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Author Topic: Newman press conference  (Read 27883 times)

Offline prometheus_effect

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #15 on: April 08, 2005, 05:39:34 AM »
Yes, I think it is overunity.

Hi Stefan,

Three questions:

1) How would you measure the OU?

2) Are you sure it is not some unknown battery chemistry that kicks in due to the high voltage, high frequency nature of the back emf of those RF bursts?

3) Have you or Newman tried starting the motor with a non polarized parallel cap bank connected across the batteries, then when the motor is running disconnect the battery bank and see if it still keeps running? If it keeps running you can then discount some unknown battery chemistry effect and few very would doubt it is OU even without "Closing the Loop"

Regards,
Prometheus Effect

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #15 on: April 08, 2005, 05:39:34 AM »

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #16 on: April 08, 2005, 03:32:43 PM »
Prometheus,
well, you can see it, if you compare the brightness of the bulbs, that are just only powered by the
output RF currents and not via the chopped DC input, versus others same bulbs, which are powered
by normal DC to compare for the wattage input.
You will see, that with a big Coil and the right sparking at the commutator you can create very big
RF currents, that power these light bulbs very brightly, which are in series with the coil  !
If you compare the input chopped DC power into the Newman motor at the same time,
you see, that it is less input power.
ALso you get the mechanical output in addition to the light output.

Okay, there is also a battery effect with it as the batteries seem to like
RF currents to be charged up or not to discharge so fast..
Seems to be a simular effect as the Bedini battery charging effect.

Regards, Stefan.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2005, 04:11:22 PM by hartiberlin »

Offline prometheus_effect

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #17 on: April 08, 2005, 03:58:54 PM »
Hi Stefan,

But the biggie is will the Newman motor will run from a non polarized cap bank or it is powered by a new chemical effect in the batteries. If it will not continue to run from the cap bank then there is no OU in as far as the input power is concerned. However there still may be OU but we need to do a simple and fool proof measurement of energy in verus energy out.

As I see it there are two questions to be answered:

1) Will the motor continue to run at a stready RPM when powered from a non polarized capacitor bank?

2) Does the motor put out more real work than input? Here I'm talking about running the output into a simple strip heater emersed into a container filled with water, then measuring the rate of temp increase. It's then real simple to measure the real energy output as against real energy input (which can be measured by any voltage variation on the cap bank). No light bulbs, amp / power meters or scopes needed.

A simple Newman motor OU test:

1) Charge the non polarized capacitor bank with sufficient energy to get the motor started and running for say 30 minutes.
2) Run the motor for 30 minutes while it delivers power into a strip heater emersed in a heavily insulated water container.
3) Disconnect the capacitor bank and output load.
4) Compare the initial capacitor bank voltage with that after 30 minutes and calculate energy loss / gain.
5) Compare inital water temp with that after 30 minutes and calculate the amount of energy transfered into the water.
6) Is the ouput energy greater or less than the input energy?

Newman would seem to be suggesting that the cap bank voltage will increase while delivering real power into a load. If so this is a sure fire simple test to finally prove what Newman is saying is real OU.

Hey Evan you listening?

Regards,
Prometheus_Effect.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #17 on: April 08, 2005, 03:58:54 PM »
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Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #18 on: April 08, 2005, 04:19:36 PM »
Hi Stefan,

But the biggie is will the Newman motor will run from a non polarized cap bank or it is powered by a new chemical effect in the batteries. If it will not continue to run from the cap bank then there is no OU in as far as the input power is concerned. However there still may be OU but we need to do a simple and fool proof measurement of energy in verus energy out.

As I see it there are two questions to be answered:

1) Will the motor continue to run at a stready RPM when powered from a non polarized capacitor bank?


Probably not, as the capbank can not store the RF currents as the batteries can.

Quote

2) Does the motor put out more real work than input? Here I'm talking about running the output into a simple strip heater emersed into a container filled with water, then measuring the rate of temp increase. It's then real simple to measure the real energy output as against real energy input (which can be measured by any voltage variation on the cap bank). No light bulbs, amp / power meters or scopes needed.

Well, the RF currents have been tested to heat a resistor in a water bath and this output was already higher than the
electrical input from the batteries.
This is documented in Newman?s book and was done years ago by a crew of a few engineers.

Quote

A simple Newman motor OU test:

1) Charge the non polarized capacitor bank with sufficient energy to get the motor started and running for say 30 minutes.
2) Run the motor for 30 minutes while it delivers power into a strip heater emersed in a heavily insulated water container.
3) Disconnect the capacitor bank and output load.
4) Compare the initial capacitor bank voltage with that after 30 minutes and calculate energy loss / gain.
5) Compare inital water temp with that after 30 minutes and calculate the amount of energy transfered into the water.
6) Is the ouput energy greater or less than the input energy?

As I said above, you get the mechanical energy output for free ADDITIONALLY !
The main OU output power is in the RF currents !

Quote
Newman would seem to be suggesting that the cap bank voltage will increase while delivering real power into a load. If so this is a sure fire simple test to finally prove what Newman is saying is real OU.

Hey Evan you listening?

Regards,
Prometheus_Effect.

If you create a circuit, that will efficiently transform theRF currents into usefull energy, then
it will be possible.
In this moment the only way to use the RF currents are incand. light bulbs in series with the coil
which light up due to the RF currents.

Regards, Stefan.

Offline prometheus_effect

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #19 on: April 08, 2005, 04:55:28 PM »
Hi Stefan,

As you know the back EMF and input energy demands of a Newman motor are highly non sinusordial. Thus very few instruments will tell you what is really happening. Have you or Newman ever done a spectral analysis of the RF? If so where / at what frequencies are the energy? On the small motor you built what is the peak back EMF?

If would not be hard to build a cap bank to supply and handle the back EMF. A few high voltage power factor correction caps with a few RF friendly one should do the job. You just need to know how many joules, at what peak voltage and at what frequencies the cap bank will need to accept the energy.

BTW, where did you get the info that batteries can store RF better than caps?

Regards,
Prometheus_Effect

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #19 on: April 08, 2005, 04:55:28 PM »
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Offline prometheus_effect

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #20 on: April 08, 2005, 05:07:07 PM »
Hi Stefan,

As another thought you could use diodes to seperate the current flowing from the batteries to the motor and the current flowing from the motor to the batteries. Then run both though emersed strip heaters in individual water tanks, measure the temp rise in each water tank and calculate real energy flows each way. Has this been done?

Regards,
Prometheus_Effect


Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #21 on: April 08, 2005, 05:14:51 PM »
Hi Prometheus,
it is all not so easy, that is why there has not been too much progress into this direction.
ALso as the RF currents are needed for correct operation, the coil unit puts out high RF noise
into the surroundings, which must be shielded, before a unit could be
sold and also the burning contacts at the commutator are needed
and this problem also has to be addressed in better materials lasting longer,
so you see, it is not as easy as you think.


Also this presented machine at the press conference is at a power
level of only around about 1 to 3? Watts !
If you want to go into the 100 Watts or Kwatts range
it is very difficult to scale up.
Then you need again high voltage supplies
or massively bigger coils , which is very expensive to
build..
This is why I have concentrated my own research now to
other areas, which are more easy to scale up.

Regards, Stefan.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #21 on: April 08, 2005, 05:14:51 PM »
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Offline prometheus_effect

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #22 on: April 09, 2005, 02:59:13 AM »
Hi Prometheus,

It is all not so easy, that is why there has not been too much progress into this direction.

Also as the RF currents are needed for correct operation, the coil unit puts out high RF noise
into the surroundings, which must be shielded, before a unit could be
sold and also the burning contacts at the commutator are needed
and this problem also has to be addressed in better materials lasting longer,
so you see, it is not as easy as you think.

Hi Stefan,

Storing the energy of the RF bursts into a cap bank is not as hard as you may think. RF engineers do it all the time, How do you think high power RF transmitters work? Has there ever been a spectral analysis done of the RF burst feeding back into the batteries?

Quote
Also this presented machine at the press conference is at a power
level of only around about 1 to 3? Watts !
If you want to go into the 100 Watts or Kwatts range
it is very difficult to scale up.
Then you need again high voltage supplies
or massively bigger coils , which is very expensive to
build..
This is why I have concentrated my own research now to
other areas, which are more easy to scale up.

Scaling up is just engineering time and money. But first the underlying OU effect needs to be clearly understood and I suggest the small motor would be a good cost effective model. Stefan once it is proven there is a OU effect here, money and good engineering minds can solve any other problems.

Regards,
Prometheus_Effect

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #23 on: April 09, 2005, 03:34:12 AM »
Yes, the OU effect comes mainly from the spark-gap effect at the commutator.
But as far as as I know, there has not been a spectral analysis been taken,
cause the high Voltage Back EMF pulses might just destroy every spectral analysator !

It really depends on the contact material at the commutator, how big these
pulses are and how big the RF output power is.
With copper-carbon it works quite well.
With conducting water- conducting water it does not work at all !
This I have already tested.

With his bigger earlier machines there were also DC components additionally
to the RF bursts, this depends on the "Stray capacity" of the coil.
The bigger this Stray capacity is, the bigger is also this DC component that kicks
back and recharges the battery too.
So to wind a coil, which has lots of capacity is better.
Regards, Stefan.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #23 on: April 09, 2005, 03:34:12 AM »
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Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #24 on: April 09, 2005, 03:38:32 AM »
P.S. The turning magnet inside the coil will also help to make the
Back EMF Voltage even bigger and thus "power" the spark up !

Regards, Stefan.

Offline prometheus_effect

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #25 on: April 09, 2005, 04:05:27 AM »
But as far as as I know, there has not been a spectral analysis been taken,
cause the high Voltage Back EMF pulses might just destroy every spectral analysator !

Hi Stefan,

No way will it destroy a spectrum analyser. Any RF engineer worth his salt could design an input circuit which will do the job. It's just engineering. Not magic. Then once the RF envelope is known, designing the cap bank would be simple and we can get onto really determing what is or is not happening inside a Newman motor.

Hey Evan you out there?

Regards,
Prometheus_Effect

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #25 on: April 09, 2005, 04:05:27 AM »
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Offline erickrieg

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #26 on: April 10, 2005, 04:31:00 AM »
Stefen,

    thanks for not deleting my posts.   I would be interested in what information from
www.phact.org/e/skeptic/newman.htm
that you consider to be lies.    I sincerely want to post correct information - I put up pages of messages from people who disagree with me.
    Newmans many different designs include ones he claims puts out at least 10 times more output power than taken in - I would think it should be easy to cause something like that to self run.   Have you made a self runner based on information from Newman?    Do you know of anyone who has?     I would be willing to believe Newman's or anyones claims if there was proper proof I could see.

Eric Krieg

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #27 on: April 10, 2005, 05:26:22 AM »
Eric, I would say the Norman Biss Story
is a bit overexxagerated and also the Story with marying the kid...

Newman?s public Demos are still missing the "beef".
I have seen much better demos in some of his videotapes.

I did get also a lot of RF power out of my devices,
but due to time and lab limitations I could not go
on with the research.
Someoneover here from Germany did build a much bigger
Newman machine than me and got around 120 % efficiency he told
me, but he wants to stay anonymously.

The Video from the Canadian TV is too bad filmed, so I can not see,
if he has some kind of incand. bulbs ontop of the new motor.
In a few older videos he could run a few incand. bulbs
on the RF power the commutator generated and in a recent video
he did run already a 60 or 100 Watts light bulbs from it, when much
less chopped DC powerwent into the machine.

Too bad Newman did not show a conclusive demo with the
AC-Generator. It seems there the mechanical output is not so strong,
otherwise he would have run more loads than just about 1 KWatts.
He had a 10 KWatts generator hooked up to his motor
and only did run about 1 KWatts electrical loads on the generator,
what I have seen in the videos...
Does anybody know, if he has run more loads with it ?

Anyway, the OU power is inside the RF, the mechanical output in
my view could be less than the chopped DC input.
That also depends mainly on the setup of all the magnets and coils
and the airgap losses.

Regards, Stefan.

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #28 on: April 10, 2005, 05:32:33 AM »
P.S: I had some pretty long email exchanges with Norman Biss and the more he wrote,
it was clear, that his "ramblings" about Newman did not make any sense and he never came
forward with the second motor he wanted to build and test. We still wait
for this today. So I don?t give any validation to this "story".

Offline Thaelin

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Re: Newman press conference
« Reply #29 on: April 14, 2005, 12:12:37 AM »
Stephan,
    I read the post of Biss about his working with Newman and anyone could tell these
two awrny cats on a hot tin roof. Newman wanted it done his way and the Tech had a
fit because he couldn't do it the way the book said. I really would have loved to see the
exchanges between them.
   I cant elaborate on who is right and wrong as I wasn't there. When you build something
for some one else, thought you were supposed to do it the way they wanted. Good or bad.
Kind of like my writing a SF story and then someone proofing it to their liking, not my story
any more. And that would really piss me.

   New technology is new technology. It most likely will not follow the hallowed lines of the
manuals taught in school. But thats how we break new ground, break the rules a bit now
and then.


Oh well, Yada Yada Yada

sugra

 

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