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Author Topic: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)  (Read 17289 times)

Offline martinzurix

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #15 on: June 04, 2008, 05:24:44 PM »
ohh  i can`t understand why peoples make things without knowledge how it may run .  from were energy in gravity wheel ?? can someone explain it to me ?   energy is dynamic process it`s need to flow from one place to other place with different energy potencial.. it like wind .  what is the wind who make gravity wheel to spin ??

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #15 on: June 04, 2008, 05:24:44 PM »

Offline rlortie

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #16 on: June 04, 2008, 06:50:15 PM »
ohh  i can`t understand why peoples make things without knowledge how it may run .  from were energy in gravity wheel ?? can someone explain it to me ?   energy is dynamic process it`s need to flow from one place to other place with different energy potencial.. it like wind .  what is the wind who make gravity wheel to spin ??

IMO you are correct, only what you call "energy potential" I call gradient. Gradient is a potential force capable of producing energy.  Your dynamic process of flowing is gradient force turned into useful energy.

 All gradient force can best be described by the negative and positive posts on a battery. Energy is produced when the two are connected thus they seek a balance, (dead battery) energy is obtainable in the process.   

 Water has potential because of the gradient of its surface elevation to depth. Wind is created due to gradient between high and low atmospheric conditions. Gravity has gradient from the surface of the planet to outer space. Gravitational forces on unlike masses creates gradient between the two. Like masses on an unbalanced lever create gradient by leverage. The position of the fulcrum verses mass dictates the amount of gradient potential. Once the potential is released the wheel turns until the gradient becomes equalized (dead battery) 

One can even say there is gradient between inertial forces (static and dynamic) and kinetic energy.  Although one is considered a force and the other energy already in motion.

What we seek is the capability to keep the wheel in constant gradient by displacing the masses in an un-symmetrical  pattern, thus retaining  a gradient force potential between the two sides. Inertia and kinetic becomes the wind you seek. 

To reiterate your question;  The "wind" that turns a gravity wheel is the gradient between masses so displaced as to create a dynamic energy potential  between two sides of the wheel. In a sense, we have the knowledge to make it run, we just have not figured out the correct configuration of applying it. (where the ---- are those battery posts?)

Thats my opinion!

Ralph   

Offline Alexioco

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #17 on: June 04, 2008, 08:57:20 PM »
Ralph I will continue about my wheel on email...

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #17 on: June 04, 2008, 08:57:20 PM »
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Offline seymour85202

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #18 on: June 04, 2008, 10:10:25 PM »

Hello Martinzurix

    Bessler made a gravity wheel work about 400 years ago but didn't tell anyone
how it worked.  He kept it a secret.  We don't know how it worked so we can't
tell you "how it may run." 

We don't really know much about gravity and energy.  Mathamatics can describe
very well all about how a rock falls but it does not explain why.

Gravity (and magnets) is different than wind (and river current).  With wind you have
air (river has water).   Gravity has no moving particles.  Even works even in vacuum of
space.   So there is no "wind who make gravity wheel spin?".   Not easy to
understand.  Maybe nobody really does.

You maybe misunderstand why people make things here.  This is not to make
products to use or sell.  People make guess as to how gravity wheel could work.
Only way to know is to make working model to see if guess is wrong.
Is just a simple experiment.

Is ok if you do not understand how to make gravity wheel and have questions.
No one here knows how to make one either.  But we make guesses and
make experiments.  We learn.  Maybe someday we guess right.


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Cap-Z-ro

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #19 on: June 05, 2008, 01:42:55 AM »

It always amazed me how a bumble bee can fly despite the aerodynamic impossibility.

The wheel is a very interesting concept with unknown potential...great design.

Regards...

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #19 on: June 05, 2008, 01:42:55 AM »
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Offline Charlie_V

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #20 on: June 05, 2008, 03:28:38 AM »
Alexioco, I'd like to build a model of MT 27 like you showed in your video.  It appeared like yours was built out of cardboard - a great idea if you ask me.  What are the dimensions?  You mentioned that the marble weight can't be too much or it won't return the marble to the center, I imagine that this limit is based on the size of the wheel, bigger wheel bigger weight? 

Also, are the linkages of the "imbalancing arm" (aka what the marble is attached to - I don't know what you are calling it) specific or can you play around with them.  I was thinking it might be beneficial to have the arm come around and actually rest on the axial.  Would this be possible or will it throw things off too much - I have drawn what I mean below.

Offline Haliburton

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #21 on: June 05, 2008, 04:19:13 AM »
Don't want to rain on the parade but i just think no matter how many levers or how you put them it will ever work.

If i was to have that same wheel with a weight on the top end and drop it, it would swing that same distance as the one in that video, if not farther.  so what is so neat about it?

the strings may help put the weight or lever into position but don't they also act as weights or levers in there own way,

i understand gravity can be turned into energy but don't you have to use the same amount of energy as what you get from it if not more, because of friction just to get it back to the next rotation?

I am not a expert at this but how can you get overunity out of something that will never change, like gravity.  And with gravity never changing and friction always slowing it down, if you do the math it just don't add up, 

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #21 on: June 05, 2008, 04:19:13 AM »
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Offline rlortie

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #22 on: June 05, 2008, 05:01:59 AM »
Charlie,

I am not Alex but thought I would pass on my 2 cents worth!

Also, are the linkages of the "imbalancing arm" (aka what the marble is attached to - I don't know what you are calling it) specific or can you play around with them.  I was thinking it might be beneficial to have the arm come around and actually rest on the axial.  Would this be possible or will it throw things off too much - I have drawn what I mean below.

With some designs you can let the weight rest on the axle thus relieving the ascending side of the returning weight. This design does not meet that criteria. Note that be lengthening the arm your red supporting lines are now out of symmetry.  This is going to kill any advantages when it turns 180 degrees. 

Suggest you make a copy of the above original or move it to an editing application where you can blow it up in size.
Keep in mind that it is one of a collection of drawings that do not work as the inventor had hoped. These drawings do not represent Bessler's own work but rather his collection of none-runners. They all need the main driving force that Bessler so kindly left out of his collection.

Ralph   

Offline martinzurix

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #23 on: June 05, 2008, 10:42:58 AM »
to: rlortie

yes gravity have energy gradient  it is stronger to surface and less stronger on highter altitude its like air pressure .

gravity is flow of energy vortex it flows from big bang and make implosion result of this implosion is forming materr -planets-plants -animals


if you want use gravity wheel you need to make one side shielded from it ..  because on each side of wheel energy gradient is equal.

you can`t trick gravity by strange trajectories of weights or different combinations. you need real difference in weights on each sides.

you need one side to rotate against gravity flow .


gravity is implosion force  only known way to defeat it is explosion - all energies in universe have implosion vortex direction.

if Besler get his wheel work in not bee made only with pendelum weight combinatinos... there bee some `elprimo` mover what helped passing  COG !!!


v.shauberger in his book `energy of water`   took about forrel-fish what dont move but stays  against flow , may bee primomover is something like this...

bumble bee make air vortex and area of low pressure what sucked in bees body... something like UFO`s :) koanda effect...

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #23 on: June 05, 2008, 10:42:58 AM »
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Offline Alexioco

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #24 on: June 05, 2008, 02:38:01 PM »
Alexioco, I'd like to build a model of MT 27 like you showed in your video.  It appeared like yours was built out of cardboard - a great idea if you ask me.  What are the dimensions?  You mentioned that the marble weight can't be too much or it won't return the marble to the center, I imagine that this limit is based on the size of the wheel, bigger wheel bigger weight? 

Also, are the linkages of the "imbalancing arm" (aka what the marble is attached to - I don't know what you are calling it) specific or can you play around with them.  I was thinking it might be beneficial to have the arm come around and actually rest on the axial.  Would this be possible or will it throw things off too much - I have drawn what I mean below.

Hello Charlie, thanks for your interest  :)
I have played around with the wheel quite a bit and if you want it to rest on the axle, then the lever will have to be made shorter, if you don't adjust the lever and weight and string correctly the weight will not self lift, once the lever is attached, the end of the lever (where the weight will be attached) needs to be in line with where it is attached but just to the side of the axle.

Here is a computer drawing of my wheel, I copied it from my wheel so you can see how everything is attached and positioned...

Note that the weight does not touch the rim of the wheel, this allows for the weight to pull down on the wheel and to keep pulling down as its guided into the axle...

Its amazing, I have never seen anything like it...

Anyway now a few other things to note...

1. If the weight is to heavy, then it wont lift, why? Because the lever arm itself acts as a tiny weight in order to lift the bigger weight that little help it needs to move it up (unless you start the weight from half way up the wheel then it flies up)

2. If you do add say a 2 ounce weight, then add a 1 ounce weight at the top where the lever is attached, in fact the weight should be able to weigh less than 1 ounce...


3. Finally you can attach the wheel and the weight may lift but you can improve it by messing with it, making slight changes until you have a really effective position where the weight does not just lift up but accelerates up  :D

Offline Alexioco

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #25 on: June 05, 2008, 02:46:58 PM »
Also, ever thought that Besslers wheel may have looked like this?

(http://i26.tinypic.com/2hxqbt1.jpg)

You could play with this combined with some of the other wheels including MT 27 and may have a runner...

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #25 on: June 05, 2008, 02:46:58 PM »
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Offline Charlie_V

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #26 on: June 05, 2008, 03:32:57 PM »
Thanks Alexioco, when I get some time I'll try to build one.  To all the others, yes I realize that this setup alone will not work.  But I believe we need to think outside the wheel - attaching more arms to the inside is futile.  I have an idea I would like to try but I want to experiment with the arm thing first to get a feel for it.

Thanks,
Charlie

Offline Haliburton

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #27 on: June 06, 2008, 03:03:00 AM »
you guys are just wasting your time on this wheel thing.

If you get 1 pound of force going down you need the same amount to go back up

no matter how you put the levers or strings ETC

if you had zero friction then you and make it go forever

until you get rid of friction it will never ever ever change

with all those levers in all your just fooling yourselves

add another element in there, something that is known to create force

then you might get a result worth working on  ;)

Offline AB Hammer

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #28 on: June 06, 2008, 03:38:31 AM »
@Haliburton

Have a little faith. There is magic in the air, and magic in the ground, as you look at something cool the wheel goes round and round.

Offline Haliburton

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Re: Self Rising Weight (MT 27)
« Reply #29 on: June 06, 2008, 04:22:02 AM »
there might be magic in the air and ground, but you sure in hell are not gonna tap in to it with strings and levers.

IT WILL NOT WORK,,,,,, EVER

 

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