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Author Topic: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing  (Read 12410 times)

jikwan

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bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« on: May 07, 2008, 06:05:36 PM »
for me eighty quid both ways    i got to think about it
but i can feel your energy enthusiasm through the screen
dont worry bout the mot   those guys dont have much to do with the engine
its easily concealed

Bulbz

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2008, 07:53:38 PM »
I have an idea for separating the HHO into the 2 separate gasses Hydrogen and Oxygen.

[EDIT] I'm not sure if this would work, but the idea behind it is... Hydrogen has a positive charge, and Oxygen has a negative charge, am I correct ?. Would it be true to say that once the HHO has been cracked, the two gasses should flow through the water to the 2 oppositely charged guides ?. [/EDIT]

[DOUBLE EDIT] OOPS !... Almost forgot something. Those dots near the top of the water, are stainless steel gauses, that are connected to the gas guides.[/DOUBLE EDIT]

Bulbz

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2008, 08:25:56 PM »
I was also thinking about using vacuum in one of my designs,. As I have noticed in some of the YouTube videos, the lowered pressure in the upper chamber, does seem to make the bubbles break away from the electrodes faster and allowing more contact between the water and electrodes.

Mr.Entropy

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2008, 08:45:06 PM »
Hydrogen has a positive charge, and Oxygen has a negative charge, am I correct ?.
Not in gaseous form, no.  Hydrogen is lighter than oxygen, though, so you could separate them with a centrifuge.
Hydrogen also a has lower melting and boiling points, so you could separate them by refrigeration.

ResinRat2

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2008, 08:55:04 PM »
Hi Bulbz,

I wish it were that simple, but the hydrogen and oxygen atoms combine at their respective electrodes and form hydrogen and oxygen molecules. In this case it would be hydrogen (H2) and oxygen(O2) gases. The gases are electrically neutral and would not be separated by electrical charges.

Feynman

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2008, 10:42:07 PM »

I think the vacuum idea might work .

Bulbz

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2008, 12:39:04 AM »
Hey jikwan !...

When you say vacuum, do you mean something like this ?.

Bulbz

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #7 on: May 08, 2008, 12:42:58 AM »
Hi Bulbz,

I wish it were that simple, but the hydrogen and oxygen atoms combine at their respective electrodes and form hydrogen and oxygen molecules. In this case it would be hydrogen (H2) and oxygen(O2) gases. The gases are electrically neutral and would not be separated by electrical charges.

So I assume that is why neo-magnets have no effect on the HHO bubbles !.

It's a shame though, coz separating the hydrogen from the oxygen would make it far easier to make the engine run without petrol. It could eliminate the need for timing modification.

exxcomm0n

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #8 on: May 08, 2008, 01:28:45 AM »
Yes it is possible to separate the gases.

But you have to isolate the electrodes which severely limits the gas production.

From what I've learned/seen the closer the polarities are, the more gas production happens. This is NOT an absolute! It's just what I've seen so far and other experimenters on YouTube describe as well.

Also, the rate at which hydrogen burns is MUCH faster than vaporized gasoline/petrol. Gasoline engines actually spark the spark plug before TDC (top dead center. the point where the piston stops going up and starts going down) because gas is slow to burn.

H2 or HHO (in sufficient quantity) would need the timing advanced so that spark happened @ TDC or sometime AFTER it so the explosion would not be working against the mechanics.

Keep experimenting!! :D

<See drawing> This is the experiment setup that hydrolysis was shown to me in H.S. chemistry.

Bulbz

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #9 on: May 08, 2008, 01:39:30 AM »
Yes it is possible to separate the gases.

But you have to isolate the electrodes which severely limits the gas production.

From what I've learned/seen the closer the polarities are, the more gas production happens. This is NOT an absolute! It's just what I've seen so far and other experimenters on YouTube describe as well.

Also, the rate at which hydrogen burns is MUCH faster than vaporized gasoline/petrol. Gasoline engines actually spark the spark plug before TDC (top dead center. the point where the piston stops going up and starts going down) because gas is slow to burn.

H2 or HHO (in sufficient quantity) would need the timing advanced so that spark happened @ TDC or sometime AFTER it so the explosion would not be working against the mechanics.

Keep experimenting!! :D

<See drawing> This is the experiment setup that hydrolysis was shown to me in H.S. chemistry.


Hmmm. I tried that one years ago, and seeing a significant amount of gasses was slower than the drying rate of paint. I suppose it could be practical if a few thousand volts were pulsed though it though.

jikwan

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #10 on: May 08, 2008, 01:55:18 AM »
bulbz
you make some very nice pictures!
what kind of software/programme  you use?

why the need to seperate the oxygen?
there are 3 main views/theories about oxygen presence in the actual combustion chamber

1 the more the oxygen the more the rust (to valves+piston rings plus of course exhaust pipe
and silencer)

2 ive come across views saying "hho? no problem-nothing will deteriorate"

3 we NEED oxygen to help burn the hydrogen
how can you burn hydrogen without oxygen?

my (actually joe xogens) idea about vacuum electroysis is using the engine's vacuum
from inlet manifold     very VERY powerful suction


your picture about the little fan---i posted the idea a few weeks ago on this site
hell if im going to dig it up

the idea was.............get a fairly high powered cell going (on the bench) and wire a fan to it
just a low powered (encased) belt driven fan
there you get vacuum
because its belt driven.............theres no posibility of electrical ignition to hho

jikwan

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #11 on: May 08, 2008, 01:59:08 AM »
bulbz
man! wered you get the idea no timing adjustments necessary?

ITS CRITICAL no way can you avoid it

hho ignites very fast compared to petrol/gasoline

Bulbz

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #12 on: May 08, 2008, 02:08:34 AM »
jikwan...

I used good-old trusty MS Paint to do those pictures  ;D.

The reason I was looking for a way of separating the gasses, was so that the hydrogen can be mixed with normal air, just like a petrol.

I was thinking about how quickly HHO combusts, due to it being a perfect mixture. I thought that maybe, just hydrogen could be fed to the air intake and because it would be a less than perfect mix, I was kind of hoping that this could be a way of slowing down the burn rate. If this can be achieved, it would eliminate the need for timing adjustment, and would make it far easier for the conversion of cars with fuel injection systems, especially the ones that have no distributor.

But all of the above assumes a water fuel cell that could produce enough gas to run an engine exlusively on water alone, so that we could tell the oil companies to shove their fuel where the sun don't shine  :D.

Bulbz

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #13 on: May 08, 2008, 02:10:51 AM »
bulbz
man! wered you get the idea no timing adjustments necessary?

ITS CRITICAL no way can you avoid it

Would your design produce enough HHO to power the engine exclusively without petrol ?.

[EDIT] I have had people asking me if the above question is possible [/EDIT]

Bulbz

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Re: bulbz possible hho project and it could be nothing
« Reply #14 on: May 08, 2008, 02:17:09 AM »
jikwan... I sent you a PM.  ;)