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Author Topic: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)  (Read 303610 times)

delboy

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #510 on: March 02, 2010, 11:52:08 AM »
Hi to all.
I "feel", you all guys need to look at this site:
http://amasci.com/tesla/tesceive.html
I don't want take part in this discussion since my knowledge ends just on popular science. I include an excerpt from this particular page, which may catch your attention:
"CONCLUSION
To sum up: we see that by putting a big AC voltage on the tuned circuit and by adjusting its phase in relation to the tiny incoming current, we can "suck" the E x M wattage from the enormously broad wavefronts of the incoming waves. It also works this way inside a simple circuit using conventional voltage dividers: add a resonant circuit, and the series impedance of the power source behaves smaller. See this example circuit. It should still work this way even when a part of the antenna circuit contains a series capacitor whose dielectric is made up of many feet (or even tens of km) of empty space. "
It's not that! That is compensation and voltage divider.
What I am talking about is making true one resonant transmitter (TC) and picking up that BIG reactive power by one wire receiver so not to disturb resonance !

sparks

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #511 on: March 03, 2010, 05:18:34 AM »
   Bart A the nail on the head.  We know that we can build up a huge amount of reactive energy in resonant electrical system but the trillion dollar question is can this resonance be maintained with minimal dampening and still be able to do work in excess of the energy needed to maintain the oscillations.  Perhaps an experiment needs to be devised which creates an rlc where the internal currents are maintained at 1000 of times the maintenance current input.  Then see if there is a way to tap the 1000 fold gain without diminishing the oscillations below what is needed to maintain them when the sytem isnt doing work. 

delboy

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #512 on: March 03, 2010, 01:09:34 PM »
   Bart A the nail on the head.  We know that we can build up a huge amount of reactive energy in resonant electrical system but the trillion dollar question is can this resonance be maintained with minimal dampening and still be able to do work in excess of the energy needed to maintain the oscillations.  Perhaps an experiment needs to be devised which creates an rlc where the internal currents are maintained at 1000 of times the maintenance current input.  Then see if there is a way to tap the 1000 fold gain without diminishing the oscillations below what is needed to maintain them when the sytem isnt doing work.

To maintaine resonance wit minimal losses you need good circuit controler :D
That is why Tesla perfected it so many times! He used 4 kinds of controlers till he picked right one!
Oscillation in RLC (primary) will be long if resistance R is small ! That is why controller need to be close to ideal switch ! Small resistance on close, big resistance on open. Controller runs resonance effect. Resonance effect in secondary gives rise to voltage and to current! It is series open RLC circuit, it is not standard RLC as you learned in school :D Tesla designed RLC circuit that will not overload source and yet it will give amplification for both voltage and current like standard series RLC !
How to pick up that energy? Well by one-wire receiver! Receiver see only X and nothing else, no source overload!
It is not trillion dollar question, it si maybe 10 000 dollars question :D because you need big TC as Tesla had one!

Magluvin

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #513 on: March 07, 2010, 08:34:20 AM »
Just to talk about transmitters and receivers, my little 5v 1a power supply I use for the 5v stuff, it puts out some power to receive.
I had an Orbonbon test going on and for some strange reason if I fiddled with the bread board or the wires, my output voltage was changing a bit. I thought it was a loos connection somewhere. Well after tearing power from everything on the board just leaving the bridge rectifier and a cap on the dc side, if I touched one of the ac side leads of the bridge, the cap starts charging, all the way to 90 some volts. I thought, NO, Cant BE.
But if I unpluged the PS, the charge faded. And this is with the power supplies wires just laying on the floor. I wasnt going to say anything of it till I get the receiver going with better results, because it is impressive now, imagine if I work on it a bit. No caps or coils for tuning. While receiving with 1, another can receive the same without diminishing the 1st. It charges fast too. Maybe this is Titos Way.
The PS is running at 500hz from what my meter says.    Well, its the 3 legged bridge, gota love it.  I am going to try a couple ant, 1 on each ac in but also try with a cap on 1 ant to knock it out of phase from the first and see what it pumps.
Wouldnt it be whacky if I can get some current going with this. I will have to measure the PS input current to see if the draws affect it. And it is idle with no load. The PS id a dc switching type.
But this project, found by accident, is worth looking into. Just for the nature of it.  =]

Mags

grizli

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #514 on: March 29, 2010, 12:34:02 AM »
Hmmm, isn't resonance effect that gives rise to reactive power???
How big Q factor than proportinaly that big will be reactive power!
For example, if we have on primary say 3kV and primary is 1 turn and is in loose connection with secondary and primary see only  few turns of secondary, for example 5 of them, and secondary have 50, giving 45 is left! Because nothing is ideal, let supose that we transfered let say 2kV to 5 turns of secondary.
That 2kV is now one NEW SOURCE of high frequency! And we have stil 45 turns left and also there is TOP-LOAD capacity! This is new RLC open circuit: SOURCE – 45 turns= INDUCTIVITY – TOP_LOAD capacity. This is important to understand. Resonance is possible in an open RLC circuit! One wire transfer!
Than if Q of secondary is for example Q=500, than under resonance this will give 500*2kV =1MV voltage of high frequency. Than you can calculate by uper formula, how big power will be., because it depends on capacity, frequency and square of voltage! Tesla build TC with relativly big diameter. You now why? Because he wanted to reduce loosses in secondary because if you have thousand of turns your voltage will be eaten up by parasitic capacity!
That's why he had only 30-50 turns in secondary but diameter was 3-15 meters which gives high induction necessary to have high Q! Tesla enlarged induction by making diameter bigger not turns! It is also square dependent!
How to collect this power without disturbing resonace?  With one wire transfer (wireless)! One wire can be Earth, Air(over 5 miles high), Sea, Copper etc I must go through something. That's why I call it ONE WIRE. You first must understand pricips of one wire transfer, than talk about how Tesla drive car on some black box bla bla. You are skiping the important part in Tesla's life.
You have patents 645576 and 649621 describing transversal receiver. Receiver is reverse of TC. Or if you want logitudinal one than look at 685955.
Ask your selves, how come that bulbs are light on connection C when they are short circuit?
I recommend reading this :

http://www.tfcbooks.com/tesla/1919-05-00.htm
http://www.tfcbooks.com/tesla/nt_on_ac.htm

BUT if thats so easy why dont we have OU tesla devices ? I mean its not beag deal to make two identical tesla coils
Elecated tapaity between them  bother ends to earth ...
or we may also have 1245 recievers for example not just one , in resonance reciever is TRANSMITTER in the same time isnt it ?

so you suggest that thats all thats needed ?  i mean reactive power remains in LC can it be utilised ?..

why 1/4 wavelength ? Speed of wave in the coil is NOT the same as speed of wave in transmission line.. usually Natural resonance of coil is not the same as 1/4 wirelength for wavelength ..
CAn we have more than one resonance for example LC resonance and quater wave resonance ? For example for clasic colenoid natural LC resonance is usually about double in frequency than 1/4 wirelength=wavelength .. so we can add top capacity to lower natural LC and we match 1/4 wirelength or not ? tesla does not say about that...

so of we have capacity coupled secondaries (OU is point here not wireless) so they are relative close top capacityes are relative near..

I mean is it ONLY that , question is can reactive power be converted to usable power this way ? 

All in all why would we need several meter wide coil ? who cares if Q is 20 or 500 20 is good enough ..

grizli

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #515 on: March 29, 2010, 12:52:45 AM »

Here is not problem in receiver at all. It's problem in design of good transmitter like Tesla described. There is no point in mini Tesla Coil. What is purpose of that „mini“ when it has several thousand of turns and all energy is eaten up by parasitic capacity and that what is left is radiated around in space because of very high frequency!
Mini TC can not develop high reactive power which is required to have enough voltage per length!

I would not agree

why not maing reciever and transmiter ONE single device ?
we do not need wireless..

voltage can be lower to prevent arcing and pover loss
capacity can be reduced MUCH using pancake coil with wire layers not in the plate surface. or clasic smaller TC with bugger pacing between turns ?

why not 200V primary 4 turn for example and secondary is 50 turns .. max voltage will be hmm maybe 2kV to low for arcing and loss..

question is : is etheric field or torsion field or what every on EARTH planet responsible for free energy obtainable at higher frequencies or like tesla say must be low ?


grizli

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #516 on: March 29, 2010, 01:12:14 AM »

Than if Q of secondary is for example Q=500, than under resonance this will give 500*2kV =1MV voltage of high frequency. Than you can calculate by uper formula, how big power will be., because it depends on capacity, frequency and square of voltage! Tesla build TC with relativly big diameter. You now why? Because he wanted to reduce loosses in secondary because if you have thousand of turns your voltage will be eaten up by parasitic capacity!

Ask your selves, how come that bulbs are light on connection C when they are short circuit?
I recommend reading this :



Simple 30cm diameter coil about 200 turns of wire has more than 500 Q

for example 30 cm diameter 90 cm long 200 turns 2 mm wire diameter ..

188m wire 12 ohm quater  wave resonance  400 khz , natural LC resonance 700khz

so TELL me how would you calculate Q factor ?
Q=1/R*squareroot(L/C)
L=3431uH
C=15pF(for example) dont know

Q= over 1200

thats NOT low AT all .. and I really dont see if your theory works than also this kind of TC also works ..

grizli

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #517 on: March 29, 2010, 01:43:08 AM »
DELBOY ;D


If you theory is correct WE REALLY DO NOT NEED TWO TESLA COILS to obtain OU or reactive power

IMAGINE THIS

WE have 5 turns coil LC primary and 5 turns coil secondary . one end of secondary is grounded, wire goes from 5 turns secondary to QUATER wave=  wire length magnifier coil .
At the bottom of magnifier is 5 turns LC reciever low turn coil..
thats IT

reciever 5 turns coil is NOT in magnetic field of primary 5 turns coil. many turn magnifier is FREE away from primary , and 5 turns reciever does not affect resonance = loose coupled..

DO WE AT ALL NEED QUATER WAVE for wire length here ?? cause we DONT need antenna we dont need wireless transmission here !!!

just ALL LC resonances must match !!!


baroutologos

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #518 on: March 29, 2010, 08:02:03 AM »
Quote
Grizly Said:
I would not agree

why not maing reciever and transmiter ONE single device ?
we do not need wireless..

voltage can be lower to prevent arcing and pover loss
capacity can be reduced MUCH using pancake  with wire layers not in the plate surface. or clasic smaller TC with bugger pacing between turns ?

why not 200V primary 4 turn for example and secondary is 50 turns .. max voltage will be hmm maybe 2kV to  for arcing and loss..

question is : is etheric field or torsion field or what every on EARTH planet responsible for free energy obtainable at higher frequencies or like tesla say must be low ?

A little experimentation and you will see your major error you make. I least i saw mine trying to replicate Don Smith's setups..

it all boils down to - in order to get considerable resonance you need small capacity that is located at free terminal (not intercoil capacitance) and large inductunce. No 20 turns ect -

Try your view in an experimental setup and YOU WILL COME to my words.

Cya

grizli

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #519 on: March 29, 2010, 11:11:46 AM »
A little experimentation and you will see your major error you make. I least i saw mine trying to replicate Don Smith's setups..

it all boils down to - in order to get considerable resonance you need small capacity that is located at free terminal (not intercoil capacitance) and large inductunce. No 20 turns ect -

Try your view in an experimental setup and YOU WILL COME to my words.

Cya

Q is proportional to square root of (L/C) RIGHT.... but all in all why would we want 1000Q if we can make good OU device with 10 ?

what were your experimentational results ?

delboy

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #520 on: May 01, 2010, 08:42:34 PM »
Tesla (1901) :
...my next step was to use the earth itself as the medium for conducting the currents, thus dispensing with wires and all other artificial conductors. So I was led to the development of a system of energy transmission and of telegraphy without the use of wires, which I described in 1893. The difficulties I encountered at first in the transmission of currents through the earth were very great. At that time I had at hand only ordinary apparatus, which I found to be ineffective, and I concentrated my attention immediately upon perfecting machines for this special purpose. This work consumed a number of years, but I finally vanquished all difficulties and succeeded in producing a machine which, to explain its operation in plain language, resembled a pump in its action, drawing electricity from the earth and driving it back into the same at an enormous rate, thus creating ripples or disturbances which, spreading through the earth as through a wire, could be detected at great distances by carefully attuned receiving circuits. In this manner I was able to transmit to a distance, not only feeble effects for the purposes of signaling, but considerable amounts of energy, and later discoveries I made convinced me that I shall ultimately succeed in conveying power without wires, for industrial purposes, with high economy, and to any distance, however great.

forest

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #521 on: May 01, 2010, 11:29:51 PM »
Link please !

gyulasun

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Magluvin

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #523 on: May 01, 2010, 11:44:31 PM »
Hey Delboy. Good to see you back. =]

I wonder if Teslas transmission of power through the earth was just normal in all other ways like power lines.
Like would each reciever added to the system(earth) put more drain on the transmitter? And if nobody was using power, would the transmitter still be pushing out the power and it be wasted? These things would still make it logical to just run wires as to get everyone to pay for the production of power, or do the receivers have usage meters.
And could it be known, from the earth, whether power is being used or not in order to not waste power in production.
Thanks for the tidbit Delboy.

Mags

delboy

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Re: Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter (amplify electricity)
« Reply #524 on: May 02, 2010, 08:52:45 AM »
...Now, there is a vast difference between these two, the electromagnetic and current energies.  That A which goes out in the form of rays, is, as I have indicated here, unrecoverable, hopelessly lost.  You can operate a little instrument by catching a billionth part of it but, except this, all goes out into space never to return.  This other energy, however, of the current in the globe, is stored and completely recoverable.  Theoretically, it does not take much effort to maintain the earth in electrical vibration.  I have, in fact, worked out a plant of 10,000 horse-power which would operate with no bigger loss than 1 percent of the whole power applied; that is, with the exception of the frictional energy that is consumed in the rotation of the engines and the heating of the conductors, I would not lose more than 1 percent.  In other words, if I have a 10,000 horsepower plant, it would take only 100 horsepower to keep the earth vibrating so long as there is no energy taken out at any other place

...Suppose that the earth were an elastic bag filled with water.  My transmitter is equivalent to a pump.  I put it on a point of the globe, and work my little piston so as to create a disturbance of that water.  If the piston moves slowly, so that the time is long enough for the disturbance to spread over the globe, then what will be the result of my working this pump? The result will be that the bag will expand and contract rhythmically with the motions of the piston, you see.  So that, at any point of that bag, there will be a rhythmical movement due to the pulsations of the pump.

That is only, however, when the period is long.  If I were to work this pump very rapidly, then I would create impulses, and the ripples would spread in circles over the surface of the globe.  The globe will no longer expand and contract in its entirety, but it will be subject to these outgoing, rippling waves.

Remember, now, that the water is incompressible, that the bag is perfectly elastic, that there are no hysteretic losses in the bag due to these expansions and contractions; and remember also, that there is a vacuum, in infinite space, so that the energy cannot be lost in waves of sound.  Then, if I put at a distant point another little pump, and tune it to the rhythmical pulses of the pump at the central plant, I will excite strong vibrations and will recover power from them, sufficient to operate a receiver.  But, if I have no pump there to receive these oscillations, if there is nowhere a place where this elastic energy is transferred into frictional energy (we always use in our devices frictional energy -- everything is lost through friction), then there is no loss, and if I have a plant of 1,000 horsepower and I operate it to full capacity, that plant does not take power, it runs idle, exactly as the plant at Niagara.  If I do not put any motors or any lamps on the circuit, the plant runs idle.  There is a 5,000 horsepower turbine going, but no power is supplied to the turbine except such power as is necessary to overcome the frictional losses.

Now the vast difference between the scheme of radio engineers and my scheme is this.  If you generate electromagnetic waves with a plant of 1,000 horsepower, you are using 1,000 horsepower right along -- whether there is any receiving being done or not.  You have to supply this 1,000 horsepower, exactly as you have to supply coal to keep your stove going, or else no heat goes out.  That is the vast difference.  In my case, I conserve the energy; in the other case, the energy is all lost.