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Author Topic: Working Air Battery  (Read 184528 times)

Offline mscoffman

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #165 on: July 12, 2010, 02:49:51 AM »
@all

Guys have a look a this fire from a potato.

One potato emptied in the middle filed with salt and toothpaste , 2 wire they seem the same material , so i don't thing galvanic here , 5 minute and voila enough current to start a fire , its probably a trick but if real really worth looking into .

http://wickedhowtos.com/index.php/2009/05/28/how-to-make-fire-with-a-potato-potato-battery-cotton-ball-fire/

@Mk1

It’s a guess, but most likely the potato battery is voltaic but not
a normal battery reaction, One where the reaction does not go ahead
unless current flows though a low ohm load external resistance.
It probably is a standard ionic Chemical reaction that is occurring
as a chemical reactant concentrations flows towards the center,
and that the wires act as voltage probes rather then chemical
reaction sites.

Most likely the toothpaste needs to contain sodium fluoride.
Fluorine is the most powerful and electronegative of all ions.
Most likely the salt acts as an astringent to draw fluids out
of the potato tissue. Raw potatoes contain Alkaloids Which
are chemically basic end make raw potatoes taste somewhat
bitter. It also might be the calcium metal in the potato.

It would be interesting to try other nightshade foods: tomatoes
and eggplant, too see if these might make good temporary
batteries too.

The fire part occurs from the small electrical spark. Shesh,
lunch could get dangerous.

:S:MarkSCoffman

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #165 on: July 12, 2010, 02:49:51 AM »

Offline Mk1

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #166 on: July 13, 2010, 12:45:46 PM »
@all

I just posted my first battery prototype here

http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=9346.msg248575#new

With pictures and meter reading ...

Mark

Offline jeanna

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #167 on: July 14, 2010, 01:58:03 AM »
@ Dr Zoldberg,
It would be great if you can give us more information about the gel electrodes. That is very interesting information, indeed.

@Conrad.
This is probably the answer to my puzzlement.

I will see if I can set up my scope in a way to measure what you are seeing in yours. Meantime, I will figure on the half point and see if it corresponds to the amount of light output I am seeing.

Thank you,

jeanna

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #167 on: July 14, 2010, 01:58:03 AM »
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Offline sm0ky2

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #168 on: July 15, 2010, 08:36:46 AM »
if you take a potato, and you place 2 probes in it, at a distance
it creates a nice battery. its a potassium reaction that is stimulated by the current flow. an almost identicle thing happens with a lemon. [2K + 2H2O -> 2KOH + H2] the hydrogen fuses with oxygen at the anode (?) and forms back into water.

you can run a clock straight off a potato for weeks. just put probes on the plug and stick it in. adding the salt probably acts as some sort of catalyst. (or reactant with the toothpase to help start the fire?) potatoes are actually a suprising source of energy.
if you were willing to sacrifice the minerals in your soil, you could probably run the farm off of them, instead of selling them for food...



Offline DrZoidberg

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #169 on: July 15, 2010, 08:37:15 AM »
@ Dr Zoldberg,
It would be great if you can give us more information about the gel electrodes. That is very interesting information, indeed.

I used a small medical solid gel electrode and put a copper coin and a piece of zinc on it. I got about 0.85V and 40 µA. If I use a wet paper towel instead I get 100 µA. So I get less then half the current from the solid gel but the big advantage is that it never dries out.
The current may seem a little low but that's because I wasn't able to put the gel in between the coin and the zinc. I put both on the same side of the gel electrode.
It also is sticky which should come in handy if I want to use manganese dioxide in my battery.
Now I just need to find out if I can dissolve that gel, maybe in acetone, so I can soak paper in it. Then maybe I can build a powerful zamboni pile.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #169 on: July 15, 2010, 08:37:15 AM »
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Offline jeanna

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #170 on: July 17, 2010, 01:19:27 AM »
Here are 2 pix of 2 airbats running a beefy joule thief circuit.
The jt circuit makes 441v spikes when being driven by a AA battery, but with a 25mA airbat, I am getting 45v at 38khz.
The second pic shows the same circuit being run by a 5.1mA airbat. It is a 1/2 inch cu pipe wound with mg ribbon and completely taped. When it is soaked, it gives 5.1mA.

jeanna

Offline plengo

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #171 on: July 17, 2010, 10:34:20 PM »
This project is simply amazing. Not only it is demonstrating history of Natan Stumblefield in its primary origins but also opening new doors.

I had an idea. Based on the Big 1 1/2 amp 2 batteries with the tick carbon rod and Magnesium and after a few days it oxidized (here at http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=9276.msg246347#msg246347) I thought about:
- What would be the effect of this same battery under a Bedini Radiant charge effect? Would it rejuvenate the Mg battery (NS battery) and reverse the oxidation and therefore promote longer life or it would not help?

I wonder based on Natan's patent that his battery is in reality 3 things at once, battery, coil and radiant receiver (secondary battery if it was a Bedini monopole)  just like this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuQGuXJ02fo&feature=related). That could explain (if my idea is correct) that it would run for a much longer time than chemical reactions allow, all because of the positive effects of radiant energy.

Fausto.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #171 on: July 17, 2010, 10:34:20 PM »
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Offline Mk1

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #172 on: July 19, 2010, 05:57:22 AM »
@all

I got more detail on the potato lighter mixing fluoride and salt make fluorine ...

Look at this video to see the power of fluorine  :o

http://www.disclose.tv/action/viewvideo/50237/Fluorine_new_Periodic_Table_of_Videos/

Offline jeanna

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #173 on: July 19, 2010, 06:48:12 PM »
@MK1. That was a good and scary video. hmm my teeth! ...do not add salt to tooth gel while brushing my teeth?
OR... become a fire breathing dragon in 2 easy steps, using only tooth gel and table salt! No match is necessary!  ;D  ;D

----

I think I actually have a qualified air battery.  8)
I had forgotten to add the salt when I made my latest, so I made a very strong solution of epsom salts after the fact and both soaked the battery then sat the air battery into what was left which was about 1/2 inch in the bottom of a glass.  It really blasted the lights. My meter said it was making over 147mA. amazing.
Then I let it dry out and it produced less than 1mA. So, I sat it into plain water, and it immediately took off.
After about 10 minutes... maybe less, I poured the water out of the glass and 24 hours later, the lights are not as bright, but they are bright and on and the battery feels dry.

So, maybe this is a real air battery..
That would be cool.

(please recall that this is a 1"cu pipe 7" long with 30 -32 turns of mg ribbon ( = 100 inches) half taped around it, and using cloth as separator.)

thank you,

jeanna

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #173 on: July 19, 2010, 06:48:12 PM »
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Offline zhak

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #174 on: July 19, 2010, 08:34:55 PM »
Good afternoon
I present to you the experience of the life of one man, in Russian
--------------------------
Ð’ далеком 18.. (не помню точно) году русский ученый Василий Петров соорудил батарею состоящую из чередующихся медных и цинковых кружков, между этими кружками была проложена ткань, чтобы изолировать кружки друг от друга, затем в эту батарею залили пресную воду и погрузили в лодку,в лодке был установлен электромотор мощностью около 2 киловатт, батарея установленная в лодке выдавала примерно такую же мощность, после этого несколько дней проходили испытания на одной из рек, электромотор работал бесперебойно, не подвела и медно-цинковая батарея , выводы были такие- без расхода какого либо топлива(за исключением воды, мизерный расход) можно было питать электромотор в лодке, такая батарея очень хорошо подходит для речного транспорта оборудованного электромотором. На этом все и закончилось. Ð’ далеких 90Ñ… нашего века во времена кризиса электроэнергии в Казахстане я вспомнил о этой батарее Петрова и попробовал соорудить несколько усовершенствованную батарею Петрова, суть этого эфекта в том что между двумя металлами разделенными водопроницаемым изолятором(у Петрова была ткань) возникает электрический ток, соединяя параллельно или последовательно добиваются нужного напряжения и мощности, воду для батареи лучше брать дистиллированную, дольше прослужит(проверено),так как мощность и напряжение в этой батарее зависит от площади соприкосновения то вполне логично напрашивается вывод - чтобы создать компактную и мощную батарею нужно использовать тонкую медную и цинковую(или покрытую цинком фольгу) , а изолятором хорошо послужит тонкая синтетическая тюль, после собираем батарею    медная фольга - тюль - цинковая фольга -тюль -медная фольга и так далее и получается в итоге батарейка работающая на воде + небольшой выход водорода(идет само электролиз воды). Собрал я такую батарейку из того что было под рукой(кусочки медной и покрытой цинком фольги), не было даже тестера чтобы измерить напряжение и мощность, но методом тыка, подсоединял лампочку 4,5 вольта, добился яркого горения, батарея работала пол года после была выброшена за ненадобностью(появился свет), все те пол года пока не было света эта батарея давала свет(маленькая лампочка от фонарика) и позволяла слушать радио. А так вполне можно делать такие батарейки, будут служить годами, но похоже не выгодно производить государству такие долгоиграющие батарейки.
------------------------
It says: the battery that served for many years, required only sauce distilled water or pure water, consisted of copper foil + synthetic tulle + zinc foil.
Note: no salt in the water! This extends the work!

Offline conradelektro

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #175 on: July 19, 2010, 09:31:36 PM »
@zhak

I think that kitchen paper towel comes pretty close to synthetic tulle.

I did long time tests with copper - aluminium and copper - mild steel (both separated by kitchen paper towel soaked with water):

- tap water without salt works but gives less ampere than salted water;

- after two to three weeks the cell (or battery) stops working because strange deposits have formed on the metals; washing and scrapping off the deposits and replacing the paper brings the battery back to life; therefore one should come up with a design that allows easy assembly and disassembly;

- total submersion of the metals in water only works for some hours (therefore one should use paper).

I am on the way to try silver and zinc and will report the results.

I never tried magnesium because I consider it dangerous (fire hazard).

A very good anode would be graphite, but I did not discover a good source in Central Europe yet.

A very good combination concerning voltage is graphite in combination with magnesium but silver in combination with zinc comes very close to it (and is easier to get; silver coated copper wire is not expensive; also zinc coated wire is not expensive, many nails are zinc coated).

Did you replicate the "Russian battery"?

Greetings, Conrad








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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #175 on: July 19, 2010, 09:31:36 PM »
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Offline mscoffman

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #176 on: July 19, 2010, 10:36:31 PM »
Russian to English text translation c/o "the fish"

---

translated from zahk's post;

In order to create a compact and powerful battery all that is necessary is to use
thin copper and zinc disks (or disks covered with zinc foil), and as insulator thin
synthetic tulle cloth which will serve as a water permeable insulator. One gathers
the battery together as copper foil - tulle cloth - zinc foil - tulle cloth - copper foil
and so on to obtain the resultant small battery pile working with water, plus a low
yield of hydrogen gas. It produces the electrolysis products of water automatically.

[Web link defining Tulle cloth];

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulle_netting

In the year 1918. (I do not remember the exact date)  Russian scientific Vasiliy
Petrov built this battery consisting of the alternating copper and zinc disks,
between these circles was lain cloth, in order to insulate disks from one another.
Then fresh water was poured into this device and it was mounted on the
inside of a boat. In the boat, an electric motor with the power of ~2KW was also
mounted and the battery connection provided about the same power to run it .
After this several days of undergoing tests on a river, the motor ran constantly
without interruption, but all this work did not bring this copper-zinc battery
to exhaustion even though it consumed no fuel (except for a very scanty
expenditure of water) Since it was possible to feed electric motor on the boat  -
this battery would be well suited to river transportation. These batteries
were also used to power a radio.

So even though it is completely possible to make such small batteries, and they
will serve for years, It most likely is not profitable to produce these long lasting
small batteries.


---

Natural water will contain some ionic minerals and CO^2 is absorbed
by any standing water to yield carbonic acid ions.


:S:MarkSCoffman

Offline conradelektro

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #177 on: July 20, 2010, 12:33:20 AM »
@mscoffman and all interested in simple batteries:

There seems to be a grave error in the Russian text.

Look at a "voltaic pile", e.g. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d3/Voltaic_pile.png

It is obvious that the right order of metals and tulle is the following:

copper
tulle
zinc
copper
tulle
zinc
copper
tulle
zinc

There must always be a zinc plate in touch with a copper plate (besides the first copper and the last zinc plate). The Russian text omits this "touching of metals" in a voltaic pile and proposes tulle between all plates. This would cause 0 Voltage (in case the first and the last plate is of the same metal) or just one "copper - zinc" difference in Voltage over the whole pile (which is around 0.5 Volt).

And it is hard to believe the 2 KW.

Interesting, already in 1918 there where tall tales about technical achievements. And I thought that started with overunty.com  :)

Greetings, Conrad

Offline jeanna

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #178 on: July 20, 2010, 12:55:02 AM »
Just another update on my next air battery. Today I remembered to really soak the cloth in the strong epsom salts solution. With 32 turns around the 1" copper pipe 7 inches long I got 201mA.
That is my record.

I am liking that I can get these results using a small length of a copper pipe that is available at the hardware store... not to mention the $3.40 price of it.
A "D" cell is the same diameter, and about 2 1/2 inches long.
With the copper wire that forms a hoop at the top it is the same as 3 "D" size batteries.

I am now lighting 6 leds in series from the secondary of this, which means that if I add 3 more strings of  6 leds in parallel, it will be as bright as the 24 led lobe light in the camper, which is a great lamp.

 ;) Hmm I am wondering if I can slip the pipe over a "candle" in a standard lamp and run that lamp from a bright jtc. Looks like a trip the the thrift store is coming up. (that is more fun than moving isn't it?)  ;)

-------------

I also want to report on the carbon stick wound with a little mag ribbon.
That is only 3 inches long and I wound just about 6 times around which might be 4 inches length of mag ribbon.
I made a special jtc for it without a base resistor but with a 47uF cap at the base, (like the 'mosquito' that lidmotor did). That puppy lights 2 leds in series off its secondary for days before needing a drink.

I am reporting this because it is easy to think if I do not say anything it has stopped.
It has NOT stopped.

thank you,

jeanna

edit add:
Quote
And it is hard to believe the 2 KW.

Interesting, already in 1918 there where tall tales about technical achievements. And I thought that started with overunty.com  :)

 ;D ;D

Hi conrad,
I agree the 2KW is really hard to believe.
I am glad you said it!

Also,
Stephan has been using graphit paper. We called it carbon paper in the states. We used to use it for making pressure copies of typed documents. Maybe there is a store with old stock that has some?

jeanna

Offline Mk1

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Re: Working Air Battery
« Reply #179 on: July 20, 2010, 01:28:59 AM »
@jeanna

Try to take your mag/copper battery and carbon rod , and try to make a battery between the carbon and copper by using the copper side lead of your battery (paper on the carbon rod ,your battery lead copper side twisted around the carbon rod), and check the voltage between the magnesium and the carbon ...

Mark

 

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