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Author Topic: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack  (Read 6464 times)

jratcliff

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Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« on: April 30, 2008, 12:16:03 AM »
Let?s all cut Archer Quinn some slack.  He said he would make an announcement on June 20th, so let us show some patience and wait until June the 20th.

I don?t necessarily agree with how Archer has decided to unveil his invention; as it seems to me he is doing things a bit backwards.  Nevertheless I applaud his attitude about the whole affair and his participation and candor.

I was trying to imagine a laundry list of the pros and cons about Archer Quinn?s announcement and it kind of falls out like this:

Con:  He claims that he once had a working device but destroyed it (http://freeenergytruth.blogspot.com/2008/04/free-energy-on-june-20th-fe-truth-world.html)

         He then claims that a small machine is simply ?a toy?. 

        There are a few problems with this.  First of all any perpetual motion machine; be it large, small, crude, or sophisticated, represents an earth shattering breakthrough for the world.

       A perpetual motion machine has to be no more than 0.0000001% over-unity in a completely closed system to be able to change the world. 

      In this regard toys are good things indeed.  A toy that can be easily replicated and shared across the world and community at large would be profound. 

      While I agree with Archer that an overunity PMM capable of producing usable power is of incredible value, I disagree that a ?toy? is pointless.

      Those who hang around the PMM community lose sight of the fact that still today there is not a single repro case of any machine in any form that can be easily demonstrated and distributed.  This would do more to change the minds of the world than any number of YouTube videos or web based dissertations.

Con:  If Archer had a working device, why did he destroy it?  That makes no real logical sense.  Why would he destroy his only working reference model?   If he wants to communicate this principle to the world why would he destroy his best and only case for it?  Wouldn?t a toy be much easier to demonstrate and replicate?  He didn?t even do the minimum of showing photographs and YouTube videos of the alleged device.

These are two pretty big items in the ?con? column. 

Now, let us go to the ?pro? column if you will.

Pro:  Archer?s passion about the topic is inspiring.  His claim that he intends to release this for free to the world is a noble one, and deserves applause for that sentiment alone.

One of the most annoying aspects of PMM mythology are those who claim to have a working device but refuse to share it with the world.  This is probably the most selfish attitude possible.  It's like having a giant hoard of food, while surrounded by starving people, yet you refuse to share without getting paid.

This goes far beyond a matter of wealth; this is a fundamental moral issue.  If you were in possession of an actual over-unity device it would be a crime against humanity and the planet to hold it in secrecy. 

Pro:  For all of the time, effort, intellect, and industry invested in PMM inventions over the past few centuries, to date, there is not one single material result.  In fact, the only measurable affect of PMM efforts is how it has shaped our mythology.  These make great stories and, let us be honest, the stories are most of the actual enjoyment we get out of any of this stuff anyway since, after all, none of these machines ever actually work.

For this reason I applaud Archer Quinn for adding to that mythology and creating an interesting story-line that we will all now get to follow.  I can wait until June 20th, and then I can wait some more after that.  We all know that if he, or anyone else, ever succeeds in creating a true open-source (and easily replicable) over-unity device (toy or not) the world will change forever and the person who delivered us from ourselves will be held in the greatest esteem and find their place in history.



Bobbotov

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2008, 12:47:57 AM »
>Archer?s passion about the topic is inspiring.

I think the term is manic. The guy is a certifiable fruitcake and I cannot see how all the fruitcakes in the world can help our energy crisis no matter how sincere they may appear. The problem is signal to noise ratio. Free energy has had nothing but a history of noise with no signal. To give credence to more noise with the caveat that people should cut him some slack is inviting wackos to procreate. There is no free energy in this universe that has been realized and the odds against finding it on a level sufficient for human use is astronomic. You would have a better chance of getting a royal flush sixteen times in a row. Perhaps not impossible just highly improbable.

exxcomm0n

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2008, 01:06:25 AM »
@ Bobbotov

Hey bud,

So why are you here anyway?

The entire concept of this site seems to mean members have a sneaking suspicion that energy doesn't stop at electrical or nuclear and we need to learn and discover.

If you came to laugh and point, it's been so noted and rest assured we're used to it.

No one beleived Ben Franklin could capture the fingers of the aether (lightning/electricity).
No one believed Wilber and Orville could fly.
No one beleived a patent clerk from Austria could slam particles you couldn't see together and generate energy equal to a portion of the sun even momentarily.

Until they did.

What did you do today?

fletcher

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2008, 01:11:39 AM »
20 June 08 isn't too long to wait [plus a few days contingency ?] - people will keep us informed if the blog updates fizzle out & the build pictures dry up, so as long as there is still obvious progress being made towards his goal I can be patient & charitable of mind.

I'd like to see just one come thru !

Bobbotov

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2008, 01:27:29 AM »
>If you came to laugh and point, it's been so noted and rest assured we're used to it.

Yes, and everyone but a child said the Emperor had no clothes on. If you cannot separate the wheat from the chaff it is your problem. Considering the fact that I am a champion of technology having worked with it for over thirty years I do have a distinct crap detector for Woo. The problem is that if people cannot discern anymore then the problems facing the world will be at the mercy of every crackpot with a hair brain scheme to provide false hope. Please tell me what value this has? And obviously you cannot tell the difference between real science and Woo. Archer has never held a job for longer than two months. His website has some of the craziest rants going. Did Einstein, the Wright brothers and Franklin spout wacko rants?

What did I do today? I planted a vegetable garden. But this cuts both ways. What did you do today to invent "free energy?"

exxcomm0n

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2008, 02:24:15 AM »
Fair 'nuff.

I thought and played with computers.
What's the going rate on that?

The playing with computers I get paid well for. The thought I see as of enormous importance to me.

You obviously value your thoughts enough to post them here, so did I.

The value of listening to "every crackpot out there" is that I listened to form an opinion, evaluated all the points, and formed my opinion from what I thought vs. what I was told.

Like a child in front of a naked emporer.

Tesla was finally historically seen as a "kook", but you wouldn't be able to use an electrical appliance without his brilliance and A/C current.

I'm no better than you, just different.

I did nothing to create or discover "free" energy, but I discovered through some experiences of others how not to.
Like Edison finding out how not to make the filament for a light bulb.
That poor guy didn't seem to make it far, did he?

But he didn't have the internet to expound upon and share concepts either, did he?

jratcliff

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2008, 07:46:11 AM »
To be fair, I want to make clear what are my own personal interests in PMM.  What draws me to this topic is the mythology itself.  I used to follow UFO myth for a while, but I got bored with it eventually.  After enough time and consideration I finally came to the conclusion that UFOs are real and that until the jack-asses flying the UFOs stop flitting about the shadows, I won't let them bother me any more than I bother them.

I did look into conspiracy theories for a while, until I concluded that even though conspiracies do in fact exist (as Robert Anton Wilson pointed out, it is part of our natural primate psychology), it doesn't change the rules of evidence.  That is to say that once you fall into the trap of treating a lack of evidence as proof for the existence of something, you have fallen so far down a rabbit hole that you put your rational mind at risk.

What fascinates me the most, personally, is why anyone believes anything that they do.  Whether it is UFOs, conspiracy theories, Scientology, Mormonism, Catholicism, or perpetual motion machines.

I never cease to be amazed at the processes that lead individuals to adopt, adapt, and shape their own personal reality labyrinths.

Right now Archer Quinn is presenting an entertaining piece of mythology.  As his story unfolds it will continue to entertain and amuse those of us who frequent this forum.  There is nothing to be gained by calling him a fraud or a lunatic at this point.  We might scare him away and, thus, lose the delightful story that is sure to unfold.

Remember the 'Joe Cell', 'Stanley Meyer', or those guys who got all excited about the Hale Boppe comet?  Let the story unfold, watch it develop in real-time on our forums.  Let members attempt to replicate his device and wait, with baited breath, for stories of men-in-black who so frighten and disturb our reluctant hero that he destroys his device and repudiates all claims.

Let this fable run its course and wind its way into PMM mythological history.

For those of us who don't actually bother to build any of these machines, it is the story itself that is the reward.

Leave my Archer Quinn alone, I want to hear the rest of his tale as I am sure it will be an entertaining one.

John W. Ratcliff
http://jratcliffscarab.blogspot.com/
 

helmut

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2008, 09:06:41 AM »
It was just a matter of time,that the neysayers come here and try to disturb the freedom of
a community.

Here and now,there are useless.
Useless ,as some Person in a Hospitalroom beside a bed,
where a child will come out of mothers loaf.
cry out loud : it is death it is death,  while one can see some of babys hair and not more.
Such people are useless and not welcome,because there only interest is to do some Crucifixion.

They came here
Name her thread after a Inventor just like Lable on a coffin.
That is in my sight absolutly against the philosophy of this Forum.

That`s the Moment,when i ask Stefan to do a whise step.

helmut


Bobbotov

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #8 on: April 30, 2008, 01:59:09 PM »
>We might scare him away and, thus, lose the delightful story that is sure to unfold.

I seriously doubt that. He is an egomaniac desperate for attention and usually those types do not go away quietly until they have satisfied their egos. This guy comes across like Jeffery Goines from Twelve Monkeys.

I agree with the other things you wrote and I too am amazed at the depth of belief people have with so little impetus to do so. No one has ever convinced me that believing in anything is a good thing. Knowledge, yes, but not belief. Either you know or you don't. Knowledge is black and white, belief is one vast gray sea that has no boundaries, no form, no substance. Like smoke. Just add mirrors to reflect whatever you want. And usually the reflection is ourselves.

The issue I see though is that we do not need mythology to solve our problems. Our problems are real and if we wait for the "Gods"  or other Myths to solve them we are sure to wait in vain until it is too late. If there were a tornado coming and you were trying to gather everyone into the storm cellar but they were sitting around enraptured by a guy who was telling them that the Plaideans had placed a impenetrable shield around them to protect them what would you do? Let them die? There is an Arabic saying that goes, "trust in Allah but tie up your camel." Meaning, you are better off hedging your bets and while believing in something make sure you do the pragmatic thing and cover your ass just in case.

Most people do not have the ability to handle hard science. It is not as accessible as a Myth. It follows rules, it requires math and extreme powers of observation, hard work and diligent documentation. Myths are easy, require no math and have no rules. They can be whatever you want them to be except real.

AB Hammer

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #9 on: April 30, 2008, 11:36:07 PM »
I myself am looking forward to June 20th  ;D

oak

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #10 on: April 30, 2008, 11:46:00 PM »
Leave Archer alone.

ramset

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #11 on: May 01, 2008, 01:36:10 AM »
P  where /what is =8d ?     Chet

scraven

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #12 on: May 05, 2008, 01:03:39 PM »
ummm. 2 hours ago he "released" "it"
http://www.surphzup.com/gpage3.htm
I guess the weight of the sky falling in got too much

ResinRat2

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #13 on: May 05, 2008, 04:30:41 PM »
Just go to http://www.surphzup.com

follow the construction link.

am1ll3r

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Re: Come on, let's cut Archer Quinn some slack
« Reply #14 on: May 05, 2008, 04:32:26 PM »
http://www.surphzup.com/gpage3.html

for some reason the link in that post does not work.  :)