Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Electric vehicles => Electric cars => Topic started by: luishan on September 09, 2010, 05:50:07 AM

Title: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: luishan on September 09, 2010, 05:50:07 AM
Check it Out.  Fuelless Motor Car.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5n1BTU0vM4

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 17, 2011, 11:17:56 AM
Hi All,
I got these supportive emails from Konehead ( Doug Konzen),
who is also working on overunity pulsemotors:

Douglas L. Konzen
 an harti
   
   
hi Stefan
 
here is Ismael Aviso's electic car - it runs on "nothing at all" (it loops) and uses a battery only as buffer
 
plus the car runs on a standard forklift motor ...I dont know if you know about it yet - here is the peswiki article whch has condensed all the public information on it fairly good:
 
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Ismael_Aviso_Self-Charging_Electric_Car
 
 he uses highvoltage resonating and "shorting" coils in the MEG and gets exponential power increase, maybe its similar to Tesla's electric car...but that antenna isnt really the way it works so much - the antenna is sort of a power-booster to it.
 
He did some tests of 600 reps of starting and stopping this car, and the battery doesnt go down and those forklift motors are amp-hogs.......its very amazing Ismaels MEG.....

Just tought I would give you heads-up on it...Ismael is good friend of mine we went to Sweden two summers ago to build electric car for SAAB but nothing happened they were going broke and what he does is very hard to believe to be true too...anyways you could put generator in place of car too, and have free energy home gensets easy enough.

Hopefully he will start producing some MEGs for public soon just thought I would let you know.

Basically how it works is he SHORTS coils at sinewave peaks, the coils collapse and rebound with huge voltage increase -then he shorts the peaks of the oscillations created and then you get the exponential power increase (nutshell description)...so instead of oscillations "fading out" the oscillations expand to huge increases in power - its non-reflective type of power increase too - rosens ramp the primary up in extra draw...
 
ciao Konehead (Doug Konzen)

Hi Stefan
 
you can post it on OU.com no problem
 
I know Ismael really well and he has told me how it works on telephone when he gives me his updates and progress...so
I know mabye 90% in general terms, and mabye 60% in "technical terms"

Ismael is a genius - he is microwave engineer and set up all the cell phone system in Saudi Arabia where he went to school.
He can write with his right hand , or his left hand, it doesnt matter so he is one of those guys with two brains going at once...
 
He uses some "inventions" of mine from my old konehead motors which I am proud of that he is using  - these are "pickup winds" which are simply secondary winds wrapped around, behind, and inside, of the primary winds. (his "core" is actual an inner secondary coil! plus more windings behind and around the "primary" to pickup all the normally-wasted ambient magnetic flux)
 
Also Ismael has the "repelling force" technology, which I have witnessed in Sweden of demos for  SAAB execs - this alone is really super amazing -  he can shoot a 1 kilo object in air (a coil) 30 ft in under a second and he dows it with a 9V battery and he can do it 16 times over and over and the battery will only drop around .3 V.....when I saw this, I wanted to throw all my stuff away....he has been doing the repelling force for awhile - he has some you tube videos showing it. Basically it is a coil vs coil
 N agains N and pulse is super high frequency resonating pulse of 7500VDC discharge....dont know how he does it really but doesnt use invertor and is cascading DC and pickup winds "recycle" power back to where it came from plus he does coil-shorting in it too "somehow"
 
So think about  doing this repelling force with no moving parts - just slam a coil against another coil with that much force, and which  requires hardly any power to do - (it is all very much resonating power too, in the repelling force - iron just nearby will throw the resonance off!!)
 
He made some attempts at motors powered by it, but things kept flying apart from so much power - he started concentrating on the MEG last year, with no moving parts, and it has made the "mechanically rotating" repelling force obsolete sort ot....
 
 other things he does is that he uses bifilar winds like that famous Tesla patent and he takes out all the hundreds/thousands of harmonics produced from them - he says that most people dont realize what bifilars do - because the increased power is usually cancelled out but Ismale gathers it all up somehow....actually he went to "septfilar" winds lately - 6 wires instead of just two, and now he got much more power that way.
 
He told me if you realy understand the HUBBARD coils, that is sort of what he is doing in his MEG.
 
Ther real heart of system, is the "shorting of the coils" at their sinewave peaks - this is also one of my inventions/discoveries I did a few years ago - you can amplify the voltage in a regular generator coil around 20times more voltage doing this - it is REALLY SIMPLE - just use a switch  (must be very low resistance like high-amperage mosfet or a few mosfets in paralell) and simply "touch" the coil leads together with this switch for say 2ms or so - and put FWBR AC legs across the coil and ZING  - a cap on the DC side of bridge goes up in voltage X 20 just like that...."amps" remain the same.....the coil collapses, and "rebounds" with a vengeance is how I describe how it works...
 
Ismael took this a few steps further - and he shorts the coils 5 times during sinewave peak period - it is very interesting looking at scope at a shorted coil - it is like a Tesla spark gap as it creates oscillations/ringing and what Ismael does is short the PEAKS OF THE OSCILLATIONS CREATED with very quick and accurate switching....this is heart of his MEG system as far as I understand it, and where he gets all his power from the "ambient" you could say....so he gets X100 increase in power doing this from his initial primary-feed....
 
the gain is in VOLTAGE - and you cant put any resistance on the cap as itr fills - and also like mentioned the switching must be very low resistance....Ismale uses some IGBTs  in the MEG - it is high voltage, high frequency....
 
it must have a "2-stage output" circuit, where the cap fills from shorting, then cap hits load while cap is disconnected from "source"...pretty simple also....
 
I will answer your quesitons below:

 
>
> Could I post this in my overunity.com forum ?
DK:
sure no problem
 
> Or could you post it ?
DK:
you can  do it...
 
DK:

 Have you tested it yourself ?
I helped Ismael do demos of his repelling-force power in Sweden two summers ago, so have witnessed it and have general knowledge how it works (the replling force tech) and it is very real and very amazing jsut that...
 
As for the MEG, I havent built one - it is way too complicated it needs special microproccesors for IBGT filtering and EMP cancellations in order to do the very fast frequencies the MEG works on - he hired team of top notch computer chip guys to do his special microproccesors - but I have tested the "shorting-the-coils tech" alot, and I know how good that works plus know that pikcup winds around primaries gathers all the "ambient" flux that is normally wasted....so those two things, and also backemf/recoil collection circuits too I know and have tested all that but I cant do the 7500VDC cap discharge in his repelling force tech (I assume alot this is his "primary" in his MEG too)
and I cant do the resonating-high frequency pulse to his repeliing force tech either.
 
that anntenae on his car I dont really think does all that much - it will do somethign, but the real power is in the resonance, the shorting coils exponenetila-power increase via 5 times at peak coil-shorting, the pickup winds, and all the HUBBARD coil-like tech in his MEG.

>
> Are you convinced that it works this way ?
DK:
yes - I've seen the repelling force, and have been following his MEG progress for the past year and it works just like described - in fact better than you think, since it is so amazing, nobody believes it! I asked him what is the "ratio" of power increase, if you have like 100W system, and you put the MEG "onto" it, just so I could tell people, and he said it is 1000 times more power - and I said come on Ismael you have to tell something to people they will believe!! So just for fun I say it is 100times increase in power - but it is really way more than that....the doing the math on his older repelling force tech - it comes to about 1200HP blasts  from a 9V battery 16 times....which is ridiculous nobody believes it...Hector thought there was rocket fuel in the videos and it was fake!

 
> The videos are pretty amazing...
DK:
Yes - the battery is a BUFFER actually in way to connect high voltage power to lower voltage -
he uses no invertor but something else is going on  - so the battery is-not the "power source" but you got to give something people understand so the battery is in there...you can imagine how much power it takes to run a forklift motor - and battery goes up while he is running it....
they did 600reps  of starting car form stop battery stayed at 13V
His MEG when it puts out power has already gathered-up all the backemf and plasma then will destroy brushes  in the switching - so he runs that forklift motor on very high voltage and very low amps which is also amazing thing too....he has  recent video of this - looking at the brushes in his forklift motor and there si no plasma at all >

> So how does he extract the power from the shorted coils ?
DK:
Like described above - at least that is how I do it - he does something very similar but needs very low resistance switch, and no resistance in the caps and must have a two-stage circuit...his MEG is very complicated to me cant really say exacty what he does in extraction of the coil-shorting he does at high voltage and high frequencies but it works I can talk about this stuff forever he has told me lots about it.

 
> Does he use some kind of transformer hooked up to it ?
DK:
No - no invertor and doesnt step-down the voltage to the motor either - it is very "clean" power hitting the forklift motor as described.


> So does this violate Lentz law ?
DK:
Yes in that the extra-power gained in the "coil shorting" 5 times at sinewave peak is "non-reflective" to the primary.
I use the coil-shorting tech in my latest Muller-type generators, and with two stage output and "AC series cap" in circuit (like Tesla does with his "resonator caps" in his spark gap stuff) I can get power output form my aircored generator coils, (induced by neodymium magnets in rotor like Muller) to be "non-reflective" to the motor input.....which is "lenz-buster"

Ismael told me that the 5 times at peaks coil shorting does not affect the primary to any extra draw too, and he uses the "AC series caps too, which worked like "high bypass filters" really, in that the 'lug" is blocked" but the high end stuff goes through and fills caps up with no-reflection...I could go into more details on this but this is good enough for now....

 
> BTW, what happened to your own pulse motors ?

 
DK:
I started doing Muller motors with very strong neodymiums, and  started doing lots of AC rotovertors...best thing that happened with the old konehead pulse motors, is that Ismael took it and expanded it into what he has now...Ismael was one of the first people to replicate one of my konehad motors long ago and got it to work great (overunity) - then he incorporated the shorting coils into them too - ( I just did this with generator coils in Muller generators)  then he got the repelling force tech going (with pickup winds which were from konehee motors) and then went onto the MEG>
> Any progress ?
DK:
Doing some good motor-generators right now seem to be 8 times overunity sold a unit to someone in florida but my stuff is like toys compared to Ismaels tech....>
 

> Many thanks again and keep up the great work.

 
DK:
 
you too overunity.com is great thing going on!
I am going to replicate Anton HHO tech soon - my friend has reactors, I modified motor already...
 
Here is cirucit I use for coil-shorting....what Ismael does is "somewhat" similar to it...note the AC cap in series off the FWBR...this is what make it "non reflective" to motor draw:

http://sites.google.com/site/alternativeworldenergy/upright-alternator-circuits
 
Here is my site-lots of rotovertors and muller-type generators on their axles

http://sites.google.com/site/alternativeworldenergy/
 
Robert Myrland in Norway has some LOOPING "rotovertor-Mullers" he uses hiperco cores with needle-point design - he is doing some small scale produciton right now like 2 or 3 a month - i might help him make some in may....
 
Here is the thing I made this summer for cusotomero - an "uperight motor-generator" that uses coil shorting in the generator coils - runs on 5W and puts out about 40W (that is nothing compared to Ismaels stuff!)

http://sites.google.com/site/alternativeworldenergy/upright-alternator
 
ciao!
Konehead
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 17, 2011, 11:45:07 AM
This is really a genius trick and it will really kill the Lenz law:

https://sites.google.com/site/alternativeworldenergy/shorting-coils-circuits

Well done Doug and Ismael !

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ramset on February 17, 2011, 02:50:28 PM
Stefan
This is History in the making ,and opens the door to a new day!
I'm sure Thane Heins is watching this with great interest!

WOW!!
Thanks
Chet
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: e2matrix on February 17, 2011, 06:42:29 PM
I've been following Ismael and Doug for quite a while as time allows and it's great to see more news and discussion here about this.  All those years Doug's been working with different motor ideas I knew he'd hit on something that would be big.  Add Doug's motor wizardry to Ismael's high tech engineering knowledge equals BREAKTHROUGH! 

   I'd just like to suggest to Doug and Ismael or others close to this that they take the time to put in place a plan to keep this from being smashed, buried, bought out or ending up in the history books like so many other great inventions where 50 years from now a bunch of people are trying to figure out how it was done (like Tesla's electric car and many others) because none of the details were saved and secured in such a way as to get them public in case the PTB try to make it all go away. 

 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: scratchrobot on February 17, 2011, 10:01:45 PM
This is really a genius trick and it will really kill the Lenz law:

https://sites.google.com/site/alternativeworldenergy/shorting-coils-circuits

Well done Doug and Ismael !

Regards, Stefan.

So instead of opening the coil at the peak ala bedini to get a spike we short it?
Then maybe this is an idea
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 18, 2011, 04:16:40 AM
So instead of opening the coil at the peak ala bedini to get a spike we short it?
Then maybe this is an idea

Yes, this is the best idea since long time.
I am very excited !

They really mastered the Newman high voltage coils and brought it many steps further !

Ismael Aviso could be seen as the Faraday or Tesla of the 21th century !

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 18, 2011, 06:08:00 AM
I linked now all the video on the homepage of overunity.com
in the youtube playlist.
Just watch the first 19 videos after each other.

By the way, here is the homepage of Ismael Aviso.
http://www.ismaelwater.com/inventions.php

The alkaline water he is selling is also good for your
body.
I just studied the bad acid body conditions when you have too much acid in your body
which makes you sick and using
an alkaline salt like Baking soda (sodium hydrogen carbonat) each days 3 times in water
will really help you get rid of all illnesses in your body.

Try to stay at PH value 7 to 8.5 , not below 7 !
Just measure it in your morning urine with some test paper ÃœJ-strips for PH value.

Regards, Stefan.
P.S: this is offtopic, but Have a look at this video from Vito regarding the cancer killing of
alkaline baking soda-melasse drinks:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yl8Y8I_TsjI

Backing soda the secret health weapon !
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgBql4N9xGs

P.S. If anybody from Apple is reading this,
show these videos to Steve Jobs ! He seems
to be very ill from cancer...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: evolvingape on February 18, 2011, 06:13:16 AM
Hi everyone,

This is fantastic news. I am VERY excited by these public developments. This is the year Humans get infinite energy!

Congratulations to Ismael, Konehead and the Team!!  ;D

I note with interest the almost sideline mention of the repelling force demonstrations. Two coils reacting violently with only a very small initiating pulse.

If everything in the environment has electrical content as Tesla claimed (and I also believe) then it may now be a short step to replace "one" of the coils with the Ether. Will just be a matter of finding the correct resonant frequency for interaction.

This will truly make a "Flying Saucer" propulsion system possible!

The mention of Iron in the vicinity throwing off the resonance though is a bit annoying, I was planning one day to use a HELP and a HHO PCT as the power source for my flying saucer.

RM :)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Poit on February 18, 2011, 09:43:44 AM
As much as I would like to be excited about such a project.... one questions burns in my mind.... How is this ANY different to ALL the rest?

what I mean is - every year something like this comes out... and everyone is all like "yea!!! this is it!! yea!!! this year for sure!!"

then what?? it dies in the arse... and everyone moves on (mainly to square ZERO!)....

So... ill ask again, How is THIS any different?

they going 100% open with their plans? or are they going to do what everyone else has done and try and patent it and in the process get squashed by the powers to be?

personally I think the latter, history is a precursor.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ramset on February 18, 2011, 03:54:48 PM
Poit
Yes ,we need to try to make this time different!
and Yes, What is the technique ?and can we manifest this on our benches?

How do we do this Stefan?,can you get more info for a replication ?
People have been pounding coils for a long time,is the timing circuit and speed of switching the key here?

Chet
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Mark69 on February 18, 2011, 04:03:46 PM
Yes, please get this information out for everyone into simple, easy to reproduce format so the rest of the world can build it before it is lost or covered up!   ;D
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 18, 2011, 04:11:44 PM
It is different, cause Konehead already told us, how it works.

The shorting of coils in this configuration is not new.
Newman has already done this in his earlier models with his
mechanical commutators, but as these were very fragile
and he never explained it well, this knowledge got lost...

Now Konehead and Ismael have reinvented it and gave it a new
spin with using this AC cap in series to block the Lenz law
and Ismael even seems to exponentially extract more energy by
even shorting out the induction spike voltages at the caps,
so he is some kind of step charging his caps from the ringing peak
spikes, so he gets higher and higher voltages at his caps and then after
every pulse is shorting out the coil again with the higher voltage applied
from the cap so the next induction pulse will be even higher and put back more
voltage into the cap bank.
As the energy stored in caps is dependend from the SQUARE of the voltage,
he just really exponetially raises his energy output this way.

He really captures the energy that was lost in Joe Newman´s demonstration to radio frequency
bursts.
Do you still remember when Newman drove his repulsating unit with 10.000 Volts how
much radio frequency energy it put out in the surrounding and how many CFLs he flashed ?
There is really something going on inside coils, when you collapse and
let hit magnetic fields versus each other.

When you ever watched how spinning toy gyroscops crash into each other and what
mechanical energy is released then, you can understand the theory of Joe Newman.

The same is true here and Ismael has suceeded to bring this to the next level
and capture all this energy in his bifilar coils and convert it to
real usable electrical energy.

In my opinion it is just a confirmation of what Jeo Newman has discovered and
there are really tiny gyroscopic particels ( the particels  or waves that are the magnetic
field lines) converted into energy, so we have a very tiny small mass to energy conversion.
But as it is E= m * c^2 it is so powerful.

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: wings on February 18, 2011, 05:20:42 PM
posted by minoly on EF  ::):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRyKVU6YzYw





http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/6786-bedini-ferris-wheel-regauging-motor-40.html#post130954

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Poit on February 18, 2011, 07:00:09 PM
It is different, cause Konehead already told us, how it works.

The shorting of coils in this configuration is not new.
Newman has already done this in his earlier models with his
mechanical commutators, but as these were very fragile
and he never explained it well, this knowledge got lost...

Now Konehead and Ismael have reinvented it and gave it a new
spin with using this AC cap in series to block the Lenz law
and Ismael even seems to exponentially extract more energy by
even shorting out the induction spike voltages at the caps,
so he is some kind of step charging his caps from the ringing peak
spikes, so he gets higher and higher voltages at his caps and then after
every pulse is shorting out the coil again with the higher voltage applied
from the cap so the next induction pulse will be even higher and put back more
voltage into the cap bank.
As the energy stored in caps is dependend from the SQUARE of the voltage,
he just really exponetially raises his energy output this way.

He really captures the energy that was lost in Joe Newman´s demonstration to radio frequency
bursts.
Do you still remember when Newman drove his repulsating unit with 10.000 Volts how
much radio frequency energy it put out in the surrounding and how many CFLs he flashed ?
There is really something going on inside coils, when you collapse and
let hit magnetic fields versus each other.

When you ever watched how spinning toy gyroscops crash into each other and what
mechanical energy is released then, you can understand the theory of Joe Newman.

The same is true here and Ismael has suceeded to bring this to the next level
and capture all this energy in his bifilar coils and convert it to
real usable electrical energy.

In my opinion it is just a confirmation of what Jeo Newman has discovered and
there are really tiny gyroscopic particels ( the particels  or waves that are the magnetic
field lines) converted into energy, so we have a very tiny small mass to energy conversion.
But as it is E= m * c^2 it is so powerful.

Regards, Stefan.

Ok... thats all very well and all... but....... heres the kicker.... when can we have a guide on building this device.. step by step... I am more than happy to contribute creating the guide, but of course I would need all the information.....
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by 500 KV
Post by: Doctor No on February 18, 2011, 08:22:37 PM
Ismail should improve his car to make engine start with 500 or even 70 KV. It is simpler, needs no electronics. The car will flying high, as well as Amis disc for already 50y. with this technology of TT Brown. And to S. Jobs. From March we will cure everybody from anything. When only pays. Price equal for all, poor children from silly families too: 1.000 ounces of gold. I had always said, money are of not my interest. Only gold. Or diamonds. Diamonds forever are. So, when Steve wants somewhat stay longer with us, please tell him about this possibility. But this offer is only till 91 birthday of our Fuhrer valid-18.05. Later it will be much more to pay..... 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: mscoffman on February 18, 2011, 08:38:43 PM

Ok... thats all very well and all... but....... heres the kicker.... when can we have
a guide on building this device.. step by step... I am more than happy to contribute creating the guide, but of course I would need all the information.....


I'd like to see a plexiglas plastic and electronic component model built for a
reasonable size self running machine, powered from a 9Volt transistor battery
for starting or something and running a light led bulb of some type. Then sell to
us a locally (for him) built reproduction of this. It would have the coil assembly
and an operating computer controller. It would allow people to test out the RF
behavior of this device. Then offer people licenses to build this tech into other
stuff.

He himself should focus on building an overunity recharging station for existing
electric auto's.

His "combustion analog" method seems competitive with the Plasmerg Papp engine
process and is an entirely different subject. He should just do it and try to sell some
of this stuff and stop futzing around. IMHO. I also think that having current hopes
of designing something for use inside electric automobiles is woefully mistaken
pathway. They basically don't put unproven tech inside an unproven product and
expect things to work successfully.

:S:MarkSCoffman
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Doctor No on February 18, 2011, 08:46:46 PM
This princip can not operate with 9V. You need KV voltages to make it for real.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on February 18, 2011, 09:14:08 PM
A lot of this technology we have been working on/studying for many years. I started working on RV systems  back in 1998/1999. I had many arguments here with people that tell me OU does not exist but behind the scenes a number of us been sharing this technology with Hector and Kone leading the way. Albeit its been Open Source for a LONG time but no one cares to look.  I tried hard to get you to look at rotoverter but too many dismiss it when for 2 years now there are self running looped RV's driving Konehead generators running right NOW in Norway. Ismael started off with RV and Kone generators he see the magic here and developed the solid state version as a MEG type device.

A lawnmower driven by RV was looped here and disclosed on this site about 3 years ago.  Coil shorting technique has been around for a long time but Konehead really made it very simple. A lot of generators go OU when coil shorting and use High Pass filter.

Radiant Energy is directly related to RF principles where RF is applied in Electrical power engineering.  Coil shorting is alike RF Quenching makes generator as Super Regen Radio the Q gain of the RLC increases to thousands.  I mentioned this many times. Its amazing how so much falls on deaf ears. Hopefully enough people have finally woken up to make a real difference but it takes time and MONEY to make it happen.

HHO looping is not so hard as seen last Xmas but i was aware the French did it a few years before. Both myself and Kone are also making HHO gensets. Its probably one of the easiest technologies to loop.

BTW don't expect Ismael to post a circuit of his MEG he is tied into investors contracts but is simple raising awareness on youtube etc for mainstream interest/momentum into electric cars.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ramset on February 19, 2011, 02:12:05 AM
Bolt
Yes you have been saying this a long time,So now it seems that Ismael has maximized this effect?

You mentioned "Solid state"? Do you feel what he has done is optimize the old technique with solid state speed and accuracy.
Or is there something extra that he does?

Are you willing to share any ideas here that could assist a replication of your HHO looping  or gen set tech??

Thank you

Chet
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: e2matrix on February 19, 2011, 02:20:07 AM
Yes, please get this information out for everyone into simple, easy to reproduce format so the rest of the world can build it before it is lost or covered up!   ;D

Well unfortunately as bolt has just mentioned Ismael is tied to investors apparently.  I had always heard he was not open to sharing all the technical details.  Unfortunately that may be his failing.  I think if he were to sell kits of controllers and details it would get replicated and become big enough to not be stoppable.  However with the info hartiberlin has posted from Konzen I would guess some very savvy and dedicated person with some money could take the concept given and reproduce it.  Of course that would not be good ethics wise unless they were giving some to Ismael.  Lets just hope that either way it works into being a replacement for the insane way we are currently getting most of the worlds energy. 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kmarinas86 on February 19, 2011, 04:47:49 AM
It is different, cause Konehead already told us, how it works.

The shorting of coils in this configuration is not new.
Newman has already done this in his earlier models with his
mechanical commutators, but as these were very fragile
and he never explained it well, this knowledge got lost...

Now Konehead and Ismael have reinvented it and gave it a new
spin with using this AC cap in series to block the Lenz law
and Ismael even seems to exponentially extract more energy by
even shorting out the induction spike voltages at the caps,
so he is some kind of step charging his caps from the ringing peak
spikes, so he gets higher and higher voltages at his caps and then after
every pulse is shorting out the coil again with the higher voltage applied
from the cap so the next induction pulse will be even higher and put back more
voltage into the cap bank.
As the energy stored in caps is dependend from the SQUARE of the voltage,
he just really exponetially raises his energy output this way.

He really captures the energy that was lost in Joe Newman´s demonstration to radio frequency
bursts.
Do you still remember when Newman drove his repulsating unit with 10.000 Volts how
much radio frequency energy it put out in the surrounding and how many CFLs he flashed ?
There is really something going on inside coils, when you collapse and
let hit magnetic fields versus each other.

When you ever watched how spinning toy gyroscops crash into each other and what
mechanical energy is released then, you can understand the theory of Joe Newman.

The same is true here and Ismael has suceeded to bring this to the next level
and capture all this energy in his bifilar coils and convert it to
real usable electrical energy.

In my opinion it is just a confirmation of what Jeo Newman has discovered and
there are really tiny gyroscopic particels ( the particels  or waves that are the magnetic
field lines) converted into energy, so we have a very tiny small mass to energy conversion.
But as it is E= m * c^2 it is so powerful.

Regards, Stefan.

I created a playlist on YouTube showcasing the Ismael invention.

On my channel page:

http://www.youtube.com/user/kmarinas86#grid/user/41172E6280825AD2

Just the playlist:

http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=41172E6280825AD2

Also see my elaboration of Newman's theory of Gyroscopic particles:

http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=9638.msg257779#msg257779
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on February 19, 2011, 08:03:36 AM
This forum already knows the way to "short" coils to produce spikes, compiled here at Bruce's TPU Theory and Experiments ver.1.2, Reply #561: http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2300.msg221623#msg221623
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on February 19, 2011, 10:11:40 AM
Bolt
Yes you have been saying this a long time,So now it seems that Ismael has maximized this effect?

You mentioned "Solid state"? Do you feel what he has done is optimize the old technique with solid state speed and accuracy.
Or is there something extra that he does?

Are you willing to share any ideas here that could assist a replication of your HHO looping  or gen set tech??

Thank you

Chet

RV is a teaching tool everyone needs to start somewhere. Here you learn that RF=RE as a simile where RF techniques are converted to Electrical Power engineering. Eventually it all comes down to RLC and tune tune and more tuning.  Here you will learn the importance of VARS where standing waves and power factor zero equate to an infinite VSWR. Within the TPU its a triple frequency stacked co-linear 3 phase solid state RV tuned to create infinite VSWR or PF zero or standing wave condition of immense VARS. This creates a partial singularity device which creates compressed gravity due to the singularity and time compression. For a 1000 watt device the VARS within the device will be around 10KVAR's

You also notice that the "gurus" of our history all most always start with looped motor/generator systems then later it becomes a solid state design. Kapanadze is a fine example of this. If you have a generator where a moving magnet or coil is just replaced with a stationary magnet and coil except now you just pulse it.  Then you find a way to extract the pulse without lugging. Several methods can be used  such as switching the pulse into a load cap then disconnecting the source. Or using bifilar windings to prevent self induced magnetic fields. This is kapandaze trick. Or short on coil pulse peaks creates harmonics of much higher frequency and of greater energy then the source pulse. By using a simple high pass filter you can literally syhon off the HF energy without disturbing the LF source frequency provides an anti-lugging generator. Magnacoaster technology works exactly the same except is using Bloch Wall modulation on carrier frequency and the excess harmonics are pulled off using High pass filter. Other methods include switching flux paths and isolating the source after pulsing creates excess energy from ferromagnetic resonance of the iron goes OU. This produces a MEG transformer typical COP is around 3.  Several people have done this from Bulgaria, Russians, Italians many people made this flux path switching MEGs and shown i/p about 1kw and providing about 3Kw o/p.

So here is the summary - there is nothing new under the sun its all basically what we already know but the tweaks are in the details. There is no need to work BLIND first accept that OU is real that takes most people about 10 years for the brain to activate. Then research the many methods and start building upon the things you know starting very small and make it bigger this is how Ismael made his electric car.

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: neptune on February 19, 2011, 12:05:56 PM
@bolt . Your last post was quite informative .However much of the information was of a general nature , rather than specific . The problem for most people is that there is loads of information about , some of it true , and some of it misinformation . It is like having a textbook where someone has torn out  the first 100 pages . We need to start at page one . The nearest I have seen to this was Bedini and the Simple Schoolgirl device . Sadly , as far as I know , no one could make it work in a proven OU manner . I would love to see Bedinis electricity bill . Theory on its own is just theory . The world still awaits a simple apparatus that demonstrates OU . I don't want this post to be offensive , but we get claim after claim , and it always seem to come to nothing .We can only continue to hope .
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: FreeEnergyInfo on February 19, 2011, 02:36:16 PM
http://freeenergylt.narod2.ru/
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on February 19, 2011, 02:37:08 PM
I understand that but you wont get specifics. Look at something as simple as the Joule Thief. Even that is barely reproducible as a specific device with constant values. However the method is taught and others replicate it by substitution of parts they have around in each country. This creates thousands of working variations. For example the Joule Ringer requires a Fuji transformer type X11 and transistor type 2n3067 and some vintage germanium diodes as a pure example. Now everyone gets excited and they want to build it but they cant find a fuji camera, then they cant find 4 germanium diodes then no one stocks that transistor any more. Can you see this is only like a 4 component circuit??

If the method is taught and the principle of operation is fully understand now this circuit can be made from a thousand other devices. Indeed it doesn't need  fuji transformer but understanding how it works can then use a ferrite ring instead and the germanium diodes can be sub for 1n4007's and set the bias using 2 resistors to suit  your transistor.  The point I am making here is yes there is an abundance of information but far too many expect it to be served on a silver platter. Did SM, Kapandaze or Ismael work from a fixed kit of parts? Absolutely  not,  they worked from whatever they had on hand with only the knowledge of a basic system operation in mind and started from that blank sheet and the device evolved.

Do as SM stated "start with small kicks" The fact that others are churning out devices over the years is proof it not a hopeless venture only a learning curve and there is a lot of help and  support now more than any other time in history.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ramset on February 19, 2011, 02:38:47 PM
Bolt
Funny how a little time changes things, a few years ago
I would have read your "How it works"post and been totally baffled!

Now I just get excited,because I recognize so much of what you posted !
You speak with the authority that only experience can bring!

Actually makes me jealous,I wish I lived in your world!

And then I realized "I DO" !!

Lets get this done fellahs!!

Thanks bolt.

Chet
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Poit on February 19, 2011, 10:39:29 PM
all i see is talk.... until i see full schematics and diagrams on how to build this it will only ever be talk..

If schematics will never happen (which I would bet money on, any takers?) why waste the forums time?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ramset on February 19, 2011, 11:06:35 PM
Poit
Well we don't have any "magic fairy dust"[out of stock till tuesday],so this will have to do for now 20x OU
http://sites.google.com/site/alternativeworldenergy/shorting-coils-circuits
From Guyala here

http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=10398.msg275342#new

Chet
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: woopy on February 21, 2011, 12:18:29 AM
Hi all my 2 cents

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5BxwkvCaIg
Good luck at all

Laurent
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 21, 2011, 12:32:32 AM
Hi all,
I received this message from Isamel:

Hi, to all

My own technical view to open the free energy window;

1st. Low impedance load (To radiate enough Bemf or creating dominant freq or creating a carrier freq. to reach the Higher freq to attract surounding energy ) Using High resistance load will kill the effect.  Most designer based from the advantage & convenience of High impedance design..like Bedini, Newman, Hector RV,  & many more , but they forget Tesla always use very very low impedance & short it to the capacitor to create a very powerful vibration or oscillation. 

2nd Circulating voltage  inside the system minimum of 5 KV ( the more higher voltage the lesser grip of Lenz law )

3rd. Circulating freq. above 700Mhz  ( If you gain 10watts at 1 Hz or one shorting pulse/sec, why not make it 1 million shorting per second ? using same input )

Shorting will be the main process to manipulate the  above  3 basic requirement. The  more shorting the more free  energy you  can get. Unlimited extraction of free energy. Totally depend on the budget. The more extraction of  energy, the more overheating of parts, the more  R & D cost required for parts development alone to withstand the saturation of destructive spikes.  I considered Kone is the master of shorting in  a low freq. process.

As per latest survey, based from Keelynet.com info. 20 trillion dollars burned just to extract free energy with substantial work , but so far no valid result, I think my technology will be excluding n the statistic survey. I am now very very near to the  reality of real application , We hope everybody can benefit. Still a lot  to do & more need funding for  R & D.

A lot asking How about the Parallel flynn technology using P. magnet? For me  It's a free energy, but limited up to 20 Hz only. Push beyond the 20hz the P. magnet power start to be depleted or no gain at all. The sterling engine & P. magnet with similarity. Hard to apply into real application. Like PM , Sterling was so slow to react to the require application to contineosly extract free energy. 

Update : re : Government testing of my technology MIGHT be next week. using the same DC motor power by conventional power supply  or battery & compare the output work power by my own technology. I requested this since last year DEC 2010, with a little  help of push from some of friends in the Government & Media.

I will keep you update re: the testing,

BTw, As per the producer info I recieved yesterday, I think tomorrow or Tuesday my TV interview with Chn 7 ( biggest TV network in the Phill.) will be air including the footage meeting with technical evaluation council created by the Government specially for my energy.

Ism
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 21, 2011, 08:37:04 AM
A new email from Ismael today:

Hi, To all

I am recieving  a lot of positive response & some negative , but only 2% skeptics from more than 12,000 email.

Based from survey .

The positive response always the same topic,,

Making the cost of the conversion as low as possible. It doesn't matter whether it will disharge or not ,,,as long it can run with few standard lead acid batteries & can travel average daily driving range & need charge every two days with common accessories ;like...aircon etc...

Within that parameter my technology it's a done deal already. Just a matter of funding & design optimization to cope with different climate condition.

On the side of skeptics. Here's where I am most worried. Not only pulling me down, but it will cost hard earned money whoever they can able to convince & finance.

Most of these skeptics brilliant people are armchair scientist, stupid / Ignorant design engineers & Inventor. The most appropriate name to these  kind of people who's don't respect the hardship , pains experienced of the real inventor.. is a TALKING PARROT.

We should always BEWARE of  scam artist , but with the same level of awareness, be careful as well to any scientist , inventor  or engineer's,,, happen to be your technical consultant, convincing & claiming. They can duplicate my system, by just buying a bank of LIthium ion/polymer, the ( BMS ) battery management module & a 220V 63amps DC motor. my estimate ,,It will cost with the same dimension set up of 1/2 ( hidden part ) black box & motor minimum  total of $15,000.

Actually that is a big lie. Before you believe, first call the Lithium battery supplier not one. Ask several supplier from China to USA. Give them the motor spec the minimum current of 25amps - 63amps & maximum of 150amps for starting. The better way is show them my Ecar video running back & forward. They will tell what really the capability of the Lithium ion.

FYI, for the  last two months, I am personally sourcing possible supplier of LI ion all over the world. Until now I don't receive any response of commitment & guarranty these will work, by just using LI ion with 220 v & 10AH.  Most they said, a 150amps starting current of the motor will quickly overheat & eventually destroy the 10AH  LI ion battery internal wiring connection.

To those who realy happy to burn money just to prove is not problem. To those who will not stop accusing me as a scam artist. I challenge them of risking the exposure of my technology( opening the hidden part of the black box,  just to prove I don't  have the LIthium ion, once I  am  right I will run the car over their face. For those no balls to be run over & offer me 1 million dollar & I will open it & collect the money once I am right.

Any skeptics who canno't accept that challenge, just keep quite & wait the testing process.

Update:

My TV interview with Chan 7 was aired this early 6:30Am morning, but unfortunately not able to copy it. The producer promised me He will give me a copy within this week.

Re: Government testing schedule still waiting for everybody availability. I add some additional testing parameters to increased the testing credibility.

1st. I want parallel test with  my power supply technology & switch to standard power supply from the  wall outlet & then measure the volts amps, torque & rpm. will be at least 10 times of switch over. Actually this idea from Konehead.

 2nd. Test a standard commonly used for electric car series DC motor 36 volts, Just building up the database & comparison to that level. 

More cost to me, no problem, but very essentially to everybody.

Thanks

Ismael

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE for free
Post by: Doctor No on February 22, 2011, 03:16:04 PM
If schematics will never happen (which I would bet money on, any takers?) why waste the forums time?
I always say, only idiots are born for free. It costs really nothing to do some fuc. and they come more and more. I think Stefan that it came time in history to get rid of idiots. First from this Forum. It is really wasting time, bits and server for them. Dr Adolf Nowak   National Socialists Polish Workers Party    www.nsppp.bloog.pl
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ramset on February 22, 2011, 04:38:28 PM
Stefan
Do you have a phone  number or address for Ismael?
I have a friend in the Phillipines I would like to give it to.
Thanks

Chet
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: tagor on February 22, 2011, 05:42:38 PM
Stefan
Do you have a phone  number or address for Ismael?
I have a friend in the Phillipines I would like to give it to.
Thanks

Chet
http://www.ismaelwater.com/contact.php
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: mscoffman on February 22, 2011, 06:00:53 PM
This guy is making a bad mistake by having it tested installed in a vehicle. 
The primary important questions for a power supply are:
 
a) Does it work?, b) Is it safe for life around it?, c) Does interfere with
Radio frequencies?
 
The important secondary question of utility is: d) Does it operationally interfere
with copies itself?
 
Irrelevant questions are but those that are going to be ask because it is in a
vehicle are:
 
e) Does have a high horsepower slew rate?, f) Can it operate at extended power for
long hours?, g) Can it survive 100Kmiles on the road?, h) Is it safe in a 20 kph. collision?

Now the government panel can either not force the answer to some very important
questions,  or else look like idiots for approving something that is not at all adequately
designed for a vehicle.  Which will it be? Don’t worry though, a Billionaire can still
make money while having this idea thoroughly emplaced on a shelf. 

---

Here is the thing; I think the a person who engages in lack of honesty and
information hiding even with "denyability" should be expected to economically
sell out. Once again the experimenting public gets an enticing summary but
with no details, the billionaire gets to make a profit, the inventor make claims
of inventing applicable technology that really isn't. And nothing really changes.

:S:MarkSCoffman
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ramset on February 22, 2011, 06:19:06 PM
Tagor
Sweet!!

Thanks ,I'll make sure my freind gets this!
Chet
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 22, 2011, 11:28:15 PM
Yes, I also think Aviso should not concentrate on cars,
bust just show an overunity power supply.

Okay, it can also be used for cars, but this
will mostly wake up the wrong people probably.

Did you all hear the new interview with Sterling Allan ?

See:
http://pesn.com/2011/02/21/9501769_How_Aviso_extracts_energy_from_surroundings_to_power_his_EV/

and here is the interview:

http://www.mevio.com/episode/270096/fen.110221

So, it was a bit hard to understand for me as the phone line had some hum
and the accent was a bit hard to understand.

But what I gathered from the interview was the following:

He uses low impedance coils to discharge caps probably charged up with high voltage.
This way he creates very big oscillations and the oscillations probably have a high Q factor
as there is not much resistance in his LC dicharge circuits, so he has big oscllation amplitudes.

As he is also using low impedance ( low ohmic resistance) coils, he also can switch
the current very fast. He is working in the 700 Mhz to 1.2 GHz range....
So this is a frequency range, where you need a lot of experience and also need expensive
m
measurement equipment to be able to see waveforms on a scope for instance, so
it is not really easy to working with such high frequencies.
Also it seems he is then creating a carrier frequency from this discharge ringing
and this seems to convert environmental heat energy from the surroundings
of the coil into electrical energy.
Well, as this is already a very low infared frequency range so to speak,
it might be possible that he just taps into heat energy and cools it down this way.

So probably his coil cools down during this process and converts the heat to electrical energy.

His "special transistor" is just an array of cheap MOSFET transistors to replace expensice IGBT devices.
So if he blows up a few MOSFETs it is cheaper to replace 8 x 1 US$ MOSFETS than buying 1 x IGBT at 250 US$.

But how he is using them at 700 Mhz to 1.2 Ghz is a puzzle to me...

Are there 1 US$ MOSFETs that can switch this fast ???

Maybe if you did understand it better than me, please add your comments what you heard...

Many thanks also to Sterling  who did this interview.

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hakware on February 23, 2011, 05:59:01 AM
@hartiberlin No there no 1.00 mosfets which can be driven to the 700Mhz range.
You can gang the mosfets up to increase the power capability as you well know, but you also have to drive them pretty hard as the gate capacitance become much larger and harder to cause a hard short.

as far as the 700Mhz, IMHO I dont know if that is really going on or if its more of a realistic frequency like AM broadcast mixing or possibly something of a lower frequency. The coil in his video's is far too large for 700Mhz to resonate in any matter.

as far as heat conversion he claims that he cant run it too much because the heating will burn it up. So lets not get ahead of ourselves on how this thing converts/extracts energy yet.

If I understand him correctly, What he is doing is exactly the same process IE, "secret sauce" used in the VTA, Marks coil, Cooler and quite a few other EM devices we have seen over the years.

Kent
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on February 23, 2011, 06:18:20 AM
@hartiberlin No there no 1.00 mosfets which can be driven to the 700Mhz range.
You can gang the mosfets up to increase the power capability as you well know, but you also have to drive them pretty hard as the gate capacitance become much larger and harder to cause a hard short.

as far as the 700Mhz, IMHO I dont know if that is really going on or if its more of a realistic frequency like AM broadcast mixing or possibly something of a lower frequency. The coil in his video's is far too large for 700Mhz to resonate in any matter.

as far as heat conversion he claims that he cant run it too much because the heating will burn it up. So lets not get ahead of ourselves on how this thing converts/extracts energy yet.

If I understand him correctly, What he is doing is exactly the same process IE, "secret sauce" used in the VTA, Marks coil, Cooler and quite a few other EM devices we have seen over the years.

Kent

Well what type of transistor do cell phones use for transmission?

Could it be he is just using the fets to just timely kick the osc using a much lower freq?

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on February 23, 2011, 06:22:59 AM
Dang even 1 ghz, I wonder how long that would ring in a properly tuned circuit.

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hakware on February 23, 2011, 08:05:41 AM
Well what type of transistor do cell phones use for transmission?

Could it be he is just using the fets to just timely kick the osc using a much lower freq?

Mags

Yes they do have some Fets for that, But I haven't seen any available that were of high current on the cheap.

In response to harmonics, yes it may be possible to get a harmonic at some order to match somewhere in the cellular range. But here again, Cellular towers are not very powerful. The power would never come from such. Any harmonic mixing at 20th order would be weak as each harmonic is many db down from the primary frequency.

also if you look at a datasheet for an IGBT, you can see that were talking almost 2000 nanoseconds from off to on to off state. that makes its maximum operating frequency at 500Khz.

I still dont think that coil could ever be used for ringing in that frequency range. Its dimensions are too large.

 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on February 23, 2011, 01:22:26 PM
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=8141.msg203722#msg203722
In the above link Otto starts his thread where he tries to explain his experience with spikes. In reply #5 he explains why no more than 200kHz should be used to do that..
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on February 23, 2011, 03:01:12 PM
The Ismael radio show audio was very bad so i cleaned it up here on my site. Look on this page for the audio is much smaller and cleaner than original MP3 but its now open source OGG format. You may need VLC player to listen.

http://sites.google.com/site/silverfreeenergy/links
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: norman6538 on February 23, 2011, 03:14:33 PM
I understand how the backemf makes higher voltage but how does
it make more amps or watts? It seems to me its just making the pie pieces (amps) smaller.

And then the air coil with the long bar magnet puzzles me too.
The air coil would have very low current out due to no core
flux concentration.


Norman
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: teslaalset on February 23, 2011, 04:03:20 PM
I don't want to spoil the fun we have here, but applying GHz range oscillations with coils the size Ismael is showing in his video's seems a bit unrealistic to me.
Somebody at the Energitic Forum also mentioned that in one of the video's a co-rider of his car is joining a ride on his car and sits down right at the coil location. This would indeed influence the coil behaviour a lot if GHz range frequencies are applied. Will he cope with such alteration?

I want to be neutral here, but I wonder whether anybody else has similar observations.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: FreeEnergyInfo on February 23, 2011, 04:28:36 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkVFusWKCNc&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: grizli on February 24, 2011, 12:42:15 AM
RV is a teaching tool everyone needs to start somewhere. Here you learn that RF=RE as a simile where RF techniques are converted to Electrical Power engineering. Eventually it all comes down to RLC and tune tune and more tuning.  Here you will learn the importance of VARS where standing waves and power factor zero equate to an infinite VSWR. Within the TPU its a triple frequency stacked co-linear 3 phase solid state RV tuned to create infinite VSWR or PF zero or standing wave condition of immense VARS. This creates a partial singularity device which creates compressed gravity due to the singularity and time compression. For a 1000 watt device the VARS within the device will be around 10KVAR's

You also notice that the "gurus" of our history all most always start with looped motor/generator systems then later it becomes a solid state design. Kapanadze is a fine example of this. If you have a generator where a moving magnet or coil is just replaced with a stationary magnet and coil except now you just pulse it.  Then you find a way to extract the pulse without lugging. Several methods can be used  such as switching the pulse into a load cap then disconnecting the source. Or using bifilar windings to prevent self induced magnetic fields. This is kapandaze trick. Or short on coil pulse peaks creates harmonics of much higher frequency and of greater energy then the source pulse. By using a simple high pass filter you can literally syhon off the HF energy without disturbing the LF source frequency provides an anti-lugging generator. Magnacoaster technology works exactly the same except is using Bloch Wall modulation on carrier frequency and the excess harmonics are pulled off using High pass filter. Other methods include switching flux paths and isolating the source after pulsing creates excess energy from ferromagnetic resonance of the iron goes OU. This produces a MEG transformer typical COP is around 3.  Several people have done this from Bulgaria, Russians, Italians many people made this flux path switching MEGs and shown i/p about 1kw and providing about 3Kw o/p.

So here is the summary - there is nothing new under the sun its all basically what we already know but the tweaks are in the details. There is no need to work BLIND first accept that OU is real that takes most people about 10 years for the brain to activate. Then research the many methods and start building upon the things you know starting very small and make it bigger this is how Ismael made his electric car.

Classic TC method could use VARS, but load  in general is NOT resistor , its capacitor, which will not reduce huge Q factor of TC.
I mentioned this several times here but never had chance to replicate it.

we have TC Transm and TC Reciever.     TCT and TCR.

when TCR has resistor for load it lowers Q factor of TCR and also that way TCR affects TCT as load.

Why not using capacitor instead resistor, rectifier and capacitor. Voltage drop will be small on capacitor and Q factor will not be reduced much.  for example 10V 10F(just example) capacitor at the bottom of TCR in series to earth (using full rectifier), we can also use low turn coil instead.
This seems like perfect way of using reactive energy, of course charged cap must be disconnected before its energy we can use and replaced with empty cap.


Another well known crude way is after we increase  magnetic  field inside coil, we disconnect the coil from battery, and coil starts to natural LC oscilate, than we collect that energy by charging cap.


Than imagine simple coil like Tesla coil but not top capacity, just simple single layer solenoid. Every coil has its own LC natural frequency.

when voltage at the ends is maximum we short the ends of the coil and what we get ? we should get HF complex harmonics oscillation inside coil I presume, and only way to collect that energy is to have maybe center tap of coil, cause outer ends are shortened.

but this frequency should be EVEN higher than natural LC frequency of solenoid

Bolt please enlighten me :D
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: grizli on February 24, 2011, 12:53:20 AM
Hi all my 2 cents

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5BxwkvCaIg
Good luck at all

Laurent

This is not natural LC coil oscillation shorting at its peak, its shorting of coil than with perm. magnet approaching affected. Shorting  such coil equals to opposite , it equals to free oscillation of coil when you open the coil. I dont think thats what the did, read my post above, but of course I am not sure, bolt will answer I hope. All in all it may harvest that effect in a way
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on February 24, 2011, 05:54:59 AM
I've read through the posts here and there is confusion about that "large coil" he uses....

there are two different techs Ismael uses and is demonstrating in videos, and the "large coil" (1 kilo weight) seen in the videos where he blasts  blasts up in air with small battery 35ft high in under second is NOT the type or size of coil(s) he uses in his MEG (motionless electronic generator)

and the MEG is what he powers his car's DC forklift motor with and he doestn use the "repelling force/coil blasting" large type coil in his car.

he has old vidoe mabye two years old where he has car-motor he build that spins car wheel up in ari at 240VDC input from an invertor and input to invertor is 8 amps and 12V and the "output" from the pickupw winds is 15 amps and charging 12V battery - that motor he built has coils "similar" to the large coil-blasting video coils.

the many smaller size coils he uses in the MEG work very similar to HUBBARD method he tells me, and they are wound bifilar-style but with 6 wires  instead ... I think there are total of 200 coils in MEG  but not certain on that...he also has PICKUP/SECONDARY winds around the bifilar coils that pikcup and collect  the "ambient flux" from the large magnetic fields that envelope the resonate-frequency-chopped energized primary coils - pickup winds are actually inside and around the primaries.

In that large coil he blasts up in air with the repelling force, it is bifilar 22GA wires in primary, and 5 paralell 19GA wires on the scondary/pickup winds wrapped all around the primary - these pikcup winds are what give that coil its big size and weight


So he has many small coils in the MEG not one big one. in place of core, there is that inner coil and he says that at high frequencie this inner core works like  an iron core does at low frequencies

It doesnt really matter if someone sits near that anntenae obviously,  its sort of recent add-on feature and is NOT whre the power "comes from" it is jsut an additional thing he added on recently...he told me there are three Power supplies - there are
1)pikcup winds,
2)shorting of coils 5 times at peaks where the oscialltion peaks themselves get shorted - and this is how he gets the exponential power increase and this is the heart of the system..
3)also there is the backemf collection in radio invnterview he mentionn he combines the back emf with the shortingof coils to create a carrier wave and it become sdominate frequency and that is how the anntanae pulsl in power - its my meager opinon that the annatnae could not even be there and he would still be making the huge power he does from "Nothing" in the MEG using only the backemf and shotitng and pikcup winds but if he gets only 10W from anntane and his MEG has a gain of X1000 then that is 10W fiom anntenae so maybe it is some sort of prioming type of thing to feed his system...he hasnt discussed the anntane with me I dont know thatmuch about it but it worked fine when he didnt have one

also the discussion on mosfets not being fast enough I asked him about that awhile back and it is the mosfets are the initiators of the Rings via the shoritng of coils  at sinvewave peaks and it is the oscillations "created" that are the gigahertz speeds and the switches themselves do not have to go that fast....he has very advanced HF RF filters made for his homemade IGBTS
he callls them - filtered IGBTs - "FIGBTS" and without the filters his thing jstu wouldnt do what it does...he has team of topnotch computer chip guys build them for him...



Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on February 24, 2011, 06:01:15 AM
correction - I meant to type 10,000W not 10W from the X1000 "gain" from his MEG if that anntanes sucks in 10W

figure it is putting out 5 to 6KW right now powering that car with the 60%eff forklift motor so the antennae maybe adds 20% increase?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on February 24, 2011, 06:15:34 AM
also tha video shown above of shorting coil with reed switch is good one, showing simply how to do it with genrator coils incuced by rotor of magnets (should be N-S magnets)...it is better to have FWBR AC LEGS across coil - and if making big power,also have AC cap in series from FWBR to work as high-bypass filter so no lugging at all of motor this way)
Also the power should go into cap wiht no resistance, then cap goes into load in 2 stage process - and cap is disconnected from coil when it hits the load - Ismael does it like this - his forklift motor has NO PLASMA AT ALL in the brushes because the pwoer feed to it is very very clean cl with no plasna/backemf problems burning up the brushes.

Anyways Ismels in his MEG has cap-diacharge that saturates his coils, and at the cap sarutation-point, that is when he hits it wiht the 5 shorts at "peak" which gives the expontnetial power increase AND with no reflecion back to the primary too
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on February 24, 2011, 06:58:03 AM
here is scope shot in link below of air-cored coil being shorted at sinewave "peak-period"
this is from testing with a 1200rpm AC rotovertor motor spun generator-rotor of 6 large neodimium N-S magnets that makes the 60hz AC sinewave signal - note the "smears" of oscillations produced by the coil short.
Ismaels more advanced power producing method is he shorts those oscillation peaks themselves...also note the simple solid state circuits if any of you want to try some experiments:

http://sites.google.com/site/alternativeworldenergy/shorting-coils-circuits

here is circuit I use in working motor-generator unit - note it doesnt have "2 stage" output - that AC cap in series working as "high bypass filter" made it non-reflective to motor draw all on its own:

http://sites.google.com/site/alternativeworldenergy/upright-alternator-circuits


Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Secruoser on February 24, 2011, 07:38:36 AM
Hi, is there a peer review and journal for this prototype? Thanks.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on February 24, 2011, 04:00:48 PM
Ismael technology is NOT open source. He is able to generalise upon the technology but only to a point of retaining IP rights to protect investors. So while many many people of engineering background have visited his premises to see electric car and coil launching demos you will not see a full circuit diagram any time soon. Alike the TPU where general format of operation provided the details are missing. You need to fill in the blanks.

Basic principle of operation already shared as coil shorting technique. Only those with these attributes will take this a step further to developing a real OU device of substantial power. Ismael like others in this field have spent $100,000's in R & D and needs to recover this costs.

MONEY

FULL RF LAB setup

TIME

DETERMINATION

Probably requires RF/engineer trained with >20 years experience and strong understanding of OU/ZPE devices in general.

This means only perhaps a handful of people meet this attributes everyone else will have to wait.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: dllabarre on February 24, 2011, 08:41:47 PM
The Ismael radio show audio was very bad so i cleaned it up here on my site. Look on this page for the audio is much smaller and cleaner than original MP3 but its now open source OGG format. You may need VLC player to listen.

http://sites.google.com/site/silverfreeenergy/links

Bolt

Off-topic... so others please ignore.

Do you have the actual file for the simulator in this video out-2.ogv on your site?  A Spice file would be fine also if you have it.

Thanks
DonL

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 24, 2011, 10:10:51 PM
Bolt

Off-topic... so others please ignore.

Do you have the actual file for the simulator in this video out-2.ogv on your site?  A Spice file would be fine also if you have it.

Thanks
DonL

Yes, would be great,
if you could post the simulation files, so we could play
with oit ourself.
Many thanks in advance.

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 24, 2011, 10:22:27 PM
2 New emails from Ismael:

The  test Video result . The motor 11Kw powered by wall outlet or  conventional supply = 45% effeciency only & my Ecar technology  125%.

Repelling force Test. conventional lifting a kilo by means of ordinary low speed  motor up 33 feet & my repelling force 1:4 ratio. means if I consume 100 watts the conventional 400watts.

Video within few hours , but we made it in a fast forward mode. To see what happening inside the testing lab. 

heres  the link of my TV interview

http://gmanews.tv/video/74270/ub-filipino-inventor-nakadevelop-ng-self-charging


Aviso E car test result by DOE & DOST

   
Here's the link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cJW2On1E54


=============

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on February 25, 2011, 02:05:37 AM
Bolt

Off-topic... so others please ignore.

Do you have the actual file for the simulator in this video out-2.ogv on your site?  A Spice file would be fine also if you have it.

Thanks
DonL

That circuit was originally uploaded for someone else during an Rotoverter discussion quite some time ago now. I just left it there as its my scratch pad site. So no i don't have the source files but you can copy it an reproduce it if you want to do that as long as i get credit for the circuit.  Someone made a SS version using 3 large 150 VA toroidal transformers and it he had it working to about COP >3 but had to stop it after the caps almost exploded over volts.  It design purpose is to run a 3 phase motor direct from DC supply using pure self resonance. The motor will run at its own pure optimal speed at extremely low power consumption.

If you want to play with the sim go here

 http://www.falstad.com/circuit/

Its a great tool and so easy to use. It can do a lot of basic circuit ideas but of course it can not SIM zero point energy or radiant energy....not yet anyway:)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 25, 2011, 03:37:12 PM
New email from Isamel:

Testing figure

Testing DATA 5 

Test1.

Meralco: 1,300watts/  6.4amps./  223 V    Dyno: 291 Newton /  570 watts

Aviso tech: 308 watts/  13amps / 23.74 v  Dyno :210 Ntwn / 418 watts


Test2

Meralco: 2000watts/ 9.5Amps / 227V  V  Dyno: 455 Newton / 931 watts

Aviso tech: 306 watts/ 13amps / 23.6V     Dyno: 210 Newton / 402 watts

Test3

Meralco: 2,300watts / 10.98amps / 229V  Dyno: 507 newton / 1,100 watts

Aviso tech: 306 watts/ 13amps/ 23.56 V   Dyno: 200 Newton / 389 watts

We drive outside few 100 meters & back again to LAB & again some testing, due
to they found two sets of batteries 7amps/12V in front of the Car. I told them supply only for   
FAN & Microcontroller, but they don't believe so we test again for the 4th time & confirmed
no connection powering the motor & drops of volts & increase of current draw. Very minute
draw of current only either on or off of the motor.

Note: Actual Average time testing of AVISO tech 5 minutes. Two minutes running  allocated for the
        DYNO computer setting up.

 

Testing of repelling force.

6 times Conventional way of lifting a 1kilo coil & Using conventional small 12V DC low speed motor.

Height : 12 feet
Average Time to reach 12 feet :   0.9 sec.
Average Current draw :  0.93 amps
Battery : 12V / 24AH
 
FYMEGM repelling force by AVISO TECHN. 1Kilo coil

3 times repelling Battery start at 12.48 V end up 12.29V

Average Height: 26 feet
  "         Time: 1 sec
Battery: 9 V + 1.5V AA + 1.5 AA = 12volts

Note: I am Not satisfied re: the Height reached, but i don't have time to adjust to full power.

I told them, Once I recieve  the enough funding. Next test will be 110 Kilometers per hour & until battery
 it run down.

Ismael
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: neptune on February 25, 2011, 07:12:30 PM
@Hartline's post above .These tests could be history in the making . So let us make certain that everyone understands them fully .I will concentrate on test no1 .
Meralco;1300 WATTS/6.4 AMPS/223 VOLTS .Dyno570 watts .
Aviso tech ,308watts/13amps/23.74 volts ,Dyno418watts .
The Meralco is a brand name of a mains power unit .As the voltage quoted is223 volts , I assume that the 1300 Watts is the input power to the power supply unit , that is , the power drawn from the mains . No figures are quoted for the output of the power unit ,which will be the same as the input power to the motor . The Dyno [Dynamometer] measures the mechanical output power of the motor ,570 Watts .Most of the lost power will be motor losses as we can expect the power unit to have an efficiency of between 80 and90% . Using the Aviso Tech power source , the figures quoted are for the output of this unit .No figures are quoted for the units input , as it does not have one! So the motor has an input of308 watts and a mechanical output power of 418 watts . So here we have two miracles . A power supply unit with no input , and a motor running at well over 100% efficiency . This is my understanding of the test . Can someone PLEASE correct me if I am wrong .
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: dllabarre on February 25, 2011, 09:36:57 PM
That circuit was originally uploaded for someone else during an Rotoverter discussion quite some time ago now. I just left it there as its my scratch pad site. So no i don't have the source files but you can copy it an reproduce it if you want to do that as long as i get credit for the circuit.  Someone made a SS version using 3 large 150 VA toroidal transformers and it he had it working to about COP >3 but had to stop it after the caps almost exploded over volts.  It design purpose is to run a 3 phase motor direct from DC supply using pure self resonance. The motor will run at its own pure optimal speed at extremely low power consumption.

If you want to play with the sim go here

 http://www.falstad.com/circuit/

Its a great tool and so easy to use. It can do a lot of basic circuit ideas but of course it can not SIM zero point energy or radiant energy....not yet anyway:)

Thank you for getting back to us.

DonL
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on February 25, 2011, 11:36:35 PM
@Hartline's post above .These tests could be history in the making . So let us make certain that everyone understands them fully .I will concentrate on test no1 .
Meralco;1300 WATTS/6.4 AMPS/223 VOLTS .Dyno570 watts .
Aviso tech ,308watts/13amps/23.74 volts ,Dyno418watts .
The Meralco is a brand name of a mains power unit .As the voltage quoted is223 volts , I assume that the 1300 Watts is the input power to the power supply unit , that is , the power drawn from the mains . No figures are quoted for the output of the power unit ,which will be the same as the input power to the motor . The Dyno [Dynamometer] measures the mechanical output power of the motor ,570 Watts .Most of the lost power will be motor losses as we can expect the power unit to have an efficiency of between 80 and90% . Using the Aviso Tech power source , the figures quoted are for the output of this unit .No figures are quoted for the units input , as it does not have one! So the motor has an input of308 watts and a mechanical output power of 418 watts . So here we have two miracles . A power supply unit with no input , and a motor running at well over 100% efficiency . This is my understanding of the test . Can someone PLEASE correct me if I am wrong .

Yes i will explain it all to you.

Meralco;1300 WATTS/6.4 AMPS/223 VOLTS .Dyno570 watts .

Meralco is the name of the city supply and it passes through very accurate metering system which measures  a 1300 watt i/p. The Dyno is the watts on the car wheels  after allowing for all losses in the system as the Dyno is basically a calibrated generator.

So you can see 1300 watt i/p versus 570 watts on the wheels.  = 43% efficiency OR the system losses are 56%. This is made up of 66% efficiency of DC motor and 10% drive train losses. ..roughly. As you go through each test the losses are about 50% with some small variation depending on how fast the motor and drive train is running.

Now the Aviso Tech

308watts/13amps/23.74 volts ,Dyno418watts .

308 watts measured i/p from the batteries using calibrated shunts and accurate metering.

The Dyno records 418 watts on the wheels which equates to about 12 to 18mph. Now remember there is a system loss of 50% we know this from the mains data sets. So 418 is multiplied by TWO to allow for reversing the loss = 836 watts. This is what the MEG must be supplying to give the watts on the dyno.

836/308 = COP 2.714 This the the GAIN of the MEG device.

If stood on a glass table supplied with 1000 watts i/p it will light 2714 watts worth of lamps or heaters.

That said this is a prototype and Ismael said more than about 25 mph the MEG delivers too much power and things start smoking. I figure it can run no more than 5kw at the moment without problems driving the 11kw DC motor.

You can do the other data sets and always the mains loss is roughly 50% from wall power to wheels and the Aviso tech reversing the losses for the data provides a COP of 2.7 through out the test. So despite the glamorous  sounding  technology its no better that other OU Meg devices already shown alike looped RV's and the Bulgarian MEG etc also has a COP of around 3.

Now we have to give Ismael praise where its due as he is one of the first to have an OU device measured by  government DOT engineers so now it has 3rd party verification its a real ZPE OU system albeit not the best when comparing to the TPU or Kapanadze etc. As i said in the other forum don't lose sleep over how this coil shorting and cascading thing actually works as there are dozens of other systems capable of COP 3 which is indicative of pulsing and dump to cap techniques most of which is open source for decades. Even magnacoster coil banging with magnet will do COP >3

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: neptune on February 26, 2011, 11:56:25 AM
@bolt . Many thanks for that detailed reply .Whilst agreeing with most of what you say , I feel there is a point you have overlooked .If you look at the figures for the Aviso test ,and for the mains test , No figure is quoted for the input voltage of the motor . Either the motor runs at about 220 volts ,or more likely a lower voltage . Also we know it is a DC motor . So we cannot connect it straight to the mains . We need a rectifier , and, more than likely a transformer . These will introduce additional losses . These losses are not large , but will skew the figures a bit .AS YOU SAY , PROBABLY HIS GREATEST ACHIEVEMENT IS GOVERNMENT RECOGNITION .
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on February 26, 2011, 08:39:01 PM
@bolt . Many thanks for that detailed reply .Whilst agreeing with most of what you say , I feel there is a point you have overlooked .If you look at the figures for the Aviso test ,and for the mains test , No figure is quoted for the input voltage of the motor . Either the motor runs at about 220 volts ,or more likely a lower voltage . Also we know it is a DC motor . So we cannot connect it straight to the mains . We need a rectifier , and, more than likely a transformer . These will introduce additional losses . These losses are not large , but will skew the figures a bit .AS YOU SAY , PROBABLY HIS GREATEST ACHIEVEMENT IS GOVERNMENT RECOGNITION .

It absolutely  doesn't matter what the volts are in each component. The only thing  that matters is WATTS INPUT and WATTS OUT.  So there might be rectifier to convert to DC just after the mains grid watt meter but the losses here are not worth mentioning perhaps 1%. There is always something that can be argued but mostly its splitting hairs.

In fact the data report tells you how many volts and amps is being consumed when its plugged into a very expensive calibrated WATT meter then whatever the electronics and motor does with this who cares? The answer comes out on the wheels and the Dyno shows the output watts.

let me put it another way. Does your electric meter care if you watch TV or use the Vacuum cleaner, what about charging your cellphone that's only 5 volts? Of course not it just measures the power consumed. In Aviso tech mode the i/p is now the batteries which are measured with calibrated meter shunts. Its a 3rd party government test so we have to assume within some tolerance they know how to measure IN versus OUT.

Well the bottom line is many OU debunkers will have to admit they were wrong its another notch of history etched in the road to energy freedom but for OU veterans a COP 2.7 is not fantastic.

Kapandaze device is around a COP of 100. He sticks 50 watts in and gets 5000 watts o/p
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: neptune on February 26, 2011, 09:55:37 PM
@bolt . I was not disagreeing with your explanation .just trying to get my head around it .I did say that the presence or absence of a transformer and/or rectifier would have very little effect on the figures . Ultimately ,I am hoping that although this may not be the only, or even the best technology , It will at least reach the marketplace , as a result of Government recognition .Difficult though technology is , the politics is always equally difficult . This is the big problem with the Kapadnadze device . I have sent you a private message .
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: TheOne on February 27, 2011, 12:08:07 AM
Ismael say its better to short the coil a many time as you can, he say if you could short a million of time instead of few or one is better the more you short during a phase the better free energy you get
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: peakprod on February 27, 2011, 07:53:29 AM
Hi , Konehead on this site ; https://sites.google.com/site/alternativeworldenergy/shorting-coils-circuits
Shows a circuit to short a coil using 2 Mosfets. The mosfets will surely only swith on when the d lead is positive to the gate. So with ac from the coil only 1 mosfet can be on at one time. Thus never shorting the coil. Can someone plaese correct me if I am wrong. Thanks peakprod.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: markdansie on February 27, 2011, 12:29:13 PM
well not a scam...just delusional
why not put it on the bench and close loop it ???
Mark
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ramset on February 27, 2011, 04:11:07 PM
Mark
You have a budget to go visit??
Chet
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: iald on February 27, 2011, 05:05:50 PM
Hi , Konehead on this site ; https://sites.google.com/site/alternativeworldenergy/shorting-coils-circuits
Shows a circuit to short a coil using 2 Mosfets. The mosfets will surely only swith on when the d lead is positive to the gate. So with ac from the coil only 1 mosfet can be on at one time. Thus never shorting the coil. Can someone plaese correct me if I am wrong. Thanks peakprod.



Ismael to go open source, sell His E car Plan $150 - $200 & Kits $2,000

http://pesn.com/2011/02/27/9501773_Aviso_Ponders_Open_Sourcing_Self-Running_EV_Tech/
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: e2matrix on February 27, 2011, 05:46:48 PM


Ismael to go open source, sell His E car Plan $150 - $200 & Kits $2,000

http://pesn.com/2011/02/27/9501773_Aviso_Ponders_Open_Sourcing_Self-Running_EV_Tech/

EVERYONE needs to read the link above.  This is BIG and IMPORTANT!!!   We can make a difference NOW to get off oil dependency and other polluting fuel sources.
 
  Excellent article!  What WE do in the next 3 months can determine whether Ismael goes open source with this. 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on February 27, 2011, 08:58:23 PM
Sorry I am a bit late with posting this as I am just testing the new
forum software in another forum.

New Email from Ismael with a few pictures:

here's the picture of my MEG ( Motionless Electronic Generator )

Per picture est. capacity 8Kw - 9Kwatts. Still we have on going R & D.  My Semiconductor design group doing the High freq. Filtering system of the High spikes Bemf of the Transformer.  This R & D not very easy , but once I hit the right button , everything will become easy.

Design to be loaded either resistive or inductive.

 I started designing since Dec. 2009. I got two Investor dedicated only for MEG.  I strongly believed this where to go for the household application. Once I am successful in producing 230% eff. I will start to shrink the transformer coil.  At present 500 times bigger than the electronic modules. It's a modular type 1 module represent 3Kwatts.
MEG R & D very difficult, but once I hit the right button everything will be easy. The cost way cheaper compare to the mechanical repelling force set up & the mass production process can be in many million per month.

Limitation up to maximum 10Kwatts, but the extreme electromagnetic repelling force no limit up to MEGA WATTS.

Included in the picture, when I start building the MEG on Dec. 2009 until I refined it. All picture related to MEG R & D

Ismael
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on February 27, 2011, 09:36:20 PM
Excellent article!  What WE do in the next 3 months can determine whether Ismael goes open source with this.
Ismael needs no money at all to disclose his material at open source. When he gets money, there is high probability he gets patent, then he sells it to the big guys. Then they will decide what to do next. This way we may never see this project alive.
Edit. IMO this guy will disclose it at open source only when he sees too little or no interest from potential investors.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: markdansie on February 27, 2011, 09:37:17 PM
@Chet
I applaud their efforts but have seen nothing that would warrent a trip at this stage. i will await for the test reports but find it strange the way they are conducted. Why not as Rossi did put it on a bench (no Dyno's) and close loop it.
At this stage I believe it is smoke and mirros.
I have seen other devices visited by government officials and even with independent engineering reports...that amount to nothing.
I however will see how this pans out, but hold little hope.
There is overunity and it is being developed...but nothing that appears in forums
Mark
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on February 28, 2011, 01:34:07 AM
@Chet
I applaud their efforts but have seen nothing that would warrent a trip at this stage. i will await for the test reports but find it strange the way they are conducted. Why not as Rossi did put it on a bench (no Dyno's) and close loop it.
At this stage I believe it is smoke and mirros.
I have seen other devices visited by government officials and even with independent engineering reports...that amount to nothing.
I however will see how this pans out, but hold little hope.
There is overunity and it is being developed...but nothing that appears in forums
Mark

The test reports are already out there and thus there is nothing to wait for.  COP is 2.7 for the MEG and the car is 132% efficient  from battery power demand versus power hitting the wheels. Most of the losses are due to the DC motor is only about 66% efficient. 

Just because something amounts to nothing doesn't mean it can not or does not work. Its only politics and not technical that prevents the public gaining access. Ismael must have listened carefully to the thousands of emails sent in recent weeks to make the technology open as a power supply only which should provide access to DIY systems ranging from 100 watts to 1kw will make them very affordable and is taking the option to go open source very seriously. Industry and commercial projects requiring high power of 5kw+ i am sure will pay him directly to produce specific power plants with a good cash flow will ease all his credit problems.  The technology will find its way into electric cars and electric bikes automatically as a result.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: markdansie on February 28, 2011, 01:49:20 AM
The test reports have not been released. Remeber they found the hidden batteries and had to do a 4th test. I will wait for the official report.
Why not just do a closed loop bench top test..why a car?
there are many inconsistancies to take this seriously at this stage
Mark
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kmarinas86 on February 28, 2011, 02:41:25 AM
Complete test reports have not been released.

Remeber they found the hidden batteries and had to do a 4th test.

And here's a direct quote:

http://pesn.com/2011/02/24/9501772_Philippine_DOE_Verifies_Aviso_Self-Charging_EV/

Quote from: Philippine DOE Verifies Aviso's Self-Charging EV
Subject: Testing figure

Testing DATA 5

Test 1
Meralco: 1,300watts/ 6.4amps./ 223 V Dyno: 291 Newton / 570 watts
Aviso tech: 308 watts/ 13amps / 23.74 v Dyno :210 Ntwn / 418 watts

Test 2
Meralco: 2000watts/ 9.5Amps / 227V V Dyno: 455 Newton / 931 watts
Aviso tech: 306 watts/ 13amps / 23.6V Dyno: 210 Newton / 402 watts

Test 3
Meralco: 2,300watts / 10.98amps / 229V Dyno: 507 Newton / 1,100 watts
Aviso tech: 306 watts/ 13amps/ 23.56 V Dyno: 200 Newton / 389 watts

We drove outside about 100 meters & back again to LAB & again some testing; inasmuch as they found two sets of batteries 7amps/12V in front of the car. I told them that it was a supply only for the fan and microcontroller; but they didn't believe me; so we test again for the 4th time & confirmed no connection powering the motor & drops of volts & increase of current draw. Very minute draw of current only either on or off of the motor.

Note: Actual Average time testing of AVISO tech 5 minutes. Two minutes running allocated for the DYNO computer setting up.

Testing of repelling force.

6 times Conventional way of lifting a 1kilo coil & using conventional small 12V DC low speed motor.

Height : 12 feet
Average Time to reach 12 feet : 0.9 (corrected to) 9.0 sec.
Average Current draw : 0.93 amps
Battery : 12V / 24AH

FYMEGM repelling force by AVISO TECHN. 1Kilo coil

3 times repelling Battery start at 12.48 V end up 12.29V

Average Height: 26 feet
" Time: 1 sec
Battery: 9 V + 1.5V AA + 1.5 AA = 12volts

Note: I am not satisfied re: the Height reached, but I don't have time to adjust to full power.

I told them, Once I receive enough funding, the next test will be 110 Kilometers per hour & until battery it run down.

Ismael
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: iald on February 28, 2011, 03:01:11 AM
Ismael recieved a lot of offer from a billionaire to Big company. Here's several offer & condition;

1. Most of offer want His LAb to be transfer outside Philippine. Rejected. His stand Philippines or no deal.
2. Wants contract all Alt energy technology will exclusive  excluding Healthy Water technology . Rejected. Ismael wants every power capacity will be with individual  clause of contract. It means 50Kiwatts contract diff from 1 megawatts. Ecar Sedan type diff from Heavy Truck.
3. E car Value SRP will be agreed after determining the cost of mass production.
4. Production will be in the Philippines
5. He is the Boss n mass production
6. there some details with less important

He's taking His time , since His desicion will be based on group decision. Final decision after three months.
Sterling is a moving force why Ismael considering about Open source.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: teslaalset on February 28, 2011, 11:35:41 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yL00le5NoCQ&feature=feedu

Competition?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: e2matrix on February 28, 2011, 05:41:06 PM
Complete test reports have not been released.

And here's a direct quote:

http://pesn.com/2011/02/24/9501772_Philippine_DOE_Verifies_Aviso_Self-Charging_EV/

They were just being thorough but those two little 7 amp batteries (like are used for backup in alarm systems etc.) wouldn't stand a chance of turning that big forklift motor with a normal hookup let alone moving the car more than a second or two.  They were just being used for the electronics of the 'box'. 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: FreeEnergyInfo on February 28, 2011, 08:49:01 PM
So instead of opening the coil at the peak ala bedini to get a spike we short it?
Then maybe this is an idea
FREE  INFO ...
http://freeenergylt.narod2.ru/
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Doctor No on March 01, 2011, 02:12:34 PM
I will add only, this what Ismael calls: the Repelling Force, is nothing other as tachyons (free gravitons) power, same effect as Biefeld-Brown. Only the technic is new, much more progressive and lighter. With this, he is only a step to make own electrogravity disc. I think Ismael knows about, but why he don^t wants to speak anything?:-)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: iald on March 01, 2011, 06:34:22 PM
I will add only, this what Ismael calls: the Repelling Force, is nothing other as tachyons (free gravitons) power, same effect as Biefeld-Brown. Only the technic is new, much more progressive and lighter. With this, he is only a step to make own electrogravity disc. I think Ismael knows about, but why he don^t wants to speak anything?:-)

Actually Ismael will apply a Patent soon for a complete car that will levitate ,, Once He run the Car w/o Discharging

Iald
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Poit on March 02, 2011, 02:23:59 PM
Ismael technology is NOT open source. He is able to generalise upon the technology but only to a point of retaining IP rights to protect investors. ............

Exactly! and because he is going down the same path as all the rest, he will fail with out a doubt. Albert Einstein "Insanity doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."

The ONLY way free energy can be obtained by the people of the world is to NOT patent it, it is to NOT to seek millions of dollars....... Open source is the only way!

Don't get me wrong..... I would absolutely love for this to get out......... hell, even if Ismael patents it and charges $100k for it, I would gladly pay.... but unfortunately it will never get to this point...... history is the best teacher here.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: serm on March 02, 2011, 03:15:15 PM
Last result he tested his MEG
MEG testing result 
Duration: Total of 4 hours 
Load: 800watts Resistive Bulb [estimate] 
Input: 12.8V 
Battery capacity: 6,000 watt-h. 
Battery remain: 12.7V 
Volts drop: After 4 hours =0.1 volts

I think reamined volt was not enough clalified. He could show the remained amp-hour of battery. Becase when battery is drained volt will decreased a little.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Doctor No on March 02, 2011, 09:00:25 PM
Poit! What i remember You were against free energy, and now such a turn?;-]  When Ismael shows anything or makes it open source, he will be most silly man on this planet (or even in Universe;-)). I would like to pay him for this work done 500 mlns EUR in gold, cos it is a bargain simply said.:-)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on March 03, 2011, 02:57:16 AM
Poit! What i remember You were against free energy, and now such a turn?;-]  When Ismael shows anything or makes it open source, he will be most silly man on this planet (or even in Universe;-)). I would like to pay him for this work done 500 mlns EUR in gold, cos it is a bargain simply said.:-)

Ismeal open to serious offers now for quite some time. Not too many people come along with real serious cash but investors so far small project funds mostly from family and friends all need some money back now in difficult economic times. One or two billionaires  made offers but they never just want to hand over cash for technology advancement as its not about the money to them its about control. There are always painful strings attached.  What you end up with is something far worse than a Dragons Den offer!!

 As he said before offered to relocate to another country, retain only 20% shareholding, do whatever they want with the technology including shelf it or use on secret projects. Prevent any disclosure for least 15 years, sell your soul to the devil and lend out your daughters at weekends!

If you can handle these type of deals then sure you can be very rich indeed and the rest of the world will never see the MEG again.

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on March 03, 2011, 02:22:03 PM
Here are some more emails from Ismael:

2:30pm I check again the running MEG , but the brightness of the bulb a little bit dim. I check the batteries, I found the battery from 265v down to 254v . I check individual voltage of the 21 batteries. I found out Two Battery that was used to power my controller & other sensor down to 7.8v & the other one down to 6.2v. but the rest still  in the good level of voltage.

Replace it three times the 75AH capacity compared to the other 19 batteries24 AH. To accomodate the Microcontrollers & sensor drain. After the replacement back again to 261V &  back again to the MARATHON Testing of the household power genset of the future the MEG.

Ismael




We just bought a new tester.

Here's exactly my MEG set up. temporarily I have series of batteries up to 265V/ 24AH.( total of 21set of 12V batteries ) Since yesterday testing 4 hours same batteries.

I supply it to  the MEG resonator & my MEG output connected to a load of  2,000watts bulbs.

Today Since 10:15 am up to 1:40pm = 3 & 25 minutes running untill now. The voltage drop from 265v down to  260v.

This measurement of voltage while the MEG is running. Not when is power off.

The measurement between the power Off & On condition with 2 volts difference. from 265V at off condition & it will down 263 v if the MEG start.

If you will measure from off condition,, totally you will not notice the voltage difference & sometimes it goes higher to 270V.

The load not a exactly 2,000watts, but only 800watts since the volts accross the load only vary from 85v - 92v.

ismael



 batteries is 12V 24H Motolite AGM type. Bulbs 100watts 220V incandescent GE.

I swicth off my MEG at 5:45pm, I need to go for church activity. As well to ask more guidance & Blessing for humanity. Start from 10:15am,interrupted for 15 minutes & run again up to 5:45pm , Battery drops to 251v. So far so good I think I am more than 197% already. I will try to increase tomorrow, if give the chance.

Ismael

OK Guy's you can post now the video

Thanks

Ismael

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f36lPtGeybM


=================


Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: teslaalset on March 03, 2011, 05:04:42 PM

The load not a exactly 2,000watts, but only 800watts since the volts across the load only vary from 85v - 92v.

I vote to send Ismael back to High School.

Why?
Well, 2000 Watt/220V light bulbs have an estimated resistance of 24.2 ohms.
(R=Volt^2/Power, NOT Volt/Power!!)
At 85 - 92V this means a power consumption of roughly 300 - 350 Watt, not 800 Watt

His statements are full of this kind of crucial mistakes.
He seriously needs to check his data otherwise he is just scamming without even knowing it himself.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: mscoffman on March 03, 2011, 05:40:12 PM
I vote to send Ismael back to High School.

Why?
Well, 2000 Watt/220V light bulbs have an estimated resistance of 24.2 ohms.
(R=Volt^2/Power, NOT Volt/Power!!)
At 85 - 92V this means a power consumption of roughly 300 - 350 Watt.

His statements are full of this kind of crucial mistakes.
He seriously needs to check his data otherwise he is just scamming without even knowing it himself.

@teslaalset,

As I have stated previously incandescent light bulbs are poor overunity demonstration
devices because they suffer from negative thermal resistance. This means that the
resistance of the filament is variable and a cool bulb will be a much lower resistance.
So these bulbs tend toward operating as constant power devices. This can help
stabilize the output power of a raw overunity generator, but it also means that it is
very difficult to know exactly what wattage a bulb is operating at. Most likely he has
measured the wattage of these bulbs at the reduced voltages. And I would imagine
his numbers are correct.

I recommend a LED bulb be used as a demonstrators as they transmit much more
energy away from the generator as light rather then having energy hanging around
as heat.

:S:MarkSCoffman
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: tbird on March 03, 2011, 07:25:54 PM

i think ismael needs a nap.  he seems to be confused about more than math.  i think he put the wrong video with the comments he made.  notice the number and type of batteries.  i only see about a half dozen 6 volt golf cart batteries.  i went to motolite website to see how big a 24h battery is.  couldn't find a listing...... 

if anyone can find this battery, please post a link.

tom
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Doctor No on March 03, 2011, 07:57:21 PM
Bolt: when comes to peaceful intervention of US in Libya, there prices of oil fall aftermath to under 80/barrel. Who would be interested in free energy and Ismael works? But this Libya oil will make good to US and rest of the silly world for 3-4y. Who will be next to jump on with peace? Hugo Chavez. Iran not, cos he is close to Russia. I think when although electrogravity vechicles can not drop bombs, but fly invisible over States, Hugo will eagerly pay Ismael 500m. What is better: to have invisible spy and transport plane or nothing against US? Do You bet how many Hugo pays Ismael? And how many for own nuke;-] Had i not earlier mentioned, that peace and hot kitchen are best purposes for free energy? When don^t need uranium to make peace.....
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: tbird on March 03, 2011, 07:57:59 PM

maybe this is the one he has...

http://www.motolite.com/battery.php?id=15

part #OM24-12
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: teslaalset on March 03, 2011, 08:05:16 PM
@teslaalset,

As I have stated previously incandescent light bulbs are poor overunity demonstration
devices because they suffer from negative thermal resistance. This means that the
resistance of the filament is variable and a cool bulb will be a much lower resistance.
So these bulbs tend toward operating as constant power devices. This can help
stabilize the output power of a raw overunity generator, but it also means that it is
very difficult to know exactly what wattage a bulb is operating at. Most likely he has
measured the wattage of these bulbs at the reduced voltages. And I would imagine
his numbers are correct.

I recommend a LED bulb be used as a demonstrators as they transmit much more
energy away from the generator as light rather then having energy hanging around
as heat.

:S:MarkSCoffman

Mark,

I respect your loyalty to Ismael, but a factor of 2 in resistance value is a lot in this particular case.

In general, I think this guy needs to be a bit more structured in doing his measurements.
Using light bulb or even leds is certainly not a good reference, we all know that.
Until then, I remain skeptic.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: pese on March 03, 2011, 08:26:37 PM
I vote to send Ismael back to High School.

Why?
Well, 2000 Watt/220V light bulbs have an estimated resistance of 24.2 ohms.
(R=Volt^2/Power, NOT Volt/Power!!)
At 85 - 92V this means a power consumption of roughly 300 - 350 Watt, not 800 Watt

His statements are full of this kind of crucial mistakes.
He seriously needs to check his data otherwise he is just scamming without even knowing it himself.
Give attention.
This resistance is true  IF its lightning at full power !!

If the bulb ist off . (filament cold) so the resistance can be the half ,
(pls test this exactly out) .
That say that an 80Volt red glowing lamp have not 24 ohms . possibly lower than 20 Ohms.

The Ampers and watt´s must be calculated another way !
Pese
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: neptune on March 03, 2011, 08:48:48 PM
@ Pese . In the past you described a method to estimate power consumption of a light bulb . It is an old Amateur Radio method . Make a box divided into two equal compartments with a frosted glass lid . Place the bulb under test in one compartment . Place a second identical bulb in the second compartment . Feed the second bulb from a DC power supply fitted with volt and amp meters . Adjust DC power supply so both bulbs are equally bright .Calculate power= IxV .Do you think this method would work here? You could measure the brightness more accurately by a small solar cell and milliamp meter .
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on March 03, 2011, 09:59:28 PM
Proper measurements are very easy to do. The use of battery terminal voltages and guessing lamp brightness will always have a massive discrepancy.  Despite the fact the DOE car tests clearly showed a good OU device these silly tests without proper measurements will not do Ismeal any favours.

Put a volt meter on the batteries and a current shunt to get i/p watts. Do the same with the load. Volts and AMPS and then a scope shot to make sure we are looking at either SINE or DC on the o/p A 3kw electric heater is a good load and then measure accurately the power going to it.

If the MEG is unchanged from the car data tests it has a COP of 2.7. For 1000 watt load the battery will be providing around 370 watts.

A 24Ah battery has about 288 watt hour so two in series capacity 576 watt hour. However lead acid is rated at 20 hour discharge. Within 1 or 2 hour discharges capacity can be 30% less. This assuming the batteries are brand new is enough to supply 1kw out of the meg for about 90 mins while the battery load is a constant 370 watts.

Its loopable assuming 1kw  is a 24/7 comfortable MEG  figure without over heating. 370 watts needs to go back plus losses could need a total of 470 watts going back if using inverters and lead batteries. This means it can loop and run a 530 watt load indefinitely.

However it would be so much better to see all this properly measured and recorded. Its also interesting that Ismael is considering using the MEG as a power source as i strongly suggested about a year ago  without it being tied to an electric car.

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: neptune on March 03, 2011, 10:54:49 PM
@bolt . You are of course quite correct in all you say .I especially agree about using the MEG independently of the electric car . However , as previously stated in other threads , the two lamp idea can still be very useful in devices where the output consists of complex waveforms . All that I ask is that people keep this useful device in mind as an additional weopon in their armoury .
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: iald on March 04, 2011, 01:09:14 AM
Proper measurements are very easy to do. The use of battery terminal voltages and guessing lamp brightness will always have a massive discrepancy.  Despite the fact the DOE car tests clearly showed a good OU device these silly tests without proper measurements will not do Ismeal any favours.

Put a volt meter on the batteries and a current shunt to get i/p watts. Do the same with the load. Volts and AMPS and then a scope shot to make sure we are looking at either SINE or DC on the o/p A 3kw electric heater is a good load and then measure accurately the power going to it.

If the MEG is unchanged from the car data tests it has a COP of 2.7. For 1000 watt load the battery will be providing around 370 watts.

A 24Ah battery has about 288 watt hour so two in series capacity 576 watt hour. However lead acid is rated at 20 hour discharge. Within 1 or 2 hour discharges capacity can be 30% less. This assuming the batteries are brand new is enough to supply 1kw out of the meg for about 90 mins while the battery load is a constant 370 watts.

Its loopable assuming 1kw  is a 24/7 comfortable MEG  figure without over heating. 370 watts needs to go back plus losses could need a total of 470 watts going back if using inverters and lead batteries. This means it can loop and run a 530 watt load indefinitely.

However it would be so much better to see all this properly measured and recorded. Its also interesting that Ismael is considering using the MEG as a power source as i strongly suggested about a year ago  without it being tied to an electric car.


Ismael

Already signed of  tired, mixing everything so don't expect a clear data or measurement from Ismael, Actually he is not using any tester now, just common sense.  He 's no proper sleep for the last 5 days, because MEG R & D. The sure thing to what he is doing now, he still running the same 2,000 watts bulbs with 110V across the bulbs terminal & the batteries start from 270V drops to 266V only from 6,000watts for more than 6 hours now.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: iald on March 04, 2011, 01:19:53 AM
Proper measurements are very easy to do. The use of battery terminal voltages and guessing lamp brightness will always have a massive discrepancy.  Despite the fact the DOE car tests clearly showed a good OU device these silly tests without proper measurements will not do Ismeal any favours.

Put a volt meter on the batteries and a current shunt to get i/p watts. Do the same with the load. Volts and AMPS and then a scope shot to make sure we are looking at either SINE or DC on the o/p A 3kw electric heater is a good load and then measure accurately the power going to it.

If the MEG is unchanged from the car data tests it has a COP of 2.7. For 1000 watt load the battery will be providing around 370 watts.

A 24Ah battery has about 288 watt hour so two in series capacity 576 watt hour. However lead acid is rated at 20 hour discharge. Within 1 or 2 hour discharges capacity can be 30% less. This assuming the batteries are brand new is enough to supply 1kw out of the meg for about 90 mins while the battery load is a constant 370 watts.

Its loopable assuming 1kw  is a 24/7 comfortable MEG  figure without over heating. 370 watts needs to go back plus losses could need a total of 470 watts going back if using inverters and lead batteries. This means it can loop and run a 530 watt load indefinitely.

However it would be so much better to see all this properly measured and recorded. Its also interesting that Ismael is considering using the MEG as a power source as i strongly suggested about a year ago  without it being tied to an electric car.


Ismael goal to run the bulbs 24hours a day 7 days a week forget the measurement.

All Of His testing instrument BUSTED from RADIANT ENERGY SPIKES. he is using only his senses now,,, ears for sound & eyes for intensity of brightness & nose for burning coil insulation.

E car has own Build in MEG. Need first to solve the overheating from problem.

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: mscoffman on March 04, 2011, 01:37:28 AM

These various videos he is making are not real time. So his development cycle
seems more compressed then it actually is. One thing he should be concerned
about is rotating too much energy through each of his acid/lead batteries -
essentially wearing them out even if they stay charged up. The sooner I see
someone who says that his setup is actually producing this energy for them,
the better I will like it.

It's like the humans who first invented fire. Get the thing out there and starting
to do some good, we'll be glad to discuss it's "magic" later on.

:S:MarkSCoffman
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: synchro1 on March 04, 2011, 11:45:50 AM
Here's an interesting video from Altrez of the Energetic Forum Ismael Aviso thread. Altrez runs a piece of magnet wire from a microwave oven to the negative pole of a 9 volt rechargable Ni-Cad battery and raises the voltage. Ground scouring or rectenna effect?
Same gigahertz Ishmael multiplies his cell tower signal up to.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJP1xRvevoc
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: iald on March 05, 2011, 06:41:04 AM
I vote to send Ismael back to High School.

Why?
Well, 2000 Watt/220V light bulbs have an estimated resistance of 24.2 ohms.
(R=Volt^2/Power, NOT Volt/Power!!)
At 85 - 92V this means a power consumption of roughly 300 - 350 Watt, not 800 Watt

His statements are full of this kind of crucial mistakes.
He seriously needs to check his data otherwise he is just scamming without even knowing it himself.

Don't worry Ismael so exited & tired ( mistake on calculation usually happen to any devoted inventor's ) on His MEG R & D newly born less than two weeks after they assemble it. We have new two video showing the big difference  between a normal load of 1,000 watts & the voltage drop per minute, against 1,000 load with MEG system & voltage drop per minute using same batteries. They have very big difference.
Title: Ismael Aviso MEG.
Post by: synchro1 on March 05, 2011, 03:18:03 PM
Here's the link to Ismael's new video. He describes the microwave ground scouring charge effect demonstrated by Altrez as "Inductive Collapse".


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f36lPtGeybM
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ramset on March 05, 2011, 04:02:03 PM
Synchro 1
Quote:
He describes the microwave ground scouring charge effect demonstrated by Altrez as "Inductive Collapse".
-----------------------
Sir, I did not hear him describe that in the Vid you posted?
Do you have a link?
Thanks
Chet
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: synchro1 on March 05, 2011, 06:59:51 PM
Ramset:

Sterling D. Allan had a 3 way online interview with Karl Palsness and Ismael Aviso. Palsness suggested that term to Aviso to help him describe what Aviso refered to as "an imitation of BEMF". The inference is that Aviso approved of the new description supplied to him by Palsness. This appears about two thirds down from the start, just beneath the video box. Aviso's English is a little weak. Here's a link to the interview:


http://pesn.com/2011/03/02/9501776_Aviso_Solid_State_Generator_Makes_Hundreds_of_Watts/
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: synchro1 on March 05, 2011, 08:10:36 PM
I saw a youtube video awhile back where a hillbilly in a garage self looped a series of 12 volt head light bulbs to some 12 volt lead acid batteries hooked up to an A.C inverter and to a mystery component concealed under the table inside a cardboard box. Guess what? I'd bet any amount of money at this point that it was a microwave oven, wired back to the lead acid batteries! I'll search
for it.

Update:

I located the video I was thinking of by Peter Samaruck and saw no evidence of a microwave oven. It has since occured to me that this would be extremely dangerous for anyone to try.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: matrixkey on March 06, 2011, 06:57:44 AM
Just for grins I'd like to see the video.  Can you post the link?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: synchro1 on March 06, 2011, 05:14:37 PM
Here it is:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPsnbhHV_xs
Title: Microwave oven battery loop.
Post by: synchro1 on March 06, 2011, 09:13:21 PM

Would anyone know where to connect a wire to inside a microwave oven to transmit the signal to a battery?
Title: Re: Microwave oven battery loop.
Post by: gyulasun on March 06, 2011, 09:57:20 PM
Would anyone know where to connect a wire to inside a microwave oven to transmit the signal to a battery?

Hi,

I think the principle should be similar to what Naudin demonstrated where he used a quarter wave long antenna inside the owen to make plazma ball inside.
On the top of a quarter wave antenna there is always a voltage maximum and if you wish to lead this voltage to the outside, you may wish to use an Avramenko plug principle, by applying perhaps a length of an odd number of times of the quarter wave to come out from the closed space to the outside.
Here is the link to Naudin:
http://jlnlabs.online.fr/plasma/gmrtst/index.htm

Gyula
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on March 07, 2011, 05:50:06 AM
Peter Sumaruck on PESWIKI: http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Pete%27s_%22Zero_Amp%22_Electronics
There are also some pages on the net.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Goat on March 11, 2011, 02:23:59 AM
Hi All

I didn't see any mention of the simulcast of the Aviso demo on Smart Scarecrow broadcast on Justin.tv tonight as per peswiki..

http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:SmartScarecrow_Broadcast

For anyone interested.

Regards,
Paul
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Goat on March 11, 2011, 06:23:53 AM
Hi All

Well I haven't heard from anyone who's watched the broadcast but it was informative...

Ismael talked about 2 things that caught my attention:

1. The benefit of using litz wire

2. Pulsing the coil at 10,000 Hertz but at that frequency the secondary coil would give back Mhz of vibrations.

3. The BEMF is the key to make this thing work, where is the force coming into the network to oppose the EMF?  If you can use this force to further amplify the input then that is the key to tapping the aether or dark energy.

He also discussed a lot of other things so it was worth watching and I wish everyone involved in this endeavor good luck in bringing this technology to mankind.

Regards,
Paul
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: happyfunball on March 11, 2011, 06:53:22 AM
Every single one of these inventions to date have produced absolutely nothing publicly. Zero, nada. They're always coming to market 'very soon' and never heard of again. Every single one of them.... None of them powering anything in the real world as far as I know. Now we have a 'cold fusion' power plant supposedly being built. Don't hold your breath. Gets tiring after a while. The only benefit I have seen in this quest is some interesting research revolving around resonance (Joule Ringer) which seem to have real world applications, although I've yet to see it being used practically by anyone. What happened to Bedini's 'ferris wheel?' Looked impressive, what is it powering? Anything, anywhere?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Goat on March 11, 2011, 07:49:44 AM
@ happyfunball

I agree with you that a lot of would be FE devices have been shelved.  I think that there's always hope that someday one of these inventors will forgoe fame and fortune and goes open source for the benefit of mankind rather that riches.

But at least Ismael is sharing some information which is very kind of him to do so.

Regards,
Paul 
Title: Re: FUELLESS: k-Mart, Castorama and others
Post by: Doctor No on March 16, 2011, 02:19:02 PM
Hey You above! Maybe You should check for free energy devices in: k-Mart, Castorama, Leroy Merlin or others such big shops. I was always astounded why they are not interested? And when not, You can always find it in News. Topics: DRJ200, DRJ600, DRJ10.000, Academician Potapov-constructor of worlds first OU cold nuclear fusion reactor for home use. With national socialistics: Heil!-  Dr Adolf Nowak National Socialists Polish Workers Party www.facebook.com/nsppp  www.nsppp.bloog.pl                   
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Poit on March 16, 2011, 03:13:03 PM
Every single one of these inventions to date have produced absolutely nothing publicly. Zero, nada. They're always coming to market 'very soon' and never heard of again. Every single one of them.... None of them powering anything in the real world as far as I know. Now we have a 'cold fusion' power plant supposedly being built. Don't hold your breath. Gets tiring after a while. The only benefit I have seen in this quest is some interesting research revolving around resonance (Joule Ringer) which seem to have real world applications, although I've yet to see it being used practically by anyone. What happened to Bedini's 'ferris wheel?' Looked impressive, what is it powering? Anything, anywhere?

I posted something very similar to this in this very thread (referring to your post)... and it was deleted by the admin... It would seem that this forum isn't interested in the truth, just false hope and delusion.

Don't be too shocked if you are censored and suppressed.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: lefferdink on March 21, 2011, 08:28:12 PM
If anyone can keep me posted of more information on this site, it would be greatly appreciated by me.
Thank you very much.
Gasoline is going up again and this time it will not be a pretty sight.  Our dollar is slipping in value.

Regards,
Ray
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Poit on March 21, 2011, 10:15:21 PM
I wouldn't hold your breathe... Mr Ismael is going down the same path as Stanley Myer... Patent = Death to invention....and Inventor... i dont care if I the admin deletes this post, im over it...... if he wants to censor the truth,... thats his problem.

Where is my proof? wait 12 months (and when you see nothing has changed in the world), then you can say I was right....... I guarantee it.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: abdusamed on March 25, 2011, 09:26:57 PM
I really interested designing this car for a competition. Does anyone know the complete design blueprints? I really want them and show them to my team members.

I'm a mechanical engineering student myself.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Poit on March 25, 2011, 10:36:13 PM
I really interested designing this car for a competition. Does anyone know the complete design blueprints? I really want them and show them to my team members.

I'm a mechanical engineering student myself.

You and everyone one else.... it will never happen mate... you might as well forget about it now.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: FreeEnergyInfo on April 13, 2011, 06:49:19 PM
INFO
http://freeenergylt.narod2.ru/vladimir_pantiuhov/
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: aussepom on April 14, 2011, 05:50:06 PM
Hi
you still ask the awkward questions Mark D,  I know why he can not close loop it, I have the same problem with my MagGen unit, great at charging batteries, lighting up lamp loads,  it even goes better under a heavy load OU 2,
BUT  the type of collection circuits that pump up cap etc, can not be closed looped they collapse.   There is another thing, to long to go into on this post, but the ‘antenna coil’ can no way supply high current on its own, ask the 2M radio hams.
But the MEG is still the interesting part, but the main secret is in the making use of the ‘high circulating currents’ in a tuned circuit, and it seems that he is using a push pull output circuit.  By rearranging to circuit for the coils in the DC motor There is a method in which it could work. I think that Teslar did the same with his ‘own’ AC Motor.
All interesting and yes Poit no one has any thing commercialised as yet.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: eisnad karm on April 14, 2011, 06:54:44 PM
Hi Aussie
Mark D is past tense...he and a few others after years of contributions (good and bad) are now under moderation which means it can take many days to have a post approved....well after they are relavant.
However behind the scenes he is still very active and a believer that anything is possible.
Kind Regards
EK
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: jan.kolar on April 16, 2011, 12:13:34 PM
This thread is clearly the scam. If I would be administrator of this forum I would delete it. Its typical for defrauders in this area that they use very obscure double-talk language. Running his car for 10 minutes in garage should be evidence for overunity? Don't be silly. I also doubt that he used 11 kW motor in his setup. One horse-power (750W) is sufficient for this kind of demonstration. This power range can be successfully operated from bank of batteries (maybe some of them hidden). Dear fans of overunity.com you are missing critical thinking. There is no way you can extract extra energy by shorting coils. This is in contrary to conventional electrical theory. Thats the reason that spice files can't prove overunity. For those that don't know Spice is popular program for simulating electrical circuits. I know it very well because we have it used during my study on electrical engineering faculty. Huge spikes of voltages don't automatically mean more power. It's all in accord to theory U = L * di/dt where L is inductance, di/dt is change of current in infinitesimal small time slice so called derivative in mathematics and U is voltage.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: FreeEnergyInfo on April 16, 2011, 02:16:13 PM
INFO..

http://freeenergylt.narod2.ru/free_energy/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-Xu1Rm8ExQ
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: abdusamed on April 17, 2011, 09:19:13 AM
what device does he use to short the circuit at the exact moment????
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ElectrifiedMonteSS on April 26, 2011, 08:01:32 PM
So has anyone heard anything new about the car or generator?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ariovaldo on April 26, 2011, 08:04:52 PM
No at all. To quiet
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hacko on May 02, 2011, 08:56:57 AM
Hi, i want to share something that i post on the Aviso`s yahoo group wall.
I ask , "Do not you worry about the big oil companies? Do not exert pressure on you? Are not you afraid?"
And guess what, they delete my post, and do not answer to my questions.
I think that many of you ask themsefl about these questions. Because everybody know that oligarch will be in falit. And oligarch do not want to be in falit, and they can pay someone one to k..l.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: khabe on May 03, 2011, 05:59:46 PM
Hmm?
But why to worry about the big oil companies? What kind of pressure? Why to afraid?
I think that every kind of overunities are much more simple way for making good money when to deal with oil ... drilling ... shipping ... destilling...ship again ...
much more easy and more simple is to buy a good OU device (with all rights) and start to produce this devices or/and start to sell pure energy  ::)
Does not matter who is the man who will make the real OU - you or mr. Beam - anyway this man will sell this OU only for big money.
You not? OK ... but also you are not able for ... perhapse you will come able for and then you will sell ... only for biiiiig money  8)
Big oil companies and oligarch  ::) ... they are the only ones who are able to buy this kind of unit ... because this unit will cost a huge lot of money.
The only reason why it still not happened - up till today this kind of working device does not exist.
cheers,
herbert

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ElectrifiedMonteSS on May 21, 2011, 07:00:15 AM
Still way quiet in here! 
I wonder what happened with his other projects like the repulsive coils he was working with?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on May 23, 2011, 04:13:49 AM
Hi All,
here are 4 new videos from Isamel.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rujb0T9jSng

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXKN-aUAe6Q

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rv7C7YOetDY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKvR5OlLNDM



Ismael Aviso said, he was forced to make these video to answer all repeated question coming into his email everyday.

The last 3 videos will show you how & what is needed to accomplish the over-unity machine.

He gave 30% technical details & 95% basic principles on how to extract ambient energy..
Including what is inside the black box of his Ecar...

Sorry for the shaky amature hand video.

His original channel is here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/ley858

I got permission from him to copy it to my Youtube channel as a backup.

Many thanks for Ismael to have come forward with the explanations how his great technology works.

He is a real genius.

Please support him.

Many thanks.

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: khabe on May 23, 2011, 08:48:09 AM
Not for to belittle, not for to vilify - just question:
Why so large batteries when current in milliamps  ???
Why not miniature cells series ::)
cheers,
khabe
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: wings on May 23, 2011, 10:34:32 AM
Hi All,
here are 4 new videos from Isamel.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rujb0T9jSng

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXKN-aUAe6Q

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rv7C7YOetDY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKvR5OlLNDM



Ismael Aviso said, he was forced to make these video to answer all repeated question coming into his email everyday.

The last 3 videos will show you how & what is needed to accomplish the over-unity machine.

He gave 30% technical details & 95% basic principles on how to extract ambient energy..
Including what is inside the black box of his Ecar...

Sorry for the shaky amature hand video.

His original channel is here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/ley858

I got permission from him to copy it to my Youtube channel as a backup.

Many thanks for Ismael to have come forward with the explanations how his great technology works.

He is a real genius.

Please support him.

Many thanks.

Regards, Stefan.


nice radiant energy idea

powering low voltage power supply with low potential output
powering high voltage load output with high potential output

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ElectricGoose on May 23, 2011, 01:26:06 PM
Interesting stuff but he does not have OU yet.  If you listen to what he says he admits they are a long way from being finished and "needs MUCH more investor money" (alarm bells).  Anyone that has OU doesnt need money.

Few other things raised my eyebrows a bit, one of them being the amps consumption on the inverter.  That was 100% rubbish.  Those inverters are efficient but 'IDLE' (no load) at around 300Ma and he was trying to say on the video that it was only consuming 1Ma unloaded and around 5Ma when he shorted the cap??  No Way!

A custom built resonant circuit with the load fancily interwoven, YES you can get the current draw very low BUT he was showing a supposed direct connection from battery through amp meter to off the shelf inverter pulling 1Ma??

All he has at the moment is a tesla switch of sorts (which is what his black box does), this is how he attains the long run times with his electric car.  Remember folks...he is ALWAYS USING BATTERIES...lots of them.

TRUE OU YOU DON'T NEED THE BATTERY once the proccess is started.





 

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Jdo300 on May 23, 2011, 03:53:10 PM
Hi Stefan,

Thanks for the video updates, I have been following this ever since the start, and he does a pretty nice explanation of the coil shorting (in general). I haven't been on this particular thread lately but am curious to see if anyone addressed the following idea explaining why the coil shorting effect works.

I had thought about various scenarios that would allow power to be taken from a generator without creating a back-load on the armature (Lenz drag). It is the resulting current flow through the generator windings that is solely responsible for the amount of drag that is created in a generator (aside from magnetic attraction to the coil cores if they are metallic). One early idea I had was to simply wind the generator windings such that the output voltage would be very high, with a minimal current flow to help combat the induced drag force. However, the problem with this line of reasoning is that you must wind many turns of wire onto the coil in order to induce a high voltage output during generator operation. The added resistance of the winding reduces the efficiency of the power output, while the added number of turns creates a strong magnetic field, even with a much lower current flow. So in this scenario, the situation still appears to be of no benefit over low-impedance windings.

However, once introducing the coil shorting technique, one can immediately see some striking possibilities. For one, the coils used in this scenario are low-impedance coils as opposed to high impedance ones. When the coil is shorted at the peaks of the sine wave, high voltage spikes are created which can be AC coupled from the coil and rectified for use. What is striking about this is that even if the coil shorting operation itself does not yield excess power, it is a great technique to get a low impedance coil to ‘act’ like a high impedance one. So, if the current does, in fact, drop during the HV pulse transients, the current flow through the coil would be greatly minimized, and thus reducing (or even eliminating) the Lenz force all together.

The benefits of this are far reaching because the low impedance design means low winding resistance. Fewer turns means that the meager current that is generated has a much smaller impact on the armature due to minimal drag MMF production.

The same principle should work for a SS system as well, since less induced magnetic field means less loading on the primary circuit.

- Jason O
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: ratul on May 23, 2011, 04:39:02 PM
TRUE OU YOU DON'T NEED THE BATTERY once the proccess is started.
Thanx for wake up ;D
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: hartiberlin on May 23, 2011, 08:48:01 PM
I think his mA ampmeter is indeed showing Amps and not milliamps as he also shows in his newer 3 explanation videos, thus the big batteries.

Jason please describe it in more detail what you mean please.
Do you say the coil switching currents reduce the input current into thr system?

Many thanks.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Jdo300 on May 24, 2011, 06:31:25 AM
Hi Stefan,

Here's some more information on my perspective.

Consider the case of a generator; as the magnets pass by the windings, there is an AC voltage induced into the windings, whose magnitude generally follows the equation EMF = -N*dΦ/dt where,

EMF   = The induced voltage
N      = Number of coil turns
Φ      = Magnetic Flux Density

So in a standard generator, the induced voltage is directly proportional to number of coil turns and the speed at which the magnetic field is changing. While keeping these principles in mind, recall that Lenz Law is in effect here because the minus sign designates that the induced field is oriented such that it is in opposition to the inducing field. As mentioned before in my previous post, this opposing field only manifests when a current is allowed to flow through the windings.

However, there is one other aspect of this scenario that is not talked about nearly as much. That is the idea of mechanical impedance matching. For example, consider a simple experiment with a magnet sitting on top of a pulse coil. When a pulse is fired such that the fields repel eachother, the magnet jumps; the height of the jump is directly dependent on the amount of current flowing through the coil, and the length of time that the pulse is on.

It can be observed that if the pulse width is decreased, the amount of force, that the coil has on the magnet, mechanically is reduced. If the voltage is raised substantially while the pulse width is reduced substantially, the amount of power input to the system can have the same effect on the magnet, despite the fact that more energy is dissipated through the coil.

So in other words, if we put, say, a 50V pulse of 1 ms into the pulse coil, lets say that the magnet jumps six inches. If we want to increase the input votlage to the coil, but keep the jump height of the magnet the same, we simply reduce the pulse width. I have done many simple experiments along these lines and what you will find is that as you increase the voltage and decrease the pulse width, you need more power to make the magnet jump the same height. Which means that at higher voltages, the pulse applied force faster than the magnet could absorb it mechanically and react. Anyone can try this simple experiment and see it for themselves in action. It works particularly well if you use air-cored coils so the effects of core saturation don't complicate things.

This idea can, likewise, be applied to the generation case also. If, somehow, one could decrease the time in which the induced energy moves through the coil, the effects of Lenz’ Law could be substantially reduced because the mechanical impedance matching between the moving magnet and coil could be minimized. Meanwhile, a larger and larger amount of energy could be transferred through the coil while having the same effect on the magnet. This simple mechanism could very well be the secret of the coil shorting technique.

One other aspect of this, which could also substantially reduce the impact of the Lenz force, is the oscillations created during the shorting action. The following explanation will be illustrated using the attached figure at the bottom of this post.

When creating a series of coil shorts, the waveform is approximated as a high frequency sine wave oscillation superimposed onto the larger induced EMF from the generator magnets. If we assume that the rising edges of the high frequency oscillations represent negative MMFs (Magneto-Motive Forces), which drag against the motion of the generator, and the falling edges of the waveform represent positive MMFs which aid in the motion of the generator, we can see that these two MMF’s can actually cancel eachother out assuming that the respective magnitudes of the fields are about equal.

What this essentially means is that any of the High frequency oscillations, resulting from the coil shorts, would have little to no impact on the mechanical drag of the generator. This, coupled with the fast, HV nature of the spikes, creates a mechanical impedance matching condition whereby the rotor sees almost no loading from the generator coils, no matter how much power is drawn.

- Jason O
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: bolt on May 29, 2011, 07:03:56 AM
Interesting stuff but he does not have OU yet. 

yes he does its already been tested by DOE and DOT engineers on the electric car. System has a COP of 2.7

If you listen to what he says he admits they are a long way from being finished and "needs MUCH more investor money" (alarm bells). 


There is always work and money required to complete projects. Free Energy is very expensive:)



Anyone that has OU doesnt need money.

How did you work that out? No one gives a hoot if you have 1 watt OU or 10,000 watts. The days of investors coming fast to support free energy devices has long gone. Even Steven Mark had problems with investors on his TPU back in the late 80's and early 90's



Few other things raised my eyebrows a bit, one of them being the amps consumption on the inverter.  That was 100% rubbish.  Those inverters are efficient but 'IDLE' (no load) at around 300Ma and he was trying to say on the video that it was only consuming 1Ma unloaded and around 5Ma when he shorted the cap??  No Way!

Amp meter in mA is now measuring AMPS across calibrated shunt



A custom built resonant circuit with the load fancily interwoven, YES you can get the current draw very low BUT he was showing a supposed direct connection from battery through amp meter to off the shelf inverter pulling 1Ma??

All he has at the moment is a tesla switch of sorts (which is what his black box does), this is how he attains the long run times with his electric car.  Remember folks...he is ALWAYS USING BATTERIES...lots of them.

TRUE OU YOU DON'T NEED THE BATTERY once the proccess is started.

Not true you can have a COP of 10 but mostly impedance matching and voltages offset prevents o/p returning to i/p to close the loop. The minimum you need to loop is COP >2 PLUS system losses
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: iald on May 31, 2011, 04:52:52 AM
Hi, BOLT

Looks to me U know all of Ismael doing. Can U technically describe how come Ismael pulse the 1 kilo Electromagnet up to 33 feet ? Don't forget he is using small battery. I want to know that. 

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Bruce_TPU on May 31, 2011, 05:23:09 AM
Hi, BOLT

Looks to me U know all of Ismael doing. Can U technically describe how come Ismael pulse the 1 kilo Electromagnet up to 33 feet ? Don't forget he is using small battery. I want to know that.

I believe it is called a "repulsion coil".  My guess is it is a combination of shorting the battery for a moment of time, and the consequential effect on aluminum within his coil...   ;)

Cheers,

Bruce
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on May 31, 2011, 07:24:24 AM


I helped Ismael do some demonstrations for some SAAB execs in Sweden two summers ago - we were doing that "repelling force" where he knocks a 1 kilo weight coil up in air about 33 feet up in air in under a second... do the math if any of you want to, how much horsepower or watts that would require.

Anyways, there is an aluminum tube that the coil shoots out of.

Any iron within a few feet of the repelling-force system will throw off the resonance!
So NO iron or ferrous steel or ferrite etc is involved or can be involved.

There are two coils: one faces up, and sits at bottom of the aluminum tube.
The other lays on top of it, and it gets shot up into air when the coils are both energized with bucking fields against one another (N against N or S against S dont know which)
Ismael has a very special "cascading DC" circuit where he fills up a 7500VDC cap in a few seconds from ONLY a small 9V battery (200ma) and also a couple 1.5V  AA batteries too, in series, since his system was designed for 12V, and going to 9V would throw off the resonance.

Ismael told me that there is a bifilar 22GA wire coil as the primary of the coil; the "insides" of it, and then there are 5 paralell strands of 19GA wire "pickup coil" wrapped all around the primary, and this large pickup wind is what gives the coil its large shape.

IT uses VERY LITTLE power to hit that coil up that high. Nobody else is even close to what he can do with the repelling force energy.

This is NOT the MEG tech - this is different thing, the "repelling force" tech.

With that small battery-pack, he can do the coil-blast 16 times, (sixteen!)and the 9V/twoAA batteries will drop in voltage from 12.4VDC at start, to 11.8VDC after those 16 repetitions....you can figure watts-consumed by the battery voltage-drop as a general estimate of the watts-input requrired to shoot that coil up in air 33ft 16 times.....I dont know how long the actual high=frequency pulsing to the coils lasts - maybe 1/10th of millisecond just guessing - dont know...

I think he uses coil-shorting to recycle the power from the pickup coil back into the cap but not really sure about that, just guessing on that too but I know he shorts "something" 5 times at the "peak period"

I asked him do you short the primary, or the pikcup/secondaries and he said it doesnt matter and laughed...(!?!) so go figure on that...

also he told that the pulse that drives that coil up in air is also "resonate chopped" in that it is a very high frequency chain of pulses - he gave me an analogy of if you want to shoot through some steel, and you fire one large bullet at it with huge gun, that one bullet probably wont make it through, but if you fire 10,000 very tiny bullets in a second with very small gun you will rip right through the steel.
Anyways if you do the math on how much electrical power is consumed and how much "mechanical" power is created in the force to drive that 1 kilo weight coil up in air its very much overunity (mabye 100 times?)  and obviously using this power to drive large flywheel with big generator on it is one way to produce kilowatts of power from practically nothing.

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: wings on May 31, 2011, 07:33:39 AM
Hi, BOLT

Looks to me U know all of Ismael doing. Can U technically describe how come Ismael pulse the 1 kilo Electromagnet up to 33 feet ? Don't forget he is using small battery. I want to know that. 


see:

http://science.net84.net/magnetic-generators/magnetLauncher.WMV

from

http://science.net84.net/magnetic-generators/generatorY.html
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: T-1000 on July 09, 2011, 12:03:26 PM

I think he uses coil-shorting to recycle the power from the pickup coil back into the cap but not really sure about that, just guessing on that too but I know he shorts "something" 5 times at the "peak period"

I asked him do you short the primary, or the pikcup/secondaries and he said it doesnt matter and laughed...(!?!) so go figure on that...


When producing primary pulses on resonance state.. shorting secondary on peaks (spark discharge on HV) would be answer to question why it does not need so much power do work. Right Pulse on Right Time is the answer to everything... :)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: CuriousChris on July 31, 2011, 04:22:21 PM
I hate to be a downer here but I cannot see anything special about any of this.

The repelling power is simple. he takes a low voltage, 6-12 volts, inverts it to a high voltage. stores this in a capacitor, (actually a bank of capacitors) and then releases all that energy in a very short period of time. this then propels the weight skyward.

If I could see a demonstration of him doing it with a AAA battery then I'd be impressed. but I am guessing the AAA claim is a case of 'chinese whispers'

If you want to see another fun example of the sort of force you can generate with this very very simple setup, look at this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XiIlQIe5Qs8

One other claim in the series of claims is that "shorting of coils at peak amplitude (top of sine wave)" One statement was that this and a capacitor is blocking Lenz's law. Sorry but that is dreadfully wrong. it is BECAUSE OF lenz's law you get the very high voltage spike.

Here is a video which shows the basic operation, it was linked earlier in this thread. watch it and then come back...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRyKVU6YzYw

In the video the presenter admits he has no clue as to where the voltage spike comes from. that's an admission he doesn't know what he is talking about.

The answer is simple and if he showed you the accurate timing of the closing and opening of the reed switch you would see that the high voltage spike occurs not when it is closed but when the reed switch opens.

So what is happening?
The rotating magnets induced a voltage in the coil. we see that when he runs it without the reed switch connect. some 2 or so volts. this is normal it is a generator. nothing special there.

Now he connects the reed switch.

Now what happens is he shorts the coil at the 'peak' remember at this time the coil is generating about 2 volts. What happens is that voltage drives current through the coil. It has to go somewhere and the only place is into itself. this builds up a magnetic field around the coil, IN ADDITION to the one provided by the magnet. In fact if the reed was left closed it would stop or slow down the rotation of the magnet in line with Lenz's law. (The extra flux actually opposes the flux from the magnet, but as the overall result is the same and its more confusing to describe it that way I will describe it as if it is additional, OK?)

But that's not what happens. What happens is the reed switch opens. Remember the reed switch also shorted out the neon. Its impossible for the 90 or so volts to be generated across the neon while the reed shorts it out, when the reed is closed. Anyway, as the reed opens the current in the coil stops flowing. This current was supporting the 'extra' flux around the coil. Well it can't flow anymore because the reed switch is now open, So the flux starts to collapse, and in line with Lenz's law a voltage is induced to try to prevent the collapse of that flux. But because of the open circuit no current can flow. Therefore the voltage rises, and dramatically. until the neon breaks down and starts to glow.

Now the neon doesn't glow very bright, why is that? well he mentions the reason. Because the reed switch is burnt! Its burnt because the extreme voltages cause the air between the contacts to ionise. Thus current flows and that current burns the points. Reed switches are only designed for low current, low voltage applications ( I am sure there are exceptions), they can't hack the punishment given it by this very simple example of back emf generation.


Lastly how much power does this method produce? Well in the last part of the video it becomes clear. Go back to it when you finish reading this. The presenter does not draw attention to it because I am sure he is totally unaware of it.

A voltmeter, particularly a digital voltmeter has a very high input impedance. Which is to say it draws an extremely small amount of power. If it didn't it could not accurately gauge the correct voltage. in the last part of the video it shows the 20 or so volts across the capacitor discharge very rapidly. you can watch it drop in seconds. Why is that? because the cap contains very little energy. don't forget the diode prevents that energy leaking back into the coil so it is dissipating through the voltmeter (and a little through the diode). He used a totally wrong cap as well and may have stuffed it.

This is very elementary to anyone who understands electronics. there is absolutely nothing new here. Certainly nothing extraordinary.


CC

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on August 01, 2011, 08:37:45 AM
Hi CC

Ok absolultey everything you wrote is wrong but dont worry about it eh.

Ismael uses only a common 200mah 9V battery to do his repelliing force demo, and with additon of 2 AAs in sereis too, so he has 12V.

that is ALL he has for power supply - then this goes throug a voltage cascadionbg device for 7500VDC in cap...

he also has big pickup winds around his primary, and he also employs 5 tiems at peaks coil-shorting and also resonate-chopped high speed frequency to the primary pulse into coil too plus recycling the power too via peicup winds - its NOT ANYTHIGN like you say of it being very simple anyone can do it type of descritpiton.

Ismael shorts his system 5 times at peaks, and the peaks he shorts are of the resonate frequency chopped input too so everyhting happens extremely fast.

he can shoot the 1 kilo up in air 30feet or so 16 times, in less than a second, and battery voltage drops from 12.4 to 11.8 after all those reps.

Thats what it is and it is true and I have seen it and helpe him do demos.

As for the coil shorting your debuniking descipiton is very badly done.

the coils shorting goes into DC capapcitor after FWBR

your are measuing the voltage in a capacitor that is filled by coil shorting at peaks.
there are lots of videos showing the effect on youtube and its best to not use reed swtiches they blow up easy that is the only thing you got right.

Best to use high amperage very low resistance bidirectional mosfets.

the coil-shorting power must go into DC type caps, not AC type, with no resistance across caps en they fill up,  then cap dump into load in two stage process, whre cap is disconnected from "source" when it hits load.

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: k4zep on August 01, 2011, 10:36:51 AM
Hi CC

Ok absolultey everything you wrote is wrong but dont worry about it eh.

Ismael uses only a common 200mah 9V battery to do his repelliing force demo, and with additon of 2 AAs in sereis too, so he has 12V.

that is ALL he has for power supply - then this goes throug a voltage cascadionbg device for 7500VDC in cap...

he also has big pickup winds around his primary, and he also employs 5 tiems at peaks coil-shorting and also resonate-chopped high speed frequency to the primary pulse into coil too plus recycling the power too via peicup winds - its NOT ANYTHIGN like you say of it being very simple anyone can do it type of descritpiton.

Ismael shorts his system 5 times at peaks, and the peaks he shorts are of the resonate frequency chopped input too so everyhting happens extremely fast.

he can shoot the 1 kilo up in air 30feet or so 16 times, in less than a second, and battery voltage drops from 12.4 to 11.8 after all those reps.

Thats what it is and it is true and I have seen it and helpe him do demos.

As for the coil shorting your debuniking descipiton is very badly done.

the coils shorting goes into DC capapcitor after FWBR

your are measuing the voltage in a capacitor that is filled by coil shorting at peaks.
there are lots of videos showing the effect on youtube and its best to not use reed swtiches they blow up easy that is the only thing you got right.

Best to use high amperage very low resistance bidirectional mosfets.

the coil-shorting power must go into DC type caps, not AC type, with no resistance across caps en they fill up,  then cap dump into load in two stage process, whre cap is disconnected from "source" when it hits load.

Good Morning Konehead,

Do you remember what size cap he used?  How many uF @ 7500 ++V?

Thanks
Ben K4ZEP
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: CuriousChris on August 01, 2011, 01:32:07 PM
Hi CC

Ok absolultey everything you wrote is wrong but dont worry about it eh.

As I said any one with an elementary understanding of electronics will understand nothing special is going on here. Wishing it was so, doesn't make it so.


Ismael uses only a common 200mah 9V battery to do his repelliing force demo, and with additon of 2 AAs in sereis too, so he has 12V.

that is ALL he has for power supply - then this goes throug a voltage cascadionbg device for 7500VDC in cap...

Where? I am yet to see this video? I pointed out I'd be impressed if I saw it but its not on his site and no one seems to know of the videos existence. If you can direct me to such a video please do. if not spoken words are meaningless. what was the quote from somewhere else on this site... Something about words without witness are just words.

by the way, AA batteries are 1.5v so two in series is 3v not 12v. Perhaps you didn't realise this.

he also has big pickup winds around his primary, and he also employs 5 tiems at peaks coil-shorting and also resonate-chopped high speed frequency to the primary pulse into coil too plus recycling the power too via peicup winds - its NOT ANYTHIGN like you say of it being very simple anyone can do it type of descritpiton.

Ismael shorts his system 5 times at peaks, and the peaks he shorts are of the resonate frequency chopped input too so everyhting happens extremely fast.


That's nice.

Perhaps you didn't notice or didn't care to read I did not comment on Ismaels setup, I only comment on the one video which I provided a link to. I was led to believe it is similar, If not then show me a circuit diagram (and video if possible) and I will look it over as well.

In case you haven't brushed up on your electrical theory of late. The speed at which the magnetic flux cuts the conductor (copper coil) effects the voltage. The faster the flux cuts the coil the higher the voltage. So he HAS to do it fast to create high voltages, but as I have already said. Voltage does not equal power. drag a comb through your hair it generates thousands of volts. so what. the most it can do is make your hair stand up, there is not enough energy to do anything else.

Also high speed switching generates a lot of electrical noise. That electrical noise is very inefficient, lots of radio waves (harmonics) emanating from the device and into the environment wasting energy. That's why a power drill or kitchen appliance will often effect a nearby TV or radio.

he can shoot the 1 kilo up in air 30feet or so 16 times, in less than a second, and battery voltage drops from 12.4 to 11.8 after all those reps.

Thats what it is and it is true and I have seen it and helpe him do demos.

As for the coil shorting your debuniking descipiton is very badly done.

If you say so, Its very hard to describe what is happening when you know half the audience doesn't have a clue about basic electrical theory. perhaps I was a little simple in my explanation.

To declare my 'debunking' (I thought I was explaining, but if that's what you think) as badly done, you must know better than me as to how the circuit works. Please describe exactly what happens. I'll put aside my years of experience as an electronics technician and listen to your side of the story. If you have a valid reply I'll happily agree to it. remember I am here too because I am not satisfied with the current state of affairs. But I won't be told black is white when I know otherwise. I may be eager to learn but I am not eager to be led up a garden path. If I wanted that I'd be in church right now.

the coils shorting goes into DC capapcitor after FWBR

your are measuing the voltage in a capacitor that is filled by coil shorting at peaks.
there are lots of videos showing the effect on youtube and its best to not use reed swtiches they blow up easy that is the only thing you got right.

Best to use high amperage very low resistance bidirectional mosfets.

the coil-shorting power must go into DC type caps, not AC type, with no resistance across caps en they fill up,  then cap dump into load in two stage process, whre cap is disconnected from "source" when it hits load.


When I stated he used the wrong caps, he (in the video) is using what are called electrolytic capacitors. very common. they are dc biased and for their size have a better capacity than most normal caps. BUT the output from the coils can be exceedingly high in voltage (due to the fast shorting). They are very voltage dependent and may blow if you subject them to excessive voltage. That's all, it was just an observation. Also I remind you it was about the video I linked to not Ismaels setup.

The only part of ismeals I saw was a 6 or 12v lead acid or gel battery with an inverter and some caps. These can really pack a punch! enough to push a weight into the air many times. a one kilo weight 16 times or perhaps a 16kg weight once? (harder but with good equipment can be done).
http://ismaelwater.com/i4.php <= this video

I could not see enough of Ismaels setup to give any conclusive comment so I refrained. only stating the obvious, he has plenty of power there to kick the weight into the air.

You said you saw it with your own Eyes, That's great. I truly wish I had been there. But I wasn't so I can only go on whats been presented and whats been presented is nothing special at all.

I said it earlier. Wishing it was so doesn't make it so.

So before you came back at me with some half arsed abuse. How about you sit down and write out a complete description as to what exactly is happening and why it works the way it does. Don't worry if its above my head I have plenty of engineer friends who can enlighten me on what is wrong with my understanding.

To PROVE me wrong is a bigger rebuke than just saying I am wrong or hurling pitiful abuse at me or anyone else who dares to consider that what has been said is perhaps not gospel. So go ahead prove me wrong!

If you believe the engineers I would show your proof to are wrong, that's Ok. Just don't be stupid like the foolish hippie I spoke to once, when I told her, If she was so convinced geothermal power is easy to do she should go to university get a degree and show the other (obviously more stupid) engineers what they are doing wrong. Her answer was, she didn't want to be corrupted like them. What an irrational cop out. Wants to tell the world they are liars, but too lazy to seek out the truth herself.
 

CC
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on August 01, 2011, 07:51:47 PM
hi Ben

I am sorry I dont know the cap uf size of the coil-blast but it is 7500VDCit holds in it. ITs a fairly larege silve rcap is all I know... It take 12seconds to fill up the cap between blasts with the 9V battery and 2 AAs for 12V
the blast knocks a coil that wieghts 1 kilo straight up in air approx 33feet it takes less than second to go that high.
I dont kniow the pulse length, but ismael told me that the primary coil inside the massive pikcup winds is bifilar 22 GA and the pickup winds all around it are 5 strands of 19GA wire, in paralell...the pikcup winds around the primary catch the backemf, and also the "ambient" flux too - when the inner primary ignites, it makes a big flux field that extand all round the primary, and the pikcup winds gather all this.
He uses no diodes! also he has speical cascading DC to step up the DC - I think this uses the coil shsorting technique.
Ismael first chops-in the primary pulse in a very fast resonate frequency, I dont know wha this frequyenc  is, but he cant have any iron in cores, or even nearby system or it will upset this resonate frequency and the thing wont work right - it is very touchy and very dangerous too with that 7500VDC in DC cap
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on August 01, 2011, 08:58:40 PM
But what he uses instead of diodes ? how does he fill DC cap without rectifying "signals" ? 7,5kV diode bridge ? I didn't heard about something like that
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on August 02, 2011, 06:50:13 PM
hi forest

there are no diodes in the "repelling force" coil blast thing...he told me they will lbow up no matter what since the powr is so extreme (and it is) '
but most probably diodes in the other techs he has (such as in his MEG which powers his electirc car)...there are diodes inside mosfets and IGBT and like things so basically he was telling me the way he collects the backemf requires no didoes...
In the coil-blaster, there is inner primary coils (bifilar 22GA) that takes the hit of the resonate-chopped 7500VDC, and when this inner primary ignites from the jolt of juice, it creates a huge electromagentic field streching say 4 inches or so around the primary with very stong force....so this is normally wasted power, and Ismael wraps lots and lots of secondary winds all around this primary, and behind it too I bet (thats what I do too) and so now all of that field induces lots of power into the secondaries - I call these secondaries pikcup-winds.......
AND this big pickup wind picks up the backemf/recoil too, and then he SHORTS that, 5 times at peaks and jacks up the voltage into cap even more - all this without affecting draw to primary...power goes out to load, or is "recycled" (as I assume the coil blast does) when primary swtihc is off and "source" is disocnnected from caps then they hit load or recycle.
ITs all very complicated including the cascading-DC way he ramps up voltage to the cap from 12V to 7500VDC in 12 seconds between blasts.
To say this is elementary science and anyone can do it is pretty wishful thinking.
He employs coil-shorting too, (as far as I know) in the cascading DC step-up circuit, this is probably inside the recycling-circuit of the recovered power from the seconary/pikcup winds....
I dont know how he eventually collects it all into DC caps without diodes probalby some clever switching dont know for sure but that is "where" it comes from in what I described....same thing really with automotive ignition coil - one coil in it is 12V and then other coil around it is very thin winds so you get the 15KV spark from that and also the backemf/recoil is collected too byt hainve coil around coil.
anyways, no diodes, no iron, HV, coil shorting 5 times at peaks, and EVERYTHING is in resonate or harmonic fregueincies...this is coil-blaster, not his MEG whihc is differnet thing...the MEG powers that electirc car in all the videos not the coil-blast technique...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on August 03, 2011, 07:44:25 AM
konehead

Thank you, I understand now. Still the bigest problem for me are diodes and synchronization, but I'm just starting only...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: jbignes5 on September 06, 2011, 09:57:10 PM
 I myself am struggling to understand this but I think I might have a clue. This effect he is producing is not being generated in the normal fashion of our traditional electronics. So trying to apply traditional theories to the operation will do nothing for proof. He is generally working off the basic premise that Tesla used in all of his high voltage experiments. Capacitance discharge into a coil will always net huge potentials. Especially when the coil is a very low resistance bifilar coil which Tesla patented. So from the Tesla patent we will see that:

"I have found that in every coil there exists a certain relation between its self-induction and capacity that permits a current of given frequency and potential to pass through it with no other opposition than that of ohmic resistance, or, in other words, as though it possessed no self-induction. This is due to the mutual relations existing between the special character of the current and the self-induction and capacity of the coil, the latter quantity being just capable of neutralizing the self-induction for that frequency. It is well-known that the higher the frequency or potential difference of the current the smaller the capacity required to counteract the self-induction; hence, in any coil, however small the capacity, it may be sufficient for the purpose stated if the proper conditions in other respects be secured. In the ordinary coils the difference of potential between adjacent turns or spires is very small, so that while they are in a sense condensers, they possess but very small capacity and the relations between the two quantities, self-induction and capacity, are not such as under any ordinary conditions satisfy the requirements herein contemplated, because the capacity relatively to the self-induction is very small.
In order to attain my object and to properly increase the capacity of any given coil, I wind it in such way as to secure a greater difference of potential between its adjacent turns or convolutions, and since the energy stored in the coil—considering the latter as a condenser, is proportionate to the square of the potential difference between its adjacent convolutions, it is evident that I may in this way secure by a proper disposition of these convolutions a greatly increased capacity for a given increase in potential difference between the turns."

 Reference: http://www.teslauniverse.com/nikola-tesla-patents-512,340-coil-for-electro-magnets

 So what this man has done is exactly what the bifilar was always intended to do and that was to totally convert the current to super high potential via the increased speed at which the cap dump goes trough the coil due to the lower BEMF. This is cancelling the BEMF totally and allowing the current dump from the cap to shoot trough the coil at incredible speeds. This in turn increases the magnetic response from the environment towords the source of this event without having to initiate a magnetic event in the first place and it bounces back and forth between the final cap and bifilar coil(capacitor) causing a huge generation in the external pickup coils. This is Tesla Tech at it's finest.

 Here is also another clue using more traditional technology: http://www.teslauniverse.com/nikola-tesla-patents-390,721-dynamo-electric-machine

 Please read and reread these documents over and over before dismissing these claims. Tesla used non traditional armatures (field coils) they were toroids. That meant the magnetic field was wholly contained in the core toroid. Just as Leedskanin proves with the phm. The only other field that could possible be present is the electric field emmanating from the copper wires and Tesla knew everything there was to know about the electric field. Once separated from the magnetic field there is no lenz drag and one could generate huge amounts of energy without the lenz force because it did not effect the source.

 Here is a close up of the core he used: http://www.teslauniverse.com/nikola-tesla-patents-382,282-electric-converting-distributing . They must be closed upon them selves meaning forming a circuit. So if you use iron wire it must be circular in nature or closed looped to get the effect.

 As usual we have misinterpreted the patents and that is due to Tesla needing to have the basis of his real invention in the public eye. He knew one day someone would decode the puzzle and hopefully it has been decoded properly.

 Has anyone tried to detect a magnetic field around a pmh? Trust me there is none because it is locked inside of the core forever circulating. This circulation is what he mentions about the circuit having inertia. When you trap the magnetic field inside the core the only other field that is present is the electric field and that field is solely responsible for the generation of currents in the generator section of the second patent. The second patent can be utilized all on one shaft if the field coils go in the opposite direction of the turning motor. If the exciter is of a high voltage type meaning many many windings of fine mag wire you can see that it is pure potential that turns the field of the field coils. The generator rotor is a heavy copper wire like house wire and when the electric field cuts that huge currents are pulled into the system. Plus the more you put drag (clutch for a vehicle) on the motor the more the currents gets generated if you follow the design in the second patent compensating for the motor to amp up and try to go back to a steady state.

 I don't have it all worked out but I think People like Konehead can more then figure this out. Give it a shot and let me know what you think.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Poit on September 07, 2011, 03:33:33 PM
another few more months till i will be proven right.... that is that in 3 or so months would make a year since his first claim of a "break through" etc etc blah blah invention... and i said that in 12 months nothing at all would of happened .... ill renew my "bet" for another 12 months.... frick.. how about 100 years? thats how confident i am that this is BS
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on September 07, 2011, 04:00:46 PM
supression, think
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Poit on September 07, 2011, 04:08:33 PM
nope, not suppression.. just plain old stupidity!

Ok.. think of it like this... if EVERYONE tries a certain thing and fails, EVERY time! you would (as a potential new comer) want to try something different? right?

not Mr Ismael.... hence FAILURE! not suppression... stupidity!

(just to spell things out... the "thing" i am referring to is trying to patent the device in question to ultimately (try and fail) become a billionaire)

the "something different" would be open sourcing it... making it suppression proof! ........ but nooooooooooooo greed and stupidity seem to go hand in hand
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: mscoffman on September 07, 2011, 04:31:13 PM
nope, not suppression.. just plain old stupidity!


I have to agree;
There must be one hundred ways to convert this effect into a product so that
people can see this for themselves that this works without having to enter the
"Alchemy design Zone". He sold a product when he ships his alkaline health water.
Why can he not do the same with his other ideas? Many, many more people want
him to truly prove his inventions rather then to steal them. The situation as it exists
makes no sense; to have everyone in the world have to reproduce the invention
of a good idea before society can get any value from it...Oh, Well.

:S:MarkSCoffman
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: jbignes5 on September 08, 2011, 04:20:22 AM
Hi All,
here are 4 new videos from Isamel.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rujb0T9jSng

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXKN-aUAe6Q

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rv7C7YOetDY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKvR5OlLNDM



Ismael Aviso said, he was forced to make these video to answer all repeated question coming into his email everyday.

The last 3 videos will show you how & what is needed to accomplish the over-unity machine.

He gave 30% technical details & 95% basic principles on how to extract ambient energy..
Including what is inside the black box of his Ecar...

Sorry for the shaky amature hand video.

His original channel is here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/ley858

I got permission from him to copy it to my Youtube channel as a backup.

Many thanks for Ismael to have come forward with the explanations how his great technology works.

He is a real genius.

Please support him.

Many thanks.

Regards, Stefan.

 Hey Poit.. Do you even read anything that is posted? How about what I posted? This man goes as far to show you step by step on what this system is. He even shows you what is inside his little black box! All you got to do is click the video links and Walla you know how he does it. Yeah it might not be step by step production instructions or the best video quality but it is the meat of his method.

 As for him open sourcing this, well after all this is only the same method used by Tesla over 100 years ago and with the same coil Tesla designed and patented. This guy thinks he is gonna get rights to the technology but he can't it has been public domain for so long that he couldn't get rights. This might be one reason it is taking so long right now.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Poit on September 08, 2011, 04:25:41 AM
step by step? fuelless car? just two of the many many claims here.....

let me see two other FACTS...
1: youtube video uploaded on 22 May 2011
2: no one has replicated or proved "fuelless" car

your counter argument sir?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on September 08, 2011, 07:21:03 AM
Ismael doesnt call his electric car a fuel-less car. that is what others have hyped it up to be like Ashweth in his video of it....all Ismael says about it in "bragging-rights" is that if his MEG "as is" was put into conventiaonl electric cars to power them, it would make three times more effecient electric cars as far as range goes- that is all he claims with it.

The electric car has a "36V" forklift motor powering it, there is about 600V going into the forklift motor from his MEG. then a single 12V batery powering the MEG.
There is absolutely no backemf/recoil plasma/arcs in the brushes of the forklfit motor thats how he can pump so much voltage into it...
the car's rear where was put on dynamotor in Phillpine DOE lab there is videos of it and it was proven wihtout doubt to be 133% effecient - this in measuing the power from the wheels in HP compared to the input power in watts into the MEG.

Nobody else in world has ever been able to take ANYTHING to a DOE lab in any country anywahere and prove somethign to be operating abover 100% effecient (overunity)....and this is a piece of junk forklift motor powered by his MEG that shows that overunity. So if you dont like it thats a personal problem and I cant help you and neither can Ismael too.

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: jbignes5 on September 08, 2011, 02:06:59 PM
step by step? fuelless car? just two of the many many claims here.....

let me see two other FACTS...
1: youtube video uploaded on 22 May 2011
2: no one has replicated or proved "fuelless" car

your counter argument sir?

 I'm not gonna argue with you. The truth is he does tell you what he is doing and how to do it yourself! If you want to prove it to yourself then by all means do it. He gives enough information for you to be able to replicate it like you have been asking. So either replicate it or stop beating on the man verbally.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: jbignes5 on September 08, 2011, 02:11:29 PM
Ismael doesnt call his electric car a fuel-less car. that is what others have hyped it up to be like Ashweth in his video of it....all Ismael says about it in "bragging-rights" is that if his MEG "as is" was put into conventiaonl electric cars to power them, it would make three times more effecient electric cars as far as range goes- that is all he claims with it.

The electric car has a "36V" forklift motor powering it, there is about 600V going into the forklift motor from his MEG. then a single 12V batery powering the MEG.
There is absolutely no backemf/recoil plasma/arcs in the brushes of the forklfit motor thats how he can pump so much voltage into it...
the car's rear where was put on dynamotor in Phillpine DOE lab there is videos of it and it was proven wihtout doubt to be 133% effecient - this in measuing the power from the wheels in HP compared to the input power in watts into the MEG.

Nobody else in world has ever been able to take ANYTHING to a DOE lab in any country anywahere and prove somethign to be operating abover 100% effecient (overunity)....and this is a piece of junk forklift motor powered by his MEG that shows that overunity. So if you dont like it thats a personal problem and I cant help you and neither can Ismael too.

 Hey Konehead did you have a chance to look at my post with the Tesla references attached? I would be very interested in your opinions about them..

 Key points are Bifilar coil patent and the description and the rather odd generator and subsequent shorting of coils in the second patent.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on September 08, 2011, 07:01:46 PM
hi Jbigness5

OK looked at the 2nd patent of the generator - seems not too complicated, as its some permanent magnets whirling around inside 4 coils and cores and the brushes make the power induced in the coils alternating AC...and also you could adjsut pulse widht duty cycle with those burshes...
I dont see where he "shorts" the coils with switching at peaks or anything like that - but the Tesla spark-gap stuff makes oscillations exaclty like switch-shorting coils at their peaks...as when the spark does jump across, and when it connects then disconnects, it is like shorting a coil with a switch at peaks, and both ways will cause the coil to go into flurry of HV annd HF decaying-oscillations, and the first few will fill up cap much higher in votlage as compared to no sparkgap or coil chorting at peaks.
Ismael makes the oscillations created by coil shorting to expand, rather than decay, "simply" by very fast and accurate coil-shorting-at-peaks of the OSCILLATION-PEAKS....so: the first "primary"coil-short causes a train of osciallations, then 4 or so next-in-line coil shorts ("secondary" sort of ) are timed to occur at the peaks of the oscillations created.
Thats how I understand it, as told to me first-hand by Ismael. This is the heart of the MEG the heart of the repelling-force coil-blast too (how it fills up caps so fast and so high)

anyways if Tesla had two spark gaps, and  could "time" the 2nd (secondary sort of) spark-gap stuff to have oscillations that are of consistent fairly fast frequency, and laid it "on top" of the intial spark  of slower frequency, and made it so the the "secondary spark gap would "ride the peaks" of the slower-frequency  first/primary spark gap, then that would be what Ismael does. You could say synchrounous-sympathetic system mabye...

as caps fill up, the resistance changes, so the freuqeuncy and resonance/harmonics of it all changes too as caps fill then dump to load- this is problem Ismael overcame in some way.

 I have a feeling tesla deveopled some "self-regulating" caps like in his electric car that would make the resistance always consistent in the cpas while filling up and dumping to load then filling again over and over very fast....

Ismael is all over the bifilar coil thing - in his MEG he says he got lots more power by tripling the bifilars into septfilars....not sure what he does however exactly, such as series cancelling, series-adding, or split the bifilars where one half is induced-pwoer wind other is primary..I will guess he does the split-bifilars approach, and shorts the induced-power half of it, which would also be picking up the backemf spikes too; as he mentions in one of those videos that he is "shorting the backemf" but dont know for sure about that as usual... 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: jbignes5 on September 08, 2011, 08:20:03 PM
hi Jbigness5

OK looked at the 2nd patent of the generator - seems not too complicated, as its some permanent magnets whirling around inside 4 coils and cores and the brushes make the power induced in the coils alternating AC...and also you could adjsut pulse widht duty cycle with those burshes...
I dont see where he "shorts" the coils with switching at peaks or anything like that - but the Tesla spark-gap stuff makes oscillations exaclty like switch-shorting coils at their peaks...as when the spark does jump across, and when it connects then disconnects, it is like shorting a coil with a switch at peaks, and both ways will cause the coil to go into flurry of HV annd HF decaying-oscillations, and the first few will fill up cap much higher in votlage as compared to no sparkgap or coil chorting at peaks.
Ismael makes the oscillations created by coil shorting to expand, rather than decay, "simply" by very fast and accurate coil-shorting-at-peaks of the OSCILLATION-PEAKS....so: the first "primary"coil-short causes a train of osciallations, then 4 or so next-in-line coil shorts ("secondary" sort of ) are timed to occur at the peaks of the oscillations created.
Thats how I understand it, as told to me first-hand by Ismael. This is the heart of the MEG the heart of the repelling-force coil-blast too (how it fills up caps so fast and so high)

anyways if Tesla had two spark gaps, and  could "time" the 2nd (secondary sort of) spark-gap stuff to have oscillations that are of consistent fairly fast frequency, and laid it "on top" of the intial spark  of slower frequency, and made it so the the "secondary spark gap would "ride the peaks" of the slower-frequency  first/primary spark gap, then that would be what Ismael does. You could say synchrounous-sympathetic system mabye...

as caps fill up, the resistance changes, so the freuqeuncy and resonance/harmonics of it all changes too as caps fill then dump to load- this is problem Ismael overcame in some way.

 I have a feeling tesla deveopled some "self-regulating" caps like in his electric car that would make the resistance always consistent in the cpas while filling up and dumping to load then filling again over and over very fast....

Ismael is all over the bifilar coil thing - in his MEG he says he got lots more power by tripling the bifilars into septfilars....not sure what he does however exactly, such as series cancelling, series-adding, or split the bifilars where one half is induced-pwoer wind other is primary..I will guess he does the split-bifilars approach, and shorts the induced-power half of it, which would also be picking up the backemf spikes too; as he mentions in one of those videos that he is "shorting the backemf" but dont know for sure about that as usual...

 Yeah the scond patent is just a general approach. I would assume the patent is the motor that Westinghouse made for him. The Box he had was the control mechanism both spark gaps and shorting mechanism for the generator winding(rotor) then fed into the primary mover (motor). If you read the text of the patent it is specifically mentioned that he is familiar with shorting of coils: Reference: "If under such conditions the coils F F', of the generator-armature be closed upon themselves or short-circuited, no currents, at least theoretically, will be generated in the said armature-coils. In practice I have observed the presence of slight currents, the existence of which is attributable to more or less pronounced fluctuations in the intensity of the magnetic poles of the generator-ring. So, if the armature-coils F F' be closed through the motor, the latter will not be turned as long as the movement of the generator-armature is synchronous with that of the exciter or of the magnetic poles of its field."  So this leads me to believe he is very familiar with coils shorting.

 As for the Bifilar coils Tesla stated that the only resistance to the flow of current in such a coil is the resistive or ohmic value of the wire used to make the coil and that these bifilar coils are capacitors<-- So there is the key!. But much like resistors you could parallel many bifilar coils and halve the resistance many fold, Couldn't you?

 I think I have a good handle on what Ismael is doing here. charging up the end caps then disconnecting the caps from the source then boucing it back and forth between the now disconnected caps and newly connected Bifilar. Since both are considered to be caps electrically he harvests the pulses from the bifilar setup at each pass and increases the value by shorting the bifilar coil many times when it reaches peak value. Very nice setup.

 I have a suggestion for him though. Tell him to make the pancake version of the bifilar and parallel many flat ones together. This would lower the resistance to extremely lower values and allow for better ringing back and forth. Also Tell him to use two such bifilar setups instead of one that he collects from now. Remember these coils act like capacitors but they also act like coils too. Maybe layering one pancake coil on top of the other in pairs, one being the source or capacitor and the next layer being the collector. Many layers would allow for better performance. He is gonna have to experiment with the pancake coils in order to figure out how to harvest the mega pulses which should be emanating from the source coils.

 Also instead of using silicon to control the shorting I think Tesla used vacuum tubes. They can handle much more current then Silicon can and they run at analog speeds.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on September 09, 2011, 07:21:42 PM
Hi Jbigness6

I think the quote from Tesla was talking of a continuous dead-short in his generator, and not shorting coils at peaks briefly. collpasing the coil,  then at swtich opening, caps fill like crazy.
Ismael did go with "multiple bifilars", (septfilars) and got much more power, plus the pictures inside his MEG show stacks of torroids too, so he might already be doing in the MEG jsut what you suggest.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: jbignes5 on September 09, 2011, 08:39:51 PM
Hi Jbigness6

I think the quote from Tesla was talking of a continuous dead-short in his generator, and not shorting coils at peaks briefly. collpasing the coil,  then at swtich opening, caps fill like crazy.
Ismael did go with "multiple bifilars", (septfilars) and got much more power, plus the pictures inside his MEG show stacks of torroids too, so he might already be doing in the MEG jsut what you suggest.

 Well the quote says that he is familiar with shorting because thats how he engages the generator to start the process up to a steady state, that turns the generator setup into a huge induction motor then releases the coil to short through the motor. If one was to repeat this across a spark gap it would automatically short to the motor at the peak of current generation in the generator coils and short to the motor across the spark gap. So in effect yes it is the exact process Ismael is doing. Except the motor is not a bifilar coil.. Or is it?

 *Edit* In figure two of this patent is that a bifilar setup for the field coils? http://www.teslauniverse.com/nikola-tesla-patents-511,915-electrical-transmission-of-power
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on September 09, 2011, 09:13:52 PM
Yeah the scond patent is just a general approach. I would assume the patent is the motor that Westinghouse made for him. The Box he had was the control mechanism both spark gaps and shorting mechanism for the generator winding(rotor) then fed into the primary mover (motor). If you read the text of the patent it is specifically mentioned that he is familiar with shorting of coils: Reference: "If under such conditions the coils F F', of the generator-armature be closed upon themselves or short-circuited, no currents, at least theoretically, will be generated in the said armature-coils. In practice I have observed the presence of slight currents, the existence of which is attributable to more or less pronounced fluctuations in the intensity of the magnetic poles of the generator-ring. So, if the armature-coils F F' be closed through the motor, the latter will not be turned as long as the movement of the generator-armature is synchronous with that of the exciter or of the magnetic poles of its field."  So this leads me to believe he is very familiar with coils shorting.

 As for the Bifilar coils Tesla stated that the only resistance to the flow of current in such a coil is the resistive or ohmic value of the wire used to make the coil and that these bifilar coils are capacitors<-- So there is the key!. But much like resistors you could parallel many bifilar coils and halve the resistance many fold, Couldn't you?

 I think I have a good handle on what Ismael is doing here. charging up the end caps then disconnecting the caps from the source then boucing it back and forth between the now disconnected caps and newly connected Bifilar. Since both are considered to be caps electrically he harvests the pulses from the bifilar setup at each pass and increases the value by shorting the bifilar coil many times when it reaches peak value. Very nice setup.

 I have a suggestion for him though. Tell him to make the pancake version of the bifilar and parallel many flat ones together. This would lower the resistance to extremely lower values and allow for better ringing back and forth. Also Tell him to use two such bifilar setups instead of one that he collects from now. Remember these coils act like capacitors but they also act like coils too. Maybe layering one pancake coil on top of the other in pairs, one being the source or capacitor and the next layer being the collector. Many layers would allow for better performance. He is gonna have to experiment with the pancake coils in order to figure out how to harvest the mega pulses which should be emanating from the source coils.

 Also instead of using silicon to control the shorting I think Tesla used vacuum tubes. They can handle much more current then Silicon can and they run at analog speeds.

you are a good thinker ! salute you ! :) Einstein said that imagination is better then knowledge but I can add intuition is sometimes better then both. I thought about such setups too and will try to make prototypes .
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on September 10, 2011, 06:31:00 AM
hi Jbigness

yes it does look like bifilars in those 6 coils in fig 2.
Very interesting the way three adjacent coils seem to connect in series with one-half of bifilar, and then the coils at 180 degrees apart connect with the other half of the bifilar it seems...I wonder what this will do...
maybe one half is motor, other half is generator I dont know..
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on September 10, 2011, 06:42:03 AM
hi Jbigness

Not sure what you (and Tesla) means by engaging the short to get it up to steady state - I guess this means thats how it "outputs" his power generated?
I see "problem" of shorting directly into motor coils - this might just kill the whole effect -
going into unloaded-caps first, then unloading them to motor coils would be way to do it in my feeble opinion -  maybe Tesla is doing it like that...
I mentioned before (and Ismael was telling me of this too) is that the resistance in a cap with no volts in it, and then halfway filled up, and  3/4 filled up, etc.. is always a different and changing resistance-value when filling the caps and discharging the caps to load
so if there is a razors-edge resonant condition/frequency/resistance for filing the caps, its going to go out of resonance as the cap's resistance changes... Ismael was thinking that Tesla must have had some self-regulating caps in his electric car that would "automatically"  change resistance to match-up with the short/spark gap (same thing) feeding the caps....maybe those ball-shaped caps in some of Teslas stuff are what those are...
anways good thinking like Forest said...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: jbignes5 on September 10, 2011, 03:29:55 PM
hi Jbigness

Not sure what you (and Tesla) means by engaging the short to get it up to steady state - I guess this means thats how it "outputs" his power generated?
I see "problem" of shorting directly into motor coils - this might just kill the whole effect -
going into unloaded-caps first, then unloading them to motor coils would be way to do it in my feeble opinion -  maybe Tesla is doing it like that...
I mentioned before (and Ismael was telling me of this too) is that the resistance in a cap with no volts in it, and then halfway filled up, and  3/4 filled up, etc.. is always a different and changing resistance-value when filling the caps and discharging the caps to load
so if there is a razors-edge resonant condition/frequency/resistance for filing the caps, its going to go out of resonance as the cap's resistance changes... Ismael was thinking that Tesla must have had some self-regulating caps in his electric car that would "automatically"  change resistance to match-up with the short/spark gap (same thing) feeding the caps....maybe those ball-shaped caps in some of Teslas stuff are what those are...
anways good thinking like Forest said...

 Well first thing is first. Reread the Bifilar patent again till you understand what it is doing. This is my take on the bifilar coil! The coil for all intense and purpose is both an inductive source (coil) and a capacitor<----Key here is it is both! The only resistance in that capacitance is the wires resistance if it is made the Tesla way (pancake), other configurations lower this outcome (solenoid). But what if we made it of litz wire?<--There would be almost no resistance at all. As far as I know there is no variable resistance in the bifilar coil, unlike all the caps we use today. If we choose not to use litz wire then we can use both capacitance rules and resistance rules to double capacity and halve the resistance by paralleling the bifilar coils. In effect we could possibly lower the resistance to nil and increase the capacitance to huge amounts this way!

 As for the second patent with the generator, what I meant was that you can both Short the generator rotor to get it back up to speed and this shorts the motor (prime mover) as well. This shorting can be done via a spark gap or vacuum tube. If the prime mover (motor portion) is made with bifilar coils you can see how that would work (Ismael's technique). This happens all at once and if the spark gap has a magnetic quenching the amount of on and off becomes nearly unlimited.

 As for shorting the generator rotor in the start-up procedure that would make the the generator rotor a huge induction motor and cut out the prime mover (motor) at the end of the process. There are three distinct portions to this unit: 1) Exciter, 2) Generator/Start-up motor, 3) Prime mover or motor. All of these are designed onto the same shaft as far as I know. Let say once it comes upto a steady state speed we merely short and un-short the generator Rotor and the motor likewise gets this shorting. I think this is what he used in his box that he had on the pierce arrow experiment. It was merely a pulsed short generator that would intermittently short the generator rotor and prime mover(motor) to enable the unit to continue to run. Tesla probably used a cascade tube setup to increase the frequency at the peek of each ac wave generated by the exciter. and there might have been two cascade setups for each half of the wave like Ismael does (+,-). That is speculation by me but my research into the pierce arrow experiment says there were 12 tubes involved. 6 for each half of the wave.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on September 10, 2011, 07:18:54 PM
hi Jbigness5

I've wound and tested lots and lots of bifilar coils tested against regular winds over years mostly becasue of that Tesla pancake patent is reason plus sometimes people will say they have expeirment that proves bifilars are superior because they double as capacitors, and/or they have more induction to them, and/or pick up more paper clips and pull in radiant energy and all the reasons. but i am always dissapointed in myself int that I cant see any clear advantage every time maybe its just me but its always a bit more voltage with bifilars, and a bit more amps with regular winds thats all I see...I still dont beleive in my testing though and assume there is soemthg great to bifilar sI havent tapped into yet - there was lots of interest recently in the bifillar-cancaleling-series method then jam it into resonance with caps and LaserSaber had video doing this effect well but as for me the way I see the bifilar's advantage is when they are used as both motor and generator coil at same time - so one half is pirmary, and other half is induced-gernator wind and this other half will also be picking up the backemf spikes too becaeu of the tight induction - so when you take out the generator-half into caps like LC circuit, not only are you pickuyp up all the ambient enrgy around the primary winds, and the backemf spike, but also putting it into the right size caps makes it so the voltage captured into the caps will be way over the primary voltage...then you jsut have to put this captured into caps into a load non-reflective like didoe plug or two stage circuit and you should have accelerating motor if motor, lower draw, a power source output almost if not more than the input...anyways this is what I do with bifilars....I geve this idea long ago to Ismael and also had more winds around the primary-coil too so it becaome large-looking coil (these connectd to the gernator-coil half of bifilars) and also :"pikcup" wind BEHIND the primary too, - Ismael expanded on this and put winds INSIDE the primary, where a core would "normally" be...
Now so far nothing about shorting of these coils but what is nice to short is those PICKUP winds (also connected to that gernator-half of bifilar so its all one big coil around behind indside and within the primary gathering every speck of ambient flux plus the backemf spike too - different things)
OK now with that Tesla-generator patent, with the 6 coils, is sure does look like its bifilar coils in that and funny way he hooks them all up too but I bet the induced/secondary/gernator half of those bifilars get shorted and maybe the motor-half too, right after the motor swtihc closes...
I bet the winds in the gernator patent do what they do as one half is motor other is generator - the 3 adjacent coils areporbably the AC out - one hal fpos and other neg phase - and the 180 degrees opposed pairs are probably the motor-part of it...and I bet those are N-S magnets in rotor too...anyways jsut my two cents worth Iam lousy patent-analyzer -
again what Ismael does that sets him apart from Tesla although Tesla probably figured this out too is that Ismael creates the initial RING of the coil with a short, then he shorts the peaks of the RINGS after that....and 5 times at peak is how many times you can do it in the time slot you will probably have....(actually one primay-ring and 4 peak-rings)
I thought the cascading DC circuits were to fill up caps from a primary DC source - didnt know that you can change frequencies with that too but thats pretty good to know now - maybe Ismael does this for the peak-stuff maybe he has a cascading circuit off eac coil short...I think this is what you thinking too

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: jbignes5 on September 10, 2011, 09:50:54 PM
 Yes there is two distinct events happening in the Bifilar Pancake coil. One wind is separated by the other return strand. Think about this now. Two pairs of wires wound around each other. One goes one way and the other goes the other way. What this does is accelerate the incoming current. Ok here is a simple analogy. You have two lanes of traffic on a highway. The cars are actually the little wooden ones we here in the states make as Boy Scouts. Each car has a magnet on it with one having a north facing forward and the other has a south facing forward. Now push them in there respected lanes and at some point when they get close enough they accelerate towords each other. That is what happens in the pancake bifilar coils. The magnetic field is shorted out in between the winds but it causes an acceleration in the current except if you follow the lines around the spiral in the patent it is always surrounded by opposing winds. Do this, color the top wire red till it connects to the outer lower wire. Leave the outer lower wire the color it is. now assign it a direction of flow from top left to lower right. Also assign a direction of flow for the wire you didn't color and you will see the direction goes opposite the other color is. But since this is an uneven attraction 2 red to one it accelerates the current. The bifilar pancake coil is a charge accelerator And it nets more magnetic field in the core of the coil because of this. the ratio of charge acceleration is 2 to 1.
 Also the coils still induce voltage in a higher degree to the adjacent wires to boot. This is probably a very bad translation of what is really happening but it is as close as I can figure.

 I think Tesla eventually figured out this in the early 1932 when he did the Pierce arrow experiment. What I find interesting is that he had to have a fan installed on the end of the motor probably to increase air flow due to the frequencies involved. Iron isn't a perfect conductor of the magnetic field and eddies form causing heat build up. This could have been a duel purpose too if the generator/motor was sucking free charges from the air like I think it was doing. It might be that he did in fact use an antenna as well to boost the collections and the motor was the outlet of those charges (heat).

 I assume you are correct because in his black box (Ismael) he has 3 transistors or the likes. In Tesla's generator/motor the only magnets are in the Exciter section. The rest is induction based including the prime mover.

 I will know soon anyways because I am building the generator/motor and will be taking pictures and movies of the build process.

 Right now I have an AC induction motor and the iron ring cut in half for ease of building. I hear the ring should be made out of soft iron wire for optimum efficiency. But for right now I have a split soft iron ring that is all one piece(not segmented) as a test. I'm just waiting on some magnet wire to finish the build and of course the shaft and frame including bearings. I will know soon enough what this entails.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on September 10, 2011, 10:17:17 PM
now, the point is how to measure capacitance of bifilar coil ? excellen explanation ,thanks jbignes5
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: jbignes5 on September 11, 2011, 04:50:34 AM
 That is the question I guess. How do we measure the capacitance of the bifilar. I would think it should be like any other capacitor but then some say that there are special rules. Again the Bifilar patent says:

 "If now, as shown in Fig. 2, a conductor B be wound parallel with the conductor A and insulated from it, and the end of A be connected with the starting point of B, the aggregate length of the two conductors being such that the assumed number of convolutions or turns is the same, viz., one thousand, then the potential difference between any two adjacent points in A and B will be fifty volts, and as the capacity effect is proportionate to the square of this difference, the energy stored in the coil as a whole will now be two hundred and fifty thousand as great. Following out this principle, I may wind any given coil either in whole or in part, not only in the specific manner herein illustrated, but in a great variety of ways, well-known in the art, so as to secure between adjacent convolutions such potential difference as will give the proper capacity to neutralize the self-induction for any given current that may be employed. Capacity secured in this particular way possesses an additional advantage in that it is evenly distributed, a consideration of the greatest importance in many cases, and the results, both as to efficiency and economy, are the more readily and easily obtained as the size of the coils, the potential difference, or frequency of the currents are increased."

 Now If I could only figure this out it could tell us a lot. But I'm too tired to think clearly at the moment. Let me think about this some more.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on September 11, 2011, 09:31:45 AM
That is the question I guess. How do we measure the capacitance of the bifilar. I would think it should be like any other capacitor but then some say that there are special rules. Again the Bifilar patent says:

 "If now, as shown in Fig. 2, a conductor B be wound parallel with the conductor A and insulated from it, and the end of A be connected with the starting point of B, the aggregate length of the two conductors being such that the assumed number of convolutions or turns is the same, viz., one thousand, then the potential difference between any two adjacent points in A and B will be fifty volts, and as the capacity effect is proportionate to the square of this difference, the energy stored in the coil as a whole will now be two hundred and fifty thousand as great. Following out this principle, I may wind any given coil either in whole or in part, not only in the specific manner herein illustrated, but in a great variety of ways, well-known in the art, so as to secure between adjacent convolutions such potential difference as will give the proper capacity to neutralize the self-induction for any given current that may be employed. Capacity secured in this particular way possesses an additional advantage in that it is evenly distributed, a consideration of the greatest importance in many cases, and the results, both as to efficiency and economy, are the more readily and easily obtained as the size of the coils, the potential difference, or frequency of the currents are increased."

 Now If I could only figure this out it could tell us a lot. But I'm too tired to think clearly at the moment. Let me think about this some more.


That means it is variable capacitor depending on applied voltage ! Also seems like superconductor if you know how to connect it !
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: jbignes5 on September 11, 2011, 04:24:19 PM

That means it is variable capacitor depending on applied voltage ! Also seems like superconductor if you know how to connect it !

 Not only the voltage but the size of the coil, the frequency of the current ans weather or not you can reduce the resistance of the wire itself. This can be accomplished just by paralleling 2 coils together and then you net an increase in the capacitance as well Per capacitance rules.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: johnnymx on October 17, 2011, 08:29:30 PM
hi  everybody i am going try to replicate ismael efect, i start with vcr head motor, this motor has 4 coil and rotor with permanent magnet in alternate poles like +-+- i use 2 coil for run the motor in pulse motor design and 2 coils as alternetor generator for short, and see if the motor goes down in rpm after load is conected, right now i am in the 1rst phase, i run the motor, next step is make an oscilator to drive a mosfet for short generator coil, i will try with diferent frecuencies, and see what happen ok i show what advances i got.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on October 18, 2011, 06:35:15 AM
hi Johnnymx

use bi-directional mosfets to short the coils - this is two mosfets wired together at gate and source leads, then the switching occurs between the two drain leads.

Use mosfets with high amperage rating and also high voltage rating too - mosfets with high amp rating will have low resistance - if too much resistance in the switching it will snuff it all out and caps wont fill up like they should.
Expect X20 voltage into caps as compared to what magnets-only spinnng past the coils will put into caps.

Also be sure to fill up DC type caps (not AC type) that have no resistance or load attached to them when they fill up....you need to fill up "caps-only" from coil shorting,
then after they fill up, disconnect your coils being shorted into the caps, and then dump the caps to load whild coils are disconnected.

this is called two stage output circuit - if you dont do this it wont work - so resistance can kill it not only in the switching, but also if across the caps themselves.

Dont expect a speed-up happening when the caps fill up, or when the caps hit load (with coils then disconnected from caps)
that is what RomeroUK did, and Thane gets, and Mariusivic and some other guys got going with their Mullergen/RomeroUk "variants" but that is whole other thing going on, using high imnpedance coils, and high rpms and iron or ferrite cores....its not the same thing as shorting coils at peaks however Marisuvic did short his coils with reed switch direct into load, and got a speed up to happen, but dont "expect" it to happen is what I am saying -

Just as long as you can pulse a load with the caps you filled up from shorting coils at peaks, and the draw to your motor part of it doesnt go up during filling of the caps and also when caps hit load - that is successful experiment coil shoritn at peaks...Ismael does it in cluster of 5 shorts at peak and also way I understand it is he shorts the peaks of the oscillations created by initial short, so that is much more advanced....try just one short per sinewave peak for now - experiment with pulse width too ....if pulse width is too wide, it will cause your motor to go up in draw - if too narrow of pulse width, it wont completely collapse the coil and the spring-back of collapsed coil when switch opens wont be as strong as it should be, and so you wont get as much voltage quickly into your caps as they could/should be filling up like...
Also cap UF size is important to experiment with - too small of UF value and you wont have as much power as they could be when they hit the load; too big of UF value and the caps will fill up too slow and to a lower voltage level....


Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: crazycut06 on October 18, 2011, 02:49:45 PM
Hi all! I've tried the coil shorting schematic with two mosfets by kone, it works! great! my setup was a pwm, (12v input) connected to the coil shorting mosfets, then i used a 9v-750ma transformer for the shorting voltage, and as i adjust the pwm's duty cycle to get maximum voltage, it went from 11vdc to aproximately 40vdc! output from the fwbr and caps, wow huge increase! input amps doesn't go up much, i have no other measuring equipment or scope, just used a multimeter, but oviously the voltage is real as i can light a small 220v-10w bulb with 40vdc. no wonder aviso can run his car with just a 12v battery! genious!

Sorry can't post a picture or video co'z i dont have much time to do it......but it surely works! and nice circuits by Kone... tnx... :D
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on October 18, 2011, 07:44:28 PM
Hi Crazycut06

I assume you have the 9V transformer with its HV side attached to grid?
then your only adjsutment is the pulse width of this through a PWM tied to the mosfets?
If so, then it doesnt seem you are actually shorting at peak-period only - if you did this, you might get 100-150Vdc into the same cap during same amount of time...and no extra draw to primary at all if pulse width is not too wide...

here are a couple circuits that will sense the peak period, then decide the peak "capture" period (pulse width), and then has ability to chop up this capture period into pulses in frequency of your choosing too - pretty nifty...this circuit was originally thought up by "Bolt" using three 555 timers, then RonP made the dual4047 circuit which is a bit simpler and also will switch AC....but this had glitch of delay between first coil short and the cluster that occurs right after, (might not really matter much) and then Mike Ross did the triple 555 circuit with all the transistors that cures the delay-glitch problem.
I built RonP's cirucit and it works great but for the slight glitch ...havent personally finished and tested Mike's triple555 circuit but he did, and it works perfect he said...if you can have these trigger your mosfets then you are getting into Ismael-territory of triggering mulitple times at peaks...these circuits are for 60hz feed to them - different feed-frequencies can be adjusted for by changing the small caps on the timers...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on October 19, 2011, 12:32:16 AM
...it went from 11vdc to aproximately 40vdc! output from the fwbr and caps, wow huge increase! ... :D
Hi, guys. Isn't this the same effect as in an ordinary automobile ignition coil? An explanation is here: http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=6763.msg302309#msg302309

I also found interesting articles worth consideration:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marx_generator
and another, you cannot use this link independently, only from the above given "Marx" link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/croft-Walton_generator
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: johnnymx on October 19, 2011, 05:20:12 AM
hi cone and all thanks for your info i´m go to next step, i build oscilator with 555 /variable frecuency and variable duty i have not too much time but i do what i can, this is my pulse motor:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38QiFhXOwHU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38QiFhXOwHU)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on October 19, 2011, 06:39:35 AM
Hi Qwert

No its not the same thing as ordinary car igniton coil which takes 12V and shoots it up to 15,000V bursts into sparkplugs...those will have a primary and secondary wind - the primary is thick wire, the secondary is super thin wire plus lots of turns...you dont get any "gain" in power since with that 15,000V you have like .0001 amps (just guessing tha amps)
That said, Ovi Fetch does have a special igintion-coil circuit that uses coil-shorting method in it that works on a motorcycle...so if you want to you can use coil shorting to ramp up voltage gitime into caps, and then cap discharge to plugs.
He says some car or motor cycle companies do some coil-shorting in their electronic iginiton systems but its propreitary and sort of secret in what they do he says.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: crazycut06 on October 19, 2011, 02:38:08 PM
I assume you have the 9V transformer with its HV side attached to grid?
then your only adjsutment is the pulse width of this through a PWM tied to the mosfets?
If so, then it doesnt seem you are actually shorting at peak-period only - if you did this, you might get 100-150Vdc into the same cap during same amount of time...and no extra draw to primary at all if pulse width is not too wide...



Yes that's correct, what if i use a pwm with a duty cycle & frequency control? would it be more adjustable and would i get the 100-150Vdc? or maybe more? and thanks for the circuit, ill surely try it... G.b.u...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on October 19, 2011, 06:47:05 PM
Hi Crazycut

having the short trigger tight at the sinewave peak is what you need to do in order to get really good performance along with no extra draw to primary.
pulsewidht adjstu after that is needed too...frequency control of the actual chopping of the peak period is what you want...not so much the frequency-contorl of the feed-signal itself although why not have that too.

becasue you are using a transformer off the grid, you need someway to sense the peaks - if you had a rotating rotor with magnets in it, like a Mullergen or someting similar, with spinning rotor inducing power into coils its easy to do since you can rig up halleffects or whatever to be triiggered by the shaft rotation, or if small magnets in rotor, you can trigger halleffects with the rotor magnets themselves - or use a light sensor or even common motor brush-commutator...but if nothing rotating like what you have, you need somehtign to sense sinewave peaks - thats what those circuit I put up do - the first pot finds your peak period, 2nd pot decides capture-width of this peak period, 3rd pot chops up that capture-pereiod into pulses...you can do one big pulse or lots of small ones...other way is a toy strobelight circuit to sense peaks not sure about this havent tried that way...what you do is attach yoru mosfets to those sinewave peak circuits and they trigger the mosfets that do the coil-shorting.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on October 19, 2011, 08:29:26 PM
Since my electronics knowledge fails, my considerations are based rather on my reasoning' thinking. So, tell me guys, if this is what you are seeking recently (though it's not ready solution, I consider it rather a kind of a view of the problem):

"Transformers as magnetic amplifiers
The so-called saturable reactor in which a control winding is impressed with d.c. in order to vary the inductance of an a.c. carrying winding can be considered a primitive magnetic amplifier. Except for the way in which it is used, the device resembles a transformer. Indeed, a conventional transformer can be operated in this fashion ~ the basic idea is to control core saturation so that the second winding changes its inductance, thereby controlling the a.c. in the load.
Usually, however, the term 'magnetic amplifier' is reserved for a very similar device which also exerts its control through core saturation. Known also as a magamp, this device does not rely upon the d.c. control winding to actually saturate the core, but only to govern the amplitude level (and therefore, the time) at which core saturation occurs during the cyclic excursions of the a.c. in the load winding. The onset of core saturation switches the inductance of the load winding from a relatively high to a very low value. Therefore, the duration of load current within a half-cycle is subject to control."

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on October 20, 2011, 07:47:22 PM
Hi Qwert

No this isnt really very close to what Ismael is doing with "coil shorting at peaks"....

look into the Thane bi-torroid transformer for some cool transformer performance, also look into Hector's TRANSVERTOR experiments and circuits - a guy named selfonlypath has 3 videos up about it -

the EXTRACTION of power from caps in the transvertor is similar to Ismaels extracion-circuit (two stage I call it) it has 2 caps that output to load (via "diode plug" circuit ) in see-saw fashion  (one cap fills while other cap hits load and vice versa - alsways with cap disconnected from "source" when a cap hits load)
filling up caps fast without reflection onto primary as additional power draw is one thing to accomplish, (shorting coils into caps at sinewave peaks does this) getting power from those caps into a load also without reflection back as additonal power-draw to primary draw is another ("two stage" output cirucit - have caps disconnected from source that already filled caps, when caps hit load)...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on October 20, 2011, 11:16:07 PM
Hi Qwert...
So, is it like this? Description:
"A number of capacitors are charged in parallel to a given voltage, V, and then connected in series by spark gap switches, ideally producing a voltage of V multiplied by the number, n, of capacitors (or stages). Due to various practical constraints, the output voltage is somewhat less than n×V."

Or rather like this? Description:
"A full-wave CW multiplier
The CW is a voltage multiplier that converts AC or pulsing DC electrical power from a low voltage level to a higher DC voltage level. It is made up of a voltage multiplier ladder network of capacitors and diodes to generate high voltages. Unlike transformers, this method eliminates the requirement for the heavy core and the bulk of insulation/potting required. Using only capacitors and diodes, these voltage multipliers can step up relatively low voltages to extremely high values, while at the same time being far lighter and cheaper than transformers. The biggest advantage of such circuits is that the voltage across each stage of the cascade is equal to only twice the peak input voltage in a half wave rectifier. In a full wave rectifier it is three times the input voltage. It has the advantage of requiring relatively low cost components and being easy to insulate. One can also tap the output from any stage, like a multitapped transformer".
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on October 21, 2011, 05:32:32 AM
hi Qwert

yes those have similarities - Ismael I know uses a voltage-cascading circuit in his "repelling force" coil blaster tech that can knock a 1 kilo weight coil in air 33 feet in less than second and he can do this 16 times over and over with power supply being only small 9V battery with two AAs in sereis for 12V power supply...12 second charge time for the 7500VDC capacitor between blasts - the small batteries drops about 1.3V  from 12.7 to 11.4 after those 16 blasts...

anyways the repelling-force has a special voltage-cascading circuit in it....so he doesnt just ramp up the voltage with a transformer or invertor - there is probably much more to it too, as backemf recovery makes for lots more voltage in cap, and also single-short-at-peaks coil shorting does too (X20 expect in either)

also I know that in the discharge-event from caps filled by "ambient" as Ismael calls it, he has a battery in series to the capacitor during discharge-event of cap to load (this his MEG tech not his repeliing force tech) and this battery works like a buffer/filter to prevent very destructive EMP harmonics....so the "series-cap" paragraph you quote is also "similar" but not really the same thing...really the "heart" of his systems is the coil shoritng at peaks - first short at peak creates oscillations,
then the socillation-peaks get shorted at their peaks -
so coil-short-created HV and HF oscillations expand in voltage rather than decay...so it becomes exponenetial voltage increase you couuld say that fills caps up...
also interesting thing is the process of filling up caps REQUIRES zero voltage in caps or there are problems since caps will be "polarized" one way,  and caps wont accept "ambient" power if they have even a little bit of voltage in them -  this since the tesistance from being polarized kills the whole effect; similar to having resistance acorss caps,
or switching that has high resistance to it too will kill the effect (why must be high-amp mosfets) just learend about the zero volts needed in caps to accept ambient power last week from Ismael...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on October 21, 2011, 07:41:05 AM
Hi, all.
My two citations in my previous post are excerpts from two Wikipedia articles: one is "Marx Generator"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marx_generator

 and anoiher one is "Cocroft–Walton generator" (to get there is only one way, through above "Marx" link).
So you, Konehead confirm that this sounds like the Ismael Aviso's technology. Of course I understand that the Marx Generator / Cocroft–Walton generator is only one, but basic component of Aviso's generator.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on October 21, 2011, 05:34:01 PM
Hi Qwerk

No i am saying its similar in his repelling-tech is all. (the cascading DC circuit) I dont know exaclty how he does it but assume coil-shorting is involved in it too, and your links doent mention coil-shorting so they are only similar. The MEG is similar to HUBBARD coil if you want to study that.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on October 21, 2011, 09:07:26 PM
HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT ???? Nobody saw Hubbard device in action and detail, and even if same had seen they are dead now....
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on October 21, 2011, 10:04:51 PM
Hi Qwerk

No i am saying its similar in his repelling-tech is all. ...
Thank you Konehead, that's what I wanted to hear. Those generators don't give real power, only very high voltages; they need something else to get power. That means that my understanding is correct.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on October 22, 2011, 05:09:26 AM
hi Forest

There is lots of information on the web about the Hubbard coils with modern drawings and illustrations and all sorts of stuff.
Just google it and look around for a couple hours and study it if you want (or not)
Ismael told me that his MEG is very similar to the Hubbard coil at least in some parts and functions of it - so whatever you see on the web about the Hubbard coil is also similar to Ismaels MEG - I will guess the multiple coils part of it and the arrangement of coils are the similarities.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on October 22, 2011, 05:21:26 AM
Hi Qwert

Part of the circuit with funciton of filling a cap to 7500VDC very quickly (12 seconds after each coil blast) using a 9V battery and two AAs as power source in Ismaels "repelling force" coil blaster might be similar to a Marx generator type of DC cascading circuit - might not be too - Another way to contribute to the fast cap-filling is multple coils shorts and sinewave peaks like I described where the oscillation-peaks created by intial short are shorted at THEIR peaks  - this will put HV into caps super fast - maybe then, a DC cascading circuit is also used too in combination with peak coil shorting circuit  (dont know but why not)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Khwartz on February 05, 2012, 02:16:23 PM
Hi Qwert

Part of the circuit with funciton of filling a cap to 7500VDC very quickly (12 seconds after each coil blast) using a 9V battery and two AAs as power source in Ismaels "repelling force" coil blaster might be similar to a Marx generator type of DC cascading circuit - might not be too - Another way to contribute to the fast cap-filling is multple coils shorts and sinewave peaks like I described where the oscillation-peaks created by intial short are shorted at THEIR peaks  - this will put HV into caps super fast - maybe then, a DC cascading circuit is also used too in combination with peak coil shorting circuit  (dont know but why not)
Hi Kone!

You find me here because your post are too much interesting to miss any of them ;) and indeed, it's Ismael car which made me interested mostly in the Free Energy! but as I saw he never run his car more than fully charged big set of cap could by themselves provide as energy (20min) at low speed, I had too much doubts to continue on its work without longer run.

Here are my calculations, could you tell me if you see any error (reference to the following vid):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jR4DvNO0jg


He uses a 11[kW] electrical engine. In an other vid where he ran his car outside, he ran it for only 20 min and at very low speed, means he used at maximum could be only 10% of the power of the motor to run it so slowly:


1/3[h] * 11[kW] ~ 3.7[kWh] of energy needed for the run, if constant speed.


If he starts with 15[F] caps full, he has already:

0.5 * 210[F] * 311²[V²] ~ 10^7[J] ~ 2,800[Wh] ~ 2,8[kWh] of already present energy in the cluster of caps.


So, remains to get from the battery, as energy for the 20 min run:

3.7[kWh] - 2.8[kWh] = 0.9[kWh] = 900[Wh] ~ 3.2 106[J]


Assuming he used a 12[V] battery in his 20 min run:

3.2 106[J] / 12[V] ~ 2.7 10^5[As] ~ 75[Ah]

And we have ordinary batteries of 100[Ah].

So, if his very caps was more or less 10 or 15[F], he didn't need any "ZPE" or any "Venturi Pumping Like Effect" from EM fields to make his demonstrations :-\


I've tried to communicate with him about this, but he never replied, so I gave-up with this stuff  :(

---------

Any way, I'm very interested by you just have written, and it is right in the sense of our discussions:

Yeah, you look to me having made a very pertinent statement about on which peak were should fill the caps.

Because yes: I made a conjecture too that WE WILL GET NEAR INFINITE POWER IF WE CAN USE THE FRACTAL ASPECT OF A WAVE.

I mean that more we go in the thinness of the form of a waves, more we are able to use the infinitesimal changes in the from. And indeed, what you propose goes straight in the sense.


Can't we do that with a kind of sampling device that could sample in real time the wave form and so set the 2 parts cycle in real time to fill the caps an short the coils alternatively?

Can't we use use schematics like in digital scope for sampling True RMS measurement?

Best regards.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on February 05, 2012, 07:26:13 PM
hi Khwartz
Ismaels MEG is what power the forklift motor, and he is powering the 36V rated forklift motor with around 600V from the caps, so must be very little current. He also has no plasma or arciing at the brushes too, so every speck of backemf/recoil is removed.  all this is pretty remarkable in itself.
Ismael is not open source, and he doesnt really care if people think it is fake or no good or not he does what he does very wekk,  and does shows videos for the public, but the videos are not conclusive proof of anything really they jsut show what his machines do, not HOW he does it down to the bone like everyone wants to see.  he doesnt really respond to people questioning if his things are real or fake and they want to see proof and know how it is done for further proof.
The single battery "powering" the forklift motor in his electric car is actually IN SERIES with the capacitor bank tha tis filled by the MEG.  The MEG uses the coil shorting at peaks tech that you know about now.  Also Ismale shorts the peaks of the rings that are cretaed byt the initial peak-short, so he gets "exponential power" increase.
Anyways because the battery is in series with the caps the battery he tells me is working sort of like a buffer - it is there not really as the "power supply" to the MEG, but working as a buffer...I talked to him alot about what percentage of pwoer comes from the battery, and what percentage comes from the cap bank to the forklift motor to run it...he hsa some complicated calculations about it I dont want to go into it now but anyways, becasue of this, your calculations dont really apply its a long discussion to figure it out but basically the battery is a "buffer" to keep the system from blowing up and to dampen the huge spikes by it being in series.
The car being driven demos is sort of just fun to see - it works and he cruises around....the other video demonstarting 300 consecutive starts from stops witout affecting the batteyr is dramatic, 9try doiongthat wit regular electirc car) and also the best one to "prove" anything is the one with the Filipino DOE testing it in their lab on a dynometer - so what is the power from the tires to the road, aand declaring it OVERUNITY  via it being 133% effecient...Ismael had some overheating problems with it but that is all part of R and D to fix things.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Khwartz on February 07, 2012, 01:14:18 AM
hi Khwartz
Hi Kone

Quote
Ismaels MEG is what power the forklift motor, and he is powering the 36V rated forklift motor with around 600V from the caps,
Sorry, but he show only 311V on his vid, at his cluster of caps. How he would give 600V to the motor?

 
Quote
so must be very little current.
And very little peaks of voltage?

 
Quote
He also has no plasma or arciing at the brushes too,
You mean brushes of the motor, ones that give the power to the rotor of the motor?

Quote
so every speck of backemf/recoil is removed.
I don't see the link, the relationship, could you tell me more?

Quote
  all this is pretty remarkable in itself.
I need to see clearer the concept, how does it work.

Quote
Ismael is not open source, and he doesnt really care if people think it is fake or no good or not he does what he does very wekk,  and does shows videos for the public, but the videos are not conclusive proof of anything really they jsut show what his machines do, not HOW he does it down to the bone like everyone wants to see.  he doesnt really respond to people questioning if his things are real or fake and they want to see proof and know how it is done for further proof.
So why he makes vids and bring "peoples" to see and testimony if he would not care about to prove his system work? but while doing it, would nice he does in a way that could really show he has achieve overunity, and if my calculations are correct, he has not proved it! and all the thing could be just "how to use cap instead of batteries"! and that could explain why we don't hear about him since a while, while he was supposed to deliver his system since even last year :/

Quote
The single battery "powering" the forklift motor in his electric car is actually IN SERIES with the capacitor bank tha tis filled by the MEG.
do the battery in parallel with the MEG, but in series with the battery?

 
Quote
The MEG uses the coil shorting at peaks tech that you know about now.
ok :)

 
Quote
Also Ismale shorts the peaks of the rings that are cretaed byt the initial peak-short, so he gets "exponential power" increase.
Sub-peak by sub-peak, or the whole set of peaks after shorting the coils?

Quote
Anyways because the battery is in series with the caps the battery he tells me is working sort of like a buffer - it is there not really as the "power supply" to the MEG, but working as a buffer...
Ok, he can say what ever he want to tell us, and yes, it could have sense, like Tom Bearden and Bedini use batteries, but by calculation, if I'm right, it could be just the additive power need to run his demo, but would need these 10-15F caps! So all the problem for me is to be sure of the capacitance of these dam caps!

Quote
I talked to him alot about what percentage of pwoer comes from the battery, and what percentage comes from the cap bank to the forklift motor to run it...he hsa some complicated calculations about it I dont want to go into it now but anyways, becasue of this, your calculations dont really apply its a long discussion to figure it out but basically the battery is a "buffer" to keep the system from blowing up and to dampen the huge spikes by it being in series.
Kone, he can tell you what he wants, and justify as he want too, and "complexities" could show hiding of reality too! :/ But unless he could make a run that is longer than a battery + cluster of such cap can power the energy for, I can't give any credit too, I'm sorry :/

Quote
The car being driven demos is sort of just fun to see - it works and he cruises around....the other video demonstarting 300 consecutive starts from stops witout affecting the batteyr is dramatic,
As I could know: battery, it's know by car-professionnal-fixing-man/women, doesn't lose much voltage to be empty! at 12V it is already "empty" and have given near all its power!...

Quote
9try doiongthat wit regular electirc car) and also the best one to "prove" anything is the one with the Filipino DOE testing it in their lab on a dynometer - so what is the power from the tires to the road, aand declaring it OVERUNITY  via it being 133% effecient...Ismael had some overheating problems with it but that is all part of R and D to fix things.
I'm not at all convince of their process. If the caps and battery has given higher voltage because of his system, of course, the mechanical power could only increase, like 33% more, but it never means overunity, just increase of power, that could mean only more draw from the power supply.
What would have prove overunity, would have been to let it run until the full discharge of the battery and caps and compare it the energy of work provide to the testing bunch.
It's like the said "joulesthiefs" that only ionise a gas that makes it more conductive, and so, increase the power of the load, but draw more on the power supply, while all the measurements doesn't take care of the RMS effects. I mean, at the end, if you obtain a more powerful load because of ionisation, or HV High-frenquency-peaks, it doesn't necessary mean overunity, we need to check the "quantity of energy" aspect each time. And having a car-battery at 12V has never meat it is a full battery :/
But the proof of it is very simple, so that strange it didn't make it: just to run his car more longer, like double or triple, of the whole energy storable in a 12V battery and 400V and "x" Farad caps, could ever sustain; that's very simple and very doable! but that strange thing for me, and that why I'm so suspicious, the time he ran it was the time it could run it only by the addition of the storage of the battery and the cluster of caps...(still assuming they were 15F caps).
But for that he wants to keep his secrets of how he could achieve overunity if he really achieves it, I do understand and respect :)
Cheer.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on February 07, 2012, 08:34:37 AM
Whatever -
The DOE lab in Phillipines CONFIRMED 133% effiecincy in the forklift motor, and this is maeausing HP at the tires on the dynometer....
Ismael is the first person in world to get and governnemt labratory to confirm OVERUNITY OPERATION, and this is is an old beat up amp-hog forklift motor that is making the power at the wheels - and the MEG powers the forklift motor.
Like I said Ismael is NOT open-source, he has many investors and can only show this and that of the total picture -   and so dont expect to have answers for all your questions from him (or me) and he doesnt really care (nor do I) if people are not satisfied with his videos or data or expect alot more scientific confirmation in order for them to "beleive it". 
The tests by the DOE lab confirm overunity so find anyone else in the world who has done anything like that.
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Khwartz on February 07, 2012, 11:43:16 PM
Whatever -
The DOE lab in Phillipines CONFIRMED 133% effiecincy in the forklift motor, and this is maeausing HP at the tires on the dynometer....
Yes, but Kone, it's means nothing! because of course, if you deliver to the motor higher volatge, for example, of course it will have higher efficiency! Same: you give same voltage but higher frequency, you will have the same increase of efficiency! And it could be only a matter then of increasing the power by the nature of the voltage applied to the motor, like many other loads. You CAN increase the power of a load by modifying the voltage and the form of the voltage wave as per its frequency, and then, you just have more draw from the power supply, and faster emptying of the power supply, or more draw form the grid.
But Kone, hear me well please: I'm not saying Ismael have make fake, I just say that for now, I have no prove that it was not.  :-\

Quote
Ismael is the first person in world to get and governnemt labratory to confirm OVERUNITY OPERATION, and this is is an old beat up amp-hog forklift motor that is making the power at the wheels - and the MEG powers the forklift motor.
Ok, but I know too the country where he leave, and my last daughter is Filipinas. It's not like the CNRS in France, or the MIT, I can ensure you that! there are very pride people in this country who can do many things to sustain their own people to the face of the world. And I've seen several times the vids, and sorry, I'm far to be convinced, sorry Kone.

Quote
Like I said Ismael is NOT open-source,
As, I wrote you: I have no problem at all with that, Kone. he can keep his secrets on how it works,  but he can or not really prove the overunity, and for me, he hasn't so far, as I couldn't check the value of his caps.

Quote
he has many investors and can only show this and that of the total picture -   and so dont expect to have answers for all your questions from him (or me)
What "all" Kone, don't dramatize please! I had only 1 and it was not to know anything of his concept, but just to know the value of his caps! do you think it's something form which he really depends in any case for his concept? he far much more in his vid than this very little detail! but if not important, and if with no significance because he has nothing to hide about THE RESULTS, not the principles, so why not answering and so free the person of any doubts?! :/

Quote
and he doesnt really care (nor do I) if people are not satisfied with his videos or data or expect alot more scientific confirmation in order for them to "beleive it".

So why to make all these advertisements he made if he de didn't care? and why, while he were supposed to have since near 1year now, a millionaire investor in US, he didn't made progresses, and even said in a vid he can't achieve more? But ok, he could be right, he could be true, but for me, I'm not about to say it's a proved overunity when I'm not agree with that statement.
I'm far to be "a believer", in terms of sciences and technics. Could be I'm not skill at all in electronics, but in terms of energy, "genie energetic design", I have few skills and experiences, especially in heat pumps, and about process, measurements, checking, too.
As I could see you're friend with Ismael, ans well, it is probably enough too grand him for honesty. But it's ok, if you no more want to share me your experience and your understanding in free energy, it's ok with me. But my integrity makes me say the things as I see them, I'm sorry. And what I see here, it's a big DOUBT (not a fake...), enough to maintain my decision to not care of his work until more sustainable proofs for my own point of view.

Quote
The tests by the DOE lab confirm overunity so find anyone else in the world who has done anything like that.
Ok, it's your opinion and you have perfectly the right to have it, Kone, even if yes, could be he had a interesting way to test, but sorry, I've seen nothing that prove the overunity in that experiment, by lake of duration and data on the characteristics of the caps. give me a forklift and I'll put 2 batteries in parallel and you'll will see if the motor won't be "more efficient"! and forklift are used to be move by batteries for hours and with very heavy loads in terms of kg. and I would have same result with caps added to a battery, while we already use special super-caps in automobile industry to run electrical cars.
but any way, I don't think I could say anything that could change your mind, and unless having the long run I had expected, I don't think we could reach any agreement.
Cheer, Khwartz.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on February 08, 2012, 07:13:43 AM
not going to continue the discussion on this with you sorry.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Khwartz on February 08, 2012, 10:44:07 PM
not going to continue the discussion on this with you sorry.
No problem, we all have right to have our own point of view and we can respect that  ;) Just I wish for Ismael his right any way :)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on February 09, 2012, 02:40:50 AM
In my opinion governments usually provide pretty enough educated scientists to do their job
I guess, PesWiki contains pretty ample amount of information about Ismael Aviso's invention and tests done by government's scientists:
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Ismael_Aviso_Self-Charging_Electric_Car
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on February 09, 2012, 07:57:26 AM
hi Khwartz
I dont think people have a right to opinions made public about other people that are completely false and imaginary.
ciaoK
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 21, 2012, 07:21:42 AM
Hi. I am very interested in this technology and I will be doing some experiments in the coil shorting area.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wC6aglJ6a_8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wC6aglJ6a_8)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 21, 2012, 07:50:38 PM
Ismael:

In your clip you claim that when you short a coil and then collect the energy in a capacitor using an FWBR that you get three times the energy collected in the capacitor as compared to the energy that was put into the coil.

Show us some proof please.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 22, 2012, 07:54:35 PM
a peak coil shorting experiment is simple to do - do it yourself if you want real proof or look at Ismaels 133% eff electric car tested by Filipino DOE in lab on peswiki (his MEG powering the car uses coil-shorting tech) if you want official government-lab tested proof...
the DC cap in coil-shorting experiment will go to X20 voltage over short period of time, and X3 voltage instantly.
Three times more voltage in cap and at discharge into load you will have three times more power.
If magnets induce coils at 60hz have coil-short event occure for no more than .5milliseconds - do short at sinewave peak and wiht that ratio of pulsewidthh-of-short to freqeuncy and it wont affect draw to motor spinnnng magnet-rotor at all.
 
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 22, 2012, 11:03:16 PM
Konehead:

Quote
a peak coil shorting experiment is simple to do - do it yourself if you want real proof or look at Ismaels 133% eff electric car tested by Filipino DOE in lab on peswiki (his MEG powering the car uses coil-shorting tech) if you want official government-lab tested proof...

The burden is on Ismael to prove his claims.  Let him do it, not me.  You have already read the rebuttals to the Filipino DOE lab tests in this thread.

Here are some good comments from PESN:

http://pesn.com/2012/05/15/9602093_Aviso_Demonstrates_Self-Looped_Generator_for_Philippine_International_TV/

Quote
The only discrepancy was between the power measured as drawn from the batteries which averaged 307W versus the dynamometer average of 403W.  If one is familiar with dynamometers that apparent energy gain is easily seen as low-range offset error in the torque transducer.  The dynamometer at UPME is reated at 260KW.  The 100W discrepancy corresponds to 0.038% Full-scale error on the dynamometer.  It is way below the instrument accuracy.  Consequently, there is no reliable evidence that the motor delivered anymore mechanical power than drawn from the batteries.  There was no evidence of anything unusual.

In plain English you can't use a dynamometer designed to measure up to 260 Kw to measure 300 watts.  This is a known issue with many comparable measuring devices; you can't accurately measure very very small values as compared to the full-scale measurement capability of the device.

Quote
the DC cap in coil-shorting experiment will go to X20 voltage over short period of time, and X3 voltage instantly.
Three times more voltage in cap and at discharge into load you will have three times more power.

I don't know why you would say this because you know that measuring voltage without factoring in current is meaningless.

Quote
If magnets induce coils at 60hz have coil-short event occure for no more than .5milliseconds - do short at sinewave peak and wiht that ratio of pulsewidthh-of-short to freqeuncy and it wont affect draw to motor spinnnng magnet-rotor at all.

I disagree with you.  What I will say is that in many cases if you draw a small amount of energy from a spinning rotor, that the change in speed of the rotor will be imperceptible with your human senses.

So, my question still stands, wee need proof of Ismael's claim and that should be done by Ismael himself.  He needs to do a full proper bench test to prove his claim.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 23, 2012, 12:53:35 AM
Konehead:

The burden is on Ismael to prove his claims.  Let him do it, not me.  You have already read the rebuttals to the Filipino DOE lab tests in this thread.

Here are some good comments from PESN:

http://pesn.com/2012/05/15/9602093_Aviso_Demonstrates_Self-Looped_Generator_for_Philippine_International_TV/ (http://pesn.com/2012/05/15/9602093_Aviso_Demonstrates_Self-Looped_Generator_for_Philippine_International_TV/)

In plain English you can't use a dynamometer designed to measure up to 260 Kw to measure 300 watts.  This is a known issue with many comparable measuring devices; you can't accurately measure very very small values as compared to the full-scale measurement capability of the device.

I don't know why you would say this because you know that measuring voltage without factoring in current is meaningless.

I disagree with you.  What I will say is that in many cases if you draw a small amount of energy from a spinning rotor, that the change in speed of the rotor will be imperceptible with your human senses.

So, my question still stands, wee need proof of Ismael's claim and that should be done by Ismael himself.  He needs to do a full proper bench test to prove his claim.

MileHigh

"The burden is on Ismael to prove his claims.  Let him do it, not me.  You have already read the rebuttals to the Filipino DOE lab tests in this thread."

Really? Says who?  You?   :]  keep dreamin  Rebuttals?  Are they rebuttals that are backed up by testing? Or are those rebutts just talkin? ? 
Well I demand that those rebutters bare their burden of proofs, or, or, Ill just be really really mad at dem. Yea, vewee angwee.  ;]

"I don't know why you would say this because you know that measuring voltage without factoring in current is meaningless.
"
Again and again, you must not have read the comment you are answering here and just assuming, again, or you know exactly what was stated and offering argument in favor of your own views. So which is it M?  You very well know that a measure of voltage in a "cap" that it is unnecessary to figure in current to know the value of energy stored in that cap over a period of time.  Cmom M. You know better. ;]  Dont you?  Isnt this what has been discussed in the tar baby thread, that you spend a lot of time in? ;] Hmmm?

"So, my question still stands, wee need proof of Ismael's claim and that should be done by Ismael himself.  He needs to do a full proper bench test to prove his claim."

Again, more demands?  Or what? People cant make a thread here and talk about it? Again, says who? You?  (I Chuckle)  You are simply amazing. I mean that sincerely. ;]

Mags

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 23, 2012, 01:48:44 AM
Mags:

Ismael makes a claim in his clip that his circuit will give you back three times the energy over what you put in.

I left the capacitor issue in an oversimplified form.  Voltage, current, capacitance are all meaningless unless you talk about energy in vs. energy out, or average power in vs. average power out.

So I am asking Ismael to back up his claim with data and to show us how he makes his measurements, etc.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 23, 2012, 02:22:43 AM
Mags:

Ismael makes a claim in his clip that his circuit will give you back three times the energy over what you put in.

I left the capacitor issue in an oversimplified form.  Voltage, current, capacitance are all meaningless unless you talk about energy in vs. energy out, or average power in vs. average power out.

So I am asking Ismael to back up his claim with data and to show us how he makes his measurements, etc.

MileHigh


Kone said...

the DC cap in coil-shorting experiment will go to X20 voltage over short period of time, and X3 voltage instantly.
Three times more voltage in cap and at discharge into load you will have three times more power.

MH, why is it that you saying now....

I left the capacitor issue in an oversimplified form.  Voltage, current, capacitance are all meaningless unless you talk about energy in vs. energy out, or average power in vs. average power out.

M. In the claim, he is charging the drive battery while powering a load(the car).
I know you want proof and now. But that is totally up to Ismael, whenever he is ready to do so. So I guess once he does produce papers and data, then it will be time to examine that and make arguments for or against the claim. But even then, would you believe it? ;]
So at that point, one would have to build it to prove or disprove the claim. But will you? ;]

As above, you say that you "asked".  But in the previous post, it was "he needs to show".  I can see the difference.  ;]

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 23, 2012, 02:47:24 AM
Mags:

I am not talking about the car project.  I am talking about the clip Ismael linked to a few postings back where he draws a simplified schematic and makes his free energy claim.  It's just four or five postings back, Ismael's last posting.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 23, 2012, 03:09:55 AM
Mags:

I am not talking about the car project.  I am talking about the clip Ismael linked to a few postings back where he draws a simplified schematic and makes his free energy claim.  It's just four or five postings back, Ismael's last posting.

MileHigh

Ismael is Kehyo77?  Hmm.  If this were so, why would Kehyo77 say this about Ismaels circuit and vid presented in the post?
"Hi. I am very interested in this technology and I will be doing some experiments in the coil shorting area."

And, the car does use the shorting tech. This was explained a while ago.

Mags

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 23, 2012, 03:14:44 AM
He probably is not Ismael.  I just looked at the YT date on the clip and assumed it was a brand new upload by Ismael himself.  Needless to say, the questions are directed at Ismael.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 23, 2012, 03:15:58 AM
@MileHigh

Hi.
It wasn't  Ismael making that post... It is mine entry :D
And if You do not recognize that clip being a part of Ismael's presentation
where he tries to prove that claim on video then You have to watch it carefully.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10JY4agHjE4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10JY4agHjE4)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEtxb6skBCE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEtxb6skBCE)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrbChoUe7B4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrbChoUe7B4)
Having seen this footage I conclude that his basic experiment proves it.
Output capacitor bank is charged up to 1000VDC in this setup, while using his "black box".
An inverter, using about the same input power, is able to charge it only to 330VDC.
So he says it is 3x more, where in reality it is 9 TIMES MORE!!! ( E=0.5*C*V^2)...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 23, 2012, 02:03:58 PM
Kehyo77:

I only watched the first clip, the others are too long.

Quote
Having seen this footage I conclude that his basic experiment proves it.
Output capacitor bank is charged up to 1000VDC in this setup, while using his "black box".
An inverter, using about the same input power, is able to charge it only to 330VDC.
So he says it is 3x more, where in reality it is 9 TIMES MORE!!! ( E=0.5*C*V^2)...   

The voltage you can charge a capacitor bank to has nothing to do with the energy in vs. energy out or the average power in vs. the average power out.

Ismael is not credible and I apologize for mistaking you for Ismael.  We can expect that we will never see Ismael back up his free energy claims about the coil shorting with serious measurements and hard evidence.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 23, 2012, 02:14:27 PM
@MileHigh



So how do You propose to measure Pin vs Pout using the simplest method available to me?
I do not have fancy equipment but I'd like to be able to do proper measurements
in coil shorting experiments... (My handheld scope has got one channel only and I'm in possession of only one multimeter).
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 23, 2012, 04:25:01 PM
Kehyo77:

Your question can't be answered with a few sentences.  You should start a thread and ask for help from the people in the forum.  I am assuming that you are a beginner in electronics so you will need it.

If you plan to work with that schematic you posted then I am assuming that you can already describe how you think the energy in vs. energy out can be measured.  Don't take your eye off the ball and start discussing all sorts of things that aren't even related to what you are trying to accomplish.  As a minimum you would want to construct a full timing diagram for your circuit and unfortunately things like that are beyond the capabilities of most of the regular contributors to the forum.  The key to understanding your circuit and the energy or average power will be in the timing diagram.

Good luck.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: WilbyInebriated on June 23, 2012, 04:47:18 PM
In plain English you can't use a dynamometer designed to measure up to 260 Kw to measure 300 watts.  This is a known issue with many comparable measuring devices; you can't accurately measure very very small values as compared to the full-scale measurement capability of the device.
you idiot... you don't know jack shit about dyno's do you...

prove your asinine claim that a chassis dyno can't be used.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 23, 2012, 05:25:13 PM
Quote
you idiot... you don't know jack shit about dyno's do you...

prove your asinine claim that a chassis dyno can't be used.

You moron, I don't know jack shit about dynos but I have read by comments by people that I believe to be credible.

Let Ismael prove that the chassis dyno can be used.

Do you believe that the test done at the Filipino DOT was legit and credible Wil-beast?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 23, 2012, 07:10:43 PM
Mile HIGH
please start your own thread if you have purpose here of dicrediting Ismael with the power of your opinons and ignorant ovservations.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 23, 2012, 07:32:51 PM
mile HIGH
your quote:
"I don't know why you would say this because you know that measuring voltage without factoring in current is meaningless."
duh
maybe you should understand stuff first:
caps fill up UNLOADED from the coil-shroting event
current "appears" when caps hit load. It can be measuered in watts in form of joules-release
when you  have 3 times more voltage in cap hitting load you have three times more power into whatever load it appens to hit.
the unloaded caps DO fill up X20 in voltage ove rperiod of few seconds. do the experiment look at you tube stuff showing it done in simple expereiments
coil-shorting does not work if caps have load alreday across them - output is in two-stage process...caps fill up, caps hit load when caps disocnnect from coils so coils never see load - this is very common and smple way to discharge capacitors to load.
also the dynaometer tests were accurate and fact they can go to different "scales" is meanianigless and is something skeptics will think up grabbing for stuff in the dark (like you are) - dynometers measure HP at the wheels in fact lots of power is wasted before it gets there so the MEG that powers that forklift motor is way more effeicent that 33% OU
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 23, 2012, 07:47:33 PM
Hy mile HIGH
your quote:
"The voltage you can charge a capacitor bank to has nothing to do with the energy in vs. energy out or the average power in vs. the average power out."
WRONG
what you have in voltage in cap that discharges to aload has everything to do with what the power/watts is in the output of a system that uses a cap discharge as the power-event.
If the input is a capacitive-discharged one, then same thing with input. (or if input happens to be Hp-watts measured in dyonmeter at DOE lab that is other case)
Ismael fills caps UNLOADED then disconnects cap from coils being shorted, tand lets caps hit load with that "source" disconnected - this is called a two stage output circuit.
look at diode plug circuit below for idea what I am talking about...this is similar to how Ismael gathers power into caps from his MEG, and how Ismael lets loose that stored-power into the load )forklift motor in his car) note that the source (coils being shorted at peaks in case of the MEG) nver sees the load, it only fills up capacitors:
if you want to LEARN anything erase your erroneous preconceptions first or you will stumble down wrong path of what-is-the-truth as you are now doing
 
 
DUH
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 23, 2012, 07:59:42 PM
Konehead:

I am very familiar with electronics.

We need to check energy in vs. energy out, or average power in vs. average power out.

You are not discussing the energy in or the average power in.  What is your measurement for that?

Also, I am willing to bet both of us are not experts on dynamometers.  So neither of us can say if the DOT dyno measurement is accurate when the measured load is 0.115% of the maximum load the dyno can measure, can we?

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 24, 2012, 06:13:24 AM
@MileHigh

I am very familiar with electronics too.


I've just finished soldering my coil shorting module.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 24, 2012, 06:18:10 AM
@MileHigh

I am very familiar with electronics too.


I've just finished soldering my coil shorting module.

Nice Kehyo

But didnt Ismael say that there were shorting transistors in parallel to get down to .0028 ohm shorting resistance?  Unless you are trying something else.

Good to see someone doing it.  ;]

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 24, 2012, 06:35:55 AM
Thanks Magluvin.


This module is capable of driving many parallel MOSFETs or IGBTs.
Peak driver current is 9A. I've got really good IGBTs right now and paralleling them might not be necessery
as it all comes down to low resistance of the shorting "contact" according to Ismael. IGBTs are better in that respect.
My thoughts on this is the dv/dt switching time plays even more important role than the really low resistance.
With this config I am able to short ends of a coil with a  potential difference of 1000V with 25ns rise/fall time :D
Anyway we will see...
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 24, 2012, 06:39:16 AM
Nice.  ;]

Will it be shorting multiple times near or at the peak?

Mags

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 24, 2012, 06:45:29 AM
Yes, multiple times with a freely adjustable time window starting at any given point on a sine wave.
Easy to implement when you are dealing with constant frequency using some zero crossing detection circuit triggering hardware interrupt on arduino...
Piece of cake :D
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 24, 2012, 07:01:43 AM
Yes, multiple times with a freely adjustable time window starting at any given point on a sine wave.
Easy to implement when you are dealing with constant frequency using some zero crossing detection circuit triggering hardware interrupt on arduino...
Piece of cake :D

Ive been wanting to try one of those Arduino. RS has 2 kits. Maybe Ill grab one to check them out.

Cant wait to see what you come up with.  Good luck.  ;]

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Groundloop on June 24, 2012, 07:08:52 AM
Thanks Magluvin.


This module is capable of driving many parallel MOSFETs or IGBTs.
Peak driver current is 9A. I've got really good IGBTs right now and paralleling them might not be necessery
as it all comes down to low resistance of the shorting "contact" according to Ismael. IGBTs are better in that respect.
My thoughts on this is the dv/dt switching time plays even more important role than the really low resistance.
With this config I am able to short ends of a coil with a  potential difference of 1000V with 25ns rise/fall time :D
Anyway we will see...

@kEhYo77,

Thanks for posting the circuit drawing at Reply #209.
Are you willing to post the component values/numbers also?

Nice circuit BTW. :-)

GL.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 24, 2012, 08:17:02 AM
Hi Groundloop.

Now with components.

kEhYo

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Groundloop on June 24, 2012, 12:10:43 PM
Hi Groundloop.

Now with components.

kEhYo

@kEhYo77,

Thank you for posting components values. :-)

GL.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 24, 2012, 07:24:19 PM
to all:
important to use paralell MOSFETS, not transisitors, in coil shorting circuits like what Ismael shows in that video with hand-drawings...mosfets are lower resistance and also paralell easily.
to mile too-HIGH:
yes I am familiar with electronics too, so is practically eveyrone here. glad you admit you really know nothing about dynometers so what you say in criticscm about Ismael being tested in DOE lab in Philipines is something to ignore completely. 
the testing is on video if you want to watch it, and the testing results are published if you want to read them....if you dont, then you should not write about stuff you know nothing about and only conjecture and opinionate.
cap discharge formula to figure WATTS:
FARAD value of cap / 2
X
(maximum voltage in cap SQUARED) - (voltage in cap after discharge SQUARED)
X
discharge-events PER SECOND = WATTS
this is how you figure out how much power you have from discharging caps to load...use a scope. for this
 
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 24, 2012, 08:06:41 PM
Konehead:

I didn't ask you about the output measurement, I asked you about the input measurement.  So what about the input?

As far as the dynamometer goes my instincts are good and they are probably right.  Plus I have read several comments with the same line of reasoning.  Basically all of us with any experience in electronics have observed and are aware of this phenomenon.  Just take the example of a digital multimeter, the lower the value on the display the less accurate the measurement is.

I saw those clips from about a year ago.  There was no proper description of how they measured the input power either, and you probably needed a DSO to do it properly.  Without a DSO it could have been be a very difficult measurement to make.   So for that DOT test both the input power measurement and the output power measurement are suspect.  On top of that, if he really had a working over unity system based on coil shorting, there was no reason at all to put it in a car.  The logical thing to do would have been to put the circuit on a bench and do the measurements there.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 24, 2012, 09:16:39 PM

 @ Anyone interested in playing with this, here is a little bit of ArduinoUNO code for my Coil Shorting Module to do its thing.
 One just needs to hook up 4 pots to analog input pins 1-4; pin 10 is the output to the CSM; pin 2,5 input from zero crossing detector (from Schmitt trigger)
 
Quote
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// COIL SHORTING v1.0 /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
 ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// by kEhYo77@gmail.com ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
 
 const int plsPin = 5;                                                  // dedicated pin for using hardware counter to measure triggering frequency
 const int csmPin = 10;                                               // signal pin output to control COIL SHORTING MODULE (CSM)
 const int int0Pin = 2;                                                // dedicated pin for using hardware interrupt 0
 const int delayPot = 1;                                              // potentiometer for setting the delay period before the shorting starts to occure
 const int countPot = 2;                                              // potentiometer for setting the number of shorting pulses per trigger event
 const int pulsePot = 3;                                              // potentiometer for setting the pulse width of shorting event
 const int bemfPot = 4;                                               // potentiometer for setting the period to collect BEMF from the shorting event
 
 unsigned int count;
 unsigned int shtDelay = 0;                                       // time window delaying shorting sequence after zero crossing detection trigger
 unsigned int shtPulse = 0;                                       // time window for coil shorting pulse width
 unsigned int shtBEMF = 0;                                       // time window for BEMF recovery from shorting the coil
 unsigned int shtCount = 0;                                       // number of shorting events per trigger
 unsigned int frequency = 0;                                      // zero crossing detector triggering frequency from the hardware counter
 unsigned int val = 0;                                                 // temp storage for value
 unsigned int pot = 0;                                                // temp storage for pot value
 volatile boolean pulseON = false;                            // variable that can be changed from within the interrupt function
 
 //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// INITIALISATION ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
 
 void setup() {
   pinMode(csmPin, OUTPUT);                                   // preparing output pin for coil shorting module ON/OFF control
   digitalWrite(csmPin, LOW);                                   // CSM is OFF which means that the coil has 'OPEN' ends
   pinMode(plsPin, INPUT);                                       // preparing the pin for input
   digitalWrite(plsPin, HIGH);                                    // hardware counter setup for counting input pulses
   pinMode(int0Pin, INPUT);                                      // preparing the pin for input to trigger hardware interrupt 0
   
   bitClear(ADCSRA,ADPS0);                                     //  \
   bitClear(ADCSRA,ADPS1);                                    //   } running analog pot inputs with higher than normal speed clock (set prescale to 16)
   bitSet(ADCSRA,ADPS2);                                       //  /
   
   TCCR1A=0;                                                          // reset timer/counter control register & starting the clock counting pulses from pin 5 input
   getCount();                                                         // getting the value from the hardware trigger counter on pin 5
   
   attachInterrupt(0, trigger, RISING);                    // enables INT0 interrupt on Pin 2 input to execute CSM turn ON/OFF cycle
   
   Serial.begin(115200);                                         // send and receive through USB serial port at 9600 baud rate
 
 
 ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// MAIN  LOOP //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
 
 void loop() {
   
   if (millis()%1000==0) {                                              // executed when a real time clock reaches full second (every second)
   
     frequency = getCount();                                              // triggering frequency readout from the hardware counter
   
     pot = analogRead(delayPot)/2;                                              // setting the delay time window of the coil shorting event
     if (pot==0 && shtDelay!=0) shtDelay=0;
     shtDelay = pot;
     
     pot = analogRead(countPot)/128;                                              // setting the pulse width of a coil shorting event
     if (pot==0 && shtCount!=0) shtCount=0;
     shtCount = pot;
   
     pot = analogRead(pulsePot)/64;                                              // setting the pulse width of a coil shorting event
     if (pot==0 && shtPulse!=0) shtPulse=0;
     shtPulse = pot;
     
     pot = analogRead(bemfPot)/32;                                              // setting the time window for BEMF recovery
     if (pot==0 && shtBEMF!=0) shtBEMF=0;
     shtBEMF = pot;
   }
     
   if (millis()%3000==0) { // executed every 3 seconds
     
     Serial.print("pulseCOUNT: ");
     Serial.println(shtCount);                                              // prints the shorting pulse count in serial monitor
     Serial.print("pulseWIDTH: ");
     Serial.println(shtPulse);                                              // prints the shorting pulse width
     Serial.print("windowBEMF: ");
     Serial.println(shtBEMF);                                              // prints the shorting pulse width for BEMF recovery
     Serial.print("tFREQUENCY: ");
     Serial.println(frequency);                                              // prints the triggering frequency
     Serial.println("");
   }
   
  //---------------------------------------------- executed X times whenever there was a trigger event ----------------------------------------------//
 
 
   if (shtPulse!=0 && shtBEMF!=0 && shtCount!=0 && pulseON) {    // do the shorting when every pot's value is bigger than 0 and trere was a trigger event
 
 
     for (int k=0; k<=shtDelay; k++){                                                      // time delay before the shorting event
       val = analogRead(0);                                                                        // 'blank' readout that takes 'some' time to execute
     }
 
     for (int j=1; j<=shtCount; j++){                                                         // do the shorting X times
        for (int i=0; i<=10; i++){                                                                 // do the coil shorting, output goes HIGH
           bitSet(PORTB, csmPin -8);                                                         // the quickest way to turn the output pin HIGH
             for (int x=0; x<=shtPulse; x++) {
             val = analogRead(0);                                                                  // 'blank' readout that takes 'some' time to execute
             }
           bitClear(PORTB, csmPin -8);                                                      // output goes LOW for a period of BEMF recovery value
             for (int x=0; x<=shtBEMF; x++) {
             val = analogRead(0);
             }
         }
     }
     pulseON = false;                                                        // ends shorting sequence, resets the trigger variable
   }
 
 }
 
 ///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// End of the MAIN LOOP /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
 
 
 void trigger() {                                              // function executed at trigger event
   pulseON = true;
 }
 
 
 unsigned long getCount()  {                                              // returns the current count of pulses from pin 5, resets the count, and starts counting again 
   TCCR1B = 0;                                                           // Gate Off / Counter Tn stopped
   count = TCNT1;
   TCNT1 = 0;
   bitSet(TCCR1B ,CS12);                                           // Counter Clock source is external pin
   bitSet(TCCR1B ,CS11);                                          // Clock on rising edge
   bitSet(TCCR1B ,CS10);                                          // you can clear this bit for falling edge
   return count;
 }
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: WilbyInebriated on June 25, 2012, 01:42:21 AM
You moron, I don't know jack shit about dynos but I have read by comments by people that I believe to be credible.
you mental midget... if you don't know jack shit about dynos (by your own admission) then there is no way for you to know if someone is "credible" when they speak of dynos... ::)  again, tu  stultus es!

Let Ismael prove that the chassis dyno can be used.
NO. YOU are the uneducated dolt saying it can't be used... YOU PROVE YOUR CLAIM... the burden is not on ismael over the dyno, it is on you.

Do you believe that the test done at the Filipino DOT was legit and credible Wil-beast?
what i "believe" is none of your business you troll...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 25, 2012, 02:18:35 AM
I stand by what I said and you can kiss my ass if you don't like it you slimy bitch.  You go to back to the cesspool Wil-beast you grotesque burping and farting little Chet-monster.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfggccwQrcY

Making you unhappy makes grovelling snotty little Wil-beast happy.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 25, 2012, 07:54:16 AM
hey Mile too-high
The DOE lab doesnt rely on instinct to do measurements of input power in HP and watts at the wheels in Ismaels car.   
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 25, 2012, 08:06:09 AM
Konehead:

How much do you know about dynos?

More importantly, this is now the third time I am asking you about the input energy or the average input power measurement.  What is your response?

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 25, 2012, 08:19:57 AM
hi KeHyo77
this is very interesting coil-shorting thing you have - have you got it going?? any test results yet??
AS far as I know, Ismaels causes the coils to ring first, in oscillations, with a single very quick coil-short at sinewave peak, using very low resistance bank of paralell HV mosfets...
Mabye he has them in bidirectional- mode (gates and source leads connect so that they swtihc AC) not sure if he does this for sure, but if not he should be....
Then after the oscillation-rings happen form that initial quick coil short, he then shorts the PEAKS OF THE OSCILLATIONS THEMSELVES.....so the ringing now doesn "decay" instead in increases expontnetionally... He told me when I was in Sweden with him, that he shorts 5 times at peaks in his coil-blaster stuff (he didnt have the MEG then)
Ismael told me recently that caps must discharge to be at ZERO volts....they cant have any "polarity" (?)  or differnt resistance other than what the caps are at zero-volts, or he says that the system wont collect the ambeint-energy (for some reason) ... he says this makes it difficult and tricky  to tune/design the system for particular loads and frequency of output-pulsing etc etc...anyways dopnt know if this infor will help or hinder you, but its what he told me.
Also I am wondering if your coil-shorting circuit has a two-stage output to it?? or is it jsut fill up caps at this stage??
I am working on a "diode-plug" type output for my coil shorting generators....so instead of a FWBR captureing the HV rings into caps, with four diodes, instead I want to do it with single diode into capA and another single diode faciing opposite into capB...then caps A and cap B hit load in alternating fashion....reason this is good is whtn you do two-stage type circuit and you have to disconnect coils from caps when caps hit load, at that time, the coils arent filling up so you lose power-to-be-gathering into caps, during the time the cpas discharge. so its not as effecient as didoe-plug, plus might cause some EMF or some crazy problems of disocnnecting circuit filling caps suddenly too....
with diode-plug type cirucit a cap is always filling either from pos peak shoritng or neg peak being shorted so you could say its 100% effecienct in collecting pwoer into caps, even at cap discharge-event too.
also I did a bunch of testing and to make it totally non reflecitve in extra draw to primary/prmime mover, you need "ratio" of pulse with of .5ms to coil shrot if 60hz sinewave as example...so if 120hz , .25ms sinewave etc etc....on shorting the peaks of the ringings, I dont know what that would be yet - havent got that far but it must be very short time period...
 
also I have a circuit Ron P in canada came up with that finds peaks, adjsutst for peak-capture period (pulse width) then chops up this capture period during peak too - then this can trigger mosfets...maybe you cna imcorporate this into your circuit I dont know - but this is how I would "imitate" Ismael's trick of shorting the peaks of the ringing....
 
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 25, 2012, 08:37:46 AM
mile too-high
my response to you is you are wasting everyones time here including your own posting trash calling people childish names.
If  I was the moderator in this thread, I would ban you from posting after your last post calling someone a fart-monster or whatever it was...that was really stupid childish and lame.
So read up on Ismaels stuff and study it if you want to criticize constructively....so far you havent done that and you are only being an "opinionted-obvserver" right now with no knowledge whatsoever of what you are talking about.
if you want to read up on dyno-testing wheels of a car for HP, look it up on wikipedia etc and google it dont ask me to asnwer your questions on stuff you know nothing about use a search engine for yourself.
If you want to prove that the filipino DOE messed up the HP tests of Ismaels car, write to them ask what machine it was, what the settings were and all that....burden of proof is on you.
Ismael already "proved it" taking it to that lab....he is first person in world to get a goevernment lab and engineers to actually say officially something is "overunity"...and this is a amp-hog forkdlift motor too (pwoered by MEG) , power was measured at wheels, which is lots of loss byt the time the rubber meets the rollers in the machine, and the car was powered by single fairly small 12V battery too....easy to do input - its ammeter on battery seeing how fast it drains in amps.
 
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 25, 2012, 09:17:00 AM
Konehead:

So you refuse to answer the question about the input energy or average input power.  In my opinion you can't do it.  Nor do I believe that Ismael can.  The reason I asked you about your knowledge of dynos is because in earlier postings you made definitive pronouncements that the results were legitimate.  I am assuming that you are just like me, and you don't know one way or the other.  Therefore you earlier statements are invalid.

Without an input power measurement any claims of over unity, like Ismael stated that he got 3X output over input, are bogus.

These questions are real and they are not wasting anybody's time.  All readers to this site that hear about allegations of an electronic circuit producing over unity are by definition interested in the input and output power measurements.  That's what this site is all about and just "pretending" that you can ignore doing the difficult input power measurements and then only making the easy output power measurements and then proclaiming over unity is not going to cut it.  If you are serious about your research then then you have to make both measurements.

I have a pretty good knowledge of Ismael and I am aware of what he has been doing for a while.  You look at that DOT test, can you imagine what some of the pitfalls and problems could have been?  Both the input and the output power measurements are highly suspect.  Where is the vehicle right now?  What happened to the million charging stations by the end of 2011?

The burden of proof is on Ismael - extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.  All we saw were some bewildered Filipino DOT employees have an incredibly low-power electric car roll into their DOT test station built to measure the miles per gallon and the exhaust emissions for normal gas-powered vehicles with normal output power levels.  Most of them stood by while Ismael's team set things up.  There was no credible documentation for the input power measurement and the dyno simply wasn't designed to measure that low an output power level.  That is a reasonable assumption.  I am just telling you what I saw.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 25, 2012, 09:40:45 AM
Konehead:

I am sure that you are aware that Wilby has a notorious reputation for harassing and intimidating people.  Hence the reply.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 25, 2012, 08:19:33 PM
Quote
Ismael told me recently that caps must discharge to be at ZERO volts....they cant have any "polarity" (?)  or differnt resistance other than what the caps are at zero-volts, or he says that the system wont collect the ambeint-energy (for some reason) ... 


Some good info here, thanks konehead.
My schematic is preliminary and I already knew that I have to short the BEMF oscillations themselves. And yes, I've been thinking about two stage output as well.
I didn't want the to make the schematic too complicated so it is not there yet.
Electronic diode plug sounds interesting, I will be checking out this idea for sure.
 
I am familiar with the circuit for shorting as I have built it. What I found is that in the end stage the oscillator doesn't do what I wanted,
so I replaced it with 555+393 for more accurate control of shorting. My Arduino code does the same thing as that modified circuit.

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 25, 2012, 08:58:54 PM
hey Mile too-high
I did tell you what  the INPUT to Ismaels car is.
It runs on single 12V battery, that is its only source of power. you should know this if you studied up on it, and you should know the draw from the battery is the obvious answer to what the input is.
wnen something is overunity you can look at it as there is "no" source of power, (where does it come from ambient?) 
but in case of this electic car he has single 12V battery or it wont work at all so it "runs" on that.
so obviously you would measure the amp draw from it,
or the drop in charge over time with hydrometer,
or how long it can run the car befroe it goes dead, and figure the watts-consumed knowing the amp-hour rating of the battery,
all this like you would do with anything running off a 12V battery...take your pick which way they will all come out the same in watts comsumed from battery.
His MEG is a capacitive-discharge unit too, so I even gave you the formula to figure WATTS form that too,
so I gave you two methods of measuring input, either from the "source" (the battery) or the input "out" of the MEG whihc goes INTO  the forklift motor.
So I answered your quesiton TWICE and now  have answered it again in more detail.
Hope you are happy now but doubt it - you do not understand Ismaels MEG system pworeing his car, and you will have to really study alot on it and do some experiemtns of your own on peak coil shorting before you do. 
If you did expeiments with coil-shoritn at peaks you will see you get 3time more power and it doesnt reflect back to source too, when this power is made soits an overunity method of extracing poer from energized coils simnple as that. Ismael has expanded upon it, make it high frequency and high voltage and its very amazing what he has done.
I have talked peresonally on phone with Ismael alot about this DOE test before it and after it, and know how long it took him for them to get into the lab, (about a year) and that he had to meet with all engineers before hand and make them fully understand his system, (took a full day) and I also talked to him alot on the input measurements, and gave that same formula to Ismel to double check with what the cap-discharge is too in watts.
I dont think for a second that they did a bad job in the testing of it - they are govenment DOE lab and they dont put out bogus and inaccurate measuremnts. If they did they would all be fired.
Those dynometers are incremental in there meausrments of things and can do motorcycles and small stuff like three wheel meter-maid use would use I am sure...if they could NOT measure accurate, the DOE would of SAID SO....they arent "working" for Ismael...they are engineers and test stuff legitimate.
the power that his MEG puts out is way more than 133% eff too - there is so much mechanical and rotational loss in that electical car with forklfit  motor it gets "watered down" to only 133% effecient.
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 25, 2012, 09:34:02 PM
Hi Keh077
jsut to elaborate on the zero-volts thing, it has to do with fact that as capacitors fill up, the resistance in them changes as they fill plus fact the polariztion of cap changes resitacne form non-polarized state too.
when they discharge, the reistance in them changes too of course too...but Ismeal needs to take that voltage all the way down to zero upon a discharge-event.
Ismaels systems are all VERY resonate-condition based, so if resistance jsut changes a small bit, the whole thing goes out of whack easy and this control of cap resistance is very important...and is one reaosn fro "why" the zero volts the caps must be at or they dont fill up as they should.
also it has to do with fact as soon as you have any voltage in cap, now the cap is polarized to be one way (he is filling and discharginn DC caps in MEG as far as I know) and if cap is at zero volts there is "no polarity" to it...not sure exaclty about this but that is general idea I got from him talking on phone with him a few months back....
this all relates to filling up capacitors UNLOADED as you must do, when doing coil-shorting at peaks - you know that if you have any resitance across those caps that fill from the coil-shoritng it snubs away all the HV ringing that happens from the coil-shaort at peak and you get NOTHING happening out of ordinary of filling up cap from induced or energized coils.......this is also why solid state relays, SCRs and transisitors will not work AT ALL doing coil shorting - their resistance is too high, and it snubs it all away, and you get that NOTHING....I could only do coil-shorting with reed swtiches or mechanical brush-commutators for years,  ( Idisconevere id in 2006 with reed swtihces on Mullegenraror coils jsut folling around)
It wasnt unt until Ismael told me a couple years ago to use paralell HV mosfets and it is the high resistance in my SSRs that was killing everything in my feeble attempts,. so after I wnet to paralell HV mosfets, it  now worked perfectly solid state....
anyways what I am getting at is the that "collector"cap's resistance-value is very touchy and sensitive - probably especially when you get into shorting at the peaks of the ringing (!)
and so that is why the must-be-zero volts....and the polarity of the cap being "set up" one way in polarity probably also changes the reistance value of cap very drastically compared to the "zero-votlage" state of a DC cap is my theory on it all, even if it is jsut one or two or even a half-volt volts in cap ...it now will sort of put cap into a polarized-mode, and that polarized-mode has changed resistance drastically as compared to zero-volts non-polarized state (even if DC cap) anyways this is my take and understanding from info Ismael gave me.....could be something else altogether but somethign to chew on at least.
 
On other thing, are thos IGBTs inyour circuit "bidirectional? Isee the ources are connected, but are the gates? I see diodes there...not sure...also could you try out two single didoes facing opposite for purpose filling two sperate DC caps (one from pos phase one form neg phase like diode plug)...this instead of the FWBR you have?
this iswhere I am going next few dasy or this week as I want to do diode-plug output instead of two stage ouptut where "eveything" disconnects whiel cpas output as explained afew posts back......not sure if its going to work or not like FWBR does butit should - it would be good to get 2nd opinion (like my psychiatrisst told me I was crazy so I went to my regular doctor for 2nd opinion and he told me I was ugly too) ha
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on June 25, 2012, 10:21:52 PM
I'd like to ask here something which is important to me but may look a bit offtopic. Is that discharge of capacitor using parallel fet's unidirectional ? Or maybe diferrent question : is it possible without using diodes to have unidirectional discharge from capacitor using FETs or IGBT ?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 25, 2012, 10:42:39 PM
Konehead:

Quote
I did tell you what  the INPUT to Ismaels car is.

I am not talking about that input measurement.  Ismael's car only came up later in the conversation.

Just to deal with that issue, the average current at 12 volts to make 300 watts would be 25 amps.  We have no information on the architecture of the electrical/mechanical power system in the car.  The load on the battery would certainly not look like a purely resistive load and that means that the current would pulse be pulsing.  If 25 amps is the average current then the pulsing current might have peaks of 50 or 75 amps.  High current peaks would cause the battery voltage to drop.

With high amperage current pulses and a non-constant battery voltage that would be a challenge to measure properly.  The real way to make the measurement would be with a digital storage oscilloscope.  There was no sign of a DSO in the clips.  Ismael made no mention of how he made the measurement for the battery output power - which is the input power to the car.  We also know that a digital multimeter can get "scrambled brains" sometimes when trying to make current measurements when the current waveform is pulsing.

So with no explanation or documentation from Ismael on how he made the battery power measurements I have very little confidence that a good measurement was made.  At the same time the people in the DOT lab had no experience or understanding on how to measure the electrical power consumption of an electrical car.  They clearly were not equipped to do that and let Ismael's team make that measurement.

If Ismael had presented clear data and explained exactly how he made the power measurement for the battery it would be a different story.  Unfortunately we have no information at all.  The only thing we have is a claim that the draw on the battery was 300 watts.

These issues cannot simply be avoided or swept under the carpet.  If you are going to make a claim that you have an over unity electric car then you have to present credible data to back it up.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 25, 2012, 11:09:55 PM
Konehead:

Now let me go back to the real discussion:

Kehyo77 posted a clip by Ismael where he sketches a magnet passing by a coil, you short out the coil, then collect the energy in a capacitor with an FWBR.

It's in that clip where he claimed that you can get a three-fold increase in the energy out (or the average power out) as compared to the energy in (or the average power in.)

That's where I stated that Ismael has to show input and output measurements to back up his claim.  If he is a serious researcher, he should already know ahead of time that that is what he has to do.

Then you showed a somewhat similar circuit but you made no specific claims.  But the same concept applies - if your circuit is going to be useful then you have to make input and output measurements on it too.  The challenging measurement is the input measurement.  Even measuring the average power output from the charging capacitors gets a bit tricky as the frequency of operation of the device gets higher.  Hence the same question was directed at you since you posted your schematic diagram.

Again, Ismael made a simplified sketch of a cap pulser circuit that is driven by magnets moving past a pick-up coil and claimed that this circuit outputs three times more energy or average power than you put into the circuit.

If Ismael wants to convince me or anybody else that this is actually true then he has to make properly documented input and output measurements.  You have to do both measurements and show your methodology and your data.

You posted a circuit that is similar in concept to Ismael's circuit so I am suggesting the same request for your setup.

Any statements about how high the voltage you can charge the output caps to and the value of the capacitors is meaningless without a corresponding input power measurement.

So that's what I was asking Ismael and by extension I am asking you too.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 26, 2012, 01:41:31 AM
Mile too-high
the way Ismael ecplained his system to me, is that the battery (the pwoer source) works like a buffer, in that it is IN SERIES off the cap-bank, which discharges from the MEG.
The MEG puts out 600V in cap discharging, and this is what the forklift motor runs on, so the forklift motor is the load - the forklift motor is rated at only 36V, so fact he slams that amount of voltage into it is fairly amazing in itself - hwoever he also shows absloutley no arcing at the brushes, so for that reason, having no recoil/backemf spikes, then he can run that motor on 600V cap discharge from the MEG.
The MEG itself works on the coil-shorting principles and Ismael told me is very similar to the HUBBARD coil, if you want to read up on that...so Hubbard coil with coil-shorting at peaks is what the MEG is, in nutshell.
He has the battery in series from the MEG, since the invertor/step up HV circuit in his MEG will not work or fry if the voltage input exceeds 15V or whatever it is, just like regular invertors, where they shut down above 15V input (or below 10.5V input) so the battery that also runs the whole show, also woks as buffer of sorts too, for his circuits so it has double-purpose....
so he had problems doing input measuremnts totally truthful and legit, and was asking me all about it too in preparation for taking it to that DOE lab and other places....and I gave him that coa discharge formula to help out....basically he has 600V "Behind" that 12V battery and at same time the 12V battery is running the whole show...things go crazy when thigns are OU is what is going on.
He said he had to explain the whole thing to them, and get them to totally understand it first too before the testing and it took a full day, maybe two, jsut to get the engineers up to speed.
What they saw at first was proably unbeleivable - 0 amps input and the like, so him explaining it and sor forth was to make it a good certified-by-DOE scientific test, not a smoke screen to fool people.
I dont really know exactly how they did the watts input, but simce the system will not run without that DC battery, and it is the only source of power really (antannae supplys very small power) so then that battery draining down is the only way to measure the power input and that is what they MUST of been done.
I will guess what they did analog amp meter with some HV filtering on pos of battery to the MEG supplying the 600V cap discharge to forklift motor, and also hydrometer tests (it was lead acid battery) and also battery-dain tests  too - let it go for extended period until it stops which is easy to do....If you dont want to beleive it is real that is your choice but you have burden of proof to proove something "doesnt work" after a DOE lab says it does....really that is top-of-line testing, to take something OU to a DOE lab - betery than university, and certainly better than "rejection and analysis" by internet science board posts from disbeleivers and skeptics.
If you want more info on what nput tests exactly were, you will have to contact the DOE lab since I wasnt there.  but it couldnt be too hard to see what amps are flowing from a DC lead acid battery eventually into forklift motor and remember this system is way OU in itself.
also I have told you already its X3 more voltage into caps instancly with coil shorting when you fro example pass  neo magnets past coils to make power AND the output does not get reflected back to source too, so that is what it is...usually, thanks to lenz-law when you make 100W for instance the "source" or "prime mover" (in my case motor or motor coil spiing gernator rotor of neo magnets) will also in consequence go up in draw 100W....this is usually how it is...but in case of coil-shorting at peaks really quick, the draw to rpimemover/source does nto go up when power is made...so have anwered all your questions and you wil have to go elsewhere to get more answers to prove what you make up to be the case..
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 26, 2012, 02:12:54 AM
Konehead:

For the DOT lab, Ismael was supposed to provide their official report within two months.  At least 10 months had passed by with no report and then I lost track of the story.  Did Ismael ever provide the DOT report like he promised?

My impression is that Ismael made arrangements to get access to the DOT lab.  This was out of the ordinary and therefore taking away from the "official" use of the equipment.  There was not necessarily any engineers there.  It's just a testing station to make sure cars and trucks are street legal.  There could have been a mixture of operators and technicians there.  Their may have been some engineers present, but in the day to day operation of that station you don't need engineers.

Then they put the buggy on the dyno and they produced their report on the measured mechanical output power.  Somebody must have signed the report, it was not necessarily an engineer, it could have been the operator of the dynamometer testing machine.  If an engineer had signed it the issue of the accuracy of the very low power measurement should have been addressed in the report.  Whoever signed it is not likely accountable in any way.  This whole event was just an exception to the normal day to day operations of the test center.  The only paper work the people that work at the test station are worried about is the real paperwork associated with their job functions.  All of this is speculation on my part and taking into account my impressions of the videos.

So the point that I am trying to get across is this may not be as officially endorsed by engineers as you think.

Regarding the use of coil shorting and cap pulsing goes, I can't really comment.  What I can say is that whenever a capacitor is being charged there is Lenz drag on the moving magnet.  In my opinion the thing that you have to do is see if you really have anything worth investigating by making input vs. output power measurements first.

Then you need to use your scope to document and figure out what's going on.  You make lots of speculations about what the circuit is doing with lots of prose, and all of them can be confirmed or denied with a scope.  For this type of work that's all based on pulse circuits, your scope is king.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 26, 2012, 02:23:26 AM
Konehad:

Quote
but in case of coil-shorting at peaks really quick, the draw to rpimemover/source does not go up when power is made

You have to prove that with measurements.  Like I already said, if you assume that your moving magnets are on a rotor, you can't necessarily perceive that the rotor slows down with a quick test using your five senses.  You draw a very tiny amount of mechanical energy from the spinning rotor when you do a really quick shorting at the peak.  Then when the coil is charging the capacitor, you draw another tiny amount of mechanical energy from the spinning rotor.

Whenever current is flowing through the coil it is acting like a magnet in opposition to the rotor magnet.  Nobody has a work-around for that one at this point in time.  You can talk about cheating Lenz' law and that's fine - then you have to go an back up your theories or statements with hard data.  That's supposed to be the fun part.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 26, 2012, 05:14:06 AM
Updated version of my code...


Quote
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
//                                                  COIL SHORTING v1.0 by kEhYo77@gmail.com                                                           //
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////


const int plsPin = 5;                                 // dedicated pin for using hardware counter to measure triggering frequency
const int csmPin = 10;                                // signal pin output to control COIL SHORTING MODULE (CSM)
const int int0Pin = 2;                                // dedicated pin for using hardware interrupt 0
const int delayPot = 1;                               // potentiometer for setting the delay period befor the shorting starts to occure
const int countPot = 2;                               // potentiometer for setting the number of shorting pulses per trigger event
const int pulsePot = 3;                               // potentiometer for setting the pulse widtch of shorting event
const int bemfPot = 4;                                // potentiometer for setting the period to collect BEMF from the shorting event
unsigned int count;                                   // variable used by the hardware timer function
unsigned int shtDelay = 0;                            // time window delaying shorting sequence after zero crossing detection trigger
unsigned int shtPulse = 0;                            // time window for coil shorting pulse width (CMS ON)
unsigned int shtBEMF = 0;                             // time window for BEMF recovery from shorting the coil (CMS OFF)
unsigned int shtCount = 0;                            // number of shorting events per trigger, numer of shorts
unsigned int frequency = 0;                           // zoro crossing detector triggering frequency from the hardware counter
volatile boolean pulseON = false;                     // variable that can be changed from within the interrupt function


//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// INITIALISATION ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////


void setup() {
  pinMode(csmPin, OUTPUT);                            // prepering output pin for coil shorting module ON/OFF controll
  digitalWrite(csmPin, LOW);                          // CSM is OFF which means that the coil has 'OPEN' ends
  pinMode(plsPin, INPUT);                             // prepering the pin for input
  digitalWrite(plsPin, HIGH);                         // hardware counter setup for counting input pulses
  pinMode(int0Pin, INPUT);                            // prepering the pin for input to trigger hardware interrupt 0
  bitClear(ADCSRA,ADPS0);                             //  \
  bitClear(ADCSRA,ADPS1);                             //   } running analog pot inputs with higher than normal speed clock (set prescale to 16)
  bitSet(ADCSRA,ADPS2);                               //  /
  TCCR1A=0;                                           // reset timer/counter control register & starting the clock counting pulses from pin 5 input
  getCount();                                         // getting the value from the hardware trigger counter on pin 5
  attachInterrupt(0, trigger, RISING);                // enables INT0 interrupt on Pin 2 input to execute CSM turn ON/OFF cycle
  Serial.begin(115200);                               // send and receive through USB serial port at 9600 baud rate
}


////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// MAIN  LOOP //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////


void loop() {
  if (millis()%1000==0) {                             // executed when a realtime clock reaches full second (every second)
    frequency = getCount();                           // triggering frequency readout from the hardware counter
    shtDelay = analogRead(delayPot);                  // setting the delay time window (1024 us maximum)
    shtCount = analogRead(countPot)/128;              // setting the number of pulses (8 times maximum)
    shtPulse = analogRead(pulsePot)/16;               // setting the pulse width of a coil shorting event (64 us maximum)
    shtBEMF = analogRead(bemfPot)/8;                  // setting the time window for BEMF recovery (128 us maximum)
  }
  if (millis()%3000==0) {                             // executed every 3 seconds
    Serial.print("pulseCOUNT: ");
    Serial.println(shtCount);                         // prints the shorting pulse count in the Arduino's serial monitor
    Serial.print("pulseWIDTH: ");
    Serial.println(shtPulse);                         // prints the shorting pulse width
    Serial.print("windowBEMF: ");
    Serial.println(shtBEMF);                          // prints the shorting pulse width for BEMF recovery
    Serial.print("tFREQUENCY: ");
    Serial.println(frequency);                        // prints the triggering frequency
    Serial.println("");
  }
}


///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// End of the MAIN LOOP /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////


void trigger() {                                      // function executed at trigger event
  if (shtPulse!=0 && shtBEMF!=0 && shtCount!=0) {     // do the shorting when every pot's value is bigger than 0
    if (shtDelay!=0) {
      for (int k=0; k<<shtDelay; k++){                // time delay before the shorting event
        bitClear(PORTB, csmPin - 8);                  // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
        bitClear(PORTB, csmPin - 8);                  // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
      }
    }
    for (int j=1; j<=shtCount; j++){                  // do the shorting X times
       for (int i=0; i<=10; i++){                     // do the coil shorting, output goes HIGH
          bitSet(PORTB, csmPin - 8);                  // the quickest way to turn the output pin HIGH
            for (int x=0; x<=shtPulse; x++) {
              bitSet(PORTB, csmPin - 8);              // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
              bitSet(PORTB, csmPin - 8);              // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
            }
          bitClear(PORTB, csmPin - 8);                // output goes LOW for a period of BEMF recovery value
            for (int x=0; x<=shtBEMF; x++) {
              bitClear(PORTB, csmPin - 8);            // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
              bitClear(PORTB, csmPin - 8);            // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
            }
       }
    }
  }
  pulseON = true;                                     // sets the variable to indicate that there was a shorting pulse sequence
}


unsigned long getCount()  {                           // returns the current count of pulses from pin 5, resets the count, and starts counting again
  TCCR1B = 0;                                         // Gate Off / Counter Tn stopped
  count = TCNT1;
  TCNT1 = 0;
  bitSet(TCCR1B ,CS12);                               // Counter Clock source is external pin
  bitSet(TCCR1B ,CS11);                               // Clock on rising edge
  bitSet(TCCR1B ,CS10);                               // you can clear this bit for falling edge
  return count;
}


///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////  The END  //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 26, 2012, 05:30:42 AM
Konehad:

You have to prove that with measurements.  Like I already said, if you assume that your moving magnets are on a rotor, you can't necessarily perceive that the rotor slows down with a quick test using your five senses.  You draw a very tiny amount of mechanical energy from the spinning rotor when you do a really quick shorting at the peak.  Then when the coil is charging the capacitor, you draw another tiny amount of mechanical energy from the spinning rotor.

Whenever current is flowing through the coil it is acting like a magnet in opposition to the rotor magnet.  Nobody has a work-around for that one at this point in time.  You can talk about cheating Lenz' law and that's fine - then you have to go an back up your theories or statements with hard data.  That's supposed to be the fun part.

MileHigh

From the looks of it, Kehyo seems to know what he wants to do and how to do it. Im sure when he gets it all together, we will see scopes and meters. Lets at least give him a chance to get it all together. ;)


Kehyo, how many shortings will happen at and around each peak? Also, what freq/time on and off?

Thanks 

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 26, 2012, 06:00:33 AM
mile too-high
you really like to make stuff up in your imnagination
the offical report came out about a month later there are photos of it and what it says on pesiwki I have seen it so has everyone else too (but I guess not you).
Engineers were there, the DOE people and lots of them...(again you make stuff up )videos of all the engineers and all are there in video IF you want to watch it and study it.
Ismael got permission for THEM to test his stuff - they are interested since his tech can save lots of enegy consumption in phillipines....it was not done for Ismael to use THEIR LAB to fabricate fake-confirmation his system is OU like you insinutate, ... the DOE engineers declared it OU.
I am relaly THROUGH replying to you about this subject of Ismel being "credible" you are not credilbe, or beleiveable yourself  that is for sure.
 you seem like someong looking for fight and argument about stuff you know nothign about and dont want to learn about either since you have decided already on its validity. its very irratating and wasting my time really sorry.
 
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 26, 2012, 06:04:41 AM
@Magluvin


It's there in the code comments ;)
I plan to do maximum of 8 shorts per peak (it will depend on the frequency), where the duration of the short is no longer than 64 us.
Ismael said something about this to be in the range of 0,02 - 0,05 ms to get the best results although I might try to go as low as 1 us
when the coil being shorted will be of very low impedance. (low impedance is very important according to Ismael)
When it comes to the frequency of shorting, the BEMF from my coil oscillates at 250 kHz but I will try to work with 25 kHz with additional capacitor in parallel with my primary to resonate at this frequency.
I will be shorting low impedance secondary coil of my air core transformer

At first, a zero crossing detector triggers Arduino's pin No. 2 causing an immediate execution of the interrupt  trigger() function
The micro-controller now 'knows' that our sine wave signal has just crossed 0 and it must 'wait' for the peak to occur (a delay period set with pot 1 in micro seconds)
If any of the potentiometers' values, beside the no 1, equal zero then the shorting will not be executed.
This maneuver allows me to stop the shorting quickly while I am setting a value on any of the pots, if something goes wrong :) .
After the short (duration set with pot 3) there is a regulated w time window to collect the collapsing field from the short. (a delay set with pot 4)
And the short-collect cycle happens x times (no of repetitions set with pot 2)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 26, 2012, 06:19:20 AM
Mile way too high
I am through on subject of ismael with you but will do jsut one more reply on the coil-shorting not affecting draw - I put it all up on the RomeroUK Muller thread here a few montsh ago and I am not going to spend an hour to dig it up for you and link my experiment-results for you either so you find it yourself there on OU,com Muller thread where Romero makes the looper work....its towward the end of the 200 or 300 pages there.
that is, if you really want "written" proof go there, and I doubt you do, you jsut want to argue some more your hopeless case.
I used rpm meter., and also analog meter on power input to puelse DC coils spinnng  rotor of large flat rotor of 8 neo magnets, spinning past coils each side of rotor being shorted into fairly big caps  it would reflect alitllte bit on motor draw, UNTIL I got it down to the "ratio" of .5ms time-length to coilshort of a sinewave peaks, and this was with 60hz sinewave. dont tell me my meauserements were not accurate and you wat proof and how do you know I am not lying and you want proof and how much do you know about electronics and you want proof of my credetnials and was the meters calibrated and you want prrof and it was pulsed DC so how do you know if hte analog meter was right and you want proof and was the battery in your rpm meter fullcharged and you want prrof and did you have the rpm meter locked in rpms and so it didnt who any slow-daown and you want proof and how do youknow if hte cap was connecedte an filling up for sure and you want proof and all else that gets thrown out witt the trash.
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 26, 2012, 01:30:38 PM
Konehesd:

I found the report.  I simply forgot about it, it came out so long after the testing.

Here it is:

http://www.pureenergysystems.com/news/2011/10/18/9501935_Philippine_DOST_Report_of_Aviso_Overunity_Electric_Vehicle/Report_on_Ismael_Aviso-v3.pdf

You are the one making up things about this report. 

Quote
This report presents results of preliminary tests conducted as part of an investigation of
Mr. Ismael Aviso’s electric vehicle. The tests were conducted at the UPME Vehicle
Research and Testing Laboratory (VRTL) on February 24, 2011. The tests, considered as exploratory only and a prelude to a more exhaustive examination, aimed to (a) perform
an energy accounting of the electric vehicle when running at a specified steady state
condition and (b) determine the range for a given battery charge. The energy accounting
consisted of power measurement at the wheels using the chassis dynamometer and
voltage-current measurements at the batteries. 


They state that they measured the battery power draw with a DSO which is good.  But in the report they say the following:

Quote
The “Output Power” is the
wheel power measured with the dynamometer. AC input power is (VA x pf) while input power from the battery is ( Vave x Iave ).


The highlighted text shows that they were measuring the power draw from the battery using the average voltage and the average current, which is wrong and very bad.

Here is the conclusion:

Quote
Comparison of the output power vs. the input power when running on Aviso Tech seems
to indicate an “unaccounted for” source of power or energy responsible for the higher
values of output power than input power. It is strongly recommended that a more detailed examination and testing of the Aviso electric vehicle be conducted to address this observation.


Not a single person in the Filipino DOT has signed their name to this document.  So what are talking about when you say a bunch of engineers verified and confirmed this system works as claimed?  Your statements are not true.

Sorry the text is all bold because of a problem with the text formatting and I am not going to try to fix it.

There are no conclusions in this report and nobody even signed their name to it.  They also compare Ismael's system with a mains transformer hooked up to a FWBR to make a power supply.  They measure the "power in" from the mains power line which makes no sense.

I seriously doubt that we will ever see a follow-up report that is more seriously done with real engineers taking responsibility for the report and the data and signing their names to the document. 

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 26, 2012, 01:44:37 PM
Konehead:

I didn't really want to talk about Ismael's car project myself.  But I found the preliminary report and gave you my comments.

I was really talking about the clip where he claims the three-to-one increase in energy with the magnet moving past the coil and the coil shorting and the collection of the energy into the caps.

That is nothing more than a claim made by Ismael with no data to back it up.  My main point is that you must have data to back up claims like this and you must show your input and output measurements.  Without doing that, then you have nothing.

You seem to be alleging that with a shorting pulse below a certain length of time, that you can put energy into the caps without drawing off energy from the magnets moving past the pick-up coils.  That's not happening at all.  What's happening is that with a very short pulse you are only drawing off a very small amount of energy and you can deceive yourself into believing that you are not drawing any energy off from the moving magnets.

You state that you have done some full tests with output and input measurements?  Please show them to us.   All that I know from the stuff that you have posted is that you always talk about the output, I can't recall a single time you discussed the input.

The bottom line is that for all of these coil shorting/cap dump experiments is that you absolutely must measure the input and the output.  If you don't measure the input and just focus on the output then you are just having fun but you can't make any claims at all about any alleged over unity in the circuit.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: crazycut06 on June 26, 2012, 04:30:22 PM
Hi,
If I may chime in, Ismael did say in one of his videos, that the power output cannot be measured because of high voltage transient spikes and he said he already damaged some scopes because he is trying to measure the output, thats why the DOST of the philippines did not take the risk of frying their oscilloscope, and only used the dyno's result to estimate the power that is coming out of the wheels...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: crazycut06 on June 26, 2012, 04:39:54 PM
Konehad:

You have to prove that with measurements.  Like I already said, if you assume that your moving magnets are on a rotor, you can't necessarily perceive that the rotor slows down with a quick test using your five senses.  You draw a very tiny amount of mechanical energy from the spinning rotor when you do a really quick shorting at the peak.  Then when the coil is charging the capacitor, you draw another tiny amount of mechanical energy from the spinning rotor.

Whenever current is flowing through the coil it is acting like a magnet in opposition to the rotor magnet.  Nobody has a work-around for that one at this point in time.  You can talk about cheating Lenz' law and that's fine - then you have to go an back up your theories or statements with hard data.  That's supposed to be the fun part.

MileHigh
But what about the speed under load thread? or Thane heins regenerative acceleration coils? Aren't they lenz killer? For what I know it can also be made in solid state...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on June 26, 2012, 04:43:20 PM
Hi,
If I may chime in, Ismael did say in one of his videos, that the power output cannot be measured because of high voltage transient spikes and he said he already damaged some scopes because he is trying to measure the output, thats why the DOST of the philippines did not take the risk of frying their oscilloscope, and only used the dyno's result to estimate the power that is coming out of the wheels...

Yes,yes yes! Here is the analogy : if you slowly put hand into water there is not much resistance but if you slap it fast water will respond like solid wall. Now inside water there is more to be done because this effect occur only at the barrier, so you have to create a bit of air or bubble inside then slap throught the bubble.
You see ,universe is simple ,everytime there is common analogy and every electrical device is just that...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 26, 2012, 06:24:11 PM
Crazyct06 and Forest:

In this case the output is measured mechanically on dynamometer, so there is no issue.  As far a transient spikes go and stuff like that goes, it all can be measured also.  Those things have to be dealt with on a case by case basis.

Quote
if you slowly put hand into water there is not much resistance

Exactly, but the key is there is still some resistance and it can be measured.

You can indeed make analogies to any electrical circuit.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 26, 2012, 07:14:08 PM
Konehead:

Quote
I used rpm meter., and also analog meter on power input to puelse DC coils spinnng  rotor of large flat rotor of 8 neo magnets, spinning past coils each side of rotor being shorted into fairly big caps  it would reflect alitllte bit on motor draw, UNTIL I got it down to the "ratio" of .5ms time-length to coilshort of a sinewave peaks, and this was with 60hz sinewave. dont tell me my meauserements were not accurate and you wat proof

I can't comment at all about the specifics of your setup.  It sounds like you were driving a pickup-coil/shorting/cap pulser setup with a motor and monitoring the RPM of the drive motor.  If that's the case then it's perfectly conceivable that the drop in the motor RPM was imperceptible when you got it down to 0.5 mSec.  You are dealing with the same measurement phenomenon here.  Also, were you draining the caps afer each pulse?

Quote
you really like to make stuff up in your imnagination
the offical report came out about a month later there are photos of it and what it says on pesiwki I have seen it so has everyone else too (but I guess not you).
Engineers were there, the DOE people and lots of them...(again you make stuff up )videos of all the engineers and all are there in video IF you want to watch it and study it.

I do NOT "make stuff up" and I resent you stating that.  I gave you my honest impressions of the DOT testing from my memory from more than a year ago.  I didn't state that my impressions are absolute facts.  Then I found the preliminary report and read it again and commented on it.

I am NOT a bullshitter and you have a problem with people that disagree with you.  That's what a forum is all about, a respectful debate about different subjects of common interest.

Like I said, I am not really interested in the DOT test of the buggy.  It was raised in the thread and I gave people my impressions.  I will not have that twisted and spun into allegations that I am making stuff up or intentionally trying to confuse people - that is totally unacceptable.

My primary interest is in the allegation of 3:1 energy gain with the coil shorting technique.  I stated that that has to be confirmed with serious scientific measurements on both the input and the output and nobody can disagree with that.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 26, 2012, 08:27:28 PM
I am trying to ignore mr too high but you are so irritating.
there is no reason people should "sign theri names" to the attest to the validity of the DOE document. Is there a section that says all engineers sign here? (NO)
did these people REFUSE to sign it?  (NO) ...
again YOU MAKE THINGS UP
sure it is preliminary thats what all tests are called first time you do them.
because they are prelimantry doesnt mean they are therefore false but AGAIN YOU MAKE THINGS UP
there is nothign worng with putting AC meter on wall and measurieng power from wall into FWBR, DC filtering caps and use that in "replacement" of DC battery as the power supply...this will tell you the input in watts no problem really and it can be double-checked using the thre ways I gave too.
I built electric car with 36V of golf cart batteisand forklift moto (old fiat spyder) draw at slow speed to 20 mph from stop on level ground is between 50A to 100A...so 1800 to 3600watts consumed
Ismael is runnign on only 300W so he obviously has something good going on and is not faking it either and netiher are or will the DOE lab guys  (but you are one faking it)
 
 
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 26, 2012, 09:04:41 PM
hey mile way too high all the time:
I am glad you resent me for calling you what you are...thats how resentments foster; from people telling you the truth about yourself you dont want to beleive is the truth.
What IS true is you make up a lot of stuff that is not true - not exactly a classical liar, more like a delusional blockhead,
I am going to TRY again to ignore you, unless you get on the ball and can come up with some more really good  insults again,  against my friend Ismael, (calling him un-credible) or try and drag me down to your level of ignorance with your oponnioated no-fact observations.

If you want to discuss the no-lenz coil-shorting techniques and testing, go over to the RomeroUK-Muller thread and read up for a few hours, and I will not reply to you there, instead of not replying to you here.
I am open source, so you get same benefits from my research as do  people I actually like personally, respect, and consider intelligent.
 
 
 
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 27, 2012, 12:53:16 AM
Konehead:

Quote
I built electric car with 36V of golf cart batteisand forklift moto (old fiat spyder) draw at slow speed to 20 mph from stop on level ground is between 50A to 100A...so 1800 to 3600watts consumed
Ismael is runnign on only 300W so he obviously has something good going on and is not faking it either and netiher are or will the DOE lab guys  (but you are one faking it)

I am not faking anything and I wish you would stop that please.

Ismael ran on 300 watts and as a result of that the buggy motor had almost no torque whereas your golf cart has torque because of the higher power.  As it says in the report they ran into trouble trying to go up a very small incline.  It appears that what might have happened is the buggy slowed down and the reduced RPM of the motor created less CEMF.  With less CEMF the current draw started to go up and the power electronics in the buggy started to fry.

Quote
I am glad you resent me for calling you what you are...thats how resentments foster; from people telling you the truth about yourself you dont want to beleive is the truth.
What IS true is you make up a lot of stuff that is not true - not exactly a classical liar, more like a delusional blockhead

That's just a lot of hot air.  I have been around for a fair amount of time now so people know me and they know that your characterization is silly and not true.  You are simply over agitated - take a chill pill.

Quote
If you want to discuss the no-lenz coil-shorting techniques and testing, go over to the RomeroUK-Muller thread and read up for a few hours, and I will not reply to you there, instead of not replying to you here.

If you believe that you can shorten your shorting pulse and then at a certain "magic" short pulse length you can fill up your collector caps without putting a mechanical load on the rotor then I have a proposed test for you.  Just think about this logically:  You know with longer pulses you fill up the collector caps and you can measure a drag on the rotor.  Then you notice that with shorter pulses you fill up the collector caps more slowly and still see a drag.  Then with an even shorter pulse you fill up the collector caps even more slowly and don't see any more drag.  That doesn't make sense - just the fact that the collector caps are still charging is telling you that there is still a drag on the rotor.

Here is the suggested experiment:  Assume that you have an electric motor driving a rotor and the rotor powers the pick-up coils/shorting/cap pulser setup.  Also assume that you have a fully synchronized cap dump system that dumps them every time there is a pulse.  Without the synchronized cap dump system the test will not work.  Because the charging pules are very small, you could also do a synchronized cap dump every 64 or 128 pulses, or perhaps when the collector caps meet a certain threshold voltage, your choice.

You measure the current draw on the drive motor with a current sensing resistor and you also measure the RPM.  You put an RC low-pass filter setup across the current sensing resistor and connect your multimeter to the capacitor.

Now, you know how Gotoluc has a precision digital multimeter that has six digits of precision after the decimal place?  You connect Gotoluc's multimeter across the capacitor, and then make two measurements:  (1) The filtered voltage across the capacitor when the drive motor is powering the setup without any coil shorting (i.e.; no mechanical load on the rotor).  (2)  The filtered voltage across the capacitor when the drive motor is powering the setup with your minimum shorting pulse setup, the one that you believe does not put a load on the rotor but still charges the energy collecting capacitors.

When you switch from (1) to (2) you should see the capacitor voltage slowly climb over a few seconds and then stabilize at a higher value.  That's telling you that the current draw of the motor went up a tiny fraction because the load on the drive motor went up a tiny fraction.  The increased load is due to the pick-up coils causing a tiny amount of Lenz drag on the rotor magnets because of your very short coil shorting pulses.  The filtered average voltage across the current sensing resistor might only go up a few hundred micro-volts.  That would be proof that your minimum shorting pulse technique still adds a load to the rotor.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 27, 2012, 07:06:44 PM
mile way too high all the time
I am not even looking at your posts anymore (100% IGNORE MODE) so save your breath for when YOU do some EXPERIMENTS YOURSELF, and you can have the experience of replying to dumb-ass ignorant critiscm from other people who like to shoot in the dark at whatever ridiculous scenario comes to mind (like you)
other option is to change your handle, writing style, and brain function (plus new attitude),  and return as whole other person and then I will reply then,  since I wouldnt know it was you.
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 27, 2012, 07:59:00 PM
Konehead:

Quote
mile way too high all the time
I am not even looking at your posts anymore (100% IGNORE MODE) so save your breath for when YOU do some EXPERIMENTS YOURSELF, and you can have the experience of replying to dumb-ass ignorant critiscm from other people who like to shoot in the dark at whatever ridiculous scenario comes to mind (like you)
other option is to change your handle, writing style, and brain function (plus new attitude),  and return as whole other person and then I will reply then,  since I wouldnt know it was you.

That is a truly pathetic reply.  I give you a suggestion for a serious test and all that can come up with is that?  What I said to you above was REAL.  Why can't you discuss like a normal person?

You never answered the question about power input vs. power output for your pick-up coil/shorting/cap pulser circuit.  I asked you at least three times.  Based on your lack of response so far I don't believe you have ever made the measurements nor do I believe that you are capable of making the measurements.  It's up to you to prove otherwise.

Just so there is no confusion:  We are talking about mechanical energy or average mechanical power in (the magnets passing the pick-up coils) and comparing that to electrical energy or average electrical power out (discharging the collector caps.)

You can talk the talk all you want about coil shorting and timings and what caps you use to collect the energy - but without making the mechanical input measurement all of that talk is useless.

So, since this is your pet project, have you measured the input and the output for one of your systems?  If yes, how did you do it?

Don't go crying to Stephan again like a baby because I asked you some serious legitimate questions.  If you really think your coil shorting system has merit then prove it by showing your measurements for input and output.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 27, 2012, 08:11:49 PM
Hey mile too high
I am ignoring you and will not answer.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 27, 2012, 08:16:47 PM
My ass you are ignoring me.  As far as I am concerned you won't answer simply because you can't answer.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on June 27, 2012, 09:38:08 PM
My ass you are ignoring me.  As far as I am concerned you won't answer simply because you can't answer.

Answer what ?  :-\ What do you expect ? I think enough was disclosed, don't expect too much...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 27, 2012, 10:04:07 PM
Forest:

Quote
Answer what ?  (http://www.overunity.com/Smileys/default/undecided.gif) What do you expect ? I think enough was disclosed, don't expect too much...

The simple fact is that if somebody alleges that coil shorting has a tangible benefit implying more energy out than energy in, then they should show data to back their claim up.  Are you uncomfortable with that?  It would be of great benefit if more people were comfortable with requesting data in an open source community.

Suppose you watch a clip where there is a spinning rotor with coil shorting and energy collecting capacitors and the person making the clip shows the voltage that can be built up in the caps, and then they show you the caps discharging into a charging battery and it all looks pretty impressive.

It may all look pretty impressive, but if the person doesn't show you measurements for the input energy and output energy then it's meaningless.  You have no idea if anything interesting is really happening without solid data.

So far nothing has been disclosed as far as I am aware.  The minimum expectation you should have and everyone should have on a forum for research into alternative energy is the energy in measurements and the energy out measurements.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: poynt99 on June 28, 2012, 12:49:42 AM
Sounds great Loner.  ;)

Perhaps you or someone else should ask Konehead and/or Ismael to do just that, i.e. loop it and prove it, or keep your lips tight when it comes to making or supporting extraordinary claims.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 28, 2012, 07:54:13 PM
go to hell mile too high I dont need your pathetic approval and stinky analysis nor do I want it
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 28, 2012, 10:53:50 PM
Konehead:

The technology that you use for the coil pulsing and energy collection is your choice.   The idea is to look at your system as a black box, with a mechanical power input on one end and an electrical output on the other end.

So there are two challenges associated with your system.  The first is to design the coil pulsing system itself.  The second is to design  the measuring systems for the input and the output.

Then, you make adjustments to your coil pulsing system, then do a test run and measure the input and the output.  You can iterate on that and try to perfect your system.

That's what I would do if I was in your shoes, and I would welcome both challenges.

As far as the coil shorting itself goes, what I think is happening is the following:  When you short the coil at the peak of the sine wave, the voltage across the coil goes to zero.  At that moment in time the coil is seeing a lot of changing flux from the passing magnet.  Therefore current starts to flow through the coil.  It will rise linearly from zero and start to flow through the MOSFET array.  You are getting Lenz drag on the rotor while the current is increasing.  When the switch opens, whatever energy now stored in the coil has to go somewhere, and that is into the capacitors or the coil starts self-resonating, whatever your design does.   However, let's examine the case where the coil charges a capacitor through a diode.

Two things will be happening at the same time when the coil starts charging the capacitor.  The first thing is what I just stated above, the stored energy in the coil due to the current flow will dump into the capacitor.  The second thing is that the moving rotor magnet will also charge the capacitor because there is still changing magnetic flux.  This second effect will also cause Lenz dag on the rotor.

The next step would be to verify that sequence of events on the scope.  Working on the bench is the bridge between theory and practical reality.  What I said would have to be verified, I could have made some mistakes.

With respect to the transfer of the energy, starting off with a discharged capacitor has some issues.  When you first start to charge the capacitor and it's at zero volts, it's a very low impedance.  For the first fraction of second it looks like zero ohms.  That means that there will be an impedance mismatch with the coil.  At the very start of the capacitor charging cycle, the initial power flowing through the coil will be burned off in the internal resistance of the coil itself.  As the capacitor voltage starts to climb, its instantaneous resistance will start to increase and as the power flows through the coil, less will be dissipated in the resistance of the coil itself, and more will be stored in the capacitor.

When I think about this, you can see a potential negative issue associated with going with very short pulses and discharging the capacitor for every single pulse.  Suppose a single pulse only charges the capacitor to 0.3 volts.  If you then discharge the capacitor for every pulse back to zero volts, then the capacitor always looks like a low impedance device (depends on the size of the capacitor also).   But you can imagine a scenario where short shorting pulses generate very small energy pulses from the coils.  These very small energy pulses from the coils are always hitting capacitors that are at zero volts.  In that scenario most of the mechanical energy extracted from the spinning rotor will be burnt off in the internal resistance of the coil itself instead of going into the capacitor.

Some issues for your consideration.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 29, 2012, 04:17:03 AM
I am not reading your posts at all mr mile too-high so you are wasting your time I see your name and dont even glance at it.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 29, 2012, 04:47:46 AM
Konehead:

Well then why don't you point me to a working Romerouk/Muller motor that is a self-runner that uses your coil shorting technique?  I am not aware of any in existence.  I think a lot of people had their hopes high for ZeroFossilFuel.  I just checked and the last clip that was posted related to his Romeruk build was eight months ago.

After all the talk, building, testing, measuring input and output, the real goal is results.  Can you link to any positive results associated with coil shorting experiments?

With respect to the discussions about the tech, whether it be Kehyo77's new design or your discussions about coil shorting techniques, the thing that you want to do is check your theories against what your scope is showing you.  A very useful technique is to construct a timing diagram based on your scope observations.  If you are good and you understand what you are doing, or you learn as you go along, you should be able to produce a timing diagram that shows exactly what happens with respect to the voltage and current signals of interest.  You can also add a derived signal to the timing diagram, the instantaneous power.  Then you can derive another signal from the instantaneous power.  You just have to integrate the instantaneous power signal with respect to time and you can derive an instantaneous energy signal.

That would be a great exercise, to plot the complete timing diagram for a coil shorting system.  Even if it ends up not being over unity, you still get the satisfaction of understanding your circuit inside-out.  That gives you an expanded knowledge base for tackling your next experiment.

I will repeat it again:  For analyzing pulse circuits, your two best friends are your scope and some graph paper for constructing your timing diagram.  If you really know what you are doing you can create a full energy audit trail for your experiment.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 29, 2012, 05:13:07 AM
I found a timing diagram for illustrative  purposes.  With your two scope channels you can often keep a "reference" signal on one channel and with your other scope probe poke around in your circuit and look at any signal you want.  With a little bit of effort you can then draw three, four, or five signals all referenced to the original "reference" signal.  That way you can understand cause and effect relationships between signals and get a "snapshot in time" of the entire sequence of events, from the coil shorting right through to the charging of the collector capacitors.

That's what the analysis of pulse circuits is all about.

MileHigh

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 29, 2012, 06:59:39 AM
Ive been doing some simple tests and messing with this idea in sim

Something that I find interesting. When we disconnect a current from a coil, we get a spike. These spikes are powerful but short lived. As any experienced tech or electrical engineer will tell you, there is no more energy in the spike that what was input to make the spike.
During that short period of time when the spike occurs, that spike has the ability of penetration of sorts. Like, almost no matter the load that the spike is applied to, that spike is evident with a scope.  For example, if the input were 12v and the coil produced 90v during the collapse, but in a 10ohm load, the 90v would be reduced but still a spike that is visible. Lets say across the 10ohm load we have 36v. Not real numbers, just a general operation chart. ;]

If we have a dc to dc power supply, that converted 12v to 36v and applied that 36v to the 10ohm load, we would have roughly over 130w being consumed.

I was experimenting in using a 1to1 transformer with ac applied to the primary at 40hz and shorting the secondary at 4khz throughout the ac cycle.

I tried some additional caps and coils also in different ways and there are things that need to be tried on the bench.

Im getting waveforms that are spiky on input and output. Im finding that if I put an inductor in series with the secondary, the input goes from just producing output, to recieving input. Not that the power companies would want us doing that.  ;)

So the output and the input spikes are filling in the 40hz wave trace to look solid, 100 spikes per cycle wave. 

So im getting 2 to 5 times, depending on adjustments and such out into the load compared to input, AND the input is getting some back.

So it appears that if we have many shortings during the input cycle, along with additional inductors and caps, that there is more out than in with AC charge back.

I have a few versions of the circuit on sim before I build it. Ill post a couple tomorrow with pics of the circuit and scope shots showing power dissipation input and out. Even expanding the waveforms, it looks good.

The idea is, with so many shortings the spikes seem to take over, creating larger solid looking waveforms as compared to not shorting.

Im a bit amazed. But it is still sim and has to be tried.

I was messing with filtering the 4khz out of the output, and we have a virtually cleaned up output, but more than without shorting. I think this is something they are dealing with in the Kapanadze thread also. Makes a lot of sense.  like I said, those spikes have oomph. And it seems enough to hold up that larger waveform into a load, especially when the spikes are very close together, happening very often. ;]

Either way, im taking the shorting more seriously at this time. ;]

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on June 29, 2012, 09:50:12 AM
Hi Magluvin.
I like your approach.
My shorting module is ready for testing and I've been thinking along those same lines using a transformer.
For my first tests I want to do the shorting of a secondary while primary is being driven in a state of resonance.
I've got a quite good kill-a-watt meter to measure power consumption with phase angle measurement so
we will see if the shorting is reflecting back to the source...
There is a pretty big 300VA toroid waiting for this my meter shows 1W consumption with added caps at primary (reduced from 3W idling without any caps)
The two identical 55V secondaries will be connected in parallel for quicker response in building a field while being shorted.
 
kEhYo
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 29, 2012, 07:43:42 PM
Hi Magluvin and Kehyo
I asked Ismael if he creates the rings with an inital short at the peak, then when the ringing starts, and he tehn shorts the peaks of the rings themselves... he laughed and said "thats it"..
but making the shorting "non-refelective to source" is mandatory otherwise eveytime you make power, also  more power is required to make it so "no gain" happens
usually ringing like you see created by a spark-gap or a coil shorted momentarily very quick in a switched-short will decay-out in the voltage peaks of the ringing if looking with scope, but when you short at the "peaks of the rings" too,  the power going into caps goes up exponential-fashion (explosiong of voltage sort of)...if cap fills to 100V and the ring peaks decay down to 95V or bleow, and you still have lots of ringing, that cap is not going to fill speck more in voltage no matter how may times it is pulsed below 100V so in a single-shot short event it is only the first couple rings that boost the voltage up in cap, but in multi-short event you can get it to go up and up and up in voltage...
making system non-reflective to source ("lug free") is divided into two events; where the lug will happen - 1)the filling up of the capacitors, and 2)the knocking of capacitors into load...
putting caps into load without lugging system is pretty "easy" really - use the diode-plug or two stage circuit where caps disconnect from source (coils) during the dicsharge to load....this is pretty much  mandatory in coil-shorting stuff to be doing - you cannot throw a resistance acorss those caps when coils get shorted during the filling-up of them -  it will snuff everything out-  that resistance..
to make filling of caps lug-free, the caps size is important to experiment with, as way too big of cap uf value will have lots of resistance "in itself" so the resistance of cap can snuff out the ringing of the coil short too...
what I have found is ultra-important is the pulsewidth of the coil short and like I was saying a few pages back tha I found through expeimenting alot, is that if for an example you are working with 60hz sinewave, the coil-short at peak needs to be under .5 millisecond, and make sure it is at peak too, then in this case the rotor of generator (what I was testing ) will not slow down a single rpm while the caps fill up  - also I found that with wider pulse width, that does slow rotor a bit, (lenz lugging) the cap doesnt fill any faster than with that below .5ms pulse so that is a good thing.... anyways good luck in the experiments...
I guess jsut want to say again; time those multiple shorts per peak period to occur at the peaks of the ringing is the trick then its unbeleivable power rgoing into those caps and dont apply load to caps that have filled up until you disconnect caps from coils at same time...
I have been using a FWBR to rectfy the short-rining into DC caps, I want to experiment next wtih single diodes, going into two "alternating" DC cap banks so that I can do also the altenraing-DC-cap discharge diode-plug output with it....I'll let you know what happens with this - also I have been using "bidiretionally" hooked-up mosfets that will switch AC, but if doing single diode approach, maybe I can get by with only single mosfets to do the short, maybe PNP on pos phase NPN on neg phase not sure yet how its going to work but on paper it should...
 
   
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 30, 2012, 01:48:06 AM
Here is my initial example. Im working on tuning this one as it is just set at some simple values for components.

The input is 40hz 20v ac

The transformer is a 1to1 10mh

The switch is an analog switch set for .005ohms. Hey, what da heck. ;]  Simple.

The control input for the switch is set at 4khz square 50% duty cycle

The inductor and cap added is what made it all happen as nice as it looks. With just one or the other, output suffered. 10 mh and 10uf    And 99ohm load resistor.

With the addition of the inductor and cap, we get power being sent back to the input. bout 260w peak. Peaks?  Yea, but it is all peaks here. Dense peaks. ;]

Im working on tuning and a couple other versions. I just wanted to put this out there to show it in basic form.  Also the additional cap and inductor seems necessary for it to work by increasing the output as compared to without the LC, and providing power back to the source. 

The continuous shorting seems to not be much of a problem, and it is simpler. ;]

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 30, 2012, 02:15:32 AM
Here is the same circuit with a 10ohm load instead of 99ohm. Notice the difference in input and output compared to my previous post.   ;) ;D

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 30, 2012, 02:57:46 AM
Mags:

Can you explain in some more detail what we are looking at?   They appear to be power waveforms?  Is one the input sine wave power and the other the power through the resistor?  What are the faint spikes and why are they there?   Are you sure that's just not an aliasing artifact?  Can you also show plots where we can see the 4 KHz switching waveform?  Except for the analog switch, are you using ideal components?  If yes, then you should do a second circuit where you simulate real-world components and show those waveforms.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 30, 2012, 03:27:47 AM
Hey M
Im not claiming anything yet. ;]  Actually, I was just messing with it and removed the LC and the powers were not much different. Im a bit confused.  I gota eat something and get back to it.

That is just aliasing. When the waveforms are expanded, the input are sharp tipped ramps.
The output, right shot, is nearly straight spikes, but are ramp down once expanded some..   Also expanded, the power seen being sent back to the source is near 250 w but like a square wave, not a perfect top. But it can easily cancel out some of the area seen in the sharp ramp coming from the source.

Yes, I can expand the waveform to show the 4khz riding the 40hz. I have 6 circuits that I have to go through again to check for consistency. Removing the LC and seeing the results is not what I remember from earlier, err, last night.  Im going to do some comparisons in sim at lighting a sim light bulb via direct AC and then the circuit. At a slow rate in sim, you get to see the time period that it takes for the filament to heat up, and visually as the bulb gets brighter. It can run both circuits simultaneously. It can give us an idea if the wattage shown is really doing the amount of work it might look like its doing.

This is my friday night.  ;D   Gota eat.  Then I gota see what is going on with the LC added and not.


Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on June 30, 2012, 04:50:17 AM
By the way, I am pretty sure that a typical MOSFET has about a 2-ohm D-S resistance.  I think I read that several times on the other thread.  I suggest that you guys check your spec sheets.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on June 30, 2012, 05:11:28 AM
Hi guys.
Is this discussion about a well known principle used in the auto ignition system? Here is a picture from well known book which describes many such aspects; what about a term "inrush current"? It's "Practical Transformer Handbook". See attachment.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 30, 2012, 05:42:04 AM
By the way, I am pretty sure that a typical MOSFET has about a 2-ohm D-S resistance.  I think I read that several times on the other thread.  I suggest that you guys check your spec sheets.

An IRFZ44 D to S is .028 ohms on resistance.  A very common mosfet

 ;D

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 30, 2012, 05:54:35 AM
Hi guys.
Is this discussion about a well known principle used in the auto ignition system? Here is a picture from well known book which describes many such aspects; what about a term "inrush current"? It's "Practical Transformer Handbook". See attachment.

If you read the description in the pic you posted, it says the capacitor is to protect the switch contacts. But it doesnt just do that. If you try this setup on the bench, you will quickly find out that the capacitor helps to give a much better spark. When that switch is released( without the cap in place) you will see a spark across the gap of the switch.

But when you have the cap across the switch, that voltage has a path into the cap instead of the open contacts of the switch.  So now what happens? Oscillation!  ;] And a nice fat spark. Not just 1 puny static cling looking and sounding spark as with no condenser(cap) across the switch.

But most books on this will only say it is to protect the switch. ;] 

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on June 30, 2012, 05:58:30 AM
An IRFZ44 D to S is .028 ohms on resistance.  A very common mosfet

 ;D

Mags

I would need 5 or 6 of them in parallel to come close to my theoretical switch in my circuit above. I wasnt being unrealistic.  ;]

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on June 30, 2012, 07:34:01 AM
 Sorry, Magluvin, I meant something else: "sudden collapsing current". Here is a quote from the mentioned book. The picture in my previous post relates to this quote:
Quote
Stepped-up high voltage from not so high turns ratio.

An experimenter is interested in determining the approximate turns ratio of an automobile ignition coil. He impresses a small audio frequency sinewave on the primary terminals and uses an oscilloscope to measure the induced voltage in the secondary. As a result of this measurement technique, it is found that the voltage step-up is approximately 100. This does not appear reasonable because 100 times the 12 V of the automobile battery falls far short of the 15 000-30 000 V needed for firing spark plugs. What is the nature of the discrepancy? Although not commonly referred to as a 'flyback' transformer, the ignition coil develops its high secondary voltage in a similar manner to the flyback transformer in a television set. In both instances, the primary winding requires a waveform with a very high rate of voltage or current change. Such a waveform induces a high voltage counter EMF in the primary and it is this induced voltage which is stepped-up further in the secondary. Thus in an automobile ignition system, the abrupt cut-off of the applied 12 V induces a counter EMF in the primary with a peak amplitude of about 250-300 V. When this purposely-produced 'transient' is multiplied by a 100 to 1step-up turns ratio, one obtains the 25 kV or so needed for reliable firing ofthe plugs. The basic breaker point ignition system is shown in Fig. 5.2
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 30, 2012, 07:55:02 AM
Hi Magluvin
you are "supposed to" not have a resitance like your 99 ohms or 10 ohms in the circuit, UNTIL the caps fill up first - to whatever voltage you desire them to be at (via pulse width of short, frequency of shorts, cap size and all the variables that decide how fast those caps fill up in unloaded-condition)....THEN have a Noff SWon disconnect the coils being shorted from that capacitor being filled up, WHILE at same time, a Noff SWon swtihc connects caps to your load....this way the coils being nver shorted never "see" the load itself - only the resistance of the cap itself is all the coils being shorted have to worry about resistance-wise....can you do this with your simulator program?
when you have a lump resistive load across that cap, you are snubbing away alot of potential power and also will be causing a refleciton back to the primary, so you get extra draw when coils fill up which is no good and is what you want to avoid always....
when yo uget to building the real thing, for sure try 5 mosfets or so in paralell, amd/or very high amp low resistance mosfets that are also HV.....try some IRF P460 NPN types .... remember to put a pull-down 1K resistor across the whole cluster of mosfets if you paralell them - I like to also put a 1K pull-down resistor across EACH mosfet as well as one all the way across the cluster to make sure those mosfets never stick-on...also you should use a driver chip too - I like the 4421 type, and if you pop in a 4422 instead, it inverts the mosfet swithces to become Noff SWon instead of Non SWoff (or vice versa) so this is really easy way to make a "two-stage" output switching circuit...
If you want to have continuous short, then the way to go for that is the Thane method of a certain  high frequency and high ohm coils (IF somethign rotating), to get speed up under load, or the RomeroUK magnets behind cores method to get speed up under load...(again if somethign rotating)..if non-rotating, best to fill up caps unloaded with peak-short, dump caps to load when caps are disconnected from coils...
that "lump" resistive load is how they hide OU !!
 
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on June 30, 2012, 01:20:45 PM
Oops! It looks like you gouys are convinced that the distributors' role is only one in ICE ignition system: to distribute power. My above two posts prove it has also another task: to reinforce the power.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on June 30, 2012, 07:59:39 PM
hi Qwert
Ovi Fetche in Romainia has a coil-shorting circuit that he uses in a motorcycle ignition system and it works great he says:
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on June 30, 2012, 10:25:51 PM
Hi, konehead.
My intention of showing this feature (collapsing current to reinforce power) is to make you aware that it was known and used for long time.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on July 01, 2012, 10:41:17 AM
I finally got my coil shorting going! :D
I had to rebuild my PWM driver as the old one has gone in smoke :)

I've dug up my old setup with a rotor and I am driving it GAP POWER style magnets all same pole out.
Driving coil in attraction polarity magnets behind the coil in repelling mode to the rotor.
I am shorting two gen coils non stop, they're hooked up in parallel.
I'll make a short video soon.


kEhYo
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on July 01, 2012, 07:40:43 PM
Hi Kehyo
Looks really fun - try pulsing those coils you have, then shorting them right after the motor-pulse has turned off, keeping everything (both motor coisl pulse and motor coil short) "within' the sinewave peak period that the rotormagnets create........or just use them as gernator coils, see if you cna get draw to "prime mover"  be not affected at all...use RPM meter to check draw as you dont want it to slow even 1 RPM to be dead-sure....ammeters can/will show no extra draw, but there may be some rpm drop.....so RPM meters are best to make ssure there is no reflection with the ringing into caps, and also the caps into load - neither should affect rpms or draw at all...if you dont have a two-stage diode-plug type circuit where cap disconnects from coils when they hit load, you will get a reflection in extra draw unless you hit on something really unique...(like Thane or RomeroUK getting speed up under load)
Hi Qwert
yes besides igniton-coil type circuits, Tesla's spark-gap stuff is almost exaclty like a "coil short at peak" since the spark gap jumps only at the high voltage peak (so it happens at peak period) and the spark-jump, when it reaches other side, will SHORT the coil that caused the jump to happen in first place....
also Joe Newman I heard used the coil-shorting to happen right at the time the motor-pulse turns off like just described to kehyo...
but, I have never heard before of people shorting GENERATOR COILS  into caps, and the from caps into load  in two-stage output tyep of thing so gernator doesnt affect draw to motor spinning it...this is sort of new territory and is key to lenz-less generators of any mechanical design..
Ismael has taken the whole coil-shrting thing to high level, with HF resonate pulsing and shorting the "peaks of the rings" is something I dont beleive has been done before excepy maybe by Tesla wiht some variable-capacity caps and crazy spark gap resonance stuff and it probalby was extremely fickle to sustain over a long time.
apparently Edwin Gray used very large capacitors that "imitate" a short-circuit from their resistance and he would hit 5 or so quick pulses into these - not quite same thing as coil short at peak but similar....
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on July 02, 2012, 04:12:48 AM
...
but, I have never heard before of people shorting GENERATOR COILS  into caps,
...

You are right, konehead. There was however a lot of discussion on this subject several years ago on threads related to TPU (Toroidal Power Unit) at this forum. A treasure of info, only problem to dig it up.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on July 09, 2012, 08:01:48 PM


Hi All


Here is my video of something related to this thread.
Pulse Motor Generator Coil Shorting Test (http://youtu.be/9UlwdLXO3AI)


A Hall sensor triggers a MOSFET transistor to activate the driving coil in attraction mode to the rotor. The stack of magnets behind the driving coil is in opposition to the rotor.
When the driving transistor shuts off, the magnetic field from this stack pushes the rotor away from the TDC. When there is no power applied the rotor is affected by cogging only a little as the stack of magnets is pushing away while the iron/magnetite cores of the generator coils pull to the TDC. The rotor consists of 6 neodymium permanent magnets (N50), of which all the poles are oriented with their NNNNNN outwards.
Two generator coils that are connected in parallel are being shorted constantly many times per cycle using two MOSFET transistors connected source to source with bypassing diodes. This pair is being driven from a small variable frequency/pulse width square wave signal generator/MOSFET driver.
Two neon bulbs are connected across the generator coil pair being shorted.
There are moments when they put out quite a light show of purple flashes there.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on July 10, 2012, 01:18:27 AM
Kehyo77:

Quote
Two neon bulbs are connected across the generator coil pair being shorted.
There are moments when they put out quite a light show of purple flashes there.

Let's assume some current was induced into the generator coils while the MOSFET switches were closed.  Then when the MOSFET switch pair goes open-circuit there are no loads across the generator coil pair.  With no loads the generator coils produce high voltage and that fires the neons.

If you put small current-sensing resistors in series with your generator coils you should see a small induced current waveform when the MOSFET switches close.

You could do a spin-down test where you time the spin-down with the generator coils without MOSFET shorting and compare that with a spin-down test with the MOSFET shorting.  We can assume ahead of time that the spin-down test will be shorter with the MOSFET shorting.  This would prove that the MOSFET shorting causes Lenz drag on the rotor.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on July 10, 2012, 04:35:39 AM
Nice setup Kehyo.  What are all those knobs on that controller? ;]

Well that is at high voltages. Have you tried some various wattage 12v light bulbs? Even some low wattage 120v, 220v depending where you are  ;] 

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on July 10, 2012, 08:02:39 AM
hi Kehyo
from the sound of it, it seems your coil shorting lugs the rotor down in lower rpms, and more draw too...especially at the slower speeds you can tell by the sound of motor in the video.
you need to short coils for purpose of filling the biggest caps you can, as fast as possible, and as high in voltage as possible - all the while not affectin rpms or amp draw to motor spinning the rotor....you really should not put a load on it all at once like you have done with those small lights...
peak coil shorting is meant to go into caps first - and these are unloaded caps...

its nice you have the pulser-circuit so that you can do mulitple shorts, BUT it needs to be very precise timing to it and of course very short pulse widths too -  as the reason for any multiple shorts as opposed to just one very quick one, is to first cause the ringing, via the first short, then after that, the additional shorts must align themselves in timing with only the peaks of the rings created....
when the caps hit your load,  at this same time the caps should be disconnected from the coils that were shorted...so you need an additonal "two stage" output circuit...
very nice setup regardless of all this critic!
 
here is a simple drawing I did of something I am working on with a two-stage output circuit (diode plug in this case with single diodes instead of FWBR, and  filling up two alternating-dishcharge caps and note the "shorting switch")
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on July 10, 2012, 09:19:25 AM
Hi Konehead, thanks for the heads up.
I know where to go with this with load separation timing etc.
I am getting there I just do things one by one.
Now its finally time for my Arduino to do some shorting and load switching :D
I was thinking of using another hall sensor with tiny magnets at TDCs of N and
'silent' S poles to trigger the shorting sequence only at TDCs.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on July 10, 2012, 10:57:25 AM
Kehyo77:

Quoting Konehead:

Quote
as the reason for any multiple shorts as opposed to just one very quick one, is to first cause the ringing, via the first short, then after that, the additional shorts must align themselves in timing with only the peaks of the rings created....

Look at Konehead's circuit.  After the short is removed the coil will discharge into one of the capacitors through a diode.  By definition there will be no ringing.  The coil will discharge all of it's stored energy into the cap via the diode and then everything stops dead.  There is no LC component to make any oscillation.  The coil will not self-oscillate with it's own internal vestigal capacitance because there will be no energy available for the oscillation - all of the energy will have been transferred into the capacitor.  This will be very easy to verify on the bench.

I know that you are deferring to Konehead but I can tell you from reading him that he is no electronics expert by any means.  The real challenge for a circuit like this is to make a timing diagram like I already explained.  If you don't make a timing diagram then it's almost like you are operating blind.  You end up just having fun but not really being serious, your choice.  I also am aware that almost nobody makes serious timing diagrams, and they are all making a mistake if they truly want to understand their pulse motor circuits.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: MileHigh on July 10, 2012, 05:29:57 PM
Kehyo77:

Just a comment for you if you are going to try to build Konehead's circuit.  All that it does is temporarily store energy in the capacitors before the energy in the capacitors gets discharged into some sort of a load.  You don't gain anything by doing this and you increase the complexity of the output section quite a bit.  I know that Konehead believes that somehow short pulses will fill up the capacitors without putting any Lenz drag on the rotor but that is simply not true, it's a fantasy.

It still might be a fun exercise to build it anyways because of the challenge of synchronizing the Arduino timing signals with the spinning rotor magnets.

MileHigh
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on July 10, 2012, 09:40:45 PM
Hi Kehyo
I make rotor-discs with really small neo magnets in them (1/16" wide X 1/4" long so about 1.5mm wide and 6mm long approx) they are really cheap to get on magnets4less site.you can cluster the magnets to make pulse widht longer too...
BUT I found that just one of these very-small magnets triggering a halleffect, still does not make for small-enough pulse width to the coil short, to make sure the rotor does not slow at all when the caps fill.
So, I used two hall effects, and two mosfets (bidirectional they happen to be) and then hooked up these IN SERIES....a 4422 driver runs one mosfet, a 4421 driver the other, so this makes it easy way to make a mosfet either Non-SWoff, or Noff-SWon....
then by adjsuting the distance between the two halleffects, (both triggered by same small trigger-magnet, or two magnets in trigger-rotor both exactly in phase) now you can adjust pulse width down to being very very narrow...and now there will be absoutley no extra draw as the caps fill up.
mabye you can do it with your arduino somehow -  have a small magne be the "trigger" for a very small pulse width via two mosfets in series, one Non-SWoff and other Noff-SWon....anyway this worked great for me and I came up with fact that at 60hz, (as example)  a single peak coil-short event needs to be less than 1/2ms ....
 
anyways here is the circuit - note that the mosfets are bidirectional in this case, and also I have caps filling up from the backemf/recoil too (other subject), but note how the mosfets connect in series and the two halleffects, and the 4421 and 4422 drivers, to adjsut pulsewidth:
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on July 10, 2012, 10:26:35 PM
Hi Konehead
Quote
4422 driver runs one mosfet, a 4421 driver the other, so this makes it easy way to make a mosfet either Non-SWoff, or Noff-SWon....
What a brilliant idea! :)

Yes, I prefer to do it with Arduino, where the hall sensor will just trigger with a rising edge for example a routine by hardware interrupt.
Then the timing can be adjusted from this point and gives me even more freedom to easily change it with a potentiometer for instance or to
make it self regulate automatically depending on the speed of the rotor.


Thanks!


kEhYo
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on July 11, 2012, 06:48:58 AM
hi Kehyo
that 4421 or 4422 driver chip for Non-SWoff or Noff-SWon mosfets works really good other ways to do it too, like changing the hall effect to one flipped over but easier to jsut pop out the driver chip and put another in....anyways mabye you can program the arduino to trip a 4421 or 4422 driver for a diode-plug like output circuit (two stage) or whatever you want to do...
also a guy named "RS" drew up this schematic on using a hall-effect to send the inital signal to 556 timer, and then you can set the capture-period, and then the frequency of chopping - this is meant for miltiple peak coil shorting, but whatever you want to do with it - I havent tried it or built it, but here it is.... maybe this can give you some ideas that will match up with arduino program from this I dont know...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: thelast on November 15, 2012, 01:45:28 PM
Anything new?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: truesearch on November 15, 2012, 05:57:17 PM
@thelast:


I'm afraid not. . . it's been very quite on the "ISMAEL" front as far as I know. I had hopes that something real would come of his work and experiments. However, the longer it goes like this, the more it appears to be another case of "mis-measurement", or maybe "intentional deception", or perhaps even "discrediting/suppression by people in power".


truesearch
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on November 15, 2012, 09:26:24 PM
simple question related to shorting coils : how can I synchronize square wave generator with sinewave so square wave will start when sinewave start (at zero volts) ?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on November 15, 2012, 10:30:36 PM
Hi Forest.
The simplest way is to program a micro controller such as an Arduino.
First you have to build a zero crossing detector - to generate a pulse, every time a sine wave AC
goes positive/negative. That pulse will trigger an instantaneous execution of a function
attached to a hardware interrupt in the micro controller.

You can count those pulses as well to determine the frequency and then calculate time needed to start sending signals to do the shorting :)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on November 16, 2012, 03:43:50 AM
hi Forest and everyone
here is very good circuit that can control a bank of mosfets to do coil shorting at peaks.
It was made up by Ron P from Canada and he built one and it works great, so did I, and another person named Justin in USA also built this circuit so its been tested out and works fine.
the first pot you adjust to find exactly where in the sinewave you want to trigger  the switching (mosfets)..so you can have the swtiching turn ON right in middle at peaks, or little before or after ore even down at the zero line area if you want.
the 2nd pot adjusts the "capture width" that you want to have - narrow, or wide...
the 3rd pot chops the capture-period selected up into a frequency of your choosing...
for coil-shorting at peaks, you want to use ultra-low resistance switching, or else too nuch resistance will snuff-out the HV and HF ringing that happens with coil shorting (the ringing created when switch OPENS after shorting coils,  is why the caps will fill so fast and so high)
Its best to have a very narrow pulse width to the coil short, and at peak, in order to make it
non-reflective (no extra draw)
Good idea Ismael gave me is to use many mosfets in paralell - like 5 or 10 this will give you very very low resistance...use a driver chip that can supplly lots of amps so that the paralelled mosfets will all swtich ON-OFF same time. I like the 4421 or the 4422....whihc one you chosse will make the swtihcing Non-SWoff or Noff-SWon...you need this sort of thing for a "two stage" output circuit...(see below)
Also for coil-shorting you should have BIDIRECTIONAL mosfets - that is, two mosfets connected at gate and source leads (or two banks of paralelled mosfets) so the mosfets will switch AC...the switching now occurs between the "leftover DRAIN" leads of the mosfets.
I like to put 10K "pull down" resistors across the gate and source leads of each mosfet, and also one across the whole cluster too, if you are going to paralell mosfets for the low ressitance reason...this way if somethign blows up, the driver chip will fry, but the mosfets will be OK....
If coil shorting, DO NOT hit a load directly with the power from the coil-shorted created ringing HV and HF...instead to rectify it, and simply fill DC caps...this  is your first objective - as fast and as high as you possibly can, ...... then after filling the caps, dump caps to the load  you choose.
at same time during the cap-discharge-to-load  the caps must be  DISCONNECTED from the coils being shorted, when caps do hit the load, this is called a two-stage output circuit....other metthod of outputting the caps is to dump the "collector" caps into a 2nd bank of caps, then  2nd bank of caps hits load - this way the collector caps isolate the coils being shorted from the resistive load (AKA "bucket brigade" method)
here is Ron's "dual 4047" peak sensing/capture/chopping circuit:
 
 
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on November 16, 2012, 08:33:07 AM
Thanks Konehead

What is J2 and J3 on schematic ? Doesn't transformer shift phase of original sinewave current ?
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on November 16, 2012, 06:42:33 PM
Hi forest
 
J2 and J3 are the Junction "out"s I guess is what the J stands for...there are two of them in case you choose to skip the chopping feature that you can do with the pot 3
These hook up to the gates of the mosfet banks, its the signal that finally triggers the mosfet banks.
you need to have a trnasformer with AC signal that matches up with what you want to short - lets say you want to short the run-cap phase of a rotovertor AC motor - so good idea for that is put the HV side of a MOT (Microwave Oven Transformer) across the run cap phase, and use the LV side of the MOT to control/signal this circuit.
If you have some sort of generator working that you want to short the phases of the coils at peaks, then put across a coil or phase, some sort of small transformer, or even a small aircore coil, to create the AC siden wave that triggers this circuit...just check with scope that the "signal" wave form look similar to what you are actually going to be shorting.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on November 16, 2012, 07:00:42 PM
Konehead

You said
"Also for coil-shorting you should have BIDIRECTIONAL mosfets - that is, two mosfets connected at gate and source leads (or two banks of paralelled mosfets) so the mosfets will switch AC...the switching now occurs between the "leftover DRAIN" leads of the mosfets.
"


I can't imagine that. Why source leads should be connected too ?  Could you draw schematic of this bidirectional mosfets ?

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on November 17, 2012, 05:45:01 AM
Hi Forest
 
Here is schematic showing two mosfets hooked up bidirectionally, also it is a coil-shorting circuit too. Note the 10K pull-down resistors too...which make it so the driver chip will the sacrifical component, not the mosfets, if some wires get crossed or something.
This circuit has its timing of when the mosfets turn ON-OFF controlled by hall effects, which would work with a generator-rotor spinning around  wtih some small trigger-magnets on rim of  rotor, in order to trip the hall effects....so to find peak period, all you have to do is adjust the position of the hall effects in relation to the spinnign trigger magnets... you can  mount the halls on a adjsutable swivel- plate that can be locked in place once you find the timign you want...
the small coil off to the left is jsut a way to replace the 9V battery, that supplies the small DC power for the switching (driver, halls and mosfets)  via being induced by the rotor-magnets, once the generator rotor gets going around....
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on November 17, 2012, 11:23:23 AM
Thank you, really interesting schematic. How did you resolved the danger of dielectric breakdown of capacitor due to too high voltage spikes from coil ? do you have any snubber or just measured max voltage from shorted coil and had chosen proper capacitor ?

Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on November 17, 2012, 05:59:47 PM
hi Forest
Use high voltage rated caps, and I dont like to make too much voltage in first place, from the gernator coils before they short at peaks to keep voltages down...figure about X20 voltage you get in cap form the short, over some time, and "instantly" you get X3 voltage...you will need to discharge cap periodically too,    The UF value of cap you need to find considering what load you have, and how fast and how high of voltage you will get and need - a high UF value will fill slower, low UF  will fill faster...you will get more power from high UF, lower power from low UF so there is a balance you need to find when choosing the DC cap that collects the ringing created from the short.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Magluvin on November 17, 2012, 06:42:41 PM
hi Forest
Use high voltage rated caps

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khduXAjvktU      ;)

Mags
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on November 17, 2012, 07:05:15 PM
hi Mags
those homemade caps are only 1.9someting NANO FARAD so they are way too small to store any power worth anything when they discharge to a load.
the caps that collect the ringing from the peak-short should be polarized, DC type also.
I like to use these HV caps - they are cheap too whihc is nice thing - I have ordered around 50 of them...you can paralell or series them:
http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/PPC-273/PHOTO-FLASH-CAPACITOR-270UF-330WV/1.html (http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/PPC-273/PHOTO-FLASH-CAPACITOR-270UF-330WV/1.html)
 
flash caps are good ones to use, since they are made to store and discharge power very quick -like what you want to do with caps in coil-shorting circuit,,.. common electrolyctics  are made to STORE power for fairly long periods in most uses for them, so these dont fill up as fast and easily since they arent really designed for that.
here are some HV diodes too:
http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/D660/RECTIFIER-DIODE-6-AMP/600-PIV/1.html (http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/D660/RECTIFIER-DIODE-6-AMP/600-PIV/1.html)
 
 
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: forest on November 17, 2012, 07:42:35 PM
hi Mags
those homemade caps are only 1.9someting NANO FARAD so they are way too small to store any power worth anything when they discharge to a load.
the caps that collect the ringing from the peak-short should be polarized, DC type also.
I like to use these HV caps - they are cheap too whihc is nice thing - I have ordered around 50 of them...you can paralell or series them:
http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/PPC-273/PHOTO-FLASH-CAPACITOR-270UF-330WV/1.html (http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/PPC-273/PHOTO-FLASH-CAPACITOR-270UF-330WV/1.html)
 
flash caps are good ones to use, since they are made to store and discharge power very quick -like what you want to do with caps in coil-shorting circuit,,.. common electrolyctics  are made to STORE power for fairly long periods in most uses for them, so these dont fill up as fast and easily since they arent really designed for that.
here are some HV diodes too:
http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/D660/RECTIFIER-DIODE-6-AMP/600-PIV/1.html (http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/D660/RECTIFIER-DIODE-6-AMP/600-PIV/1.html)


Thank you, very valuable info. I will try some flash caps. Seems that I need to fight more with electronics to understand how to control those spikes. I have audio DC capacitors like that one : http://uk.farnell.com/epcos/b43456a9478m/capacitor-4700uf-400v/dp/3878170

(you know , I don't want any explosion of it  :o )
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: TinselKoala on November 17, 2012, 09:45:38 PM
What? I am afraid I don't understand the schematic. When the driver chip's output goes HI, both mosfets will turn on, shorting both coil leads to "source". When the driver chip's output goes low, the mosfets are disconnected from everything except the "ac capacitor" , the fwb and the reservoir cap to the right.  This might allow that cap to charge with DC from current induced in the coils by the rotor motion, but where does any drive pulse to the rotor come from?
Please explain the schematic and what you are trying to do with it.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on November 18, 2012, 06:35:06 AM
Hi tinselK
take away those mosfets, and the circuit is a simple and normal induced-by-rotormagnets generator-coil circuit that fills up a DC cap after being rectified....you have to have "something" to be shorting at peaks, and that is the induced-power you get from the magnet sweeping by the coils in this particular circuit....what this peak coil shortin cirucit does tha tis good, is it fills up those caps much higher in voltage, and much faster than the "normal" circuit.
To spin the rotor with magnets that sweep past the coils, you can have any sort of motor, or drive coils built into the generator it doesnt matter that is whole other subject how the rotor will spin - do it however you want to...
This circuit is meant to show the circuit how to short some genrator coils at the peak period and fill up caps and that is it....it doesnt show how to spin the rotor, it doesnt show how to eventually unload caps to load either...for that the caps should be disconnected from the coils, whenever the caps do hit the resistive load in their discharge - this is called a  two-stage output circuit..
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on November 18, 2012, 08:22:40 AM




You can do the shorting on a transformer too, no rotor. Ill be testing it shortly...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on November 18, 2012, 07:20:37 PM
Hi Kehyo
yes why not -use that "dual 4047" circuit by Ron shown up above to sense the peaks if you want....keep that pulse width very narrow so you dont get extra draw from the shorting events....if 60hz as an example, try to get pulse widht less than 1/2 millisecond, and time it right at the peak too - - the peak is sort of a teeter-totter point, things can go either way right there, plus this is maximum voltage too, so this is place to short the coil/phase at....
what Ismael does is create the ringing from the short, then he shorts the ring-peaks too!...If you can do that you will be in fat city...that is purpose of that dual-4047 circuit, with the chopping feature using the 3rd pot...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: kEhYo77 on November 18, 2012, 08:59:47 PM
Hi Conehead.
As I said before I plan to use Arduino to generate the pulse, then I will measure on the scope the BEMF response.
I will know then, how long I have wait to make the shorting. Really easy to implement. I am winding some heavy ferrite cores now. I'll let you know how it goes.
I only recently have bought 100 supercaps needed hence the delay. $$$ :/
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: konehead on November 19, 2012, 06:04:04 AM
Hi Keyho and everyone
Here is drawing Ismael made for the EVGRAY yahoo group over a year ago - he is showing the wave-form you get when you pass a magnet by a generator coil, and then short it at the peak to make X3 power - which is good thing,  .... and then also in comparison,  he shows the CAP DISCHARGE DC-impulse trick to his MEG, where he first SATURATES the coil, then smacks it with 5 very quick shorts and he says there is 10,000 times power increase if you get it right......
he says that with magnet-generated waveform you dont get more power with additional shorts - since "no magnetic field" he explains...
Not sure what he means here exactly, but I assume the magnet-induced wave form is RECEEDING after the single peak-short, as shown in his drawing, so no way would it be saturated anymore.... but dont know for sure about that being the point he is trying to make.....
So he seems to say in this drawing and explanation, that its during the saturation-period, where you want to do the multiple shorts....anyways maybe this can be implemented in your BEMF sensing transformere aquino-controlled circuit Kehyo, maybe not...
 so I will assume he is  saying that you saturate first, and after and during saturation is when you short the coil - and do it multiple times too.....I dont know why a very strong magnet wont have abiltiy to saturate a coil -  maybe you need a core to saturate???  (not sure)
if all you need is proper core, for magnet-induced generator coils,  you simply would want to do mulitple shorts halfway up the ascension of the sinewave and stopping the shorting-events at the peak is what I see but like I keep saying, not sure...... here is the drawing and explanation by Ismael -  maybe this will  ring a bell for someone:
 
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Сергей В. on December 26, 2012, 04:45:50 PM
Ismael Aviso Big BREAKTHROUGH to run a big motor almost no battery with validation 2012

http://turbobit.net/3398apw32izo.html

FREE ENERGY BREAKTHROUGH BY AVISO
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: swompwalker on December 26, 2012, 05:48:56 PM
Messy out of focus video
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Qwert on December 26, 2012, 11:43:06 PM
Ismael Aviso Big BREAKTHROUGH to run a big motor almost no battery with validation 2012

http://turbobit.net/3398apw32izo.html (http://turbobit.net/3398apw32izo.html)

FREE ENERGY BREAKTHROUGH BY AVISO
After clicking the link, I got a page with an info:
"Our service is currently unavailable in your country.
Sorry about that."
After several more clicks through that page I got a Vivid application and NOT any video.
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: tagor on December 27, 2012, 08:10:01 AM

After several more clicks through that page I got a Vivid application and NOT any video.

nothing new , it is an old one video  (august)
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: FreeEnergyInfo on June 02, 2013, 02:17:47 PM
Hi Conehead.
As I said before I plan to use Arduino to generate the pulse, then I will measure on the scope the BEMF response.
I will know then, how long I have wait to make the shorting. Really easy to implement. I am winding some heavy ferrite cores now. I'll let you know how it goes.
I only recently have bought 100 supercaps needed hence the delay. $$$ :/

THANKS SXEMATIC ...
Title: Re: FUELLESS CAR PROTOTYPE by ISMAEL MOTOR
Post by: Сергей В. on June 06, 2013, 08:44:16 PM
Привет Konehead  :D

Have you got some good news from Isamael Aviso ??

Did you finished your last project - NF coil shorting your last motor?

If you are interesting i have some suggestions  about HF coil shorting. I mean on real High Power shorting - several tenths of KVolts and several KAmps. This mean back on old Russian Power Technology using checked and verified Military grade Ignitrons. I knew Ismael shorted OЭДС (Kick Back) pulses on peak envelope power exactly like Tesla did in his time. It's one of ways how to excite Aetheric - Etheric forces and get his counter actions. Problem is in that we can't use elemantary base and have not enough reserve funds to complete research and build new high voltage high amperage components so we need to use what Tesla had used. Tesla Mechanical controller is Ultimete Weapons in hands of people which know how and what to do. Meybe the best thing is to built one of his controllers. This of course need specialists from different disciplines and of course founds and much more time for lab work.

I wish you luck

Regards
Сергей В.