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Author Topic: 100% energy saver in the market  (Read 39005 times)

Offline hansvonlieven

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #45 on: January 07, 2009, 09:01:54 AM »
G'day Fritz,

The system was originally not really designed to cheat power companies of funds, though it did that. The primary purpose was to dodge power rationing and avoid stiff fines for overuse. Remember this stuff surfaced in 1945.

Hans von Lieven

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #45 on: January 07, 2009, 09:01:54 AM »

Offline Pirate88179

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #46 on: January 07, 2009, 09:11:03 AM »
@ Hans:

Great historical info....thanks.

Bill

Offline pese

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #47 on: January 07, 2009, 09:29:19 AM »
Creativity,
Group,

I made some power measurements of things on around the house using my killawatt meter:
were supposed to be 120v @ 60hz

Blower on forced air, outside Wood burning stove/furnace.
123V, 2.35A, 153W, 290VA, 0.53PF
This Dual monitor computer, UPS, router, wireless radio and another computer CPU unit.
122.6V, 2.82A, 238W, 325VA, 0.69PF
Microwave Oven 1,1kw on hi cup of water inside.
119.8V, 11.77A, 1255W, 1400VA, 0.89PF
Christmas tree lights. incandescent lamps.
120V, 2.02A, 244W, 245VA, PF 1.0
Humidifier (portable)
122.4V, 0.16A, 11W, 19VA, 0.58PF
Large LCD TV, Satellite receiver dvr, DVD/VHS unit, alarm clock, Barn bug radio, all on UPS.
120.7, 2.17A, 243W, 263VA, 0.92PF
Phillips 13W CFL.
122.6V, 0.21A, 16W, 26VA, 0.62PF
CRT TV, volume set to max.
122.2V, 0.81A, 71W, 94VA, 0.73PF
Upright Freezer.
123.2V, 1.17A, 118W, 145VA, 0.81PF
Box window fan.
122.4V, 0.76A, 90W, 93VA, 0.95PF
All Tube oscilloscope.
122.2V, 2.62A, 300W, 320VA, 0.93PF

Most of the big things are wired in directly with no plug.
My wife wasn't doing laundry so i cant get data from those two machines.

DrSpark






That is exactly what i have written to you,
now , take fluorrescent tube lamp-  ) not electronic.
the old-one ,driven with an choke (copper at iron core).
possible the 230volt tubes (europe) make more
lesses than yours (US) on 120volts line.
BECAUSE the difference or the rearly working voltage
on an such lamp ist approx.  only 95 volt.
the rest to the line voltage make high differences to the counter.
!

See that rearly ohmic load have phase differences 1 = zero.
Such loads  connected over  the power saver, aswell loads
with different PV will only dampimg the power daver.
Each inductive load must be separatly connected to his
own (opimized) saver to become the optimum avaiable PV=1

Now see that that lamps make (if uncompensated -without cap-)
make you wonder

Pese


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #47 on: January 07, 2009, 09:29:19 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline sushimoto

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« Reply #48 on: January 17, 2009, 02:49:41 PM »
.... interesting side-effect of all of this FE-research.

Is it illegal to recycle?
how many of the PAYED electricity are you giving back to the grid FOR FREE?

the best ideas are flashing while i am in my bathroom. (because nobody disturbs me *gg*)
My water-bill is just about m3. so the pressure is free or already payed?
why not putting a tesla turbine or such into the water-system do drive a generator while any tap is used?

I know, my first post should look different,
but unfortunately reality is biting while researching on FE.

best,
sushimoto

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #49 on: January 13, 2010, 12:28:40 AM »
Boondee.net has a new resonance power supply:

http://www.boondeeworkshop.com/resonant.html


But to compensate all the power factors under 1
to 1 as some devices do is a very good thing also for the power
companies and should be done to save money for your electic bills !

I was shocked to hear that CFL bulbs only have a power factor
of less than 0.6 and thus don´t save money at all but just
waste lots of energy this way !

So it will be a very good way to sell power saving corrector boxes
that can be easily connected to your grid lines and will
save you real money.
As these boxes mostly contain just a few big caps
and some switching circuits, these should not be too expensive
and maybe we can develop something over here
in open source and make kits available.

I am planning to program into this domain an auction plugin or
shoping cart , so users can sell their hardware over here.

Regards, Stefan.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #49 on: January 13, 2010, 12:28:40 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline gadgetmall

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #50 on: January 13, 2010, 12:43:39 AM »
I use the power saver 1200 and Dad got one as well . My light bill before was average 250-325 in the summer  it went down to no bill over 65 dollars all summer long !  same so far in the winter although i suspect my bill to be a bit higher as  it is colder than normal for us here .
dad has 4 freezers 2 refrigerators and and a ceiling fan in every room plus a water pump and ever bulb in the house is CFL now ,his bill decreased 45 %  . It works and it works well . they are 299 free shipping . you have to put it on its own 220 breaker  here in the US to cover the entire house . The Power saver 1200 works . It saves on anything Inductive including CFL , Motors and transformers  . Pure resistive heat ,NO  but one using a transformer yes .

Albert

Offline Cap-Z-ro

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #51 on: January 13, 2010, 01:39:02 AM »
From what I read a while back, those spiral CFL's emit harmful radiation...and are more costly to run than regular bulbs.

It was discussed here a couple of times...can't recall a thread though...shouldn't be hard to locate the info on the net I would think.

Regards...

« Last Edit: January 13, 2010, 11:58:03 AM by Cap-Z-ro »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #51 on: January 13, 2010, 01:39:02 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline hartiberlin

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #52 on: January 13, 2010, 06:48:13 AM »
Yes, CFLs are bad for your eyes and health.
They hurt your eyes and emit dangerous radiation and
now as we know the power factor is bad in them they don´t save any electricity !

Better skip them and go directly to the new
warm white light (~3500 Kelvin temperature) power LEDs.
They emit much better eye friendly light.
More compareable with the warm halogen light.

So don´t buy any CFLs or fluorescent tubes anymore cause they
also contain bad mercury gas, which is bad for the environment
and go directly to these new great PowerLEDs.

Offline Mark69

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #53 on: January 13, 2010, 03:51:00 PM »
@gadgetmall,

Are you running a/c in the summer as well?  That is a huge savings, down to 65!

Mark

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #53 on: January 13, 2010, 03:51:00 PM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline ramset

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #54 on: January 13, 2010, 04:07:15 PM »
Albert
quote:
Pure resistive heat ,NO  but one using a transformer yes
------------------------------------
Transformer heater??

I'm all ears [If its cheaper than Oil heat]
BTW
Love your contributions
Chet
PS
Stephan do you have a source/link for this""PowerLEDs""

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #55 on: March 11, 2010, 02:55:49 PM »
A great new Power Saver is the one here at the border or footer ad.
This also gives you 300 US$ tax credit and it costs only 199 US$,
so you save double !

It works by reestablishing the power factor back to 1
when inductive loads
reduce your power factor to less than 1 on the AC system.

Just click the banner to get one.

Many thanks.

Regards, Stefan.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #55 on: March 11, 2010, 02:55:49 PM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline allcanadian

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #56 on: March 11, 2010, 07:07:30 PM »
@All
I find this thread simply amazing, LOL, here we have four pages of posts and nobody is wiling to state "what" power factor correction is nor "what" it does. We also have the critics who continually state their opinions as fact about things they obviously do not understand. Power Factor (PF) correction is not stealing nor tricking anyone nor anything it is simply a means to correct a power phase imbalance. Maybe we should start at the beginning--- and not the end of this process:).

A power company has AC (alternating current)generators and these generators move an electric current back and forth (a push then pull) in the conductors -- the current alternates! In a power plant we are continually correcting the voltage and current to match the customer load, we are also correcting the phase or power factor as different types of loads come on line -- Inductive, resistive and capacitive loads.

We can use a simple analogy here, if we have a mass bouncing up and down on a spring then the mass having inertia is like an inductance, the spring is resilient like capacitance and the air resistance is like electrical resistance. Now imagine this mass on a spring is bouncing up and down at 60Hz(cycles per second), if the spring and mass values are correct then a small external force (the generator) on the spring will keep the mass bouncing at 60Hz which is its natural frequency of oscillation. In this instance the generating force only needs to overcome the air resistance of the moving mass, if there is more air resistance then the generating force must increase to keep the mass oscillating at 60Hz. Now what if we added more mass (inductance)to the same spring value? Well the natural frequency of the system would be lowered and we would have to push and pull the spring harder and faster to maintain a frequency of 60Hz. This is what inductance does in the power line, it acts like a mass having inertia which wants to keep moving in one direction so we must reverse the applied force earlier (frequency)and we must push and pull harder because we are working against the inertia or inductance of the load -- not with it. Now instead of doing all this "extra" work to maintain our frequency of 60Hz why don't we just change the "stiffness" of the spring(capacitance) to compensate for the change in mass (inductance) in our system? If more mass is added why not just make the spring stiffer so the natural frequency is maintained at 60Hz without extra work? This is what the "magical" process of power factor correction is all about, they switch a capacitor into the circuit at the right times to compensate for changes in inductance exactly like we would change our spring stiffness to compensate for changes in mass. Now does this sound like something is being stolen? -- does it sound like we are trying to trick someone? No, this is just common sense and we are simply providing a means to increase efficiency. You see when we add an inductive load the system is now out of balance and by adding capacitance at the correct time we are simply restoring balance, it is no more complicated than that. Let's go back to our spring and mass for a second, did you notice that if we have to apply a force harder and faster to correct the system then we have done more measurable work at the source but this work does not show up at the mass load? Where or where has our work gone? It has gone into our spring of course which is moving faster and farther than it needs to generating losses due to friction, we could consider all this extra motion not required in a balanced system as heat losses.
Power Factor correction simply limits current flow due to induction with a capacitor which stores the energy as electrical energy in the capacitor. When the current reverses or alternates this energy in the capacitor now acts in series with the source to increase voltage thus current, it corrects the "time" at which current and voltage reach peak values limiting current flow so your electric meter runs slower --- because you are drawing "less current" not because you are stealing something.
Regards
AC

Offline Goat

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #57 on: March 11, 2010, 07:49:33 PM »
Hi AC

I've been looking at these devices for a long time as I used to work in a factory where the electrician had installed one to correct the PF used on the motors...he had explained to me how it worked and everything but it's been over 30 years so I forgot a lot of the info...so thanks for the info you just posted....

However...there seems to be a lot of articles stating that these are a scam because home power is not billed the same as factories or businesses which use huge amounts of electricity....here's a link to one such article I was reading earlier...

http://gadgets.boingboing.net/2009/02/22/power-factor-correct.html

and

http://powerelectronics.com/power_management/motor_power_management/power-factor-correction-0507/

I wonder if you could take a look at the replies at the bottom of these articles, I'd be curious to see what you make of it all...it seems like the power companies don't charge consumers the same way so it seems like a waste of money according to some...here's one comment....

"Utilities bill on KWH which is real power used multiplied by time. Power factor correction can reduce amperage if you have a power factor less than 1, but it will not reduce the real power or the KWH, which is what you are billed for."

Anyways, just wondering if it's all on the level...

Thanks,
Paul

Offline allcanadian

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #58 on: March 12, 2010, 07:32:27 AM »
@Goat
Quote
I wonder if you could take a look at the replies at the bottom of these articles, I'd be curious to see what you make of it all...it seems like the power companies don't charge consumers the same way so it seems like a waste of money according to some...here's one comment....

"Utilities bill on KWH which is real power used multiplied by time. Power factor
correction can reduce amperage if you have a power factor less than 1, but it will not reduce the real power or the KWH, which is what you are billed for."

That article and the comments were interesting but have you ever got the feeling most everyone is just repeating what they have read from a textbook as all the answers sound the same? The problem is that many times people substitute real understanding of a process with memorized terms and equations, that is they can repeat what they have read but they have not taken the time to really understand what is happening nor prove the matter for themselves. I would agree with the comment above however reactive power does produce heat losses in the load which is real power we are billed for. Therefore power factor correction which reduces the reactive power in circulation does matter as it effects efficiency. I am sure we can all understand how much real power is consumed by even a small heating element, so why turn all our conductors and inductors into space heaters?
Regards
AC

Offline forest

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Re: 100% energy saver in the market
« Reply #59 on: March 12, 2010, 10:01:13 AM »
Allcanadian,

please help, I'm starting to understand what we need to know and what is important. Real understanding from the beginning to the end of current flow and magnetic flux flow.
Can you describe how LC oscillator is working , where is electric current flow ,where magnetic and IN WHICH PART of oscillation cycle ? I mean , there is for example starting 1/4 of the resonant wave - where is the electric energy now,where is current, where is magnetic field flux .
I realize clearly that LC electric circuit is like a pendulum so it has to contain kinetic and potential energy.I HAVE TO understand it !

 

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