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Author Topic: Towards Realizing the TPU  (Read 202877 times)

Room3327

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #75 on: January 23, 2009, 06:50:03 PM »
Continuing these thoughts, with the use of soft steel for a core you can't run it any higher then about 500 Hz max. which would be 500x60 or 30,000 RPM.  If as I suspect SM went to ferrite cores, something Tesla did not have in his day, then this could be operated at much higher frequencies.  5KHz input would now be equivalent to 300,000 RPM, I would think a lot of power could be generated, just think of spinning a normal generator at 300,000 RPM.
   And keep in mind here, there is nothing moving except the magnetic field!

forest

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #76 on: January 23, 2009, 09:11:41 PM »
Continuing these thoughts, with the use of soft steel for a core you can't run it any higher then about 500 Hz max. which would be 500x60 or 30,000 RPM.  If as I suspect SM went to ferrite cores, something Tesla did not have in his day, then this could be operated at much higher frequencies.  5KHz input would now be equivalent to 300,000 RPM, I would think a lot of power could be generated, just think of spinning a normal generator at 300,000 RPM.
   And keep in mind here, there is nothing moving except the magnetic field!

I agree with you. However using electronic circuit for driving such coil might be problematic.Better is to use positive feedback with negative regulator to set device rotating magnetic field exactly at required power output for connected load.That means a tiny load (resistance?) connected continuously to sustain rotation of magnetic field ?

Room3327

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #77 on: January 23, 2009, 09:51:31 PM »
Forest,

        I agree that in the real world you would want to use feedback for control of the input, so you only use as much input as is required for the output you need.  But I disagree about using an electronic circuit for driving it.  Electronically creating a 2 Phase sine wave drive 90 degrees out of phase is pretty easy today.  This would give easy control of operating frequency's and other parameters and is easily amenable to feedback control. You could use frequency control to increase or decrease output. It would also be cheaper and easier to build then a Tesla exciter.

P.S. Don't forget SM used electronic control of his devices.

forest

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #78 on: January 24, 2009, 08:54:35 AM »
Forest,

        I agree that in the real world you would want to use feedback for control of the input, so you only use as much input as is required for the output you need.  But I disagree about using an electronic circuit for driving it.  Electronically creating a 2 Phase sine wave drive 90 degrees out of phase is pretty easy today.  This would give easy control of operating frequency's and other parameters and is easily amenable to feedback control. You could use frequency control to increase or decrease output. It would also be cheaper and easier to build then a Tesla exciter.

P.S. Don't forget SM used electronic control of his devices.

Yes,but don't forget what SM told us about using electronic and why we should experimenting with vacuum tubes . Anyway I think that it's perfectly realizable without electronics. Look at perepiteia.

turbo

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #79 on: January 24, 2009, 11:41:20 AM »

Also, for the TPU, would any ferro core be required?  Would it not be simpler, if a true
90 degree operation is desired, to simply simulate one with the outer coil having a DC
bias, establishing containment and allowing greater inner field density?   That would
certainly eliminate the saturation that would have happened at the high load.....


Steven already said this is not about induction.
If you needed a place for particles to freely float around, like in a particle accelerator, would you put a core in there??
I for one would not.

As for this thread, if the author was given the real operating priciple, he would dismiss it and continue to build yet another theoretical thread with another shitload of poyntless data and all the guy's will add their thought's to it, but there will be no end to it, it has happend before.
No realizing the TPU.

Marco.



MACEDONIA CD

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #80 on: January 24, 2009, 01:13:20 PM »
yes  is spin fast like  jet engine turbine  <<like  my  tpu  strong sparks  > whit my small adapter ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

sparks

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #81 on: January 24, 2009, 02:49:13 PM »
     Tesla designed his transformer to be a voltage multiplier. He wants to get some highvoltage to overcome the transmission line drop.  He knows that the faster the magnetic lines of force change around a conductor the higher the voltage.  The only rectifier in those days were commutators.  So he designs a static commutator utilizing magnetic fields.  Now his ac exciter pulses are converted to magnetic compression waves that circulate about the core.  Any conductor in this field then sees this magnetic field changing around it and induces a current that opposes this magnetic field shift but in this case the primemover isn't going to bog down it could care less abount counteremf and all that shit because it is in a different electrical inertial frame of reference than the play going on at the generator.  The higher the frequency of an event the more chance there is to convert it into a low frequency event of more meaningful kinetic energy conversion.  So the relatively high frequency occurance at the exciter is converted into the low frequency occurance of dynamo currents.  DC is about as low as you can go on frequency conversion.
    Everything has ac flowing through it.  Just a matter of converting it into lower frequency of higher amplitude.
    The question still remains what scource of highfrequency was SM using to create his dynamo.  This was battery technology not a free energy device by his own words.   The hf torroidal transformers in his machines are a dead give away as well as the meltdown of his core in the video where some clown is running around showing us the crossection of the torroid while SM and others in a state of panic screw around with what appears to be a glowing element used in his signal transmitter.  Could SM have been converting hf given off by a chemical reaction into lowfrequency pulsed dc?  Isn't that what you do when you do a Tesla coil?  Could be something as simple as burning nitrogen and oxygen in a spark gap and converting it to electricity.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2009, 03:33:44 PM by sparks »

wattsup

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #82 on: January 24, 2009, 04:38:23 PM »
@sparks

You are very right. There is something happening much more important and that is his use of the converter is reducing the induction in the generator and hence the inherent generator drag on his drive motor. He could have shorted the generator output with a standard load as we all do today and then be exposed to the drag, but no, Tesla does things in the "best" way possible to advantage economy of function. How you treat the output is just as important as how you produce the juice. No capacitors. Just make the juice and  get it out and away from their, asap.

Here's something else about the converter. Page 4 line 64

"The construction may be carried further, as above pointed out, by enclosing these coils with iron - as, for example by winding over the coils a layer or layers of insulated iron wire."

Imagine having such a toroid that is then covered with iron wire. You can then cover the iron wire with another pick-up coil to grab more juice back for added efficiency. Hmmmm.


wattsup

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #83 on: January 24, 2009, 05:08:11 PM »
@sparks

I have done much testing on the SM FTPU both in the center toroid types and the outer rings with the outer coils.

For the toroid, nothing makes any sense at all. Chokes used with such a big toroid being either laminated or ferrite cored, given the wire AWG used, would have required much more then the one layer windings with such thin wire to really do anything on the realm of significant coupling action. This is not normal.

As for the outer rings 2-3 turns and outer coil of approx 10 turns per quad, there again after so many types of pulsing there is nothing happening in the 5khz range. The only activity of coupling action from the outer coil being pulsed and measuring off the inner ring (or vis-versa) was happening at the 2mhz range which is the maximum my FG can go. I am convinced that the frequencies used in the FTPU are anywhere between 2-20mhz (or higher) but not in the 5khz range that SM said.

The references made of a slight vibration in the realm of 5khz if caused by kicks would confirm the above. If a kick is to happen between other spikes, then the frequency has to be much much  higher then the 5khz to then at least get kicks at 5khz. At 1 kick out of 100 cycles, you are already at 500khz. At 1 kick at every 400 cycles you get to 2mhz.

The again the FTPU could work at 5khz inorder to capture the power emitted by the adjacent HV lines since NOTHING in standard pulsing that range has any effect. The HV frequency as shown by EM when matched to SMs 5khz frequency claim is toooooooooo much of a coincidence to be ignored.

I wonder what the frequency was of EMs miniTPU. I think it was in the 20mhz range but could be wrong.

Now, on the other hand, for the toroid, if one looks up HF transmitters using the bucking coil configuration, you will find various uses in the category of baluns and that would also explain the meager windings. You could then postulate that the ring is a receiver and the TPU is working in a loop.

I put up a pdf file on my OU ftp site located here;
http://www.purco.qc.ca/ftp

click - Researchers - Balun Information - HFbaltransys.pdf
If you look at page 20, this will give you an idea on what the toroid(s) may be. There are tons of SM TPU photos and nick-nacks on the site for all.

Then there is the most puzzling side. I once did a test using the FTPU outer rings, coil as primary and ring as output secondary. The primary was connected to a Tesla ozone patent set-up so the outer ring coil was the primary of the working circuit. This actually gave the best coupling effect I have seen in any of my tests. But here is the question. To do this you need a coil of high induction and where in the FTPU could you see such a coil. It's not the outer coils or rings, it's not the center toroid, so where??????? It could be the one hidden on the lower disk or it could be placed inside the center of the reel structure since we see there is something there when he turns it over. I thought it looked like a microphone to induce high frequency audio feedback.

Anyways, for me it is only a question of time before I get the solution of the FTPU. There are not 1000 parts to make. The builds are very easy in variations so there should be no excuse for others to not do some DIRECTLY RELATED testing in this regard. But hey. To each his own. lol

If I was an R&D manager, I think I would have a good idea on how to go about doing the many tests to figure it out, but alone, it is always more difficult and time consuming.

@GK

I will get the Keely book. I am due for a good sofa read.

@Room3327

I think the fastest turning objects are only in the 100,000 rpm range. These are generally flywheel batteries and these flywheels are encased in carbon enclosures in case one should fly apart, it would be one hell of a bang.

@marco

I think we are doing the best we can with what we have and what we know.

turbo

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #84 on: January 24, 2009, 05:10:30 PM »

@marco

I think we are doing the best we can with what we have and what we know.


The best you can ?
I think you cannot do worse.

Grumpy

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #85 on: January 24, 2009, 05:45:43 PM »

As for this thread, if the author was given the real operating priciple, he would dismiss it and continue to build yet another theoretical thread with another shitload of poyntless data and all the guy's will add their thought's to it, but there will be no end to it, it has happend before.
No realizing the TPU.


I think he already has it, but he's not boldly stating this.

turbo

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #86 on: January 24, 2009, 05:47:48 PM »
I think he already has it, but he's not boldly stating this.

Well if that is true, he would not dismiss it right?
So why did he?

Trust me, He's not even close.

sparks

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #87 on: January 24, 2009, 06:32:17 PM »
@Wattsup

     The rotating magnetic field is just one of the effects of the tpu.   Electrical resonance can not be disregarded.  The highfrequency transformers used in SM's oscillators and capacitors are tuned to be in resonance and coupled to the input windings of the Tesla solid state alternator.  This therefore represents a conversion from highfrequency low amplitude energy to lower frequency high amplitude conversion.  The resonant high frequency circuit can oscillate virtually forever if it does no work.  When the inductance in the resonant circuit appears as a loosely coupled transformer the resonant circuit oscillates undamped.  In the TPU this effect results in a highspeed magnetic field rotation as opposed to a highvoltage low  amperage event as one would normally see in a Tesla transformer utilizing highfrequency conversion.
     And I'll be damned but Tesla along with others figured out the Earth is a bigold inductor resonating a 7something hertz.  So we are virtually inside a big old piece of wire between the capacitor and the inductor.  Now how the hell do we add some resistance to this ringer?

Room3327

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #88 on: January 24, 2009, 06:44:14 PM »
Wattsup,

          I'm not sure where you are coming from, but the rotation I am talking about is not physical rotation of the device, yes physical rotation can not be taken very high, I actually don't even know of anything that can rotate at 100,000 RPM.  The rotation I am talking about is a magnetic field rotation, Magnetic field lines rotating about the core.  Do you think there is a limit to the rotational speed of a magnetic field with no mass accompaniment.  We have no mass moving to limit rotational speed, now there may be a top speed involved such as the speed of light but 300,000 RPM is not that great.  To achieve 300,000 RPM speed in the core we need only to drive this with 5KHz.
I hope this brings the obfuscation of this thread to an end, please,  we have a good basic operating principle here to work with. If we can avoid too much wild theorizing on this thread we can keep everyone here working on good principles and maybe get somewhere.

Thank you
Room3327

turbo

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Re: Towards Realizing the TPU
« Reply #89 on: January 24, 2009, 07:09:59 PM »

       Do you think there is a limit to the rotational speed of a magnetic field with no mass accompaniment.

Room3327


One more time,

Magnetic fields are stationary in space therefore they cannot rotate.
100.000 RPM is nothing i have seen a physical system rotate twice that fast.
We need only this we need only that core here core there and now all of a sudden we have a good basic operating principle.

You have nothing, and that was the poynt.

There are no crossing high voltage power lines above Poynt99 head, so he is not even close?   :P

In case you were thinking this was about the powerlines, i can refresh your mind, because it is not.
Your becomming almost predictable Chef, any idea what that means?