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Author Topic: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like Tesla's 'charge siphoning'  (Read 144091 times)

Feynman

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #15 on: May 13, 2008, 04:36:00 AM »
This is really really interesting, considering latest measured COP is 1.2

(http://ringcomps.co.uk/doc/images/modified_cct.jpg)

Input supply:  8.0V on 0.299F cap (2.392Coulombs; 9.568Joules)
discharged to:  7.0V (2.093C; 7.326J) in 45.8s
Energy supplied:  2242mWs(milliJoules)
(Power in: 2242/45.8 = 49mW av.)

Switched osc.
(cycle:  0.85ms;  charge/cycle duty:  0.17/0.85 = 0.2)
power:  0.73mA*7.5V = 5.5mW av.
Energy drawn by Switch osc.:  5.5*45.8 = 251mWs

Output cap:  charged from 0 to 2.67V on 0.342F (0.913C; 1219mWs)

Total start charge: 2.392C
Total end charge: (2.093+0.913) = 3.006C
(charge on 0.0005F switching cap can be ignored)

Energy stored into Output cap via 10R load:  1219mWs
   = Energy discharged via 10R load

total energy thro' Rload = 2*1219 = 2438mWs

unquantified losses:
dissipation by MOSFETS;
sound/vibration from inductor-magnet

Load Energy/Energy supplied = 2438/2242 = 1.09

Co-efficient of Performance (COP)
  = Useful energy/Energy supplied = (251+2438)/2242  = 1.2
« Last Edit: May 13, 2008, 04:58:41 AM by Feynman »

Koen1

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #16 on: May 13, 2008, 11:43:17 AM »
:) Yes, riveting stuff. :D

Finally a non-battery based, solid state backpopper ;D
Go Ringwood, go ringwood! :D

nul-points

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #17 on: May 13, 2008, 02:42:16 PM »
thanks for the encouraging words, guys!

this is not a sexy motor or light-show, so the thread's likely to just get dumped in a side-street and have it's wheels removed  :)

but i hope that these experiments might help a few of the people doing the right stuff to take advantage of these anomalies and see if we can learn the secrets of unlocking 'vacuum' energy

@Feynman
thanks for uploading my website data - i'm hoping to edit it all in to the early posts in the thread so that the latest results will always be at the beginning


NerzhDishual

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #18 on: May 14, 2008, 10:27:30 PM »
Hi Guys,

Thanks a lot for your 'feedback'.
Sorry, I was "out of this 'topic'" for a while.

I was 'playing' with LEDs (Zon circuits).
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,4223.0/topicseen.html
It works pretty well. Is my reproduction really 'OU' is another question...

I was also 'playing' with the "DallasGoldBug" electrodes.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,4302.0/topicseen.html
They also work well...

As I'm far from a specialist, I wish you were providing more 'newbie-oriented'
explanations and circuits. Anyway, nice basic(breakthrough) results.

Best

Frederic2k1

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #19 on: May 14, 2008, 10:44:34 PM »
Quote
Input supply:  8.0V on 0.299F cap (2.392Coulombs; 9.568Joules)
discharged to:  7.0V (2.093C; 7.326J) in 45.8s
Energy supplied:  2242mWs(milliJoules)
(Power in: 2242/45.8 = 49mW av.)

Switched osc.
(cycle:  0.85ms;  charge/cycle duty:  0.17/0.85 = 0.2)
power:  0.73mA*7.5V = 5.5mW av.
Energy drawn by Switch osc.:  5.5*45.8 = 251mWs

Output cap:  charged from 0 to 2.67V on 0.342F (0.913C; 1219mWs)

Total start charge: 2.392C
Total end charge: (2.093+0.913) = 3.006C
(charge on 0.0005F switching cap can be ignored)

Energy stored into Output cap via 10R load:  1219mWs
   = Energy discharged via 10R load

total energy thro' Rload = 2*1219 = 2438mWs

unquantified losses:
dissipation by MOSFETS;
sound/vibration from inductor-magnet

Load Energy/Energy supplied = 2438/2242 = 1.09

Co-efficient of Performance (COP)
  = Useful energy/Energy supplied = (251+2438)/2242  = 1.2


@ nul-points

Your calculations are very impressive. But I have to ask: Did you check if the capacitators have really the capacitance mentioned on the labels ?

nul-points

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #20 on: May 15, 2008, 09:03:22 AM »
@ NerzhDishual

no problem, i also try to look in on the zon thread from time to time, too - i'll also have a look at that electrodes thread you mention too, thanks

i'm happy to post more info about the experiment if you'ld like - i didn't want to tire people with too much info, since there is already quite a lot of calcs, but i've been able to simplify the amount of measuring i've had to do because the output is now charging a cap then discharging it, so i can keep my calcs in energy form & compare directly with energy supplied

have you done any more experiments with your very cool-looking test cap-to-cap discharge rig?


@ Frederic2k1
good question - and very important!

you'll see that the values shown in my calcs for the two stacks of supercaps are 0.299F and 0.342F not the nominal value for 4x1F in series (0.25F)

the values shown were measured using the time taken to discharge to 37% from any preset voltage (the amount of discharge which takes one RC time constant) using a measured R for load resistor



Frederic2k1

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #21 on: May 15, 2008, 05:00:27 PM »
Quote
@ Frederic2k1
good question - and very important!

you'll see that the values shown in my calcs for the two stacks of supercaps are 0.299F and 0.342F not the nominal value for 4x1F in series (0.25F)

the values shown were measured using the time taken to discharge to 37% from any preset voltage (the amount of discharge which takes one RC time constant) using a measured R for load resistor

Ok, when you have measured the time for one rc-constant exactly, then you are my hero :D .
I'm very happy, that you has verified the values ;)

Hopefully you make some other experiments in future :)
« Last Edit: May 15, 2008, 05:22:05 PM by Frederic2k1 »

NerzhDishual

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #22 on: May 16, 2008, 10:18:37 PM »

@Nul-Points,

No, I have not made any more experiments with my caps.

You know what?
I tend to spread myself too thinly and little is achieved... :-\
I'm interrested in a lot of things and this very forum is getting so huge that
I'm lost... :)

Best

nul-points

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #23 on: May 17, 2008, 01:07:34 AM »
@ND
i agree, it is difficult to stay focussed when there are so many interesting experiments going on

i find it is actually helpful to have one's own experiment(s) to maintain (from the French? 'to hold'?) a focus and follow up a related thread in OU.COM to which you can contribute some understanding and also,from time to time, look in on different threads which look interesting or perhaps are completely different to one's own interests just to learn something new maybe, or have a wider feel for what is going on elsewhere

your own experiments can give you some specialist knowledge and the rest of the forum can give you general knowledge

don't give up on those experiments! :)

tak22

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #24 on: May 17, 2008, 11:17:34 PM »
@Nul-Points

you've got my attention with this one  :o  I'd like to replicate your experiment with the
idea of confirming the results and adding in another couple of ideas I have. would you
say between your posts here and your website there is enough info to go parts shopping?
or have you learned enough now to suggest different components or values? if it's not
too much to ask could you post a suggested component list? thanks.

tak 

nul-points

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #25 on: May 18, 2008, 01:32:24 PM »
@tak
thanks for the interest

i'd welcome attempts at replication

my intention here is not aimed at a end-user device yet (although hopefully, if this is really an example of free energy, then we may be able to build on these results to develop useful devices)

what i'm hoping to learn from these experiments is easily-repeatable methods for interacting with the Quantum Vacuum to divert some of its 'background energy' into conventional loads

i'm assuming at the moment that the excess charge & energy are somehow supplied by the combination of capacitance & inductance, other possible influencing factors being an air-gap (& maybe the magnetic biasing) on the inductor and also charge-switching with 'flyback' diode energy recovery

now that we're see real evidence of free energy i'm hoping we can try varying some of the circuit elements to see if we can identify more closely which are the key parts and actions which are causing the energy imbalance in our favour

i'm on leave now in the West of England until next weekend and won't be able to confirm some of the details until then

i'll see if i can get a more up-to-date schematic to you via PM in the next few days with MOSFETs replacing transistor switches

i'm not using any nonstandard parts apart from winding my own inductor - the circuit is built on a couple of breadboards, one with the super-cap stacks on, & one with remaining components - the inductor stands free next to component board

super-caps are 1F, 2.3V; switching caps are regular 2x1000uF (16V?) in series; load R is nominal 10R, 1/4W carbon; MOSFETs are 1xIRF540N (load switch) & 1xFDN304P (input switch); flyback diode(s) gen. purpose germanium signal diodes (connected reverse-biased from 'hot' end of inductor to ground); switching oscillator is CMOS 4093B quad schmitt NAND using two gates as astable feedback oscillator (unused gates grounded input) with independent feedback for +ve -ve pulse widths - cycle period doesn't seem critical but i get best results currently around 1 - 2ms cycle and approx 0.1 - 0.2 charge pulse

i hand-wound the inductor as windings on two separate tubular ferrite cores (approx 1" long; 1/2" od & 1" od) where i can insert one inside the other to make a simple transformer (for variations of my experiment), roughly 1:1 turns; wire diam. to be confirmed when i return home (but gauge thick enough to plug into breadboard connections without bending); total resistance of a few ohms; - in the current results posted, both windings are connected in series as one inductor (choose config for best output)

i don't think the inductor construction is critical but the air-gap between inner & outer ferrites may be helping - also, i place the ferrite vertically in the centre of a ceramic ring magnet from an old speaker - again, not sure yet if this helps

changing Rload & inductor still produces the anomalies & then you can tune values to increase output

hope this helps to get started - more to follow when i get home

sandy

nul-points

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #26 on: May 18, 2008, 08:10:08 PM »
schematic for circuit giving results posted above & currently on website...

nul-points

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #27 on: May 18, 2008, 10:42:54 PM »
i mentioned on the website and in earlier posts but not in the parts list,a couple of posts above, that the input and output capacitors, C1 & C3, are each a stack of 4x1F super-caps in series

nul-points

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #28 on: May 19, 2008, 01:00:21 AM »
 
<b>there's another interesting effect i see when running tests:-</b>

i usually discharge a fixed amount of energy from the input cap (eg start at 8V & discharge down to 7V) and finally i discharge the resulting volts on the output cap ready to run the next test

well, after both these discharges, when the previous test has finished, <b><i>both caps re-charge a certain amount, over the next minute or two, without any further input to the circuit!</i></b>

the input cap volts rise back to approx 7.1V and the output cap volts have risen to as much as 0.3V after being completely discharged by a short across the terminals (ie. about 10% of the volts i've just discharged from it!)

so it looks like the whole OU behaviour we're seeing with this type of circuit operation is connected with an 'inertia' type effect:-

  eg. the switched uni-directional pulses start the aether/Quantum Vacuum framework 'spinning' with a 'momentum-like' property and when the input energy is removed (by stopping the pulses, or discharging the cap) the aether spin continues for a while and goes on adding a little more energy even after the test energy has been stopped

this type of action might also explain the OU effect: once the aether is caused to spin it starts to add energy of its own to that provided by the circuit

...this is spooky, even as i'm writing-up this sort of 'aha' moment, i just realised this might also explain another weird behaviour i saw:-

  i usually let the experiment run to completion at a fixed oscillator frequency - but during one test run i adjusted the cycle time as the test ran - i ended up over & undershooting the cycle time i wanted a few times before the final 7V level was reached

when i looked at the volts on the output cap it was a few percent in excess of the usual level i was achieving! (i repeated the operation to confirm this really happened - it did - something to be investigated further)

at the time, i thought maybe the small +ve & -ve changes in charging slope i was causing were acting like some kind of amplitude modulation and that this was causing the increase in output, but now i've written this about the 'inertia' idea, i'm wondering if what was actually happening was that i was giving the aether spin a few small 'kicks' along the way which increased its spin even more and therefore increased the amount of energy it was added to the overall result

has anyone else seen this kind of external 'inertia' behaviour feeding back into a system?
« Last Edit: May 19, 2008, 01:33:54 AM by nul-points »

gyulasun

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Re: OU/COP>1 switched cap PS cct like half 'Tesla Switch'
« Reply #29 on: May 19, 2008, 01:25:53 AM »
Hi Sandy,

I think this phenomena comes from the dielectric material inside the electrolytic capacitor: when you discharge it the dielectricum tries to "remember" and scrolling back towards the initial electric field strength.  Any capacitor behaves like that but those stuffed with much dielectic material like electrolytic ones manifest this the most.  I found this with electrolytic capacitors when discharging them to zero from 200-300V, after a few minutes they "regained"  any value between 0.5 ? 0.8 ? 1V or so.
I have no info if this is connected with aether effects or not, it is possible to certain degree.
You can avoid evaluating problems that may come from this by reading the meters quickly and simultaneously?

rgds,  Gyula