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Author Topic: Electricity Amplification Device - It's so simple !!! (Hatem Magnetic Cogging)  (Read 41517 times)

Offline MileHigh

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A little add-on comment.

So if they are in he business of the business of tapping into the vast pool of venture capital investment money out there - then what is their product?

Their product is "fantasy."  Investors buy into companies like these for the fantasy of getting rich and/or the fantasy of helping to develop a free energy system.   So their product is mental energy induced into the minds and hearts of their investors.  The "investors" are actually the customers for the product - the mental fantasy.  And they pay for it dearly.

It's very similar of course to buying a lottery ticket when the jackpot surpasses 100 million.  You buy not expecting to win, what you are really buying is the idle daydreaming that you can indulge yourself in about being fabulously rich for a week before the draw takes place.

MileHigh

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Gwandau

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MileHigh,
 
you are probably correct in you guess, even if you are clearly underestimating their description of what is happening.
 
They say the secondary axis, given rotational torque from the motor axis through the magnetic bearings , is creating an unexplained and anomalous magnetic field oscillation around a second set of very big magnets placed in a special configuration situated at the back part of the axis of the secondary wheel.
           
You seem to think they are harnessing the energy through the two magnetic bearing wheels at the front of the photo, which is not their claim.
 
You see they are talking about a secondary effect called forth by magnetic oscillations only if the secondary axis is driven indirectly by another axis through magnetic bearings. So you have obviously underestimated the complexity of their claim.
 
You get the idea? It is not the two magnetic bearing wheels at the front of the picture that creates the field imbalance that they are tapping when nature tries to reestablish balance, it is the rear set of big magnets that allows for their claimed effect to happen. It's as I said just that the secondary axis has to be rotated indirectly through magnetic bearings for this to happen. If they try to drive the second wheel directly with a motor, the effect does not appear. And If I recall correctly, their claimed COP is quite small.

But you might still be correct in your assumption, I won't argue on that. Especially since they never seemed to have been able to realize the grand plans presented 2010. Additionally their hompage is missing.

But in spite of all the scammers out there using magnetism to fool people, I would advise you to be less self confident regarding the possibilities with magnetism, since this is a phenomenon we actually know very little about.

Gwandau

Offline MileHigh

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Gwandau:

My follow-up comment that I didn't want to mention before because it's sometimes inflammatory is this:  Once you do the analysis for a magnetic interaction like I described, then you can generalize it to virtually any magnetic interaction.  A lot of people don't want to believe this.

So hence you make the argument that "this is a special magnetic interaction" but the problem is that there is no such thing as a special magnetic interaction.  It's all related back to the analysis and the symmetry and harmony inherent in Nature.  There simply is no workaround.  That may sound closed minded to you, but what you may not realize is that your view sounds closed minded to someone like me.  Nature is showing you its balance and harmony everywhere you look, and you unlock the understanding with the application of common sense and mathematics and confirm it with empirical observation.

This thing should be a no-brainer self runner with the addition of a few belts and pulleys!

Quoting you:

<<<<They say the secondary axis, given rotational torque from the motor axis through the magnetic bearings , is creating an unexplained and anomalous magnetic field oscillation around a second set of very big magnets placed in a special configuration situated at the back part of the axis of the secondary wheel.>>>>

That's simply you indicating a willingness to buy into what they are pitching to you.  It's not real and the experiments would prove to you it's not real.  There is no "special configuration" because we are 100% sure that we can generalize the fact that the line integral will clearly indicate a zero net gain in energy when you go through the entire loop and end back where you started.

You can accept this idea that states "the line integral through any closed loop path in 3D space filled with a magnetic field will give you a net zero gain in energy," or not.

I looked at the PESN article from 2010 and someone posted that Sterling first interviewed them in 2006.   So we are a full six years later and I have to assume that the "miracle device" has never been seen.

Ultimately you believe what you want to believe and many people prefer to have that "big lottery ticket buzz" all the time when it comes to free energy.  I am more pragmatic, I will believe it when I see it and I measure it.

MileHigh

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Offline avalon

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Guys,
I think you are both right. MileHigh is right when saying that they have nothing but want some long-term investments for 'final research' and Gwandau is right when saying that their maybe a bit more to that.
I am, actually, convinced that the magnetic interaction (of some sort) will be the answer to (a version of) OU. Will it be them? Probably not but that does not remove the fact that the magnetic interaction is real.
A have seen a lot of companies like that. All of them are looking for investments for the 'final research' which, undoubtedly, will take forever. Still, OU is real and is waiting to be found. We just need to be persistant.



Offline Magluvin

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This thing should be a no-brainer self runner with the addition of a few belts and pulleys!


MileHigh

Ehh, I wouldnt say that. I did some magnetic gear stuff and if you use many small magnets in close intervals, there is a better more free wheeling connection between the wheels than with a belt or even gears. For physical contact, I would prefer (thin)gears over belts and chains.

But, if the claim is large in OU, then plenty could be wasted on some extra frictions of belts , gears and chains and still have some left over. If.  ;]

All said and done, If the output is just a bit over input, using magnets vs belts would be a good idea. Especially in the longevity department. We wouldnt want our OU device to be out of service because belts are too expensive because oil has skyrocketed, would we? ;]

Also, over a period of time, the losses of a belt or chain would add up. Plus belt replacement.

Remember the Big Trax programmable tank toy?  It used a magnetic clutch connection between the 2 drive motors to keep them in sync when moving forward and back. It also helped sync turn radius positioning, as the motors had optical wheels to measure distance and such according to program, and the mag clutch would lock into place to maintain optics timing positions. Had one as a kid.

When the 2 motors when in opposite directions, the magnetic bond between the magnetic clutch would be mechanically broken and spin quite freely in opposite directions.

These big trax are popular on ebay as many use them as a nice robot base to work with and add Auduinos and other modifications. Some are impressive.

MaGs

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Offline Magluvin

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That was, big trak   not trax.  Sorry  lol

http://www.bigtrakisback.com/

MaGs

Offline tagor

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In the midst of ideas setting off the scam alert warning, we may miss the real ones.
 
 
Magnetic coupling employed in a far more sophisticated way by these guys:
 
http://pesn.com/2010/07/14/9501672_Terawatt_Research_LLC_defies_free_energy_stereotypes/
 
 
What's your opinion?
 
Gwandau

yes this one could be very efficient ...
but difficult to replicate ...
who want to give a try ?

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Offline gadgetmall

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Seems to me Magnetic coupling is still coupling and if you add more generators the drag will be the same as if it is coupled with a belt or gears. Take any PM Alternator and you will see they are very hard to turn with a load . If you run one and couple another then another and 3 4 more you will see the drive motor Die or simply the magnetic coupling will just break like a clutch slipping unlike gears .Belts would probably slip also with many Gens running from one motor . If it was so easy then all that would be needed would be a throw switch like the WITTS Dude to remove the power and run it self . Doubtful this is any good . I hope some one could prove this that has some money to burn . I would think that the Pull from two magnets attracting( N-S)  would also require more energy to break away thus taking more energy . Seems maybe a repelling magnet would work better?The original quote "In the test model I built, the drive motor consumed 134 watts of power and produced 184 watts." [1] seems this is enough to self loop buy they couldn't >?

Offline tagor

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. Seems maybe a repelling magnet would work better?

yes you are true

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline allcanadian

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@Milehigh
Quote

These things can be very offensive if you forget about the lure of over unity and just look at this at face value.  There are people who work in professions related to what this company does and they are flabbergasted to see other people apparently masquerading around and making a mockery of science all for the almighty dollar.
Now that was a good rant!

It was a pretty god rant however as usual it was completely biased.
 
As for making a mockery of science I believe the scientific community has already done a pretty good job of doing that all by themselves. Take the "God particle" for instance where billions upon billions upon billions have been spent in search of a theoretical particle which like so many others pops in and out of existence from multiple magical universes we have never proven actually exist. Now all these thousands of scientist and engineers are probably not donating their time so I'm guessing their getting paid to be there, paid obscene salaries plus overtime to search for a fantasy particle we have no proof actually exists and they have been doing this for decades.
 
To make matters worse this mockery is funded by the taxpayers money, you know those poor people who do not actually have a choice of whether they pay taxes or not, so money is "Taken" from them/us against our will to fund a complete and utter fantasy. At least these private companies seek private investors and these investors have the choice of whether they invest or not where we are not given that opportunity.
 
If you want to see a great scam then you need look not further than most of the mainstream science that is publicly funded because it should be obvious that if they ever succeed then most of them will find themselves unemployed which is priceless. If there was ever an incentive to not succeed or make up nonsensical BS then this would definitely be it, the ultimate scam.
 
I should also note that the people you probably think are stupid and delusional and have said as much are the same people I have a great deal of respect for, that is the people here. The people who willingly give their time and resources, all at their own personal expense, for the slim chance they could make the world a better place.
If that is delusion then count me in, I'm all for it.
 
Regards
 
 
 
 

Offline Gwandau

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allcanadian,

This specific topic may well be reflecting a dead end, which MileHigh is very quick to point out, but any theory involving the harnessing of an electromagnetic unequilibrium is targeted by this guy.

I bet MileHigh will never agree to discredit any conventional science projects, not even the imbecill search for the "god particle" at Cern or the useless almost 50 year old economical distaster of hot fusion research. He seems to lack outside the box thinking as long as it is not confirmed by the ones inside the box, which makes me wonder again and again: What is he doing here at the OverUnity forum?

He is as close to a troll anyone can come without being a troll, still the result of his input most often is the same as that of the trolls.
With guys like him freely roaming here, this forum sometimes reminds me of the old SlapStick game of the fifties, were you are supposed to slap the other participants cards off the table the very moment they try to place them there.

Instead of encouraging one another to try our ideas, guys like MileHigh do their best to discourage anyone from doing experiments that seems to violate the conventional scientific viewpoint. And he is very good at it, to such a degree that I am sure he thinks himself he is doing us a favour by "bringing our wild and unfounded ideas back to earth."  What he doesn't seem to understand is that he is violating the very atmosphere of a novel outlook on things, making sure anything in a direction he dislikes is being discouraged and stalled.

To be curious and open minded like a child without any preconcieved "does not work" concepts is what we need here if we want to succeed in braking new ground, not someone who always is at our heals negatively nagging like an old crone. He really seems to have missed the whole point of being here.
 
This forum should only accept critical input that is empirically verified.
That way we would be free from those people compulsively dedicated to discourage anything unothodox that does not fit with their frame of reference.

Gwandau

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline MileHigh

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Gwandau:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29

Quote
In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.

I am not doing any of the above.  You and many others abuse the definition of the word "troll."  It's a cop out.  You are being a cry baby.  Somebody disagrees with you so you abuse the definition of the term "troll" and you try to change the meaning of the term to "somebody that disagrees with me."  That's simply wrong.

You live in a world where there are differing opinions, you have to deal with it.  Con artists are out there ready and willing to steal your money.  Another thing that everyone has to deal with.

You had no reply to what I told you about magnetic fields.  You claim that "there are a lot of unknowns and things we have yet to learn about magnetic fields" in what I perceive to be pure ignorance.  Have you sat in a calculus class?  After that have you sat in an electronics class?  After that have you sat in an electromagnetics class?

MileHigh

Offline Gwandau

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MileHigh,

First of all:
I never accused you for being a troll. I just said that your negative interference have the same effect.

Secondly:
You are critizising and discouraging very much here at the forum instead on encouraging the free research.
That makes me sucpicious of you. Don't you encourage free research in the garage? Then you are in the wrong place.
 
Regarding magnetism: Can you explain what makes a magnet attract a piece of iron without touching it?

If you can, you know more than anybody else on earth. Because nobody knows.
Stephen Hawkings has a theory about the attraction being created by virtual electrons circulating between this universe and another adjacent one.
But that's just a wild theory, still totally impossible to validate.

And don't give me any stupid answers about mere symptons, like the observed differential of rotational spin of electrons in the crystal lattice of a magnet, because this along with everything else we know about magnetism are only SYMPTOMS, nothing more. We know a lot about the symptons of magnetism, making it possible for us to apply magnetsism in many sophisticated devices, but we still don't know why magnetism work.

The source cause for magnetism still is a total mystery, and anything you try to impose on that subject are merely SYMPTOMS.

Gwandau

Offline MileHigh

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Gawndau:

You are using the same technique as AC.  What makes the sky blue?  Who can say what "blue" really is?  What does water taste like?  How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?  Where does a mobius strip start?

It's just another cop out.  Some con artists say that they can make magnets produce energy out of nothingness.  That's a real and tangible claim.  And your argument is "You can't tell me what magnetism is!"

Quote
Can you explain what makes a magnet attract a piece of iron without touching it?

Yes, absolutely.  You will call that a symptom-centered answer, but IT WORKS.  That's what you have to deal with.

MileHigh

Offline Gwandau

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MileHigh,
 
What are you doing here at OU?
 
Your prescence is very odd.
OK, I know by now what you want to discourage, but that just makes you a very anti OU member.
 
My question is : Are there any novel and groundbreaking research areas that you want to encourage here at the OU forum?
 
Gwandau

 

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