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Author Topic: N-machine theory tested  (Read 14110 times)

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #15 on: December 12, 2009, 03:31:49 PM »
It appears Craigy's device is producing AC.

Most of that is most likely due to contact voltages and the contact changing. If he would just place a 0.1ohm resistor across the voltage meter and make a lot better contact (perhaps from graphite brushes) then it would go away.

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #15 on: December 12, 2009, 03:31:49 PM »

Offline broli

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #16 on: December 12, 2009, 03:38:32 PM »
PL can you illustrate your latest experiment, I have a hard time understanding what you mean.

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #17 on: December 12, 2009, 03:57:14 PM »
In the 1st experiment the current flowed through the NdFeB magnet from inner to outer edge. I wanted to do the same thing, except have the current separate from the magnet. So in the 2nd experiment the placed a wire that routes from the battery to the center of the magnet (perpendicular), then when the wire almost touches the magnet it routes parallel to the magnet to the magnets outer edge, and from there it goes to the batteries other terminal.

There was a rotational torque on the wire, but there was absolutely no rotational torque on the magnet.

So I think whatever N-machine effect there might be, it's something else other than what Bruce told me.

Paul

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #17 on: December 12, 2009, 03:57:14 PM »
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Offline broli

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #18 on: December 12, 2009, 04:17:21 PM »
Does the below illustration show what you did? If so are you 100% positive the whole circuit if allows to rotate on a free axle rotates? This alone is something substational, I recommend you redo the experiment attaching the circuit to an axle so it can rotate.

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #19 on: December 12, 2009, 04:23:42 PM »
I don't have the equipment to put it on an axle right now. My NdFeB magnet is not even 1" in diameter. Maybe a bit over 1/2" diameter.

BTW, anyone trying these experiments should use magnets with high coercivity such as NdFeB. Ceramic magnets due terrible when they're thin because of their low coercivity.

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #19 on: December 12, 2009, 04:23:42 PM »
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Offline gravityblock

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #20 on: December 12, 2009, 04:35:22 PM »
PaulLowrance,

If the magnet is fixed (such as being on the carpet), then the external circuit will rotate.  If the circuit isn't attached to both the axis and the rim of the magnet, then there will be no rotation.  Here's a few simple homopolar motors showing this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9greHLiR5c&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xnxf1WeXxgk

GB


Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2009, 04:37:57 PM »
PaulLowrance,

If the magnet is fixed (such as being on the carpet), then the external circuit will rotate.  Here's a few simple homopolar motors showing this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9greHLiR5c&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xnxf1WeXxgk

GB

No, that's not the experiment. The experiment is about getting the magnet to rotate, not the circuit.

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2009, 04:37:57 PM »
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Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2009, 04:46:30 PM »
Conventionally speaking, the magnet should not rotate.

I think the attention should be placed on Bruces inertia & gravity experiments where he demonstrated something very interesting happens to rotating objects. If the n-machine is cop>1, then maybe there's a change in the metal disc compared to the external wire circuit.

Offline gravityblock

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #23 on: December 12, 2009, 04:50:48 PM »
No, that's not the experiment. The experiment is about getting the magnet to rotate, not the circuit.

The magnet isn't going to rotate if the outside circuit isn't attached to both the axis and the rim of the magnet.  You must have a force on both ends (the axis and the rim) before there is rotation.  You're forgetting that the nickel coating on the magnet is the same as a disc glued to the magnet.  If current doesn't flow through this nickel coating or the disc, then there is no torque on the magnet.  Remove this nickel coating on the magnet, and you can spend a lifetime trying to get the magnet to rotate without success.  Having a contact at the axis only, is the same as having no nickle coating or disc attached to the magnet.

GB

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #23 on: December 12, 2009, 04:50:48 PM »
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Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #24 on: December 12, 2009, 04:57:25 PM »
Both experiments proves there's no angular force on the magnet itself, which is in agreement with conventional physics. The force is on the electrical current.

I recall telling Bruce that the outer edge of his disc experienced 9000 G's centrifugal force. That's a lot of G's! IMO that's the secret. His large machines spun at over 10000 rpms. If the n-machine has a smaller diameter, then it should be made to spin at a higher rpm.

Twice the radius = twice the centrifugal force at the same rpm.

Offline Craigy

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #25 on: December 12, 2009, 05:08:46 PM »
do you mean like this? not really sure

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3aPQqNt15-o


edit missed post above sorry

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #25 on: December 12, 2009, 05:08:46 PM »
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Offline gravityblock

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #26 on: December 12, 2009, 05:09:26 PM »
Conventionally speaking, the magnet should not rotate.

Likewise, a magnet won't rotate if there is no current flowing through a coil in regular induction.  The disc or conductive coating is similar to a coil.  If only one lead is attached to the conductive coating, then it's like only having one lead connected to a coil.

Your experiment proves nothing because it is doing nothing.  Try to get a magnet to move with only one lead connected to a coil.  It's not going to happen.  You must have a force on both ends (the axis and rim) just like having both leads connected to a coil.

GB

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #27 on: December 12, 2009, 05:20:15 PM »
Likewise, a magnet won't rotate if there is no current flowing through a coil in regular induction.  The disc or conductive coating is similar to a coil.  If only one lead is attached to the conductive coating, then it's like only having one lead connected to a coil.

You're experiment proves nothing cause it is doing nothing.

First one proves the magnet does not produce an opposing force, which is the magnet & the current flowing through it rotated.

Second one proves that the current itself does not cause the magnet to rotate.


Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #28 on: December 12, 2009, 05:22:44 PM »
do you mean like this? not really sure

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3aPQqNt15-o


edit missed post above sorry

No, current is flowing through the magnet in that one.

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: N-machine theory tested
« Reply #29 on: December 12, 2009, 05:26:18 PM »
My 1st experiment was conclusive, but the 2nd one was not since it's more difficult to perform. maybe someone else could do it with bearings & on an axis.

 

 

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