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Author Topic: Conventional physics does state it's possible!  (Read 14153 times)

Offline PaulLowrance

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Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« on: December 24, 2008, 07:40:46 PM »
The mathematics of conventional physics does show that a "free energy" machine that captures ambient thermal energy (that exists in *all* matter) is possible. Conventional physicists say it's impossible because of the laws of thermodynamics. Although, conventional physics acknowledges that the laws of thermodynamics has an associated error rate for common simple elements such as gas, and is by no means meant for a microscopic scale analysis. For details please see -->
http://greenselfreliantenergy.com/physics/

Other areas of conventional physics clearly shows that it is possible to capture ambient thermal energy. For example the best small signal semiconductor mathematics clearly shows that diodes must rectify Johnson noise. One cubic meter of copper contains over 1 billion joules of energy from the free electrons in such copper. Johnson noise is sufficient, and it's continually sustained by the Sun, solar energy.  :D

So to be accurate, we cannot say that conventional physics says it's impossible to capture ambient thermal energy. It's merely an interpretation, and an interpretation that ignores small signal semiconductor physics while accepting the laws of thermodynamics which is not meant for microscopic effects such as the thermal energy of free electrons.



PL

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Offline TechStuf

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #1 on: December 24, 2008, 08:07:44 PM »
Perpetual motion is everywhere.  As the late Howard Johnson once said:


"I don't know how the electrons got started spinning, and I don't know how to stop them, do you?"


Man's 'laws' of physics are a frail and feeble ivory tower of babel.


One with a foundation of iron mixed with clay.



TS

Offline madddann

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #2 on: December 24, 2008, 08:11:47 PM »
@PaulLowrance

Hi, i'll just quote your post from the cavitation thread, hope it's ok...

"Does anyone have any theories why nearly 100% of the "free energy" community avoids discussing methods of capturing ambient thermal energy like the plague, but wants to pursue unknown exotic energies that are unproven?"

- Well maybe 'cause there seems to be a greater potential - at least this is what people see. If you want to share some info about how to enhance the capturing of ambient thermal energy at low cost, so that it could power a house, i'm all ears.

"An ambient thermal energy mover would not create nor destroy energy, but would create an energy loop where energy would flow from the device to the appliance to the environment (air & earth, etc.), and then back to the device."

- Actually that's exactly my point - once you know how things behave, such a "perpetual" loop can be created. Using high voltage electricity is probably only one of many ways to do it.

"Conventional physics is riddled with limitations. The concept of "equilibrium" is based on the fictitious concept that a closed system can be in perfect 100.0000...% equilibrium. In the *real* world, equilibrium is an *impossible* state that would require *infinite* thermal insulation in a closed system. When the mathematics works with and replies on *impossible* states such as equilibrium you end up with fictitious mathematics."

- For what i know, the universe is the sistem, we just have to adapt our needs to it and know how to do it - how to attach ourselves to the wheel of nature...

"There is over 1 billion joules of Johnson noise per cubic meter of matter, which is sustained by solar energy."

- So how much of this energy could we extract in base of your theory and today's tech?
I'm just very courious...

Merry Christmas to all!


Dann


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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #2 on: December 24, 2008, 08:11:47 PM »
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Offline sparks

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #3 on: December 24, 2008, 08:58:21 PM »
  emwave energy ouput from the sun 58percent infrared wavelengths.  Earth's surface and atmosphere full of water.  Water absorbs infrared like there is no tomorrow.  Coincidence I don't think so.  Visible light spectrum from sun converts to infrared reflection.  Coincidence I don't think so.  Average temperature of ground.  50'f again in the infrared radiation spectrum.    We may see the light bouncing around but the infrared is here to stay.

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #4 on: December 24, 2008, 09:38:32 PM »
Quote
"There is over 1 billion joules of Johnson noise per cubic meter of matter, which is sustained by solar energy."

- So how much of this energy could we extract in base of your theory and today's tech?
I'm just very courious...

Merry Christmas to all!


Dann
I don't see any limitations in the math, so as far as I know it's all available energy. Thermal energy is continuously flowing in all matter. The diode array proves that it is possible to use thermal energy to direct itself that is more meaningful to us, humans. An ambient thermal energy device would merely direct that energy into something useful. So unless the output application is something such as a radiating antenna directed toward outer space, the energy stays here on Earth, no contribution to global warming, completely clean and reusable energy.

MCE (Magnetocaloric effect) is the starting point to understanding how magnetic materials can capture ambient thermal energy. When the applied magnetic field is removed, then it is ambient thermal energy that *forces* the magnetically aligned atoms into a slightly more state of disorder. That requires energy, which is why *all* magnetic material cools down when the applied field is removed. This effect is used for deep chillers. The problem is, when the field is applied, the opposite happens, the material heats up. So the goal is to make the cycle unbalanced such that it requires more work for thermal energy to demagnetize the material. I have found such a design. I have found such a design. Such a design completely relies on magnetic viscosity, which is in agreement with what Steorn says. I have used FEMM, a magnetic numerical analysis software, to clearly see that my design would work.

PL

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #4 on: December 24, 2008, 09:38:32 PM »
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Offline TechStuf

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #5 on: December 24, 2008, 10:05:05 PM »

So, that's what Steorn was trying to demonstrate with that tiny 'paddle' wheel on jeweled bearings?  Basically what you've already demonstrated via solid state?


TS

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #6 on: December 24, 2008, 10:22:45 PM »
I don't know if Steorn's released their design or not, so all I can say is that their claim to magnetic viscosity being the secret is a match to my magnetic theory.  Magnetic viscosity is only used as the tool. It's the tool to allow the device to change the *effective* magnetic structure before the magnetic material has the time to respond.

PL

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #6 on: December 24, 2008, 10:22:45 PM »
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Offline spinner

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #7 on: December 25, 2008, 10:20:45 AM »
The mathematics of conventional physics does show that a "free energy" machine that captures ambient thermal energy (that exists in *all* matter) is possible. Conventional physicists say it's impossible because of the laws of thermodynamics. Although, conventional physics acknowledges that the laws of thermodynamics has an associated error rate for common simple elements such as gas, and is by no means meant for a microscopic scale analysis. For details please see -->
http://greenselfreliantenergy.com/physics/
Laws of Thermaldynamics are still the best tool we have when dealing with the "reality" like a heat transfers we currently know. Tapping a heat reservoir without the necessary heat difference (NO POTENTIAL between the source/drain) is the same as tinkering with the ZPE. Or tapping the intrinsic motion/energy in the atom... Science cannot definitely say it's impossible, although our currently valid thermodynamic "laws" are strict about it. NO GO. Needless to say, there is no devices which would show the opposite. But this can be changed instantly!
If you have a indisputably working concept (Oh, yes, you have) which UNDOUBTEDLY shows, e.g., a "Maxwellian daemon" in reality, than you are the winner!
 
Quote
Other areas of conventional physics clearly shows that it is possible to capture ambient thermal energy. For example the best small signal semiconductor mathematics clearly shows that diodes must rectify Johnson noise. One cubic meter of copper contains over 1 billion joules of energy from the free electrons in such copper. Johnson noise is sufficient, and it's continually sustained by the Sun, solar energy.  :D
Which areas of conventional physics shows that ambient energy can be "exploited" without some kind of potential difference? Johnson noise (we discussed it previously) happens in each and any el. conductor. Why don't you use e.g.,  an resistor array, which would yield to even greater effect? Ah, because of the diode rectification. So, what do you think about my proposal, to use a bipolar transistor arrays instead of diodes? (connect E+C, the base is the other electrode?) It was confirmed to give a lot more of thermal noise than a common diodes. If biased, of course...
1m3 of copper contains trillions and trilllions of Joules of Energy in an atomic scale... Too bad we don't know how to exploit it yet... A piece of copper (1m3) would cover all the energy needs of the humanity for quite a while.... You know, E=mc2...
Quote
So to be accurate, we cannot say that conventional physics says it's impossible to capture ambient thermal energy. It's merely an interpretation, and an interpretation that ignores small signal semiconductor physics while accepting the laws of thermodynamics which is not meant for microscopic effects such as the thermal energy of free electrons.
PL
Yep, for the moment it's "only an interpretation" (ok, it is still working quite well in the practice). For sure!

Paul, the idea about using a diodes for the rectification of a Johnson noise IS OLDER THAN YOU...

To validate it, one would need a definite proof ... Not just in the form of a "theory" or some milllivolts and microAmperes coming from the many diodes, array. The values can originate in many other electrical effects... (measuring error is the first which came to my mind.... no matter what you do to prevent it)

If you could present a believable theory, I'm sure you could get ANY(!!!) microelectronics company who could make the prototypes for you INSTANTLY! Dealing with a low tech type components, it should be very simple.... A few hours of engineers work with a suitable equipment....
Some member(s) did propose to you that you should contact Universities / their labs...

So?

Offline sparks

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #8 on: December 25, 2008, 01:33:38 PM »
         Something that appears as cold is not always without heat potential.  Pipe filled with ionized gas in a binding magnetic field would appear to have very little heat in it at all.  Alot of spin but not alot of vibration.  Heat would therefore spread into the field of the gas with little resistance as the gas temperature would appear very low.  The heat then converts to spin velocity of the ions and they go faster and faster but still appear quite cold to the ambient media.   Now move the spin field bulk to location 2.  Let the spin velocity of the ions convert to vibrational mode and temperature rises where we need the heat.  No thermodynamic laws broken at all.  Endothermic at point a exothermic at point b.
        Also consider an absorption refrigeration system like used in an RV.  The ammonia gas is heated and causes a low density area and allows the refrigerant to vaporize.  Then it flows by gravity to a heat exchanger where it releases the heat to wherever you need heat.  Heat producing cold. 
       And one last one. Ocean Thermal Energy Conversion.  Big one being tested in Hawaii.  You really don't need the cold water well they have in use because pressure of the vaporizing gas can drive a turbine to drive a compressor to use the air for a heat sink.  Basicallly you could do the same thing in the desert and bury a pipe where it stays 50degreeF with a surface temperature of 200degreesF or more if you want to put some black rocks out in the desert somewhere and a little aluminum.  Make it reversible so at night you get the same deal backwards.  Fuck pumping the oil and start pumping the heat!

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #8 on: December 25, 2008, 01:33:38 PM »
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Offline spinner

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #9 on: December 25, 2008, 02:40:07 PM »
Hi Sparks!
I always read your posts even though they're not always in accordance with "my beliefs"... Thanks for your positive & nice attitude!

You are really a great tinkerer, and by far one of the most patient ones. You never get yourself being dragged in a nonsence accusations and bashing. You must have an "iron" nerves! ;)


         Something that appears as cold is not always without heat potential.  Pipe filled with ionized gas in a binding magnetic field would appear to have very little heat in it at all.  Alot of spin but not alot of vibration.  Heat would therefore spread into the field of the gas with little resistance as the gas temperature would appear very low.  The heat then converts to spin velocity of the ions and they go faster and faster but still appear quite cold to the ambient media.   Now move the spin field bulk to location 2.  Let the spin velocity of the ions convert to vibrational mode and temperature rises where we need the heat.  No thermodynamic laws broken at all.  Endothermic at point a exothermic at point b.
        Also consider an absorption refrigeration system like used in an RV.  The ammonia gas is heated and causes a low density area and allows the refrigerant to vaporize.  Then it flows by gravity to a heat exchanger where it releases the heat to wherever you need heat.  Heat producing cold. 
       And one last one. Ocean Thermal Energy Conversion.  Big one being tested in Hawaii.  You really don't need the cold water well they have in use because pressure of the vaporizing gas can drive a turbine to drive a compressor to use the air for a heat sink.  Basicallly you could do the same thing in the desert and bury a pipe where it stays 50degreeF with a surface temperature of 200degreesF or more if you want to put some black rocks out in the desert somewhere and a little aluminum.  Make it reversible so at night you get the same deal backwards.  Fuck pumping the oil and start pumping the heat!

Yes, the Einstein's fridge is an interesting gizmo... You provide "heat" to "chill" the things... Although I'm not sure if gravity is involved in the process?

Yep, "Fuck pumping the oil and start pumping the heat"!
Hear, hear!
(My car would not be happy, but nevertheless...)

Cheers!

Offline Kator01

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #10 on: December 25, 2008, 07:57:41 PM »
Hi all,

I just wonder : Who and Why was tinu´s post removed ? I just saw it here 1 Hour ago.

He was indicating the Aspden-Work about theThermoelectrial-Effect based on the Nernst-Effect which give 20 times more voltage that a normal Peltier-Element.

Kator01



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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #10 on: December 25, 2008, 07:57:41 PM »
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Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #11 on: December 26, 2008, 05:02:16 PM »
Quote
If you could present a believable theory, I'm sure you could get ANY(!!!) microelectronics company who could make the prototypes for you INSTANTLY! Dealing with a low tech type components, it should be very simple.... A few hours of engineers work with a suitable equipment....
Some member(s) did propose to you that you should contact Universities / their labs...
If I showed enough $ to a chip fabrication company then perhaps they would listen.


BTW, interested people, and interesting people, I've presented and offered both the mathematics and the working model. For anyone who has questions ***please*** would you first read my forum blog notes on my diode research. Here's the "Answers" section -->
http://greenselfreliantenergy.com/forum/index.php?board=31.0

Also, when time permits I would like to add an appropriate GUI to my numerical analysis trapdoor simulation, and then release the source code written in MFC VC++, which clearly shows that ambient thermal energy can be captured by means of a passive trapdoor. In the trapdoor sim, more of the gaseous particles travel from the right to left chamber through the trapdoor, on average. The trapdoor is also made of particles. So the trapdoor bends and such. The sim includes basic blackbody radiation.

PL

Offline PaulLowrance

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2008, 05:25:19 PM »
Hi,

Quote
Maybe thermal energy in form of radiation?
You're right. Ambient thermal energy is a continuous exchange and conversion from electromagnetic radiation <--> mass kinetic energy. All matter exists is a sea of energy. Within the space between all matter, between all atoms, exists blackbody radiation. Blackbody radiation exists inside all solids, liquids, gas, and in outer space. It is a continuous changing sea of electromagnetic waves where particles continually exchange energy by means of such electromagnetic waves. Such electromagnetic waves are produced by the acceleration and deceleration of charged particles-- electrons and protons. As the charged particles vibrate around, they are giving off blackbody radiation, and it is such radiation that causes the particles to continually move and vibrate.

One square meter (3.28ft by 3.28ft) of surface at 297K (74.9F, 23.9F) radiates 441 watts. Both sides of that flat surface radiates 882 watts. The peak frequency of such blackbody radiation is 31THz (31e+12 Hz).

PL

Offline Rosemary Ainslie

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #13 on: September 23, 2010, 08:34:28 AM »
Hi Paul.

I think it's acknowledged that Thermodynamic Laws are very much open to revision.  There's a NEED for this since the discovery of dark energy.  And a RELUCTANCE to do this because it'll up end all known physics.  Effectively dark energy has been proved.  Not open to dispute.  And this force has NOT been incorporated into known physics.  The reluctance to get around this problem is because these 'dark' forces are not related to any tangible matter.  They either have to FIND a particle or they have to CONCEDE that this energy is based on a dark matter particle that behaves like a tachyon.  Tachyons are only 'theorised'.  They have never been found.  And they're proposed to EXCEED light speed.  So.  If they DON'T find that particle that generates this dark energy - then they'll have to concede that it's a tachyon.  And that brings them face to face with something that the entire theory of relativity requires - which is that NOTHING can exceed light speed.  Our mainstream scientists have got their backs to the wall. 

 ;D

Personally I think that the study of physics should only ever be based on the potential that 'anything' is possible. Unless we're advised differently in a one to one conversation with God Himself.   ;D  Right now our Classicists are rather emabarrassed.  Which is why the most of them are defending their position with such extraordinary posturings.  Is my take.   ;D

btw.  These 'dark energies' that are needed?  To balance the books, so to speak - they need to find a source of energy that is believed to account for something like 97% of all the matter in the universe.  Just think of it.  That's 97% more energy theoretically available than has EVER been found in the actual visible matter of the universe.  That's an awful lot of energy.  Makes me think that perhaps, finally, they're beginning to think in terms of aether energies.  LOL

Regards,
Rosemary

Edited.


Offline sparks

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Re: Conventional physics does state it's possible!
« Reply #14 on: September 24, 2010, 02:18:27 AM »
   Thomson inverse scattering says its possible.  It says more or less that there is a probablility that a photon can leave a piece of matter with a higher energy that when it came aboard.  One does not have to go with general relativity one only has to deal with classical quantom mechanics to realize where alot of energy is stored.  Every electron in a 1s orbital is equivalent to one milliamp.  This is a huge amount of energy when one considers the amount of electrons in one mole of atoms.  Been a long time since chem 1 but I rember Avogardros #is like 10to the 23.  So a mole of atoms has in its lowest electron orbitals 10 to the 20th amperes of current.  When we convert by ionization one mole of atoms into a plasma the plasma current can exceed billions of amperes.  The plasma as a whole will appear electrically neutral but with a current in the billions of amperes it will be sure to react with external magnetic fields.  The energy locked up in the electron orbitals can become macroscopic with macroscopic effects instead of thermal photon radiation and scattering.  Thomson inverse scattering is just the tip of the iceberg as far as the possibilities in conversion of electron potential energy into electron kinetic energy. 

 

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