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Author Topic: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo  (Read 29178 times)

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #75 on: December 29, 2009, 12:13:48 AM »
Electrostatic cooling is well documented and does not take "millions of volts"

e.g.


LASER BEAM REFLECTOR SYSTEM
United States Patent 3703813
An electrically conductive laser beam reflector is cooled by a high voltage electrostatic field created between the reflector and a probe spaced from the surface of the reflector on the same side of the reflector as the impinging laser beam. The cooling effect by the electrostatic field is of essentially the same distribution as the heating effect of the laser beam thus eliminating different and varying temperatures gradients in the reflector and the resulting distortions in the beam.

Your source even says "high voltage."  I am dealing with low voltage.

Also I never said "electrostatic cooling" requires millions of volts. I said it would require millions of volts to cool my device down by means of electrostatic cooling.

The amount of voltage depends how much mass, the desired temperature drop, and thermal  conductivity. In my case the magnets are rotating at ~ 10000 rpms, and thus the effective thermal conductive is very high. There's zero, as in 0.0000000000000 chance this is due to electrostatic cooling.

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #75 on: December 29, 2009, 12:13:48 AM »

Offline Vortex1

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #76 on: December 29, 2009, 12:52:29 AM »
For the record, I am able to log 1.5 kilovolts as read on my ElectroStatics Model 9000 electrostatic meter held one inch from a piece of plastic tape rotating on my dremel tool. The meter reads that the charge is positive(+).

With the tape removed and a sanding disc the same diameter, there is nothing registered on the meter.

I have repeated this several times. The positive charge is being accumulated on the plastic due to air friction. It dies away when I shut the dremel off.

This is consistent with my guess that electrons are ripped off the toroid insulation causing a very low level surface cooling effect as picked up by the IR Temp meter.

I will do some tests with temperature probes to see if the cooling effect can be induced.

Please excuse my interruption, I'm probably way off base, just reporting what I see.

Kind Regards.....V

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #77 on: December 29, 2009, 12:54:48 AM »
1.5KV is far from millions of volts. 1.5KV on an insulator is nothing. Even rubbing against a piece of tape can cause more voltage than that, but such low voltage is not going cool it to any measurable temperature here.

Anyhow, as stated I've performed those experiments already. The rotating magnet without the toroid *heats* up, it does not cool down. It heats up because of air friction.

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #77 on: December 29, 2009, 12:54:48 AM »
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Offline Vortex1

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #78 on: December 29, 2009, 01:13:07 AM »
Agreed, however in my tests with a dual thermometer the electrostatic cooling effect is rapid, however air friction seems to shortly override it causing the frictional heat to prevail with a resulting temperature rise after the initial drop.

I made no claims for the temperature of rotating magnets or stationary toroids. No toroids or magnets in my test....yet.

Just trying to demonstrate an initial temperature drop of a stationary object near a source of rotating positive (+) electrostatic field.

Anyone wishing to get a good idea of what can be done with electrostatic cooling should read the attached patent. Extrapolate the numbers downward and form your own conclusions.

Kind regards.....v
« Last Edit: December 29, 2009, 01:37:52 AM by Vortex1 »

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #79 on: December 29, 2009, 01:24:09 AM »
Maybe under the correct conditions where the goal is to achieve good electrostatic cooling one could cool it by a few tens °F, but in my experiment it actually increased by 0.2°F. Humidity probably makes a difference as well. Maybe how much the tape has been handled by hands makes a difference from oil. Regardless, +0.2°F, -0.2°F, either way is far from the 2.5°F that occurred when the toroid was under the magnets. I still don't know for certain what caused it.

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #79 on: December 29, 2009, 01:24:09 AM »
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Offline plengo

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #80 on: December 29, 2009, 03:19:06 AM »
When I was playing with an Adams motor one of the claims by Dr. Adams was that the coils indeed cool while the motor runs.

I did measure the temperature of my coils at the time using a probe and a DMM meter. The probe is a physical sensing tool no lasers. My findings did show cooling off of the coils at about 3 to 4 F too.

I tried to eliminate any wind on the setup and I was satisfied with my findings. The coils indeed cool under the correct conditions.

Needless to say that the Adams motor works in a similiar way than the current theories of how the Orbo is working. (Magnets attracted to the core and a pulse nullifies that polarization allowing the motor to continue its spin).

Fausto.

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #81 on: December 29, 2009, 04:20:00 AM »
Hi plengo,

You Adam's motor sounds interesting. 3°F to 4°F is a significant temperature drop! Has anyone tried to make one self-run? And where could one find the plans to build one of these Adam motors that you built?

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #81 on: December 29, 2009, 04:20:00 AM »
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Offline plengo

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #82 on: December 29, 2009, 04:26:56 AM »
Hi plengo,

You Adam's motor sounds interesting. 3°F to 4°F is a significant temperature drop! Has anyone tried to make one self-run? And where could one find the plans to build one of these Adam motors that you built?

I build a few Adams motor ( or at least I tried ) some 5 years ago. Most of the material I purchased from the official site at (http://www.aethmogen.com/index.shtml) and another member of our forum here has created this great site (http://www.totallyamped.net/adams/).

I will be replicating Orbo using my last Adams setup but with a spin. I think Adams was not only using his coils but also he may have closed the loop, in effect transforming his bifilar coils into a toroid, therefore making more sense today why he claimed overunity with his motors.

Most of the good material is for sale (I am not advocating to purchase it but it has good data) from that official site.

Fausto.

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #83 on: December 29, 2009, 07:34:23 AM »
Thanks for the links. Lot of good info. I just came across this at rex research,

http://www.rexresearch.com/adamotor/adamotor.htm

Seems close to the eOrbo design.

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #83 on: December 29, 2009, 07:34:23 AM »
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Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #84 on: December 29, 2009, 07:54:10 AM »
Not to get away from the eOrbo design, but just wanted to mention a quote from a guy who replicated an Adams motor, "I ran these experiments on the Adams motor many years ago now, however I never forgot those results because the temperature was so obviously cold. I must have hit the right tuning spot with the geometry."

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #85 on: December 29, 2009, 06:06:31 PM »
Earlier I did a lot of experiments with no toroid, just the spinning magnets. There are two *measurable* effects here that I can see -->

1. Heating from air friction. The magnets slowly heat up due to air friction.
2. The magnet temperature quickly changes to the ambient temperature.

Ambient temperature is almost always changing due to the outdoor temperature, the Sun, wind, appliances, etc. There's only a short moments that occur twice per day when the outside temperature (over all) does not change, and those are the peak and lowest temperature of the day. Everything in the room has different thermal conductivity, including the dremel motor. More importantly, if the dremel has been running in the past 30 or so minutes it can be a few tens °F above ambient. So, when the dremel is first turned on, it will quickly drop to ambient temperature, but eventually will begin to heat up. Constant temperature fluctuations & gradients of objects in a room of a few tenths is common. Anyone who has an IR gun or temperature probe will see that.

So those are the two measurable effects I see. No doubt there's some electrostatic cooling, but it seems that is so small it's unmeasurable in this case. If my dremel motor & magnets are at the same temperature (less than 0.1°F) as ambient temperature, then the magnet temperature does not drop, it increases. If the dremel has been used in the last 30 or so minutes, it & the magnets can be a few tenths °F above ambient, in which case the magnets will quickly drop in temperature by a few tenths °F, and then begin to slowly increase, reaching ambient, and go above ambient.

Although, the above is nothing new & unexpected. Obviously #1 above, heating from air friction, was occurred in my video, which would only increase the toroid / magnet temperature, but in the full uncut video I use the IR gun to show the ambient temperature at various spots such as the wooden desk, and the ambient temperature was 67.2°F to 67.8°F. Yet the toroid / magnet temperature dropped to 64.6°F!  IMO this seems to be due to an unknown magnetic effect. This effect has been noted in other very similar magnetic machines such as the Adams motor, and is definitely worth investigating!



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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #85 on: December 29, 2009, 06:06:31 PM »
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Offline wings

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #86 on: December 29, 2009, 07:06:46 PM »
find in internet:

http://www.moletrap.co.uk/forum/comments.php?DiscussionID=546&page=1

and a theory:

""energy gain from magnetic viscosity:

You need to bring the magnets together in "attraction" (no effort required to achieve this and you can actually gain and store some energy on the way in)

Wait long enough to allow the attractive field to maximize (pause is required in order to align the domains as fully as possible)

Then flip into repulsion to separate the magnets very quickly (energy required to flip into repulsion but less than that required to exit while in attraction. Use some of the kinetic energy you stored on the way in.). If the magnets are separated quickly enough, the domains will not be fully relaxed. They will continue to do so after the separation. So there will be a field of diminishing strength which can be used for a brief period of time.""

related to magnetic viscosity

http://www.bitzracing.com/steorn/

http://gigagauss.com/Home.html

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #87 on: December 30, 2009, 01:20:27 AM »
My IR gun is pretty narrow as it is, 12°. You can think of it as a 1 pixel thermal camera. ;-)

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #88 on: December 30, 2009, 05:19:54 PM »

Here are further details after further analyzing my video. It is now clear that the IR gun was not pointing at the toroid. Rather, it was pointing at the magnets. The temperature of the magnets dropped 2.9°F down to 64.6°F.

So it appears all of my attempts to replicate my video were wrong since such replications were pointing the IR gun at the toroid. Hopefully today I can find out more from further experiments.


Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Cooling effects in Steorn eOrbo
« Reply #89 on: December 31, 2009, 04:47:00 PM »
The part of half of yesterday was spent on replicating my video again. This time the IR gun was pointed at the magnets, but it showed 0.°F cooling, which is too close for comfort to say it was cooling.

Just as seen in my full video, I pointed the IR gun at the various locations to get measurements of the ambient temperature. Everything was pretty much the same as the video, except the magnets did not cool 2.9°F.

The next step is to let the magnets and all rest for two weeks and try it again.

The other half of the day was spent on making my interpretation of the Steorn eOrbo replication. That should be up and spinning today.

 

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