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Author Topic: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface  (Read 45922 times)

Offline mikestocks2006

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #15 on: May 21, 2009, 05:21:49 AM »
I tried it with my big rectangular ceramics. They do it too, but they are kind of hard to slide stably. But they do it.

And the leading edge thing--I only observed it with a very thin disk --think US Dime --on a big thick Al plate. I can't seem to get it to do it (lift up on the leading edge first) with any of these more cylindrical or square magnets.

TK thanks for testing/answering. Glad to see lostcauses10x  bring it up again.
That same question was asked right after lumen's post of the phenomenon.

_____
Quote from: lumen on May 17, 2009, 06:50:32 PM
@TK
I posted a short video showing the uneven magnetic drag effect with a few different magnets. I am sure it is there but don't really know why at this time.

It's almost like one field direction has almost a hooking effect on the aluminum where the other direction a light push.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0YCTwWvykw

Hi lumen,
Could you quickly try the same experiment with nonconductively coated magnets? Curious if there is a "skin effect" due to the typical electircally conductive Nickel coating over the Neos, and its interaction due to eddies etc.

Nice interesting observation, thanks for posting.
Mike
____


Now regarding the repulsion effect, at sufficient relative speed, it does seem to work.
This maybe of interest as a demonstration of the repulsion effect, at speeds of up to 24 mph maybe even less.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glCNP6qH_Dc

TK, as the mags accelerate towards the lower end of the Al or Copper surface, is there an estimate on how fast they are traveling at the time they start moving away/flipping??

Thanks
Mike

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Offline 0c

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #16 on: May 21, 2009, 05:38:31 AM »
It almost makes me believe in different pole strengths.

C'mon now. That wouldn't be symmetrical, would it?

Offline X00013

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #17 on: May 21, 2009, 06:45:31 AM »
@ all, i confirm TKs claim that the neo "flips backwards" while falling, very odd. It also interests me if this happens on the bottom half of the planet, like flushing the toilet?, water spins opposit in N. vs S. hemispere, neat stuff. We nead south of the border neo input!!

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #17 on: May 21, 2009, 06:45:31 AM »
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Offline RunningBare

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #18 on: May 21, 2009, 07:06:08 AM »
You are speaking of the Coriolis force which is a myth, but an understandably created myth, I believed it most of my life.

@ all, i confirm TKs claim that the neo "flips backwards" while falling, very odd. It also interests me if this happens on the bottom half of the planet, like flushing the toilet?, water spins opposit in N. vs S. hemispere, neat stuff. We nead south of the border neo input!!

Offline 0c

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #19 on: May 21, 2009, 07:13:00 AM »
In this case, I think the purpose of the experiment would be to see whether the earth's magnetic poles influence the magnet's behavior. If he N pole flips in the northern hemisphere, does the S pole do it in the southern hemisphere?

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #19 on: May 21, 2009, 07:13:00 AM »
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Offline RunningBare

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #20 on: May 21, 2009, 07:20:24 AM »
My personal opinion without having tested the theory, no, because the field created by these magnets under test swamps that of the earths magnetic fields, and of course the weight of said magnets would be much greater than the influence of the earths magnetic field.

In this case, I think the purpose of the experiment would be to see whether the earth's magnetic poles influence the magnet's behavior. If he N pole flips in the northern hemisphere, does the S pole do it in the southern hemisphere?

Offline AbbaRue

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #21 on: May 21, 2009, 07:27:39 AM »
@Lumen0
The last magnet you used turning toward the south side is very interesting.
It clearly shows the phenomenon at work.
Every time I look at it, it reminds me of particles in a cloud chamber.
The way some particles turn towards one magnets pole and away from the other.
This is how they distinguish protons from electrons.

@Lumen0
Just make sure it still does the same thing when the aluminum plate is facing
180 deg. from it's present position.
Just to make sure the earths north pole isn't pulling the magnet that way.
You didn't tell us which way was north on your video. 
Personally I don't believe it will matter which way the plate faces, but some
others here may have that thought, and this is the way to rule it out.

« Last Edit: May 21, 2009, 07:52:22 AM by AbbaRue »

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #21 on: May 21, 2009, 07:27:39 AM »
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Offline Magluvin

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #22 on: May 21, 2009, 07:27:57 AM »
Maybe this effect has something to do with showing flux direction flow. I cant think of a better guess.


There may be a difference in how the pole fields bend/flex while being dragged through the aluminum, due to flux direction flow.
If it is so, this would put a better perspective on how we look at fields and maybe see a way to take some advantage of this feature.
Magluvin

Offline AbbaRue

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #23 on: May 21, 2009, 07:38:47 AM »
I believe this phenomenon can be used to get past the sticky spot in a magnetic motor. 
The same repelling force that causes the magnet to flip would neutralize the
last magnets pull.
And this force appears to be stronger, the faster the magnet moves.
So the faster a magnetic motor spins the better it will work.

We just need to find a configuration that utilizes it properly.

I also wonder if the metal used makes a difference in which pole down flips.
Does it have something to do with electrode potential?
Aluminum is -1.66  Copper is  +0.159 Lead is +1.69 Silver is +1.98
The best test would be between Aluminum and Silver,
but Aluminum vs Copper would work too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_standard_electrode_potentials



« Last Edit: May 21, 2009, 08:29:54 AM by AbbaRue »

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #23 on: May 21, 2009, 07:38:47 AM »
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Offline RunningBare

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #24 on: May 21, 2009, 08:05:30 AM »
If I may point you to OC's idea that led to the whipmag, this is also a theory based on flipping the magnets at the correct moment to overcome the sticky spot, we got some odd results from replication but no free runner, the interesting part was certainly the stator and rotor magnets spinning in opposite directions.

I believe this phenomenon can be used to get past the sticky spot in a magnetic motor. 
The same repelling force that causes the magnet to flip would neutralize the
last magnets pull.
And this force appears to be stronger, the faster the magnet moves.
So the faster a magnetic motor spins the better it will work.
 
We just need to find a configuration that utilizes it properly.

Offline Magluvin

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #25 on: May 21, 2009, 08:07:26 AM »
Ok  think about it.
Set the magnet to slide down. If flux is flowing into the Al. from the pole facing it, then dragged through the Al. due to the magnet in motion,being bent  upward/dragged/held back from where it came, the exit point of the aluminum would be higher in the aluminum, above the magnet, thus a change in the path of flux from the norm.
But, if flowing out from the outer pole of the magnet, the one thats not facing the Al., then the flux direction is not influenced by the Al. drag before entering the Al. So the  point of entering and exiting will be in different from each other.
Dudes, this is a full possibility.

Magluvin  Sumthins Cookin

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #25 on: May 21, 2009, 08:07:26 AM »
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Offline Magluvin

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #26 on: May 21, 2009, 08:10:17 AM »
Oc TK did you like my last post? I know you will get what I said.

Magluvin

Offline WilbyInebriated

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #27 on: May 21, 2009, 08:29:27 AM »
wow. our resident 'experts' are rehashing old news...

posted sept. 04, 2007
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iABmUEH5s0k

Offline AbbaRue

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #28 on: May 21, 2009, 08:38:12 AM »
wow. our resident 'experts' are rehashing old news...

posted sept. 04, 2007
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iABmUEH5s0k


The braking effect of a magnet against aluminum isn't the point here.
Yes that is old news.
The point here is this new phenomenon of the magnet flipping when the
opposite pole moves against the aluminum. 

We haven't seen this phenomenon mentioned by anyone before.
If you have please give us the link.



Offline WilbyInebriated

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Re: Magnetic braking of magnets sliding along a sloped aluminum surface
« Reply #29 on: May 21, 2009, 08:41:03 AM »


The braking effect of a magnet against aluminum isn't the point here.
Yes that is old news.
The point here is this new phenomenon of the magnet flipping when the
opposite pole moves against the aluminum.
obviously...  ::)
the point is, if you 'play' with magnets, even a little, you stumble upon this (not new) phenom...
if you didn't, well, you're not very creative, imaginative or deductive.

 

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