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Author Topic: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....  (Read 181254 times)

Offline jadaro2600

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #75 on: January 09, 2010, 02:54:04 AM »
This thread is very interesting to me, I think i'm going to try to wind my own trigger coil - I just don't have the means to buy one at the moment.

Do these devices contain a ferrite core?

Judging by the simplicity of the schematics posted here, it seems all that I need is a small coil, with yet another coil wrapped about it each sharing a common connection?


Offline jadaro2600

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #76 on: January 09, 2010, 03:10:40 AM »
I just used a prefab inductor from a dsl filter, and wound about 20 turns of magwire around the outside, as described in my last post, I used a common lead, and a diode off the free end to a capacitor bridged to ground and it's reading 45 volts...

a capacitor from ground off a diode directed from the other free end of the 20 turns revealed 2.6 volts.

This was coming from a 1.2v source.  Pretty cool.  I'm not sure how many windings are on the inductor itself, but the ohmic resistance is about 3.8 ohms.

These trigger coils work pretty well on this circuit.

Offline jeanna

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #77 on: January 09, 2010, 03:12:58 AM »
Hi jadaro,
I just got a reply from jonny today about how to put it together, and he told me to take apart a flash camera circuit and use the trigger coil from there.
I did cuz I got 3/$1 from goldmine last year.
The wire must be a 40 awg. It is the skinniest wire I can imagine.
I am also planning to wind my own, but after I get this done.

Yes, in answer to your direct Q, it is ferrite wound like those helmholz inductors you used earlier this year, only with thin wire.

Sirmikey,
I pm'd jonnydavro because I was unable to get started because I am so far behind in making this kind of thing.
I will give you a copy of what jonny sent me so it can save him the trouble. These are clear instructions and worth repeating.
Thank you jonnydavro!

Quote
To get started you need 2 trigger coils.
1 for the oscilator and
1 to make a resonant reciever circuit.
These can be obtained from any flash camera or you can buy them from mouser.
If you use a camera coil,then you will need to solder three wires onto the pins.

The output is the top pin which goes to the xenon tube and use your multimeter to find continuity between the other two pins but make sure you don't use the output pin twice as i think it protrudes through to the bottom.
If you are going to use alu pans you will need two for the barebones(output and base ariel) and 4 for the full setup(output/base ariel/positive line /negative line)I find that when you use so many pans it takes a fair bit of space so i am using small stainless steel cups which i can get 4 for £1 at a local poundshop and these work really well and make it far easier to adjust things as when you build this you will find that pan placement plays an important part in performance.

So i will run through the build and i would do this on a breadboard and you need plenty of croc leads.
I have been measuring current with a voltmeter across a 1 ohm resistor on the positive input.

1.croc lead from batt positive to 1 ohm resistor
2.1 ohm resistor to primary of trigger coil +
3.negative of trigger coil to collector of mpsa06/2n2222/bc182 or try what you have handy
4.emitter of transistor to negative of battery
5.base of transistor to alu tray via croc lead
6.output of trigger coil to alu tray

This is the bare bones

7.croc lead from alu tray to negative or can be put in series with the negative input
8.croc lead from alu tray to positive or can be put in series with the positive input
Points to watch out for

To start the oscilator you want to have the base tray near the output tray and touch them together briefly or with your hand to get it going.
If it does not start,reverse your trigger coil primary connections.
Move the base tray away from the output tray to decrease amp draw and i have also found that if the negative output tray is brought near the base tray,amp draw is reduced.I position my trays/pots with the output tray on the left,base in the middle and negative to the right and leave the positive some distance away from these three.
You will need to make an led detector to see the wireless energy but you should see the voltmeter reading somthing.i would try and run it below 100mA and i find 50-60mA works good from a 12v supply.When you get it going you can experiment with lower voltages.

The led detector is just an avramenko plug with an led and a croc lead in a loop with each end connected to the one end of the avramenko plug.
The wireless reciever circuit is important as it amplifies the recieved signal and makes the leds really bright.
This consists of your 2nd trigger coil with the output going to a 10uh and then a 22uh inductor in series and then into an avramenko plug and then into a string of leds and of the negative leg of the last led you put a croc lead going to another alu tray as a virtual ground.

I am still not too sure which is the + lead is, so maybe someone here can help me.

jeanna

Offline sirmikey1

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #78 on: January 09, 2010, 03:47:00 AM »
Thanks Jeanna ;)  Hopefully someone can post a drawing once all of the detalis are worked out.  MASS REPLICATION AND THIS WONT GO AWAY...
Dr. Stiffler called it "near infinite lighting".  These circuits can be referred to as the milk and the meat!  The meat is the "Lighting Maker" (current magnification) IMO.   Just my 2 cents...

Exciting...
Mikey

Offline slayer007

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #79 on: January 09, 2010, 03:53:09 AM »
I noticed the exiter seems to run better when it's under load.
In this video I have the pan with the AV plug going to a big 12v battery for a load.
I also thought it was kinda cool how the cfl will light off the run battery.

I don't think it will charge the big battery but I'll let it run for awhile and see.

Here is the video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79EIv-na_o8

Offline jeanna

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #80 on: January 09, 2010, 03:55:31 AM »
This is lidmotor's version with the 2 pans. I believe this is the one jonny refers to.
I will also post the address for jonny's circuit, although I believe it is more complicated than this.

jonnys circuit address:
http://img121.imageshack.us/i/torroidsec1.jpg/

jeanna

Offline xee2

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #81 on: January 09, 2010, 04:59:21 AM »
Hopefully someone can post a drawing

This is a drawing I made from his video but I am not sure it is correct. The circuit he described to jeanna seems more like Lidmotor's circuit.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2010, 05:25:27 AM by xee2 »

Offline jeanna

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #82 on: January 09, 2010, 05:51:26 AM »
I put jonnydavro's pm to me in the blue quotes.
My suggestion is to copy and past it onto a document on your computer.
He told me the lidmotor drawing was the one to use.

I am only mentioning this because many times I see the blue quotes box and skim over it.
I put it there so nobody would think it was my idea, but it does kind of hide it.

jeanna

BUT maybe I am on the wrong thread.
I wanted jonny's sec with pans that lid copied.
This thread seems to be about chilliqueen's 2 transistor circuit.
(my personal limit is 1 transistor and 1 battery, so I'm outta here.)
Sorry to bud in!

cheers!

jeanna

edit
Here is lidmotor's video for ease and reference
http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=Lidmotor#p/u/5/2Rzw4FRovnI
« Last Edit: January 09, 2010, 06:16:14 AM by jeanna »

Offline sirmikey1

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #83 on: January 09, 2010, 06:13:30 AM »
Jeanna,

   You are correct, xee2 appears to have missed our posting of Darvo emails; though I don't think Lid was using the second receiver trigger coil.  He was hiking the input voltage to 12v instead, if I recall correctly. I also recall him mentioning "600 volts".  I don't have a 1000pf cap, am using the flash camera cap (1000uf) and measuring 300volts (still climbing).
   Thanks for your input, and please stay with this thread.

Regards,
Mike     

Offline slayer007

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #84 on: January 09, 2010, 10:35:20 PM »
My last attempt to charge the big battery failed.
So now I'm taking a different approach and it seems to be working very well.

The transformer is going to some AL tape around one of the batterys.
That battery also has a diode on each post facing backwards.
Then running over to the other 12v battery.
There is also a piece of AL foil around the AA batterys with an AV plug running back up to the batteries.

It's only been running for close to a half hour but both batteries are charging from just two AA batteries.

Here is the video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Trx91_-sW4

Offline jonnydavro

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #85 on: January 10, 2010, 12:48:23 AM »
Hi Mike and all.The circuits Jeanna posted are for my simple sec pan oscillator and also my torroid Sec and these are not based on chilliqueens circuit but are both oscillators which produce the SEC wireless and one wire energy transfer which is what i am researching at the moment but they contain useful imformation that can be utilised to increase the performance of the super joule thief circuit regarding wireless and one wire operation.
My chilliqueen Sec circuit can be found at the start of this vid.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZanIc5nS78A
Since i made this Vid,i have found that by adding a croc lead and a pie tin/metal bowl to the base of the npn increases the brightness off the wireless leds and also alows you to control current draw by moving the base pan closer or further away from the output pan as i do in my pan oscillator.
Mike you asked about the brightness of my leds well the reason they are so bright is that i am using a reciever circuit that resonates at the same frequency as the transmitter.The reciever circuit requires just as much thought as the transmitter side and if they are both on the same frequency then recieved energy is greater.Its like a radio tuned into a radio station and a radio does not load the transmitter.
I am doing the same as Dr stiffler except he is using matched towers and i am using 2 of the same trigger transformers and in both cases they act as transmitter and reciever.We really need a radio man on this and then i bet output would be increased further.Maybe Gadget can have a think about this as i know he is a ham radio licence.
Also,the avramenko plug/led strings need to have a virtual ground on the last negative leg of the led string.This consists of just a croc lead going to a aluminium pie tin or pot.This is vital for bright leds.
Hope this helps.Regards jonny.
@Xee2.Your circuit diagram of my chilliqueen sec just needs the lower metal plate moving to the npn base and i think thats it.I was also using a 1.5v emergency phone charger which outputs 5.5v which i recomend people trying if they see one.Thanks for taking the time to do that.I would have taken a pic of the drawing i did but my cat left me a present on it as it don't like the cold.grrrr.Many thanks jonny.
@Slayer.Quite amazing you can do that of two 1.5v batteries,I wonder if its loopable back to source.Nice.Jonny

Offline xee2

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #86 on: January 10, 2010, 01:56:59 AM »
@ jonnydavro

Thanks for sharing your results. It is amazing that you can light the LEDs wirelessly so far away from the transmitter.

A new drawing is attached. I would like to replicate some of your experiments, but I do not have any large space to work in and I am afraid the high voltage fields may damage things like the TV and computer. Have you had any problems of that sort?






Offline resonanceman

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #87 on: January 10, 2010, 04:05:43 AM »
This is a drawing I made from his video but I am not sure it is correct. The circuit he described to jeanna seems more like Lidmotor's circuit.

Xee

If I understand  your drawing 
All that  is happening is  the circuit is  driving the  trigger coil
Then the trigger  coil is causing a static charge on the pan
The  static  charge on the pan is causing  ripples in the eather
Scaler waves?
The  ripples  are being picked up by the other pan.

It is incredible that it is that simple.

What if the transistors were bigger and the pan was 100 times bigger?
WHat if the  voltage  of the static charge was 100 times more?



gary

edit

This makes me wish I had tried to see how  high I could  get the voltage  of a JT

If  I am right about this......there is a good chance that anyone  with a JT over about  1000 V should  be  able to  do wireless  like this  just by connecting  a  pan to one side of  the secondary

I am not sure what to do with the other side of the secondary.......maybe  just connect it to a cap..........or  a ground



Edit again

An ignition coil  should  work  like a big  trigger coil.
Connect  both  terminals to a secondary.
Then  connect the  high voltage output to the plate.
I would suggest  a well insulated plate

It is late..........I think I will try this tomorow

gary
« Last Edit: January 10, 2010, 04:48:43 AM by resonanceman »

Offline sirmikey1

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #88 on: January 10, 2010, 07:28:27 AM »
resonanceman,

   You may want to see this video which is the JT used to pulse a "Stun Gun" KV circuit (current magnification?).  Lidmotor and Kooler's project. 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGJKtYbGLw4

Mikey

Offline sirmikey1

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Re: New Jewel Thief "Resonate LCR Circuit" Much less energy draw....
« Reply #89 on: January 10, 2010, 08:44:05 AM »
xee,
   Another member here has said that the original JT needs to be measured by running the transistor C&E through a full rectifier bridge.  I get around 7volts on the old JT.   Your method shows around 40 volts, but he is speaking of a DC spike that you get with your one diode method.  I sent him your Chilliqueen mod to see if he can help us there also. 
Later,
Mikey...