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Author Topic: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.  (Read 70857 times)

Offline hansvonlieven

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #30 on: March 05, 2008, 12:21:46 AM »
G'day all,

I don't know why they would use such an idiotic system as direct heat from solar collectors such a parabolic mirrors. All you get is erratic behaviour each time a cloud passes. This problem has been solved long ago in submarines that are driven by Stirling motors. (Yes, they exist)

Instead of heating the heat exchanger directly it is embedded in a massive tank filled with aluminium oxide pellets. These pellets are heated with whatever heat source is employed. The advantage is that you get an even flow of heat into the motor  in spite of an erratic or sporadic heat source. Secondly the engine will keep running for a long time after the heat source has disappeared as the pellets store heat and only release it gradually.

Why do the guys that dream up these systems never do their homework?

Hans von Lieven

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #30 on: March 05, 2008, 12:21:46 AM »

Offline Groundloop

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #31 on: March 05, 2008, 05:45:13 AM »
@tinu,

I wish that I could take credit for this idea but I can not!  :D The rotary Stirling engine is invented by Robert L. Dieter and
has a US patent number 7,185,492 B2. It was filed August 3, 2005.

Groundloop.

Offline Groundloop

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #32 on: March 05, 2008, 05:58:00 AM »
@hansvonlieven,

They use such an system as direct heat from solar collectors such a parabolic mirrors because it is much more effective than solar panels at a much lower cost.

I think that the guys that dream up these systems has more imagination then the rest of us!  ;D

Groundloop.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #32 on: March 05, 2008, 05:58:00 AM »
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Offline hansvonlieven

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #33 on: March 05, 2008, 06:36:13 AM »
Not really groundloop,

this looks like a hastily cobbled together project, using well known technology to attract investors.

Only because they have a website, passable graphics and talk big that does not give them credibility. Their project, from what I have seen, is full of holes from an engineering point of view. I doubt they have even a prototype running. This is all concept stuff.

Sorry, but this is my honest opinion until I see something more solid.

Hans von Lieven

Offline Groundloop

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #34 on: March 05, 2008, 07:09:09 AM »
Hans von Lieven,

I'm not sure what web site and guys you are referring to?

Do you state that a Stirling engine generator that are powered from the Sun is not real?

Do you state that you can't get more energy from a Stirling powered system at a lowered cost
than solar panels? (Compared to the area of solar panels vs. the area of parabolic mirrors.)

Groundloop.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #34 on: March 05, 2008, 07:09:09 AM »
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Offline tinu

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #35 on: March 05, 2008, 04:30:17 PM »
@tinu,

I wish that I could take credit for this idea but I can not!  :D The rotary Stirling engine is invented by Robert L. Dieter and
has a US patent number 7,185,492 B2. It was filed August 3, 2005.

Groundloop.

Damn, damn, damn!
Although very busy at work, I was planning to study the idea in deep details. Anyway, during the last evening it was clear to me that it?s not actually a Stirling (no isochrones at all) but still worth of investigating. Biggest challenge would be the gas-tighten requirement for sliding pistons, which is in clear conflict with low drag requirement.
Well, damn again! Nothing new under the Sun and if, by slightest chance, anything new, it?s been patented already.
So, I?ve re-made my mind: It definitely won?t work!  ;D
But we still may buy it in the next year(s).  ;)

Cheers,
Tinu

Offline Groundloop

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #36 on: March 05, 2008, 04:39:01 PM »
@tinu,

I had the same thought. The center steel in the piston must be very good. If the center steel is split in two with a spring in the middle then the gas-tight will be good.

Groundloop.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2008, 05:11:04 PM by Groundloop »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #36 on: March 05, 2008, 04:39:01 PM »
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Offline dutchy1966

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #37 on: March 05, 2008, 10:21:15 PM »
Hi everyone,

Afew days ago I came across a rotary stirling too, although it functions differently from the one groundloop found.
It even has construction details with it.
Maybe we can do something with that idea too....

http://www.emachineshop.com/engine

What you think?

regards

Robert


Offline Gearhead

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #38 on: March 05, 2008, 10:36:27 PM »
Hi everyone,

Afew days ago I came across a rotary stirling too, although it functions differently from the one groundloop found.
It even has construction details with it.
Maybe we can do something with that idea too....

http://www.emachineshop.com/engine

What you think?

regards

Robert
From the website this quote;

"Although this design has less points of friction than a conventional Stirling engine, it is slightly less efficient as it lacks dwell time and a regenerator, and chamber air turbulence is lower. It is not the first pseudo-rotary heat engine but it is the simplest. This site shows the simple parts needed to build the engine. The model shown has a 6 inch chamber diameter."

Rotary or reciprocating with a crankshaft are more complex and prone to breakdowns as well as requiring more machining and parts.  Free piston engines can be sealed easier and promise much longer life and less parts.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #38 on: March 05, 2008, 10:36:27 PM »
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Offline Groundloop

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #39 on: March 06, 2008, 03:25:18 PM »
@dutchy1966,

Thank you for providing the link to the rotary Stirling engine.

@Gearhead,

What we need is something robust that will do the job and last a long time.

Groundloop.

Offline xingu

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #40 on: March 09, 2008, 09:48:20 PM »
Microgen has already developed a combined Stirling motor/generator. If I am correctly informed they can be installed in the central heating of your home using the waste heat of your central heating burner or be placed on the warm water tube spiral, to generate electricity up to a few kW a day. Now this might not be worldshocking, but at least it is a good start.
Also a dutch manufacturer of central heating systems is developing a similar device/system.
So it's not free energy, but could easily contribute to keep your energy bills low(er).

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #40 on: March 09, 2008, 09:48:20 PM »
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Offline Overwrought

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #41 on: March 20, 2008, 11:47:33 PM »
Hello Tinu & folks!

Please bear with me as I'm new to this forum discussion thing and I just happen to blindly find your site yesterday.
I'd like to thank all of you for your constructive & critical thoughts on the Dieter Stirling Engine.  This rotary style Stirling has been a work in progress for my father for many years.  Dad holds an earlier patent from the 70's on an internal combustion rotary which I believe fueled, (no pun intended) this concept.
I cannot tell you the number of highs and lows this animal has incited.  However, after breezing through some of ya'lls topics and issues at this site I think we're in good company.
Within the last few years Dad and I have attempted to do the following: contact, make contact and then be ignored, out right rejected, well received and let down, etc, etc. by "engineers" and "engineering / prototyping firms". On the other hand we've met some truly genuine and helpful people along the way.
For the good news.
We have engaged a firm and have a proof of concept prototype in production with an ETC of 45 days.  The primary objectives: hold compression on the seals and rotate thru the closed curve of constant width with minimal resistance introduced through the seals.  I know this will function.  I'm convinced it will run with any  heat source, solar, geothermal, waste heat exhaust, etc.  The trick is to convert that heat to work as rapidly as possible as well as dissipate the heat on the "cold side" and cycle the process.
Anyone know a good thermodynamics guy?  Optimum material choices per component will be one of our next objectives.
Thanks again to all of you who've taken your time and commented on the merrits of my Dads invention.  Any of your thoughts, constructive, critically constructive or just plain 'ol critical would be appreciated.  I'll keep you posted if interested.

Overwrought aka David Dieter
 

Offline tinu

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #42 on: March 22, 2008, 09:24:25 AM »
Hi David,

It?s very nice to have you here! Hopefully you?ll come with good news on prototyping. I?ll be very interested in hearing about any advancement. Unfortunately corporate power and money are heavy players against good ideas. See Microgen above, which I have to find some time to dig upon.
Definitely I?m interested in keeping contact with you.

Welcome again,
Tinu

Offline magkor

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #43 on: March 22, 2008, 12:08:00 PM »
The Infinia solar stirling engine is essentially what you are trying to make. I know because I had the same idea and have a drawing I made. I then went on-line searching and discovered the idea already was in production. I have a couple variations, though, that I'd like someone to look at.

Cheers

Offline Groundloop

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Re: Closed chamber Stirling engine generator.
« Reply #44 on: March 22, 2008, 02:01:51 PM »
Hi David,

Thank you for posting information here. I'm very intrested in your rotary engine. Please post
informations about your progress. The world need alternative ways of producing energy.

I have one idea to improve your engine. As I understand from your patent description the rotating
and sliding piston must be "air tight" to the cylinder. This will result in a lot of friction and wear
on the piston due to the small "foot print" of the piston to the cylinder at high rpms.

One way to counteract this wear and to keep the piston flush at the cylinder at all time is to use
"floating" spring loaded piston heads. The springs will press the piston material flush against the
cylinder at all time until the piston material is "used up". See my simple drawing.

Thanks again for posting here, I will be looking forward to see more information about your engine.

Regards,
Groundloop.

 

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