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Author Topic: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory  (Read 14378 times)

Offline lumen

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Re: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory
« Reply #15 on: June 15, 2010, 06:44:41 PM »
Ok, so I apply a force to a magnet to accelerate it to speed V within my frame of reference. Then I accelerate another magnet to the same speed. Both magnets have the same mass and react with each other to leave one stationary and the other moving at 2v in my frame of reference.

How does that work?

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Re: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory
« Reply #15 on: June 15, 2010, 06:44:41 PM »

Offline Rosphere

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Re: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory
« Reply #16 on: June 15, 2010, 11:50:25 PM »
Ok, so I apply a force to a magnet to accelerate it to speed V within my frame of reference. Then I accelerate another magnet to the same speed. Both magnets have the same mass and react with each other to leave one stationary and the other moving at 2v in my frame of reference.

How does that work?

Good question.

Reference frames with respect to mechanical systems are easy for me to contemplate, (BSME.)  Electromagnetic reference frames are something that I only started to ponder today, after my reply to this topic.

Let's see,... we would need individual reference frames for the electronic components, the Earth, the Sun, the Milky Way Galaxy, and the entire Cosmos.

But electric and magnetic fields spread out in all directions, far away from the outer bounds of the physical components, like a ball or the floor, and they intermingle in 3D space, unlike a ball against the floor.  The effects of a simple spark can not be confined to the component, the Earth, the solar system, etc.

Is it even possible to define reference frames in electromagnetic terms?

I need to think about this for awhile...

EDIT: (My two posts thus far on this subject are reactions to the posts only as I have not yet stolen enough time to read the posted PDF.  I hope to read it tonight.)
« Last Edit: June 16, 2010, 03:31:19 AM by Rosphere »

Offline smoky

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Re: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory
« Reply #17 on: June 16, 2010, 06:43:12 AM »
This could be a valid explanation for the Donald Duck motor generator OU system at
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-MQvzOCNSI

Different frame of reference for the "pushes"

??

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Re: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory
« Reply #17 on: June 16, 2010, 06:43:12 AM »
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Offline exnihiloest

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Re: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory
« Reply #18 on: June 16, 2010, 09:35:45 AM »
Quote
...
We already explained that the force must be fast enough in order to catch and to push the ball.
However, we forget to mention that acting force should be an Impulse, without passing extra path.
...

Meaningless. What means "fast enough"? How much? What means "passing extra path"? Where is the impulse applied from? Where are the equations? Those in the pdf are wrong or misinterpreted. It has to be honestly rewritten.

Milkovic's pendulum is a usefull device for some applications but under unity and perfectly explainable with current known physics laws. Nothing more. Or prove it by making it selfrunning instead of providing misleading math; this work would be much more profitable. If we had "12 times more output than input" as stipulated, this should be very very easy...


Offline exnihiloest

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Re: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory
« Reply #19 on: June 16, 2010, 10:04:06 AM »
...
Is it even possible to define reference frames in electromagnetic terms?
...

It is not possible if you refer to fields. For example if you are stationary between the very large plates of a big capacitor moving along the plane of the plates, you can't see a moving field.
A field is just scalar values representing some space characteristics at every point (Feynman's definition) and when the values are constant it doesn't a matter if the source is moving. It is the same thing with a disk magnet rotating around its magnetic axis: the field is constant everywhere therefore the field doesn't rotate.
It follows that we can't take a field as "reference frame".



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Re: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory
« Reply #19 on: June 16, 2010, 10:04:06 AM »
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Offline Cloxxki

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Re: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory
« Reply #20 on: June 16, 2010, 01:47:16 PM »
X
O-----o
      X
^    ^
|     |
|     |

X              magnets, moving upward.
--            magnets' respective initial vectors
O-----o     launch arm and pivot, massless and lossless.

The arm falls in place, beind the left, and in front of the right magnet. Right magnet exerts force on the lever, immediately transferred to the left magnet. Due to the pivot of the arm being further offset less the lateral distance between the magnet paths, the force transfer is fast enough, and end speed of the right magnet (near) zero. Elasticity of the arm might assist in accomplishing complete KE transfer.

According to Milkovic, the vectors can be added to result in double velocity for left magnet.
According to E=1/2 MV², it cannot.

Am I understanding this right?

Offline Rosphere

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Re: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory
« Reply #21 on: June 17, 2010, 12:58:09 PM »
Meaningless. What means "fast enough"? How much? What means "passing extra path"? Where is the impulse applied from? Where are the equations? Those in the pdf are wrong or misinterpreted. It has to be honestly rewritten.
...

I do remember my engineering classes.  Units were very important.  Remember Hubble?

Not just English to Metric units; we could always check our answers for gross errors by checking the MLT, (Mass, Length & Time,) characteristics of our answer against what was expected: If our answer was in meters per second, (length over time = L/T,) and we were expecting an L/T^2, (acceleration,) answer, then we knew we made a mistake somewhere in our math because we got velocity, L/T.

I got stuck/lost on page three of the PDF and completely lost interest after that.  They proposed transferring energy using a force, while on the previous page they state momentum as the transfer unit.

mass = M
length = L
time = T
velocity = L/T
acceleration = L/T^2
momentum = mass*velocity = M*L/T
force = mass*acceleration = M*L/T^2
work = energy = force over a distance = M*L/T^2*L = M*L^2/T^2
power = work done over time = M*L^2/T^2/T = M*L^2/T^3

So, instead of using momentum, M*L/T, he uses a force, M*L/T^2, or M*L/T/T.  This is why he needs to state that it is an impact force, he needs to eliminate the "over time" part of the force, (/T), to get back to the momentum transfer.

Then there were all of these extra stipulations or definitions of how the force was always constant everywhere and I started to doze-off.  I wasted about an hour typing a response here and then I deleted it without posting.  I felt like I was getting sucked into another lead-out theory discussion around all the overunity spewing out of a simple pendulum because someone was twisting the basic rules of the game.  I was not up to tearing down the window dressing hung up around the force about how this force shall act and how this force shall be applied, again.

The whole set-up on the top of page three just blew me away.

...
Milkovic's pendulum is a usefull device for some applications but under unity and perfectly explainable with current known physics laws. Nothing more. Or prove it by making it selfrunning instead of providing misleading math; this work would be much more profitable. If we had "12 times more output than input" as stipulated, this should be very very easy...

Yep.

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Re: New Breakthrough in Over Unity Theory
« Reply #21 on: June 17, 2010, 12:58:09 PM »
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