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Electric vehicles => Electric cars => Topic started by: g4macdad on April 19, 2009, 12:25:56 AM

Title: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 19, 2009, 12:25:56 AM
Currently the only thing stopping you from getting $.02 a mile electric vehicles, are state laws. Most likely your state does not currently allow you to register a legitimate plug-in Electric car.

Electricity is currently the cleanest way to power our vehicles.

Hydrogen is produced and distributed by oil companies to keep you "pumping" price controlled fuel.

Hydrogen is produced using electricity and after you get it into your vehicle, it cost more money and has a far greater negative impact on the environment than plug-ins.

We all need to take political action for this to change.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on April 19, 2009, 12:33:12 AM

I have read that the recharge process needed for electric cars is just as expensive as gas when you get your electric bill.

That would mean you are no farther aahead if true.

Regards...

Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 19, 2009, 01:02:09 AM
I have read that the recharge process needed for electric cars is just as expensive as gas when you get your electric bill.

That would mean you are no farther aahead if true.

Regards...



This is a fox news style reply "some say" and it is utter bologna. Where and who said such a thing?
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: broli on April 19, 2009, 01:24:11 AM
Isn't this a bit too obvious? It never has been something technically. Somewhere some guy wanted mooooore money. Greed and corruption is what is leaving us in the stone age. The biggest case in history must be of nikola tesla. We would be casually space traveling if it wasn't for the greed and corruption of a few. Politics is a joke. It's just a mix of a monarchy and a very convincing puppet show.

I'm waiting for the day people realize this and sentence these bastards. But I guess most people are too busy working like sheep in McDonald's or some factory.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 19, 2009, 01:42:42 AM
Isn't this a bit too obvious? It never has been something technically. Somewhere some guy wanted mooooore money. Greed and corruption is what is leaving us in the stone age. The biggest case in history must be of nikola tesla. We would be casually space traveling if it wasn't for the greed and corruption of a few. Politics is a joke. It's just a mix of a monarchy and a very convincing puppet show.

I'm waiting for the day people realize this and sentence these bastards. But I guess most people are too busy working like sheep in McDonald's or some factory.

The law was put in place by someone's actions. People sitting and waiting for "the day people realize" is why they are winning. The "bastards" aren't waiting and that is why these laws exist.

Violent revolutionary action is not the answer.

They don't want you to know our system WORKS. They know it works and they are taking great advantage of it.

Wake up and be a great country again. Not a bunch of whining suckers.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: d3adp00l on April 19, 2009, 01:45:47 AM
Well lets compare the two then.

car 20mpg (yes I am aware that some get better but not all that many standard cars do)

2.50 / 20 = cost per mile 12.5 cents and at 60 miles per hour thats 12.5 cents per minute
or 12.5 x 60 = 7.50 per hour

At 60 mph it takes around 18650 watts to move it. So thats 18.65 Kw every hour, so 18.65kwhr. The electrical system is about 90% eff, so 18.65/.9 = 20.722kwhr battery power, charging batteries is around 90% eff, so 20.722/ .9= 23 KWHRs to charge

I pay around 20 cents a kwhr, so .20 x 23 = 4.60 dollars per hour
or 7.6 cents per mile

So your claim is refuted, and it is in fact cheaper, and better for the environment to drive electric. next time don't believe what you read, analyze it.

Next are state laws stopping electric cars? NO they aren't plenty of people have them and register them in fact in california when filing out docs, there is a place to check electric as fuel source.

So what is stopping electric cars? imho WE ARE.

We say we want electric but then everyone complains about worrying about the range,
We say we want electrics, but only if they give us exactly what we have now, instead of accepting them as they are and making the industry give us better results at their whim.

WE ARE because we can make them ourselves and don't. We are because some of us have the ability to make controllers and sell them at reasonable prices to eachother and we don't.

We are because those of us with the money to do the conversion don't we go finance new cars instead of rebuilding the old one.

I am not much better and include myself in the WE, but I am working on become not part of that, and if I didn't get kicked in the financial teeth at every turn I wouldn't still be a part of that WE.

How to change it, start doing it!.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: broli on April 19, 2009, 01:46:51 AM
The time of "being a great country" is long overdue. We need to be a great species. There are two answers violent revolutions or independent technological advancement. You can choose which one I picked. What do you think you will achieve by mere words?
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 19, 2009, 01:52:18 AM
Well lets compare the two then.

car 20mpg (yes I am aware that some get better but not all that many standard cars do)

2.50 / 20 = cost per mile 12.5 cents and at 60 miles per hour thats 12.5 cents per minute
or 12.5 x 60 = 7.50 per hour

At 60 mph it takes around 18650 watts to move it. So thats 18.65 Kw every hour, so 18.65kwhr. The electrical system is about 90% eff, so 18.65/.9 = 20.722kwhr battery power, charging batteries is around 90% eff, so 20.722/ .9= 23 KWHRs to charge

I pay around 20 cents a kwhr, so .20 x 23 = 4.60 dollars per hour
or 7.6 cents per mile

So your claim is refuted, and it is in fact cheaper, and better for the environment to drive electric. next time don't believe what you read, analyze it.

Next are state laws stopping electric cars? NO they aren't plenty of people have them and register them in fact in california when filing out docs, there is a place to check electric as fuel source.

So what is stopping electric cars? imho WE ARE.

We say we want electric but then everyone complains about worrying about the range,
We say we want electrics, but only if they give us exactly what we have now, instead of accepting them as they are and making the industry give us better results at their whim.

WE ARE because we can make them ourselves and don't. We are because some of us have the ability to make controllers and sell them at reasonable prices to eachother and we don't.

We are because those of us with the money to do the conversion don't we go finance new cars instead of rebuilding the old one.

I am not much better and include myself in the WE, but I am working on become not part of that, and if I didn't get kicked in the financial teeth at every turn I wouldn't still be a part of that WE.

How to change it, start doing it!.


I agree with you 90%.

My state law is exactly what is stopping me.

Most states are similar to mine but mine is by far the worst. I cannot register an electric car that exceeds 20 mph in Ohio.

There are plenty of options for buying electric cars for us RIGHT NOW. State laws are the number one reason this is not possible.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on April 19, 2009, 01:59:16 AM


I'm not sure where it was g4macdad...it may come to me or I may run across it again...it made me stop and think though...and it is something I did not consider.

If true, it would be burdensome to have to stop and charge frequently...I guess it would be ok for people with bladder issues, as they have to stop frequently anyway. :)

So, until we can come up with a way to get over that hump they may be relegated to last resort status.

Regards...

Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 19, 2009, 02:04:10 AM

I'm not sure where it was g4macdad...it may come to me or I may run across it again...it made me stop and think though...and it is something I did not consider.

If true, it would be burdensome to have to stop and charge frequently...I guess it would be ok for people with bladder issues, as they have to stop frequently anyway. :)

So, until we can come up with a way to get over that hump they may be relegated to last resort status.

Regards...



I can assure you it is not true.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on April 19, 2009, 02:07:31 AM

I missed your post d3adp00l.

The information was that it takes 30 hrs to recharge those battery's.

20 miles a gallion. :)...do  those Rolls Royce's ride really smooth ?

Regards...

Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 19, 2009, 02:19:45 AM
I missed your post d3adp00l.

The information was that it takes 30 hrs to recharge those battery's.

20 miles a gallion. :)...do  those Rolls Royce's ride really smooth ?

Regards...



Dude!

Stop posting nonsense! >:(

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMF2zn4IxLY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMF2zn4IxLY)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZBy99Fgyoo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZBy99Fgyoo)

Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: IotaYodi on April 19, 2009, 02:24:37 AM
Thats basically untrue. Its just low speed vehicles. These cars shouldnt be allowed in any state in my opinion. Just another accident waiting to happen. Some of these cars have a top speed of 25 to 30 miles an hour. They are useless even in a 45 mph zone. If they could be tracked and shut down when they travel on a street thats more than 5 mph above their speed limit I could go for that.
All 3 wheel vehicles should be banned too.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on April 19, 2009, 02:26:47 AM

I mentioned some information I had either watched or read...you asked me a question...I answered.

I made a legitimate comment regarding to the charging time to another member.

While I await a response, you intercede with disrespectful comment.

What is this nonsense are you referring to ?

Regards...

Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 19, 2009, 02:47:18 AM
Thats basically untrue. Its just low speed vehicles. These cars shouldnt be allowed in any state in my opinion. Just another accident waiting to happen. Some of these cars have a top speed of 25 to 30 miles an hour. They are useless even in a 45 mph zone. If they could be tracked and shut down when they travel on a street thats more than 5 mph above their speed limit I could go for that.

LOL

People like you are the REAL reason the country is a mess.

DO YOU EVER EVEN READ!? :o
http://bgelectriccars.com/regulations.html (http://bgelectriccars.com/regulations.html)

http://bgelectriccars.com/index.html (http://bgelectriccars.com/index.html)



Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 19, 2009, 05:47:12 AM
I keep trying to understand these regulations but I just don't get it.

The car is slow so we need to limit the speed?

Who understands this stuff?
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: IotaYodi on April 19, 2009, 03:54:46 PM
Quote
People like you are the REAL reason the country is a mess.

No its people like you who dont have a clue. We dont need glorified golf carts or lambrettas on main roads. 3 wheelers need to be banned. There are stock 4 wheelers that can go 45 which out run them. These vehicles are only good for a congested neighborhood. Thats fine by me but I know they wont stay there.

About 35 states have passed legislation or regulations allowing NEVs to be licensed and driven on roads that generally are posted at 35 miles per hour or less. Which I totally disagree with if there top speed is only 25. All your going to do is agitate people with a faster vehicle who cant pass or has an emergency situation. Even if they made one at 45 mph I know good and well kids and non thinking individuals would have them on a 55 mph road causing havoc.

A neighborhood electric vehicle (NEV) is 4-wheeled vehicle, larger than a golf cart but smaller than most light-duty passenger vehicles. NEVs are usually configured to carry two or four passengers, or two passengers with a pickup bed.
NEVs are defined by the United States National Highway Traffic Safety Administration as subject to Federal Motor About 35 states have passed legislation or regulations allowing NEVs to be licensed and driven on roads that generally are posted at 35 miles per hour or less. Safety Standard (FMVSS) No. 500 (49 CFR 571.500). Per FMVSS 500, NEVs have top speeds between 20 and 25 miles per hour and are defined as “Low Speed Vehicles.”

An EV vehicle that can go 55 mph or better has no law against it.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 19, 2009, 04:48:32 PM
No its people like you who dont have a clue. We dont need glorified golf carts or lambrettas on main roads. 3 wheelers need to be banned. There are stock 4 wheelers that can go 45 which out run them. These vehicles are only good for a congested neighborhood. Thats fine by me but I know they wont stay there.

About 35 states have passed legislation or regulations allowing NEVs to be licensed and driven on roads that generally are posted at 35 miles per hour or less. Which I totally disagree with if there top speed is only 25. All your going to do is agitate people with a faster vehicle who cant pass or has an emergency situation. Even if they made one at 45 mph I know good and well kids and non thinking individuals would have them on a 55 mph road causing havoc.

A neighborhood electric vehicle (NEV) is 4-wheeled vehicle, larger than a golf cart but smaller than most light-duty passenger vehicles. NEVs are usually configured to carry two or four passengers, or two passengers with a pickup bed.
NEVs are defined by the United States National Highway Traffic Safety Administration as subject to Federal Motor About 35 states have passed legislation or regulations allowing NEVs to be licensed and driven on roads that generally are posted at 35 miles per hour or less. Safety Standard (FMVSS) No. 500 (49 CFR 571.500). Per FMVSS 500, NEVs have top speeds between 20 and 25 miles per hour and are defined as “Low Speed Vehicles.”

An EV vehicle that can go 55 mph or better has no law against it.

You are right I am sorry ::) LOL

The clear answer is limiting the top speed a vehicle is allowed to go?

Because they are too slow so we need to not allow them to go faster?

You must be republican.  :-*
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: d3adp00l on April 20, 2009, 05:02:39 AM
http://www.wkyc.com/news/regional/akron_article.aspx?storyid=91244&catid=6

I only see opposition to 3 wheeled electric cars. You'll have to find the law. I went through the code and didn't see anything preventing an electric car from passing the road safety inspection for registration requirements.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: d3adp00l on April 20, 2009, 05:31:00 AM
cap you need to go and learn how to do some basic math before you open your trap.

Some cars do get better than 20 mpg, and if that is the case then convert my numbers to whatever mpg you think is appropriate.

At the current price of gas the car would have to get around 35 mpg, which is not unheard of. But give a 35mpg car and its weight an electric of similar characteristics would get a bit better performance, around 20% better. so instead of 7.6cents it would be closer to 6.08 cents per mile.

Battery charging time 18650 watts, lets say you drive 2 hours, so 2x 18650w = 37300 whrs
standard 20 amp circuit at 240v = 4800w, at 80% (nec code) = 3840w
37300/3840= 9.7hr charge time

lets see here, first when was the last time you drove 2hrs straight, next, lets say you drove to work
well you can charge it there for 8 hours, or after you get home, how many hours does your car spend sitting there in the drive way?, normally around 12 to 15 hours.

with a 30a 240v outlet (dryer type) it would be faster.

You really show your ignorance by speaking, maybe you should chose to be thought a fool instead of removing all doubt.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: AbbaRue on April 20, 2009, 10:14:11 AM
Unless a better technology comes along I can see the day when we use
wind generators to charge our electric car batteries.
Perfect concept, perhaps even have a small wind generator built into a car so it can be
erected into the air while we are parked at work. 
Vertical wind generators would probably be the safest type for this. 
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: IotaYodi on April 20, 2009, 06:31:37 PM
Quote
Because they are too slow so we need to not allow them to go faster?

Only in a 4 wheel configuration which they need to do. A passenger 3 wheeler is too dangerous.

Quote
You must be republican.
Im totally independent. I have never voted. I dont trust any of them after watching them for about 40 years. Being in the Military opened my eyes.  It seems like most of them have their own personal agendas and not really watching out for the common good. Im still agitated over the bailout. Im tired of bailing out gamblers and thats exactly what it is. The buggy whip companys went out of business and they can too!!   :)
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 21, 2009, 03:36:35 AM
http://www.wkyc.com/news/regional/akron_article.aspx?storyid=91244&catid=6

I only see opposition to 3 wheeled electric cars. You'll have to find the law. I went through the code and didn't see anything preventing an electric car from passing the road safety inspection for registration requirements.

Three wheeled cars ARE allowed to be registered in my state. But ALL electric vehicles are limited to 20 mph here, and between 25 and 35 in most others.

You are being fooled into thinking otherwise obviously. But you are WRONG. Sorry.

Why would anyone in their right mind, NOT drive a plug-in electric?
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 21, 2009, 03:52:28 AM
Only in a 4 wheel configuration which they need to do. A passenger 3 wheeler is too dangerous.
Im totally independent. I have never voted. I dont trust any of them after watching them for about 40 years. Being in the Military opened my eyes.  It seems like most of them have their own personal agendas and not really watching out for the common good. Im still agitated over the bailout. Im tired of bailing out gamblers and thats exactly what it is. The buggy whip companys went out of business and they can too!!   :)

The only way one could be "agitated" over the "bailout" is because they do not understand it, or they are listening to conservative BS media(which is more than 90% of it).

I won't be paying 1 cent to bail out anyone. I don't know a single person who will. The only ones paying for this make $250,000 or more a year.

The only ones "gambling" as you put it, are the ones who have the money to do so.

Those will be the ones paying their gambling debts, thanks to the liberal majority now.

Vote them out, and you and me pay, They are not one of US and they don't care about YOU.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: d3adp00l on April 21, 2009, 09:42:38 AM
Three wheeled cars ARE allowed to be registered in my state. But ALL electric vehicles are limited to 20 mph here, and between 25 and 35 in most others.

You are being fooled into thinking otherwise obviously. But you are WRONG. Sorry.

Why would anyone in their right mind, NOT drive a plug-in electric?

and where is the evidence of this claim?
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: d3adp00l on April 21, 2009, 09:43:31 AM
This thread shows exactly why we don't use technology like this or others. Like I said, the problem is us.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: Cherryman on April 21, 2009, 10:12:55 AM
Three wheeled cars ARE allowed to be registered in my state. But ALL electric vehicles are limited to 20 mph here, and between 25 and 35 in most others.

You are being fooled into thinking otherwise obviously. But you are WRONG. Sorry.

Why would anyone in their right mind, NOT drive a plug-in electric?

So if I (European)  understand it corrrectly the Tesla motors models are not allowed in many US states??  ??? ???

http://www.teslamotors.com/
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: d3adp00l on April 21, 2009, 10:31:32 AM
Thats the unsupported claim.

I would like to see some vehicle code, registration restrictions, or other law that outlines this. I have seen in canada that they blocked the EV made there from being able to be used on the road. But I havent seen it in a way that we can point to and tell the state agencies to remove the statute.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on April 24, 2009, 02:56:02 AM
Thats the unsupported claim.

I would like to see some vehicle code, registration restrictions, or other law that outlines this. I have seen in canada that they blocked the EV made there from being able to be used on the road. But I havent seen it in a way that we can point to and tell the state agencies to remove the statute.

"WE" are not the problem. Neo-cons ARE!

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/create-a-new-electric-vehicle-classification (http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/create-a-new-electric-vehicle-classification)
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: mscoffman on April 25, 2009, 06:42:56 PM

There are four interesting articles about electric cars in Fortune Magazine, Vol 159, April 24,2009.
This latest issue is not yet listed on their website, but you maybe able to get it at your public
library. If you read these articles - I think you will discover that "nothing" is holding them back.

:S:MarkSCoffman
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: d3adp00l on April 26, 2009, 09:20:18 AM
Nothing but US
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: g4macdad on May 01, 2009, 10:29:42 PM
Nothing but US

EXACTLY! US waiting for someone else to sign the petition to change the laws.
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/create-a-new-electric-vehicle-classification (http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/create-a-new-electric-vehicle-classification)
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: ewitte on October 23, 2009, 02:14:58 AM
Its easy enough to modify a prius to get about 20 miles on a charge for now.  I have a hard time believing these EV limits.  How does the tesla get around it? 
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: Magluvin on October 23, 2009, 07:10:52 AM
http://www.evporsche.com/
These guys do some great conversions. Not far from me in West Palm Beach.
If you scroll down the page they give a price on battery packs that get you 60 to 200 miles per charge. It may cost, but a manufacturer gets huge quantity pricing and they use a/c ind. motors and controls which are more efficient than dc motors and controls. Dc is cheaper for build it your self.
Also you can look at alibaba.com for Chinese battery sources for pretty good pricing.
I Have an '85 Fiero gt that is cored out for conversion. Have not made solid decisions on equipment to use yet.
Magluvin
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: d3adp00l on October 23, 2009, 08:18:18 AM
ya because most of us can afford 60k. again, I say its us keeping electriccars from being out there. By us I mean the general persons greed.

Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: Magluvin on October 23, 2009, 08:32:04 AM
Well Im not looking to build one to go 200 mpc at first. If I spend $50 a week in gas at $3 a gal to go to work, an electric conv. would save me about $2000 a year. These days thats not chump change. I can conv. my fiero to do 50-60 mpc for under $10000 and it will pay for itself in 5 years. How long and how much will it take to pay off that Prius? And then still buying gas for it when it just may be $5 or more a gal. And who knows, One of these guys/gals here at OU just may come up with a way to charge our cars for free. Maybe.  =]
Magluvin
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: d3adp00l on October 23, 2009, 08:43:31 AM
sorry but you'll have to buy more batteries before that 5 years, and you need to calc the cost of electricity.

They have done all this math, and they do not want it working out in our benefit.

when someone comes up with a new produce whats the first question they want to answer? Its not how much did it cost to make, its how much will this save people over its life, and how much can I get of that from them .
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: d3adp00l on October 23, 2009, 09:03:11 AM
200 lbs electric motor

100 lbs cu x 3.00 = 300.00
100 lbs steel x .55 = 55.00

sub total               355.00
manufacturing        355.00
sub total               810.00
profit and over head 350.00

total reasonable motor price    1160.00

this is on a manufacturing scale, not a 1 off custom build.

the same motor using aluminum could be

50 lbs of al         x 1.9 = 95.00
100 lbs of steel           = 55.00
                                  150.00

900.00 for a motor on a production scale.

until someone is willing to do that, there isn't much hope.

batteries lead acid - .95 per lbs x 800lbs = 760.00
                                          760.00 x 2 = 1520
                                           2100.00 total price.

actual price for batteries of equal power = 3500.00

Its this simple. If I make something for 100 bucks, and sell it to a distributor that sells it for 150.00 who sells it to a wholesaler, who sells it for 225.00 who sell it to a resaler who sells it for 335.00 so what am I really getting for my money? SCREWED
 
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: Magluvin on October 23, 2009, 09:52:53 AM
Well I dont know where you get your info but the electric motor is way more efficient than a gas engine, of which the gas engine is at best 30%, STILL.
And if your getting your batteries from Walmart then you may be changing your batteries a few times before 5 years are up.  But at $25 a pop, maybe they are not so bad.  But Im going for 8 yr bat life, and that is ave. depending on how they are taken care of. Some have gotten over 100,000 mi. on a set of NIMH and still goin.
Not many people realize how much they spend on gas for the year.
Are you the only super skeptic on EV's here?
Is there anyone that is for them?

Mags
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: ewitte on October 23, 2009, 01:33:23 PM
It costs either $2k or $4k to upgrade a PRIUS with LiFe-P04 and it does not even look that hard to do.  Currently studying my vue greenline for upgrades starting in 2-3 years.

4kw = 20 miles = (for me) $0.54
1/3 gallon (60mpg) @ $2.15 = $0.71

So there is a slight savings.  However thats at pretty low gas prices.  At $4 per gal 1/3 gallon costs $1.33.  Unlress you keep recharging throughout the day while at work thats about $5/mo or $23.70/mo @ $4 per gallon.  It will take 14 years even at $4/gal to pay back the $4000 cost of installing the batteries.  Although a true electric vehicle will have 800+lbs of ICE related components removed and can probably go 30-40 miles off the same charge.  The Tesla is rated for $0.40 for the same distance but it also had a much greater battery bank that is a lot heavier.
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: electricme on October 23, 2009, 02:21:05 PM
Hi guys, I hope I not too way off the thread.

Ha ha, I have to laugh, the fuel companies just love it when we all verball off to each other, their promotion industry is still going strong, and most people really haven't caught on to the following fact.

Fact is, they get all cars to be built so the tank holds enough petrol to travel for about 6-7 hundred kilometers, and so the family car has to be refuelled once a week.
Soooo people have been conditioned over the years that electric vehicles need a battery capacity to hold the equivalent in kilometers.

This is a lot of hooey. Wake up everyone, take another look see.

People have also been conditioned that a vehicle just has to have an acceleration from 0 - 100kph in certain seconds, the electric car can do this, its just been suppressed, that's all, but once again, who wants to strain the engine and drive chain just to brag his vehicle is better than the others.......

Who really drives the charriot? the wife does, and where would she drive to, the local shop.
In most cases this is the local supermarket, generally about 10 ks away down the road, then knowing how careful my wife used to be in conserving where she drove, she would work out very carefully to make sure she would not double back (wasting petrol), so the weekly shopping trip would take about 50ks at the most.

Then there was the days the kiddies went to skool, another 10k around trip, then there is the little unforeseen trips to buy a loaf of bread or milk some emergency came up, or to visit a friend, all small trips, never getting above the speed limit.

One overnight recharge would top off each of the daily trips around town, and it would be cheep at that, a lot more cheeeeeper than the weekly top up with gas, diesel or petrol.

We are led to believe we need a huge battery capacity for 700 klms, bah hooey

Lets consider the Diesel Electric locomotive, this thing has a whacking big diesel engine in it, its sole purpose is to drive a generator, that's it, nothing more. The engine runs at a constant rpm (most times), but the fact is, this generator is so powerful it can pull a train consisting of thousands of tons, a very long way indeed.

Soooo why did trains switch to diesel? why didn't they use the existing steam engine to drive a huge generator, just as a coal fired power station does? Driver comfort, less heat, not as much manual work to do and the fellas selling diesel said it is a good move to the gov.

So what am I getting at? electricity has more to it than petrol, but if we don't get on to making electric powered cars, then after the petrol runs out it will be too late, just get a horse and buggy.
There is a problem there tooo, how many horses will there be available? do you know the slightest thing in looking after a horse?

So what are councils and governments doing about this? nothing.
They have their hands in their pockets, they are asleep at the wheel, they will all say "we didn't know that this was going to happen" when petrol runs out, and it will, where will the food come from? the shops I hear you say, ha ha, but there is no fuel to run the trucks.

So no fuel equates to people starving because they can't go and buy food to feed themselves.
No fuel means the food will rot on the trees and in the paddocks, eventually, no fuel means no crops will be planted, this is a big can of worms.

No fuel means people cannot go to work, no work, no jobs, no jobs = no wages, no wages no food.
YOU DIE.
Because you die, you don't pay taxes, then the gov says, oops we made a mistake.
We should have had a backup system to keep the system flowing. Tooooolate.

There would be a big exoduses as people move out to the food bearing areas just so they could exist.
How many people make it out to the country, on shank es pony (walking), not many.

No modern country in the world has made any emergency plan to cope with no fuel.
In our country Australia, in Brisbane, we had trams, then the head honcho decided it would be a great idea to toss them out, so he did, once most people just hopped on a tram and got about, it was clean energy, a good safe way to travel, now we have the monster car problem.

If fuel dries up in Australia, all I see is big trouble, and bad at that, yep, bring back the electric car, truck, make all railways electric, double the tracks or bring back the old steam train.

Carbon credits, ha ha ha, what a lot of hooey, one volcano puts that theory to grief, oh if only people would wake up and get involved in free energy and read all the forums here.

jim



 
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: ewitte on October 23, 2009, 03:30:05 PM
While 700Km is not neccessary I can still easily drive 150 miles in a single work day. If I get sent to the ranch thats a 600 mile round trip.  With a 40mile EV range I would have to stop 15+ times!  My "mild hybrid" can get about 650-690 under perfect conditions (600 under good conditions).
Title: Re: The only thing holding back EV's (not technology)
Post by: electricme on October 27, 2009, 09:54:33 AM
@ ewitte
Excellent point you have below.

While 700Km is not neccessary I can still easily drive 150 miles in a single work day. If I get sent to the ranch thats a 600 mile round trip.  With a 40mile EV range I would have to stop 15+ times!  My "mild hybrid" can get about 650-690 under perfect conditions (600 under good conditions).

well what can I say? here is the answer we all are after, if you had posted this answer to Tesla, he would have just grinned at you and said, borrow my car, the one that runs on "nothing", I drove it around the countryside the other day, all day long, this is what you need.

Ha ha, that is a tongue in cheek answer, but until we get to that position, 50 klms is about what we are left with.

jim