is just one problem.... the video is one of MYLOW's videos, originally posted six years ago.

That's right friends. The MYLOW story is still happening.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: MileHigh on December 17, 2015, 07:59:31 AM
Now I'm really ROFLing!  The great Mack builder BroMikey has just posted two links to two copies of the same video of a "working magnet motor"  that someone else just posted to YouTube.

There is just one problem.... the video is one of MYLOW's videos, originally posted six years ago.

That's right friends. The MYLOW story is still happening.

He must be a Fifth Column/False Flag/MIB/PTB/CIA/Entartiste extraordinaire.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: kiwi3 on December 17, 2015, 10:40:14 AM
I have been following the free energy/overunity threads for a few years and am amazed at how the naysayers outnumber the cando's manyfold.
Why is this ?
Mad mack says a magnet motor is possible.
TK says it is not.
So why should we believe TK and not Mad Mack ?
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 19, 2015, 04:11:19 AM
Now I'm really ROFLing!  The great Mack builder BroMikey has just posted two links to two copies of the same video of a "working magnet motor"  that someone else just posted to YouTube.

There is just one problem.... the video is one of MYLOW's videos, originally posted six years ago.

That's right friends. The MYLOW story is still happening.

Damn!  We are still haunted by the Mylow affair.  I thought that was put to bed years ago...but, I suppose, some other folks watch the videos and "rediscover' the genius of his scam with the electric motor and fishing line. ("You can turn it off now Tony...turn it off.")

I still think the bird was in on it in some way.

@Kiwi3;

We should believe TK because he knows what he is talking about and has made and published, hundreds of videos of demonstrations.  He has also been the lead investigator in busting many, many scammers (Including Mylow) and, he has also freely shared his knowledge with the rest of us and has helped folks understand electronics and proper measuring methods.

Check out his Youtube channel and then get back to us.

I believe you will have answered your own question by then.

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 19, 2015, 09:21:04 AM
I have been following the free energy/overunity threads for a few years and am amazed at how the naysayers outnumber the cando's manyfold.
Why is this ?
Mad mack says a magnet motor is possible.
TK says it is not.
So why should we believe TK and not Mad Mack ?

Believe whomever you like.

But consider this: There is no evidence whatsoever that the things Mack has said, about having built a self running magnet motor, the NDA story, the disappearance due to medical issues.... no evidence at all that any of that story is true. You have only Mack's self-reports to go by, and he hasn't even bothered to show you a YT video or even a still photo or a blueprint! I'm amazed that anyone believed him at all, really, since he provided absolutely no evidence at all for any of it.
 
On the other hand you have a lot of evidence, and hundreds of years of scientific experimentation, plus lots of consistent, never-proven-wrong theoretical analyses, that all say that a self running magnet motor is impossible. And you have lots and lots of hoaxers, like Mylow, Mike Brady, and others who have made false claims of building these things, some of whom have been caught out -- Brady even went to jail -- and others who have simply faded away (like Mack), but nobody has ever had a self running magnet motor verified by credible independent testers. Nobody, ever. Let that sink in for a while.

So if you want to believe Mack, you will be wasting your time, money, and creative efforts on something that is doomed to fail and has no credibility and no solid theoretical backing at all. If you believe me, then you can spend that time, money and creative juice doing something else, that maybe has a chance of being productive, educational or even "cool". It's 100 percent your choice. Just remember YOLO.

Meanwhile, in another week, month, year... there will _still_ be no self-running magnet motor from the absent guru Mack -- a "sincere gentleman" -- or any of his disciples.

I have nothing against people doing research and trying new ideas. But I have not seen a "new idea" in the permanent magnet motor world in ages. The closest thing to a new idea was Steorn's core-effect motors, and of course they are externally electrically powered.  All these ramps, shields, angled magnets, inside-out things, rotating stators, etc. are all old ideas, some of them actually _hundreds of years_ old.  What I am against is people who lie about what they have done, and who try to fool others into wasting their time "replicating" something that doesn't exist in the first place, never did, and is impossible anyhow.  Mylow finally admitted his hoaxing, after his videos were analyzed and his methods exposed and even replicated. Mack is smarter -- he didn't provide anything like a video that could be analyzed! Or any other evidence, either.

So believe whomever you like. If you believe Mack, though, your faith is religious, not scientific, because it depends on claims of impossible things, miracles really, made without any evidence at all to back them up.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dbowling on December 19, 2015, 09:59:50 AM
I have to agree with SEVERAL things TK said. When Mack first posted and I took a look at what he was having people build, one of my FIRST comments on the thread was that it would be hard to do without some serious machine tools. His reply was that he did it all with hand tools. I found that a little hard to swallow. I also have a hard time believing the story about the NDA with all the things he has shared. I have a VERY hard time believing that someone who built a WORKING device has not a single photo or video of it to show, and no longer has the device itself.


So in my mind I HAVE to discount Mack as a credible witness completely. Maybe he is for real, or maybe he is a total fraud. Or maybe he is a guy who wants others to do the work because he is too broke or lazy to do it himself.


What I am left with are the details of the build itself. There are some things about this build that intrigue me. The idea of balanced rotor stator/magnets so that there is no attraction or repulsion, was VERY interesting, and I was able to get that to happen. I had NOT seen this before and if it has come up in the PAST, I would love for someone to point out to me WHERE. I was also able to see that by using the ramp as a shield, you could actually get the repulsion of the rotor magnet at the appropriate time. LOTS of folks have worked with this concept, so nothing new here. I could also see how you could use the ramp to attract the incoming rotor magnet. Some folks have worked with this concept, but Mack seems to have taken it a couple steps beyond anything that I have seen before. And then there is THIS video...  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTcw6NPn9BQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTcw6NPn9BQ)


As far as ACTUAL CONSTRUCTION DETAILS, everything has worked EXACTLY as Mack said it would. I have always been, and always will be a skeptic. Until I see it working on MY bench, I have my reservations. But when everything works EXACTLY as the guy said it would, you have to wonder if there might not be something to this.


Whether he ever comes back to share more or disappears into the woodwork remains to be seen. I will continue to work on this project not because I have any faith in Mack, but because of what I have seen on my bench. Besides, ALL hobbies are a waste of time and money, aren't they???

Oh, and even if it works, will it have enough power to actually DO any work? There are other things that show far more promise of meeting THAT goal than THIS, but I still can't abandon it.
Dave
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 20, 2015, 09:47:53 AM
The most recent post from MadMack that I can find was made on the 26th of October, post #632 in the thread on EF. And today is the 20th of December.

55 days have passed since Mack posted "Unfortunately I have little time. There is a surgery for me in a couple of days and I will be out of touch afterwards, hopefully only for a week or two."

55 days is almost 8 weeks.

I am afraid that Elvis has left the building.

Quote
And then there is THIS video...  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTcw6NPn9BQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTcw6NPn9BQ)

Seriously? You think a video that shows that a magnet is attracted to some metal, and is more attracted to more metal, is somehow important to your efforts?
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on December 20, 2015, 04:02:23 PM
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTcw6NPn9BQ

Its cool to see and the comparison between that action/shape and Macks Ramp shape are quite similar and I have never personally seen this before. along with some of the other things Dave has mentioned about Macks Device.
  while you may have spent millennia with these things trying to get them to work or Vetting claims..
some of us have a different frame of reference, and are intrigued .

I know it is VERY VERY easy to stand on the hallowed and righteous ground of your belief system and roll your logs of wisdom down upon the "Magnetically challenged".

IMO this _Magnet Thing_ and all its possibilities hasn't scratched the surface of what is truly possible, nor have we scratched the surface of what we can do when we put our heads together around a problem and explore the "what Ifs".

your willingness to experiment and   input is always appreciated however your perspective is not unique.

this Puzzle was meant to be cracked.

respectfully
Chet

PS
Tinsel
I am aware of your "smarts" and I am not trying to put you on the spot    but I ask a favor [I get to do this because you are omnipresent here  :o...its just _one" stipulation in the _Cheeseburger betters handbook" 3rd chapter 2nd paragraph "rules of engagement when the Cheesburger is on the line ". and your opponent has encamped his drooling self and pulled the "Elvis Phrase" from his quiver ...

rules is rules....

would it be asking too much for you to share an analogy of how a magnet does what it does in a system utilizing Magnets, it is profoundly obvious that it "makes things happen" and with out the magnet [or its effect] you get zilch.

why can't they [magnets]do work ?? when without them nothing gets done ?

I see Carroll  posted a magnetic analogy in Luc's or TinMan's thread of The turbo and the Recip  ICE for a comparison to a magnet and its role  ,   as you know I was trained in Aircraft and have issues with_ that_ analogy.

can you offer another ?

If you already have somewhere [or another has] I apologize I have been outa the loop for quite some time.

PPS
It may seem like a _Dopey_ and off topic question
However That's why I get paid the Big Bucs ...
To ask seemingly Dopey and off topic questions [during the Heat of Battle in the Cheeseburger wars...]

Never assume... 8)
 


 



Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dbowling on December 20, 2015, 07:12:31 PM
Seriously? You think a video that shows that a magnet is attracted to some metal, and is more attracted to more metal, is somehow important to your efforts?




Seriously? You expect me to take YOUR opinion of Mack's design to heart when you do NOT see how this video applies to what Mack has shown us? PLEASE!
His idea, since you seem to be unaware of it, involves using a magnet on a rotor and ramps (METAL RAMPS)  to accelerate that rotor in a specific direction, this video shows EXACTLY what Mack has talked about. The major difference being that the narrow end of the metal or "ramp" is bent away from the magnet on the rotor, and the wide end of the metal is split to go above and below the magnet on the stator. From the experimenting I have done, the magnet wants to move to the center of the piece of metal's mass. That point is closer to the wide end than the narrow end. By splitting the wide end around the stator magnet and Bending it away from the rotor magnet, and curving the narrow end away from the approaching rotor magnet, you can control that point. 


You can use the attraction of the ramp to pull the magnet on the rotor along the metal and past the magnet on the stator, and by a slight adjustment on the rotor magnets angle, you can get the stator magnet to push it away SLIGHTLY. This I have seen with my experiments. These are the things Mack said it would do, and it does. Whether a self runner can be achieved, I do not know. But as I said, everything Mack has told us so far has proven to be true. I have SEEN it on the bench. I take NO ONE's word for it.
Dave



Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 20, 2015, 07:34:21 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTcw6NPn9BQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTcw6NPn9BQ)

Its cool to see and the comparison between that action/shape and Macks Ramp shape are quite similar and I have never personally seen this before. along with some of the other things Dave has mentioned about Macks Device.


What "Macks Device" are you referring to? There isn't any "Macks Device", just things other people have built according to his instructions, which either violate his NDA, or don't really apply to a self-running magnet motor. Or... perhaps there isn't any Macks Device, there isn't any NDA, and his instructions are just wind-ups, which actually describe nothing unusual or even original.

Quote

  while you may have spent millennia with these things trying to get them to work or Vetting claims..
some of us have a different frame of reference, and are intrigued .


 Not quite "millennia", just 20 years or so, piled on top of another 20 years of formal education.

Quote

I know it is VERY VERY easy to stand on the hollowed and righteous ground of your belief system and roll your logs of wisdom down upon the "challenged".


Sure. I love being insulted, almost as much as I love having to explain the same basic stuff over and over again every few months whenever someone else comes up with a SMOT, or a circuit that makes spikes, or a new "theory of everything" that they think will overthrow QED or the Standard Model. Or a new value for PI, ffs. (Insert facepalm here.)

Quote

IMO this _Magnet Thing_ and all its possibilities hasn't scratched the surface of what is truly possible, nor have we scratched the surface of what we can do when we put our heads together around a problem and explore the "what Ifs".



Well... I guess it's just too bad that all those experimenters putting their heads together on EF are just too .... dumb, incompetent, lazy or whatever, since they can't make a self running magnet motor no matter how hard they try, even when a sincere gentleman has told them exactly how to do it. 

Quote

your willingness to experiment and   input is always appreciated however your perspective is not unique.

this Puzzle was meant to be cracked.

respectfully
Chet


I think a lot of people actually don't appreciate my input, judging from the amount of insults I receive.  Of course my perspective is not unique... but unfortunately many people who think like I do don't bother engaging in useless discussions with people who have a religious faith in miracles (and think they can perform them, if only they can get that magic magnet angle just right.) And Mark E is dead. And you can't crack a puzzle that has _no solution_, no matter how hard you pound your head against it. At some point, the smart investigator steps back, looks at the available data and comes to the conclusion that the head-pounding isn't going to pay off, and goes on to more potentially productive work.

Quote

PS
Tinsel
I am aware of your "smarts" and I am not trying to put you on the spot    but I ask a favor [I get to do this because you are omnipresent here  :o ...its in the _Cheeseburger betters handbook" 3rd chapter 2nd paragraph "rules of engagement when the Cheesburger is on the line ". and your opponent has encamped his drooling self and pulled the "Elvis Phrase" from his quiver ...

rules is rules....

would it be asking too much for you to share an analogy of how a magnet does what it does in a system utilizing Magnets, it is profoundly obvious that it "makes things happen" and with out the magnet [or its effect] you get zilch.

why can't they do work ?? when without them nothing gets done ?

I see Carroll  posted an analogy of The turbo and the Recip  ICE for a comparison to a magnet and its role  ,   as you know I was trained in Aircraft and have issues with_ that_ analogy.

can you offer another ? [another analogy ]

If you already have somewhere [or another has] I apologize I have been outa the loop for quite some time.

PPS
This question May _"seem_" off topic,
Never assume... 8)
 


 

I could go on and on. Conservative fields of force, lines of flux, Maxwell's equations, Faraday's law of induction.... all of these things are descriptions, analogies, and empirical results. You are perilously close to asking the "why" question. Why is there air? To fill up basketballs with, of course.

Things move to where the forces acting on them are in equilibrium, generally. The magnetic field is a field of force. Whatever that magnetic force "IS" or just "why" it exists is one of the profound mysteries of reality, but we have observed it long enough to be able to model it mathematically, to control it and predict its effects quite well. Exactly well, in fact. And one of the things we know about it is that it can be modelled by "lines of force" which pull along their length and push apart sideways. Another thing we know is that free space (air, vacuum) is relatively non-permeable by these "lines of force", and some metals and other substances are very much more permeable by them. So when you put a magnet near a bit of metal, the metal, being more permeable, allows more "lines of force" within it than the air around it does. This means that the magnet and metal experience a net force that pulls them together. The "lines of force" are models, a way of describing something in a mathematical way so as to get a handle on it for engineering purposes. The force itself is very real. So the action of the magnet in the video is very "ordinary", the magnet is behaving entirely predictably, moving to a place where the most "lines of force" are drawn into the metal and are as short as possible, until once again the forces acting on it in various directions balance out and it stops moving. "WHY" does it do this? Ultimately, you can chase that rabbit all the way down the hole to the "Why is there something, rather than nothing?" ultimate question of reality. We don't know "why" but we DO know "how", in the case of magnetism and a lot of other stuff.
 
Now if you want an analogy, the magnetic force is like a spring. And just as you cannot get net work out of a spring, you can't get it out of a magnetic field. You can store energy in the spring by stretching or compressing it, and get that stored energy back. You can do the same with magnetic fields (or gravity, for that matter).
Most people realize that you can't make a perpetual motion machine out of springs, and that springs only give back what you put into them, minus losses. But magnets and magnetism seem more mysterious, probably because we can't see the fields and it looks like "spooky action at a distance" when a magnet pulls on a piece of metal or another magnet. But just like the visible springs, magnetic fields can only store energy and return stored energy, they can't create it. 

But then you knew this already.


Have you ever taken apart a computer hard disk drive? Consider the miracles of magnetism operating within that device. Incredibly strong permanent magnets with funny carefully engineered polarization patterns, sandwiched between layers of amazingly permeable "mu metal" shields. Precise head positioning, precise to the millionth of an inch in fact, due to the interaction between electromagnets and the permanent magnets. Amazingly high speed and totally precise flipping of incredibly tiny magnetic domains in the disk material itself, which material isn't actually attracted to magnets!  And then we have people who are actually using these computers, telling us that the scientists and engineers who designed such miracle devices are idiots who don't understand the "reality" of magnetic fields! The irony of that is amazing.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 20, 2015, 07:47:56 PM



Seriously? You expect me to take YOUR opinion of Mack's design to heart when you do NOT see how this video applies to what Mack has shown us? PLEASE!
His idea, since you seem to be unaware of it, involves using a magnet on a rotor and ramps (METAL RAMPS)  to accelerate that rotor in a specific direction, this video shows EXACTLY what Mack has talked about. The major difference being that the narrow end of the metal or "ramp" is bent away from the magnet on the rotor, and the wide end of the metal is split to go above and below the magnet on the stator. From the experimenting I have done, the magnet wants to move to the center of the piece of metal's mass. That point is closer to the wide end than the narrow end. By splitting the wide end around the stator magnet and Bending it away from the rotor magnet, and curving the narrow end away from the approaching rotor magnet, you can control that point. 


You can use the attraction of the ramp to pull the magnet on the rotor along the metal and past the magnet on the stator, and by a slight adjustment on the rotor magnets angle, you can get the stator magnet to push it away SLIGHTLY. This I have seen with my experiments. These are the things Mack said it would do, and it does. Whether a self runner can be achieved, I do not know. But as I said, everything Mack has told us so far has proven to be true. I have SEEN it on the bench. I take NO ONE's word for it.
Dave

And you can see exactly the same effect in many other manifestations, from the HJ systems, the Calloway v-gate, even the Minato motors. Have you looked at my videos of the test bed I made during the Mylow affair?  Here's one for your amusement, from April of 2009.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STD7FbgC5Ss (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STD7FbgC5Ss)

Have you actually done rundown tests to see if your ramps help or hurt? I'll bet you a cheeseburger that your rotor will take longer to come to a stop, from a given starting RPM, with your ramps removed entirely than when they are present.

And no... not everything Mack has told you has proven to be true. Some things not proven: The story of the NDA. The story of the self-running builds. The story of the illness/hospital.  And etc. You've listed some of these yourself. They are "Mack saids" without any corroborating evidence whatsoever.

You may also consider that some things I've told you have also proven to be true. Haven't they? To wit: There is no self running magnet motor coming from Mack and his fans, and in another week, month, year, there will still be none.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dbowling on December 20, 2015, 09:54:05 PM
So in other words the video I posted DOES have something to do with the build proposed by Mack. Even though you insinuated that it did not.


Let me rephrase my statement about the things that Mack has said that have proven to be true. EVERYTHING he has said about this proposed BUILD has proven to be true. As for everything else he has said. It has not been proven to be true, nor has it been proven to be false.


As to the rundown test....I will not disagree that metal in the presence of the magnet on a rotor will slow the rotor. However, if you watched the video, you can see that the correct shaped piece of metal will actually cause movement of the rotor in a specific direction. Can THAT movement (Is there acceleration involved???...I don't KNOW) be manipulated enough to overcome the adverse affects of the metal in the presence of the magnet. As far as I can tell, THAT is the central issue to whether or not his proposed build will work. The mass and shape of that metal ramp and how it affects the magnets on the rotor is EXACTLY what needs to be experimented with. I would bet YOU a cheeseburger that changing the mass and shape of that "ramp" will impact the rundown times.


Let me be perfectly clear about something here. I am as skeptical of this proposed build as the next guy, BUT I am also open minded enough to explore what are (at least to ME) new areas of magnetic interaction (Like with these pie shaped ramps). In my mind, my time spent learning about something that is currently outside my experience is not, and never will be, wasted. I am sure you see this from a different knowledge base, and therefore a different perspective. To me, it is NEW knowledge, and worth having. If all this proves to be a total waste of time and money, it won't be the first or the last "money pit" I have engaged in.


I mean no disrespect to you. You may already have experimented for YEARS with these pie shaped ramps and know everything there is to know about them, but from some simple experiments I have done, which I will post in a couple days when I have the time to download them off my camera, there are some things of interest here that are worth investigating.


I believe the thread on EF is about dead. Mack has not been back, and most people over there don't actually build anything anyway. They just TALK and post YouTube videos of other people's work. So except for a few Diehards like myself (and possibly Bruce Willis, although he seems pretty busy making B movies lately) there probably aren't many folks even working on this.


Dave


Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: EMJunkie on December 20, 2015, 11:19:07 PM
waste of time
like the rest topics ...

Do not you believe?
do it!Build ;)


Idegen - Who do you work for? Exxon Mobil? US Government employed? CIA? NSA? Smithsonian? Disney?

Hahaha More like Looney Tunes (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OM6xvpzqCUA)!!!

Explain the Hydraulic Ram Pump - How is it that this device, over 300 Years Old, can Run Itself with no Energy Input required from the End User?

See: Hydraulic Ram Pump (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wG7o8ic_OQ)

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org



Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on December 20, 2015, 11:19:53 PM
Sigh.....
personally I have issues with the "Spring thing" as it applies here ..."attraction" is just one of many problems fitting the _"Spring Thing_" into my cranium.

one thing I will ask [again for the Big Bucs]
have you any personal or _"other_" experience with this particular elongated triangular shape presented by the Claimant ?

respectfully

Chet

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 21, 2015, 01:25:05 AM

Idegen - Who do you work for? Exxon Mobil? US Government employed? CIA? NSA? Smithsonian? Disney?

Hahaha More like Looney Tunes (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OM6xvpzqCUA)!!!

Explain the Hydraulic Ram Pump - How is it that this device, over 300 Years Old, can Run Itself with no Energy Input required from the End User?

See: Hydraulic Ram Pump (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wG7o8ic_OQ)

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org

Ummm..the water in the rivers and streams has to get up hill somehow right?  Around here, we call that solar energy...you know...evaporation...rain...gravity.

Sounds like it has a lot of energy input.  Just because you do not understand this does not make it overunity. Another false claim of yours busted.

You really should read some science books.  Next you will be claiming (falsely, of course) that the Joule Thief circuit is overunity.  Contrast and compare the JT circuit with the hydraulic ram and you might learn something.

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: EMJunkie on December 22, 2015, 12:03:18 AM
Junkie!
I work for the people.
The working against stupidity!
You do not understand because you're an idiot.
Infections of the next generation

hydraulic ram pump ????
You really do not understand the principle of operation?
Pathetic

I'm disney.
I'm writing a story stupid man.
The story is true!



Definitely you do not work for the People!!!

You cant work for Disney, because idegen is terribly spelled, Its Spelt Idiot!!!

You have not a single bit of Scientific Knowledge!!!

But you claim you're helping the People? How exactly, What's your recent contribution to Humanity?

You're a Git on a Stick, ramble Non-Sense, and are just a general pest!!!   Contribution = -1

All you do is fill Threads with Non-Sense!!!

For others, Idiot does not even know how this works: Hydraulic Ram Pump (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wG7o8ic_OQ) - Hidden Battery Idiot? is there?

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: minnie on December 22, 2015, 12:35:42 AM



   Poor old Junkie, you just seem as if you can't help digging
 yourself into a deep and deeper hole.
          John.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on December 24, 2015, 04:07:23 PM
Tinsel
Still no news from Mack
but here's some news from me

Happy holiday my friend you are truly a Gift to this world and I hope you are here
for a very long time.

thanks for all you do.
 and a happy holiday to all ,especially indigent [hope He finds a home and a few dollars so he can buy his own Christmas card next year  :'(  !!


Chet K

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on December 24, 2015, 09:05:48 PM
Tinsel
Still no news from Mack
but here's some news from me

Happy holiday my friend you are truly a Gift to this world and I hope you are here
for a very long time.

thanks for all you do.
 and a happy holiday to all ,especially indigent [hope He finds a home and a few dollars so he can buy his own Christmas card next year  :'(  !!


Chet K

Thanks Chet and I hope you and yours have a great, warm, cozy and happy Holiday season yourselves!

Cook a Christmas goose and have an extra platefull for me!


(And next Christmas... there will _still_  be no...... oh never mind.)     ;)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: sm0ky2 on December 26, 2015, 08:43:06 AM

Explain the Hydraulic Ram Pump - How is it that this device, over 300 Years Old, can Run Itself with no Energy Input required from the End User?

See: Hydraulic Ram Pump (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wG7o8ic_OQ)

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org

Much like a Hydro-powered Generator,
the ramp pump takes in a high flow rate and uses the pressure built up to send out
 a higher pressure, LOWER flow rate of water to its' destination.

there is much more energy in the water that is flowing into the device
a lot of the water is spilled out the check-valve, to keep up with the lower flow rate, otherwise the system would just back up at the pump head.

the only thing that made these devices feasible 100 yrs ago was its' simplicity and lack of maintenance.
they are not even very efficient.
a turbine-powered water pump placed into the stream is much more efficient.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on December 26, 2015, 10:01:55 AM
Smoky
Yes _THAT_ Ram pump is nothing special once understood [ still does priceless work all over the world tho...
however
we do have a friend who has done much with this idea [but greatly embellished] ,I will not speak of it here "yet" as I have not called him in TOO long [life has been overwhelming here] SOME of his work has been copied a bit by a group seeking money on a regular basis in another forum......
I won't say more about that other then we have people who come to these pages and others under the guise of "helping" that actually have  business motives to mostly help themselves...and their flashy lifestyles or google/youtube hits count ....

he is a truly gifted man that gives of himself and his work selflessly.

I will be calling him this Holiday week and ask him for permission to do a replication here and elsewhere.

respectfully
Chet K

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: kiwi3 on December 30, 2015, 08:06:04 AM
@ TK

I regret if my post seemed offensive,that was not intended in any way.Indeed I agree with many things both you and Pirate point out.
I just do not understand why so many members believe a magnet motor (any motor ) impossible.
Let me put the question such.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: kiwi3 on December 30, 2015, 08:10:05 AM
@All
Are there any members on this thread that would state without reservation that magnet motors would not be in commercial production in 200 years?
If so, why ?
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on December 31, 2015, 02:22:01 AM
93
Are you a sincere gentleman ?

I am sending you a PM .

thanks
Chet K
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: poynt99 on December 31, 2015, 02:34:14 AM
Don't even go there...
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 19, 2016, 10:52:06 PM
The most recent post from MadMack that I can find was made on the 26th of October, post #632 in the thread on EF. And today is the 20th of December.

55 days have passed since Mack posted "Unfortunately I have little time. There is a surgery for me in a couple of days and I will be out of touch afterwards, hopefully only for a week or two."

55 days is almost 8 weeks.

I am afraid that Elvis has left the building.

Seriously? You think a video that shows that a magnet is attracted to some metal, and is more attracted to more metal, is somehow important to your efforts?

And today is the 19th of January.... and another MONTH has gone by with no selfrunning magnet motor from the "Sincere Gentleman" or any of his disciples. And in another month, year, decade.... there will STILL be no such thing.

But how long will it take for you believers to admit that you have been duped and that I have been right all along? That will take even longer .... but I'll keep rubbing your noses in it until you do.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 19, 2016, 10:55:03 PM
I am already MANUFACTURING MAGNETIC FREE ENERGY MOTORS ...

I CAN GIVE YOU UP TO 1 TONE PER INCH ON THE DRIVE SHAFT  !  That's 1 tone of water moved up hill and it powers its self .. How many do you want ?

What do you call someone who makes false statements? False claims with no supporting evidence? I know... and so do you.

You cannot demonstrate your "Magnetic free energy motors" because they don't exist, and you aren't manufacturing anything except a stream of nonsense words and a few delusional graphics.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Gabriele on January 19, 2016, 11:04:40 PM
Magnetic engines could be done. Only if you spend more time to coercize god,than close eyes persons...does curie point tells nothing to you atheists? :-\
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 19, 2016, 11:19:14 PM
Magnetic engines could be done. Only if you spend more time to coercize god,than close eyes persons...does curie point tells nothing to you atheists? :-\

I made my first thermomagnetic motor (from Tesla's patent #396,121) many years ago for a school science fair project (which won a blue ribbon.) So you don't have to tell me about Curie points. All you have to do is to PROVE ME WRONG with some demonstrations of your own that support your contentions. But you cannot.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on January 19, 2016, 11:29:01 PM
93
Are you a sincere gentleman ?

I am sending you a PM .

thanks
Chet K

Are you serious Chet :o
The guy is a couple of sandwiches short of a picnic.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Gabriele on January 19, 2016, 11:33:44 PM
No i Can't...i reason with simple mathematic,but you could...surely help me to build a working(???) Magnetic engine... we all know how it should be done... but i posted weeks ago a partially logical scheme on how i belive it can be done... a gadolinium piston attracted by a magnet where inside cilindrum temperature rises. I think of a magnetic assisted motor...if you are so clever like you seems to be,we can go further on this... except if you are from united kingdom...
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: AlienGrey on January 19, 2016, 11:37:59 PM
What do you call someone who makes false statements? False claims with no supporting evidence? I know... and so do you.

You cannot demonstrate your "Magnetic free energy motors" because they don't exist, and you aren't manufacturing anything except a stream of nonsense words and a few delusional graphics.

Talking about streams and water, Wasn't their some guy caller victor shouburger (mountain man)he was involved in the original Nazi UFO at the old Skoda factory in WW2 where they really had flying UFO's, The Russians got that technology, well before that he was involved in pushing water up the mountain, he used air bubbles of air to carry the water up tubes, like nature does it, look him up he didn't mess about he did it !
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on January 20, 2016, 03:08:44 AM
Tinsel
If your going to come in here and throw out your Sincerely Happy reminders ...
please be reminded to shut the lights off and turn down the thermostat before you leave, and be careful the door doesn't hit you in the ....Back   on the way out [it has a very strong spring thing on it from an old experiment of Stefan's  a leftover from The Omnibus Flying Smot days.

things are tight around here , the OU doesn't grow on trees....

Yet...

Well Smoky 2 says it does but that's another thread.

respectfully
Chet K

pS
Tinman
no stone left unturned..........

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 20, 2016, 11:18:49 PM
Tinsel
If your going to come in here and throw out your Sincerely Happy reminders ...
please be reminded to shut the lights off and turn down the thermostat before you leave, and be careful the door doesn't hit you in the ....Back   on the way out [it has a very strong spring thing on it from an old experiment of Stefan's  a leftover from The Omnibus Flying Smot days.

things are tight around here , the OU doesn't grow on trees....

Yet...

Well Smoky 2 says it does but that's another thread.

respectfully
Chet K

pS
Tinman
no stone left unturned..........

I'm going to keep doing it until somebody cries "Uncle" and admits publicly that they were wrong and that I am right. All the folks that believe(d) in Mack have been duped, and have wasted their time and efforts from the beginning, just as I told you from the very first.

I won't hold my breath waiting for apologies for all the insults that have been thrown at me by people who can't PROVE ME WRONG, though.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on January 21, 2016, 12:30:17 AM
It may come as a big surprise , but plenty of folks find your position and assumption here highly insulting.

To come into a room full of grown men building something they feel has potential ,based on criteria which has not even been fully
clarified and then stating many of the things you said here ,will not only get you insulted in most places ,It will get
you into a dust up.

Politics ,religion ... and Magnets

always good for a brawl ....

But you already know that..... ::) 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 21, 2016, 03:24:17 AM
Just for the record...I find nothing wrong with TK's position on this and, I might add, I agree with him.
Maybe, just maybe, one day he will be proven wrong if/when a real working device shows up.  Until that time,
he is 100% correct to point out the issues that these false presenters assail us with.  "I'm under an NDA" (Then why disclose anything?) "I made a working device and then took it apart and threw it away...now, I can't make another one..."  "My dog ate my homework"...etc.

So, to recap:

TK: 100%
False O.U Claimants: 0%.

So Chet, or anyone else, if you think I have this scored wrong, please correct me.  As of now, I am very confident of my numbers.

Bill

PS  If these words would start a bar fight in some circles then, I suppose some folks should not go to bars.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on January 21, 2016, 04:28:14 AM
Bill
I don't think you would need a barroom to have an incident here ,The taunts would be adequate for almost any location
to encourage an insult or two at the very least.

Yes with the passing of time these assumptions would be tolerated ,however when your very first contributions are so inflammatory and assumptive so as to encourage retorts and such [speaking of Tinsels very first posts in this thread] ?

well it Begs confrontation and assumes all manner of Bad things about people whose character and intent we know nothing about ...[speaking of the early stages of this thread]

when you come in talking trash about someone ....you either have knowledge that you are privy to about that person
or you are taking huge privilege's with Due process ....

Nah ..Tinsel Begs the confrontation and then complains about the "well you already knew that" outcome.

I will never stop investigating claims about Magnet Motors or any other possible source of unknown or untapped energy
the assumption that such is not possible is amazingly arrogant and ignorant to me , Especially where it applies to Magnetism !!

and that is after all the bottom line regardless of the particular thread or claim or venue...

we just don't know what is truly possible .

No stone left unturned.

Chet






 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 21, 2016, 08:09:46 AM
It may come as a big surprise , but plenty of folks find your position and assumption here highly insulting.

What they, and you, SHOULD find "highly insulting" is when someone blatantly lies to you about what he has, what he has done, and etc. without providing one single trace of actual proof or evidence.

Quote

To come into a room full of grown men building something they feel has potential ,based on criteria which has not even been fully
clarified and then stating many of the things you said here ,will not only get you insulted in most places ,It will get
you into a dust up.

Politics ,religion ... and Magnets

always good for a brawl ....

But you already know that..... ::)

When someone is presented to me as a "sincere gentleman" and it's clearly obvious to me that he's lying and will _never_ produce any evidence for his claims... I feel like brawling myself.

Suppose someone came up to you in a bar and insisted that he could jump off a ten-story building, flap his arms, quack like a duck and fly away, faster than a 777. And kept on insisting that he could do this, and even told other people he could teach them how to do it.... but he never demonstrated it, nor gave you any proof he could do it. But he carried on for weeks making the same claims and promises, and his little group of people started doing arm exercises, and running around in circles practicing quacking like ducks. And then finally he just disappeared, leaving his followers running around in circles quacking.

Why, Chet, I do believe that even YOU might not believe him, and if someone called him a "sincere gentleman" and wanted to kick you out of the bar for disbelieving him and his quacking followers ... you might come to blows yourself.

And that is pretty much the situation here. MadMack made claims to you and to everyone else, but he cannot produce what he claimed, because it is a physical impossibility. Now, if he had produced some credible evidence that he could somehow overcome hundreds of years of real physical science and the solid Conservation Laws ... then I'd be the first one to apologize, eat my hat, and never darken your door again (while running for the hills since the whole world would soon begin to fall apart because of this discovery.) But it ain't gonna happen, you know it and I know it.

So please stop "left-handed" threatening me, and face up to the fact that you, along with a bunch of other people, have been duped by your "sincere gentleman".



Quote
when you come in talking trash about someone ....you either have knowledge that you are privy to about that person
or you are taking huge privilege's with Due process ....


Or... you know utter BS when you see it, because you know a little physics and have some experience in these matters, and you aren't afraid to say PROVE ME WRONG... because you know you aren't wrong.


Now why would people find ME insulting, when I am telling you the truth and simply challenging a claimant for evidence to the contrary, they but don't find Mack insulting when he's making his claims, telling you contradictory stuff, and not providing any evidence that he might be telling the truth? There is something seriously wrong here, and it's not _my_ attitude.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 21, 2016, 08:35:16 AM
I have nothing against research and speculation, Chet. But that is not what has happened here. Someone clearly claimed to have created a self-running magnet motor, and claimed to be able to show others how to make one. This is not "research" or "speculation", it is a clear claim that something has already been accomplished. But let me remind you that absolutely NO evidence was provided that this claim is or was true. And I know that it cannot be true, and not only that, but that there are several "tells" in the story that indicate that it isn't true, regardless of the actual physics involved.

So I'm not criticizing researchers, experimenters, even "crazy" theorists here. I'm criticizing a claimant who has made an outrageous claim without providing support, and who has gotten people to do all kinds of misguided work because of it. This is "anti-research", in fact. I've even given valid suggestions for testing some of the "subclaims" experimentally, which suggestions have largely been ignored.  People still are pushing things around with their fingers, going Ohh ahhh when they see things that are actually perfectly ordinary and which have no hope of adding a single microJoule of energy to their systems beyond what they put in with their fingers.  If they want to behave in such a silly manner instead of proceeding scientifically, I'll laugh at them publicly. If they want to proceed scientifically I've got suggestions and help -- after all, I've built more than a few "magnet motors" myself and I've demonstrated how to test them using valid techniques and proper application of the Scientific Method.

I've got a pretty thick skin. Go ahead and berate me, insult me, threaten me with brawls, et cetera. None of that addresses the real problem that is making you, or other people, mad at me.  You are frustrated because deep down inside, you know I'm right and you don't want me to be.



Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: kiwi3 on January 21, 2016, 08:37:03 AM
TK

No one can prove you wrong because there is nothing to prove wrong. All you have done is give your OPINION of Mack and his revelation.
No different to those who have a different opinion.
Unless Mack comes back nothing can be proven.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: kiwi3 on January 21, 2016, 08:58:06 AM
[And that is pretty much the situation here. MadMack made claims to you and to everyone else, but he cannot produce what he claimed, because it is a physical impossibility. Now, if he had produced some credible evidence that he could somehow overcome hundreds of years of real physical science and the solid Conservation Laws ... then I'd be the first one to apologize, eat my hat, and never darken your door again (while running for the hills since the whole world would soon begin to fall apart because of this discovery.) But it ain't gonna happen, you know it and I know it. ][/quote]

TK
Can you prove this to be a physical impossibility.Please tell me where I can find the research papers/ experiments etc that conclusively prove this to be.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 21, 2016, 09:17:47 AM
[And that is pretty much the situation here. MadMack made claims to you and to everyone else, but he cannot produce what he claimed, because it is a physical impossibility. Now, if he had produced some credible evidence that he could somehow overcome hundreds of years of real physical science and the solid Conservation Laws ... then I'd be the first one to apologize, eat my hat, and never darken your door again (while running for the hills since the whole world would soon begin to fall apart because of this discovery.) But it ain't gonna happen, you know it and I know it. ]

TK
Can you prove this to be a physical impossibility.Please tell me where I can find the research papers/ experiments etc that conclusively prove this to be.

Do you also want me to cite references for my assertion that you cannot strip naked, jump off a ten story building, quack like a duck and flap your arms and fly away faster than a 777? Do you think that somehow, someday, some wild experimenter will disprove my assertion that this is a physical impossibility?
OK, I think you will probably agree with me that this is a physical impossibility, because you have lots of experience with gravity and how heavy things behave under its influence, and you know you don't have the power-to-weight ratio or the wing loading of a bird, much less a jetpowered one. So now, as the old joke goes, it's just a matter of negotiation. Where do you draw the line between "physically impossible" and "maybe possible"?

Look them up yourself. Here are some topic headings to get you started:

Laws of Thermodynamics
Conservation of Energy
Conservation of Momentum
Conservative fields of force

A self-running permanent magnet motor would violate many solidly-proven principles (call them Laws if you like) of physics. Hundreds of years of experimentation and many many thousands of research findings support these principles.

ETA: But after all, you have it backwards. It only takes one credible demonstration to prove me (and all those conservation laws) wrong. If someone can fly off the building, naked and flapping his arms, fine, let's see it happen. If someone claims to have built a permanent magnet motor that runs itself (with no machine tooling, in several variations, and simply enough to be described in words over the internet in spite of a signed NDA, yet) fine. Let him PROVE IT. Or confess that he cannot.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: AlienGrey on January 21, 2016, 11:34:26 AM
Yeah!  but who says a gadget to enable you to do just that wont exist some where and at some time in the future ! what about this > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bCvbqMGPpa8
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: AlienGrey on January 21, 2016, 11:38:50 AM
I have nothing against research and speculation, Chet. But that is not what has happened here. Someone clearly claimed to have created a self-running magnet motor, and claimed to be able to show others how to make one. This is not "research" or "speculation", it is a clear claim that something has already been accomplished. But let me remind you that absolutely NO evidence was provided that this claim is or was true. And I know that it cannot be true, and not only that, but that there are several "tells" in the story that indicate that it isn't true, regardless of the actual physics involved.

So I'm not criticizing researchers, experimenters, even "crazy" theorists here. I'm criticizing a claimant who has made an outrageous claim without providing support, and who has gotten people to do all kinds of misguided work because of it. This is "anti-research", in fact. I've even given valid suggestions for testing some of the "subclaims" experimentally, which suggestions have largely been ignored.  People still are pushing things around with their fingers, going Ohh ahhh when they see things that are actually perfectly ordinary and which have no hope of adding a single microJoule of energy to their systems beyond what they put in with their fingers.  If they want to behave in such a silly manner instead of proceeding scientifically, I'll laugh at them publicly. If they want to proceed scientifically I've got suggestions and help -- after all, I've built more than a few "magnet motors" myself and I've demonstrated how to test them using valid techniques and proper application of the Scientific Method.

I've got a pretty thick skin. Go ahead and berate me, insult me, threaten me with brawls, et cetera. None of that addresses the real problem that is making you, or other people, mad at me.  You are frustrated because deep down inside, you know I'm right and you don't want me to be.

It really depends on what you mean by a magnetic motor, will a spinning magnet or two do ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGPnxLSgnUI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qp9cFrZWneI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycs9zDZbdVo
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on January 21, 2016, 02:35:18 PM
@ TK,

You can bad mouth Madmack all you want of course but the truth is some of us with more open minds learned a few things from him before he disappeared.  Several of us learned how to balance one magnets pull against another magnets push.   That has been applied to some other projects we have been working on.  As Ramset has said several times almost anything is worth at least looking at to see if it has value.  I had doubts from the very beginning about whether Madmack actually had a true magnet motor.  But I still took the time to see what he had to say and learned a few things in the process.  If everyone had always had your very closed minded attitude we would all still be riding horses and using spears and rocks to get something to eat.

Respectfully,
Carroll
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on January 21, 2016, 03:18:53 PM
Carroll
Tinsel does indeed have an open mind ...A quick peruse of his Videos shows more than enuff proof of that .
Its just that he has set limits ...places he feels comfortable jumping up onto the Bar and yelling Liar..
associates the veracity of the claim with his "Flying man" analogy ..with great confidence...


he has probably spent more time investigating these things [OU claims] than 99 % of the men on this planet.

Can we have a crystal ball for claims ...or a Tinsel Ball...?

will we stop looking... or listening to men that go out of their way to make a claim ??

I have to be very honest here...a very telling moment for me was when Mack made a statement to the effect
There I have shared it... MY mind can rest ...or peace of mind ...[something like that ]

It seemed his gate configuration showed an acceleration ... we have seen this many times and could easily assume
an MO for gain ,HOWEVER these assumptions have always proven difficult to manifest into a running closed circuit magnetic configuration  or magnet motor ...
much harder than hearding cats

Did Mack Assume ??
or is this balance which Carroll and others have sorted.. the key to another much bigger possibility ?
can we afford not to look closer and jump up on the bar and call Mack a liar ??

Is that a left hand or right hand threat Tinsel ?[maybe an eye poke...}

No stone left unturned...and I'm not throwing them [the stones]
just trying to have an open mind and an open heart .

respectfully
Chet



 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on January 21, 2016, 03:49:38 PM
My apologies to Tinsel then for accusing him of not having an open mind.  I am still learning about the different posters on this forum.  His continual naysaying about Mack led me to a wrong conclusion about his mindset concerning the search for free energy.

@ TK,  My apologies sir for misunderstanding where you were coming from.  I have also been accused of the same thing when I was sure something was being faked.  I should have known better.

Respectfully,
Carroll
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 22, 2016, 11:08:55 PM
Experimenters take an idea and run with it.  They'll
cogitate, ponder, try, inprovise, fail, improvise and
keep trying as they acquire comprehension of the
sought after process. 8) ;)

Then there are Builders who demand spoon feeding of
each minute detail of the "device" in question.  Seemingly
unable to think for themselves or to improvise they
remain stuck in the muck and make no progress. :o :(

With effort, fortitude and patience even a Builder can
become an  Experimenter. :)

Then there are the Emotional Cripples who choose to
engage in inflammatory conversation.  Very unfortunately,
this affliction has affected both Experimenters and Builders.

But there is yet hope!  TK may ultimately save the day! ;D
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: sm0ky2 on January 23, 2016, 07:43:19 AM
Do you also want me to cite references for my assertion that you cannot strip naked, jump off a ten story building, quack like a duck and flap your arms and fly away faster than a 777? Do you think that somehow, someday, some wild experimenter will disprove my assertion that this is a physical impossibility?
OK, I think you will probably agree with me that this is a physical impossibility, because you have lots of experience with gravity and how heavy things behave under its influence, and you know you don't have the power-to-weight ratio or the wing loading of a bird, much less a jetpowered one. So now, as the old joke goes, it's just a matter of negotiation. Where do you draw the line between "physically impossible" and "maybe possible"?

Look them up yourself. Here are some topic headings to get you started:

Laws of Thermodynamics
Conservation of Energy
Conservation of Momentum
Conservative fields of force

A self-running permanent magnet motor would violate many solidly-proven principles (call them Laws if you like) of physics. Hundreds of years of experimentation and many many thousands of research findings support these principles.

ETA: But after all, you have it backwards. It only takes one credible demonstration to prove me (and all those conservation laws) wrong. If someone can fly off the building, naked and flapping his arms, fine, let's see it happen. If someone claims to have built a permanent magnet motor that runs itself (with no machine tooling, in several variations, and simply enough to be described in words over the internet in spite of a signed NDA, yet) fine. Let him PROVE IT. Or confess that he cannot.

TK,...

If I had to rank the top 5 most intelligent, most educated individuals on this forum, you would be on the list...
and while I applaud your loyalty to Thermodynamic Theory (i'll leave the other 3 alone for now, because I don't specifically disagree with them)
I can't  wrap my head around your belligerently accepting that there is no magnetic anomalies we cannot fully explain.
we know there is a difference in the magnetic force vs a gravitational (or other time-variant field).
and anywhere else we find a difference in force (fluid pressure, rivers, wind, exploding gas) we find a way to utilize it to our advantage.

I mean sure, we can calculate the barometric pressure gradient over this part of the earth, and determine an average energy value of the wind over time,
to turn a generator, with x% losses and make electricity. We assume we know exactly where this energy is coming from....
heat from the sun and the earth's core, electrical activity between the ground and the ionosphere, etc...
but how much energy goes into the wind we harvest and where does it come from??
You accept this technology with no consideration of the thermodynamics involved?

Interacting magnets in the presence of a gravitational field can present itself in strange ways, mathematically and in physical experiment.
Eric Laithwaite made a long series of videos back some 40 years ago,  that could turn a 3yr old into an advanced magnetician.
But there were things, even HE did not understand.
I am no Eric Laithwaite.... And I'm sure there are many others that could teach me a few things about magnetism....
But I have seen at least one magnetic situation that has no valid answer under any thermodynamic resolution.

There is a second case, of which I am not yet entirely convinced, but has some anomalous properties I have not yet been able to explain.
And for some reason every year around June 20th, I find myself playing with it........ But that's neither here nor there....

Thermodynamics was designed by the scientific community to maintain stability on an economic standard of energy costs.
This may sound like some UFO conspiracy theory, and you probably won't believe me or think I am crazy or whatever..
but that's ok..  Thermodynamics does not control physics, it controls the way we use physics in our technologies.

It is resolved from 90some% of the equations that govern physics and mechanics when observed from a particular perspective.
It holds true in every case in which it is used, if you analyze the system by the boundaries set forth by the theorem.
There are systems to which these theories do not apply, or cannot be applied. Consider these to be "open systems".
Schools will not teach you this (with the exception of nuclear physics under certain curriculum programs).
It is forbidden by the National Accreditation System, the school will lose their accreditation.

I have seen enough in my lifetime to know that what they teach us is not correct, or not fully disclosed.
in college myself and/or other students in the class made such defiant devices as:
a drain plug with a hose and a jet nozzle that filled its own reservoir. (circa 1980's Coleman Cooler)
a Wick-Wheel, (made of paper) that used the capillary effect to turn a water wheel
a laser-phasing technique that exponentially increased the energy value of a combined beam.
a self-increasing dynamic thermal radiant event
as well as many mathematical anomalies that modern physics still has yet to resolve.

The field of magnetism, is the least understood of all physics, and while we have many equations and applications to describe the behavior
of a variety of magnetic arrangements
we cannot claim to be even close to knowing everything there is about magnetism.
the work of howard Johnson alone should raise your eyebrows about magnetic motors.
the history of H.J. actually happened. I grew up in Atlanta with parents in the AF, and family at Lockheed martin.
they flew electric jets built on his technology. silent, fast.
what happened to it after that no one knows, but he was under contract and working with their engineers

my personal experience with the issue, was an accident, resultant from a magnetic gearing design, but was not only self-sustaining, but self accelerating beyond any hope of control.

There are others who can clearly demonstrate magnetic anomalies, such as David Hamel.
our old friend Clanzer created a wonderful demonstration in a glass bowl with the activating magnet stationary above.
for all intensive purposes, it was a perpetual motion system, based on magnetic interaction (and gravity?).

I understand your education has set in stone certain fundamental principals that have held true throughout your realm of experiences.
But to claim that something is "impossible".... 
When ever has science been right about impossibilities?

heavier than air flight was impossible, reaching the bottom of the ocean was impossible, travel to space was impossible.
speed of sound, speed of light, I could go on....

There is more to this situation than most college professors will teach you. Some of them are oblivious, indoctrinated from childhood, and go on teaching without a clue.
While others know clear and well whats going on, and will tell you, but will not risk their jobs openly violating accreditation guidelines.

There are equations that govern technologies prohibited by modern physics. Most of these are held secret, not taught fully in schools.
some are taught, but only part of the situation is discussed.
Maxwell is one of the major exceptions to this. Some of his equations have escaped discretionary disclosure.,
and in them you can clearly see anomalous energy values occurring within discrete conditions.

The math that bridges the gap between thermodynamic law and pure einsteinian energy flow, is so simply elegant that one would spend a lifetime performing
the equations for no other purpose that the joy of doing so. (or to build a bomb under military contract....)

There are equations that are kept from us, Tesla, Euler, Maxwell, That explain situations not covered by the normal use of their equations.
These unlock technological potentials that could be devastating to the social structure of mankind (or so they say...)
Whatever reason they have for keeping this information from us is irrelevant, for most of the information is already available to us, and much of the unknown can be derived from the well used equations, and variations thereof.
The problem for most is comprehension, or more importantly, the broad scope of knowledge that has been meticulously segregated by degree-specific training,
necessary to build the entire puzzle.

The problem we face Mr Tinsel Kuala
is not that energy is not free..
but rather they do not WANT it to be.....


P.S.: ive watched a man in a squirrel suit (not naked) break the sound barrier off a cliff.
and create a shockwave@!


Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 23, 2016, 09:14:22 AM
It really depends on what you mean by a magnetic motor, will a spinning magnet or two do ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGPnxLSgnUI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGPnxLSgnUI)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qp9cFrZWneI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qp9cFrZWneI)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycs9zDZbdVo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycs9zDZbdVo)

Did you actually watch those videos? Do you understand Veproject's demonstrations?

The first video has nothing to do with magnets and is a hoax. Not only that, it is plagiarized by the "Nikola Tesla" poster who ripped it off without credit from the original poster. You will note that the video was posted in July of 2015.... but my photo of my replication of the original, attached below, was taken in May of 2015.

The second video is Lidmotor's illustration of _one way_ that the first video can be faked, out of many possibilities.

The third video is a compilation of some of Veproject's demonstrations.

There is no "self running" magnet motor shown in any of these videos.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 23, 2016, 09:34:35 AM
TK,...

If I had to rank the top 5 most intelligent, most educated individuals on this forum, you would be on the list...
and while I applaud your loyalty to Thermodynamic Theory (i'll leave the other 3 alone for now, because I don't specifically disagree with them)
I can't  wrap my head around your belligerently accepting that there is no magnetic anomalies we cannot fully explain.
we know there is a difference in the magnetic force vs a gravitational (or other time-variant field).
and anywhere else we find a difference in force (fluid pressure, rivers, wind, exploding gas) we find a way to utilize it to our advantage.

I mean sure, we can calculate the barometric pressure gradient over this part of the earth, and determine an average energy value of the wind over time,
to turn a generator, with x% losses and make electricity. We assume we know exactly where this energy is coming from....
heat from the sun and the earth's core, electrical activity between the ground and the ionosphere, etc...
but how much energy goes into the wind we harvest and where does it come from??
You accept this technology with no consideration of the thermodynamics involved?

Interacting magnets in the presence of a gravitational field can present itself in strange ways, mathematically and in physical experiment.
Eric Laithwaite made a long series of videos back some 40 years ago,  that could turn a 3yr old into an advanced magnetician.
But there were things, even HE did not understand.
I am no Eric Laithwaite.... And I'm sure there are many others that could teach me a few things about magnetism....
But I have seen at least one magnetic situation that has no valid answer under any thermodynamic resolution.

There is a second case, of which I am not yet entirely convinced, but has some anomalous properties I have not yet been able to explain.
And for some reason every year around June 20th, I find myself playing with it........ But that's neither here nor there....

Thermodynamics was designed by the scientific community to maintain stability on an economic standard of energy costs.
This may sound like some UFO conspiracy theory, and you probably won't believe me or think I am crazy or whatever..
but that's ok..  Thermodynamics does not control physics, it controls the way we use physics in our technologies.

It is resolved from 90some% of the equations that govern physics and mechanics when observed from a particular perspective.
It holds true in every case in which it is used, if you analyze the system by the boundaries set forth by the theorem.
There are systems to which these theories do not apply, or cannot be applied. Consider these to be "open systems".
Schools will not teach you this (with the exception of nuclear physics under certain curriculum programs).
It is forbidden by the National Accreditation System, the school will lose their accreditation.

I have seen enough in my lifetime to know that what they teach us is not correct, or not fully disclosed.
in college myself and/or other students in the class made such defiant devices as:
a drain plug with a hose and a jet nozzle that filled its own reservoir. (circa 1980's Coleman Cooler)
a Wick-Wheel, (made of paper) that used the capillary effect to turn a water wheel
a laser-phasing technique that exponentially increased the energy value of a combined beam.
a self-increasing dynamic thermal radiant event
as well as many mathematical anomalies that modern physics still has yet to resolve.

The field of magnetism, is the least understood of all physics, and while we have many equations and applications to describe the behavior
of a variety of magnetic arrangements
we cannot claim to be even close to knowing everything there is about magnetism.
the work of howard Johnson alone should raise your eyebrows about magnetic motors.
the history of H.J. actually happened. I grew up in Atlanta with parents in the AF, and family at Lockheed martin.
they flew electric jets built on his technology. silent, fast.
what happened to it after that no one knows, but he was under contract and working with their engineers

my personal experience with the issue, was an accident, resultant from a magnetic gearing design, but was not only self-sustaining, but self accelerating beyond any hope of control.

There are others who can clearly demonstrate magnetic anomalies, such as David Hamel.
our old friend Clanzer created a wonderful demonstration in a glass bowl with the activating magnet stationary above.
for all intensive purposes, it was a perpetual motion system, based on magnetic interaction (and gravity?).

I understand your education has set in stone certain fundamental principals that have held true throughout your realm of experiences.
But to claim that something is "impossible".... 
When ever has science been right about impossibilities?

heavier than air flight was impossible, reaching the bottom of the ocean was impossible, travel to space was impossible.
speed of sound, speed of light, I could go on....

There is more to this situation than most college professors will teach you. Some of them are oblivious, indoctrinated from childhood, and go on teaching without a clue.
While others know clear and well whats going on, and will tell you, but will not risk their jobs openly violating accreditation guidelines.

There are equations that govern technologies prohibited by modern physics. Most of these are held secret, not taught fully in schools.
some are taught, but only part of the situation is discussed.
Maxwell is one of the major exceptions to this. Some of his equations have escaped discretionary disclosure.,
and in them you can clearly see anomalous energy values occurring within discrete conditions.

The math that bridges the gap between thermodynamic law and pure einsteinian energy flow, is so simply elegant that one would spend a lifetime performing
the equations for no other purpose that the joy of doing so. (or to build a bomb under military contract....)

There are equations that are kept from us, Tesla, Euler, Maxwell, That explain situations not covered by the normal use of their equations.
These unlock technological potentials that could be devastating to the social structure of mankind (or so they say...)
Whatever reason they have for keeping this information from us is irrelevant, for most of the information is already available to us, and much of the unknown can be derived from the well used equations, and variations thereof.
The problem for most is comprehension, or more importantly, the broad scope of knowledge that has been meticulously segregated by degree-specific training,
necessary to build the entire puzzle.

The problem we face Mr Tinsel Kuala
is not that energy is not free..
but rather they do not WANT it to be.....


P.S.: ive watched a man in a squirrel suit (not naked) break the sound barrier off a cliff.
and create a shockwave@!
I doubt it, unless the "squirrel suit" had a jetpack attached, or the "cliff" was over 80,000 feet tall.

Well, you cover a lot of ground in that post. However.... you should know that Eric Laithwait's demonstrations were severely flawed, and that admitted he was wrong, that David Hamel did not do what he claimed to do, that CLaNZeR's demonstration did not produce a "self running magnet motor", that Howard Johnson also never made a self-running magnet motor, and etc etc. A lot of what you say is simply wrong.

Now, you've made some pretty outrageous claims in your post yourself, without providing any proof. And you've resorted to many of the usual strawman arguments.
"Heavier than air flight was impossible"... but you seem to forget that when some silly journalists said that, BIRDS and flying insects already proved the statement wrong. And so on.

Let's see some credible evidence for these claims:
Quote
my personal experience with the issue, was an accident, resultant from a magnetic gearing design, but was not only self-sustaining, but self accelerating beyond any hope of control.
Quote
a drain plug with a hose and a jet nozzle that filled its own reservoir. (circa 1980's Coleman Cooler)
I'll bet a cheezburger you won't be providing any.

And nothing in your post refutes my contention that the "sincere gentleman" did not have what he claimed to have (therefore his statements were false), or that there will be no self-running magnet motor coming from him or any of his erstwhile disciples (who mostly have already given up.)

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: massive on January 23, 2016, 09:57:03 AM


P.S.: ive watched a man in a squirrel suit (not naked) break the sound barrier off a cliff.
and create a shockwave@!


....actually millions of people have seen this .      an impossible feat yet an individual went ahead and did it and as of now it is in the past as an acheivement , for that individual it is normal.

103 years ago the best engineers proved flight was not possible , yet the Wright brothers and Richard Pearce flew 2 planes opposite sides of the planet .
...............today theres a plane every minute!!

Howard Johnson is a unique person  .  The video evidence of his rail car and motors is pretty rock solid .
not many people would dedicate a life time focussed on magnets , not many of us are going to
 
it can only be an individual to break new ground , even though there are "Laws" they are not going to stop
an individual

For sure there are definitely hoaxs , time wasters , unfortunately wasters of other peoples time , and there needs to be a sharp eye on them    (not my job  no thanks :))
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on January 23, 2016, 10:51:09 AM
Massive
Can you repost the link you mentioned to that Howard Johnson Video from his Home ?

I would appreciate that !

Thx

Chet

note
found it thx

Massive
Quote
Howard Johnson dedicated a large chunk of his life to magnet motor design and successfully got a patent.

"Energy from the vacuum part 4" DVD shows his linear motor and the possible thrust when designed correctly

http://www.energyfromthevacuum.com/Disc4HoJo/index.html

http://freeenergynews.com/Directory/Howard_Johnson_Motor/1979Paper/

magnet motors are definitely a reality and achievable BUT .....itd take a super dedicated researcher or team


All the best of luck
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: sm0ky2 on January 23, 2016, 06:05:26 PM


Let's see some credible evidence for these claims:I'll bet a cheezburger you won't be providing any.

And nothing in your post refutes my contention that the "sincere gentleman" did not have what he claimed to have (therefore his statements were false), or that there will be no self-running magnet motor coming from him or any of his erstwhile disciples (who mostly have already given up.)

you are probably right about this particular device, I see nothing "sincere" nor "shared" here...
Not because of any scientific "laws", but because he probably never had one fully working to begin with.


as far as the points I addressed earlier: I think you know how to calculate the pressure of a jet nozzle, with a known volume and height, aperture size, and able to calculate to what height the jet of water will fly. It's not rocket science (ok, maybe a little... but still not overly complicated).
at small volumes, the jet stream will be so thin, that no effective amount of water will be transferred.
with a large enough container, hose and nozzle designed to perform the task, the most complicated part about it is to aim the stream back into the box.
im pretty sure anyone can do it, we were just a handful of college kids that could barely write out the 3rd integral of a Feynman loop.

the whick-wheel, is irrefutably perpetual. Refuting this device must be done by talking to a tree.
 A large Sequoia would work nice for this, as they have no muscular system to lift water. E=mg(how tall are those things?)

But these things are not an "impossible magnetic motor",
they are just examples of specific cases when our scientific equations result in anomalous energy values.

a sustainable magnetic interaction is not impossible, there are equations which define such cases.
There are other unknown magnetic conditions which have not been fully experimented with, or even yet conceived.
It just seems preposterous at this point for anyone to think such an impossibility exists.
Despite them not yet having observed the contrary.


When there are multiple fields interacting, things stray from the normal linear approach, and each dipole interaction must be treated as an asymmetrical field gradient.
(Similar to the way we broke down the steps in the Tri-Force gates).
Each set of magnetic interactions must be treated separately.
There are no boundaries to the flux loop from this perspective.
energy "in" and "out" has no contextual meaning.
Interacting forces over distance(work), irrespective of time.
Time relates the energy into some value, from our outside perspective, but it does not pertain to the actual energy values inside the system. These are discrete to the field interactions.
Sure we could calculate the force, at the distance, and plot the work function over the course of a cycle, graph the changes in acceleration, elasticity of the fields, etc. and try to relate this data to our "time".
But this is not the true energy.
In truth, there is no less energy in the field interactions of magnets,
than there is in the forces bounding an electron to its' nucleic orbit at nearly the speed of light.
Its the same energy, what we observe is an accumulation of the field effects resultant from the atomic interaction.
from a certain perspective, a magnet could be described as a nuclear battery.

is it "impossible" to run a motor with a battery? what if the motor WAS the battery?
how much energy is there? how long will it run?
well, luckily for us, Mad 'am Curie left us a hint we can relate back to Einstein's E=mc^2
 
We know from signal processing that interacting fields, in certain arrangements, can build up large energy values very quickly.
purely magnetic fields can behave in a similar manner. Our current technology uses a forceful technique.
we drive things, and force induce currents.
The types of things we are trying to build use the natural cycle of energy,
 the magnets do the work for you, not the other way around.
the conditions that bound us, are our own construction flaws, and a trained 'eye' for complex magnetic fields.
we're getting better at the second one.











Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: massive on January 23, 2016, 07:37:01 PM

I didnt even see TK post ...... NZ is 2 hrs ahead of OZ , I went to sleep .

with out doing web search , TK is right , by memory theres a jet pack guy  vs  squirel suit/chute guy  = 2 diff guys . 1 jumps from a plane , the other jumps off cliffs .

it always looks dodgie when some one mentions a NDA , it seems to be the key ingredient in stories now but apart from that , why post anything if one has genuinely signed any contract of any kind ?
are they testing the law ?

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: sm0ky2 on January 23, 2016, 08:22:41 PM

it always looks dodgie when some one mentions a NDA , it seems to be the key ingredient in stories now but apart from that , why post anything if one has genuinely signed any contract of any kind ?
are they testing the law ?

I believe the original "NDA issues", were whether or not to have one with whoever the information was to be disclosed to.
Although now it would seem, there is a lack of a working prototype which to disclose...

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: AlienGrey on January 24, 2016, 02:29:40 AM
I believe the original "NDA issues", were whether or not to have one with whoever the information was to be disclosed to.
Although now it would seem, there is a lack of a working prototype which to disclose...

Yeah ! look if you have an NDA and you sign it they expect your personal info right well suppose the idea is just that your personal info, your then at risk if they dont like your thinking, i suppose .


Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dog-One on January 24, 2016, 07:01:19 AM
Yeah ! look if you have an NDA and you sign it they expect your personal info right well suppose the idea is just that your personal info, your then at risk if they dont like your thinking, i suppose .

It certainly opens the door for identity theft and other deviant behavior.  Trust is a rare thing to find these days and it doesn't take much exploring to discover why.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on January 29, 2016, 04:08:01 AM
Hmmmm
Seems a double dog dare scenario may be afoot...

Wishing Mack a speedy recovery !!

And just for clarity... This is NOT (yet) a double dog dare triple cheeseburger double down bet.

as outlined in the first edition "The portly Gamblers handbook "

This will be a more casual affair, since Mack is on the mend
But every bit sincere !!!

However , as outlined on page 63 paragraph 8 of "The Portly Gamblers Handbook"
In DDDTCDDB protocols ...claiment has the option of changing his submission
As long as the original intent sincerely meets all claimed criteria !


Gentlemen's rules,
No hanky panky ,Mr.hand...or other nefarious inputs will be tolerated.

We shall see ??
Chet
PS
To below "top secret" open source  snyd "insinuensive" remark

Its the word on the street ....no smoke filled rooms (Macks recovering )
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 29, 2016, 05:18:41 AM
Oh? Doubling down, maybe?

It has been two and a half weeks (since Jan 11) since anyone has posted on the "Magnet motor revelation" thread on EF. And the last few posts seem to indicate that even the true believers are starting to have some questions.

Of course I suppose there could always be some Top Secret discussions happening about this "open source" project that I'm not privy to.

But in another week, month, year... there will STILL be no self running magnet motor coming from Mack or anyone of his disciples. And I'll add another prediction: nobody will have the sincere gentlemanly integrity to admit that they were wrong all along and I am right, and I still won't get my cheezburger. But they'll all just fade away, stop posting, and the thread(s) will sink without even a trail of bubbles, like so many have done already. 
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: AlienGrey on January 29, 2016, 12:56:34 PM
Oh? Doubling down, maybe?

It has been two and a half weeks (since Jan 11) since anyone has posted on the "Magnet motor revelation" thread on EF. And the last few posts seem to indicate that even the true believers are starting to have some questions.

Of course I suppose there could always be some Top Secret discussions happening about this "open source" project that I'm not privy to.

But in another week, month, year... there will STILL be no self running magnet motor coming from Mack or anyone of his disciples. And I'll add another prediction: nobody will have the sincere gentlemanly integrity to admit that they were wrong all along and I am right, and I still won't get my cheezburger. But they'll all just fade away, stop posting, and the thread(s) will sink without even a trail of bubbles, like so many have done already.

Maybe, maybe not, on you tube was one of those perpetual motion things, some one had put a clip on it had a base with a shaft and a pin sticking up vertical, they also had about 1.5 inch of plastic see through tube  a long tube / stick magnet (ceramic) North one end and south the other and another magnet but shorter than the other one, all he does is stick one magnet in one end of the tube and the other one in the other end, he then mounts the plastic tube on the spike horizontally. The whole thing looks un balanced he then produces another magnet close ish to two magnets and they start to spin.

I cant find it now, very conveniently, I did copy it’s location but I have had no end of problems with this new windows 7 keeps crashing and losing stuff since I put it on 6 weeks ago, xp was far better ! such is life, but if I do come across it I will stick it one here for you all to see.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 30, 2016, 01:08:39 PM
I know the one you mean, but I can't find it in my History either.

My impression was that it was another instance of the "Minato Effect", where small involuntary hand motions provide the driving power for the rotor.

You can set up a rotor with magnets on it, and use a handheld stator magnet in repulsion direction, and get the same effect. Once you get the rotor turning with the correct angle of the stator magnet, the repulsion of the magnets causes small hand motions, and your efforts to compensate and hold hand still actually wind up "pumping" the rotor and the thing will keep on spinning.

But if you mount the stator rigidly in the same position, the rotor won't keep spinning. I think this effect has fooled many people into thinking they have "found the secret" and if they only could make the right adjustment in the rigidly mounted stator .... but no, it never works.

I think this is even the principle that fooled Steorn in the early days before the failed Kinetica demonstration. It keeps cropping up as new people discover the effect. Wouldn't it be hilarious if this was Mack's original design..... it "works" when he's holding the stator magnet at the correct angle by hand .... so all the builders have to do is to adjust their rigid mounts correctly..... LOL !!




I see from reading some other thread on EF that someone has supposedly had emails from Mack... and he's told them to _stop working_ on what they have been doing because he has now come up with a new design !!   

And I hear that Santa Claus has fired all his elves and is looking to hire some new ones. An excellent benefit package, and all the cookies you can eat! (But taking care of the reindeer is part of the job description, so I dunno.... )
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on January 30, 2016, 01:46:10 PM


I see from reading some other thread on EF that someone has supposedly had emails from Mack... and he's told them to _stop working_ on what they have been doing because he has now come up with a new design !!   



TK,

I know David Bowling personally.  If he says he has heard from MadMack there is NO supposedly.  That is an insulting thing to say about someone.  Are you implying he made that up?  I still have my reservations about a working magnet motor.  But the things Mack has said about balancing magnets against one another and some of the other things have worked like he said they would.  So I am keeping an open mind about it.  But I see no reason to insult David by saying he supposedly heard from Mack.

Carroll
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: AlienGrey on January 30, 2016, 02:11:15 PM
Don't want to interfere here ;) but unless you have the original or a link to original it's just here say (who knows the truth) so don't get hot and irate or you might burn up like one of them Aliens do on 60's Invaders do ;) he, he. 

see clip ! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIa5ocx1vY4
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on January 30, 2016, 02:19:48 PM
AG, if you are referring to my post, David told me personally in a phone call that he had heard from Mack.  So it is not hear-say.  He told me that before he posted the information.  I have known David for several years now and I totally believe in his honesty.

Carroll
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: AlienGrey on January 30, 2016, 02:50:43 PM
I know the one you mean, but I can't find it in my History either.

My impression was that it was another instance of the "Minato Effect", where small involuntary hand motions provide the driving power for the rotor.

You can set up a rotor with magnets on it, and use a handheld stator magnet in repulsion direction, and get the same effect. Once you get the rotor turning with the correct angle of the stator magnet, the repulsion of the magnets causes small hand motions, and your efforts to compensate and hold hand still actually wind up "pumping" the rotor and the thing will keep on spinning.

But if you mount the stator rigidly in the same position, the rotor won't keep spinning. I think this effect has fooled many people into thinking they have "found the secret" and if they only could make the right adjustment in the rigidly mounted stator .... but no, it never works.

I think this is even the principle that fooled Steorn in the early days before the failed Kinetica demonstration. It keeps cropping up as new people discover the effect. Wouldn't it be hilarious if this was Mack's original design..... it "works" when he's holding the stator magnet at the correct angle by hand .... so all the builders have to do is to adjust their rigid mounts correctly..... LOL !!




I see from reading some other thread on EF that someone has supposedly had emails from Mack... and he's told them to _stop working_ on what they have been doing because he has now come up with a new design !!   

And I hear that Santa Claus has fired all his elves and is looking to hire some new ones. An excellent benefit package, and all the cookies you can eat! (But taking care of the reindeer is part of the job description, so I dunno.... )

Found it !!

It's a Dual Magnet Motor

Watch this one, and then pull it apart !!!!!!!!!!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20LrW-8eDY4
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dog-One on January 30, 2016, 04:05:04 PM
Watch this one, and then pull it apart !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Done !
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: citfta on January 30, 2016, 04:14:09 PM
I saw that also as did one of the people that commented on the video.  You would think that someone that went to that much trouble to make a fake video would have put the cover on the bottom so it would not be so easy to spot.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dog-One on January 30, 2016, 06:17:19 PM
You would think that someone that went to that much trouble to make a fake video would have put the cover on the bottom so it would not be so easy to spot.

True, but you would think someone that went to all the trouble of destroying the twin towers would not be in such a haste to haul all of the steel away either.  Just depends on how one "rolls".   ;)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on January 30, 2016, 07:17:26 PM
That's not the one I was thinking of... but really. MunchausenTV is associated with, and maybe is the same person as.... veproject1.  That's all you really need to know.....
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Dog-One on January 31, 2016, 01:30:38 AM
Doing the necessary detective work is imperative, even if you happen to stumble onto a real OU device, because if you don't understand something, it's a given you will have great difficulties replicating it.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: sm0ky2 on January 31, 2016, 08:29:15 AM
Doing the necessary detective work is imperative, even if you happen to stumble onto a real OU device, because if you don't understand something, it's a given you will have great difficulties replicating it.

such an insightful statement....

how many man-hours have we all wasted, because someone "misinterpreted" a strange effect or observation?
That when explained from a physics standpoint, was not that interesting at all.....

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on February 12, 2016, 07:16:23 AM
In less than two short weeks it will have been _SIX MONTHS_ from the day the "sincere gentleman"  Mad Mack first posted his unsupported claims on EF.

And there is still no working magnet motor demonstration from him or any of his disciples. The last word allegedly from Mack is to STOP WORKING because he will have a new design.... "soon".

But there will be no working magnet motor demonstrated "soon", or in a week, month, another six months or a year, or anytime ever, since it should be clear by now that he did not have, does not have and never will have what he claimed nearly SIX MONTHS ago.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: sm0ky2 on February 12, 2016, 10:30:49 AM
ahh, yes the "New Version" !!!

That always comes just before the old version is fully complete.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on February 13, 2016, 04:10:20 AM
Unless, of course, the MIB has taken him out. 

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Lakes on February 13, 2016, 08:27:29 AM
Or the MIBO (Men in Big Oil) bought him out. ;)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on May 22, 2016, 07:33:30 PM
Reading this thread from the beginning is a real hoot. Has it really been over three months since the last post? Yes, it has, and nobody is even talking about it on the other forum any more. Pretty soon it will be an entire year since Mack started all of this, and there _still_ won't be any working prototype.... because there never was one to begin with. The "sincere gentleman" has demonstrated... exactly nothing but his own lack of sincerity.

And the people who have followed his "instructions" have learned that magnets attract ferrous metal, don't attract aluminum or plastic, and attract and repel other magnets. And they maybe even have learned that a heavy flywheel on good bearings can spin for a long time.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Lidmotor on May 23, 2016, 02:29:22 AM
But---But  they are sooooo close.  It almost works.  Just needs a few minor adjustments.  Watch ---I'll just give it a little push and it runs  and  runs  and  runs.......then stops. :-\
 
Sometimes I hate the laws of nature.  Why can't we do what we want. :'(

Lidmotor

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Lakes on May 23, 2016, 08:23:31 AM
Och Jim, ye canna break the laws of physics.

Look Scotty, just make it go faster ok? :)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on May 23, 2016, 12:12:48 PM
Of course there will never be a magnet motor...magnets can't do work  it would be heresy...
just like swimming [only a devil could conquer water in such a way]
or Flying.....
Or ..heaven forbid ... LENR

Tinsel your arrogance and assumptions will not hold the test of time.

and I mean that sincerely !


Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on May 23, 2016, 12:46:50 PM
Of course there will never be a magnet motor...magnets can't do work  it would be heresy...
just like swimming [only a devil could conquer water in such a way]
or Flying.....
Or ..heaven forbid ... LENR

Tinsel your arrogance and assumptions will not hold the test of time.

and I mean that sincerely !

1. Animals swim, proving that creatures can do it. There is no scientific principle that prevents swimming.
2. Animals fly, proving that creatures can do it. There is no scientific principle that prevents flight.
3. There is much _scientific_ research on LENR and the jury is still out on some of this research. Many scientific principles prevent _certain types_ of LENR and until demonstrated otherwise those principles are valid. Meanwhile outright frauds like Rossi continue to prey on the hopeful innocents.
4. My "arrogance and assumptions" as you call it have never been proven false yet.

I'm  not against properly conducted research, what I AM strongly against is fakers and false claimants like Mack, who has not got what he claimed, never had and never will, and who has bamboozled people into wasting time and money trying to build something that has absolutely no chance of working. And I am strongly against those who promote those false claimants simply because they seem "sincere" even though they haven't provided a single lick of proof at all to anyone ever. If someone wants to claim that they have a working magnet motor... fine, PROVE IT. But Mack cannot, and nobody else can either. He's a FALSE CLAIMANT and that's why I am against him and his followers.

Long after you and I are dead, there will _Still_ be no working permanent magnet motor from Mack or anyone else. Nor will you ever be able to breathe vacuum, use your mind to dematerialize in one place and rematerialize in another, or have personal consciousness beyond your death. Nobody will ever jump naked off a 100 story building, fly around it three times on the way down and land on her tippytoes and walk away drinking a Starbuck's grande soy nonfat latte. You may learn to swim, or use an aeroplane to fly, and maybe someday _real scientists_ may learn how to produce and control LENR, but it ain't gonna happen by believing and promoting false "sincere gentlemen" like Mad Mack.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on May 23, 2016, 04:12:56 PM
Tinsel
Times are quite different than when You were in Kindergarten and sharpening pencils for calculus class ,
 the ability to see our world as never before ..as well as measure what we see ...is growing at a pace which boggles the mind .

the average 6 year old can do more in 5 minutes on a tablet than _some_ men could do in a lifetime 50 years ago...

and yet it accelerates ...this ability to boldly Go !!

you presume way to much , and yes IMO your assumptions follow suit.

you will live to see Magnets doing work ....and No I don't believe in fairies or Pink unicorns .

I do however have eyes to see... and at times I cannot believe my own eyes when I look at what the _kids_ can do and the tools
they have access too !!

and yet it grows [their potential]

regarding Mack ?

I absolutely believe he was sincere ,did he make assumptions based on what he saw on his bench ??

maybe time will tell ?

if your lookin for that cheeseburger , I still have it over here in _storage_ !!

 :o

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: tinman on May 23, 2016, 04:22:10 PM
Tinsel
Times are quite different than when You were sharpening pencils for calculus class , the ability to see our world as never before
as well as measure what we see ...is growing at a pace which boggles the mind .

the average 6 year old can do more in 5 minutes on a tablet than some men could do in a lifetime 50 years ago...

and yet it accelerates ...this ability to boldly Go !!

you presume way to much , and yes IMO your assumptions follow suit.

 ....and No I don't believe in fairies or Pink unicorns .

I do however have eyes to see... and at times I cannot believe my own eyes when I look at what the _kids_ can do and the tools
they have access too !!

and yet it grows [their potential]

regarding Mack ?

I absolutely believe he was sincere ,did he make assumptions based on what he saw on his bench ??

maybe time will tell ?

if your lookin for that cheeseburger , I still have it over here in _storage_ !!

 :o

Quote
you will live to see Magnets doing work

Indeed.
The 2016 PMBO has only 1 week left ;)


Brad
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: AlienGrey on May 24, 2016, 09:07:45 PM
1. Animals swim, proving that creatures can do it. There is no scientific principle that prevents swimming.
2. Animals fly, proving that creatures can do it. There is no scientific principle that prevents flight.
3. There is much _scientific_ research on LENR and the jury is still out on some of this research. Many scientific principles prevent _certain types_ of LENR and until demonstrated otherwise those principles are valid. Meanwhile outright frauds like Rossi continue to prey on the hopeful innocents.
4. My "arrogance and assumptions" as you call it have never been proven false yet.

I'm  not against properly conducted research, what I AM strongly against is fakers and false claimants like Mack, who has not got what he claimed, never had and never will, and who has bamboozled people into wasting time and money trying to build something that has absolutely no chance of working. And I am strongly against those who promote those false claimants simply because they seem "sincere" even though they haven't provided a single lick of proof at all to anyone ever. If someone wants to claim that they have a working magnet motor... fine, PROVE IT. But Mack cannot, and nobody else can either. He's a FALSE CLAIMANT and that's why I am against him and his followers.

Long after you and I are dead, there will _Still_ be no working permanent magnet motor from Mack or anyone else. Nor will you ever be able to breathe vacuum, use your mind to dematerialize in one place and rematerialize in another, or have personal consciousness beyond your death. Nobody will ever jump naked off a 100 story building, fly around it three times on the way down and land on her tippytoes and walk away drinking a Starbuck's grande soy nonfat latte. You may learn to swim, or use an aeroplane to fly, and maybe someday _real scientists_ may learn how to produce and control LENR, but it ain't gonna happen by believing and promoting false "sincere gentlemen" like Mad Mack.
Have you seen this ?  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RZB1xstXS0
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on May 25, 2016, 03:39:33 AM
Have you seen this ?  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RZB1xstXS0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RZB1xstXS0)

Yes, I have. It's an obvious fake, and not even a very good one. Take a look at the poster's other videos on his channel.

Got any more?
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on May 25, 2016, 03:52:11 AM
Tinsel
Times are quite different than when You were in Kindergarten and sharpening pencils for calculus class ,
 the ability to see our world as never before ..as well as measure what we see ...is growing at a pace which boggles the mind .

the average 6 year old can do more in 5 minutes on a tablet than _some_ men could do in a lifetime 50 years ago...
And that kid understands much less about what she is doing than those men did.
Quote

and yet it accelerates ...this ability to boldly Go !!

you presume way to much , and yes IMO your assumptions follow suit.

When have I been shown to be wrong?

Quote


you will live to see Magnets doing work ....and No I don't believe in fairies or Pink unicorns .


Some people have different ideas about what "work" means; they will tell you that your refrigerator magnets holding up those kid's drawings of rocket ships are doing work. And that is the only kind of "work" from permanent magnets that we will be seeing.

Quote

I do however have eyes to see... and at times I cannot believe my own eyes when I look at what the _kids_ can do and the tools
they have access too !!

David Copperfield makes the Statue of Liberty disappear and reappear before the eyes of hundreds of witnesses. Sure, young people have great technology at their fingertips. Not a single piece of that technology violates Conservation of Energy, Conservation of Momentum, or Conservation of Miracles. A "permanent magnet motor" of the Mad Mack variety violates all three, and will never exist, no matter how smart the "kids" are.

Quote

and yet it grows [their potential]

regarding Mack ?

I absolutely believe he was sincere ,did he make assumptions based on what he saw on his bench ??

maybe time will tell ?

Sure, it's possible to fool yourself if you don't do proper testing with control setups like I've suggested many times. A heavy flywheel on good bearings will spin for a long time, and if you don't have baseline data you might think that your magnet configuration is helping it spin when it really isn't. But Mack stated clearly that he had built working prototypes and that he was under NDA with some company. So I think that takes care of the assumption question.

As far as "time will tell".... it already has told. Weeks, months, and soon a full year will have gone by with nothing from any of the people who have been trying to build what Mack tells them will work... but doesn't. Nobody has even made anything that will spin longer than the baseline setup (same dimensions and weights but no magnets), and this proves that magnets and ramps only add drag through eddy current generation. They are making _brakes_, because that's all that Mack's "designs" really amount to. Most of them aren't even bothering to keep trying any more.

Quote

if your lookin for that cheeseburger , I still have it over here in _storage_ !!

 :o

That's not the only thing that is still in storage.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: seychelles on May 25, 2016, 07:29:40 AM
Question for you TK,  which of the two dc motors will run more efficiently power wise, putting in mind that the two motors have the same stator windingS electrically,  BUT ONE WITH A MAGNET ROTOR AND THE OTHER WITH AN ELECTROMAGNET ROTOR..
I would say the one with the magnet motor will be way more efficient..why because the PM is doing extra work NO!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wI6XVCPyhYs
The problem up-till now there has not be an inventor who has come Up with a PM powered motor, the reason why is that we do not understand that PM magnetic field is a spin vortex.. it static but yet in full flight..so my suggestion is that all the PM IN THE PM MOTOR HAS TO BE FREELY SPINNING APPROPRIATELY ACCORDING TO ITS DESIGN..

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: AlienGrey on May 25, 2016, 08:00:01 AM
Yes, I have. It's an obvious fake, and not even a very good one. Take a look at the poster's other videos on his channel.

Got any more?
yes this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PLO6FJVqlxatfTY0QlElqDZNK4yE4jU3z8&v=n4YD8Nvyfa4
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Lidmotor on May 25, 2016, 09:58:55 PM
  I guess the group formed a car company for investors called "Mackmobile".

   Here is their first model coming out this year called the "Sincere"---if they get enough funding.
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on May 28, 2016, 10:24:48 PM
  I guess the group formed a car company for investors called "Mackmobile".

   Here is their first model coming out this year called the "Sincere"---if they get enough funding.

I was going to buy one of these cars but, it appears they only come in black...or, any other color you want...as long as it is black.

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Lidmotor on May 29, 2016, 05:44:08 PM

I was going to buy one of these cars but, it appears they only come in black...or, any other color you want...as long as it is black.

Bill

  Hey I was going to put an order in for one.  I didn't care what color it was but I couldn't get one with AC, pwr windows, and door locks.   >:(  That was a deal breaker.
   I have thought about building up a whimsical simple version of this contraption just for fun.  Of course it would have a hidden motor or a compressed air stream thrust or (the best) ----"Mr. Hand" drive unit.

Rusty
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Pirate88179 on May 30, 2016, 01:41:24 AM
I was going to buy one of these cars but, it appears they only come in black...or, any other color you want...as long as it is black.

Bill

  Hey I was going to put an order in for one.  I didn't care what color it was but I couldn't get one with AC, pwr windows, and door locks.   >:(  That was a deal breaker.
   I have thought about building up a whimsical simple version of this contraption just for fun.  Of course it would have a hidden motor or a compressed air stream thrust or (the best) ----"Mr. Hand" drive unit.

Rusty

Hey Rusty, never underestimate the power provided by Mr. Hand.  We have been observing his input into many "Free Energy" devices for many years now.  This poor, unsung hero deserves at least a Bud Light, or a simple thank you.

If not for Mr. Hand, how many Youtube videos would just be a collection of non functioning free energy devices?  So, I salute this guy for all of the "work" he has done.  His "input" has been invaluable to so many devices, we can't even begin to name them.

What a hard working guy.

Bill
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: Lidmotor on May 30, 2016, 06:30:24 PM
Hey Rusty, never underestimate the power provided by Mr. Hand.  We have been observing his input into many "Free Energy" devices for many years now.  This poor, unsung hero deserves at least a Bud Light, or a simple thank you.

If not for Mr. Hand, how many Youtube videos would just be a collection of non functioning free energy devices?  So, I salute this guy for all of the "work" he has done.  His "input" has been invaluable to so many devices, we can't even begin to name them.

What a hard working guy.

Bill


Thank you for the compliment.  Always happy to add my input into free energy research. 

   Sincerely yours,

                              Mr. Hand
                     
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on August 16, 2016, 12:26:20 AM
HMmm
here we have a claim,  reinforcing the sincere gentleman's original claim
if any members cannot read all the info in this link let me know and I will
place all that info here too.

sometimes non members [energetic forum] can't see all links

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20239-magnet-motor-revelation-25.html

respectfully
Chet K
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: TinselKoala on August 16, 2016, 02:48:17 AM
All I see is more speculation from UFOpolitics.... you know, the one who claimed "overunity galore" in December of 2012 on Page 95 of a 266 page thread, and who has carried on misleading people for years after that, and who hasn't, in fact, produced a single Joule of "overunity" in all that time.
 
http://www.energeticforum.com/218245-post2841.html

Now he's "teching" people something else he actually doesn't know how to do.


There is not now, and never will be, a self-running magnet motor from the "sincere gentleman" Mad Mack (who appears to have left the building) or any of his followers, most especially not from UFOpolitics.

Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on January 25, 2020, 03:59:18 PM
 a curious consideration with no Promises, from an FE investigator
http://fdp.nu/thebook/calloway.asp-URL=calloway.asp.html (http://fdp.nu/thebook/calloway.asp-URL=calloway.asp.html)
And here off topic from Adrian Marsh [energy transfer

http://www.am-innovations.com/vector-network-analyser-dg8saq/
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: skywatcher on January 25, 2020, 11:09:18 PM
a curious consideration with no Promises, from an FE investigator
http://fdp.nu/thebook/calloway.asp-URL=calloway.asp.html (http://fdp.nu/thebook/calloway.asp-URL=calloway.asp.html)
This is 12 years old.  If it would work, there would be thousands of working devices now.  Where are they ?   ::)
Title: Re: A sincere gentleman sharing a magnet motor build .[NDA issues??]
Post by: ramset on January 25, 2020, 11:55:08 PM
Yes..... seem so sincere too..

I am told Mylo is making movies again .