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Author Topic: Peter Davey Heater  (Read 490699 times)

nul-points

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #180 on: June 09, 2008, 02:15:31 PM »
Sorry Nul. I thought Sandy would be a woman's name. You know - Grease for example.
"Saandy can't you see, I'm in misery. We made a start now we're apart there's nothing left for me......."
Anyway, next generation Sherlock then. Hows that?

no problem at all - it's a regular assumption!  :)   Sandy is also a Scottish nickname for Alexander - but i guess you'd need some Scottish connections to have heard that

but i appreciate your kind words - i'm actually working on an unrelated electrical anomaly & only came over here to see what ND was up to ;)  - i hope my comments have been some help & encouragement


ND has a major error in his assembly. Davey's has a curved handle and he boils his water using
his hand to put the device inside. The reason is probably to let the cups vibrate more efficiently.

His cups is nothing like Davey's cups and still 1.1COP? (Although fuse blows very soon).
ND will get there as soon as someone sends him bells of the size that is mentioned in the detailed
construction document :) and a handle :)

i agree that there is likely a whole area of freedom in replicating this device & any associated anomalies - i think ND has made a good start - as you say, COPs +/- 1.0 are very impressive for early tests!

i think vibration may be important - but probably not in the handle - i suspect more likely in the mounting of one of the mains electrodes, probably neutral

tests will show, hopefully, if the vibration can be just physical (with good continuous electrical connection) - or else if some vibration with the electrical connection is necessary (see my comments about possible mechanical SCR action, earlier)

i agree that Davey is probably hoping to hide the internals somewhat, but i think the key thing he hasn't mentioned publically is loose electrode mounting

however, he did make a point of mentioning that his heater wasn't approved early on due to safety concerns & i think it's highly likely that the casing also plays an important role in providing earth protection (it also 'contains' the water currently being heated, so this is an important feature too)

all the best
sandy

"...tell me more, tell me more, tell me more" (sorry - a little musical joke there)  ;)

devrimogun

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #181 on: June 09, 2008, 03:24:03 PM »

i agree that there is likely a whole area of freedom in replicating this device & any associated anomalies - i think ND has made a good start - as you say, COPs +/- 1.0 are very impressive for early tests!

"...tell me more, tell me more, tell me more" (sorry - a little musical joke there)  ;)

Sandy,

Of course any input is valuable. I actually would like to transfer you from your anomaly
to this one. Here is my persuasive question : "Do you have any chances at all to get a COP of around
1 with your anomaly in your first try? :)

"well oh well oh well a-ha" (continuing the musical joke)

forest

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #182 on: June 09, 2008, 03:42:09 PM »
I have an idea. Compare Davey device with any such electric heaters. Tha good key for searching among patents is : 'instantaneous electric heater'

I'm searching currently and have found 3 already, but all seems to be related to water flow inside device and to mix AC electrodes in a sandwich : live neutral live neutral live ... and so on..

That kind of separation is as stated most efficient to reduce current.davey is using it also in his heater patent

nul-points

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #183 on: June 09, 2008, 04:25:10 PM »
hi Dev

> "Here is my persuasive question : "Do you have any chances at all to get a COP of around
1 with your anomaly in your first try?"


i'm currently seeing measured (Load Output Energy)/(Total Input Energy) ratios >= 1.1 and (Load + Control Energy)/(Total Input Energy) ratios >= 1.2 on the anomalies i'm investigating

my website below has details


what can you offer on Davey's heater?  ;)


seriously, though, i think my best contribution is to try & encourage folks to start testing, inspect results & then refine (like ND is doing) rather than think that everything has to be 'right' before you can make a start

this (heater) seems to be a very accessible area of experimentation which many people can get involved in both practically & theory-wise

there looks to be plenty of scope for members across the whole range of experience - as long as all safety aspects are carefully handled

it's not often you come across a process which seems to be crying out to have COP measurements taken straight off the bat


@forest
...just seen your latest post - i think the "live neutral live neutral live" electrode sandwich doesn't necessarily reduce current (that can always be varied by adjusting inter-electrode gap) - the real benefit of the 'sandwich' is to maximise water/electrode contact area, which therefore means that you can flow much more water past the heater per minute & still heat to the same level - ie. better suited to inline water-flow heaters than the static container type Davey is using as a 'kettle'

all the best
sandy
Doc Ringwood's Free Energy site  http://ringcomps.co.uk/doc

forest

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #184 on: June 09, 2008, 07:07:47 PM »
What about this : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buzzer ?

"The word "buzzer" comes from the rasping noise that buzzers made when they were electromechanical devices, operated from stepped-down AC line voltage at 50 or 60 cycles."

Interesting

forest

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devrimogun

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #186 on: June 10, 2008, 01:13:54 AM »
hi Dev

> "Here is my persuasive question : "Do you have any chances at all to get a COP of around
1 with your anomaly in your first try?"


i'm currently seeing measured (Load Output Energy)/(Total Input Energy) ratios >= 1.1 and (Load + Control Energy)/(Total Input Energy) ratios >= 1.2 on the anomalies i'm investigating

my website below has details


what can you offer on Davey's heater?  ;)

Doc Ringwood's Free Energy site  http://ringcomps.co.uk/doc


Hi Sandy,
Do those little capacitors really work?
I am just writing this little note to make my amazement public.
COP>1 all over the place! Maybe the time has come I don't know.
But in Davey's place we also offer prolonged life the comes with drinking coffee out of Davey's boilers ;P
You are right! We should all get off our lazy ...ses and replicate the thing as close as we could.
 

b0rg13

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #187 on: June 10, 2008, 02:33:38 AM »
OK. I FOUND SOMETHING WHICH LOOKS LIKEWISE !  :o

http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=ioe_Y56pHng&feature=related



this looks good, i wonder how much power it draws from the mains, or if it could be done with a car battery. :o

nul-points

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #188 on: June 10, 2008, 06:47:06 AM »
OK. I FOUND SOMETHING WHICH LOOKS LIKEWISE !  :o
http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=ioe_Y56pHng&feature=related

yes, same electrical connection as Davey patent - no casing container - no vibration - BUT - lots of boiling water & steam!

this is why i think it's important to start testing straight away to find out what is the baseline - what is the COP of systems like the one in this vid ?

can the COP be improved by: -  adding a container? - making electrode(s) loose physically? - making electrode(s) loose electrically?


this looks good, i wonder ... if it could be done with a car battery. :o

i believe NerzhDishual has tried low volts DC on his Davey setup & reports that he gets a little gas but no boiling

increasing DC (12V-->24V-->36V) starts to increase gas - current follows Ohm's law (approx), so 0.5A,1A,1.5A for the volts just stated - this ties in approx. with his 220V AC results where he's seeing around 10A (taking 220V RMS AC to be equivalent to 220V DC)


Hi Sandy,
Do those little capacitors really work?
I am just writing this little note to make my amazement public.
COP>1 all over the place! Maybe the time has come I don't know.
But in Davey's place we also offer prolonged life the comes with drinking coffee out of Davey's boilers ;P
You are right! We should all get off our lazy ...ses and replicate the thing as close as we could.
at the moment, Dev, i don't know exactly where in the circuit, or why, the anomalies are happening - i'm thinking it's something to do with the pulsed DC charge-switching (H Aspden has predicted OU behaviour of capacitors gaining excess energy from induced 'aether' spin)

this is how i became aware of ND's experiments - both he & i reported in another thread that we had each found a conservation of charge anomaly when charging one capacitor from another

ND went on to look at HHO production - and the Davey heater - and i followed up on the charge anomaly and found there seems to be a connected energy anomaly

this is why i need to be continuing my own practical experiments at the moment - there are lots of good people available & interested here to follow up on the Davey heater - but my cap charge anomaly is just not 'sexy' enough for folks to look into at the moment, just a bunch of waveforms & calculations  :)

i agree, we need to look into unusual claims more & see what is hiding in plain view all around us! - i think it's great that so many people are prepared to do this - despite conventional 'science' making a judgement without doing the experiments ('pre-judgement' is the exact opposite of science!!)

it was left to some very brave people, hundreds of years ago, who were prepared to go 'off the map' to confirm that the world is indeed NOT flat!  :)

all the best
sandy



storre

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #189 on: June 10, 2008, 01:51:10 PM »
I do not think that the spherical casing is anything but an attempt to hide what's inside
from curious eyes like ours. The device is simple! Look at ND there getting 1.1COP with
a setup that hardly resembles Davey's thing.

I mentioned before : If something works it works in many different shapes and ways.
For the moment I propose to assemble something that looks exactly like the device
in the document chapter14.pdf.

Storre you were going to assemble one. What happened to you?
Grinding tooooo easy remember?

I'm still here and reading all the new information :) I live in a very remote location so even getting metal is a slow process. I found a friend that works at a machine shop and on his spare time he is going to help me get and possibly shape the materials like the bells. Wish I lived closer to civilization to take a more active part in this work but then again I wouldn't want to deal with the rest that goes on with tightly packed groups of people stressing out to survive ;)

Regarding the recent postings and also the you tube video where he keeps saying on off on off. Of course we don't know what the temp was before he said on ;) I have a brute force boiler here that I yanked from an electric shower head and it will do the same thing and I'm only use 126v and neutral.

The vibrating electrodes seems a very possible solution but I will try it first with them fixed and spend most of my time adjusting the distance between the 2 bells which is what I think is critical.

About the spherical casing. I did see pictures with just 2 bells but I think at one point he needed to add a safety ground so put a grounded sphere AROUND the 2 bells. Since we can't see what is inside the spherical housing then we can't assume it's only one bell inside.

I hope my stainless steel and brass arrives soon so I can take a more active part in this work :)

devrimogun

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #190 on: June 10, 2008, 01:58:58 PM »
I'm still here and reading all the new information :) I live in a very remote location so even getting metal is a slow process. I found a friend that works at a machine shop and on his spare time he is going to help me get and possibly shape the materials like the bells. Wish I lived closer to civilization to take a more active part in this work but then again I wouldn't want to deal with the rest that goes on with tightly packed groups of people stressing out to survive ;)

Regarding the recent postings and also the you tube video where he keeps saying on off on off. Of course we don't know what the temp was before he said on ;) I have a brute force boiler here that I yanked from an electric shower head and it will do the same thing and I'm only use 126v and neutral.

The vibrating electrodes seems a very possible solution but I will try it first with them fixed and spend most of my time adjusting the distance between the 2 bells which is what I think is critical.

About the spherical casing. I did see pictures with just 2 bells but I think at one point he needed to add a safety ground so put a grounded sphere AROUND the 2 bells. Since we can't see what is inside the spherical housing then we can't assume it's only one bell inside.

I hope my stainless steel and brass arrives soon so I can take a more active part in this work :)

Unfortunately I am unable to access youtube for about a month now
as it has been banned by court order because of some videos
that insulted Ataturk. So until they are removed we are out of youtube here.

My problem that kept me from starting an experiment of my own
was that bike bells are flat when compared to these semi spherical
bells and I did not know where to find such spherical bells.

Some people were leaving for India and so I ordered some singing bells
although they would be probably too big. Then last night I finally got
a good idea from the curved handle that Davey was using. It could be a
part of a chandelier! Then it downed on me, chandeliers from the 80s
had semi spherical metal housing that secured the glass head.

The only problem could be the material of these as they could be made out of
some cheap alloy with poor electrical properties.

Nihilanth

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #191 on: June 11, 2008, 06:28:01 AM »
I thought AC was used because it's supposed to be the same frequency as the hemispheres' mechanical resonance, then wouldn't using DC to split the water probably work better if it were pulsed at the same frequency?

Sprocket

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #192 on: June 11, 2008, 05:14:33 PM »
Using DC should just result in electrolysis.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2008, 05:46:45 PM by Sprocket »

edelind

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #193 on: June 11, 2008, 06:04:26 PM »
He also notes that in his opinion his setup uses the same amount of energy to heat the water as a kettle, which is not what we want to hear - though to get practically instantaneous boiling like we see would take serious current imo, more than is 'apparently' being used...

In my tests I also get the same amount of bubbles. But this is misleading, as the bubbles came from the (little amount of) vaporised water between the 2 bells, not from all the water. As I found out by experience, bubbles does not mean much, as the device does not heat ALL the water at once (with brute-force). This means that we get the same amount of bubbles from brute-force heaters too (with no resonance), but with an inefficient amount of amperage.

As Thrapp also mentioned (here: http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZxnEQssJ4FQ ), the heating at resonance (i.e. by the intense vibration of the bell/sphere) will show no bubbles at all, only smooth heating.

So, IMHO, bubbles = inefficient heating. I also think that even Davey used both ways too heat water (resonance AND brute-force) unlike Thrapp, which used only resonance (with as little as 12V and 0.18 A).

Also, in Davey's device it's easy to figure out when your device resonates (I mean in water), as you can feel the vibration in your hand (do not touch the metal, only the handle!).

Another idea (which should be tested) is this:
Even the inner bell is excited with the mains frequency (50/60Hz), it will vibrate at HIS own frequency. So the smaller the bell, the harder to be excited (more distance between his frequency and the mains), BUT the higher his vibrating frequency, which may agitate the water more rapidly, maybe leading to a faster heating. I think this is why Davey uses SMALL bells, not big ones.

In Thrapp design the situation is different, as he (maybe) uses the exact frequency of the sphere to excite, so the enrgy is bigger (being on its fundamental).

NerzhDishual

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Re: Peter Davey Heater
« Reply #194 on: June 12, 2008, 02:26:52 AM »


Hi Guys,

As I received no 'warning email', sort of:
"A reply has been posted to a topic you are watching by xxx"
I thought this thread was almost dead.... I should had wrongly clicked somewhere
a couple of days ago... So, I vanished... Now, I'm back, and lost!  :P

I have not the time, this evening, to read all the posts I missed.
But I will read them.

As I can see the very bass player  'Sandy' alias 'Dr Ringwood' alias 'Nul_Points' have not lost
his English sense of humor.. Why should he have?  ;D

@Devrim:
Please ask me about any youtube vid you are interested it.
I can download it and upload it on my website.
http://keepvid.com/ is very usefull....

------------------------------------------------
Just for the fun of it, a new page: http://freenrg.info/The_Mess_4OU/

Best