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Gravity powered devices => Gravity powered devices => Topic started by: mondainmax on May 26, 2009, 08:35:40 PM
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Will it work ?
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No.
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why ? i want to learn. can you explain ?
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mondainmax; It looks to equal to me, and not to mention allot of friction that will require oiling. Or of course we might not understand what you have drawn as well. ???
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This cannot function since there is no difference in torque between the two sides. This was established in 1719 by Dr. Desagulier in a famous experiment called Desagulier's balance (see his drawing below ) The same principle applies here.
Hans von Lieven
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it will move like that.
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This cannot function since there is no difference in torque between the two sides. This was established in 1719 by Dr. Desagulier in a famous experiment called Desagulier's balance (see his drawing below ) The same principle applies here.
Hans von Lieven
in that photo P can move on F-G bar or not ? also W ?
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I know what you are trying to show, but there is no difference in force, in fact both sides balance.
Below is a simplified diagram of your device. It shows clearly that it acts like Desagulier's balance. The distribution of forces are the same.
Read up on Desagulier's balance, it is not a well known phenomenon but it is real.
Hans von Lieven
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I know what you are trying to show, but there is no difference in force, in fact both sides balance.
Below is a simplified diagram of your device. It shows clearly that it acts like Desagulier's balance. The distribution of forces are the same.
Read up on Desagulier's balance, it is not a well known phenomenon but it is real.
Hans von Lieven
Reds cancel cause of downward force but the others that are on gear and they want go
to left. if i make a mistake pls show me i want to learn.
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Just make a simple rig up as shown, maybe using a Meccano set and study its behaviour. The chain makes all the difference when the forces are distributed, it no longer acts like a flapwheel, though a flapwheel does not work either, but for different reasons.
Hans von Lieven
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i want to apologize because of my english . i know i cant speak good.
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Your English is no problem, what is your language by the way?
Hans von Lieven
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turkish. i live in turkiye
i think flapwheel doesn't work because of centrifugal force and friction.
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You live in a very beautiful country. Having lived and traveled extensively in Turkey in the days of General Cemal Gürsel I got to know it quite well.
Hans von Lieven
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i want to ask a question in Desagulier's balance drawn when P is on 1 and W is on 1 there will be no effect . when P is on 1 and W is on 6 then P will go down and W will go up and we take some energy ? i think it's equal to 6*P or W(mass)*G(gravity force)*sinx . then locked the machine think P and W is like a ball and move the f and h upward just 1 cm (example) and P will go to G and W will go to I
(we use very small part of energy that we gained.) Unlocked the machine now W's moment is more than P so P is going to up and W to down and also gain 2*enegry that we calculated before. If i make a mistake please show me. Thanks
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You live in a very beautiful country. Having lived and traveled extensively in Turkey in the days of General Cemal Gürsel I got to know it quite well.
Hans von Lieven
Thanks,
i think you are an old man because cemal gursel dead in 1966 and he was president of Turkiye between 60 and 66 . Tukiye is really very beautiful country .
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Yes, I will be 70 later this year ;D
hans von Lieven
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you are so close to a century. "god will give you long lifespan" ( i think it's very bad english )
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i want to ask a question in Desagulier's balance drawn when P is on 1 and W is on 1 there will be no effect . when P is on 1 and W is on 6 then P will go down and W will go up and we take some energy ? i think it's equal to 6*P or W(mass)*G(gravity force)*sinx . then locked the machine think P and W is like a ball and move the f and h upward just 1 cm (example) and P will go to G and W will go to I
(we use very small part of energy that we gained.) Unlocked the machine now W's moment is more than P so P is going to up and W to down and also gain 2*enegry that we calculated before. If i make a mistake please show me. Thanks
It's true or false ?
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mondainmax, it really isn't necessary to go into detailed analysis of your weights and motions. All that is needed is to answer one question: Does your device depend on extracting energy from the motion of weights around a closed path, without addition of outside energy?
If the answer is "yes", then the answer is "No, it cannot work."
The reason has an exact mathematical proof that involves line integrals and force vectors. You cannot extract energy from a closed path in a conservative field of force.
In addition there are literally thousands of designs that have tried and failed, over the past several hundred years. Some of them are very similar to yours.
You may enjoy looking at Simanek's site, where these and other issues are discussed. It's a big site with many pages and diagrams; here is a good place to start.
http://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/museum/physgal.htm