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Author Topic: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg  (Read 239889 times)

Offline Nali2001

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #105 on: December 04, 2009, 11:10:48 PM »
Indeed the Inkomp device works by bringing the primary close looped core to near saturation only for as long as is necessary. Once that close looped core approaches the saturated state its permeability drops rapidly and so the path from the permanent magnet is forced to find another route. There are many important things here, for one you want a material with a very sharp saturation knee, meaning that saturation will kick in abrupt and without much input. Frequency can be whatever you want and depends on material. How to accomplish the switching is up to the user but some kind of Lc based circuit would be a good choice I think. Special note on the input, the input pulse duration has to be fine tuned. It should only be on, for as long as it takes to switch the magnet field and not longer than that. So very short pulses would indeed be enough. On the scope shots in the video you see a very short duty cycle of only 20% of so. The output side is pure sinewave when Lc tuned to with the right cap. I guess the main difference with this system compared to the 'regular' MEG is that the input and its field never reaches (interacts with) the output coil/side. Input and output fields are more or less separated (except for output-coil lenz that is) But testing should be simple since it does not require any out of the ordinary exotic frequencies or core materials. All in all this thing is very much like a magnetic amplifier.

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #105 on: December 04, 2009, 11:10:48 PM »

Offline winsonali

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #106 on: December 05, 2009, 06:32:07 AM »
nali2001

i am not sure about the Inkomp device as they have not disclosed there setup
i am talking in general if you try this by your self you will find that tis setup will not work many people have tried this and they are failed

Lenz force is nothing but an electro mechanical force representation of increased repulsive force with increased current it do not effect the elctro magnetic circuit.

the BH curve will not be fulfilled to the 4th quadrant as it will only move in its 1st quadrant.

a simple experiment will explain what i mean with this

take a simple - screw driver and rub it on a magnet only in one direction it will become magnet.

do the same thing but rub in to and fro motion you will see that it will not become magnet
this is very much required when you want to generate energy with MEG you have to get the reverse field applied to neutralized the core material.




Offline winsonali

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #107 on: December 05, 2009, 06:48:31 AM »
i want to ask a simple question

i designed an inverter which convert 12 volts into 220 volts at the max. power of 1000 VA
the inverter i design is a fully computerized unit when there is no load it  consume 0.4 amps with full load it consumes 80 amps .



my question is very simple how input understand that the load is increased its time to fetch more current from input.
please also define mutual inductance?

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #107 on: December 05, 2009, 06:48:31 AM »
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Offline Nali2001

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #108 on: December 05, 2009, 06:00:43 PM »
Hi Winsonali,
When you have a transformer without a load on it, the input winding will induce/generate a voltage against itself. This (self)induced voltage is a bit lower then the inputed voltage. So for example you input 200v and the self inductance acting on the coil is close to that, say 199v. So in the end there is only 1volt really acting against the ohmic resistances of the coil hence there will be very little amp draw in idle. But once you start loading the output winding the self inductance acting upon the input coil will drop and more actual voltage will act upon the ohmic coil resistance, more amps will be drawn.

Same with a motor at idle. Why does a motor at idle draw little power? Because the motor is generating against itself also. And that generated voltage is canceling out the applied voltage leaving only a very little effective voltage to cause amp flow.

Well here is another 'special' thingy:
Take a 1000watt transformer and apply a dc input. You will see that the core dead saturates with as little as 2watt dc input. Well then, how can it be that, that transformer can in ac operation handle a 1000watt throughput?

And one other thing. How can the secondary of a transformer pickup the induced field from a transformer primary when the magnetic field never actually comes in contact with the output coil. The field is 99% contained in the core and still the output core can interact with it. See the below movie, how the output coil is very much removed from the core ans still works great.

http://home.planet.nl/~sintt000/Movie_0001.wmv









Offline Nali2001

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #109 on: December 05, 2009, 06:51:34 PM »
Hello Winsonali,
Well about the meg and inkomp. The operation of the meg and means of working are very different from what the inkomp is doing. With the inkomp device, when the magnet is not there there will also be no output at all. In other words, remove the magnet and power the input and you will see nothing on the output coil. The input never couples with the output coil.

I agree with you, the meg will probably not work, at least not the way we are being told it is supposed to work. But again the inkomp is nothing like this.

I understand what you mean with the magnet and screwdriver depiction.
But you must understand that all these effects are very much related to the core type used.
In the inkomp when the input is off, all the magnetism will go through the close looped core part and the level of magnetism in the output coil/core part will be close to zero, but only if the right material is used. Some steels tend to retain the magnetic orientation/level that was force upon them. But the right kind of material will reset itself to a neutral point when at rest. And you need to know what you are doing when designing such thing. Grain aligned cores almost always drop their magnetic field when input power is removed due to their material/structural makeup, while bad laminated steels retain the field and so are not suitable for meg or inkomp usage. Here you have an old video showing the different behavior of different core types. Don't mind some texts in the video since it was part of a bigger video at first:

http://home.planet.nl/~sintt000/CoreTests.wmv

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #109 on: December 05, 2009, 06:51:34 PM »
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Offline Kator01

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #110 on: December 06, 2009, 01:57:05 AM »
Hi Nali,

your video-demonstration is very interesting. One thing I would like to know about the laminated core-experiment :
Did you ever tried to let the pulsed core ( with shorted secondary ) rest for a while to find out if there is a time-constant, i.e a decay-period after which you can seperate the core without opening the secondary coil ?

I can not believe that this is a static process meaning that the magnetic domains remain fixed in one direction by just the presence of a shorted secondary.This is very strange.

Another small step in understanding this better would be to build a switch-circuit with a MOSFET and monitor the pulses of both coils with a two-channel-scope during puls-on-period and then when you open the secondary.

What do you think ?

Regards

Kator


Offline winsonali

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #111 on: December 06, 2009, 02:06:04 AM »
nali2001:

you have certainly good knowledge about magnetic field and transformer

the end result is due to flux the resistivity of the coil increases and due to this the power consume in it increases and this results in more current consumption.

i have addressed this issue with the new concept

as we all know
DC can be blocked with a capacitor and AC can be blocked with an inductor.
this is the key for success in MEG.

i appreciate you have very good concept and knowledge.

MEG is possible its not impossible ......
« Last Edit: December 06, 2009, 02:33:19 AM by winsonali »

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #111 on: December 06, 2009, 02:06:04 AM »
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Offline Nali2001

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #112 on: December 06, 2009, 12:05:45 PM »
Hi Kator,
With the C core and shorted coil the attraction leaks away in about 6 seconds. So it will not be attracted forever due to the coil. It could be that the coil has a capacitance that is for a short while acting as a battery. But perhaps not since such a coil would only be a few Pico or Nano farad. Wonder what would happen is that cosed coil was super conducting.
These C cores are M4 silicon steel and I got them from http://www.alphacoredirect.com/

With the rectangular core (taken from a microwave oven transformer) you see no change in behavior with or without the closed secondary coil. Once you input the field it keeps the two core parts attracted. And this for a very long time. I have had the rectangular cores attracted under the table for an month and after that they were still attracted as strong as ever. So with this core you have very much a hard steel permanent magnet effect. The magnetic domains will keep their force orientation until flipped around by a reverse current input like normal Ac operation.

Magnetic cores like transformer cores come in many varieties and one must take care in choosing the right type/behaviour for the job. In the Inkomp you would want a material which has a very sharp Bh curve, and normal non orientated silicon steel is not always suitable. See for instance the below Bh traces:


Offline LarryC

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #113 on: December 07, 2009, 12:55:32 AM »

Hi Nali,

Great video, had seen it a while back, but had forgot and was about to try to create a simple PPMT generator using transformer cores(mistake), based on Flynn's latest patent WO 2008/119055.

I did think of another possible theory that may explain the C core reaction with the secondary shorted. What if the sharp Bh curve allows the flux to be maintained for the six second period. As the core attempts to realign, the flux drops, as this happens the coil would attempt to counter the flux drop causing an increase in flux. So that an oscillation is set up until the flux is completely dissipated.

I had to put your quote at the bottom as there seems to be some type of problem typing after the quotes, as the screen keeps jumping back up to the last quote as I type. Does anyone else have this problem?

Regards, Larry
 

Hi Kator,
With the C core and shorted coil the attraction leaks away in about 6 seconds. So it will not be attracted forever due to the coil. It could be that the coil has a capacitance that is for a short while acting as a battery. But perhaps not since such a coil would only be a few Pico or Nano farad. Wonder what would happen is that cosed coil was super conducting.
These C cores are M4 silicon steel and I got them from http://www.alphacoredirect.com/

Magnetic cores like transformer cores come in many varieties and one must take care in choosing the right type/behaviour for the job. In the Inkomp you would want a material which has a very sharp Bh curve, and normal non orientated silicon steel is not always suitable. See for instance the below Bh traces:


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #113 on: December 07, 2009, 12:55:32 AM »
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Offline winsonali

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #114 on: December 07, 2009, 02:46:56 AM »
Nnali2001 what is your experience regarding permanent magnet based transformers or MEG
how you connect the oscilloscope to get the wave form?

Best transformers are those transformer where the BH curve are low micro wave transformers are usually very good transformers.
your microwave transformer cores must be connected and and due to this reason creating a capacitive load with high flux retained in it you know capacitor keep charges within them selves until and unless the discharge naturally or we discharge them in load. so may be the 6 seconds are the discharge time of the capacitance  created in core with closed loop. 




Offline Nali2001

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #115 on: December 07, 2009, 07:23:15 PM »
Hi Larry,
Yes I have posted these video's a few times. It gives some insight info the rather different behavior of core material.

What keeps the cores together with the closed core is probably some kind of capacitance effect although I am not too sure.
Here is another video where in the second half of the video I close the primary coil and open the secondary and the cores stay attracted. So it "should" not really be caused by a charge in the coil since I swap the coils around, its interesting to think about.

See here:
http://home.planet.nl/~sintt000/MoreCore.wmv

Another video showing a depleting change.
http://home.planet.nl/~sintt000/CoilTest.wmv

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #115 on: December 07, 2009, 07:23:15 PM »
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Offline Nali2001

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #116 on: December 07, 2009, 07:44:05 PM »
Hi Winsonali,
Well it has been awhile since, so I will have to digg into some info how I got that scope trace. I will get back at ya.

I did some permanent magnet assisted transformer/SolidStateGenerator testing a while back but I have not really found anything overly interesting yet. Although I have this video:

http://home.planet.nl/~sintt000/DCmagnetTransformer.wmv

never went any further on that.
I have never tried Bearden's classic Meg since I doubt that works they way they claim it works. It perhaps could be made to work but we don't seem to have that piece of the puzzle.
I have done some simple Inkomp tests and I can assure you that the switching principle does work and is a valid means of field switching approach. Not too difficult to imagine either. Once you saturate the main core the reluctance drops and the field fo the magnet has to find another way. And it is for real that, it is the field of the magnet that gets switched. Remove the magnet and there is no output. Put it back in and the output is back. Problem with the Inkomp is that they guy is not a star in English and that they are in contract with manufacturers and don't reveal anything about how the input switching is done, ac half wave, scr, fets? Some kind of resonant loop back?

In my view the sharpness of the bh curve defines the quality of a transformer. I want the Bh knee sharp. So not much current gets wasted once you reach saturation. But I guess it all depends on the intended use.

In all my tests I have found Microwave oven transformers to be the worst transformers around. They are often made of such cheap material that they lugg current while doing nothing. But since they are big and cheap I have used them often. I have made some isolation transformers out of them and most of the cores with stock primary eat away about 100 to 200 watt in idle doing nothing. And they get hot fast and since the laminations are often also welded it is no wonder there are massive eddy current losses. Anyway I don't use them anymore, I only used wound C cores these days.

Offline winsonali

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #117 on: December 07, 2009, 11:26:40 PM »
very interesting
you will be successful in future you have switched the coil like,  in fly back transformers one direction but collecting the output through 2 coils
when you connected the magnets in reverse direction it drops its power output and increase the current consumption and when they are in the same direction they enhance the power and increase the output and reduce the current requirement.

what is the frequency you are using for switching the coil.

with transformer of microwave they are not designed for continuous us short impulse may be at one time for 1 ~ 3 minutes so for them cost saying is OK versus efficiency but if you use gold star micro wave they use proper silicon sheets.

keep up your working you have very good knowledge where can i see the video of Inkomp.
   

Offline Nali2001

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #118 on: December 07, 2009, 11:36:36 PM »
Hi Winsonali,
About the Bh scope trace, I used this info: http://electronicdesign.com/Articles/Index.cfm?AD=1&ArticleID=6155


Offline winsonali

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Re: A truly overunity Transformer / Meg
« Reply #119 on: December 08, 2009, 05:52:03 AM »
hi nali2001,

have you ever tried to use the BH curve non sharp i mean low iron grade in benefit of your own system i did and it has increased the time of my battery usage, we can say in other words usage as permanent  magnet.
the life of the battery increased by 2 hours in other words it consumes less current at the same power output or you can say has reduced loss greatly.
i have gone through with your other posts you have amazing knowledge.



 

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