Language: 
To browser these website, it's necessary to store cookies on your computer.
The cookies contain no personal information, they are required for program control.
  the storage of cookies while browsing this website, on Login and Register.

GDPR and DSGVO law

Storing Cookies (See : http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/cookies/index_en.htm ) help us to bring you our services at overunity.com . If you use this website and our services you declare yourself okay with using cookies .More Infos here:
https://overunity.com/5553/privacy-policy/
If you do not agree with storing cookies, please LEAVE this website now. From the 25th of May 2018, every existing user has to accept the GDPR agreement at first login. If a user is unwilling to accept the GDPR, he should email us and request to erase his account. Many thanks for your understanding.
Amazon Warehouse Deals ! Now even more Deep Discounts ! Check out these great prices on slightly used or just opened once only items.I always buy my gadgets via these great Warehouse deals ! Highly recommended ! Many thanks for supporting OverUnity.com this way.

User Menu

Tesla Paper

Free Energy Book

Get paid

Donations

Please Donate for the Forum.
Many thanks.
Regards, Stefan.(Admin)

A-Ads

Powerbox

Smartbox

3D Solar

3D Solar Panels

DC2DC converter

Micro JouleThief

FireMatch

FireMatch

CCKnife

CCKnife

CCTool

CCTool

Magpi Magazine

Magpi Magazine Free Rasberry Pi Magazine

Battery Recondition

Battery Recondition

Arduino

Ultracaps

YT Subscribe

Gravity Machines

Tesla-Ebook

Magnet Secrets

Lindemann Video

Navigation

Products

Products

WaterMotor kit

Statistics


  • *Total Posts: 893983
  • *Total Topics: 15710
  • *Online Today: 44
  • *Most Online: 103
(December 19, 2006, 11:27:19 PM)
  • *Users: 3
  • *Guests: 18
  • *Total: 21

Author Topic: Need replication of drag free generator test results, drawing attached  (Read 4357 times)

Butch LaFonte

  • Guest
The attached drawing is of a design we tested in the shop with a set up that worked on the same basic principle. we got very interesting results and have video of tests I will post to Youtube. When we put a load on the generator coils the load on the drive motor dropped? We have a very strange coil behavior though. When we ran power to the coils from an external power source (generator not turning) we got the amp flow that ohms law predicts for a given voltage. But when we ran the generator at high RPM we got very high voltage but extremely low amp flow. The voltage and amp flow did not match ohms law. We tried many different loads on the generator and still got low amp output. We talked with electrical engineers and got opinions from many sources but each opinion was different.
Burt Weirgerfelt, the inventor of the magnetic battery from years ago told me a few months ago that his company had the same problem, but solved it. He said he was not at liberty to discuss how they did it. What is actually going on in that coil is mystery at this point. I am asking anyone interested to replicate this design we have and see if you get the same drag free operation under load that we are getting. We did have eddy current drag, but that can be eliminated. the low amp output is a problem also. We got up to 600 volts during one run, but amp output was in milliamps. When you look at the drawing think about trying to make the device a motor by putting power to the coils. It is very obvious that the rotor would not turn even if you alternated the current flow direction. But also notice this is a possible indication why it seemed to be drag free in generator mode. The outer ellipse polarity reverses as the rotor turns causing a voltage/ current but no back drag on the rotor. This is a very interesting design we came up with and I feel it deserves looking into.
Note: Animation being done at this time
Thanks,
Butch LaFonte

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Low-Q

  • without_ads
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2840
The attached drawing is of a design we tested in the shop with a set up that worked on the same basic principle. we got very interesting results and have video of tests I will post to Youtube. When we put a load on the generator coils the load on the drive motor dropped? We have a very strange coil behavior though. When we ran power to the coils from an external power source (generator not turning) we got the amp flow that ohms law predicts for a given voltage. But when we ran the generator at high RPM we got very high voltage but extremely low amp flow. The voltage and amp flow did not match ohms law. We tried many different loads on the generator and still got low amp output. We talked with electrical engineers and got opinions from many sources but each opinion was different.
Burt Weirgerfelt, the inventor of the magnetic battery from years ago told me a few months ago that his company had the same problem, but solved it. He said he was not at liberty to discuss how they did it. What is actually going on in that coil is mystery at this point. I am asking anyone interested to replicate this design we have and see if you get the same drag free operation under load that we are getting. We did have eddy current drag, but that can be eliminated. the low amp output is a problem also. We got up to 600 volts during one run, but amp output was in milliamps. When you look at the drawing think about trying to make the device a motor by putting power to the coils. It is very obvious that the rotor would not turn even if you alternated the current flow direction. But also notice this is a possible indication why it seemed to be drag free in generator mode. The outer ellipse polarity reverses as the rotor turns causing a voltage/ current but no back drag on the rotor. This is a very interesting design we came up with and I feel it deserves looking into.
Note: Animation being done at this time
Thanks,
Butch LaFonte
You know, higher frequencies, as when you speed up the rotor, the higher the impedance in the coil will go. That will cause less amps because there is a greater delay between amps and voltage as the frequency increase, so almost no energy can be taken out. In a perfect coil, there is 180 degree delay between amp and voltage at infinite frequency. There is a resistance in the coil wire that limits the delay to >180 degrees. The delay depends on frequency, resistance, and inductance. Greater inductance is greater delay. Greater frequency is greater delay. LESS resistance is greater delay.

These properties of a coil is used to make cross-over networks in loudspeakers. Capacitors have the very opposite properties. The amps are at most 180 degrees ahead voltage.

This means you can build a oscillator with a coil and a capacitor. In series, when resonance frequency are met, you will measure very high voltage separately over the coil and the capacitor compared to the supplied voltage. In parallell, you will measure much greater amps separately in the capacitor and the coil, than the current input from the generator.

Interesting things to play with.

Vidar

Offline hoptoad

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1009
You know, higher frequencies, as when you speed up the rotor, the higher the impedance in the coil will go. That will cause less amps because there is a greater delay between amps and voltage as the frequency increase, so almost no energy can be taken out. In a perfect coil, there is 180 degree delay between amp and voltage at infinite frequency. There is a resistance in the coil wire that limits the delay to >180 degrees. The delay depends on frequency, resistance, and inductance. Greater inductance is greater delay. Greater frequency is greater delay. LESS resistance is greater delay.

These properties of a coil is used to make cross-over networks in loudspeakers. Capacitors have the very opposite properties. The amps are at most 180 degrees ahead voltage.

This means you can build a oscillator with a coil and a capacitor. In series, when resonance frequency are met, you will measure very high voltage separately over the coil and the capacitor compared to the supplied voltage. In parallell, you will measure much greater amps Tseparately in the capacitor and the coil, than the current input from the generator.

Interesting things to play with.

Vidar

The maximum possible delay (in a perfect inductor) is 90 degrees between voltage and current. Everything else you've said I agree with.
Cheers

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Sponsored links:




Offline broli

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2218
Why do people forget than wattage is linear. Meaning you can take a high voltage-low current and convert it to low voltage-low current to drive the motor that is driving this generator. You'll be amazed at the result.

Butch LaFonte

  • Guest
You know, higher frequencies, as when you speed up the rotor, the higher the impedance in the coil will go. That will cause less amps because there is a greater delay between amps and voltage as the frequency increase, so almost no energy can be taken out. In a perfect coil, there is 180 degree delay between amp and voltage at infinite frequency. There is a resistance in the coil wire that limits the delay to >180 degrees. The delay depends on frequency, resistance, and inductance. Greater inductance is greater delay. Greater frequency is greater delay. LESS resistance is greater delay.

These properties of a coil is used to make cross-over networks in loudspeakers. Capacitors have the very opposite properties. The amps are at most 180 degrees ahead voltage.

This means you can build a oscillator with a coil and a capacitor. In series, when resonance frequency are met, you will measure very high voltage separately over the coil and the capacitor compared to the supplied voltage. In parallell, you will measure much greater amps separately in the capacitor and the coil, than the current input from the generator.

Interesting things to play with.

Vidar
Vidar,
Ok, we know why the coil is not putting out the amps one would like to see from the indicated voltage. Does anyone have an idea how to overcome this "choking" off of amp flow? Also the type of load will change the behavior of the coil, pure resistive load, pure inductive load or a combination of the two. I didn't see a comment on load types and their effect?
Over the years I have read many thousands of comments explaining why someones design is not working, but I would say only around 5% follow up with a suggestion on how to maybe overcome the problem and make it work. I wonder where we would be right now if every comment explaining why something will not work was followed by at least a half hearted attempt to suggest a way to go about making it work?
Any suggestions on getting some amps out of this coil. Burt was running at 900 cycles per second on his coils and was able to overcome the problem, but is keeping quite how he did it.
Thanks guys for the input,
Butch

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Sponsored links:




Offline Low-Q

  • without_ads
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2840
The maximum possible delay (in a perfect inductor) is 90 degrees between voltage and current. Everything else you've said I agree with.
Cheers
You're right. I mixed it with the combination coil/capacitor, where at resonance there is at max 180 degree phase delay between current and voltage. 90 degrees for each coil and capacitor is correct. My mistake, and thanks for correcting me :).

Good to see that some people is still awake on this forum, when I'm not ;D

Vidar

Offline Low-Q

  • without_ads
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2840
Vidar,
Ok, we know why the coil is not putting out the amps one would like to see from the indicated voltage. Does anyone have an idea how to overcome this "choking" off of amp flow? Also the type of load will change the behavior of the coil, pure resistive load, pure inductive load or a combination of the two. I didn't see a comment on load types and their effect?
Over the years I have read many thousands of comments explaining why someones design is not working, but I would say only around 5% follow up with a suggestion on how to maybe overcome the problem and make it work. I wonder where we would be right now if every comment explaining why something will not work was followed by at least a half hearted attempt to suggest a way to go about making it work?
Any suggestions on getting some amps out of this coil. Burt was running at 900 cycles per second on his coils and was able to overcome the problem, but is keeping quite how he did it.
Thanks guys for the input,
Butch
This is much about the phase shift. If you want to reduce the amp problem by implementing a device, you will again get more drag when you load it, because the energy, which is calculated by amps times voltage times cosinus of the phase shift, will increase as the phase shift is reduced.

An inductor will allways act like it does. If you want to reduce the phase shift, you can also implement a resistor, but that resistor will steal some of the energy in proportion to how less phase delay you'll get.

I think the main reason there isn't much follow ups, is because there is actually no way to fix the problem without making another problem. And maybe 5% of the people that follows up with the suggestion didn't see that other problem coming up after solving the first problem.

I have unfortunately no good solution for you, except that you can decrease the number of turns in the coil. That will reduce the voltage and increase the amps. If you want to do it very good, you can use litz-wire to reduce the skin-effect as well. However, skin-effect isn't showing before you reach 20 000 - 30 000 rpms or so. I know that small powerful electric motors have rectangular wire or litz-wire in the rotor to reduce the skin-effect.

Skin effect is what happens when current flow will, in greater extent, follow the surface of the conductor as the frequency rises - instead of using the whole area of the conductor.

Vidar

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Sponsored links:




Butch LaFonte

  • Guest
More clear drawing
« Reply #7 on: April 23, 2009, 11:43:12 PM »
Thanks,
Butch

Offline nueview

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 163

i once did the same type of out of phase current thig while trying to make a generator and for some reason tried an avramenco plug on the line and it gave me usable power at full current but only on the single line you might try this

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline BEP

  • TPU-Elite
  • Hero Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1289
The maximum possible delay (in a perfect inductor) is 90 degrees between voltage and current. Everything else you've said I agree with.
Cheers

P.F. metering normally only measures from -.5 to +.5 (90 minus to 90 plus). At least, I've never seen different.
Yes, -/+ 90 is the rule for maximums. Rules are broken.


 

OneLink