Hi Robert, you wrote:

"In the original setup as proposed by Dr. Griffin, either the zinc cathode has to be replaced or it has to be regenerated, right? In the first case, where you would replace the cathode, wouldn't that leave residue (zincates?) in the reaction medium and evt. spoil the medium???"  My hope is that by regenerating one of the zinc anodes at the same time the hydrogen is being produced, the formation of the zincates will be minimal. That way the chances of this happening will be small. The reaction itself regenerates the zinc by using the magnesium colloid:

2Zn⁺² + 2Mg_c --> 2Mg⁺² + 2Zn(this is the zinc that replates)

 the rate just does not quite keep up with the zinc ion formation, that is why the extra regeneration with the electrical current is needed.


"If this is the case then we can only go the path of regenerating the zinc cathode.... This then brings me to my second question, does the regenaration of the cathode cost less power then the power you received from the cell?" I will be doing this with two fuel cells (one after the other). One fuel cell will power the fan (or whatever I hook to it) and the second smaller fuel cell will do the regeneration. That is what my long term testing will do. Show how to maintain this system.

"something else.... I was thinking about your idea of regenerating one cathode(you mean 'anode') while the other one is used in producing hydrogen. Will the current that you put in the reaction medium to restore the zinc not interfere with the hydrogen producing proces on the other cathode/anode set? I mean you're putting a reversed potential on the cell, will the result not be zero because there will be hardly any current flow?
I'm not sure of this but maybe it is somehow an idead to do this across two seperate cells. That is..... use the second anode/cathode pair to regenerate a cathode in a separate second cell (not producing hydrogen at that time)." You might suspect this would happen, but my previous lab tests show that this does work. I can produce hydrogen and regenerate the other zinc anode at the same time. At least that is what it showed in my initial testing of this idea. I still need to try it long-term.

Thanks everyone for your interest.

 www.wateroz.com

This is were I order magnesium and silver colloids through the internet.

Good luck Robert.

I just got back home from vacation yesterday. I can FINALLY get back to work. Washington DC was cool, but I think hydrogen is more interesting. LOL!

Hi everyone,
I'm about to build a cell based on Dr. griffin's patent and RR2's experiences. I just have a hard time finding a shop to order magnesium colloid. The silver colloid is no problem.....
Can anyone point me to a webshop where i can order it? Preferably in Europe but if neccesary anywhere is fine.....
Thanks for your help!
Robert

Stefan produced a method for silver colloid which was the passing of
a modest current through silver electrodes for a certain duration of
time to produce a certain concentration in ppm using distilled water.

Stefan:
Will the same idea work using magnesium electrodes?
What do you suggest for voltage, current and time for a given concentration?
Paul.

Stefan produced a method for silver colloid which was the passing of
a modest current through silver electrodes for a certain duration of
time to produce a certain concentration in ppm using distilled water.

Stefan:
Will the same idea work using magnesium electrodes?
What do you suggest for voltage, current and time for a given concentration?
Paul.

Hi Paul,

Yes i have seen equipment for colloidal silver. I think that is the cheapest way to make some (in the long run)
Problem is getting the concentrations right with magnesium (as you say). I haven't got any means to measure it.....
suggestions welcome....

Robert

Hi Keith,

I've spent one to two hours a day over the last few days cleaning out all the old gasket and silicone residue from my reactor and I used your suggestion for sealing the leaks around the electrodes with the cyanoacrylic. I did what you said and used the thick CA to form around the gaps and hit it with the accelerator. BEAUTIFUL!!!! I wish I had know about this earlier. I wasted my time trying to use the silicone, which scraped right off as I was cleaning. SCHEESH! Live and learn.   I just wanted to express my appreciation for the info.

Thanks Keith!!

A couple more days and I'll be back in the hydrogen business! LOL!

Thanks Mikestocks2000,

This is a great diagram that you reference. It shows how this reaction runs on ambient air energy (the thermal input in the lower right hand corner). The combination of ambient air energy and magnesium colloid (in my cell's case) help to regenerate the oxidized zinc metal. This is what causes the lower energy requirements. The air energy is our energy "gain" from this reaction and should be recovered when the hydrogen runs through the fuel cell.

I appreciate the information. Thanks!
 
Dave (RR2)

Hi NssB,

Look here at the link to Dr. Griffin's company AirGen. It shows a few of the products they plan to sell:

http://www.airgencorp.com/product.html

Now Dr. Griffin has a video on the web where he has a plexiglass reactor about the size of one of the old large microwave ovens that he was using to run a go-cart. Initially he had the gas rate going at (in his own words) "70 plus liters per minute". If you look at AirGen product AG20 hydrogen generator at this link you will see that a rate of 75 liters per minute can give you 5 Kw of power through a fuel cell. Does that sound unreasonable? I don't think so.

The smaller generator AG6 can give off 15 liters / minute and supply a  1 kw fuel cell.

Average household power consumption: http://hypertextbook.com/facts/2003/BoiLu.shtml

This gives you an idea of the size. Probably a unit the size of a small microwave can power the average household.

This really gives me incentive to keep up this research.

Thanks for your interest.

The price of a 10W fuel cell is pretty high as it is, never mind a 1kW cell.

At the present time, I've seen prices around 40-60 grand. A bit steep (to say the least) but prices should drop in the future as this is still an emerging technology.

1kw wouldn't get you off the grid, but you could be running the meter backwards most of the time.