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Mechanical free energy devices => mechanic => Topic started by: prometei on March 17, 2008, 12:33:14 AM

Title: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: prometei on March 17, 2008, 12:33:14 AM
Hey every1, I've been reading this forum for a while now and finally have decided to post.

Today I glued the magnets to the skate wheel on my bedini energizer, hooked everthing up but it did not spin or anything.

(http://photofile.ru/photo/infinaut.frontru/135016581/large/135233874.jpg)

(http://photofile.ru/photo/infinaut.frontru/135016581/large/135233873.jpg)

(http://photofile.ru/photo/infinaut.frontru/135016581/large/135233875.jpg)

When I hooked up the primary or the secondary battery (don't remember which one first) for the first time to the circuit, the neon bulb had flashed. I gave the wheel a spin and nothing happened, I checked all the connections again, reconnected everything, (neon bulb did not flash this time) tried again and still nothing. Then I just took the battery and hooked it up directly to the power coil with a switch in between and the neon bulb to the trigger coil.

(http://photofile.ru/photo/infinaut.frontru/135016581/large/135233870.jpg)

When I was pressing the switch the wheel was turning 45-90 degrees, so the magnetic fields were OK, as I was releasing the switch the kickback spark was lighting the neon bulb trough the trigger coil, so bassically it is not a problem of the coils or wrong magnetic polarity, or at least it looks like that to me.

Maybe I fried the transistor 2n3055 when I was soldering one end of the neon bulb to the collector, it did not want to stick so I had to keep the soldering iron longer on the end of the neon bulb and the collector then I probably should have.

(http://photofile.ru/photo/infinaut.frontru/135016581/large/135233872.jpg)

I'm also using a IN4007 diode instead of a IN4001.

The power coil is wound with 0.6mm copper wire, the trigger coil with 0.4mm copper wire, approximately 1000 turns on a 8 cm long 1 cm wide PVC pipe with four thick welding rods inside.
I tried the set up with two 6 volt and two 12 volt lead acid batteries.

I'm linking pics of my energizer and the schematic on which it is based (i omitted the small 25ma bulb).

(http://photofile.ru/photo/infinaut.frontru/135016581/large/135233965.jpg)

Thanks for any help !

p.s. I'm going to order some magnetite powder (Fe3O4) and some regular iron powder to use instead of the welding rods.
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: Feynman on March 17, 2008, 12:39:18 AM
Hi!  Nice looking motor!

Okay, so the first thing I would do is try to get the thing working in "standard motor" form.  Just use one of your coils, and use this schematic.

http://www.simplemotor.com/hemotor.htm

(http://www.simplemotor.com/images/HEMotor-1.gif)

If you can get the thing to spin, then the problem is in your Bedini circuit. If it doesn't spin, its your coil or your motor.   Btw, One thing I noticed with the skate bearings is that they are not nearly as good as ceramic bearings, even ABEC-9 skate bearings.  But ymmv.  Also your power transistor might be bad, could be a good idea to test that as well.

Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: bourne on March 17, 2008, 01:31:20 AM
Hi prometei

Looks cool !

3 things;

1 - ALWAYS have your secondary battery connected. If you don't and your neon flashes you will damage your 2n3055 transistor. If you bought the transistors on Ebay there is are chance they are fake and will damage even quicker  :(
2 - Check your potentiometer resistance. It looks like your using a 1/2 watt pot. I have blown two 2watt pots in the past using exactly the same circuit and winding wire diameters.
3 - Completely fill your core with welding rods. In picture 2 it looks like you have some large gaps. Any copper coated mild steel welding rods will do for learning

Here is my first youtube vid, you will recognise the circuit diagram http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=yenJtDzogiE

One other thing, It is better to have magnets that, at least, are the width of your coil.

Other than that, chin up old bean. You have just started down a VERY exciting path.
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: ramset on March 17, 2008, 03:53:56 AM
BOURNE thanks for the video  I'm very Impressed   Chet
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: b0rg13 on March 17, 2008, 04:12:38 AM
thats a sweet vid , im very tempted to build one my self.
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: prometei on March 17, 2008, 12:09:25 PM
Feynman , I don't have a hall ic, I'll drop by the local electronics supply store and see if they have some.

bourne

1. I've bought the transistor in a shop, not eBay. How would one test a 2n3055 transistor with a multimeter?

2. I've just checked the potentiometer with the 100 ohm resistor and they work, I can adjust the resistance from 102 ohms to 1094 ohms.

3. I'm going to go to the hardware store to get these thin copper coated welding rods.

my coil is 14mm in diameter and the magnets are 12 mm in diameter, is that ok?
Otherwise I'll have to order magnets trough eBay cause in my small town I could not find any store that sells proper magnets for the SSG.


Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: Feynman on March 17, 2008, 03:36:24 PM
@prometei

You can get Hall IC from

http://simplemotor.com

They usually don't have Hall IC at radioshack, but you could get a reed switch from radioshack.  Sounds bourne has alot of good info.

@bourne

great song on the vid  ;)
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: gyulasun on March 17, 2008, 04:31:46 PM
.....
1. I've bought the transistor in a shop, not eBay. How would one test a 2n3055 transistor with a multimeter?
.....

Hi,

Here are two links for testing your transistor if it is a short or open circuit:
this is a shorter description: http://www.anatekcorp.com/qdmmvom.htm
this includes much more info on different type semiconductor testings:
http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/semitest.htm

The latter link includes a tablet on TIP3055 transistor which is identical to your 2N3055 (except the case):

This has been confirmed below on a selection of common transistors using an El-cheapo DMM:

     Transistor       B-C Voltage     B-E Voltage
   --------------------------------------------------
       TIP3055           0.640           0.642
       TIP2955           0.668           0.668
       BD140             0.697           0.699
       2N2369A          0.682           0.710
       PN3563            0.752           0.753
       BC108              0.715           0.716

CAUTION: Do not hold the transistor under test in your hand. For every degree the transistor increases in tempreture, the Base-Emitter Diode Drop (commonly called Vbe) decreases by 2 mV. This is a significant amount when determining the B-E and B-C junctions.

rgds,  Gyula
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: NerzhDishual on March 17, 2008, 05:56:14 PM

Hi Prometei,

Nice 'motor'.
Two thoughts:
1) On your picture the gap between the rotor's magnets and the coil looks too large, IMHO.
2) Perhaps the magnets are also too weak.

This SSG 'motor' did not work (even with a very small gap) until I 'doubled' the ferrite magnets:
(http://freenrg.info/Bedini/Replications/SSG3_Small.jpg)

Best
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: bourne on March 17, 2008, 06:42:42 PM
Hi Prometei,

Hows it going?

I didn't explain myself very clearly in my last post, it was getting late, so to clarify;

1 - This was pointed out in Bedini Yahoo group http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/Bedini_Monopole3/ as a Potential problem, if you bought them from a shop it should be nothing to worry about. I know I have seen a table showing what you should see when testing the transistor with a digital multi-meter (diode test setting), but can't for the life of me remember where. It might be in this group somewhere, it might not.
If I get time I will test one of my spares and post the results

2 - The way I damaged my 2watt pots was by adjusting the resistance too fast while the motor was running. i.e. sweeping the pot from high res to low res in 1 - 2 seconds. It's best to adjust it a tiny amount at a time and let the motor react to the new resistance.

3 - Lincoln R60 welding rods are what Mr Bedini suggests to use but I couldn't get them anywhere in Britain, so after about a week of searching  I ordered some copper coated welding rods from a welding supply on Ebay. They work fine it seems!

I must of spent a couple of months reading and researching everything I could find about the Bedini machine while I was slowly getting the bits together to build it. My wound coil was sitting on my shelf for 4 weeks while I sourced my wheel, magnets and components

Here are a few links to read through;

http://www.fight-4-truth.com/Schematics.html (Very good)
http://www.dennissharp.com/ssg/index.html
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Bedini_SG (read everything here)

Big boys group!
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/Bedini_SG/

This is a very good forum with advise from Peter Lindemann!
http://energeticforum.com/ I strongly suggest you sign up

That should keep you busy for a while  ;D


Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: bourne on March 17, 2008, 06:59:02 PM
@ NerzhDishual

Good points. Even my 50mm x 20mm x 6mm magnets are double stacked

Coil length shouldn't matter that much if the core is packed full of rods. I would say it is more important to have the magnets (at least) the width of your coil not just the core

@ Everyone

I am glad you liked my video  :)

Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: helmut on March 17, 2008, 07:09:50 PM
@bourne
Yes the video is fine. When comes the next one?

helmut
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: bourne on March 17, 2008, 09:31:18 PM
Does this make sense?

RS components Ltd(UK) part number 486-4476
2N3055 silicon Epitaxial-base planer NPN transistor mounted in jedec TO-3 metal case

measured using sky-tronic digital multi-meter set on diode/continuity test setting

   PIN
    1            BASE              RED     BLACK      RED     BLACK      -             -
  TAB      COLLECTOR          -            -           BLACK    RED     RED     BLACK
   2         EMITTER           BLACK    RED           -             -       BLACK      RED

APPROX READING            595         -              595          -           -             -     

I hope this helps.

Here is my other youtube video http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=abJuStUv4K8

Enjoy  :)

Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: NerzhDishual on March 17, 2008, 11:26:12 PM

@Bourne

Double staking the magnets must improve the 'efficiency' (COP) of the SSG but is not always essential to get it 'turning'.
I have 2 others SSGs with 'single' magnets :
http://freenrg.info/Bedini/Replications/SSG1.jpg
http://freenrg.info/Bedini/Replications/SSG2.jpg

Are they 'OU'? That is the question. ???
They can charge the output bat(s) = the voltage is increasing. But, according to some swap tests they are not 'obviously OU' .
I'm not criticizing Bedini but me! :)

----------------------------------------------------------
@Prometei

May I suggest you these tests :
(http://freenrg.info/Bedini/Replications/SSG_Test_1.GIF)
(http://freenrg.info/Bedini/Replications/SSG_Test_2.GIF)


Best
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: prometei on March 18, 2008, 02:21:39 PM
Hey folks thanks for all the help. I've tested all of the electronic components and they are fine, I even bought a new transistor, my SSG still does not work. I've replased the 4 thick welding rods with thin copper coated rods. A couple of minutes ago I did the Bedini SSG test #2 (posted by NerzhDishual) and I've only gotten 12 milivolts, this to me shows that the magnets are way to weak, am I right?
So now my next step is to order wider and stronger magnets, I wish I knew about this b4 I spent 20 euros on the tiny magnets I now have. Should I order rectangle or round magnets?


Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: bourne on March 18, 2008, 10:10:04 PM

@Bourne

Double staking the magnets must improve the 'efficiency' (COP) of the SSG but is not always essential to get it 'turning'.
I have 2 others SSGs with 'single' magnets :



Hi NerzhDishual

My understanding is this; the magnets are just the 'finger' that flicks the switch. The magnets field has to be strong enough to energise the trigger coil to turn on the transistor. On doing so the coils do their thing which, in turn, moves the wheel to repeat the process.

The circuit will never have a COP >1 because its just a simple circuit! The magic comes from the effect it has on the Lead Acid Battery. Once the batteries have been conditioned, and this takes literally months of charging and discharging, continuously without breaks, you should have a system that can charge at a rate of 1 to 1. Once this is achieved the "free energy" comes from the mechanical movement of the wheel. If this can be used to run a generator then you have "free" electricity! Yipee!

I have simplified that to some degree but I think you know what I mean.

The circuit diagram presented on the Peswiki page, posted above by prometei is NEVER going to pump out unlimited amounts of free energy but it is a good learning tool to understand the process

"Rain water is free but you still have to purchase a bucket to catch it in"

@ prometei

Rectangle magnets, definitely rectangle magnets. Bigger the better!

Watch the "Energy from the Vacuum" series particularly the Bedini film you will learn much. http://www.energyfromthevacuum.com/

Also, get this book http://www.cheniere.org/books/FEG/index.html
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: NerzhDishual on March 18, 2008, 11:44:36 PM

Hi Bourne,

Sorry to be succinct but writing in English is laborious for me...

Yes, I see (and agree with) what you mean. In the SSG device the 'magic' (should there be any :)) is in the batteries and not in the circuit.

However, I have the feeble-mindedness to believe that some circuits could be OU (coils, transients, sharp gradients, resonance etc...).

For example:
Free Energy Electronic Circuit ,- Zoltan Szili
http://www.rexresearch.com/szili/szili.htm (http://www.rexresearch.com/szili/szili.htm)

http://freenrg.info/Misc/Pretoria_News.pdf (http://freenrg.info/Misc/Pretoria_News.pdf)
http://freenrg.info/Misc/Quantum.pdf  (http://freenrg.info/Misc/Quantum.pdf) 

http://www.fredericgauthier.com/energie/cuivre.html (http://www.fredericgauthier.com/energie/cuivre.html) (In French)

Best
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: prometei on March 24, 2008, 11:27:30 PM
Hey every1! The problem is solved. I should have used 12 volt batteries instead of the 6 volt ones. The 6 volt battery was not enough to get the wheel to spin by itself.
Here is a short video of the test run http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_wwRbcJWAo
it is a mess. I'll play around with this setup for a bit and then I'll build another one, properly, with a coil that does not fall apart :)

Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: Pirate88179 on March 24, 2008, 11:44:51 PM
bourne:

Nice machine and great video!  I have been considering making one of these for a while now so I can recondition my cell batteries, and others.  Great information...thank you.

Bill
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: bourne on March 25, 2008, 12:28:00 AM
@ prometei

Well done!   Its always something simple.  Welcome to the club :)

@ Pirate

Thanks!

It will never repair shorted cells in batteries but it will bring back to life batteries that can't be charged with a 'normal' charger. Dive in, you'll love it!

@ everyone

Unfortunately the http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/Bedini_SG/ group has been disbanded. I think it was a combination of the moderator giving up and Mr J Bedini getting a hard time from some of the members  :'(
That's like punching your teacher for telling you something you didn't know. "mental-cakes"
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: prometei on March 26, 2008, 08:36:34 PM
hey everybody

I've gathered all the parts together and assembled them into a "compact" unit. :)

How do you guys measure the voltages, when?  I've seen many videos on youtube where the voltage is measured directly from the batteries while they are hooked up to the charger while it is running.  I did tests while the motor was running, right away after the motor was stopped and the batteries disconnected from the circuit and 10 minutes later with the batteries still disconnected. The measurements differ. Which readings should one use for statistical purposes?

also, how does one use the little (25mA min) light bulb in order to find the sweet spot ? I don't have a light bulb in the circuit so I just adjust the variable resistor until I get

1. max RPM with min current or
2. loudest clicking with least amount of current

I'm not really sure if these are the correct ways for adjusting the circuit

(http://infinaut.front.ru/bedini/bedini%20charger%202008%20March%20front%20view.JPG)

(http://infinaut.front.ru/bedini/bedini%20charger%202008%20March%20top%20view.jpg)

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Ts9JhjM5tW4 (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Ts9JhjM5tW4)

Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: Pirate88179 on March 26, 2008, 10:39:14 PM
@ Bourne:

I went back and watched the trailers for the Energy from the vacuum series on the link you posted.  This is great stuff.  Do you know anywhere on the web I might be able to view the entire videos without purchase?  I know, they need the money for research, but I can't afford them right now but would love to see them.  Thanks.

Bill
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: bourne on March 27, 2008, 01:38:06 AM

Hi prometei  Looks good!

You will find the battery voltage drops a little after charging, that's normal. Think of it like a gas pressure in a balloon, the battery being the balloon and your charger being the pump. When you disconnect your 'pump' some of the 'gas' leaks out and continues to leak out over time.
Mr J Bedini always said it is better to put a load on the charged batteries straight away. It is not like a 'normal' battery charger as you will learn!
 If your worried about what voltage to note down use them all. I would suggest noting a 'running' voltage, a 'stopped' voltage and an 'after 5 minute rest' voltage you might see some improvements (battery conditioning) if you make a large spread-sheet. Don't bother trying to measure current flow out of your charger, it doesn't use current to charge your batteries. But 'do' measure current out of your charged batteries when under load testing

Its almost an instinct you have to develop when tuning your machine. This is because every machine is different. The way I tuned mine was to test every 10 ohms of base resistance from 1000ohms down to 150ohms  :o  I charged the battery for half an hour then timed the discharge down to a set voltage value i.e. 12.40volts. Yes, it took ages and ages (2 weeks I think!). I have a massive spread-sheet showing all the times and voltage values etc. but it would be meaningless to anyone with a different set-up.
The general idea is to get the lowest current draw from your run battery with the best/highest charge appearing in your charge battery.
My final conclusion for my machine was 540ohms base resistance (yours WILL be different). Then when you have found your 'sweet spot' swap your potentiometer for fixed value resistors.

Like I said, its almost an instinct you have to develop based on your set-up. There is no easy way, just hard work.

Point one is basically the idea, fastest RPM with lowest current draw.
I don't understand your point 2 "loudest clicking with least amount of current" ?? What is clicking?

One other thing; try and use large diameter 'fixed' or crimped leads for your batteries.

peace!


@ pirate

"Bittorrent" but don't tell anyone I told you!  :)
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: Pirate88179 on March 27, 2008, 01:54:17 AM
@ Bourne:

Thanks.  I found them here and just watched part 1.  Amazing and very well done documentary.  This link requires the free VEOH player...very good resolution.

http://www.veoh.com/videos/v6261554PzpfRK82 (http://www.veoh.com/videos/v6261554PzpfRK82)

Bill
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: prometei on March 27, 2008, 02:25:51 AM
You will find the battery voltage drops a little after charging, that's normal.

Yes, the voltage of the primary battery drops while the voltage of the charging battery actually increases, that happens a couple of minutes after I disconnect the batteries from the circuit.


I don't understand your point 2 "loudest clicking with least amount of current" ?? What is clicking?

Well I've meant this buzzing, ringing sound,  kinda like very very vast clicking, it starts slow but as the rotor speed increases you can't tell the clicks apart anymore. If I increase the resistance of the potentiometer the sound starts to faint.


I'm doing charge discharge testing now. I've got two 12 volt 3.4 Ah C-20 batteries and I'm using 160 mA fans to discharge them, would it be ok to use something like a 300-400 mA bulb?, that's higher then the c20 rating of these batteries.

ciao!
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: Pirate88179 on March 27, 2008, 05:35:59 AM
Here is the link to part two of Energy from the vacuum.  Great coverage on Bedini.  I am glad I watched both 2 hours parts.  I learned a lot more about Bedini's work and it is great.  I am going to begin work on one tonight. Thanks again.

http://www.veoh.com/videos/v6261564q8pAYnjY (http://www.veoh.com/videos/v6261564q8pAYnjY)



Bill
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: WilbyInebriated on March 27, 2008, 06:08:44 AM
also, how does one use the little (25mA min) light bulb in order to find the sweet spot ? I don't have a light bulb in the circuit so I just adjust the variable resistor until I get...

i put 25mA bulb in series with the base resistor/pot and i put a matching bulb as the load instead of a battery. you can skip the bulb in series with the base resistor but i liked to see what was happening on both ends. adjust your pot till you get the really bright flashes on the bulb connected to the output. you will know when you hit it, it will be much brighter. the recommendation on a higher wattage pot is sound. you will burn the lil one up.

the buzzing/ringing is resonance, glad you got it running!

Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: prometei on March 27, 2008, 01:16:57 PM
hey WilbyInebriated thaks 4 yo input
 gonna go get me some of them little light bulbs and them higher wattage pots, by the way how many watts minimum  should I look for?

Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: WilbyInebriated on March 30, 2008, 04:57:44 AM
couple watts should do it. we scavenged some lil ones out of a video converter box that a friend offered for parts and they burned up quick, but i was messing around putting all sorts of strange loads on the charge end also. i would figure out what your sweet spot resistance is and then use hardwired resistors. your sweet spot shouldn't change unless you change coils or magnet arrangement.

if you have any DC auto test lights you can use those for the bulbs on the resistor and charge, they wont light as bright as the lil 25mA bulbs do but will work in a pinch
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: Pirate88179 on March 30, 2008, 07:14:10 AM
@ All:

I am gathering my components and can not wait to build.  Thank you all for all of the great info and links.

Bill
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: capacitor70 on April 27, 2008, 02:17:25 PM
just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(

1. VCR Motor bearings, 3 inch wheel diameter.
2. CD player lence magnets. total 6 magnets. Easy to obtain and much power full in small size, 7mm X 7mm X 1mm :o
3. 32 turns coil. ???
4. single Ferrite core. 8 mm core diameter. ???
5. Power supply 12V and 5V 5Amps.
6. Transistor TIP122. ???
7. Diode 1N4007 also tried with 1N4148.

1. How much turns require to start the motor ?
2. Darlington paire transistor is suitable?
3. Pulse pick up coil gives only 0.01V AC max when rotor is rotated. I think less voltage becouse of less number of turns.
    is this the reason motor is not rotating?
4. Ferrite core is suitable ? ?

Tried with reed relay, it is burned (by mistake), and it requires very close distance to operate.
 ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: prometei on April 27, 2008, 02:59:16 PM
just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(

1. VCR Motor bearings, 3 inch wheel diameter.
2. CD player lence magnets. total 6 magnets. Easy to obtain and much power full in small size, 7mm X 7mm X 1mm :o
3. 32 turns coil. ???
4. single Ferrite core. 8 mm core diameter. ???
5. Power supply 12V and 5V 5Amps.
6. Transistor TIP122. ???
7. Diode 1N4007 also tried with 1N4148.

1. How much turns require to start the motor ?
2. Darlington paire transistor is suitable?
3. Pulse pick up coil gives only 0.01V AC max when rotor is rotated. I think less voltage becouse of less number of turns.
    is this the reason motor is not rotating?
4. Ferrite core is suitable ? ?

Tried with reed relay, it is burned (by mistake), and it requires very close distance to operate.
 ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???


hi there

2. Are the CD Player magnets neodym, ceramic....?
3. 32 turns? That's too little I think, my bifilar coil has around 1000 windings.
4. Not sure about ferrite core, I have thin welding rods packed together.
5. I use 12V, when I first used 6V it was not enough. And ye 5 amps that's more then enough for a small setup I think.
6. Not sure about the TIP122 transistor, I use 2N3055
7. I use only 1N4007 diodes in my setup.

1. You mean how hard do you need to spin it? My rotor needs a light spin and it starts to pick up speed by itself.
2. I'm not sure if a Darlington is needed in this simple setup.
3. By looking at your pictures I see that your coil is not installed, what is the distance between the core of the coil and the magnets ?
4. I'm not sure.
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: capacitor70 on April 27, 2008, 04:54:34 PM
Another thing I found today about stan mayer electrolysis, CFL Coating, Conditioning of tubes

"Another variation on existing CFL technologies are bulbs with an external nano-particle coating of "titanium dioxide".
Titanium dioxide is a photocatalyst, becoming ionized when exposed to UV light produced by the CFL.
It is thereby capable of converting oxygen to ozone and water to hydroxyl radicals,
which neutralize odors and kill bacteria, viruses, and mold spores."



2. Are the CD Player magnets neodym, ceramic....?   
 Dont Know, But it satisfy this condition  Neodymium magnets are very strong in comparison to their mass, but are also mechanically fragile. Some steel kind of coting is there on outside and inside very very fragile. black,gray color.

3. 32 turns? That's too little I think, my bifilar coil has around 1000 windings.
 I will try this soon

4. Not sure about ferrite core, I have thin welding rods packed together.
  When I have pulsed coil by hands wheel spins, current is too much...

1. You mean how hard do you need to spin it? My rotor needs a light spin and it starts to pick up speed by itself.    Without coil once weel is spin it rotatels at least 50 time, bearings are somooth

3. By looking at your pictures I see that your coil is not installed, what is the distance between the core of the coil and the magnets ?  I am holding coil in hands, first trial run, distance can be adjested..
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: prometei on April 27, 2008, 08:27:55 PM

3. 32 turns? That's too little I think, my bifilar coil has around 1000 windings.
 I will try this soon

I think that's the main problem. I have not seen any SSG with less than 450 windings. Most people recommend more than 850 windings.
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: Feynman on April 27, 2008, 08:51:35 PM
Hey, seems about right time to chime in... ;)

What kind of wire are you guys using for the coil?

I tried to make an electromagnet (to just get my first motor to spin) and I used 26awg (27swg) enameled copper wire , 350' onto a ferrite core.  The resistance I measured was 20ohms.  But when I run 12V through this , there is no magnetic field.  The copper wire just gets hot.  Any ideas?

Here is a picture of my elektromagnet:
(http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/2963/elektrolg7.jpg)

Thanks
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: capacitor70 on April 28, 2008, 04:37:32 AM
I tried to make an electromagnet (to just get my first motor to spin) and I used 26awg (27swg) enameled copper wire , 350' onto a ferrite core.  The resistance I measured was 20ohms.  But when I run 12V through this , there is no magnetic field.  The copper wire just gets hot.  Any ideas?

Coil works as electromagnet without problem, Similar type like yours with ferite core and large number of turns (more than 200 Turns)

Coil shows some times N pole, When connected to DC, some times it atracts the magnet S pole. with Iron or ferrite core.  ??? ???

Soon, I will make 1000 turns bifilar coil...

Check This link http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/atep1.htm (http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/atep1.htm)
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: capacitor70 on April 29, 2008, 05:54:54 AM
 ;D ;D :D  Motor is Running, with two relay coils,  

current taken is 2 to 3mAmps at 12Volts

With relay coil it gives 2 to 3V for transistor drive.
See videos here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mg04c_H5wdY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mg04c_H5wdY)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCKMHHvgmCU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCKMHHvgmCU)
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: Tj138waterboy on February 10, 2014, 03:38:10 AM
Hello all,
Another new builder here that was amazed by the possibilities of the SG and SSG. I have tried after watching many videos and reading countless forums to build my own monopole as close to possible to posted bedini schematics on a vcr head roter. The exception is that I dont have space and cash at this time for the actual bicycle wheel kit and all parts listed aren't readily available. Ok for the lack of schematic knowledge I have I am slowly learning them but from the many I have researched they are all basically the same as this YT video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttY7yLXZSpo.

My build is around 140 turns using 40 feet of 22-gauge run wire and 40 feet of 26-gauge trigger wire on bifilar on same spool it came from in radio shack 315' magnet wire set http://www.radioshack.com/product/in...ductId=2036277
The magnet setup I have tried on hard drive using the curved neo's found inside of the hard drive using 1 epoxied on each side of disk as well as another setup consisting of vcr head with a cd-disc glued to top with 4 1" rectangle magnets from radio shack http://www.radioshack.com/product/in...=2103429spaced evenly like a + and a third setup on another vcr head with 4 tiny button neo's http://www.harborfreight.com/10-piec...ets-67488.html that i figured from the compass method have a north field while laying flat depending on which way it is filpped also in a + configuration.
Ok now free spin of the hard drive rotor is around 20-30 sec while both vcr head rotors will spin for 60-90 sec.
Here is where you guys are going to yell at me. Being on a budget and radio shack not having in stock the 3055 transistor I bought a combo pack for joule thief build consisting of 5 each 2n222a, 2n3904, and 2n4401. http://www.radioshack.com/product/in...ductId=2062586. figuring this could be my main mistake can anyone tell me why these wouldnt work on a small scale such as recharging rechargable batteries aa, aaa, 9v with 6.2v lantern battery as power source or I have various cell phone wall worts that may also be power source depending on reccomendations.
The diodes are another part that I couldn't replicate but I think should still work. I did get the 4001 right but radio shack didn't have the 4007 in stock so I got a 4005 http://www.radioshack.com/product/in...ductId=2049728 instead to go in its place.
Another scolding point is I can't find a ne-2 neon anywhere local so I am trying a 5v led just to see if I am getting a spike from the Emitter to Collector with charge battery disconnected. The LED is lit seemingly from the power source. I then attached DMM to those leads and nothing happens when I pass a magnet by the coil at any distance, it stays same voltage as power source. I have tested the coil for shorts used wire clothes hanger core and air core and I get nothing either way. I have set my circuit up according to all schematics that seem to be the same as youtube video and forums that I have read and I can't figure out where my problem is. If this isn't enough info I can take a picture of my set-up and post it here. Let me know any suggestions please.
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: mscoffman on February 11, 2014, 02:27:51 PM
You are going to need an ne2 neon bulb, if you don't have it just eliminate it (not a great idea long term).
There are those very small inexpensive neon nightlights that are just a 47K or 98K resistors in series
with a ne2 bulb. Carefully cut the plasic off the bulb, then cut the ballast resistor off the
the plug lead. *LEDS will not function correclty for the ne2 in the monopole circuit*


Just a hint, The SGS motor circuit was designed to minimize component count, therefore
the correct functioning of the circuit *depends on parameters of the active transistor*. It may
be possible to add components to adjust parameters of the others, but the easiest thing is to get
a 2n3055 or an NJE direct equivalent. Advance Electronics would be a good source
or any local TV electronics repair shop should have one.


:S:MarkSCoffman
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: Tj138waterboy on February 11, 2014, 02:52:55 PM
I understand the need for the neon bulb in the larger 12 volt applications but again I am going for smaller scale if possible because of the parts I have on hand. I was figuring if I am only trying to charge 1.5 volts max a 3-6 volt led in plave of the ne-2 lamp may be sufficient but regardless of that I still can't get  said 6 volt neon to light up when connected to emitter and base. I can't understand how soo many people are running monopole coils as small as a fingernail and getting enough voltage to charge 12volt batteries and still getting at least 65volt BEMF. I dont know if my transistors are having a negative effect or my coil just isn't big enough though it should be plenty big to give me at least something when passing a magnet by it.
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: TinselKoala on February 11, 2014, 04:52:47 PM
Yes, please post a photo of your setup!

The Bedini motor system works on relatively high-voltage spikes. Simply using smaller transistors and less wire and LEDs instead of neons... you are not making a Bedini motor any more.

The 2n3055 is really cheap and is the recommended transistor to use. Some other transistors that you can find in old CRT TV circuit boards are also good to use, but you should be able to get hold of some 2n3055s easily enough, they are very common. The transistors in your JT kit won't handle the high voltage spikes that are fundamental to the Bedini system, although the metal-can 2n2222a transistor can work well in high-current JTs with spikes of 50 or 60 volts. Any reasonable Bedini rotor-coil system will be making spikes in the hundreds of volts, though, so the smaller transistors don't have a hope of surviving. Not all 2n3055s are created equal, either.... try to find name-branded ones, not generic unlabelled Chinese fakes. The neon is there as a kind of "90 volt fuse" that fires when the spike from the coil exceeds its threshold voltage, and this protects the transistor from these HV spikes. So you can see that an LED would not do the same thing, once you got the coil making the spikes the LED would just fail open and then the transistor would probably die in short order. No pun intended.

I know you are getting tired of watching videos.... especially mine.... but here's how I made my first Bedini monopole motor/charger, when I was helping someone else get started. (If you search this forum you might find that old thread... we finally got his working.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKN0tSLqIYc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKN0tSLqIYc)

There is a better way, IMHO, to make "bedini-style" pulse motors, though, that MileHigh first suggested. We call it the MHOP, and it does everything any Bedini motor does, in terms of charging external caps or batteries, etc. but it's a little more complicated electronics project, probably not for raw beginners, although it's really not that bad.

ETA: The 1n400x rectifier diodes are tough little buggers. The 1n4005 is fine to use instead of the 4007, even though you can get spikes that exceed its voltage rating, it generally can take it since the spikes are so short duration.
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: TinselKoala on February 11, 2014, 05:14:00 PM
Ah... I see in the photo up above your post that the builder is using a lower-voltage system with a TIP122 Darlington transistor. My supplier sells these for 75 cents each, they are common as dirt! And the builder uses a LED and capacitor in place of the neon in the higher voltage system. You might consider trying the circuit he used up above.
Title: Re: just finished my first bedini energizer and already problems :(
Post by: Tj138waterboy on February 17, 2014, 05:10:40 PM
Thanks for the suggestion tinsel. I have since bought a 2n3055 and a TIP31 and still can't get anything spinning but did finally get around 20 Milliamps output spinning by hand. I also scrapped a magnetic window alarm for a reed switch thinking that could be the culprit and still no results. I have since then re-engaged joule thief and ran across the re-emf circuit by Rene. It seems to be doing what I was looking for as far as charging and desulfating same as bedini circuit and with less materials and space. So again thanks for the input and I enjoy your videos.