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Author Topic: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters  (Read 49085 times)

Room3327

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #45 on: March 25, 2009, 07:29:49 PM »
Hi All,
    I can now report that I have a smoothly rotating N-S magnetic field across the diameter of my field winding.  It works very well, to prove it I balanced a steel rod on a pin set in the center and it spins it right up, at lower frequency's, up to about 400Hz (magnetic field does not respond well enough to grab on to the rod much past that).  Guess I just reinvented the electric motor.  But it is fun to play with, I had to destroy my original converter coil in order to get at and reconnect the field windings.  So I have been playing with just the field winding and it's core and I have been discovering some very interesting things. I have a new converter design in mind already that I am going to start building.  It will incorporate some things from other peoples ideas at this forum and should be able to spin to over a million RPM.  The highest I have run this one is 156,000 RPM but the mag field is not good, the steel does not respond well as I knew it wouldn't.  That is 2.6 KHz being fed in, much too high for the steel. My new one will not have this problem. Stay tuned this adventure is not over yet.

pix

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #46 on: March 26, 2009, 09:27:57 AM »
Hi Room 327,
I am guessing how about your driving coils.In high frequency apliations long coils doesn't work good because of high reluctancy- it is like inertia and mass-more weight more inertia,you will not move heavy truck with even a big force when it is applied too short period of time,as a pulse let's say.I think that driving coils should be more flat if you want to have high frequency rotation- but it is my only personal opinion.
Also, using soft steel core for high frequncy- my thinking is that maybe core should be biased to saturation first with constant magnetic field-then you apply pulses by driving coils, at high frequency soft steel woudn't respond magnetically.Soft steel has a frequency limitation.
It is good that You have time to do a real experimentation.I wish You success.
Regards,
pix

Room3327

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #47 on: March 26, 2009, 06:24:07 PM »
@Pix,
     Your just the man I wanted to talk to.  I took a look at a copper loop for the core to see how it worked, like you asked me to test.  I wound 8 turns and laid it on top of the rotating field core and got basically nothing.  I then wound a output coil right around the field core and took a look at it.  Again basically nothing except transformer action about a volt as I expected.  So between these two coils I had basically nothing and then it struck me, maybe the core loops needed a bias on them so I tried connecting the output winding in series with the loop winding, again not much.  Then I thought maybe it needs a DC bias in the loop so I put a diode in series with the two coils hooked in series, Bingo, It started giving me more voltage out.  I changed the diode to a bridge rectifier connecting the output coil to the loop winding and this little partial test setup was outputting way more voltage then I could account for.  Increasing the rotation speed I found the voltage increasing with the speed increase!  At 156,000 RPM I had 30 volts output, it appeared to be doubling for every 1500 Hz increase in frequency, this is amazing and it was on the steel core which does not respond to that frequency well. The output looked just like SM's description, DC with in this case 2.6 KHz hash on it. I do believe we may be on to something.
   My next converter will have copper loop windings for the core, I am going to use two, one at the top and one at the bottom, and bring the ends out so I can experiment with it.  Another article I was reading said a magnetic field would follow right down a copper wire and another one stated that electrons would follow the magnetic field spiralling around it.  I think this is happening in this device and I think the rotating field squeezes the electrons around the loop core like squeezing water out of a hose. And just to top this off it has a slight vibration and a very slight gyroscopic feel to it.  I think this is closer then we have ever been.

pix

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #48 on: March 26, 2009, 07:50:49 PM »
Bingo my friend!
I have never believed that SM device is complicated.
Many people on this forum tried fo solve TPU by very sophispicated ways and theories.
Most beautiful are simple solutions.
 I was always thinking of the "squeezing electrons out of the wire" like squeezing water out of the garden hose.
Today transformers have laminated steel plates, nobody is using insulated steel or other wires as a core. Also in normal transformer nothing would happen since magnetic field is OSCILLATING in both directions.
I was wondering-what would happen in  the core - IF we will use insulated wires AND when we ROTATE magnetic field in one direction ALONG core made with wires !
A DC magnetic bias would be solution for high frequency ( many rpm), to go over magnetic saturation point of core loops- otherwise driving coils pulse would be lost trying to magnetize core loops material.
For driving coils at high frequency I would use flat coils with low reluctance.
For core loops use diode or bridge rectifier- to give electrons only one way chance to move :-).
If You use copper wire for the core loop, maybe a good idea would be to insert inside something ferromagnetic, for example between copper loops biased soft stel core or ferromagnetic- to give  closed loop path for magnetic field.
Wish You a sucess,keep working on this way- squeezing by high rpm rotating magneic field - core windings.Nobody on this forum did try this way.
Best regards,
pix



gyulasun

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #49 on: March 26, 2009, 10:26:35 PM »
Hi Room3327,

Perhaps it is too early yet but have you thought of loading your output voltage with a few kiloOhm of resistor or maybe  with a heavier one like a lamp bulb to see how your full setup behaves for a load? 

Thanks for the interesting findings and keep up good work. Maybe the modified schematics would help others too.

rgds,  Gyula

@Pix,
     Your just the man I wanted to talk to.  I took a look at a copper loop for the core to see how it worked, like you asked me to test.  I wound 8 turns and laid it on top of the rotating field core and got basically nothing.  I then wound a output coil right around the field core and took a look at it.  Again basically nothing except transformer action about a volt as I expected.  So between these two coils I had basically nothing and then it struck me, maybe the core loops needed a bias on them so I tried connecting the output winding in series with the loop winding, again not much.  Then I thought maybe it needs a DC bias in the loop so I put a diode in series with the two coils hooked in series, Bingo, It started giving me more voltage out.  I changed the diode to a bridge rectifier connecting the output coil to the loop winding and this little partial test setup was outputting way more voltage then I could account for.  Increasing the rotation speed I found the voltage increasing with the speed increase!  At 156,000 RPM I had 30 volts output, it appeared to be doubling for every 1500 Hz increase in frequency, this is amazing and it was on the steel core which does not respond to that frequency well. The output looked just like SM's description, DC with in this case 2.6 KHz hash on it. I do believe we may be on to something.
   My next converter will have copper loop windings for the core, I am going to use two, one at the top and one at the bottom, and bring the ends out so I can experiment with it.  Another article I was reading said a magnetic field would follow right down a copper wire and another one stated that electrons would follow the magnetic field spiralling around it.  I think this is happening in this device and I think the rotating field squeezes the electrons around the loop core like squeezing water out of a hose. And just to top this off it has a slight vibration and a very slight gyroscopic feel to it.  I think this is closer then we have ever been.

robbie47

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #50 on: March 26, 2009, 11:32:01 PM »
@room,

I re-read the patent and noticed that Tesla mentioned that preferably the core wire is isolated, like you mentioned earlier in reply to me, due to Eddy currents. That is why of course transformers have thin isolated plates as a core.
If I am correct you mentioned that the soft iron wire you used for core is not isolated. So would't it be better to isolate you iron core wires, instead of using copper wire as a core?
It's not easy to isolate though....

Room3327

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #51 on: March 26, 2009, 11:51:35 PM »
@Gyula,
  Yes I tried to load the output, Shorted with my ammeter I get a little over 100 ma.  The voltage decreases very rapidly with load and almost acts like a static charge? It will light a led across the output but I can guarantee that it is not overunity at this point. I have much more power going in then I have coming out.

@robbie47,
    I understand all that, I think what your missing here is I want a core that I can run at a much higher frequency then I can with steel.  Finding, making, or trying to buy a ferrite core of the size and dimensions needed here is virtually impossible.  So as others here have suggested making it out of 'insulated' copper wire may be the best way to go.  I think the copper will respond to much higher frequencies and as stated before magnetic fields will follow copper. I also have the possibility of utilizing this core 'winding' as I have been talking about.

gotoluc

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #52 on: March 28, 2009, 02:39:06 AM »
trying to buy a ferrite core of the size and dimensions needed here is virtually impossible.

Hi Room3327,

great work you are doing ;)... thanks for sharing

Here is a large 280mm Ferrite ring: http://cgi.ebay.com/LARGE-FERRITE-RING-280mm-EXTERNAL-CIRCUMFERENCE_W0QQitemZ190204642807QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_ConsumerElectronics_SpecialistRadioEquipment_SM?hash=item190204642807&_trksid=p3286.m63.l1177

280 millimeters = 11.023622 inches

Hope this can help.

Luc

Room3327

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #53 on: March 29, 2009, 12:55:37 AM »
@gotoluc,
     HOLY GOD!  Is that a monster of ferrites, I had no idea they were made this large.  I wonder what it was built for? Thank you for the information.  I very well may end up puchasing one of these. ;D

Room3327

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #54 on: March 30, 2009, 11:20:18 PM »
@All,
    Here is the clean schematic for the 2 Phase drive circuit, with I believe all changes I've made so far.  There is nothing on the output connections as that is not firmed up yet, that will be an entire circuit by itself.  I should probably mention that I have tried series and parallel resonant modes with the field and it works very nicely in either mode.  Parallel resonant mode minimizes current all the way down to 50 ma. at the freq. (1KHz) I tried it,  but input voltage was also reduced.  Series resonance worked really well boosting my input voltage to 60 Vpp across each phase and input current of 300 ma. this mode is where I had 30 volts output.  Don't forget this has a 10 to 1 transformer ratio so there is no way this voltage should have developed.  It has to be created by the rotating field.  Anyway it is TAX time so I may be a little absent around here for awhile.  For some of you if the dot method of denoting winding starts throws you off I am sorry, I don't have time to draw pictures for you, just know that all of my windings were wound in the same direction.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2009, 12:12:50 AM by Room3327 »

Room3327

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #55 on: March 31, 2009, 03:17:15 AM »
Hi All,
  I should have shown it like this to begin with, I think it will be less confusing for some and easier to understand.

gotoluc

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #56 on: March 31, 2009, 04:41:48 AM »
Hi Room3327,

thank you for all the work you have put into this and mostly for sharing it.

It show you care and want to help your fellow man.

I have one question if you have time to answer it.

I noticed each Series field coil section is 180 degrees from each other and not 90 degrees. Could you explain why this is since it doesn't look like a clock rotating order ??? 

Sorry for this question but I'm still learning ;)

Thanks for sharing

Luc

Room3327

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #57 on: March 31, 2009, 05:21:39 AM »
@gotoluc,
    That's a good question Luc, the reason is, if you look at the magnetic fields set up by connecting the coils this way it sets up a North and South super pole on opposite sides of the ring.  The 2 phase drive then rotates these 2 super poles around the ring in one direction, which can be reversed if so desired. The poles are set up at the junction point of T4 and T1 by the first quarter of the phase one signal and the last quarter of the phase 2 signal. As the AC cycle progresses the field shifts to the next junction as phase 2 starts going high and phase one starts down. In the positive half cycle the poles rotate half way around the ring and through the negative half cycle complete the trip all the way around.   Going around the ring the poles look like this starting at T4-T1 junction -- NN -- SN -- SS -- NS --, do you see the pattern two N's together on one side and 2 S's together on the opposite side. It's like two half circle magnets with N and N together and S and S together and then spun around.  If this doesn't answer your question I will draw some pictures for you, that may be the easiest way to see it. 

Sorry, in answer your 90^ and 180^ question, Phase 1 drives 0^, Phase 2 drives 90^ and so on, is that what you meant.

gotoluc

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #58 on: March 31, 2009, 05:35:12 AM »
@gotoluc,
    That's a good question Luc, the reason is, if you look at the magnetic fields set up by connecting the coils this way it sets up a North and South super pole on opposite sides of the ring.  The 2 phase drive then rotates these 2 super poles around the ring in one direction, which can be reversed if so desired. The poles are set up at the junction point of T4 and T1 by the first quarter of the phase one signal and the last quarter of the phase 2 signal. As the AC cycle progresses the field shifts to the next junction as phase 2 starts going high and phase one starts down. In the positive half cycle the poles rotate half way around the ring and through the negative half cycle complete the trip all the way around.   Going around the ring the poles look like this starting at T4-T1 junction -- NN -- SN -- SS -- NS --, do you see the pattern two N's together on one side and 2 S's together on the opposite side. It's like two half circle magnets with N and N together and S and S together and then spun around.  If this doesn't answer your question I will draw some pictures for you, that may be the easiest way to see it. 

Thanks for the great explanation ;)

No pictures needed since that is what I thought could be happening. I guess I needed a confirmation and explanation.

I'm considering making a rotating resonating toroid so your topic has been of interest to me.

Thanks once again for your help and time.

Luc


Room3327

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Re: Tesla Patent 382282, and all related to his transformers/converters
« Reply #59 on: April 09, 2009, 06:19:43 PM »
@All,

         For the last week every time I come to this site someone has been hacking into my computer!!!  I have had to pull the plug on it 3 times in the last 4 days in order to regain control of my computer.  This is unacceptable, I am out of here till something is done about this!  Good day and goodbye.

Room3327