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Author Topic: Interesting experiment with an transformer, 2 lamps, diodes and an magnet  (Read 46325 times)

Offline Jdo300

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Hi Markus,

I am a second year electrical engineering student and have access to a lab to do the testing. I have an oscilloscope similar to the one you are using so I can *hopefully* do the power measurements. If not, I can get help to figure out how to do it. The results from this experiment will be very valuable because it is amazing that you are getting that much power back from the back emf spike alone! I will be very interested to try this out and get some objective measurements to compare to yours. If this device is indeed amplifying the kicks, then we have a big part of Steve Mark's device figured out now.

My next set of tests will be to create a rotating magnetic field with iron wires. My theory is that the iron wire wrapped toroidally on his two early designs is part of an oscillator circuit that is triggered by the kicks from the small toroidal transformer on his device. The kicks can then be collected into a capacitor until it fills up and discharges into the oscillator of the circuit to kick it into action. The timing of this cap's discharge can be regulated in his control circuit to have the oscillator ramp up to a certain voltage without burning up the device. But since the inductor of the oscillator is the iron coils, it will create a high frequency rotating magnetic field that will spin past his fine collector wires and produce power! I still have yet to test out this idea but that?s the basic principle in my mind :-D.

God Bless,
Jason O

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Offline GM

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Jason,

...My theory is that the iron wire wrapped toroidally on his two early designs is part of an oscillator circuit that is triggered by the kicks from the small toroidal transformer on his device.

I can't imagine how the wrapped iron wire should looks like.
Do you mean the iron wire is wrapped like the teslawire on my torodial core?
Or would you post a small draft so that I can understand it better?

Thank you in advance.

Groet, Markus

Offline Jdo300

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Hi Markus,

Yes, the iron "bailing wire" that Steve used in his early device appears to have the iron wire wound toroidally, there are four coils around the peremiter of the device so it seems like they could be wound like a two-phase AC motor to create the rotating field.

God Bless,
Jason O

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Offline MeggerMan

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Hi Markus,
Just realised that it was you that did the original experiment - well done.
I too would like to re-create your experiment.
I have all parts needed, except for the CD4093, a very clever use of two diodes to get a variable duty cycle.
My old storage scope does have a digital output though.
In my component box I have a NE555 timer but that will not support a variable duty cycle of 0 to 100% as far as I know.

Did you use copper wire for the windings?
Have you tried it with copper wire?
What is Tesla wire, the only thing I can think of is copper coated iron wire?
Have you tried two magnets: one above and one below the core with like poles facing the core?
This way you should be able to get a neutral flux density in the core centre with it increasing as it gets nearer the windings.

Regards

Rob

Offline GM

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Hello Jason,

...Speaking of which, I want to duplicate your experiment and was wondering if you still have the contact information for the eBay seller that you got the core from. Also, what gauge wire do you have wound on the core?

I am a bit low on time.. so a short answer this time.

The ebay-nickname of the seller of the ferrite cores is "michaelacm". This nick is still active, but he offers no cores on ebay at the moment.

The teslawire I used is 0.3 mm in diameter (*). I wound exactly 42 turns on one half of the core (180 dgr.)
The frequency of the sqarewave generator is around 15.7 KHz and the duty cycle is about 20%
on-time (I guess).

edit: Sorry, the wire is not 0.3 mm in diameter, rather 0.5 or 0.6 mm. Unfortunately I don't have the original reel, so I cant say it for sure. But compared to a well known 0.3mm wire it is thicker

Bye Markus

PS: Regarding my other post you answered ('A vague idea...' in german)... don't try to understand my
earlier drawing in this post. It won't be working. What I meant in my last post is, that I have to think about
to connect two toroid cores (from this current experiment) which feed one another with their kickbacks.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2006, 09:53:25 PM by GM »

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Offline GM

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Hi Rob,

Hi Markus,
Just realised that it was you that did the original experiment - well done.
I too would like to re-create your experiment.
I have all parts needed, except for the CD4093, a very clever use of two diodes to get a variable duty cycle.
My old storage scope does have a digital output though.
In my component box I have a NE555 timer but that will not support a variable duty cycle of 0 to 100% as far as I know.

Thi circuit was not designed by me, so the clever use of the parallel diodes is not my merit(?). :-)

Did you use copper wire for the windings?
Have you tried it with copper wire?
What is Tesla wire, the only thing I can think of is copper coated iron wire?

Teslawire is "copperwire" coated with a thin insulation (in german: Kupferlackdraht).
The exact parameter (except the material of the core) you will find in my last post.

I wish success for your replication. And don'T forget to post your results here. ;-)


Have you tried two magnets: one above and one below the core with like poles facing the core?
This way you should be able to get a neutral flux density in the core centre with it increasing as it gets nearer the windings.

Yes I tried placing two small magnet this way, but nothing suprising was happend. :-)

Markus

Offline PaulLowrance

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Hi Marcus,

I am very interested in building your device as I'm also very interested in unlimited energy solid-state magnetic devices, but first I would like to build your circuit in LTSpice.  I've seen two circuits in this thread, but you've mentioned errors in both. Could you please perhaps post a circuit diagram of one of your devices that you would most recommend to build? I'm interested in your most successful device that you believe produces the most output relative to input power. Or perhaps you already have a link to such a circuit.

Last night I came up with what I think could be breakthrough in how to extract energy from the magnetic material. OK, I give my idea perhaps 30% chance of being error free, but since your device and various others successful magnetic devices seem so similar to my method I was excited to study your device.

I appreciate it!
Paul Lowrance

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Offline PaulLowrance

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I wanted to add that my method has to do with robbing kinetic & potential energy that magnetic moments give when magnetized. When magnetic material is magnetized it *must* give energy to something. It is basic physics that if you take two magnetic moments that are out of alignment and then make then align that you get energy.

So one could ask "Where does this energy go?"  There are several options:

1. Part of the energy goes to potential energy within the magnetic material.
2. Part of the energy goes to thermal energy. How much the magnetic material heats up depends on the materials heat capacity.
3. Part of the energy goes to electromagnetic radiation.

On #3 above you can verify this by wrapping a lot of turns of copper wire around a large piece of hard iron such as a steel nail and connecting it to your speaker amplifier. You will hear popping noises which are avalanches occurring within the hard iron.


Normally the above three forms of energy come from your battery or whatever you're using to magnetize your material. Most of #3 above is converted to #2. And #2 & #1 are converted back into potential energy when the applied magnetic field is removed. This causes the material become colder. So during each cycle it is known that magnetic materials become hotter and then colder.

Materials with high permeability tend to have less #2 and #3 above. Materials such as steel have a lot of #2 and #3.

I need to think more about my method, but so far it seems it will best work with low effective permeability. As example, a typical rod has significantly less effective permeability than a toroid. Also a major requirement is energizing the magnetic material as quickly as possible. Actually you don't want to put too much energy into energizing the material, but the correct amount.

In a nutshell, when you apply a magnetic field to magnetic material then the magnetic material aligns the magnetic moments. When this happens potential energy is being converted to kinetic energy. For example a satellite in Earths orbit has potential energy; i.e., if it falls then it converts that potential energy to kinetic energy. The same applies with magnetic material. When the material is not magnetized then the domains are not aligned, for various reasons such as thermal agitation. This is potential energy. When the domains align then that potential energy is converted to kinetic energy. The opposite also occurs when the applied field is removed; i.e., the magnetic material becomes colder as it converts kinetic energy to potential energy.

Initially it seemed almost impossible to capture that potential energy rather than allow it to go to heat. I have some really possible ideas how it could work.

Any advice is greatly appreciated. So far from what I've read about Marcus device it seems to match my method. For example Marcus mentions high voltage spikes, no?  Marcus, I am wondering about some other matches. For example, is your device more efficient when using rods sa compared to toroids? Also, is your device more efficient with material that is not too high or too low in permeability?

Paul Lowrance

Offline GM

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Hello Paul,

I am very interested in building your device as I'm also very interested in unlimited energy solid-state magnetic devices, but first I would like to build your circuit in LTSpice. 

Do you really expect this effect in a software simulation? Hmm...

I've seen two circuits in this thread, but you've mentioned errors in both. Could you please perhaps post a circuit diagram of one of your devices that you would most recommend to build? I'm interested in your most successful device that you believe produces the most output relative to input power. Or perhaps you already have a link to such a circuit.

Oh damn, you're right! What I actually posted is not the actual circuit I use.

(paint paint paint...)

Okay, I attach the circuit diagram of the generator and setup I use today.
I hope I forgot no details... I would appreciate it, if you post your replication results here
on this forum. ;-)

Your remaining text and your other post I read/answer later, because I want to understand
them correctly. (I should have been more attentive in the english lessons when I was a schoolboy :-/ )

Regards, Markus

Edit 29.08.2006: Sorry again a fix in the circuit draft, the 5 volt IC was absent - it seems I am "the master of forgetfulness"  >:(
« Last Edit: August 29, 2006, 12:58:23 PM by GM »

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Offline starcruiser

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GM,

I was following your experiment and find it intersting. I had a thought, have you tried adding a capacitor in place of the kickback lamp yet? I am thinking this would increase the output and the efficiency perhaps. i would suggest picking a cap value that would drive the coil into resonance (primary side) and amplify the kicks even more, what do you think? You would need an inductance meter to determine the coils inductance to assit you in selecting the correct cap value though.

Carl

Offline PaulLowrance

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Markus,

Did I spell your name correct this time.  :)

Thanks for posting the circuit. I wanted to study it to see if it fits or contradicts my theory. Actually the more I dive into the theory the more details it reveals as to exactly what should I do. So I'll use LTSpice to build my circuit and see what happens. If nothing interesting then I'll be glad to build your circuit.

Basically the theory suggests that the amount of kinetic energy converted from magnetic potential energy is relative to switching speed. I won't bore you with the details. Since the amount of energy generated from the magnetic potential remains constant and less energy is converted to thermal, then the energy must go somewhere. In this case it should go to electromagnetic radiation. The only trick I have not thought much about is exactly how I am going capture the radiation. Wires going to something like a florescent bulb could capture most of the energy, but how would we efficiently capture the photons and covert to electricity? BTW, that brings up another question. What type of bulb are you using?

Paul Lowrance

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Offline PaulLowrance

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Markus,

By small chance you don't know anyone near by that has access to a thermal camera do you?  Boy I sure would love to see your ferrite rod before and then during run time!

If not then is there any chance you could talk to some of the professors at a nearby college that might be interested in viewing your device through their FIR camera. BTW, please note that the type of camera you would need is a FIR (Far Infrared Radiation) Camera. Preferably somewhere between 5 and 50 THz.

Paul Lowrance

Offline Jdo300

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Hi Markus,

I attached a picture of the two toroidal cores I got today. After studying your circuit diagram, I am curious to know if you are actually sending back emf spikes to that bulb on the primary side of the toroid. I see how you have the two diodes on the incoming side of the circuit positioned to only let the power come into the coil but not surge back into the source. But where I am confused is about that second diode on the line going to the bulb. I can see that it clearly blocks the current from the source from surging into the bulb, but when the back emf spike rushes backwards through the circuit towards the source, it seems like that current would still not go into the bulb because it is trying to go backwards. Perhaps I am looking at this the wrong way but it seems more like the spikes are charging the magnetic field of the toroid and after the spike shuts off, the current continues to flow in one direction since your diode is only allowing a one-way flow of the current. Now, if my thinking is way off, could you or someone else here explain to me what is really happening?

God Bless,
Jason O

P.S. Where did you get your Tesla wire from?

Offline z_p_e

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Jason,

The back or cemf spike created in the primary after the input pulse goes to zero, will reverse polarity in reference to the initial input pulse. As the input coil is being energized, the top of the toroid is positive wrt the bottom. When the input pulse goes low, the coil will kick back in reverse, and the bottom of the toroid will be positive wrt the top, and hence the cemf spike can energize the bulb. During the reversal, a new ISOLATED circuit is formed by the input coil, the bulb, and its series diode.

z_p_e

Offline GM

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z_p_e,

thank you for explaining this.  :)

@Jason: I took the teslawire out of my wire-box.  ;) - Okay, no kidding... I bought it long time ago. I think at "conrad"
(electronic shop).

@Paul: Yes, now you spell my name correctly, but wrong spelled names are mostly not so important. ;)
Unfortunartely I don't have access to a FIR camera. I am not a student or something else, and my all all-day-job have
nothing to do with electronics. In the far past I had a training as an electrican assistent, but since I have a job with
no relation to electronic topics. So I think I would have no chance to meet someone with such a camera.
Please keep in mind, on one hand I am much intersted in the free energy topic and I have a small, basic skill in the principles
of electrical engineering, but on the other hand I am still a normal man with limited opportunities (like "the boy next door").

If you have the right conditions to do all these further tests, I would be very happy if you could do this test with
my circuit (resp. your replication of it) and share your results.

I will do some tests on weekend using thinner wire but with more turns on the same core as in the last experiment.

Regards Markus

btw. If I spell some sentences or phrases wrong, please feel free to correct me if you want. I will not
comprehend this as a "slight"(?). :)

 

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