h2opower,
from what i have read of your explanations of stan meyer suppied by ramset on another thred, tell me if im correct, you are sayng that when you are capable of putting oxy in very high energy state that is all you need to seperate hydrogen and oxy(water) ? there is no need for water splitter injector? just the need for thermal heat spark?
outlawstc
does the energy balance (including ionization energy) show an excess of released energy?
or can the ionization of oxygen be 'free' using the VIC method?
is the hydrogen atom really being consumed and gone, like meyer said?
thanks
I believe the gas processor is vital to the injector, as per h20's explanation but I would also like to see it applied to the wfc as in a heater or torch.
Maybe separate the h an o at the cell run the O through the GP and recombine at the orifice, this would also make it less likely to flashback.
The hydrogen atom shouldn't be consumed for all that is being created is water vapor, it the lectures Stanley Meyer says the oxygen atom over compensates giving off the high energy yeilds beyond the normal hydrogen/oxygen reaction. The all copper VIC should be used on the Gas Processor, the SS wire VIC is for use of any gap 0.06-0.01 inches and that is only found in the Water Fuel Capacitor. Note there are two types of VIC transformers not just one. I posted a video of the Gas Processor in action on the other site from MIT.damn, you're actually working on it, looking very good.
Everyone should take the time to read the whole thread as there is a lot of information given in there, plus note I was learning more as I went along. Trust me I really wont re-write everything that I went over in the thread.
Best wishes,
h2opower.
2 H-H bonds 872 kJ/mol and 1 O=O bond 7469.2 kJ/mol (@ 4th + ionization level) are formed yeilding 8341.2 kJ/mol. The net sum of the reaction now is 8341.2-1836 = +6505.2 kJ/molOk, let's assume enough energy is being released in the combustion engine, no doubt about that, it's enough to run a car; the net sum energy released in the combustion process, isn't that quantity equal (or even less) to the energy it did cost to separate the water (1836kJ/mol ) AND ionize the oxygen to 4th level (more than 7469.2 kJ/mol)?
The ioniztion energies is a two way street, what goes up must come down, so it takes the same amount of energy to raise the energy levels as you get from the enregy levels on their way down.
damn, you're actually working on it, looking very good.
In the New Zealand house meeting video, meyer actually did say the atoms are consumed, if I remember correctly.
Ok, let's assume enough energy is being released in the combustion engine, no doubt about that, it's enough to run a car; the net sum energy released in the combustion process, isn't that quantity equal (or even less) to the energy it did cost to separate the water (1836kJ/mol ) AND ionize the oxygen to 4th level (more than 7469.2 kJ/mol)?
you said yourself:
so my point is, I can see that it is possible to run a car on water, but I cannot see OU? Is the air processor a free ionizer and OU in itself?
(save your time by answering this if you already did, don't want to annoy by asking to repeat stuff, but i couldn't find it myself)
this is the link to the MIT video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQvXrxrqshk
All I did is figure out how he was able to use water as a fuel, and posted the results so everyone can enjoy energy independence.
Now I am going to set this up as an engineering project as a result I will not tell you how to build, construct, and/or design your projects if you so choose to make them. The idea is simple, to get as many different models as possible that all work. You will be shown where the power truly comes from and how everything works for the water fuel injector system, not the WFC in use with the gasous type injectors. Read them as a set of rules to follow, anyway you see fit on how to apply what you have read is up to you.
Again I stress that this is to be a engineering type project, the full build of the design shall come from the individual and/or teams that want to work together on it. And most important of all is to have fun ;D.
Enjoy: http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/3217-stanley-meyer-explained-7.html#post47874
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/3217-stanley-meyer-explained.html
A talker who makes things happen ...
http://waterfuelcell.org/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=132
Over a year ? lol I had the wire for under 3 months , plz refrain from making stuff up about me .
http://waterfuelcell.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1185&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=0
So ive seen Aaron talk about the resistance of the chokes , well the 11,600 ohms Meyers speaks of is just DC resistance ... impedance aside ..
Its true that to attain this resistance with copper you need about 45 times more.. or tiny very fragile wire..
Pm me for some
Attached Thumbnails
@Dankie and H2oPower,
To settle all the "I have the better way" (mainly from Dankie), why not put both of your systems to the test at the same time in one place. There can be a few members to wherever it is done to document the event. Then everyone will be able to see who is right and who is wrong.
Dankie, why are you attacking H2o to begin with?
@H2o, can this be modified to work for a home heating furnace in place of natural gas? Do you have any plans on creating something like that? I think that would be a great next step to conquer, affordable home heating for everyone. I don't think I have the know how or ability to build this as is and would need very simplified and specific plans.
Thanks,
Mark
Good to see you are going after the holy grail rather than just worrying about transportation. With clean sources of electricity we can do pretty much anything including transportation.
I have allot of learning to do but I cant wait to see where I can take this myself! I am quite a bit behind most but that doesnt take the fun out of the ride along the way, in fact I hope you all beat me to the finish line but If not I will help bring you there once I get close.
Hi Kippered,
You got that right, if you produce your own power and you have an electric car you kill two birds with the same stone. Energy independence means, for me, starting at home first. If you have a boat house it even gets better no more fuel tank just get the water as you go ;D. Plus for emergency power gen set units can also be made to provide potable water on site. If we learned one thing from Katrina is oil/coal type fuel is hard to come by when desaster strikes. People every year die in there homes due to the energy enslavement game, couldn't afford to pay the heating or cooling bills, and the power genaration companies/energy sellers are fine with that. This is a world wide problem killing millions each year, though there are a lot of other factors involed, energy independence will be a big step in the right direction. Trust me I know exactly what this technology can do, for if you really want to go to Mars this technology will get you there and beyound. In my view this technology is the key to humanity moving forwards again.
h2opower.
Hi Kippered,
You got that right, if you produce your own power and you have an electric car you kill two birds with the same stone. Energy independence means, for me, starting at home first. If you have a boat house it even gets better no more fuel tank just get the water as you go ;D. Plus for emergency power gen set units can also be made to provide potable water on site. If we learned one thing from Katrina is oil/coal type fuel is hard to come by when desaster strikes. People every year die in there homes due to the energy enslavement game, couldn't afford to pay the heating or cooling bills, and the power genaration companies/energy sellers are fine with that. This is a world wide problem killing millions each year, though there are a lot of other factors involed, energy independence will be a big step in the right direction. Trust me I know exactly what this technology can do, for if you really want to go to Mars this technology will get you there and beyound. In my view this technology is the key to humanity moving forwards again.
h2opower.
Interesting,
In my studies the most simplest answer to Stanley Meyer's technology is; Under a controled state change the atmospher to one that is suitable for water combustion
Here are the ionization energy levels of oxygen:
• 1st 1313.9 kJ/mol
• 2nd 3388.3 kJ/mol
• 3rd 5300.5 kJ/mol
• 4th 7469.2 kJ/mol
• 5th 10909.5 kJ/mol
• 6th 13326.5 kJ/mol
• 7th 71330.0 kJ/mol
• 8th 84078.0 kJ/mol
Now let us take a look at the reaction to break and form the water molecule under normal conditions.
4 H-O 459 kJ/mol bonds are broken taking 1836 kJ/mol to do so.
2 H-H 436 kJ/mol bonds 872 kJ/mol and 1 O=O bond 498 kJ/mol are formed yielding 1370 kJ/mol.
This is why all scientist say it takes more energy to break the bonds of water than you get from combining them, for the net sum of the reaction is negative, 1370-1836 = -466 kJ/mol.
Now the new reactions after the GP has stripped the electrons off of the oxygen atom are known as ionic reactions. Let’s take a look at the 1st energy level of 1313.9 kJ/mol.
The new reaction to form the water molecule 1st energy level:
2 H-H bonds 872 kJ/mol and 1 O=O bond 1313.9 kJ/mol are formed yielding 2185.9 kJ/mol. The net sum of the reaction is now positive 2185.9-1836 = +349.9 kJ/mol, so now we are getting more energy out than in. To give the energy level a bench mark for comparison the energy content of gasoline is +4864 kJ/mol. So only striping one electron off of the oxygen atom resulted in a positive energy level but still far behind that of gasoline.
Stanley Meyer said he stripped four electrons or more off of the oxygen atom so let us take a look at the reactions as told to us in the patent.
The new reaction to form the water molecule at the 4th energy level is as follows:
2 H-H bonds 872 kJ/mol and 1 O=O bond 7469.2 kJ/mol are formed yielding 8341.2 kJ/mol. The net sum of the reaction now is 8341.2-1836 = +6505.2 kJ/mol
5th
2 H-H bonds 872 kJ/mol and 1 O=O bond 10090.5 kJ/mol = 10962.5 kJ/mol. The net sum of the reaction is 10962.5-1836= +9126.5 kJ/mol.
6th
2 H-H bonds 872 kJ/mol and 1 O=O bond 13326.5 kJ/mol = 14198.5 kJ/mol. The net sum of the reaction is 14198.5-1836= +12362.5 kJ/mol.
Now this is more than 2.54 times the energy content of that of gasoline, and gives a most probable answer to the question of, “How did Stanley Meyer run his 1.6L engine with an hho production rate of only 7L/min.?†For you still have two more electrons to strip off.
What is your take on the math of the process? Am I right or wrong in your view? This assumes the worste case of the reaction, if done any other way will give higher energy yeilds. For what it all comes down to is energy flux density in this case I measured it in joules per mole. @ Outlawstc
The new reaction to form the water molecule 1st energy level:
2 H-H bonds 872 kJ/mol and 1 O=O bond 1313.9 kJ/mol are formed yielding 2185.9 kJ/mol. The net sum of the reaction is now positive 2185.9-1836 = +349.9 kJ/mol, so now we are getting more energy out than in. To give the energy level a bench mark for comparison the energy content of gasoline is +4864 kJ/mol. So only striping one electron off of the oxygen atom resulted in a positive energy level but still far behind that of gasoline.
i'm not even going to dignify your "GOD" theory with an answer..
use of GOD either implies that you believe it is the be all and end all way... not slightly ignorant at all... or that it is holy and is greater than man kind... still not slightly ignorant at all
there has been plenty of research into it.
This is getting sad. What the hell are you people on?
Outlaw is now throwing religion into the mix - I guess that is to conveniently fill in the missing bits that his brain can't handle or science seemingly can't explain!
H2O, maths is not proof of concept. The maths is simply figures from which you are forming your concept.
Proof of concept is having a working unit powering a ICE.... don't think you've got one of these have you?
I know exactly what to think about the likes of Dinkie. Kinesis and Outlaw, but I'm really not sure what to make of you H2O. Seems to me like your just shouting your mouth off as many have before, making out that you have all the answers, but curiously you seem to expect others to build the unit! I've heard it all before, people are good at talking the talk - yet to see anyone walk the walk. And I for one wont be holding my breath while you play with your maths.
What I'd like to know is just where all the power to continually ionise oxygen is coming from in the first place?
Personally, like Meyer, I don't for one minute think that you understand the science involved in what your are suggesting, let alone have the electronics know-how to build a proof-of-concept unit.
But don't let that stop you... please, go ahead and prove me wrong!
What I'd like to know is just where all the power to continually ionise oxygen is coming from in the first place?
Well H2O, I've now concluded that you're just as misguided as most of the others around here - what a lot of nonsense you talk!
Why would I have to prove you wrong?
I didn't find Meyer very credible, I find you less so. Proof is in the pudding, not the recipe. Once you have a working model you can then put an end to any speculation and skepticism. I, or anyone else does not need to prove you wrong, you simply need to prove yourself right, by building a working model. Afterall, you made a point of coming over here shouting about how you know how to do it - it's for you to back up you claims, not for us to disprove you. Besides you haven't actually got anything to disprove yet have you... it's all just talk!
I say again, you have nothing but theories until you put your ideas into practise and build a working - proof of concept - model. And again, where is all the energy to continually ionise oxygen coming from in the first place?
And do you really expect an oxygen ion missing half a dozen electrons to react with a hydrogen ion? If so how? Do you expect to get water as a by-product? If so, how?
Exactly what chemical reaction do you expect to get from heavily ionised oxygen and hydrogen? How can they even react?
I don't think you've really thought this through. Gases ionised to extremes won't react as normal, they need too many electrons to stabilise. Like Meyer before you, it all sounds good, but the science simply does not add up!
Outlaw sweetie, has the doctor changed your medication by any chance... because you seem to be tripping on something?
i will answer for you h20
In electricity, a corona discharge is an electrical discharge brought on by the ionization of a fluid surrounding a conductor, which occurs when the potential gradient (the strength of the electric field) exceeds a certain value, but conditions are insufficient to cause complete electrical breakdown or arcing
references
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corona_discharge
outlawstc
You are not smart enough to take on the likes of me so go call on some of your butt bodies to help you out, or take the easy way out and quit
Great to see you around Farrah ... I dont agree with all you said , but do agree with some of it .
Yeah this forum sucks now , its just a shithole , I feel like cursing @ everybody .... O yeah I remember , thats just what I did for the last few weeks , curse and insult people ., I guess this site does has its appeal after all... best part is you cant ever get banned
Be honest, did you know there where two types of VIC transformers being used by Stanley Meyer?
I went over this on the other site for anyone else wanting to know more about them.
Kineses
In spite of the bickering here,I can still pull water out of thin air and create a system for refueling a water powered car automatically.Now you guys just need to recreate Stanley Meyer's device for pulling water apart.My design could be used to refuel as a car is sitting or running 24/7.Triffid
I for one know that the Gas Processor is the most important part of Stanley Meyer's technology for at the end of one of his patents he says it can be used with any type of fuel, and as we have all seen that the Gas Processor can be driven by any high frequency switching type transformer as the MIT video demonstraited. Without the Gas Processor you can get no thermo explosive energy all you will get is 286 kJ/mol or perhapes a bit more if hho is produced. But that is no where near the energy content of gasolines 4k-5k kJ/mol depending on the grade used. Remember it all comes down to energy flux density and water for fuel with the Gas Processor has far more energy content than fossile fuels.
And kinesisfilms please don't talk to him for he is not worth it lets just run right over him for we are all making great progress right now ;) I for one am not going back for road kill ::)
h2opower
Now I am going to set this up as an engineering project as a result I will not tell you how to build, construct, and/or design your projects if you so choose to make them. The idea is simple, to get as many different models as possible that all work. You will be shown where the power truly comes from and how everything works for the water fuel injector system, not the WFC in use with the gasous type injectors. Read them as a set of rules to follow, anyway you see fit on how to apply what you have read is up to you.
Again I stress that this is to be a engineering type project, the full build of the design shall come from the individual and/or teams that want to work together on it. And most important of all is to have fun ;D.
Enjoy: http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/3217-stanley-meyer-explained-7.html#post47874
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/3217-stanley-meyer-explained.html
once again...something is not right here......Phantasm and Farrahday might be one in the same.
I get that you guys have a lot of trouble with people being myschievious here and being that there's no way to prove or disprove anything in this regard, I suppose you can believe what you willNot another annoying "smooth talker" , theres enough of you around here .
I only hope that you can still be critical of the message independently of being critical of the messenger
Thanks,
Hi! H20power, I am new to this forum. I've been reading several forums for the last year or so on Stan Meyers and about anything i could research about him and his work. I never realy wanted to join a forum until i started reading this thread for i find it very interesting. I have been working on this for over a year now. And like most people im getting no where with it. I Think you show a new outlook on the way it should be built and work. I intend on putting your ideas and math to good use (for it all adds up). I hope you and everyone welcomes me here for i may need help from time to time......I am a Machinest by trade and i am willing to help out in any way i can in that feild of work..
Thanks,
Gpssonar
If you reason it out you can only come to a few conclussions, but the primary conclussion is, he is trying to get you to not build a nesasary device found in the patents of Stanley Meyer's for the reason of keeping you all trapped in the energy enslavement game they have us all playing right now
Now I am going to set this up as an engineering project as a result I will not tell you how to build, construct, and/or design your projects if you so choose to make them. The idea is simple, to get as many different models as possible that all work. You will be shown where the power truly comes from and how everything works for the water fuel injector system, not the WFC in use with the gasous type injectors. Read them as a set of rules to follow, anyway you see fit on how to apply what you have read is up to you.
Again I stress that this is to be a engineering type project, the full build of the design shall come from the individual and/or teams that want to work together on it. And most important of all is to have fun ;D.
Enjoy: http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/3217-stanley-meyer-explained-7.html#post47874
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/3217-stanley-meyer-explained.html
Hello guys i would like to invite you to my thread http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/4617-stanley-meyer-true.html
Here i released the basic information about the way meyer did to achieve 1000x efficiency electrolysis.
I ask for donations so if you can please donate it will help a lot. I decided to come here and advert you about it.
Answer he didn't used high voltage between the plates. He talked about this to confuse people.
40kv at 1ma = to 40 watts right ?
How about 4000 amps at 0,01volts
would not it be = to 40w?
The key is how to pass this huge current thru water at this very low voltage. You would need very high surface on the plates and...
Info about this here http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/4617-stanley-meyer-true.html
Please donate
Interesting arguments L505. I'm confused about how you interpret ionization and such. Do you understand it and you say Meyers didn't?
Where do the electrons go? In Stan's case, ground. The EEC is clearly used after the electrolytic cell to ionize the liberated gasses. Stan calls it an "Electron Extraction Circuit", Tesla called it an "Ozone Generator", "Air Ionizer", etc...
The technology is older than the hills, so, it should not be too hard of a concept even when the names have changed which all inventors love to do when they invent(rediscover). like the "Transmogrifier" or a "Flux Capacitor".
In the course of my own investigations, more especially those of the electric properties of ice, I have discovered some novel and important facts, of which the more prominent are the following : Firsts that under certain conditions, when the leakage of the electric charge, ordinarily taking place, is rigorously prevented, ice proves itself to be a much better insulator than has heretofore appeared; second, that its insulating properties may be still further improved by the addition of other bodies to the water; third, that the di-electric strength of ice or other frozen aqueous substance increases with the reduction of temperature and corresponding increase of hardness; and fourth, that these bodies afford a still more effective insulation for conductors carrying intermittent or alternating currents, particularly of high rates ; surprisingly thin layers of ice being capable of withstanding electromotive forces of many hundreds, and even thousands of volts.Improvements relating to the Insulation of Electric Conductors.
I realize that I'm off the mark here, but "Electrons" cannot "Go" to ground. Please remember, unless you are working with high Negative Voltages, the electrons COME from ground.
I can assume that Stan could have been using all negative values, at which point the ground could suck up the higher charged particles. (No need to discuss the theory with you guys, as you understand it better than I.)
@L505
After re-reading your "Questions" several times, so I had some idea of what you were really asking, I can offer a small start. First, there are two ways to create ions. One is to add an electron. The other is to remove one.
Yes there is a way to steal the electron from the oxygen atoms this reaction takes place when you start to have ionization by collision inside your cells works like a chain reaction 1 electron is liberated is recirculated by the tank and again shot in the water again to knock out more electrons.
So believe me or not is your choice i ask for money
(http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y320/h2opower/Timelinewithwhitebackground-1.jpg)
L505
Magic ?
or good engineering??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKPrGxB1Kzc
Chet
Funny, I can strip electrons off of oxygen with only 5 watts of power! It's called an "Ionizer"...
Most importantly Stan never clearly explained how 4 electrons are stripped without expending energy. Electrons are not just waiting to be stripped for free. It takes great energy to strip electrons from atoms. That's what people don't understand when it comes to energy levels, and that's why there are all the free mol energy assumptions/miscalculations.
Now if you've discovered some magical way to strip electrons without expending energy, then you've gotta back it up with a sound theory and not quackery or assumption ("they'll just knock off because I said so due to my magical wave theory" isn't good enough).
People assume that it doesn't take much energy to knock off the electrons from the atom and that is simply not true.
Do you always argue with gibberish? This is the post I was addressing in the first place and now you want an answer to something else? Go educate yourself and figure it out like the rest of us! It helps to know what the hell you are debating in the first place. With the few nonsensical words you have written, it is clear you do not have the capacity to ponder such things let alone inadequate communication skills. If you truly believe this is all quackery, why hang around and argue about it? Is it because you are lonely?
Look up something called "burden of proof" and "shifting the burden of evidence" and such phrases. When you are done that, please come back.
Hi Everyone,
I could use everyones help in gain the needed funding to bring our Stanley Meyer's technology for I made it on the Pepsi Refresh Project http://www.refresheverything.com/widget/?i=4f691802-d37c-102d-826f-0019b9b9e205&w=300
Now the future of Energy Independence is in our hands. Please spread the word and show your support with votes.
Thanks Everyone,
h2opower.
from reading the last couple pages of talk about electrons, i get the distinct idea that you consider them to be discrete particles, is this correct? are you suggesting that electrons are discrete particles?
One has to make sure we don't screw up our environment by giving off radiation and/or consuming mass that we don't want to consume (i.e. taking mass out of oceans, one would have to calculate how much mass is lost with millions of cars/airplanes). A proper explanation and balanced equations is still required for this device to ever be taken seriously. No one has provided ANY whatsoever....
Now for something completely different. :o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YU47blakiiI&feature=related
Cheers all - didn't know where else to post this link.
From what I have seen in peoples capabilities here on this site, with the teachings I posted, a good 15-30% of you here on this site should now be converting your cars to run on water as it's sole source of fuel...is your car converted to run on water as it's sole source of fuel?
But as Meyer himself sometimes said, "You must learn how to ask the right questions," and I believe now I have done just that.i believe i did... just previously.
My company is bringing out a different part of Stanley Meyer's technology which will not be talked about until it's unveiling as I have stated before my knowledge of Stanley Meyer's technology is vast. I did my part in doing what everyone else before me would not, and that was to give the water for fuel technology away for free. Sure you are going to have to build, design, and everything else that goes along with creating this technology for yourself. But if this is to be a grass roots effort then I say to you, "What are you waiting for!" My company already has it's agenda on which part of his technology it will market. As for what I have converted to use this technology I will not say as this is not the correct place to do that in. This is a WAR for our independence, an energy independence, where the individual is in full control of their own energy needs. The time to act is now for you all are those individuals!so that's a no then... your car isn't converted to run on water as its sole source of fuel.
As for a home furnace or those other parts of Stanley Meyer's technology, no I haven't built anything like that as of yet. To tell the truth I haven't even thought of doing so until you just brought it up right now. I will look into it for future projects for I think you are correct there is a need for that too.
so that's a no then... your car isn't converted to run on water as its sole source of fuel.
i find that interesting.
Hi H2Opower
Nice Circuit, but I have one little problem, and you may have already corrected it on newer designs, but there is so much out there that I rarely have time to view half of it.
The "Pass" component shown is an SCR, which once conducting will not shut off until the current drops below the threshold point. Is this the correct part and idea? My only assumption is the actual current flowing through the coil and "Water Cap" is always below the this point, but wouldn't this make start-up a "Problem". (As in, the first cycle would turn on the device, but until the "Charge" was enough to limit the current, the part latches.)
I realize that there may be dynamics I am unaware of and I have not actually built this specific circuit, but I have made enough of this type of setup to know that reducing the current has always been one of the hardest parts (For me, at least...) and I am quite curious. I can imagine that a 2 Henry "Choke" might be enough to prevent "Latch-up", but I didn't want to guess and I don't have enough experience with the dynamics of the "Water Cap" itself to figure it with plain math.
I am going to read and save the last few links you provided, and that may very well answer my questions, but any insight you would care to offer would be greatly appreciated.
TIA
So a electron vacuum sort of,would work?
Hi H20power so what can one do to increase electrolysis in a cell? A guy said to put an oscillator near the cell. I am using tha lawton circuit now but if you have other ideas I would like to hear.
Thanks
Hi,
What you want it to do is ionized the water, for you do not want any electrolysis going on at all. Once you get the water to ionized just like creating ozone, water starts to lose electrons. An atom can lose a few electrons and remain the atom it is, but not a molecule for by losing electrons makes the molecule become unstable and break apart for it can no longer satisfy the Octet Rule.
In order to do this the charging choke must have a greater capacitance than the capacitor that is to be charged. In order to get higher voltages the resistance of the circuit has too increase. In patent 4789661 in the drawings you will see a variable resistor just after the negative electrode and the ground. The resistor is 60n, and in the patent Meyer tells us that with increased voltages the resistance has to go up. This raises the "Breakdown Point" and at the same time cuts the amps going to the system. The 8xa circuit can be modified with a Lawton circuit so your in luck ;). As you raise the voltage more water is broken down by way of increased ionization. That is the key to Meyer's water breakdown method, high resistance to keep the amps low and high voltage to ionize the water molecules thus ejecting very electrons it needs to keep it in a stable state.
There is no normal electrolysis taking place in the method Meyer employed. By increasing voltage/resistance you increase the amount of gas produced.
Hope that helped some,
h2opower
Do you have a working system powering an actual vehicle h2opower?
The secret of Meyer is the VIC and how it is pulsed.
Understanding the principals is more important than schematics.
Does anyone have a VIC for sale?
Hi H2opower about the Lawton circuit you said that I have to increase voltage. So I should do a sort of inverter after the circuit to higher voltage?Are you going to use a system that has just the chokes or a isolated pulsing VIC transformer? If you are using an isolated VIC pulsing transformer then all you need to add to the system is a high side PWM. In the pic of the high side PWM you just need to change the p-channel FET to one that can take a higher voltage. This PWM is hooked up to the positive side of the primary coil and the Lawton circuit to the negative side of the primary coil. That will give you control of the voltages without affecting the pulsing of the transformer.
Thanks
I'm going to create the 3-23 VIC:
A modified EI to UI core.
Turns:
Primary: 50-100 thick wire
Secondary: 30k-40k 38awg
Chokes: 30k-40k 38awg
any suggestions?
Hi H20power where is the H11D1 setup found?
Thanks
Your not going to like this one...
If your planned Reso freq = 1830 hz , the plates alternate at 1830 cps AC based on LC timing.
If you move to a larger L , the freq drops and X changes.
L + C are passive components that react differently to AC = REACTANCE
Xc and XL are 180 degrees to each other and cancel each other
2 pi formulas are sine , circular not pulse.
**A choke does not stop DC...... Electrons
6326.44 + 22996.46 + 23015.04 + 78.54 X 3.77883 nf...
R l + 2 pi f L + 1/ (2 pi f C ) + stan fig?? X C
78.54 OHMS is one of Stans tricks that out lived him and unfortunately stuck to the blanket.
**specific constants are measured at specific temperatures...78.54 @ 25 degrees centigrade, the same sample @ 20 degrees C = 80.37 , the same sample @ 100 degrees C = 55.33 ....
The Dielectric constant CANT be measured in OHMS and NEVER has been ,HOW ? ? ? ,ones a temperature the other is a ratio.
Resistivity ,R ,X ,Z are measured in Ohms but R is the only one used in RC time constant.
If you want 1830 hz ,youll need a power supply and it will need a timing circuit wether its 555 , TL494 or what ever ,it will also need an RC combo on the timing pins.
Stans WFC tech brief has mis info through out , ANYONE can go thru and check .
Have a look thru this site at RC timing and theres a section on tuned circuits.
http://www.learn-about-electronics.com/rc-time-constant.html
Theres alot of people putting in an honest effort into researching Meyers but surely there needs to be an honest approach to the info he was peddling. Put it under the microscope .
There is an actual possibility that the info is BOGUS and not even Jesus can change that .
Square one is there for everyone and unfortunately we're all there but drifting down the same path that a dead man pointed down isnt going to help .
..as you were... and NO Im not kicking you or anyone else in the guts.
Let me give you some info to help understand Stans work.
1st: Stan had three water cells.
1- variable plate cell (non resonance)
2-multi tube cell,alternator powered (also non resonance)
3-resonanct cavity,11 tube cell (the only resonance cell)
The first two cells were amp restricting cells.They only show amp restriction and no resonance action.
2nd: The biggest mistake most people make is that they think the multi tube demo cell worked on resonance,It didn't.
3rd:The next mistake they make is trying to drive a multi tube cell with a frequency driver to find resonance.It won't work,back to 2nd fact.
4th: Another mistake people make is mixing different technologies together, 3rd fact.
This one is the bigest thing I see people doing wrong.Trying to use a VIC coil with the multi tube cell.They are two different technologies.
Let me give you some info to help understand Stans work.
1st: Stan had three water cells.
1- variable plate cell (non resonance)
2-multi tube cell,alternator powered (also non resonance)
3-resonanct cavity,11 tube cell (the only resonance cell)
The first two cells were amp restricting cells.They only show amp restriction and no resonance action.
2nd: The biggest mistake most people make is that they think the multi tube demo cell worked on resonance,It didn't.
3rd:The next mistake they make is trying to drive a multi tube cell with a frequency driver to find resonance.It won't work,back to 2nd fact.
4th: Another mistake people make is mixing different technologies together, 3rd fact.
This one is the bigest thing I see people doing wrong.Trying to use a VIC coil with the multi tube cell.They are two different technologies.
page 1-1 SMTB
LC Circuit
Resonant Charging Choke (C) in series with Excitor-array (El/E2) forms an inductor-capacitor circuit
(LC) since the Excitor-Array (ER) acts or performs as an capacitor during pulsing operations, as
illustrated in Figure (1-2) as to Figure (1-1).
The Dielectric Properties (insulator to the flow of amps) of natural water (dielectric constant being
78.54 @ 25c) between the electrical plates (El/E2) forms the capacitor (ER). Water now becomes part
of the Voltage Intensifier Circuit in the form of "resistance" between electrical ground and pulsefrequency
positive-potential ... helping to prevent electron flow within the pulsing circuit (AA) of
Figure 1-1.
Very Nice Cell. I assume that you have "Tuned" these cells via exacting methods during the build? I do like the way the seals allow direct exposure of the outer tubes but I would think this "O-Ring" type of sealing would dampen physical vibration and alter the true resonance point. Yes or No?
( Yes, I am still watching, learning, lurking and interested. )
I might accept that the "Resonance" would be totally "Electrical" in nature, but noticed in several reads of many areas (I have no true opinion on Meyer himself, as the info is the important part.) that separate units were used for each tube in the "resonance" build. If all were in series, why would there be more than one unit needed? (There were many on the Buggy...)
I'm not trying to be negative, just trying to understand...
Thanks for info, as I had thought you were one of the people that first brought that little fact to light. Maybe my memory is failing me?
Keep up the great work...
h20 power. In post # 248. You saidThe vic transformers were hooked up three and three. That is to say 3 were hooked in parallel.and those 3 were hooked up out of phase. I can see and understand fron the figure 8-11b where the first three go to the outer tube. But dont understand (those three were hooked up out of phase in a three phase arrangement). Could you explain this to me better so I can understand this a little better. I am working on the alternator version now. Also if there were 9 vics in total would the stator have to be center tapped to put in 3 more vics and then put in three more off the 3 neutral legs. trying my best to understand this .Thanks.
Hi H2opower
that looks like a nicely built cell set - i notice that the design appears to work like a capacitor in that the only area of water contact is between the 2 tubes - what about the centerer of the inner tube - is it left open because i was wondering how you circulated the water from the top to bottom sections of the cell.
With the resonant cavity drawing, diagram attached, where is the earth symbolized connection on the water inlet connected to.? I'm unclear of its purpose - is it for setting a electrical polarity on the water entering the cavity.?
the question: On the VIC coil driving the cell - has anyone contemplated what would happen in the circuit if the secondary had a centerer tap and that centerer tap electrically connects to the water in the cell. ?
What I was curious about was the earthing/grounding of the inlet, and as the vic/chokes/cell are effectively a closed circuit.
Even referring to fig 8-11 of the rotary vic on the alternator setup, the diagram clearly says - water bath electrical ground 0v.
For a ground point for the water, as seen on the inlet of the "resonant cavity", is that applicable to a WFC and if so could a ground, zero point, be utilized by a centerer tap on the secondary for as an example for reference, as seen in a simple dual rail psu circuit.??
I can see 2 diagrams that refer to the water being 0v, wfc422da and fig 8-11. Writing by others suggests that on a vic circuit and cell they can get high voltages across the electrodes/plates but little output, so might an area to explore be the potential of the watter as in the 2 Meyer's diagrams?
is a cell a water bath and resonant cavity.?
BTW - anyone find the kontera.com and infolinks.com underlining of "hotwords in posts and the forum a nuisance? - use Noscript with firefox to prevent the scripts for konterra.com and infolinks.com from being used - makes the page much cleaner to read
Would appreciate some data like power in gas out.
I hope your experiments work out.
Here is a recent article I wrote for those new to the water for fuel concept.
http://revolution-green.com/2013/06/05/water-powered-cars-and-generators/ (http://revolution-green.com/2013/06/05/water-powered-cars-and-generators/)
Kind Regards
I'm not trying to confuse your efforts here, but I believe there are similarities between Stan Meyer's and Bob Boyce's technologies. Resonance is involved, but IMO the frequencies are variable and have little if anything to do with molecular or atomic frequency.
All Meyers methods involve robbing atoms of their valence electrons to nullify covalent molecular bonds.
The VIC steals the valence electrons, then applies an electric field to finish the job.
Meyers made the statement that water is an insulator, and everyone said "he's cracked!"
Well, Meyers wasn't cracked.
There are certain circumstances where water does act as an insulator.
Based on the contents of Meyers' patents, and the wealth of information they contain, along with the doubt and confusion encountered by those who try to decypher them, IMO, either Meyers was a genius and excelled at protecting his technology, or, Meyers was lead by some higher intelligence, and he blindly followed without fully understanding the technology he delivered.
http://www.mareasistemi.com/didattica%2010.html (http://www.mareasistemi.com/didattica%2010.html)
I remember when the Ravi story originally came out, and everyone was hoping to find the reason why their attempts at replicating Meyer's technology had failed. Everyone poured over the pictures, circuitry, and what little documentation was forthcoming, but to no avail. Ravi appeared to have stumbled upon success with no rational explanation. I'm convinced that even Ravi couldn't duplicate his own success since he couldn't adequately explain what he did that was different.
If one goes back and looks at all the material Meyer produced concerning his successful models, you'll find early models where he was using 3 electrodes. In my research, I believe I have found the reason he used 3 electrodes. I have discovered that water molecules bind together to form conduction paths, and as long as current continues to flow through these conduction paths, the molecules stay aggressively locked within these paths, and will resist making new paths. Thus Meyer's statements concerning the insulative qualities of water. No one could understand why Meyer would make such statements, since everyone knows water conducts electricity. I believe this is the key to Meyer's success which everyone has overlooked.
As one continues down this path of reasoning, a sequence of events have to take place to break down water.
1) Apply a 1st electric potential that will lock the water molecules into a configuration that makes them vulnerable to perpendicular forces.
2) Apply a 2nd electric potential perpendicular to the configuration of the conduction paths formed in step 1.
3) Once a number of molecules have broken, and free molecules re-align with the 2nd electric potential, shut down the 2nd electric potential.
4) repeat step 1.
Each of Meyer's models which involves electrodes submerged in water use this method or sequence of events.
Thus the need for pulsing electricity to the electrodes.
It's similar to the domino effect.
If one wants to demonstrate the domino effect, steps have to be taken.
Set the dominos up in a predetermined configuration.
Apply a force in a direction that is calculated to take advantage of a known weakness and the dominos fall.
<By all accounts, it has nothing to do with molecular or atomic frequencies/resonance, and everything to do with circuit/electronic resonance.>
I think the information Puharich gave is more correct. Why should he lie about this frequency 22GHz.
He mentioned it because he found out while doing research.
Hydrogen production using cheap metals (Nickel/Nickel Oxide) at low voltage is now possible and very efficient. Such that a single AAA battery can be made to produce it via simple method.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nh_0cRYebYU
http://news.stanford.edu/pr/2013/pr-nickel-water-splitter-111213.html
TS
I am well aware of that technology and as always they are 5-10 years down the road.
Perhaps not as well aware as you assume. Afterall, the methodology for depositing thin films of Nickel Oxide on cheap silicon wafers is not rocket science. It's only 5-10 years down the road for those who prefer the hard way. The point is, it is simple and they're doing it N-O-W.
http://jes.ecsdl.org/content/146/4/1407.abstract
The technology is eminently scalable and much simpler and more efficient than any other I've seen. And I've been down that road aways. And its back alleys too.
Hydrogen catalysis don't get much simpler than that, and with the observed output at 1.5v with a triple A battery.....
Well, the results speak for themselves.
TS
oh Did Stanley Meyers said anything about deionizing the negative out of water in his videos ? If he did not then that is what he is also doing there and all negative Ion's are also all negative electrons that are losing there magnetic attraction to itself and the temperatures does play with one of major parts of water !! And sir I dont have my head in my butt you would say here because the findings I came up with is the only explanation to my experimenting with distilled water in my video !! Have or has anyone tried to use one paper clip and one stainless steel spoon to get what I got yet here ? No because you guys think you got all the dang answer but dont !!! Its ok if you or anyone here dont listen to me its fine by me because I got something you guys have not seen or used yet !!! I wish that someone would work with me on my findings but its ok also because some of you guys are lost then and do not care to help me out at all when you got your own heads up your tuss yourselves !!!
Tom
Then lower the capacitance of each cell and reduce the number of cells and you should be in the ballpark.
I guess you know what you are doing Ed. Hope you're right.
If it were me, I'd assemble about 20 fully operational prototypes and give them away for peer review. Those reviews will be the cheapest marketing you are going to find. With thumbs up from all reviewers, only then would I consider mass production.
There are two rules you must follow if you continue on your current path:
#1 If you do not take care of the customer, somebody else will.
#2 The customer is always right.
Translation -- Nobody cares what you think you have. You have to prove yourself to them. They will happily beat you to a pulp if your product does not live up to their expectations. One whiner will end any and all funding you otherwise might have received. That's the cruel reality of "the markets" you speak about. Bring your A-game or stay home.
BTW, these guys (https://www.lulzbot.com/) have far more complex technology; they're OpenSource too. Buy theirs or build it yourself, either way everyone wins.
Well Ed, I'm a little confused.
1. You don't believe in OpenSource, yet you post publicly here at overunity.com.
2. You want to build something that can be mass produced and sold where?
3. You need everyone's help to get this off the ground, yet you scorn one-offs.
I sense a lot of mixed signals in your postings and very little hard-core details such as:
* How to impedance match the coils to the cell.
* How to tune the system once assembled.
* Where to get off-the-shelf parts.
* How concepts like Coulomb's Law apply to splitting water molecules.
* Electrical schematics and scope shots showing the exact needed waveforms.
I sometimes feel this is just your hobby Ed and you have no real desire to "save the world".
I also don't feel you have the motivation to re-create this technology and share it
in a form people can immediately get their hands on and begin to replicate.
And lastly, I doubt very much you have the guts to get yourself and your
family killed over this technology. Maybe someday you'll get lucky, get
something to work and the MiBs will offer to buy you out and you can
live happily ever after. I know in the case of Mr. Walker, he found what
he was looking for and can now go to his grave with a smile on his face.
Myself, I'd rather be JFK'd doing what I know needs to be done. My life
means nothing; what I take with me means everything. Do you have
what it takes Ed? I'm not asking you this to piss you off. I'm asking you
this so you might take a deep look into your soul and define your purpose.
I'd like nothing better than to see you setup a complete system with ICE
and generator attached and fire this all up for the very first time on live
streaming cameras, so the whole world could see you prove this technology
out. I'd like those streams to be so rich in detail that only a complete
idiot could not figure out what you have built. Do it Ed, do it. Let the
genie out of the bottle so it can never again be put back in. Get angry.
Develop a hatred for silence, obscurity and falsehoods. Let it all go.
Make a difference. Make your mark in this 21st century. And just
remember what Will Munny said in the movie Unforgiven...
We all got it comin' kid.
Well Ed,i must say that i was a little upset with Russ my self not so long ago.
I hadnt heard from him in a long time,only to see he posted a video directed at my work i was doing at the time,pointing out mistakes he thought i had made.
If he had of been following the thread at OUR,where i was asked to take voltage and current measurements separately,then maybe he would have understood what i was showing.
Needless to say,he did the measurements incorrectly him self in his video,where he showed the phase shift between two current value's,instead of the phase relationship between voltage and current that relates to power factor.
But none the less,I still believe in Russ,and what he is doing for the community.
I also still have the up most respect for him,and would have a cuppa or beer with him any day.
We (Russ and myself) gave birth to the pulse motor build off's,which was a huge success for the years it was in play. The buldoff's just seemed to bring so many people together,and was a wack of fun.
Russ and myself use to be as thick as thieves,and it saddens me some what that we no longer seem to get together,and have a yarn.
Anyway Ed--forgive and forget--thats what i say.
Brad
As for Stephen Meyer I really don't care what he has to say and will never seriously take a look at anything he has done as my goal was to get at the science behind the technology and yes I did finally got at that science despite Meyer's wishes that no one would be able to figure out what he had done. In order to do this I had to step away from Meyer's work and focus on the use of the scientific method to get at the core science behind this technology. Asking and answering questions through experimentation is what the scientific method is all about and I put in the time, a lot of time, to get the job done.
Taken down due to Armcortex
For us, now we can clearly see voltage does in fact do work and all we have to do is place a high voltage potential difference electrical field on the plates of the water capacitors we make. It's not as easy as I make it sound but at least we now know what must be done and why.
I know this has been a ruff trip for you ...
still looking for the "Papp" water turbine Vid--
As a crowd collectively we can do just as the rich do if we pool our resources together which is what crowdfunding is all about. I am really not looking for Angel investors as they normally come with strings attached. Most of the investors are looking for a return on their investment and are thus the primary reason why we are all in this mess with the climate.
H2Opower
Agree 100%, I met many quite charming, slick talking people who wanted to "invest" in this kind of technology over the years. Save the world they said but the moment they thought they had any control they turned into narcissistic abusive psychopaths.
In the end I came to the conclusion that there is no amount of money they could pay me to have to tolerate there narcissistic abusive bs. Life is short and we only have a given amount of time to live our lives and do the things which make us happy and grow as a person.
Regards
I hear you Onepower as I have been there and done that already. People tried and trap me into working for them or with them with truly one sided proposals. Some of those proposals were so bad that I wouldn't even be able to afford the technology that I figured out.
Anyway, I already have a plan that I am following and at this point in my life I don't think there is anyone that can dissuade me from that plan. I am old and as stubborn as they come and moreover I believe in what I am doing.
Here is how I see things. No one is talking about what I shared on this forum on my thread. I already know this is very new information concerning Meyer's technology to everyone as not a soul has ever talked about Meyer's technology in such a way that I am aware of. Most have brought to me different technologies that really aren't viable solutions instead of talking about what I just shared in an Open Source setting. This is what I see and can go back a few pages to easily prove what I am saying is true. When I say Meyer took this technology with him in death I meant it as I haven't shared how to actually go about mimicking a thunderstorm as I only shared the raw science behind the technology in an attempt to gainer some support for this technology as I move forwards with it.
Meyer was very good at hiding the technology in plain sight as he purposefully left out the primary equation that governs this technology as well as a few other things. He was so good at hiding things that even those that actually held his technology in their hands missed things and thus copied it wrong which is why they were unable to duplicate his work. The main thing that separates me from them is I actually took the time to make use of the scientific method and where it lead me I followed.
Are we thinking in 15% average efficiently ic-engines or 90% ic- engines. ?
https://patentauction.com/patent.php?nb=10760
IC-engines are not only used as car / ship/plane drive : stationary co-generation plant.( also as range extender ) !
"FE- generator into a motor-genrator wheel with wireless controle"
"FE- generator into a by human flying drone with wireless controle"
IancaIV
It's kind of like listening to people debating the virtues of the best donkey/saddle combination while an F-16 flies over there heads.
the best saddle for a donkey is the one that is most comfortable for the animal not the rider.
an F16 is reduced to scrap metal if the fuel tanks are empty or if a financial group halt supplies.
in our modern advanced society horses are used for nothing more than racing , entertainment or pet food yet for 1000s of years horses were used for transport and work, a much prized possession.
the donkey and F16 is just an example of how 2 worlds are made obsolete by external force. and that peoples choices are not really their own
H2 is still the biggest threat to the same old players. notice all the wind farms around the world ? the same power, has the power and don't want to give the people freedom to break loose of the grip
great to see Ed back on board. ….might be good idea to walk away from the forums tho, doesn't seem to change does it
Anybody care to share results?
Before we talk about more money...
H2O, maybe you have to admit that you were had by a conman and been parotting all those years?
Must be hard on you.
plus a reminder
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCZLQD4IgQ0
To date, no one has presented a convinsing replication of the WFC. I don't want to repeat any names as not to offend.A Breath of fresh air !!
My current search is for a method to apply an SiO2 layer to the tube. Even if I knew, how thick would the layer be?
Meyer stated in his patent the gap in his test cells were 0.625 inch. That is 1.68 mm. I know of commercial 1 mm thick sintered glass filter tubes.
Alternatively,
There is a solution that is called "water glass" which is applied to surfaces for sealing but we want a porous finish
then, I though I can mix some TiO2 with "water glass" before applying it and guess what,
TiO2 under certain condition becomes luminous!
My work will be totally open source. I don't want any money or fame. The only reason I am here is to bounce my ideas around.
Thank you
LUMINOUS ??I’m using cat litter and drain cleaner for SiO2 white oxide for concreters is my source of ti02. It will be interesting to test some metal oxides with SiO2 for some other projects https://youtu.be/Ip-jDuM25FE (https://youtu.be/Ip-jDuM25FE)
https://www.amazon.com/Loudwolf-Titanium-Dioxide-Powder-Ounces/dp/B00I581UEE ?? (https://www.amazon.com/Loudwolf-Titanium-Dioxide-Powder-Ounces/dp/B00I581UEE)A Breath of fresh air !!
plenty to experiment with here [and many "will" be [myself included
thxChet K
PSanother open source experimenter who plays with "Oxides" and may have some thoughts
Fausto here '[member Plengo
https://overunity.com/15035/crystal-cell-research-for-experimenter/msg540088/#new (https://overunity.com/15035/crystal-cell-research-for-experimenter/msg540088/#new)
To date, no one has presented a convinsing replication of the WFC. I don't want to repeat any names as not to offend.
My current search is for a method to apply an SiO2 layer to the tube. Even if I knew, how thick would the layer be?
Meyer stated in his patent the gap in his test cells were 0.625 inch. That is 1.68 mm. I know of commercial 1 mm thick sintered glass filter tubes.
Alternatively,
There is a solution that is called "water glass" which is applied to surfaces for sealing but we want a porous finish
then, I though I can mix some TiO2 with "water glass" before applying it and guess what,
TiO2 under certain condition becomes luminous!
My work will be totally open source. I don't want any money or fame. The only reason I am here is to bounce my ideas around.
Thank you
Aren’t both ideas valid. I think we should be pursuing both
Okay the thread is now yours so feel free to lead everyone away from the science I posted as I will sleep well at knight knowing I did what I promised so many years ago when I finally got at the science behind the patents.
Take care everyone,
8)
Aren’t both ideas valid. I think we should be pursuing both
I did not come here to challenge you. I am aware of all the hard work you have put in to researching Meyer's work.Still you have not demonstrated a convincing replication. This is your thread and I leave now.
Okay the thread is now yours so feel free to lead everyone away from the science I posted as I will sleep well at knight knowing I did what I promised so many years ago when I finally got at the science behind the patents.
Take care everyone,
8)
I did not come here to challenge you. I am aware of all the hard work you have put in to researching Meyer's work.Still you have not demonstrated a convincing replication. This is your thread and I leave now.
I have that video backed up. "Edward Mitchell and Gunther Rattay Interview #3 with John Frazer". I never saw #1 and # 2 published.
There is a video interview of me talking about this technology when I went to the 2013 Global Breakthrough Energy Movement conference held in Boulder, Colorado herd of it, seen it? If so what is the name of the person giving me the interview?
I have that video backed up. "Edward Mitchell and Gunther Rattay Interview #3 with John Frazer". I never saw #1 and # 2 published.
Thank you Edward for imparting more information.
This the thread is "Stanley Meyer Explained" So, I am here to find out the explanation!After so many pages it was time to get a bit of explanation.
I am not surprised they throw spanner in your wheels. I was following your thread years back on
the ??? forum that shut down. Unfortunately that happened before you spill the beans!
This video on above cloud extreme electrical discharge to the ionosphere I thought may have context here. https://youtu.be/H8HpKIUdki8 (https://youtu.be/H8HpKIUdki8)
And in the simplest construction, for example, like this one, will it be possible to get gas in excess of the Faraday law? (over current) If everything is done correctly.At least twice.So that you can fix, measure?
I have not succeeded yet.
Well, good people told me how to prevent some mistakes.I do not need 3000%, at least twice the current output is more than Faraday.That there was an incentive for further success.
In my humble view it is better to know where you are going instead of just picking a direction and going for it when trying to get someplace.
Getting at the core science behind the technology was my way of doing just that as now I know what is to be done and most importantly why it is being done in this manor. Without the core science behind the technology I had no hope of getting the technology up and running as it was more or less like trying to guess up a solution.
Excuse me if not. It’s just that you really need to get something.
But if that doesn't convince you then just put an analog amp meter in line with the power supplyI agree. This is obvious without an ammeter. But we want a miracle, right? :)
I also have a question why many people advise adding soda to the water, or worse, caustic soda.This negates the idea of high-voltage resonant decomposition of water.High voltage simply cannot exist in such a conductive medium.
If this is the current passed through the cell, then the area is the number of kulons passed in one or the other direction. :)
No, this is garbage, and since your gofundme efforts are dead in the water, I guess this is the right thing to call you out in order to keep the facts straight. There is a much better experimenter out there than you, his name is Valyon. Now I am not sure what his level of progress,
but it seems he is farther than you.
Unlike you, he sees value in the paper of Stephen meyers, wich is great, as it is an unexplored avenue.
You dont know more than anybody on this subject, I can go get a stranger down the street, give him my circuit, and he will have progressed farther than you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bw4ADWjDt60&t=726s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bw4ADWjDt60&t=726s)
Once we try the stephen stup, we can call it a day, and say we explored all Meyer avenues, and confirm that: The meyers were nothing but scamming trash.
If this is the current passed through the cell, then the area is the number of kulons passed in one or the other direction. :)
Unfortunately, I just can’t experiment with a cell and a circuit. I have to spend time repairing equipment to make a living .not enough time. :'(
Another tormented thought. Why do I see all cells are two-dimensional? Be it a cylinder in a cylinder or flat plates.If we have a water molecule is a three-dimensional tetrahedron, then can arrange three electrodes in the form of a three-dimensional grid?
And make full use of your three phases.
You will only do it poorly and feel discoueraged.I'm used to being disappointed.The same cell experimented with such a circuit. It didn’t work.
there is the sites, for what its worth ::)
open-source-energy.org
overunityresearch.com
RWGRESEARCH.com
Yeah pretty much right, many people mistakes HV bubbles with frequency for regular banal electrolysis.
How do distinguish? BIG PRODUCTION. On the electrodes or near the electrodes, if the production is BIG, then its special electrolysis.
Lets say big production = 2x Faraday efficiency.
Well, take radiolysis or photolysis.
There, decomposition products are formed in the entire cell volume, and not on the electrodes.
And this is understandable. If Meyer's technology breaks the covalent bonds of non-ionized water molecules by his resonance,HHO should be generated in its whole volume. and not on the electrode.
I wonder if anyone thought about this?
look up the stephen meyers paper, gas is generated across the whole bath.
read it!
Smoky2, I have seen such banal things before from the people at ionizationx
Its boring.
Have you considered what frequency Meyers was operating at?I do not know how really was. Open sources say that it is several orders of magnitude less than any resonant activity of a water molecule.
What does your microwave do? ??? ?
look up the stephen meyers paper, gas is generated across the whole bath.And that changes the matter.
How many of you have built a Meyers cell to experiment with?Honestly, if exactly according to the documentation, not a single one.
And if Meyer makes low-frequency pauses mechanically, by rotating one electrode?If you are serious about this technology, you need to do the work yourself. Many well meaning people will unknowingly mislead you. For start do a search "meyer wfc 2.456 Ghz". I think this is just a product of imagination
This is highlighted in yellow.
I came up with this myself! :) ;)
And the pistol shrimp is just sitting under his rock laughing...We need to stop repeating things we have heard somewhere else. Come to think of it have you ever seen a pistol shrimp?I know a lot about water but unless I can actually physically demonstrate something in person I stay silent. Still, that is my way.Now which facet of water do you want to know about? I am happy to share all I know for free! I will be conducting some serious experiments in the coming year.
If you think it is imagination, then you should spend a few years
studying water then come back to the table.
This thread was garbage untill I started posting on it.no
The pictures posted here dont even belong to H2Opower,
But to this guy
https://www.youtube.com/user/valyonpz/videos (https://www.youtube.com/user/valyonpz/videos)
He has been taking you for a ride.
H2Opower, its wrong to just post pictures as if it was yours.
no
I heard that in yours country give a startup to everyone.
No problem with that. Especially in california. :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lO06Zxhu88 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lO06Zxhu88)
So for me I must pull myself up by my own bootstraps which as impossible as it sounds I am learning how to do right now.
H2Opower
For most people including myself this was always the case and there is no free lunch.
The mistake most people make is assuming other people care about anything outside of what serves there own interests. People like to talk about things which give them that warm and fuzzy feeling however reality is very different. So it's best not to buy into the false premise that someone is just going to hold our hand and help us out without getting something of greater value in return.
If someone is all gung ho to help us then they probably want something were unaware of... red flag.
My newest theory is totally self-serving and I decided I'm going to give away FE technology and what I know. Brilliant isn't it?, if everyone is going to try to steal it and ruin our life anyways why not just give it all away and save ourselves some grief?. Why ruin our life on a losing proposition and being controlled by others when we could just do the right thing and feel good about to empowering ourselves.
If you don't like the rules of the game then change the game...
Regards
AC
This is the sad reality of being a Negro in America as the only true way my people can live a better life is for us to pick up and leave this country as that's the only way we're going to get it.Nevertheless in Russia, the majority like to be slaves. This is a very comfortable state for them.
But nothing works for me, nothing works. >:( :(
And "magic" frequencies don't help.
Water only absorbs high frequency energy.
At the same time, it heats up. :)
Edward, even though I respect you for what you've accomplished and your knowledge in the subject, it's sad to read such racial sentiment from you. I'd like to tell you that your problems aren't because you're black, but with today's political environment and anti white rhetoric becoming the norm... well let's face it, if you're white and you don't call other whites racist or white supremacists, you become persona non grata. Instead, I'd just like to say that I hope you learn to accept responsibility for your own failures, even though it may seem easier, or even correct, to blame someone else (e.g. they didn't give me a loan because they were white, etc.). After all, in research we understand that failure breeds success, changing an approach changes the output, so why not also use that philosophy in our daily lives. No matter the pigment of our skin, we can still be successful if we try.
We all have life stories, and though I doubt you’d care to hear mine, I can assure you that mine has been much more negatively affected by black people than yours has by whites. Reality isn’t black and white, and I won’t blame other black folks for the actions of individual men. Just like I won’t bear the responsibility for the actions of the Spanish Conquistadors, the tribal leaders that sold Africans to slave traders, the plantation owners, etc. etc. Nor will I accept blame for whoever threw bricks at you, the police that scared you, etc. We’re responsible for our own actions.
Best of luck in your endeavors, hope you can have a change of heart because that type of hatred is like a cancer that only brings self ruin.
I also noticed that you don't have a differential probeI have it. But in any case, and I can make it myself.
I have it. But in any case, and I can make it myself.
h20power
No disrespect to you, bud, but I have a hard time believing that you don't see the impossibility of selling such tech to the masses. I feel like your real goal is to pick up were Stan left off and actually accept the offer of Billions that Stan claims to have refused. Who could blame you? After all, it's a tough world! But I wouldn't count on things being the same for you as with Stan with regards to any billion dollar offers. These days, why pay out billions and leave a loose end when things can be taken care of by any old crack head for a $20 rock?
Just food for thought.
A death threat? What part of "No disrespect to you, bud," did you not understand?
I'm simply telling you how I see things from MY perspective! The world is RULED by people who sell energy to us. Do you really think that they would allow anyone to upset their gravy train? What you do is your business! If you think that you can buck the system, then more power to you!
I read your post quit clearly and if you think your, "No disrespect to you, bud," comment makes things all fine and dandy I say to you, "Dis some bull-shit!." Your post comes from a defeatist perspective where you have already given up the fight for your children's future. Or if you have no children given up the fight for the children of others. There is always a risk when doing something and one must weigh which one will leave them worse off and I say to sit back and do nothing as the planet's ability to support life is threatened is the worse case possibility.
With this I think that I am in the wrong place as very clearly no one here seems to know my worth.
[snip}
Here is a quote I'd like all of you to read and ponder upon:[quoteI just love the meaning to this! [/color][/size]
A father said to his daughter “You have graduated with honors, here is a car I bought many years ago. It is pretty old now. But before I give it to you, take it to the used car lot downtown and tell them I want to sell it and see how much they offer you for it.”
The daughter went to the used car lot, returned to her father and said, “They offered me $1,000 because the said it looks pretty worn out.”
The father said, now “Take it to the pawn shop.” The daughter went to the pawn shop, returned to her father and said,”The pawn shop offered only $100 because it is an old car.”
The father asked his daughter to go to a car club now and show them the car. The daughter then took the car to the club, returned and told her father,” Some people in the club offered $100,000 for it because it’s a Nissan Skyline R34, it's an iconic car and sought by many collectors”
Now the father said this to his daughter, “The right place values you the right way,” If you are not valued, do not be angry, it means you are in the wrong place. Those who know your value are those who appreciate you......Never stay in a place where no one sees your value. [/color][/size]=AZWIjxL5mf1v1gVc7acgIELmKo_SW-hPhi5mxD6OzTvdWYk_s7N6NaZyVJPMbTLdofMUhjtN5VgP_XPGhMEdmCB0HR4O3ITy0IIhtsusXs2m4R6VtGaDY_67enXj7TPE7Q_8Z-5Ma0fa_nPxm19te322N0oFLY2y3WKc7XjN5ulD7rEJCgmTe3M7tigq2IyHJx8&__tn__=*NK-y-R]#knowyourworth (https://www.facebook.com/hashtag/knowyourworth?__eep__=6&__cft__[0)[/color][/size]]
With this I think that I am in the wrong place as very clearly no one here seems to know my worth.
Edward Mitchell
CEO and Owner
True Green Solutions
h20power
Let me ask you something,
Are you familiar with patent law? If you are, then you know that you can't use Stan Meyer's tech with out legal authority. You can't use Stan's tech to solicit donations and you can't build and sell Stan's tech without legal authority. Do you have legal authority to build and sell Stan's tech? If not then no matter what you say about defeatist rhetoric, etc, you will not only NOT be able to sell tech based on Stan's patents, but if you have used Stan's tech to solicit donations then you have also put yourself in legal peril with the law. You can make up whatever nonsensical interpretations that you want about anything I've said to you or anyone else, but guess what bud, YOUR interpretations mean squat in a court of law! All you have done is make claims that you know how to make Stan's tech work, those are just words and mean nothing to no one! So you've been able to get some voltage to the WFC. BIG DEAL! Do what Stan did and then MAYBE someone will take you seriously. Until then, you should stop barking up trees looking for any way you can to get something for free! ALL my opinion, which I'm entitled to under the UNITED STATES Constitution!
P.S. I'm all for bucking the system. But I'm not for doing it in a way that will cause me harm legal or otherwise. All I've done in my posts is try to get you to see the big picture with regard to this tech to HELP you, NOT deter you! But if you choose to read my comments otherwise, then be my guest! But by all means, please keep pursuing this tech. If you should happen to find a way around Stan's patent's, then all the better. But please be aware of the law, not as a deterrent to your pursuit, but as motivation to do it the right way!
Can you, with this technology, create a high potential difference in another electrically conductive liquid, not water?
And yet, gases should be released in the entire volume of water, and not on the electrode itself.
Is not it ?
Ed
It will take courage ...you seem to have in abundance !
Perhaps we can change more for our children than just our energy issues...
Thx
Chet
To me you simply don't exist in my world a pure nobody that has attempted to get me to stop what it is I am planning and failed.
Each car owner is allowed to modificate his internal combustion engine to hydrogen/fuel-mix combustion !
My understanding of this technology will allow me to go in many directions Meyer was never allowed to go in due to his untimely death back in March of 1998.I have long been tormented by doubts, is this so? Have any of you seen him dead?
The fact is that I don't even need water decomposition and gas evolution HHO yet.
Just i want to look with at least one eye at some resonances in the water.
So that it does not heat up, converting all the RF power into heat.
So that it behaves like a capacitor. ???
https://overunity.com/7030/stanley-meyer-explained/ (https://overunity.com/7030/stanley-meyer-explained/) 2009
Nowhere something written about the technology performance ! The costs ! The minimum maintenance skills from the later owner !
compared :
2021 " water fuel cell " offer by many promotors ,here car installation specific:
https://www.google.com/search?q=water+fuel+cell+car+conversion+kit&rlz=1C1AVFC_enPT930PT930&oq=water+fuel+cell&aqs=chrome.3.69i59j0i19l5j0i19i22i30l4.9905j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 (https://www.google.com/search?q=water+fuel+cell+car+conversion+kit&rlz=1C1AVFC_enPT930PT930&oq=water+fuel+cell&aqs=chrome.3.69i59j0i19l5j0i19i22i30l4.9905j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8)
"saltwater burns"- myth John Kanzius technologySo it is possible not to work in this direction? Because I'm making a powerful generator now at 31 MHz.
And what energy from sourse electricity does the dissociation of an oxygen molecule into atoms (free radicals) require in a glowing electric discharge?
What I'd like to know is just where all the power to continually ionise oxygen is coming from in the first place?
Success is measured by the determination to make it work, and successful we shall be!
Let me in if you want me to post photos my my WFC solution that was different than Meyer's solution, okay?What does this mean?
I understood. Thank you. :)
Be that as it may, I have not yet managed to have more gas output than by Michael Faraday.
In WFC was always a analog ammeter in the circuit. For control of the constant current component.
How many coulombs of electricity were passed through the cell, so much gas was obtained.
And it was never possible to get more than a few tens of volts per cell. :(
Although I know, in radio engineering, even copper can be the perfect insulator.
This is when, for example, in long lines there are quarter-wave short-circuiting bridges ...
I don’t know how to say it exactly in English, but I hope you will understand me.
But with these cell sizes, frequncy it should be many gigahertz ...
didn't know that thunderstorms will produce large amounts of hydrogen and oxygen gases when the conditions are right for them to do so.It's true ?It's true ?
As for the frequencies this technology operates at it's around 5-12 kHz depending on the size of the resonant cavities and the inductance of the inductors used.I don’t understand anyway.
I don’t understand anyway.
The distance between the electrodes in the cell is millimeters.
The wavelength at 12 kHz is 25 kilometers. 300000000/f.
Just note that these WFC capacitors are in fact variable capacitors which is why there must be a resonance PLL system to lock on to and maintain resonance. As more and more gases are generated those gases displace the dielectric between the plates of the capacitor and it's capacitance goes down. This changes the resonant frequency which is why a PLL is needed in the circuit and it too must be fast enough to keep up with the changes in frequency as the voltages are raised/lowered.Okay, I agree with that. :)
Take a look ...The temperature is far from 100 degrees. Some kind of gas is released.
Raises the piston. The frequency is about 31.6 MHz. There is an antenna matching device that allows the generator to match any load. :) This thing is part of a VHF radio station.
p.s.
Today it occurred to me that if you try to dissociate into atoms in your resonant cell, not water, but, for example, alcohol or acetone.The binding energy of hydrogen there is much less than in water with oxygen. it will be easier to break.
In order for me to evaluate this I'd need to know at what temperate and pressureThe pressure is atmospheric. Temperature cannot be measured with an electronic thermometer, RF interference.I will find a suitable glass thermometer, I will inform you.
what mechanism does a water molecule disintegrate in you?What did you want to get? Wanted to get hydrogen from a high-frequency field? Then it is necessary, like Kanzius, to use a strong field. "Flame Discharge"
What did you want to get?I wanted like Edward's ... Or better. ;) joke. :)
Can you measure a 0.3% increase in gas yield?No.
For quick monitoring of hydrogen production, I recommend using a hydrogen sensor like this Arduino small module on base MQ-8 or better, :Thanks.
For low electricity input and high hydrogen/oxygen splitting we can use chemical strong active elements likeI have paint "serebryanka" (silver) (aluminum powder.) :)
aluminium,but now in nano-grains = high surface area per gram !
Aluminum nanopowder is not a catalyst as it reacts chemically with water?
Aluminum is consumed to produce hydrogen like conventional fuel.
What did you want to get? Wanted to get hydrogen from a high-frequency field? Then it is necessary, like Kanzius, to use a strong field. "Flame Discharge"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyZuel2iaBk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyZuel2iaBk)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quXa90HojfM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quXa90HojfM)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AQmaAEyTic (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AQmaAEyTic)
If the terminal is wetted with salt water:
- place the electrode in water, or
- put a cotton swab moistened with salt water on the terminal, the length and brightness of the discharge flame greatly increases Water ionizes and decomposes, but at such temperatures it burns again.
The increase, if there is, is small.
In general, how much gas addition did you want to get with conventional electrolysis?
0.3% can add a high-frequency field to the required energy consumption for conventional electrolysis.
Can you measure a 0.3% increase in gas yield?
It is likely that in electrolysis with a very low DC voltage, at which there will be a very small gas yield. It is desirable to create a vacuum for better separation of oxygen and hydrogen. But I suppose that with this method, the percentage of the increase will also be small.
For quick monitoring of hydrogen production, I recommend using a hydrogen sensor like this Arduino small module on base MQ-8 or better, :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9zi7mYDTIQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9zi7mYDTIQ)
This Arduino sensor module works without Arduino.
An ordinary voltmeter and a 5 volt power supply from a mobile phone charge are enough.
The sensor is of course cheap and not very accurate.
We need to find another way, how to turn 0.3% into 300%
Thank you. But so no one answered by what mechanism the water molecule divides?
Most likely, the proton will be separated from oxygen together with its electron.
Because there is no electrode similar to conventional electrolysis.
That would discharge the ion ...
And I will give you many ideas for free. :)
Today it occured to me. But look what I came up with.
If are your kilohertz by Mayer
do directly in water by the beating frequency method.
mixing higher frequencies. ;)
As for the frequencies this technology operates at it's around 5-12 kHz depending on the size of the resonant cavities and the inductance of the inductors used.the sound wave would probably have comparable cell sizes and frequencies.
kolbacict : beginning with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_bonding_of_waterWe know a little. True, we forgot a lot. It was a long time ago. I have a diploma in chemistry. :)
+ agent ? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrocatalyst
Pressure,temperature,.....
Since you've went away from Meyer's research I hate to be the one to tell you this but this thread of mines simply is no longer for you.I just don't have a choice. I have no vacuum resin and no money either. :D
a space gap of just 0.8128 mm and in the one shown just 0.254 mm.Well, I later came up with a cell with an adjustable distance between parallel stainless steel electrodes. Made from a disposable syringe. The distance can be reduced until it touches.
Without using any semiconductor or lamp diode.It is not necessary to have a diode as electronic part for AC rectification. Under certain conditions, the contacts of the cell are capable of of self- rectifying:
It is not necessary to have a diode as electronic part for AC rectification. Under certain conditions, the contacts of the cell are capable of of self- rectifying:
- cell contacts are made of different metals or metals with different oxide film thicknesses. Some metal oxides, not just aluminum, are capable of rectifying alternating current.
- even two electrodes with different surface areas conduct alternating current to the electrolyte differently, e.g. needle and rectangle, fine wire and tube
https://simplifier.neocities.org/rectifier.html (https://simplifier.neocities.org/rectifier.html)
http://no3m.net/2016/02/electrolytic-rectifiers/ (http://no3m.net/2016/02/electrolytic-rectifiers/)
Well, I later came up with a cell with an adjustable distance between parallel stainless steel electrodes. Made from a disposable syringe. The distance can be reduced until it touches.
Did not help. Only boiled water there. :)
But I want to say, although according to Meyer, the gas output has not turned out so far, only according to Faraday, I came up with many interesting things. 8) ;)
For example, would you got an electrolysis product (according to Faraday,yet) :( using only alternating current of low and high frequency? Removable directly from the secondary winding of the transformer.
Without using any semiconductor or lamp diode. And I have achieved this.
I don't know who this Sergh person isAs far as I understand, you are located territorially, in the same place as me.
This video explains why I use Schottky diodes:Yes, but I don’t know high voltage Schottky diodes ...
As far as I understand, you are located territorially, in the same place as me.
He, in general, is not a stupid person, and about his remarks above, rectifying alternating current on an aluminum electrode, I agree.Yes, but I don’t know high voltage Schottky diodes ...
But I figured out where the beggar can get a high-voltage fast diode with a large pulse current. :)
You just need to take a magnetron from a microwave oven and remove the ring magnets from it.
high voltage Schottky diodesbut if I read Stanley Meyer's original patent US5149407, Page 19 (6), Line 10:
but if I read Stanley Meyer's original patent US5149407, Page 19 (6), Line 10:
https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/d0/de/ef/9a5c1da561dabd/US5149407.pdf (https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/d0/de/ef/9a5c1da561dabd/US5149407.pdf)
Stanley Meyer patents this type of diode :
1N1198
"Power Rectifier for general purpose power supply application" 600 V 18 A
https://datasheetspdf.com/pdf-file/532202/AdvancedSemiconductor/1N1198/1 (https://datasheetspdf.com/pdf-file/532202/AdvancedSemiconductor/1N1198/1)
This is ordinary old rectifier diode.
At a potential difference of, for example, U = 2 V and a molecular thickness of d = 0.4 nm, the electric field strength is E = 5000 kV/mm To compare this figure with values from other capacitor types requires an estimation for electrolytic capacitors (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolytic_capacitors), the capacitors with the thinnest dielectric among conventional capacitors. The voltage proof of aluminum oxide (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminum_oxide), the dielectric layer of aluminum electrolytic capacitors, is approximately 1.4 nm/V. For a 6.3 V capacitor therefore the layer is 8.8 nm. The electric field is 6.3 V/8.8 nm = 716 kV/mm, around 7 times lower than in the double-layer. The field strength (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_strength) of some 5000 kV/mm is unrealizable in conventional capacitors. No conventional dielectric material could prevent charge carrier breakthrough. In a double-layer capacitor the chemical stability of the solvent's molecular bonds prevents breakthrough.[3] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-layer_capacitance#cite_note-3)
Hi Edward,
The fact that your coils make a ringing sound has direct bearing on one of my non-Meyer projects (Star Trek phaser). Normally, I try to repay information with information, but you're so advanced in your field, compared to me, that there's nothing I might say to help you. So I sent a hundred to your go fund me account. Thanks again.
I wish everyone else would try to help a little too. Everyone of us is going to benefit once you get everything sorted out, and have the equipment you need to get the cost down.
And at frequencies of tens of megahertz, we can use generally non-contact electrodes. For example, covered with glass or ceramics. :)You can find industrially produced devices that work on a similar principle.
I am tormented with my tank radio station.
In fact, there are two independent paths for the upper and lower frequency ranges.
But so far unsuccessful, they do not want to work at the same time.
Trying to run them at the same time. In order to have a difference frequency in a cell.
After all, we can create directly in the cell, any difference frequency of two generators.
You want five kilohertz, you want twelve ...
And if the phases of the two high-frequency oscillations are synchronized, this will not lead to heating of the water, will it?
And at frequencies of tens of megahertz, we can use generally non-contact electrodes. For example, covered with glass or ceramics. :)
https://dokumen.tips/documents/a-high-frequency-titration-apparatus.htmlWell, again, those who were before me stole my best ideas ... :)
Well, again, those who were before me stole my best ideas ... :)
So I guess my answers to your questions was of no use to you,I did not say that.
Folks need to understand that you can't do this your own way, you can't run around making up the rules as you go along,What can I do, right now I can’t have anything but my own brains. The person who promised me to talk to our bourgeois did not do it today. There is no one to count on, no one to rely on in this country.