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Author Topic: My Steorn prediction  (Read 21257 times)

Offline canam101

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #15 on: June 22, 2009, 06:48:45 PM »
I admire Steorn and Sean McCarthy. Despite the verdict of the jury, Sean has stated that they will launch this year.

Amazing. The guy is either a conman with the gall of a Mark Goldes, or he has the goods, and damn well knows that fire2 will spread throughout the world this year. It's just that he didn't quite get things together in time for the jury to see what he had.

Even if he is a conman, you have to sort of admire such gall.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #15 on: June 22, 2009, 06:48:45 PM »

Offline Bobbotov

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2009, 06:56:00 PM »
It's just that he didn't quite get things together in time for the jury to see what he had.


The jury was an open ended process so saying that Steorn was a day late and a dollar short is absurd. Especially since day one they said the technology was "always proven to work." Besides, if they knew they didn't have their act together then why spend $85K on the Economist ad to acquire the finest scientists they could only to have the jury spend two years cooling their heels waiting for the goods to be delivered and being compensated by Steorn during that process for incidental expenses? Also, if they did not have the tech ready until after the jury disbanded then why did they attempt the splashy Kinetica fiasco?

None of this makes any sense in terms of reality.

Offline canam101

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #17 on: June 22, 2009, 07:12:23 PM »
The jury was an open ended process so saying that Steorn was a day late and a dollar short is absurd. Especially since day one they said the technology was "always proven to work."
They meant that the readings on the test equipment always showed the anomaly.

Quote

Besides, if they knew they didn't have their act together then why spend $85K on the Economist ad to acquire the finest scientists they could only to have the jury spend two years cooling their heels waiting for the goods to be delivered and being compensated by Steorn during that process for incidental expenses?
Obviously because they believed that they would be able to race ahead and turn the anomaly into a working device, and provide the jury with the plans for it in good time.

Quote
Also, if they did not have the tech ready until after the jury disbanded then why did they attempt the splashy Kinetica fiasco?
Because they did have the tech ready, sort of. They were able to make a very fragile device that the Steorn Effect could turn - that is as far as they were able to get - and the thing was so fragile that the bearings melted. They made a sincere effort, but were unlucky/careless.

Quote

None of this makes any sense in terms of reality.

It makes perfect sense to me: Steorn found some laboratory curiosity of an anomaly and thought they could see the way to quickly turn it into a useful device. The jury was a publicity scheme of some kind to give credence to their gizmo when they finally built it, but all they could come up with were ambiguous test results to give to the jury.

The jury finally had enough of looking at numbers, and after many requests to Steorn for a gizmo to play with, or the plans for one, they said 'we quit'.

Since then, Steorn has almost come up with a gizmo that isn't as fragile as a spider web, but it won't be ready for a few more months they figure; so they are saying 'toward the end of this year' for the launch to give themselves plenty of time.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #17 on: June 22, 2009, 07:12:23 PM »
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Offline Bobbotov

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #18 on: June 22, 2009, 07:31:19 PM »
They meant that the readings on the test equipment always showed the anomaly.
Obviously because they believed that they would be able to race ahead and turn the anomaly into a working device, and provide the jury with the plans for it in good time.
Because they did have the tech ready, sort of. They were able to make a very fragile device that the Steorn Effect could turn - that is as far as they were able to get - and the thing was so fragile that the bearings melted. They made a sincere effort, but were unlucky/careless.

It makes perfect sense to me: Steorn found some laboratory curiosity of an anomaly and thought they could see the way to quickly turn it into a useful device. The jury was a publicity scheme of some kind to give credence to their gizmo when they finally built it, but all they could come up with were ambiguous test results to give to the jury.

The jury finally had enough of looking at numbers, and after many requests to Steorn for a gizmo to play with, or the plans for one, they said 'we quit'.

Since then, Steorn has almost come up with a gizmo that isn't as fragile as a spider web, but it won't be ready for a few more months they figure; so they are saying 'toward the end of this year' for the launch to give themselves plenty of time.

They have had over six years playing with this thing and have made numerous public statements and over the top fait accompli claims and you are saying that they will have something in a few months? Is this a hunch?

Even before the jury they had shown this to various universities, they have had several incarnations of developers clubs who attested to the fact that no real substantive info was ever provided and now they have the "300 club" who are currently being kept busy with physics 101 lessons.

They made great importance of the jury as the verdict was to be the basis for Validation Day that would kick off commercial operations. Now the jury has spoken, the bastards, and they are going ahead with commercialization anyway? I think you were right originally about them having the brass balls of Mark Goldes who was an infrequent poster on the Steorn site giving them all kinds of kudos. Takes one to know one, right?

I think after following this for three years it is BS. The jury confirms this and the fact that Steorn do not have their ducks in a row, jumped the gun or are just plain opportunists does not speak well of their organization. Plus their past history is one failed business venture after another. The only thing they have excelled at is marketing and getting investor money. Delivering the goods is just not their thing.

Offline canam101

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #19 on: June 22, 2009, 10:21:22 PM »
I was thinking that it might be some kind of reality tv show, as Frank Grimer suggested at the start.

Maybe a 6-parter on RTE or the BBC. At least the documentary crew fits in with that.

What doesn't fit in is who got interviewed? Jury members? Members of the forum? There is nothing I have heard about forum members being interviewed; and they would have mentioned it surely. And without interviewing the patsies, it wouldn't be interesting.

Then there is the question of what Steorn is really up to if not trying to invent an Orbo. They could have a legitimate business, with the tv show as a sideline: something that can be put together over 3 or 4 years, when they have time from their real business.

But what *is* their real business? And wouldn't there be some public documentation of it? If they are all chartered accountants, surely there would be records available to show that.

Hard to know what is going on. If Orbo isn't spinning by the end of the year, I may be disappointed.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #19 on: June 22, 2009, 10:21:22 PM »
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Offline lumen

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #20 on: June 23, 2009, 06:20:34 AM »
Maybe you could build you own Orbo!
How about the ktoy plan?

Offline wizardofmars

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #21 on: June 25, 2009, 10:02:03 AM »
Amazing. The guy is either a conman with the gall of a Mark Goldes...

There is no 'either' about it. Did you read the 2007 report by Dr Mike, the American physicist/engineer who Steorn agreed to meet with for the London demo? He stated flat out that Sean was delusional, and he has been proven right. All that Steorn has left is the 'true believers' and in that sense they are like a cult, with no rational belief system outside blind faith.

It's no surprise to me. There are thousands of delusional con artists out there - Mylow, Archer and Sterling come to mind as three that have been exposed in the last year here at OU. Most of them just don't get Steorn's level of publicity.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #21 on: June 25, 2009, 10:02:03 AM »
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Offline canam101

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #22 on: June 25, 2009, 01:39:24 PM »
Mike also said that Sean thought he could see the orbo spinning when it was not spinning - that is what he meant by 'delusional'.

Mike is just an armchair psychologist spouting rubbish. I don't believe for a second that an entire firm of people, or even the top 3 or 4, would continue to believe they had something when there was nothing.

I don't mean there is necessarily anything useful, but they must have some anomaly that they are trying to exploit.

And since they haven't been able to exploit it - scale it up - in six years, they probably never will, and may just be coasting and keeping the paychecks coming in.

And it is probably easy to coast with a fairly clear conscience if you keep seeing some blip of apparently extra energy.

Offline also antlike

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #23 on: June 25, 2009, 03:26:39 PM »
Mike also said that Sean thought he could see the orbo spinning when it was not spinning - that is what he meant by 'delusional'.

Mike is just an armchair psychologist spouting rubbish. I don't believe for a second that an entire firm of people, or even the top 3 or 4, would continue to believe they had something when there was nothing.

I don't mean there is necessarily anything useful, but they must have some anomaly that they are trying to exploit.

And since they haven't been able to exploit it - scale it up - in six years, they probably never will, and may just be coasting and keeping the paychecks coming in.

And it is probably easy to coast with a fairly clear conscience if you keep seeing some blip of apparently extra energy.

You don't believe that 3 or 4 (paid) people could believe something when there is nothing?  Really?  What about the 2 billion Christians in the world and 1.5 billion Muslims?

Look, there was no anomaly.  There was nothing that modern science could not explain, and the jury basically said as much.  No energy gain.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #23 on: June 25, 2009, 03:26:39 PM »
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Offline Bobbotov

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #24 on: June 25, 2009, 07:05:38 PM »

I don't mean there is necessarily anything useful, but they must have some anomaly that they are trying to exploit.


The anomaly was finding a dozen Rubes that would put up $15M. As it turns out that was easier (and more lucrative) to do than producing OU.

Offline lumen

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #25 on: June 25, 2009, 11:05:07 PM »
Well, if nothing else, we should all find out by years end when they release the restricted learning modules. I believe they already started releasing these at three a week, to the chosen 300, and will continue through August.
 

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #25 on: June 25, 2009, 11:05:07 PM »
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Offline stprue

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #26 on: June 26, 2009, 07:13:05 PM »
I spent so many times going over the math time after time. It is so clear cut. It's too bad that Tom Schum persistently asked me to study his diode array, when I was just ~ two months away from building my first "free energy" machine based on my magnetic theory!  :'(

PL

I f you are so sure you can build it then why haven't you? Cost? Buying thousands of diodes aren't cheap either.

Build it now!

Offline canam101

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #27 on: July 01, 2009, 10:58:28 PM »
My guess is that steorn has found an anomaly they can't explain, but that they can't scale up.

They hired the jury and gave them data from their tests. The jury looked at the data and said 'this anomaly could be due to lots of non-OU things, but we need more data to decide exactly what it is due to'.

Steorn gave them more data, but that did not eliminate the non-OU possibilities.

After several cycles of this, both Steorn and the jury had had enough and the jury quit.

Steorn now makes a MarkGoldes-type announcement:

Quote
during 2009 the company had resolved the key technical problems related to the implementation of Orbo and is now focused on commercial launch towards the end of this year

They're focused on it all right. My prediction is that the company will fold by the end of the year.

Offline Bobbotov

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #28 on: July 04, 2009, 03:58:06 PM »


They're focused on it all right. My prediction is that the company will fold by the end of the year.

I understand where you are coming from but many of these free energy companies go on for years without really having anything. For something that you would think is so clear cut (free energy) the truth is these companies are very murky in their operations. They make many promises and are always holding the carrot out to keep the interest going but like the fate of Tantalus, you can never really get a good bite out of it. They do however excel at getting funding to keep them going and in the final analysis that may be what they are all about. Few technologies that actually see the light of day have so many opposing forces: scammers, frauds, MiBs, delusion, etc. It makes the whole field of endeavor suspect.

If Steorn never delivers anything they will just be another company that exploits free energy to acquire things for themselves. It is human nature unfortunately to exploit bad situations; in this case the world's energy crisis. You see it after major disasters, pandemics, wars, etc. There will always be those who have few scruples and cash in on people's anxiety, misery and desire to hope.

This is not to say that there aren't those who truly and earnestly work to achieve what has been perceived as impossible but their efforts are clouded by so many that have less than altruistic aims. Essentially it becomes the definition of throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

Then there is the resistance of classical science. Trying to get respect for working in this area is an uphill battle and Steorn took advantage of that with its jury approach. Now it is being said that the jury did not do due diligence because of their propensity in securing Conservation of Energy. I am not so sure about that but the perception of science being the deal killer is prevalent.

In any case it will be interesting to see how this plays out in the long run. With Steorn's commitment to go commercial by years' end they have painted themselves into a corner if such does not come to pass. I have followed the story since the Economist ad and it has been a very bizarre journey full of secrecy, prevarication, failed deliverable, broken promises, change in direction, etc. Steorn as a company since the dot com days has changed its focus many times and who knows if this is not just another area that they exploit and then abandon to move onto something else.

We'll see said the blind man.

Offline solinear

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Re: My Steorn prediction
« Reply #29 on: July 04, 2009, 05:54:09 PM »
I think that they did find an anomaly, but it's one that could probably be explained with physics and won't scale up beyond a very small scale and probably isn't over unity.  The fact that they can't scale it up tells me that there is something suspect about their design.  Kinda like those pendulum/vibrating bar over unity designs - they're based on something that can't scale up beyond the small scale (25-50 watts).  Those may be over unity, but they're useless without a gravity well and can't scale up very well.

If they can keep getting money, then they won't fold.  It's not uncommon for someone to keep chasing after that golden ticket.  It's the reason people go to Las Vegas,  play the lottery and those sorts of things.  I don't think that they're purely fraudulent, I just don't think that they've found anything that can be used in a large scale design, even if it is over unity. 

There's one simple reality: It either scales or it doesn't and theirs looks like it doesn't.  It shouldn't take them three years to scale up from the <1 watt level to >1kw scale.  Heck, it shouldn't take them more than six months.

 

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