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Author Topic: Bedini's Wooden Toys  (Read 22476 times)

Offline WilbyInebriated

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #30 on: April 08, 2008, 12:25:55 PM »
please by all means elucidate your claims... i have looked and looked for where i allegedly said these things, cant find them. i can find lots of conjecture and assumption on your part, as well as just plain wrong information. the only thing unwilling around here is you, unwilling to back up your claims with evidence... they are simple questions, they have been put to you several times and you keep avoiding them.
bye, don't let the thread hit you in the ass on the way out ;)

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #30 on: April 08, 2008, 12:25:55 PM »

Offline scotty1

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #31 on: April 08, 2008, 01:11:00 PM »
You guy's know there is a debate thread for talk like this...
Why not go there and argue....
I would suggest that if none of you have working models to show running...YOU ARE ASKING FOLKS SIMPLY TO BELIEVE WHAT YOU SAY....by FAITH ALONE?
One of Bedini's motor's is said to be able to run on a cap......so why talk about some little motor that does nothing but spin around using power from a battery...when Bedini says you can use a cap with a different design?...that runs itself?
Why even worry about the SG motor?
Make the design that runs on a cap....or give me the exact circuit and i'll build the bloody thing....and there is the problem...there never is an exact circuit that will work everytime....It is the operator or the capacitance or the resistance or some other bloody thing you did wrong!
Sorry but to me that is all bullshit.......If a motor can work...then a drawing can be made that will work EVERYTIME...If the drawing is good it accounts for all the specifications required for operation.....
Has anyone ever built a working device as Bedini states that only uses a cap?
As i said...for anyone who thinks there is a schematic that will work everytime...send it to me and i'll build it.......
As an Engineering Patternmaker....I can build most things....even on the quiet......
One good drawing would change the world......just look at the a/c motor patents....they ALWAYS work.
Scotty.

Offline WilbyInebriated

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #32 on: April 08, 2008, 01:24:33 PM »
i said i have built one, koen said he hasnt... who cares if you "believe" us or not... i could post a youtube video and you could still claim it wasn't really me right? the sg doesnt spin around doing "nothing" you obviously have no idea what you are talking about... why worry about the "sg"? hrmmm maybe understanding the principles behind john bedini's circuits? how variations behave? using one battery that provides a discrete amount of power to the front end and can charge multiple batteries on the backend?
the cap motor you are refering to i believe is the window motor, i'm guessing here because you dont really seem to know yourself what design you are actually refering to. if you do mean the window motor that runs off a cap, google "bedini window motor" and have at building it, the "good drawings" have been on the internet for years now... should be a walk in the park for an "engineering paternmaker", although i can bounce your original suggestion back in your direction and suggest that you AREN'T a engineering paternmaker and are asking us to believe that ON FAITH ALONE ;)
the drawings are out there, i would post you a link, but you "claim" to be an engineering paternmaker so i think you can handle using google yourself ;)

naw i'm not THAT unfriendly ;) here you go bro
http://www.icehouse.net/john1/motor.html
although even if you do build one i might suggest that you havent ;)

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #32 on: April 08, 2008, 01:24:33 PM »
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Offline emanresu

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #33 on: April 09, 2008, 04:33:08 PM »
naw i'm not THAT unfriendly ;) here you go bro
http://www.icehouse.net/john1/motor.html

Although to be fair to Koen1, by asking about the toys I implied a desire to build a self runner; the irony of this thread is that I have more interest in producing the unidirectional current than in overunity. I asked about the toys on a whim ;D

Thanks for this link in any case. It's added some value to the disappointment that the toys were just SSG's.

Offline WilbyInebriated

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #34 on: April 09, 2008, 10:11:39 PM »
hi emanresu, glad the link helped. there are lots of great links scattered throughout the icehouse web site that are easy to miss so poke around a bit there. also energeticforum.com is a great site with people that are building such machines, including the window motor as well as the self oscillating circuits that need no rotor. dr. peter lindemann who worked closely with john for several years building variations of such circuits posts there often and is a great wellspring of knowledge and information. ren is member as is amigo, both of whom have posted wonderful info about their replications and results. here is a link to the pendulum thread which you may find interesting in respect to your desire for unidirectional impulses
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/995-bedini-pendulum.html#post14138

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #34 on: April 09, 2008, 10:11:39 PM »
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Offline Pirate88179

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #35 on: April 10, 2008, 12:22:28 AM »
The one thing I have never understood about Bedini's pendulum devices is why he never fabricated a magnet to pass through a coil while the pendulum swings?  This would not be hard to do at all. (Think shake flash lights)  It would not generate a lot of juice but it would maximize the motion of the pendulum and would not add any drag in the bargain.  Has anyone done this anywhere?  The coil could be curved to match the arc of the swing and the magnet could be made to move inside the coil with an easily designed device. (I can post a picture of one design if needed)  If nothing else, it would help the pendulum continue for even longer times before battery switching.  Just a thought.

Bill

Offline scotty1

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #36 on: April 10, 2008, 10:13:18 AM »
 ;D  Funny as mate.
Not a Patternmaker ay?
You know Patternmaker's are proud of their work.....and often take pictures...some of which may be seen here.
http://community.webshots.com/user/scott_l
Eat your heart out mate..... ;)
Check out my Les Paul guitars I made.....sweet as.... 8)
I love makin' stuff...it's kinda piling up all around my joint  :o
Like I said...i can make almost anything, and at the moment i'm making pumps for the oil rigs and other petro-chemical plants.....
I would rather work making free energy machines, but I would say that if the devices on that Bedini page worked, hundreds of people would have done it....
I myself made a pattern and cast up the metal bar with the slot in it from that very Bedini drawing.....It didn't work of course....duh.
As for the other Bedini drawings on that site, since they are so old...they do not work...it's simple.
If simple ideas like those are not quickly replicated...then they don't work except as motors.
As far as i know...nobody got a window motor with only a cap...to self run.
I've seen the Bedini video of it...but that is not independent.
If engineers had as hard a time replicating formula's as folks had on bedini's drawings then we would have no power at all...........but we would all be experts on batteries?
Bedini is a hard worker...no doubt about that...but a good free energy machine will be able to be replicated easily...if not then it is no good and cannot be used on an industrial scale.
Now on the other hand, if the devices did work as shown then that means everybody is very,very, lazy, and I don't think that is the case.
I like to think many people work hard on these things, but i would not declare an O.U device unless it worked according to a solid plan, able to be replicated EVERYTIME.
I would not feel good if i designed a motor and nobody could ever make one themselves.
The energy is everywhere, and i think one day the problem may be solved, but non working devices will always be just that.
Scotty

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #36 on: April 10, 2008, 10:13:18 AM »
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Offline Ren

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #37 on: April 10, 2008, 11:36:16 AM »
Scotty, I have read about the magnet motor that matches your cutout. Bedinis comments were that Ron Cole (who built the device with him) tinkered around with it for weeks before he got it to sustain rotation. It was barely limping along though and its probably not worth the effort unless built on a HUGE scale. (By the way, that picture above is not geometrically correct, which is the definitive factor between a working device and a lump of steel) Love your work though, I believe you have done a few Ed Lee replications no? Perpetual motion holder?

In regards to self running.

The window motor has been shown to self run and a few people have suposedly done successful replications. Unfortunately there are always skeptics and doubters, along with people who lie or use deception so I guess the only way to find out is to prove it to yourself. So saying the window motor is not overunity, (nothing is in my opinion, how can you have more than total unity?) it is a UNITY device. It is possible to tap into more than you use which is what some people may classify as overunity. In that case a windmill or solar panel is OU.

The problem arises with the window motor that people dont replicate fully. One reason being that there are exact schematics for a given wire length, but the wire length is not given (it is if you know where to look ;)). So people build the circuit and wonder why it doesnt work when their resistances dont match their coils geometry or their magnets arent up to spec etc.

I have built a number of Bedini replications by the way, including a basic window motor that was not to spec. That basic model would rotate off less than  2 volts and a poofteenth of a milliamp. I will be building a window motor with large magnets as my next project, perhaps with some luck and effort you guys will have another replication to tear apart and critize.....


Oh and by the way, I found the previous remarks exchanged between Koen and Wilby a complete waste of bandwidth. If your here to knock stuff you have limited or hearsay knowledge about you should keep it to yourself, it is only counter productive.

PS. The pendulum device as seen on EFTV2 blocked up to 99% percent  of current flow, evident by the charge being retained on the front end despite it running for a reasonable length of time. It was designed to test charging batteries with pure radiant, and worked really well at first. Over time the battery simply dried up and was unrepairable, leading John to realise that some current is needed to charge the battery and that pure voltage was not enough!

Offline WilbyInebriated

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #38 on: April 10, 2008, 11:46:25 PM »
If your here to knock stuff you have limited or hearsay knowledge about you should keep it to yourself, it is only counter productive.

exactly my point in refuting him ren, im sick and tired of people who haven't even bothered to construct a simple school girl hacking on john bedini's work and telling us how it should be done.


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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #38 on: April 10, 2008, 11:46:25 PM »
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Offline Ren

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #39 on: April 11, 2008, 12:05:55 AM »
If your here to knock stuff you have limited or hearsay knowledge about you should keep it to yourself, it is only counter productive.

exactly my point in refuting him ren, im sick and tired of people who haven't even bothered to construct a simple school girl hacking on john bedini's work and telling us how it should be done.



Too true.

Offline scotty1

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #40 on: April 14, 2008, 01:01:48 PM »
So I was right... now i need to know where to find certain wire lengths...usually i would look to the drawing for that... ???
No offence..but I work in the real world where every line and dimension has a proper function, and if it is not on my drawings then i will have to have the draftsman fix it.
I wouldn't sign my name to a model if the drawing i used was incomplete in every part.
That is my argument.
If you guy's think you can present all the correct information, why hasn't it been done?..It's not my fault...I will build you a motor with a lovely bronze cast base and flowers coming out...and forge its frame in the fire, but not with SOME of the information.
I believe it can be done..but it should be put together and presented  as a whole...free and fully functioning.
Scotty.



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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #40 on: April 14, 2008, 01:01:48 PM »
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Offline Ren

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #41 on: April 15, 2008, 02:11:17 AM »

No offence....


None taken Scotty, and you have a very valid point. The thing is, it is one thing to build said machine and another to fully understand it. And if you are given plans for exact duplication, then that is all you get, and not an understanding of WHY it works. It may make no difference to some, the person who just wants to plug his device in and benefit from it without understanding why it works. I myself started out this way but I soon discovered that if I was to remain ignorant of the principles that I wouldnt get too far.

I wish there was a simple plan to follow in exactness, there are some pretty close ones however which leave only a little experimenting and tinkering to do (in regards to the window motor). The biggest issue is the tolerances and variables. Like your yoke you made above, if but one part is different then it affects the whole and other parts may need to be altered as well.

The simple SG monopole while seeming very basic has a number of variables which are often taken for granted. Take for instance coil shape, size, core material, number of winds (all of which effect the inductional properties and thus the functioning) etc. Most people dont take into consideration that the magnet may be one of the most important considerations, and that it is fairly difficult to measure many of the properties of the magnet itself, and whether it is a match in more than just size to its brethren on the rotor.

Perhaps more complete construction plans will be available at sometime, but they are only going to come out if the people who do their homework decide to share it with the world. If you have a genuine need to study and replicate the window motor then I can only offer you what I have found in regards to its finer points of construction, like window dimensions. Perhaps I can offer even more once I have studied it further.

Shan

Offline Pirate88179

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #42 on: April 15, 2008, 02:24:05 AM »
@ Ren:

Once again, I have a question for you.  I hope I have not asked too many.  As I mentioned, I am using a vcr hub for the Bedini motor replication. (Very good idea to encase the magnets like you did, high rpm makes for bad things if magnets fly off unexpectedly) Can this small motor work off of 9 volt rechargeable batteries?  Some say 6 volts ok, and others say it has to be at least 12.  My only thought for using the smaller batteries, beside the cost savings, is that it would shorten the time required to see what is actually going on with the system.  Instead of waiting hours to drain a car sized battery, I should be able to see results faster with the smaller bats IF you think they have enough juice to run the motor.

I thank you for sharing your knowledge.

Bill

Offline Ren

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #43 on: April 15, 2008, 03:39:15 AM »
Ask away mate ;) There is no reason why it wont mate, given the correct resistance on the trigger winding. But you have to understand something about batteries.  For optimum life span the lead acid battery is recommended to be discharged at its C20. This means if it is a 20 amp hour battery it should be discharged at 1 amp over 20 hours. This wont change if you move to 9 volts or even to 24 volts. Nicads are a different story, but you should have extensive knowledge and strict safety precautions if these are used. You may find that at 24 volts your energizer draws 2 amps at its sweet spot thus a 40 amp hour battery would be needed to maintain C20.

My perspex rotor will run for a considerably long time off a disposable 9 volt if amp draw is set to 25ma. Then again, the amps can be set up to 250ma, and at this discharge pace it will most likely be dead flat after an hour. You may find that a smaller rotor is harder to start, and contains less weight and thus less inertia or flywheel effect. It should still run off 9 volts though. One of my small window motors ran off 2 volts. The air gap may need adjustments for low voltage as well.

I highly suggest joining the bedini monopole3 group to understand better the basic principles of the vanilla SG. Alot of people see it as an overunity device and are quickly discouraged when they realise it will not charge multiple batteries off one battery in its simplest form. In its simplest flavour it is only ever a unity or close to unity device depending upon its construction. The circuit has losses, the coil has resistance etc... The whole project is designed to show the principles and allow others to study the nature of both energy types and how they can be utilized. When someone has a much better understanding of these principles they can try different designs or experiment with their own.

Please dont be discouraged by that fact. It is not an overunity device, it is a teaching device, and you need to learn to walk before you fly :D

 

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