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Author Topic: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS  (Read 74663 times)

Offline gyulasun

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #75 on: May 22, 2008, 12:37:21 PM »
Hi Gyula
Thanks for that,I was thinking maybe simple points of some sort would be less expensive energy wise,what do you think?
happy hunting
peter

Peter,  I am puzzled by what you mean above,  I have included everything in my previous few posts I could to make it for you less expensive energy wise. Ask definite questions if you have any.

Gyula

Offline gyulasun

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #76 on: May 22, 2008, 03:02:58 PM »
poynt99, actually it doesn't.

 It has two coils and only use's one pole from each coil.

Hi nightlife,

Respectfully I disagree.  Both poles get utilized from each coil: when they are energized the left side of coil 22a helps block flux from North pole of the stator magnet and the right side of coil 22a repels out the South pole of the rotor magnet .  Coil 22b does the same task but with reversed polarity wrt coil 22a.
Here is some text from his patent the Figure above referred to belongs to:
What distinguishes this motor generator from all others in the art is the presence
of a permanent magnet connecting the two conducting bars which transfer magnetic energy through the pole pieces to the rotor, thereby attracting the rotor between the pole pieces. With the rotor attracted in between the two pole pieces, the coils switch the polarity of the magnetic field of the pole pieces so that the rotor is repelled out.
Therefore there is no current and voltage being used to attract the rotor. The only current being used is the repulsion of the rotor between the two conductive bar pole pieces thereby requiring only a small amount of current to repel the rotor. This is known as a regauging system and allows the capturing of available back EMF energy for use.

it's been said here that Bedini never utilized both poles

doesn't this patent look like both poles are being used?

Poynt99,  Bedini did not utilize both poles in case of the school girl (SG) and simplified school girl (SSG) motors, and the patent you showed he did. This is what I think.

Regards,
Gyula

Offline poynt99

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #77 on: May 23, 2008, 02:41:24 PM »
poynt99, actually it doesn't.

 It has two coils and only use's one pole from each coil.

the coils, magnet and pole pieces constitute one continuous magnet, just like a horseshoe magnet, and both poles of it are being used. The coils allow for switching.

Offline LarryC

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #78 on: May 23, 2008, 11:04:18 PM »
@gotoluc,

Before Thane's thread, I was developing an easy build version of Jack Hilden-Brandt magnet switching motor. My versions used the same shaded pole motor, cut up similar to what you did, except it would have required 3 shaded pole motors to get it fully working. Your Z rotor design is better. But the magnet switching setup that I used can easily be added to your unit and would increase the power by 3 to 4 times, and also the coil kickback.


The motor with magnets picture, has completely lifted the weight hooked to the fan and the rotor is completely in the air gap.

The motor without magnets picture, shows it cannot lift the weight at all.

On the motor closeup, you can see that I have an iron washer between the stator lamination and the 1" X 1/4" neo. This is to cut down the over saturation. The rest of the steel is just to complete the flux path, it doesn't have to be pretty or lamination, just a path to stop flux jumping to the stator.

The magnet are stuck N on one side of the stator and S on the other. When the coil is not energized all the flux goes thru the stator under the coil. When the coil is energized in the same N S as the stator, both the coil flux and the magnet flux is forced thru the rotor, and both kickback when released. The force formula is Flux squared. So double the flux and you get 4 times the force.

I hope you can set this up, as it would be very interesting to see the results on your electronics.

Anyone wanting to review some well done charts and statistics on a magnet switching device can check out patent 6369479. The motor is currently being built in Japan for motorcycles.

Regards,
Larry

Offline petersone

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #79 on: May 24, 2008, 12:38:29 AM »
Hi Gyula
Sorry if you were confused,I will be trying your ideas for the switch,thanks for that,VERY usefull, but was interested in your views on mechanical switches,zero resistance,maybe,but some drag on the motor.
Ihave it running at the moment on carbon brushes and an old comutater,but it's using over 50% of my energy,ok for playing with.
thanks again.
happy hunting.
peter

Offline gotoluc

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #80 on: May 24, 2008, 08:25:56 PM »
@gotoluc,

Before Thane's thread, I was developing an easy build version of Jack Hilden-Brandt magnet switching motor. My versions used the same shaded pole motor, cut up similar to what you did, except it would have required 3 shaded pole motors to get it fully working. Your Z rotor design is better. But the magnet switching setup that I used can easily be added to your unit and would increase the power by 3 to 4 times, and also the coil kickback.


The motor with magnets picture, has completely lifted the weight hooked to the fan and the rotor is completely in the air gap.

The motor without magnets picture, shows it cannot lift the weight at all.

On the motor closeup, you can see that I have an iron washer between the stator lamination and the 1" X 1/4" neo. This is to cut down the over saturation. The rest of the steel is just to complete the flux path, it doesn't have to be pretty or lamination, just a path to stop flux jumping to the stator.

The magnet are stuck N on one side of the stator and S on the other. When the coil is not energized all the flux goes thru the stator under the coil. When the coil is energized in the same N S as the stator, both the coil flux and the magnet flux is forced thru the rotor, and both kickback when released. The force formula is Flux squared. So double the flux and you get 4 times the force.

I hope you can set this up, as it would be very interesting to see the results on your electronics.

Anyone wanting to review some well done charts and statistics on a magnet switching device can check out patent 6369479. The motor is currently being built in Japan for motorcycles.

Regards,
Larry

Hi Larry,

thanks for sharing your project. That is so cool that you have done something so similar as I have. I will look into your design and see how well it would work in my design. Do you have Skype in case I have questions. If so you can pm me your username.

Thanks

Luc

Offline LarryC

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #81 on: May 24, 2008, 10:10:51 PM »
Hi Larry,

thanks for sharing your project. That is so cool that you have done something so similar as I have. I will look into your design and see how well it would work in my design. Do you have Skype in case I have questions. If so you can pm me your username.

Thanks

Luc

Hi Luc,

Sorry, no Skype, but I do have free long distance from the US to Canada. So you can pm me with your phone number if you want me to call.

The main problems with all these magnet switching devices is keeping the saturation problem down, by adjusting the magnet flux and the power to the best level.

If you look at the graph, FIG. 26 on the patent (6369479), it shows the SEPARATING FORCE at different CURRENT level for the electormagnet along and 5 different magnet thicknesses plus the EM. The cross section of the devices lamination is 10MM X 15MM.

Some results are very interesting. At the .4 amp level the EM's force along is 10KG and with the 5MM thick neo it is almost 40KG (4X). And as the amps go up the force curve starts to level out. Also, the smallest and the largest neos have the least benefit.

My design is a different from the patent or JackH's, but all of the magnet switching device are just getting that smart magnet to change to another path of least resistance and getting your EM flux to go along for the ride. So if you can't put a magnet in the middle, put it on the outside, small neos are cheap.

Regards,
Larry

PS: I use www.google.com/patents for US patents.

Offline gotoluc

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #82 on: May 27, 2008, 07:44:04 AM »
Hi All,

Please find an updated video of my Dual Pole Single Coil motor test 3, which now has a new commutator. In this test I am also collecting the Back EMF and showing it has usable power.

See it here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_uP2DDTLFQ

Stay tuned for more.

Luc

Offline gotoluc

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #83 on: May 27, 2008, 03:32:24 PM »
Hi All,

THIS IS A MUST SEE

Here is a Youtube  link of  a guy that just got in touch with me since I posted test 3 of my motor.
He is getting an interesting effect using a loose magnet inside a plastic container that he inserts in a air coil.
However I don't understand his language? Stefan can you please look at this and see if you know his language.

Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUBf-zoV9Tg

and here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOrx_yGKIQ8&feature=related

Luc

Offline petersone

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #84 on: May 30, 2008, 12:59:33 PM »
Hi Gyula
could you sugest a value of cap.C1,I'm building the the trigger you kindly suggested.Thank again.
happy hunting
peter

Offline gyulasun

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #85 on: May 30, 2008, 03:06:48 PM »
Hi Gyula
could you sugest a value of cap.C1,I'm building the the trigger you kindly suggested.Thank again.
happy hunting
peter

Hi Peter,

Yes, the value for C1 can be any value from 4.7 or 10uF and higher up to even ten times as many.  Think of it as a normal puffer capacitor in a power supply, it all depends on how heavy load you connect across it. The heavier the load, the higher value capacitor would be needed, up to the recharging capabilities of the flyback pulse as the source of energy. 
However the voltage rating of the capacitor is important: heavily depends on the how heavy the load is. Say you connect a 10uF cap for C1 without any load across it, then you need at least a 350V working voltage rated capacitor!  And when you connect a 1000uF cap for C1, at least a 160-200V working voltage is needed, when this cap is unloaded.
In case you connect a 12V battery for charging it from the flyback pulse, C1 is not needed at all.

Notice:  Try to avoid operation without a load because in an unloaded case the flyback pulse can easily exceed the breakdown voltage of  your switching MOSFET and it may fry.  The expected amplitude of the pulse depends linearly on your coils inductance and on the amount of the current-change and inversely on the switching speed, the known formula is L*(di/dt). And when you wish to disconnect the load (be it a charged battery or a lamp etc) it is a good habit to switch off your circuit first.  Unless you are using a switching MOSFET with 600-800V drain source voltage ratings...   I recommended at least a 200V MOSFET in my earlier post, a good compromise between low switch-on drain source resistance (0.082 Ohm) and price. A 600V device with under a half Ohm ON resistance costs 3-4 times as much at least...

rgds, Gyula

Offline petersone

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #86 on: May 30, 2008, 08:51:41 PM »
Hi Gyula
            Thank you very much for your VERY comprehensive reply,I ordered a few fets today,I hope I get it going before I blow up the last one,I'm trying to understand the point of all these pulse motors,it seems just to harvest as much flyback as possible,would it not be just as easy to pulse a coil,and not have all these bit of iron flying round!! there not a lot a toque it seems,I must be missing something.
Thanks again.
happy hunting
peter

Offline gyulasun

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #87 on: May 31, 2008, 12:31:43 AM »
Hi Gyula
            Thank you very much for your VERY comprehensive reply,I ordered a few fets today,I hope I get it going before I blow up the last one,I'm trying to understand the point of all these pulse motors,it seems just to harvest as much flyback as possible,would it not be just as easy to pulse a coil,and not have all these bit of iron flying round!! there not a lot a toque it seems,I must be missing something.
Thanks again.
happy hunting
peter


Hi Peter,

My understanding on such pulse motors is that torque fully depends on the strength of the electromagnets (and if a design has it then on that of the permanent magnets).  And do not forget that the facing surface areas on the rotor and stator are also important, it matters how much surface areas are involved during attraction or repulsion.
Have a look at Lindemann attraction motor description here http://www.free-energy.ws/electric-motor-secrets/attraction-motor.html  and see his text: The stator pole faces describe 30 degrees of arc. Each rotor cross bar face also describes 30 degrees of arc.   (His example rotor consists of two cast iron cross bars.)
And the rotor - stator air gap involved is also important, he recommends less than 0.1mm gap for possible overunity...

So you see, capturing the flyback pulse is only one aspect of the game...

rgds,  Gyula

Offline petersone

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #88 on: May 31, 2008, 12:37:04 AM »
Hi Gyula
I take your point,I think I'm trying to avoid having to machine to the accuracy of a Nat's kneecap!!
happy hunting.
peter

Offline powercat

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Re: FREE ENERGY USING MAGNETS
« Reply #89 on: May 31, 2008, 01:53:18 AM »
Something of interest from Montana state uny

   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVOdX8ZzYuU&feature=related

 Cart on an air track using just magnets and a MATLAB program

pc