Also, please note that not one ampre has been measured in the history of mankind.

Meters have never measured one single amp.

The meter measures VOLTAGE through a known resistance and that tells you how many "amps" is there...still NO AMPERAGE HAS EVER BEEN MEASURED DIRECTLY....the meters measure nothing but VOLTAGE through different circumstances.

Thank you again!  Light bulbs going on .. you are so right ... the maths of Power  = Volts * Current is fairly solid though ... so I don't know how much this changes anything. 

I have huge holes in my knowledge about electricity.  I always equate it back to fluid flow, which I understand a little better.  Volts = Pressure, Current = Flow.  Together, they equal Power.  The maths sort of works - but there are things about electricity that don't stack up to this simple understanding.  For example, electron drift is much slower than current flow - so if it isn't electron flow, what is it??  Are amps real?  Can they be faked, without requiring electron flow?

Thank you again!  Light bulbs going on .. you are so right ... the maths of Power  = Volts * Current is fairly solid though ... so I don't know how much this changes anything. 

That depends if you trust Ampere's law as being the *complete* and factual explanation, or just something that can't be disproved by tools that can (or can't) measure it.  The link somewhere else in one of these threads for "Note_on_Electrodynamics.pdf" would suggest there are errors made that have held us back for many decades, which itself would be a brilliant use of disinformation, because everyone believes Ampere's law because they know it's "fact" as they would say.   Me I don't know, I'm still trying to assimilate it all.

I know Tinu made me out to be a bit of a fool, and that's fair enough.  I don't suppose to know everything there is to be known about water and how it works.  So whatever the right terminology - I am convinced the best energy source is in that low temperature liberation of whatever the hell it's going to be called once mainstream science starts to acknowledge it's existence...

That was not my intention and I apologize for that!
All I want is a clean and coherent discussion; otherwise the whole thread will quickly go down the drain.
Best regards,
Tinu

I'm not sure what you've been reading here - but your conclusions are nothing like what i've learned here ...

As far as i'm concerned, there is no secret power in the spark.  Most people here seem to be using the brute force approach - maxium volts, maximum amps - large power input, for hopefully enough power output to drive a piston down a cylinder ...

The power i'm interested in is in the water.  And it would appear to be in the molecular bonds holding water together in a liquid state.  By atomising the water with a spark - the water suddenly has less molecular bond energy - and because energy is neither created nor destroyed - the energy that was previously holding the molecules together is transformed into violent kinetic energy.  And apparantly the temperature drops too - which I don't understand yet.  Heat is kinetic energy - but obviously there are different forms of kinetic energy.  For example - it's possible to freeze something (reducing heat energy) and accelerate it (increasing kinetic energy) at the same time - so different effects are obviously at work here. 

The subject of electrostatic cooling seems to be linked here.  If objects can be suddenly cooled with the application of high voltage with minimal current - it would appear that massive overunity heat engines should be possible.  I'm thinking this water arc effect is ultimately a heat engine.  But I could be barking mad.

I'm just looking for the best strategy to build a device to test these wild theories ...

Hi greendoor, I very much agree with you! ... too much time spent on the study of the spark and not enough on the role the water plays here.

I think we may find that the spark would be very different if it was in a non humid environment,  maybe much like lightning in a dry summer night.

I agree with you that the water seems to be a very important part and should have just as much attention as the spark.

After all I did call this effect Water Power and not spark power!

Luc

Hi bumfuzzled,

Aren't you making an assumption that it "puts out" this voltage and amperage? If it were so, wouldn't it be putting out 90 kilowatts? This is enough power for 9 or 10 houses if it was continuous. I think you will find that it uses a pulsed current of 2 amps for a 12 volt system and will put out 45,000 volts but at very little current. At 100% efficiency it will only put out 533uAmps (micoamps) at 45,000 volts. A microamp is one millionth of an amp...

Regards,

Ossie

It doesn't say it DRAWS 2 amps, it says it PRODUCES a 2 amp spark at 45,000v in the catalog. I'm not saying it will and I don't have the $166.30 to buy it and try it but MSD has been one of the top ignition companies in racing for years, I don't see them putting out BS for no reason. i understand the power output calculation but this is for a few microseconds not continuous.

Greendoor,

The input of the diode is touching the low voltage +. The output of the diode is touching the HV+. Anytime the voltage on the output side of a diode is HIGHER than the input, the DIODE REMAINS CLOSED.

When is there less voltage potential on the diode's output than the input side? When does the voltage drop below the input side? When the cap is discharged, think about how how much is left and what that diode is.

When does the other side of the diode drop BELOW the input side of the diode in order to open that diode?

Until then....the diode remains closed.

qiman, let me see if i know what you're getting at:

it's simple, the high current from the diode side does not come into play until the reverse inductive spike from the coil secondary occurs, which is NEGATIVE relative to the diode output. this then will allow the diode to forward bias and fully discharge the cap.

@xbox hacker
Which would be why capacitor70 circuit looks as it does,so if I was to use your circuit with an automotive coil,then the grounding issue will not be a problem,correct?

Do you want to start with a mower or a car?
With a mower you need to lose the magneto(if you have -VE), and replace it with a pickup like cap70, then use a automotive ignition coil with + to + and pulse the - from the pick up...you should get +VE 

Car...just make sure the coil has the + on the + and you should be good to go.

I will be putting the pickup setup on my motor this weekend (or sooner  ) But ofcourse that will change the timeing, so that might take a bit to get it right.

Yes...then no problems...

Hi Gang,

Boy we have a fiesty, honest and deep thinking group here.  In spite of BS and doubts, I am continuing working on my modified motor to test all this out.  Motor is finished, now have to mount, flywheel, electronics, timing, plumbing for water.....Lot of work even trying to get a motor to run and I'm trying to do it in a 6th floor condo and my closet shop!...

I have lots of pictures of head construction, secondary injection port, etc.  But one pic. attached here is good enough for now.
Ben

Geezz  Ben. I think you could just run that size engine with that size plug on the humidity of your breath.    Could you not find a bigger plug.    If this works that means the plug I will have to get my Briggs engine to run on will be the size of a 20oz coke bottle