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Author Topic: I don't want to sound like a jerk...  (Read 46164 times)

Offline step1988

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I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« on: August 28, 2005, 01:23:18 AM »
but most of this stuff is laughable. Are there better ways to get energy, absolutaly, but overunity or even perpetual motion will never work. It's just a dream that everyone wishes were true, but alas cannot be.

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Offline joegatt

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2005, 09:36:32 PM »
No!
An air-conditioner working in heating mode is an example of an effective and highly useful case of overunity. Note that when we say overunity we are refering to Coefficient Of Performance (COP), not to efficiency.  You can, for instance, get 9kW of heating by running a 3kW air-conditioner. This is not to say you are getting energy from nowhere. The heat pump is simply pumping heat from the outside into your air-conditioned space.

Overunity systems, therefore, use up some input energy to tap even more energy from a source which would otherwise not be easily available. Unfortunately there are many attempts which try to tap into Zero Point Energy. But, as mainstream science points out, no one seem to know how to do this effectively.

Perpetual motion, on the other hand, is virtualy impossible to achieve on the macroscopic scale because the slightest inefficiency in the system will eventually drain all the energy away.  Also, beyond pure scientific interest, there isn't much point in setting up a process from which you cannot obtain energy to do work.  We can simply witness perpetual motion in some highly specialized instances, like, for example, the current flowing in a superconducting coil magnet. Similarly, the motion of an electron around an atomic nucleus can also be regarded as a true case of perpetual motion.

Regards
Joseph


Offline Elvis Oswald

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2006, 06:33:42 AM »
Joe,

I'm afraid step is right.  You said yourself that the air conditioner is moving heated air into the space.  That air was heated by something.  This is not overunity.

Simply put - there is no 'overunity'.  Any energy used was created somewhere by something.

I am hoping this forum will become something helpful.  I thought at first it would be a great place to interact with people who have more experience and education than me.  But... most of the people here are too busy trying to back-engineer some device that hasn't even proven itself worthy of it.
So in a way - I agree with step.  But... I think as long as it's a post proposing an idea - even if it's shot down later - it's worthy.  What's not worthy are the posts that cause people to get obsessed on soemthing that doesn't work - just because they have a box and a bunch of wires.

Here's my example. 

Telsa powered a car with a box of wire and tubes.  He said he was amplifying energy from the atmosphere.  You see that power everytime the wind blows.
If I posted something about what kind of antenna you'd need (which I did) and tried to stimulate a conversation about what kind of oscillator and amplifier you'd need to produce power... I'd get no response (which I didn't)
BUT... if I put some small calculator batteries in a box and showed 60v on a voltmeter... and then teased everyone along with hints at resonating frequencies and vortex magnetic fields and bullshit like that... I'd have half this damn forum getting blisters on their tricorder finger from pressing keys on their HPs.

So yeah - it's not so hard to see that there is 98% bullshit here.  But not all bullshit is bad. Just the bullshit that consumes more time than it's worth.
Maybe the people who think their bullshit doesn't stink will soon figure out that they are standing in a pile of shit.  Then maybe they will learn to smell first.  :)  If it smells like shit - you've only had to smell it.  We will sniff more this way and we will find the real shit sooner!

Peace!

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2006, 06:33:42 AM »
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Offline robur

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2006, 11:18:03 PM »

If you think this is all bulls**-then why are you still here? ???

Offline Elvis Oswald

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2006, 12:13:58 AM »
I didn't say it was all bullshit.  That's why. :)

And I also qualified myself by saying that all bullshit is not bad.

But... apparently - my colorful language has (again) caused a misunderstanding.

No one has invented free energy.  Right?  That's why most people should be here - to bounce ideas around and to present data for others to confirm.
That's why topics discussing a theory should be busy.  Someone say's "hey - what about this?"  and people reply with their own experiences... or theories why it would not work - or why it would work. That should develop - if warranted - into a working device... OR - it will simply not work at some point.

My main complaint was about the people who post to say they have a device that produces free energy, or overunity.
What's the point?
If you have it working - either post the complete plans... or just bring the device to market. 
« Last Edit: February 26, 2006, 12:54:35 AM by Elvis Oswald »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2006, 12:13:58 AM »
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Offline robur

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #5 on: February 26, 2006, 09:03:01 PM »


How can you be so stupid? Bring device to market. Are you totaly crazy or what/. Do you really think that oil/gas companyes will allow that to happen? That is will be their doom. For good, as no one will ever buy any energy from them. EVER. They will do everything they can including shooting inventor down to prevent this thing from beeing marketed.

If someone post plans-not much will build. Everyone again will think those plans are con or hoax.

Offline Elvis Oswald

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #6 on: February 26, 2006, 11:05:56 PM »
That is illogical.  If you are not going to start building them and selling them... then why not post the plans?

It makes no sense that people would assume a hoax if someone posted a video of a working device along with the complete blueprints.
Especially when you see people chasing devices that are only hinted at here.

You are right that a person would be eliminated if they invented a device that ran for free.  So what are the options then?  Certainly it makes no sense to just sit at home and post here telling everyone that you have a working device.
The only use of this forum - for someone who has invented a free energy device - would be to either distribute it... or to have others try and replicate it.  Either way, you should post the plans.  If not, then what is your purpose?
There's an old saying - Shit, or get off the pot.  :)

As for the personal attacks.... I can assure you first of all that while I may be very ignorant of some things - as we all are... I am not stupid.  :)  Personal attacks serve no purpose but to show a lack of social skills on the part of the attacker.

And I really don't see why you are arguing with me about things that are off the original topic.  That was - too much time is wasted on specific devices that people claim to have working... at the expense of exploring other ideas.  Maybe after you have seen the cycle that repeats over and over and over and always ends with no free energy... then you will feel the same way.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #6 on: February 26, 2006, 11:05:56 PM »
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Offline robur

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2006, 01:26:49 PM »

I am sorry if you counted it as attack.

I do not tell about 100% free energy as 100% free output is not possible. I am saying about cheap r almost free energy. For example input 10V and get out 15-20V. Or have a motor that runs from 9V battry turn a small generator that would give out 40-50V CD OR AC.DC can be easyli transformed into AC and vise versa.

Energy companyes would not like this too, as a common know generator should produce less output then output and  15V IN-20-30V OUT-IS OVERINITY. Well, I will open a bottle of champane when they will get snookered. That would be great. And even greater is to make more energy out then you in. I am working towards it and I am sure you would like the way I want to accomplish it.  Nothing funny. Just a new type of generator. :)

Offline Elvis Oswald

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2006, 01:48:28 PM »
I think you are right.  There is a way to get more power out than you put in by manipulating it using induction.  We've been bouncing some ideas around about resonant LC circuits in cascade... paticularly how unexplained magnetic field changes occur at resonance - even though impedance is high and so we are barely pulling any power.  Of course this is with the circuit resonating with the source of input.
If this is true with a 9v battery - then you can certainly use the potential between an antenna and a ground.  But that is something else to be worked out. :)

This is 'overunity' - but is not a second law violation.  The power is coming from somewhere... and that somewhere is where the magnetic field is coming from.  If you believe Lee Edskalnin (and he did build Coral Castle, so he knew something) then the magnetic field is sucked in from the atmosphere.  Perhaps then, Meyl is right on about his scalar waves.  AND if that is true - then the power companies are charging for nothing.
And you know, that whole ground return bullshit has always sounded more like voodoo to me.  With the size of the grid - you would expect something crazy going on. ;)  Not to mention all the metal we've put into the ground would certainly interfer... I'm sure that 100 years ago it sounded better, but today, I think it doesn't make sense.

We will both drink a toast to the demise of the empire that is the root of most of the conflict in the world.  It will also mean an end to 'wage slavery' and will hopefully begin a new era of peace and cooperation.  :)

Keep us posted of your progress.

Peace!


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2006, 01:48:28 PM »
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Offline magnetoelastic

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #9 on: March 02, 2006, 06:07:45 PM »
If you really believe that 'Big Oil' or 'Big Electricity' will never let OU/ZPE reach the market - read the list of investors in Randell Mill's Blacklight Power.

From what I can tell, it is the fraudulent nature of most (not all) OU schemes that keep them from the market.

Offline Elvis Oswald

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2006, 12:32:43 AM »
I agree 100% magneto.  Logic would dictate that all overunity devices claimed over the years have been frauds or mistakes, since none of them are being used today. 
It also makes sense to me that if someone (like Steven Marks) has a working device...  then he needs to shit or get off the pot.  That whole thing is worth doubting at least... but the video being from 1997, makes it almost 100% sure to be a fraud.  Of course I noticed that he has a new video now... I shouldn't have brought it up... haha.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2006, 12:32:43 AM »
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jake

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #11 on: May 01, 2006, 01:56:12 PM »
>> Note that when we say overunity we are refering to Coefficient Of Performance (COP), not to efficiency.

It is not obvious to the casual observer that this is the case.  It would add credibility to the site to be very clear about this.  I am new to the site, and I don't see any "about us" type of page that states or defines what "overunity" is.  I am new to the term "overunity" and did some searching, which quickly led me to this site.  Most of the information I see on the subject appears "cultish" to me.  People trying to make truths out of things they want to be true, that they think should be true, that never will be true (i.e. perpetual motion, etc.).

Offline c0mster

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #12 on: May 01, 2006, 03:51:47 PM »
The best thing about this site is that there are many ideas and theories posted here. Ok perhaps some people are magicians and have a bag of tricks to try to fool people or perhaps some people are actually using the bag of tricks to produce something. From what I can tell history shows that philosophy leads to proving. Take Faraday for instance in his book Experimental Research In Electricity Part 1. Faraday discovered that passing a magnet by a steal bar rapped with a coil produced a voltage. Today this is the principle of all ac generators, but really he was trying to understand the voltage produced by a falling current in a induction coil. If one looks back over the last 300 years it seems that big discoveries were found about every 100 years that changed our existence. I am neither a skeptic or a believer in overunity. But if in the early 1800?s some one told you they had a buggy that needed no horse to make it move and did not run on steam, people might think your are crazy. We all know now that the combustion engine drives our society. I find it hard to find people who understand the difference between philosophy and actual proving of a concept. I work with a guy who has all kinds of ideas he as systematically developed and tested in his head. He has drawn pictures and is convinced he has an idea that works. But physically he has no lab and has not lifted a finger to try his ideas. A few months ago I noticed a neighbor a few doors down had a motorbike that he stripped and placed batteries on the sides of the bike. I was amazed to see this, he is the first person I have actually met face to face that is doing something with his hands. It?s a little strange only hearing the tires on the road and the drive chain noise coming from a motor bike. Lots of talk goes on about the school girl motor and how it might be overunity and it may not. But one thing discovered was that using BEMF generated from a frequency would charge or recondition old batteries. Well turns out my neighbor purchased a battery charger for china that can recondition old batteries and he claims it brought batteries that tested as junk back to good. He uses those batteries on his bike. So I had a look at this device and gee it was using a frequency to create BEMF through a coil and the BEMF is used to charge the battery. For those of you who remember the 70?s there was a guy that had a carburetor that would give incredible gas mileage when used on a conventional engine and my father told me he had seen it first hand. That is the closest I have come to any of these devices. Skepticism can be like brain storming, it can uncover the truth and lead to ideas not thought of before. Oh boy this is long winded. But if there a people reading this site and trying to replicate these devices then their knowledge has expanded. If they don?t post answers to questions perhaps they are trying something physically and believe me that takes time and money. Perhaps people are just philosophical and are followers, I look to my own experiments to determine BS from truth and I document every thing and spend hours looking over the experiments to see if I missed anything. So BS or not BS keep up the good work folks.

Camster         

jake

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #13 on: May 01, 2006, 09:49:34 PM »
Experiment all you want, but don't ignore physics.  It is a viable goal to try to figure out things would work like heat pumps that return more heat value than the electricity put in (other energy is being added by heat present in the air), but it is completely foolish to think you can get more energy out of something than is being put it.  If you do, you are simply not accounting for the energy being put in.  It is wishful thinking.

As for the magic carburetor, it is urban legend.  Since your dad saw it, just what mileage did it get?

>>I look to my own experiments to determine BS from truth and I document every thing and spend hours looking over the experiments to see if I missed anything

Believe me, if you start 'creating' energy, you missed something. (releasing energy is one thing, creating it is another.)

Offline c0mster

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Re: I don't want to sound like a jerk...
« Reply #14 on: May 02, 2006, 06:12:27 PM »
Good point Jake.
Unfortunately my poor father is dead so I can?t ask him for more details of the carburetor and as well I have herd it is an urban myth. If I don?t have the evidence I won?t say it is for real. But I can tell you of a device I seen on a pick up truck that increased the old dodge gas mileage by about 30%. I was working for a farmer back in 79 and he had built this unit that heated the gas before it went into the carb. It was a fairly simple design. A coil cylinder which was inline with the engines heater hose. Inside was a inner coil of tubing, basically the gas was heated from the engine or as the farmer explained, the gas was expanded thus the expansion took place before it entered the intake manifold and cylinders of the engine wasting less fuel. He told me the heat from the engine was extra energy and could be transferred to expand the fuel. So there is no overunity here and energy is not created out of thin air. I have never seen or herd of this unit on any other vehicle. Don?t get me wrong I don?t ignore physics. Tesla talks of the either which was abandoned and only in the last few years it has been shown that matter still exists in a zero point vacuum. Your right you can?t create something from nothing. To abide to the laws of physics energy can only be transferred not created. As well if these OU units worked then why don?t I have one powering my house. So with regards to the heat pump, perhaps the magnetic force around the earth acts the same as the heat in the air. All we need to do is understand how to transfer that energy to assist in giving us better efficiency in producing electricity.

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 ???
I?m not sure how many people read these posts but perhaps some on can answer this question. I have a brass ring and a brass circle. The brass of course is not magnetic neither does it easily become statically charged.  Connecting these two items to a Tesla type coil and adjusting the gab between the 2 items at a certain point there is both static electricity as measured using a electroscope , and magnetism as measured by a compass. When pulsed slowly the electroscope shows static electricity and  the compass shows magnetism. So if I stop the arc then start it the compass moves 3 after about the third pulse it moves 6 at this point and then after only moves 3 , repeats. Based on electricity fundamentals charge is either in motion or static (The old textbook) . But magnetism created by a coil is charge in motion, moving electrons. Static electricity is excess electrons, always trying to balance themselves. Can anyone tell me why The magnetism is not constant? Note the brass ring is grounded to the earth not the circuit.

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I think this site is a great place for brainstorming and finding all kinds of new and different philosophies, I enjoy recreating ideas or concepts I find here, I think to me, that is what gives this site credibility. Its all in how to read it, entertainment.

 :)
Camster

 

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