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Author Topic: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion  (Read 12183 times)

Offline christo4_99

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #15 on: September 10, 2010, 05:39:43 AM »

I believe that the toys page is giving examples of the different directions and positions of forces used within his wheel.

Any Comments?

Alex
i have a comment...imo:you are correct about the toys page being a concept that is used in the wheels...what you have to figure out though is the two apparent weight differences in the anvils and hammers and how they could possibly cause each other to continually rotate...it is the anvils,not the hammers that you should concern yourself with.

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Offline Alexioco

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2010, 01:08:55 PM »
I actually have never considered the anvils as I have always though them irrelevant which is kind of silly of me. So the anvils may also be weights?

Alex

Offline christo4_99

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2010, 06:00:36 PM »
I actually have never considered the anvils as I have always though them irrelevant which is kind of silly of me. So the anvils may also be weights?

Alex
what you have in the toys anvils/hammers drawing is three weights per mechanism,attached at the "handles",one mechanism is overall lighter than the other but also the lighter one is built with longer poles...also,the lighter hammermen seem to be twisted clockwise like a wound spring...so...to put it in the form of instruction:the heavier weights control the lighter weights in both cases,the lighter weights can cause just as much force as the heavy weights if a spring is employed since they have a different leverage advantage...

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2010, 06:00:36 PM »
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Offline Alexioco

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #18 on: September 13, 2010, 06:15:37 PM »
But what happens when the spring is unwound? Its got to be wound again...


Alex

Offline christo4_99

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #19 on: September 13, 2010, 06:54:08 PM »
But what happens when the spring is unwound? Its got to be wound again...


Alex
according to my theory of how bessler acheived P.M. it's not a question of how the springs get wound it's a question of what are the anvils...and saying that...how do you lift weights without other weights falling?see...because in my theory/design the weights are lifted and lowered by forces/weights that don't necessarily affect the center of gravity(= the anvils)...what i will not disclose is what i think the anvils represent...

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #19 on: September 13, 2010, 06:54:08 PM »
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Offline Alexioco

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #20 on: September 15, 2010, 02:35:31 PM »
The anvils may represent a weight. Because the two hammers are in a state of balance, the anvil being the 3rd weight would be enough to upset the two hammers and throw them out of balance. Or the hammer men may be the driving forces or the anvil (main weight) but i don't really agree with myself that the anvil is a weight because weights acted in pairs according to Bessler.
The anvil could be
1. an axle
2. a surface in which weights bounce off like an impulse
3. a simple rest for the weights as they swap

Bessler states that an anvil receives many blows, so they may represent some kind of contact point...

Alex

Offline AB Hammer

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #21 on: September 15, 2010, 10:51:07 PM »
Greetings Alex and all

 Lets look at what is an anvil. Most people think of a heavy piece of steel with a flat top and 1 or 2 horns off of it. This is only the basic smiths anvil. There are many types of anvils from round to square, from long to short, from steel to wood. Yes even wood can be an anvil. Bessler shows the hammer toys twice but in two slightly different designs.  This is just something to consider when thinking about anvils.

PS the toys have wooden anvils.

Alan

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #21 on: September 15, 2010, 10:51:07 PM »
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Offline Dr

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #22 on: September 16, 2010, 02:32:11 AM »
You know its kind of funny in a way, about the toys page!! But I have heard it explained many different ways, But no one really knows what Bessler had in mind, I believe the little men represent Heavy and Full (on one side of the wheel) and light and empty (on the other side). But it could just as well have something to do with a cord wrapped around an axle, or maybe a coiled spring, of course this a guess at best!!!

Offline christo4_99

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #23 on: September 16, 2010, 04:09:41 AM »
I agree with ABH.the anvils are made of wood.but unless someone gets a little further into my theory i will not say more.

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #23 on: September 16, 2010, 04:09:41 AM »
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Offline Alexioco

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #24 on: September 16, 2010, 06:21:37 PM »
I'm afraid i cant be bothered playing guessing games. If you have something special then, well done, if not, oh well... Keep up the good work any old how  :)

Alex

Offline AB Hammer

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #25 on: September 17, 2010, 04:38:44 AM »
I have to agree with Alex on this as well. Guessing games are not good for we have wheels to build and not give it all away, or show carelessly before their time.

Alan

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #25 on: September 17, 2010, 04:38:44 AM »
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Offline MT

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #26 on: September 23, 2010, 11:50:15 PM »
I agree with ABH.the anvils are made of wood.but unless someone gets a little further into my theory i will not say more.

Hi christo4_99 and all
Thanks for all the posts, reading them got an idea what anvil can be and how of universal motion can be done (at least theoretically)

For reference I attached original toys page. To me image represents two bistable switches and as you said top heavier and bottom lighter. You mentioned 3 weights per switch. Ok one weight can be anvil but it is not clear that other 2 weights are on handles or on toys itself but I would say weights at toys make more sense.

To me anvil looks like a mean to receive and transfer hammer kick to something else e.g. other switch. I think both anvils are meant to be firmly connected and thus when top switch flips also bottom does and vice versa. Yes bottom has more leverage but it also has longer poles!

Assuming:
- topswitch more weight than bottom at all times
- bottom switch has enough kick to flip top
- both switches operate solely on gravity
- top switch will never get to bottom or past a point where it is not practically switchable
 
a pendulum can be imagined to represent a "universal motion" of Bessler.

Tried to draw principle of it on attached picture. It represents starting position. In this position as top is heavier it rotates right. At certain angle (say 2hours) bottom flips and kick from it flips top also. Wheel should stop rotating right and start to move left. It passes 12 and again on certain angle on left side (say 10hours) bottom flips then also top flips and process continues. Wheel will oscillate using weight difference between top and bottom switch.

OK so far theory, question is it possible also design it? One thing, it is clear that top switch angle (angle between its two stable positions) should be bigger than bottom or it will reach angle (while rotating together with the wheel) where it will not be stable when kicked back.
 

Offline christo4_99

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #27 on: September 24, 2010, 02:24:16 AM »
to address this last post...i suppose you are guessing which way my theory goes with the toys page.it's not that simple.just let me say this: there are "lowly tendencies" which Bessler mentioned and i.m.o. what he was talking about is people tend to think alike...that is,he said a wheel is not a wheel and that's how he thought of it so you should too if you want to figure it out.so start from the beginning.all these designs that never worked are based on a wheel.i know this is vague but it's my theory and it's pretty simple just not as simple as a wheel with just weights and levers.you just have to think differently about things.now i will present a clue in the direction of how i developed my theory and if I'm wrong anyone is welcomed to correct me because i haven't read every post on every board concerning the Bessler wheel.here it is in the form of a question:why is it that the wheel was covered with a cloth?the default answer seems to be that the cloth was being used to conceal the mechanism.this may be true but to me it is very important to consider what we actually know to be true of the wheel.in other words i think the design itself incorporated the cloth for a very specific reason.and along these lines i have developed my theory.i have Incorporated ,as thoroughly as i can what we actually "know" about Besslers wheels and i have tried to find meaning in the things that he said about his principle of excess weight.and further i will give you exactly my concept of excess weight and my interpretation of how Bessler meant it.if we could build a wheel and constantly add weight where it is needed and remove it where it is not needed we would have this "excess weight".that's the principle.my interpretation of what Bessler meant is this:if you can find a way to raise and lower weights using weights that don't affect the center of gravity then you have "excess weight."now saying much more than this is really getting to the point where i am basically giving away my theory.i hope this satisfies those who think i am playing guessing games.

Offline MT

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Re: My Theory: The Nature of True Balance & Perpetual Motion
« Reply #28 on: September 24, 2010, 06:58:56 PM »
to address this last post...i suppose you are guessing which way my theory goes with the toys page.it's not that simple.just let me say this: there are "lowly tendencies" which Bessler mentioned and i.m.o. what he was talking about is people tend to think alike...that is,he said a wheel is not a wheel and that's how he thought of it so you should too if you want to figure it out.so start from the beginning.all these designs that never worked are based on a wheel.i know this is vague but it's my theory and it's pretty simple just not as simple as a wheel with just weights and levers.you just have to think differently about things.now i will present a clue in the direction of how i developed my theory and if I'm wrong anyone is welcomed to correct me because i haven't read every post on every board concerning the Bessler wheel.here it is in the form of a question:why is it that the wheel was covered with a cloth?the default answer seems to be that the cloth was being used to conceal the mechanism.this may be true but to me it is very important to consider what we actually know to be true of the wheel.in other words i think the design itself incorporated the cloth for a very specific reason.and along these lines i have developed my theory.i have Incorporated ,as thoroughly as i can what we actually "know" about Besslers wheels and i have tried to find meaning in the things that he said about his principle of excess weight.and further i will give you exactly my concept of excess weight and my interpretation of how Bessler meant it.if we could build a wheel and constantly add weight where it is needed and remove it where it is not needed we would have this "excess weight".that's the principle.my interpretation of what Bessler meant is this:if you can find a way to raise and lower weights using weights that don't affect the center of gravity then you have "excess weight."now saying much more than this is really getting to the point where i am basically giving away my theory.i hope this satisfies those who think i am playing guessing games.

Thanks for the tip, I think cloth cover was used as his whell needed to breathe. Better breathing = less air resistance for fast falling/casted weights ...

 

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