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Gravity powered devices => Gravity powered devices => Topic started by: SPANG on July 16, 2010, 09:26:50 AM

Title: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 16, 2010, 09:26:50 AM
Hi All,
      I've tried many times to 'post' my drawings' etc..., on this site, but I'm always told; Your files
are too big.
If any of you wish to see these files, then I'm affraid you'll have to give me your email address!
Sorry about this! Perhaps Stefan should/could do something about this(?)
By the way, you'll NOT be waisting your time.
Spang.       (BILL)
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: Airstriker on July 16, 2010, 09:30:30 AM
Hi SPANG,
I'm interested. Send it to my email and I will put it on my server for everybody to see.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: Low-Q on July 16, 2010, 11:21:35 AM
Hi SPANG,
I'm interested. Send it to my email and I will put it on my server for everybody to see.
You did bite right on the fishing hook. What is the problem with filesize? He is probably a spammer that sell our e-mails to explicit and bad companies... ;D
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: Airstriker on July 16, 2010, 02:58:01 PM
not really. There is a file size limit on this forum.
Restrictions: 10 per post, maximum total size 1100KB, maximum individual size 300KB.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 16, 2010, 04:58:48 PM
Thanks Jim,
               I'll let my wife do it ----- she knows more about these things.
I'll have to wait, untill she comes home ----- in a couple of hours or so!
SPANG.         Bill.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 16, 2010, 05:06:47 PM
To, Low-Q,
               You've deffinately got the right name ----- but you missed the 'I' out!
I am NOT a spammer, and I do NOT sell your email addresses ----- to ANYONE!   END OF!
I'm trying to HELP others, not ANTAGONISE them!
SPANG,         Bill.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: sm0ky2 on July 16, 2010, 08:36:20 PM
Bill,

if you right-click the picture file, select open with .... Paint
then you can clikc on FILE at the top, and select "save as"
and make sure the file-type is .JPG at the bottom, under the name.
this should make them small enough, if necessary, while open in Paint, before you save: you can click on Image ( at the top) and select Stretch/Skew. there s two % boxes, just make sure you set the lower % the same on both boxes, make it smaller. then save the file as .JPG
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: gyulasun on July 16, 2010, 09:35:39 PM
Hi All,
      I've tried many times to 'post' my drawings' etc..., on this site, but I'm always told; Your files
are too big.
....
Spang.       (BILL)

Hi Bill,

You can upload max.  5MB size files in the upload/Download section of this Forum. Click on the Upload/Download in the left hand side Menu column.
Here is that link:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=downloads

And a little down in the middle column of that page you can see Category Name and under it Movies  Pictures then General documents and files where you find place to upload etc.

rgds,  Gyula
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: poplianil on July 17, 2010, 05:48:51 AM
See this on same line but with output

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yheVAF-Zrvo&feature=player_embedded



or

http://gravityassistedpower.com/?page_id=5
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 17, 2010, 07:54:19 AM
Poplianil,
          I watched the video as you suggested, but think it's a load of hogwash!
 All I saw was some guy turning the  'pump' by hand. Sorry!
SPANG.         Bill.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: Low-Q on July 17, 2010, 11:42:11 PM
To, Low-Q,
               You've deffinately got the right name ----- but you missed the 'I' out!
I am NOT a spammer, and I do NOT sell your email addresses ----- to ANYONE!   END OF!
I'm trying to HELP others, not ANTAGONISE them!
SPANG,         Bill.
Sorry. My mistake. So many new members are yelling out amazing solutions, working devices etc., but we never hear from them again.
Again, I am very sorry for this big mistake. You are welcome to share your thoughts and ideas, and I will gladly help you out if you have any questions.

Br.

Vidar
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 18, 2010, 03:43:03 AM
Low-Q,
         I accept your apology!
Just to put matters straight though, I'll tell you ALL this;
I am NOT a 'new' member. In fact, I've been a member of this forum for many years, but something
happend ----- I moved house!
Because I moved house, I also had no choice but to change my service provider!
As a result, I had to re-apply for membership to this forum.
I also had to change my 'user' name ----- I guess that's why some of you think I'm a new member!
I must admit though ----- I very rarely pass comment on the work of others.
Hence, the lack of knowledge of my existance ----- on your parts!
I am a member of many other forums as well ----- mostly under different names!
All I ask for, is constructive criticism.  For me, "It won't work", isn't good enough.  I want to know
WHY you think it won't work. This type of reply, will help me (as it will others,) to give me/them,
the oportunity to put matters right.  Whether I/they succeed or not, is another thing ----- but at
least there'll be bullets in my/their guns!
BILL.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: Mr_Video on July 18, 2010, 04:30:30 PM
Quote
Because I moved house, I also had no choice but to change my service provider!
As a result, I had to re-apply for membership to this forum.
I also had to change my 'user' name ----- I guess that's why some of you think I'm a new member!

Um, unless I missed something,
Changing ISPs has nothing to do with your user account here,
or on any other site in the internet for that matter .


Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: mscoffman on July 18, 2010, 05:35:39 PM
Um, unless I missed something,
Changing ISPs has nothing to do with your user account here,
or on any other site in the internet for that matter .

@Mr. Video;

Actually…It’s slightly more complex then you indicate. Because very
often the BBS server wants to verify with your e-mail-address-of-record
before it will change the BBS account in any major way. Most people
when they are new get an e-mail with their ISP, and so use that as
their e-mail-address-of-record. Usually when you change ISP’s or
leave an institution it becomes almost impossible to have the old e-mail
address reestablished. Hence the catch twenty-two situation and
need to apply for a new user name. But I agree with Sprang, his user
ID was not new.

Reality is always somewhat more complex than theory, that’s what
gives me hope for FE solutions.

:S:MarkSCoffman
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: Mr_Video on July 18, 2010, 07:05:25 PM
@Mr. Video;

Actually…It’s slightly more complex then you indicate. Because very
often the BBS server wants to verify with your e-mail-address-of-record
before it will change the BBS account in any major way. Most people
when they are new get an e-mail with their ISP, and so use that as
their e-mail-address-of-record. Usually when you change ISP’s or
leave an institution it becomes almost impossible to have the old e-mail
address reestablished.

What you say up to this point is correct,
but there is no "Catch-22" situation that I have ever heard of,
I just changed the E-mail on my account, and I was never asked to verify it, but some forums do require verification to change an E-mail, and on the forums that do, the E-mail verification always gets sent to your new E-mail address, and maybe a notice may go to your old E-mail (for security reasons) .

When you change your E-mail, a forum does NOT depend on verifying your old E-mail, that would be insane,
because EVERYBODY would have to re-register if they change ISPs, and I have never even heard of anyone having to do that before now, and I've been on the 'net for a long time, and I am an admin on 2 other forums .

I have two friends who recently moved and we all belong to 3 different forums, and they never had to re-register on any of them . lol

Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: Airstriker on July 18, 2010, 10:29:00 PM
As promised, I give you SPANG's device info send to me on email (I edited it in a way to meat forum's restrictions):

Quote
OVERBALANCING WHEEL
                   ___________________

This design, consists of; A 'top-wheel' (which is in
fact, two wheels,) a bottom-wheel, also two wheels, and
a pair of small wheels/cogs(?).
There is also a'pivot-arm', and a 'pivot-arm' connecting
-arm. Please see drawing. There are also a pair of
'continuous' chains.

Please don't forget; this idea is just that, an idea!
I have NOT built this device yet ----- I'm simply
looking for 'feedback'. Of course, I may be wrong -----
but that's the way it goes. I've been wrong before -----
and I'll probably be wrong again!

Anyway, here's how I think it will work.

The object of this device is to create EQUAL forces on
the top-wheel, which will overbalance due to the
positions OF these forces.
To start with, these forces are generated from the
bottom-wheels, and are produced by BOTH bottom-wheels.
The weight of each bottom-wheel, is basicaly up to you,
but I've gone for 20kgs each! 40kgs in total.
This means, there is a force operating on the top-wheel
of 10kgs + 10kgs + 20 kgs ----- 40 kgs! See drawing.
Because the bottom-wheel is supported by one side of
each chain (the other side being slack,) the bottom-
wheel will try to 'drop' ----- on the slack sides.
As it tries to drop, the slack-chained side of each
wheel, will be the direction each wheel will try to
'fall'. It's pretty obvious really, what will happen if
these wheels DO manage to drop ----- they will,
eventualy, tighten up their slack chains, and the whole
device would come to a standstill. This is something to
be avoided ----- like the plague! I thought about this
for a while, and came up with what I think is the
answer.
By placing two small wheels/cogs at the 6 O'clock
position on the bottom-wheel, this will prevent the
bottom-wheels from dropping, because, as each of the two
bottom-wheels try to drop, they will rotate their own
bottom-wheel, which, in turn, rotates one of these
small wheels/cogs. Because each of the bottom-wheels
is supported on different sides of their vertical axis,
these two small wheels/cogs will rotate in different
directions and opose each other ----- PREVENTING the
'drop' from happening. This leaves each bottom-wheel
with their 10kg force(s) ----- at different distances
from the top-wheels hub, and will cause overbalancing.
As I say, I might be wrong, there again, I might be
right! This 'judgment', I leave up to you.
This set-up, ensures the correct speed for each chain.
There is one wheel supplying its own force (and chain
speed), for each of the top-wheels two wheels.
Let's hope I'm right!

Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: Airstriker on July 18, 2010, 10:31:47 PM
To be honest, I don't really understand the way, the chains are mounted to the wheels. Could you explain it better SPANG ? Why some of them are drawn as discontinuous lines and some are solid ?
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 19, 2010, 02:11:41 AM
Airstriker,
          Thanks for getting these documents on this forum for me. Well appreciated!
As to your query, the discontinuous lines equal the 'slack' section of each chain -----these slack sections of chain contain no force!
BILL.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 19, 2010, 02:49:54 AM
After having studied my own 'text' accompanying my drawing, I've seen a mistake which I'll now
put right!
I said, the forces acting on the top-wheel are; 10kgs + 10kgs + 20kgs ----------------- this is
incorrect!     What it SHOULD have read was; 20kgs + 20kgs.
How I made that mistake ----- I don't know!
Never mind ----- it's put right now. I just hope it hasn't 'put you off'.
BILL.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 19, 2010, 04:45:05 AM
Mr_Video,
            Just to put you right ---------------- my ORIGINAL email address  (being different from
my current address) was in MY name!
THIS email address, is in my WIFES' name, and I was not allowed to use (couldn't), my original
email address! So, I had to re-apply for membership. What you were saying, is allmost like calling
me a liar!  I'm NOT!
BILL.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: Low-Q on July 19, 2010, 08:33:32 AM
If the weights are limited by the wheels physical dimensions to elevate and descent there will never be possible to make this work. Gravity works vertically, and ofcourse there is no change in potential energy in the left or right of the wheel that will force it to work. Regarding username on a forum, the explanation smells a bit fishy:)
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 19, 2010, 08:44:36 AM
Low-Q,
        Obviously, you don't understand!  Sorry!
I AM telling the truth about my registration ----- why don't you look at my profile?
It quite clearly states that my email address is, in fact, that of my wife!  Sorry!
BILL.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: Low-Q on July 19, 2010, 03:41:13 PM
Ok. Let us forget about this now. I replied in your duplicate post also. Sorry for any misunderstandings I have brought up recently.
Vidar
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: mr_bojangles on July 20, 2010, 03:52:07 AM
if the forces equal each other then it should be balanced and not moving
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 20, 2010, 07:09:28 AM
mr_Bojangles,
                  Two identical forces, at different distances from their hub, do NOT balance -----
sorry pal!
BILL.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 21, 2010, 02:32:47 AM
I feel I have no choice but to try and build this device! The replies I've been recieving, lead me to
believe that I HAVE to build it -------------- just to prove my theory!
Please bear with me, as I have various dissabilities that prevent me from going fast!
It will take quite a while ------------- but not too long, I hope, to put this device together.
BILL.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: AB Hammer on July 21, 2010, 10:58:16 PM
Greetings Bill

 I haven't forgot about you. I have been busy and also suffered what is called a micro stroke. I am allot better now. I have 2 1/2 weeks of armor left and then I get to do wheel without having to build armor. ;D

To all

 Don't take Bill's design lightly for there may be more to it than meets the eye. Only test will show. ;)

Alan
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 22, 2010, 12:44:31 AM
Hi Allan,
         Nice to hear from you again ----- I DID think it was funny my having
notheard from you for so long!  I'd appreciate any help I CAN get ---------
especialy from the likes of you ----- as you seem to be well connected!

I too, have had MANY mini-strokes ----- about 8/9.  T.I.A's, I think the're
called?  I've also had two 'normal' strokes  (if you can call them that!  In
my case, they left me allmost blind, and with loss of balance. I also had a brain-bleed, but thankfully, my brain still works!
Keep your chin up pal!
Hope to hear from you in the not too distant future.
GOOD LUCK.
BILL.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: mr_bojangles on July 24, 2010, 01:53:27 AM
mr_Bojangles,
                  Two identical forces, at different distances from their hub, do NOT balance -----
sorry pal!
BILL.

that might be true, but you have this twice so each side has a corresponding counterweight

the wheels are balanced, and because of this there would be no torque on either axle,

unless you spun it initially, in which case the center of gravity of each wheel is never displaced at all, and no shifting of mass means no movement, especially if it is balanced

and if you have to initially start it, that would imply it is not gravity but a gearing mechanism that appears to increase rotational inertia, which as well implies that it would work with a fixed axle parallel to the event horizon (or on its side negating gravitational pull due to the balanced weights of the wheels)

balanced wheels will only move if a force is applied, and i do not see where this would come from
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: SPANG on July 24, 2010, 03:35:08 AM
MR - bojangles,
                    I'm glad to see you taking an interest in my design, however, I have to disagree with you.
There are only TWO forces involved here, and they are 'delivered' to the top-wheel by the two chains.
It does NOT need a 'push' to get it going -------------- it is self-rotating!
BILL.
Title: Re: A Totaly Different Type Of Overbalancing Machine
Post by: Low-Q on July 24, 2010, 11:41:48 AM
A few rules of thumbs, that applies to any gravity/magnetic powered devices:

1. If all parts in a motor that is based on tensions or magnetism, and are only able to rotate, or not able to move in any direction, there will never be excess potential energy left to power the motor.

2. If all parts in a gravity wheel are limited to move within a given area or altitude during a complete closed loop/revolution, there will never be excess potential energy to power the wheel.

3. The same applies to permanent magnet motors as well, but the force are from magnetism, and not from gravity.

For success you all need to think of another way to make a gravity wheel or magnet motor to work.

Vidar