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Author Topic: Bedini's Wooden Toys  (Read 22213 times)

Offline emanresu

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Bedini's Wooden Toys
« on: March 27, 2008, 03:12:28 AM »
Hi, I was about to start on an SSG as my first project, but I've just watched Energy from the Vaccuum Part 2 and what really grabbed my attention were the toys shown about 43 minutes in, which appeared to run without any battery or circuit.

The first model was basically two wheels, the inside perimeters of which were lined with magnets, which alternately passed a coil which was placed at right angles to the two wheels. He just started it manually and it kept running. The second was a counterbalanced pendulum. Again he just started it manually and I couldn't see any wires attached to it.

So, has Bedini released any information to groups about these toys?

Thanks

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Bedini's Wooden Toys
« on: March 27, 2008, 03:12:28 AM »

Offline WilbyInebriated

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #1 on: March 27, 2008, 05:09:04 AM »
the wooden one was just an sg with the guts hidden underneath, same with the counterbalanced pendulum. in fact on that one you can see the bulge where the coil is tucked underneath.
if you build a bicycle wheel sg you can unbalance the wheel by only putting on one magnet and get the same effect as the counter balanced pendulum. hope that answers your question.

check out the 'toy' he shows at the very end of the video, while the credits are rolling, big coil with splatter coils? lighting bulb pretty bright.

Offline emanresu

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #2 on: March 27, 2008, 07:08:12 AM »
Ah ;D I'll check out the end of the video again, thanks.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #2 on: March 27, 2008, 07:08:12 AM »
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Offline Ren

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2008, 07:26:35 AM »
Hendershot device. ;)

Offline emanresu

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2008, 02:30:35 PM »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2008, 02:30:35 PM »
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Offline amigo

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #5 on: March 28, 2008, 12:13:31 AM »
Yeah I was wondering about that wooden toy motor as well, I wish he lifted it up to show us there are guts beneath so that there's no confusion...

Here's a video clip for those interested to see: http://mihd.net/1e49k8m   (click on Request Ticket, then click Download)

Offline Koen1

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #6 on: March 28, 2008, 01:16:54 PM »
I thought "Bedini SG motor" stood for Bedini's so-called "School Girl" motor?
Which is simply an incorrect term for a variation of the Bedini pulse motors,
in my opinion...

Still find reports of batteries that have run such motors for years, then
all of a sudden go ultra-dead, and then need to be put in a grid-powered
charged to "recuperate", during which they pull several times the
supposed total battery power before starting to recharge.
And still the guys I know who have worked on this for years say
it seems to work for a while, but they claim to all have run into
this "deep cycling" problem...

I still say make one work without a battery as crucial circuit component,
start it from a battery jolt then run it off capacitors,
and if that works, then I'll jump on the Bedini bandwagon with you guys,
but so far I have not seen any that don't need a battery. And this
makes me a bit suspicious. If the Bedini motor really puts out more
than it needs to run, it should not be very difficult at all to run it off
capacitors, should it? So why then, after all these years (decennia even)
is it still not happening?

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #6 on: March 28, 2008, 01:16:54 PM »
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Offline WilbyInebriated

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2008, 03:53:33 AM »
the 'school girl' moniker came from the fact that a elementary school aged girl built machine using a variation of JB's circuit given to her by JB. how you came to the 'opinion' that this is incorrect eludes me...
they are quite simple to build, why not build one using caps and let us know your results?
perhaps in your 'research' you have missed the point. dead batteries can be brought back to usable states. it is possible to charge a number of batteries with one. even if the battery 'suddenly dries up' you go get another one that has been thrown out as 'unusable'. making it a 'self runner' never was and never should be the point.
you can build one (for under $50) or you can remain suspicious i guess.

Offline Koen1

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2008, 03:20:53 PM »
the 'school girl' moniker came from the fact that a elementary school aged girl built machine using a variation of JB's circuit given to her by JB. how you came to the 'opinion' that this is incorrect eludes me...
Because it is like you say a version of the typical Bedini motor. To act as if it is something different and refer to it as "the SG" seems misleading... Well, you can call it what you want. But it's still just another variation of the "standard" Bedini setup.
Quote
they are quite simple to build, why not build one using caps and let us know your results?
I don't build one because it is a lot of hassle, because I am busy with a totally different device at the moment and will be for quite some time still,
and because there are guys on here who have already built Bedini motors and could quite easily adapt one to use caps.
Quote
perhaps in your 'research' you have missed the point. dead batteries can be brought back to usable states. it is possible to charge a number of batteries with one. even if the battery 'suddenly dries up' you go get another one that has been thrown out as 'unusable'. making it a 'self runner' never was and never should be the point.
No, you are missing the point.
The batteries don't go "flat" to simply be recharged, like any flat battery.
They go "dead": they need to be recharged with X times the energy you would normally use to charge them fully.
In other words: the energy gained in the "free energy" operation of the Bedini battery "back-poppers" appears
to somehow still come from the batteries, and when they go "dead", all that "excess" energy needs to be
put back into the batteries. Not normal recharge, massively increased recharge.
That's just the point I'm making.
Oh, and yes, making it a "self runner" should obviously be the goal.
Are you seriously suggesting that you want to have a Bedini motor that does not self-run,
that does not produce "free energy", and is simply a normal motor that runs on batteries
which need to be recharged?
If that's what you believe, you have missed a large part of Bedinis theory and stories, I guess.
Bedini clearly claimed a "free energy" device, that could provide motive power off a battery
which does not run out because it is recharged by "negative energy" in the process,
or could recharge more batteries than it runs on without providing motive power.
I am pointing you toward the "dead" battery phenomenon that people have experienced
with Bedinis motors and the "deep cycle discharge" explanations that have been suggested,
which if true mean that there is no "free energy" process going on.

Quote
you can build one (for under $50) or you can remain suspicious i guess.
Have you actually built one?
I have heard many a story of people who tried to build one mainly for the reason
that it is cheap, but many have not been able to get it to run. Some have gotten
it to work, but say it is not really usefull, as he motor cannot provide usefull
power and the batteries don't get significant recharge, an even though they
can get it to run for long periods they can't actually pull energy from it...

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2008, 03:20:53 PM »
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Offline WilbyInebriated

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #9 on: March 31, 2008, 03:16:45 AM »
Because it is like you say a version of the typical Bedini motor. To act as if it is something different and refer to it as "the SG" seems misleading... Well, you can call it what you want. But it's still just another variation of the "standard" Bedini setup.

yes, a version a school girl built, the simple version to demonstrate the principle... and thats how it got the moniker... because a school girl replicated it, get it? this is a fact, documented by a newspaper article. you are welcome to your opinions.
I don't build one because it is a lot of hassle, because I am busy with a totally different device at the moment and will be for quite some time still,
and because there are guys on here who have already built Bedini motors and could quite easily adapt one to use caps.
alot of hassle to wind a bifilar coil and solder a transistor a resistor and a diode?  LMFAO perhaps you have armchair quarterback syndrome? when you were in school did you have other kids do your homework? there is a 'point' to doing it yourself... the obvious one is you can perform the experiment, whatever it may be, to your own exacting standards. you can measure the input and output power, be it reactive, real or true. sure i could convert to caps and do it for you, but i'm sure whatever the result, i wont have done it 'correctly'. cure your own skepticism or don't, i don't care, but step back from the bandwagon ;)

No, you are missing the point.
The batteries don't go "flat" to simply be recharged, like any flat battery.
They go "dead": they need to be recharged with X times the energy you would normally use to charge them fully.
In other words: the energy gained in the "free energy" operation of the Bedini battery "back-poppers" appears
to somehow still come from the batteries, and when they go "dead", all that "excess" energy needs to be
put back into the batteries. Not normal recharge, massively increased recharge.
That's just the point I'm making.
Oh, and yes, making it a "self runner" should obviously be the goal.
Are you seriously suggesting that you want to have a Bedini motor that does not self-run,
that does not produce "free energy", and is simply a normal motor that runs on batteries
which need to be recharged?
If that's what you believe, you have missed a large part of Bedinis theory and stories, I guess.
Bedini clearly claimed a "free energy" device, that could provide motive power off a battery
which does not run out because it is recharged by "negative energy" in the process,
or could recharge more batteries than it runs on without providing motive power.
I am pointing you toward the "dead" battery phenomenon that people have experienced
with Bedinis motors and the "deep cycle discharge" explanations that have been suggested,
which if true mean that there is no "free energy" process going on.

yes i am seriously suggesting that, a more efficient battery charger than the one you buy at sears. one that can 'charge' a battery that your sears 'amp pusher' wont even charge anymore because it sees it as an infinite amount of resistance. more armchair quarterbacking from someone who claims winding a bifilar coil and soldering a 4 component circuit is "too much of a hassle" LOL
Have you actually built one?
yes i have
I have heard many a story of people who tried to build one mainly for the reason
that it is cheap, but many have not been able to get it to run. Some have gotten
it to work, but say it is not really usefull, as he motor cannot provide usefull
power and the batteries don't get significant recharge, an even though they
can get it to run for long periods they can't actually pull energy from it...
the rotor part of the energizer is not meant to provide large amounts of torque, in fact you don't even need a rotor, so that line of argument is mute. again you clearly demonstrate your superior understanding of bedini's work, without having replicated his work... neat trick, show me how to do that sometime will you?
my batteries recharged just fine, and after many cycles done with a small 5v lithium it lasts much longer, but never mind all that, its just to much of a hassle for you and we will leave it at that.

Offline Pirate88179

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #10 on: March 31, 2008, 04:26:16 AM »
I have decided to build a small version of the Bedini SG motor.  I have been collecting parts.  I am going to use the head bearings from an old vcr as the rotor.  My main interest at this point is to "resurrect" my cell phone bat. which only last about an hour of talk time now.  I have seen several videos of people doing just this.  They say it makes the battery last longer than when they first bought it.  This alone would save me over $50.00 and I know I can build one for less than that.  If that works, I am going to zap my laptop batteries which will save me about $150.00 (more than the laptop is worth) if it works.  I know I can buy the batteries and repair the laptop cell myself for about $40.00 but this would be more fun if it works.

Then, I want to try to power the Bedini motor from my earth battery cells.  I also want to try the super caps things as I have been playing with them in the Earth battery experiments all along.  They are much better than any battery I have ever seen or used.

I am trying to keep an open mind and do not expect miracles.  No matter what happens, I will be having fun and surely learn a thing or two along the way. (Unless it blows up, ha ha)

Bill

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #10 on: March 31, 2008, 04:26:16 AM »
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Offline WilbyInebriated

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #11 on: March 31, 2008, 05:06:19 AM »
I have decided to build a small version of the Bedini SG motor.  I have been collecting parts.  I am going to use the head bearings from an old vcr as the rotor.  My main interest at this point is to "resurrect" my cell phone bat. which only last about an hour of talk time now.  I have seen several videos of people doing just this.  They say it makes the battery last longer than when they first bought it.  This alone would save me over $50.00 and I know I can build one for less than that.  If that works, I am going to zap my laptop batteries which will save me about $150.00 (more than the laptop is worth) if it works.  I know I can buy the batteries and repair the laptop cell myself for about $40.00 but this would be more fun if it works.

Then, I want to try to power the Bedini motor from my earth battery cells.  I also want to try the super caps things as I have been playing with them in the Earth battery experiments all along.  They are much better than any battery I have ever seen or used.

I am trying to keep an open mind and do not expect miracles.  No matter what happens, I will be having fun and surely learn a thing or two along the way. (Unless it blows up, ha ha)

Bill

i know you know to exercise care with lithiums, here is my experience with doing what you are planning. the lithiums did not warm up at all, except when i was using probe tips contacting the + and - contact plate surface on the battery and the probe tips had vibrated slightly away from the battery creating a miniature spark gap. i fixed that right away but noticed the battery got very hot, but just at the area around that contact plate. once i made a more stable 'jig' to hold it all i never encountered that again. as far as input voltage, i played around a bit, anything from 3.3V up to 20V

earth cells powering bedini on the front end and charging super caps? or super caps on the front end? sounds cool either way.

Offline Koen1

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #12 on: March 31, 2008, 10:16:14 AM »
@WilbyInebriated:
Dude, what is your problem?

I merely point out that I have heard tons of stories about and from people
building Bedini motors and other battery chargers who experience the
dead battery phenomenon. It is well known and even Bedini and Bearden
mention it.

Why attack me for not actually building the thing?

Do I attack you for not building other devices? No, I don't.

And when you have a Bedini motor that can power your house,
or run your car, then I'll be severely impressed.
But impressed with you trying to burn me for not building one,
i am not.
Do you not see that is beside the point? It is not what I was talking about.
But hey, if you choose to refuse to listen to my story about the
dead battery thing, that's cool, just don't harass me with your
building zeal either then, ok?

Offline WilbyInebriated

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #13 on: March 31, 2008, 10:35:10 AM »
lets see, you come into this thread where someone is thinking about building a bedini device and asking about some of the demonstration devices bedini has shown, you contribute nothing to the threads main topic and attempt to derail it by an entirely negative post backed by your third party hearsay knowledge and i have a problem? LOL

still not sure where you think i attacked you, please point out the sentence that offended you.

"tons of stories"? yeah ;) and i've told you a million times not to exaggerate. i'm not 'harassing' you with some imaginary zeal... let me be blunt since you didn't get when i was civil. you haven't built one, you have no personal experience to add, all you have brought to the table is some "i heard this from a friend of a friend" and all of that was negative.  why try and talk someone out of an experiment based on your third party knowledge?

i saw 3 points to your first post:
1 to call it a school girl is 'wrong'
2 batteries 'dry up', you didn't mention that this is a side effect of using just voltage to charge the battery.
3 your 'conditions' to get you on the bandwagon.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2008, 11:10:03 AM by WilbyInebriated »

Offline Koen1

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Re: Bedini's Wooden Toys
« Reply #14 on: March 31, 2008, 01:13:42 PM »
lets see, you come into this thread where someone is thinking about building a bedini device and asking about some of the demonstration devices bedini has shown, you contribute nothing to the threads main topic and attempt to derail it by an entirely negative post backed by your third party hearsay knowledge and i have a problem? LOL

Haha! Yeah, that's funny.  ???
When did I "try to derail" anything?
I merely pointed out some things I think should be kept in mind.
I never told anyone not to attempt Bedini replications, did I?
Do not put words into my mouth or accuse me of doing things I did not do.

Quote
still not sure where you think i attacked you, please point out the sentence that offended you.
Well you have been quite (passively) aggressive in your reactions.
I don't see a reason for that.

Quote
"tons of stories"? yeah ;) and i've told you a million times not to exaggerate.
I am not exaggerating much. I I really have heard many stories about peoples batteries dying in some form of Bedini setup.
Quote
i'm not 'harassing' you with some imaginary zeal... let me be blunt since you didn't get when i was civil. you haven't built one, you have no personal experience to add, all you have brought to the table is some "i heard this from a friend of a friend" and all of that was negative.  why try and talk someone out of an experiment based on your third party knowledge?
Well, I think now I see why you are so upset. You misunderstood.
I am NOT trying to talk anyone out of any experiments!
I am merely pointing out that battery death has been reported in the context of the Bedini motors,
and that perhaps you should keep an eye on that possibility.
I am not claiming that the battery death phenomenon is necessarily going to act up, but
that I think it is something you should keep in mind when running tests on your motor
and batteries. And of course, if something like that occurs at all, it would only be after a
long time, so you'd only see it in long term tests.

Ans about your remarks dismissing my input as useless "third party hearsay";
come on man, as if you received the motor design from John Bedini himself personally.
Do not accuse me of referring to "third party" info, for you are yourself using "third party" info as well.
Or are you that "school girl" that personally got the design from Bedini? No, I didn't think so.

You may have built a version of that design. Well, great, and I applaud you for that.
But that still does not answer any questions about the battery phenomenon.
You may prefer to dismiss it as "negative" and "hearsay", instead of considering
the possibility and simply stating that you have not experienced anything like that
yourself. Fine. And you may indeed never encounter the phenomenon. Now I would
then take the latter to be positive feedback, since that would show that the claimed
"deep cycling" is not in fact happening and there is real OU taking place. But you
are of course free to dismiss the very idea of the "deep cycling"/"battery death"
reports.

I may not have built one, but I have built other types of pm, and I have been involved
in pm motor building for quite a while, including a group that tested several promising
designs incl some bedini variations. That was years ago already, but one thing that
was quite a thing in the discussions was that battery phenomenon, which was also
addressed by Bedini himself.

Also, as it is apparently unclear to you what I said, let us review:
Quote
i saw 3 points to your first post:
1 to call it a school girl is 'wrong'
Yes, I did say that in my opinion it is not correct to refer to it as "the schoolgirl motor"
because it is merely a simplified version of Bedinis standard motor concept.
So it is a Bedini motor of the design he shared with that "schoolgirl".
You could also call it "the science fair motor" if you'd like, for that was what the
"schoolgirl" used it for. But that does not change the fact that it is a Bedini motor.
Using terms as "SG" could confuse people, as the term is also used for totally different
things, like the famous Searl Generator for example.
But that was a minor point, more intended to simply be food for thought, and certainly not
a point of argument in my view.
Quote
2 batteries 'dry up', you didn't mention that this is a side effect of using just voltage to charge the battery.
No, I didn't mention the batteries "dry up" either, I said it is claimed that after a certain period of use,
the batteries appear to go "deader than flat". I did not mention what causes this because I am not sure
what does, so I don't really want to make any unfounded claims on that. I recall that back in the days
when the motor builders group I mentioned was still active, there were quite a lot of reports of Bedini
battery chargers and/or motors workign just fine for long periods, but then every once in a while
someone would report that their batteries went flat and needed a lot more grid-powered input to
recharge and become functional again. That is what I brought up, and what you seem to find such
a horrible an idea that you do not even want to think about it, and prefer to burn me for. Or at least,
that's what it sounds like, and if you claim you are not attacking me then why are your replies
so passively aggressive?
Quote
3 your 'conditions' to get you on the bandwagon.
Again you seem to be missing the point. I was on the bandwagon years ago, and still am,
but at present am involved in totally different experiments that require most of the spare
time I have. As tons of people have been and still are working on Bedini motors, I am sure
someone will figure out a way to turn one into something more usefull than a battery
charger, something like a direct output generator. When that happens, I may well decide
to build one. This is also why I nag about the use of capacitors instead of batteries:
if it is not a "deep cycle" battery-killing process that occurs in the Bedini motors,
and it is really producing OU, regardless of whether it is "back EMF capture" or "negative
energy spikes generated by a locally broken quantum symmetry" (the two most commonly
used explanations for why it works), then a version without batteries should work as well,
and in that case we should be able to use capacitors, and we should be able to upscale
the output into something we can use to power our homes on.
You could try that with tons of little batteries and charge them constantly, but it seems
to me that although the Bedini back-poppers are of an ingenious design, the "schoolgirl"
design will not be the solution to our energy "crisis".
In any case, the guys in those pm builders group have built and tested many versions,
and although selfrunners were built, none of those was able to actually produce
usefull amounts of output. The group was active for several years.
Oh, right, that's all invalid info as far as you're concerned, because it is "third party" info, I bet.
;)

So, for clarity:
1) by all means build a Bedini motor if you want
2) if you like, and you decide to run long term measurements, keep an eye on the battery
recharge time; perhaps regularly recharge the battery using a normal grid-powered
charger, see if they still charge in the same way and same time period. This could
provide more certainty about the entire claimed "dead battery" phenomenon.
3) I think using the term "SG" for a Bedini motor can be confusing as it is also
used for the Searl Generator for example.
4) I think we should ultimately try to build a Bedini motor without battery, as a self-running
power generator instead of a battery charger.
5) I am not trying to discourage anyone from building their devices
6) I am not trying to pick a fight or anything like that.

 

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