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Author Topic: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power  (Read 179322 times)

Offline i_ron

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #330 on: September 26, 2014, 08:30:10 PM »
Ron:

I annotated your drawing and attached it here.  In position 1 the magnetic field comes in at the "top" of the hall sensor (where the black band is).   So in your interpretation you are calling that "South" because your sensor is telling you flux is coming in the top and going out the bottom of the sensor.  You say that flux going in an "up to down" direction is "South" so you label that part of the coil "South."

Likewise in position 2 you see flux entering by the "bottom" of the hall sensor so you call that "North."

The reality is what you see in the annotated sketch.  There is NO "North" or "South," there is just the convention that we have adopted that says "flux direction coming towards you" is "North" and "flux direction going away from you" is "South" when you position yourself above or below the core in your sketch and you look towards the core.

I don't know if you can understand that but your drawing of the cross section of the coil core with the polarities at each corner of the cross section is completely wrong.  The reality is the orange lines of flux with the directional arrows as I have drawn them out.  There is NO true "North" or "South" there is just flux direction as per the convention that we have defined.  All that "North" and "South" really mean on a bar magnet is that flux is "exiting" from the "North" end of the magnet and "entering" at the "South" end of the magnet.  It's a  just a naming convention.  In reality the flux lines are closed loops with no "start" or "end" or "North" or "South."

The only thing the hall sensor is showing you is the amount of flux and the direction of the flux.  It's up to you to make sense of that information and right now you clearly are not making sense of it and you are drawing conclusions and making statements that are wrong.

A stack of cylindrical magnets will line itself up with the field created by the coil.  You are stating "how can the North of the stack of magnets be attracted to the "North" part of the coil?"  The answer is that there IS NO "NORTH" PART OF THE COIL.  Repeat, the cylindrical magnets simply line themselves up with the field created by the coil.

This madness, this endless spinning and grinding and arguing and getting nowhere, could be remedied if you locked yourself away in a room for one week with a determination to understand magnetic fields and to understand how magnetic fields interact with ferromagnetic materials.   Then you will be able to look at a relatively simple setup and nearly instantly be able to visualize and understand what is going on.


OK, that makes sense. Now why couldn't you have said that before now instead of all the insults???
To be an effective teacher you should not start out calling the pupil a dumb shit. I am the first to admit that I am here to learn and open to correcting my mistakes


Thanks for the useful information! real thanks for contributing to the group, much appreciated.


Ron

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline i_ron

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #331 on: September 26, 2014, 08:48:36 PM »
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Offline gotoluc

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #332 on: September 27, 2014, 02:54:52 AM »
Hi everyone,

here is the first test video of the Triple MMM Super build.

Link to video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GY-lhATLv4

The results are for one coil and one wire strand

More tests to come

Luc

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #332 on: September 27, 2014, 02:54:52 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline telecom

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #333 on: September 27, 2014, 03:28:08 AM »
Hi Luc,
incredible results and fantastic setup -a very fine craftsmanship!
I think you are making history here.
Regards

Offline gotoluc

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #334 on: September 27, 2014, 04:39:51 AM »
Hi everyone,

here is a quick 2nd test of the Triple M Super build.

Link to video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6pc-XNS9uo

The results are for one coil and two wire strand connected in series


The simple 1 inch wide Triple M Pulled 500g for 0.43 Watts

The 8 inch Super build single coil one stand gave a result of 2Kg Pull for 0.43 Watts

and now the 8 inch Super build single coil 2 series stands gave a result of 2.5Kg Pull for 0.43 Watts

So by using only half of the 8 inch Super Build we are pulling 5 times more then the one inch build

Stay tuned for the full results of the Tandem (double) Triple M Super build

Place your bets on what you think it will pull for 0.43 Watts

Luc

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #334 on: September 27, 2014, 04:39:51 AM »
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Offline DaKrampus

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #335 on: September 27, 2014, 04:56:39 AM »
Same here

thank you luc for pointing me to this thread in this forum.
I am very impressed!

The only question I have is: how do you get to 0.78 volts...
This is not a voltage I would have preset on my power supply.. I meen I probably could as it is a lab grade power supply where i can preset anything between 0.1 and 30 volts and 0.1 and 5 amps..
but I would not have set it to 0.78 by intuition.
so i was wondering.. is there a special reason?

Luciano

Offline gotoluc

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #336 on: September 27, 2014, 05:14:18 AM »
I was having some Youtube link problems with the above link which was going to the previous video even though it was a different link ???

It's fixed now

Luc

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #336 on: September 27, 2014, 05:14:18 AM »
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Offline Farmhand

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #337 on: September 27, 2014, 08:30:10 AM »
Luc, Aren't you just getting closer and closer to 100 % efficiency ? And when you get the best possible efficiency you can get won't
that be the closest to 100 % efficient you can get ? Is there an efficiency rating for those lifts and what an OU lift would figure as ?

Please forgive my "Apparent skepticism" and feel free to ignore my questions if you wish.

..

Offline woopy

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #338 on: September 27, 2014, 10:04:41 AM »
Hi Luc

Thank's very much for sharing

Beautifull work great bravo

Can't wait for the next videos

Laurent

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #338 on: September 27, 2014, 10:04:41 AM »
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Offline synchro1

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #339 on: September 27, 2014, 03:35:26 PM »
Hi everyone,

here is a quick 2nd test of the Triple M Super build.

Link to video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6pc-XNS9uo

The results are for one coil and two wire strand connected in series


The simple 1 inch wide Triple M Pulled 500g for 0.43 Watts

The 8 inch Super build single coil one stand gave a result of 2Kg Pull for 0.43 Watts

and now the 8 inch Super build single coil 2 series stands gave a result of 2.5Kg Pull for 0.43 Watts

So by using only half of the 8 inch Super Build we are pulling 5 times more then the one inch build

Stay tuned for the full results of the Tandem (double) Triple M Super build

Place your bets on what you think it will pull for 0.43 Watts

Luc

@Gotoluc,

Are "2 series strands" the same as "Series bifilar"? I forecast a very exciting historical precedent on the approaching horizon!

Offline gotoluc

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #340 on: September 27, 2014, 04:24:26 PM »
Luc, Aren't you just getting closer and closer to 100 % efficiency ? And when you get the best possible efficiency you can get won't
that be the closest to 100 % efficient you can get ? Is there an efficiency rating for those lifts and what an OU lift would figure as ?

Please forgive my "Apparent skepticism" and feel free to ignore my questions if you wish.


Good questions Farmhand and I'm glad you brought it up as this post will hopefully clear the air on this.

I've already said that I would be surprised if this design could be 100% efficient or even OU. How can it be since the generator effect is present in this design. So the more magnet power surface area this design has, the more generator effect it also has, which you should know is a braking effect on the speed the coil can move.

I understood this before building the new Super build. So why build it?... because I already had all the magnets and wire purchased to build it 5 years ago. The other reason is, if we never build and just trust what science says then we can never claim we personally know.
And a better reason is, maybe this design technology can be used to make the most powerful Solenoid action yet available?

I ask everyone to please research a Solenoid Pull or Push force to see how many Kg. the existing technology can pull per Watt.  Please post the best scores you can find.

One thing you also need to keep in mind is Solenoids may hold a certain amount of weight once the center core has reached it's resting position. However, they can only pull a fraction of that weight at the beginning of their stroke.
The Triple M does not suffer from this limitation as it's pull or push force is equal throughout it's 1 inch stroke.

So there you have it, this should answer more then enough questions people may have as to why I went though the time and trouble of building this.

Don't get me wrong, I will test it for OU ptential ;) by seeing if it's own coil weight (2.35kg) can travel up 1mm against gravity.
The below amount of Joule energy is for the 100% efficiency mark. It has been calculated by Khwartz
post: http://www.overunity.com/8429/mostly-permanent-magnet-motor-with-minimal-input-power/msg418177/#msg418177

W [J] = 2.35 [kg] × ~10 [m.s^-2] × 1/1000 [m]

= 23.5/1000 [kg.m^2.s^-2] = 0.0235 [J]


Luc

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #340 on: September 27, 2014, 04:24:26 PM »
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Offline gotoluc

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #341 on: September 27, 2014, 04:32:47 PM »
@Gotoluc,

Are "2 series strands" the same as "Series bifilar"? I forecast a very exciting historical precedent on the approaching horizon!

Yes!... same as Series bifilar

Luc

Offline i_ron

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #342 on: September 27, 2014, 04:37:58 PM »
Hi everyone,

here is a quick 2nd test of the Triple M Super build.

Luc


Great experiment Luc, nicely done!


Ron

Offline gotoluc

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #343 on: September 27, 2014, 05:45:20 PM »
Here is a chart of what a tipical Solenoid can pull of grams per watts.

The % is is on time and notice as the stroke increases the pull force drops.

Here is the link to the pdf. http://dlnmh9ip6v2uc.cloudfront.net/datasheets/Robotics/ZHO-420S.pdf

So I challenge everyone to find the most powerful specs. you can find and post them.
I would be surprised you can even come close to what the 1" build can do!

Luc 

Offline synchro1

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Re: Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power
« Reply #344 on: September 27, 2014, 05:49:56 PM »

Quote from Gotoluc:


"The 8 inch Super build single coil one stand gave a result of 2Kg Pull for 0.43 Watts, and now the 8 inch Super build single coil 2 series stands gave a result of 2.5Kg Pull for 0.43 Watts"!


Luc's test results prove conclusively that the value of Tesla's "Coil for Electromagnets" is genuine and not imaginary as falsely claimed by some. 




 

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