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Author Topic: Bismuth core Joule thief  (Read 61763 times)

Mk1

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Bismuth core Joule thief
« on: June 17, 2010, 12:14:37 AM »
@all

I got one more idea last night , i personally don't have the tools and materiel , to build it , but maybe some of you do ...

We need to build a toroid from Bismuth ...

I have gathered some info on the subject .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-9SQfDzZn4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUoUSz-hD8A

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bismuth


Mark



 
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jadaro2600

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #1 on: June 17, 2010, 06:00:48 AM »
Looks interesting.  Any other results to report? ...it might not be so difficult to make a mold for a toroid, all that's needed would be a pre-existing toroid.

Lead is also diamagnetic.  ...meaning that most bismuth alloys would also work just as well.  They may even melt faster for you.
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resonanceman

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2010, 03:50:02 AM »
Quote from: jadaro2600 on June 17, 2010, 06:00:48 AM
Looks interesting.  Any other results to report? ...it might not be so difficult to make a mold for a toroid, all that's needed would be a pre-existing toroid.

Lead is also diamagnetic.  ...meaning that most bismuth alloys would also work just as well.  They may even melt faster for you.


It would be great if bismuth could  be used for toroids.
Thinking  that lead free solder should  have alot of bismuth I tried  a few coils........ so far I have not  got any  of my tries to oscillate at all

All of them have been made  with bifilar twisted pair...... at least 16 turns....
The largest core was a 1 pound spool of solder.... the smallest  was about 14 inches  of solder.

tomorow I may try adding  a few wraps of solder to a few  working JTs just to see if anything happens


gary
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Pirate88179

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2010, 05:54:41 AM »
What is the reason for this?  If you want a material that magnetizes and de-magnetizes instantly faster than ferrite try Met-glass.  Otherwise ferrite is the best choice here.

Bill
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jadaro2600

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2010, 06:17:27 AM »
those lead-free solders are mostly tin.

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Mk1

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2010, 06:30:24 AM »
@pirate

I was thinking about the NS coil , and some other devices that to me work in the same way , it got me thinking about the Kapa and the briefcase devise that show lamination of aluminum bismuth and copper , with a sync link to ground , i just can't find it now , but BUT the briefcase is a tesla coil , yes one connect to ground goes into a coil that one into a second one spark gap then cap to ground , just like Wordenclife i suspect the coil of being an electromagnet NS type , the A.B.C plates could be battery , and after some research Bismuth can be tweaked into a solid electrolyte , it also generates a huge magnetic field . Look into fuel cell for more detail but what if we could make a fuel cell without the fuel and replace it by the magnetic pulse making it a magnetic cell.


I hope someone get what i am saying on this ,  :D i bet not .

So i am looking into making a cell that work like the NS but with a solid  electrolyte that is also the core ...

The best way to see how it could work is to make a JT  ;D.

Mark
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resonanceman

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2010, 12:52:40 AM »
Quote from: Pirate88179 on June 22, 2010, 05:54:41 AM
What is the reason for this?  If you want a material that magnetizes and de-magnetizes instantly faster than ferrite try Met-glass.  Otherwise ferrite is the best choice here.

Bill

Bill

How  can you  be sure  what is the best possible  choice.?

I am sure that if OU is possible  it will be found in the  quirks that are ignored  or explained away  by conventional  teaching.

The  fact  that bismuth is the most paramagnetic  material sounds  like a quirk to me.......... it also sounds  like what  it  can do  has not  been studied much......to me that is another hint  that there might  be something  to it.

I think I read that someone said  that bismuth puts out a huge magnetic field.......if that is true...it might   be a better primary wire than  copper..

I am not  assuming  anything  about it.......I just think  it is an bismuth has some interesting quirks  that I think are worth looking  into.


gary


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resonanceman

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2010, 01:02:20 AM »
Quote from: jadaro2600 on June 22, 2010, 06:17:27 AM
those lead-free solders are mostly tin.

Jadaro     

OK ........
I read  on one of the links  a few posts back that bismuth  was used in solder..... I had some solder and  felt more like experimenting than  researching.

````````````````````````````````

Does anyone know of a common  product  that  is mostly bismuth?
A link also  said  it was used  for sinkers.....I checked walmart..... all of theirs seem to be lead.

gary

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resonanceman

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2010, 01:23:24 AM »
Quote from: Mk1 on June 22, 2010, 06:30:24 AM
@pirate

I was thinking about the NS coil , and some other devices that to me work in the same way , it got me thinking about the Kapa and the briefcase devise that show lamination of aluminum bismuth and copper , with a sync link to ground , i just can't find it now , but BUT the briefcase is a tesla coil , yes one connect to ground goes into a coil that one into a second one spark gap then cap to ground , just like Wordenclife i suspect the coil of being an electromagnet NS type , the A.B.C plates could be battery , and after some research Bismuth can be tweaked into a solid electrolyte , it also generates a huge magnetic field . Look into fuel cell for more detail but what if we could make a fuel cell without the fuel and replace it by the magnetic pulse making it a magnetic cell.


I hope someone get what i am saying on this ,  :D i bet not .

So i am looking into making a cell that work like the NS but with a solid  electrolyte that is also the core ...

The best way to see how it could work is to make a JT  ;D.

Mark

Mark

I think I saw a video about that briefcase device.   I did not understand it.
If you are right ........and bismuth  puts out a bigger magnetic pulse than other metals  it could be very useful  for  many things......including JTs

In one of the links it showed  a bar  of bismuth  being  attracted to a magnet then repelled by it....  If  a bismuth  wire coil  had a similar response  ..........if it made a big pulse then  collapsed or reversed......wouldn't that make  a faster JT?
Wouldn't  that  be a faster rate of change..... closer to a disruptive discharge than  a normal JT?

gary
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Pirate88179

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2010, 02:07:44 AM »
Gary:

I was talking about a core material, not for primary winding.

Bismuth can be easily obtained from shotgun shells, just be careful unloading them if they are live.  The pellets are bismuth instead of lead.  I read this somewhere on the net.

Bill
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resonanceman

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #10 on: June 23, 2010, 03:14:06 AM »
Quote from: Pirate88179 on June 23, 2010, 02:07:44 AM
Gary:

I was talking about a core material, not for primary winding.

Bismuth can be easily obtained from shotgun shells, just be careful unloading them if they are live.  The pellets are bismuth instead of lead.  I read this somewhere on the net.

Bill

Bill
Yes you clearly were talking  about  bismuth as a core material.

I was thinking along wider lines.

If  others here want this to  be  only  about bismuth cores I will keep to myself  about other possibility's.

I am thinking  if it is usable  at all  for cores......it is probably great for  other things ....... I can't explain  why I think this.... you could call it intuition.

gary

Edit

thanks  for  the information on  shotgun shells...... a quick  search shows that some of them but not all of them are a bismuth alloy

Nearly pure bismuth  can  be found  on ebay for a little over $15 a pound    I am not  sure  yet if this is a good price or not.

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resonanceman

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2010, 03:45:46 AM »
Given  the low melting point of bismuth  it should be very easy to make a crude core.

supplys

a little  bit  of good quality car wax as mold release

A short  section of  plastic  pipe  or something else to act as a  ridgid support   on the outside of the mold.

A tube of silicone rubber.

A toroid  or  toroid  shaped  material of the right size.  ( a wax toroid  would not need mold release )

A small metal bowl stainless  would  be ideal.
a metal  measuring spoon  might  be good enough for a small core.

A blowtorch

pliers or visegrips for  holding on to the  metal bowl while heating and pouring.



`````````````````````````````

I  would  start  by  putting  a nice even layer  of silicone rubber in the short section of  plastic  tube  as a " floor "  for the toroid .

I would  get this first layer  as level as I could then  let it sit a few days to cure.

The outer tube should   be  cut to  be even   with the  toroid plus the  floor .

I would then  put a  coating of car wax over the  toroid .......  It might  be a good idea to test  a few samples first to make sure the that particular wax will  be an effective mold  release with for silicone rubber.

next I would  fill  the  mold to be  with silicone rubber........then place the  waxed up  toroid into the center  of the whole works.
I would then use  a  straight edge  of some kind to scrape  off the excess silicone rubber so that the top  of the toroid is right at  the surface.

I would  give it a week or so  to cure.............then  press on the underside to pop  the toroid  out.

A blowtorch  and a small metal bowl of some kind should  be all that is needed to melt the  bismuth.

once the bismuth  is melted  pour it into the  mold  .......let it cool....then pop it out.


gary




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Pirate88179

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #12 on: June 23, 2010, 03:47:04 AM »
For those that want to learn about bismuth, this video is done by a cool professor who has a series of videos.  Here is the one on bismuth:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyIo-c7VmIM&feature=related


It is radioactive and emits alpha particles, which I did not know.  It is considered meta-stable however.

Bill

***EDIT***      I went back and watched the posted video again and it is weird.  The old professor says it is the heaviest metal on the elements chart that is NOT radioactive and yet his lab assistant says they discovered 5 years ago that it is.  It sounds like it is very, very low level and she was holding a crystal form of it in her hand and was not concerned so it must not be any big deal.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2010, 09:22:01 AM by Pirate88179 »
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WilbyInebriated

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #13 on: June 23, 2010, 04:45:15 PM »
bismuth and stubblefield...
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Mk1

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Re: Bismuth core Joule thief
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2010, 01:34:54 AM »
@wilby

You got it , just imagine a 3 layer sandwich bismuth (modified to be  a solid electrolyte) so it could be aluminum /bismuth (electrolyte/reactor)/ carbon plate turned into a coil think tpu size coil , then put a coil around it(secondary) and a switching device on the coil to kick it.

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