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Author Topic: The Tesla Project  (Read 234039 times)

Offline wattsup

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #345 on: September 26, 2008, 01:55:36 PM »
@amigo

Usually, when someone wants to bash someone else, as a sign of common courtesy to others, the person in question will first state to whom their grand tirade is destined,

Please modify your post and add to whom you are yelling at. We're all ears.

By the way, reading these 10 small pages of thread will not teach you anything. Experimenting will.

But regardless of who you are really talking to, I think you are really barking up the wrong tree. Some people are here day after day, others come once in a while to see what's go'in on, and some, that we understand to have a good grasp of alot of these answers simply because of their greater devotion to study and experimentation come in once and a while and lay it down. So what. Does not mean they have it all. I am sure in many ways, they are also learning from what we try here.

@Ren

There are guys here that use them all the time but they know what they are doing much more then me. There is a guy called @zpfe that  lately wanted to sue Bearden, Bedini and Lindeman and asked members what they thought of this. The guy knows something about PWM so I am putting a part of his last post before he apparently left the forum for good. Too bad, he would have been a good help here.

Quote
I’ve been designing embedded PWM motor controllers for a living for over 20 years. I do know a thing or 2 about this subject. The recoil pulse is not wasted. The inherent body diode inside the Mosfet puts this pulse across the large capacitor that is between the positive supply and ground. (We use schottky diodes for bypass, because it’s faster in response time than the body diode inside the mosfet and it dissipates the heat that the mosfet would have had to deal with).
The rough formula is 100uF for every 1 amp current to the motor.
That is the largest electrolytic capacitor(s) on each and every PWM speed controller.
Unquote

The link to that half page thread is here;
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,5619.msg127796.html#msg127796

Another forum member @gotoluc has recently introduced another new member @JohnUrbanowski I call him @JU for short. He has made a pretty niffty little battery charging circuit that uses some SS but he is paying close attention to the flyback using a return diode, I think just as @zpfe referred to.

That thread is only one page and starts here;
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,5621.msg127695.html#msg127695

Offline clone477

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #346 on: September 26, 2008, 02:42:31 PM »
Wattsup and all,
After reading through the controller patents, I had an idea for the controller.  Tesla used liquid conductors and insulators for the contacts.  I dont know if this would work but I'm willing to try it.  Im thinking of submersing the controller in and insulating liquid, like oil.  Im thinking this might stop alot of the arching Ive been seeing??  Does anyone see any problem with that idea??  Fern

Offline wattsup

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #347 on: September 26, 2008, 03:31:02 PM »
@clone477

In those patents, Tesla is using mercury as a liquid conductor. As the controller rotates via the coil/armature, the mercury is jetted onto each contact making the connections. Other patents are using the same type of method but with rotating brushes or other rotations.

I don't think putting a relay in oil will help. It may actually slow down the movement of the contacts, inhibit proper contact or at worst case, catch on fire.

I think the good thing about those patents is the general information in them and the confirmation of Teslas continued quest to make the ultimate contact. The level of his design elaborations is only a testament to the level of his concern. He wanted better contacts and knew they were of utmost importance. As I was reading through those patents, it was as if Tesla was sitting right beside me talking about a problem we are having today, but that he had over 100 years ago.

Yes there has to be a better way, but what? Now what if a contact had more then one contact. What if, instead of using a relay with one common, one n/o and one n/c, you had a relay with 5 or 10 of these contacts all in parallel. Would this spread out the spark but maintain the same energy transfer punch. Hmmm.

Offline Goat

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #348 on: September 26, 2008, 03:38:38 PM »
@ clone477

I have tried using olive oil to quench the spark on my SSG setup see http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,5024.msg111777.html#msg111777 but what I noticed is that the spark is still there so it's not the same as a magnetic quench setup or liquid metal contacts.

Regards,
Paul

Offline clone477

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #349 on: September 26, 2008, 05:05:20 PM »
Wattsup,
Tesla also said that he used either mercury as a contact OR and electrolyte, thats a safer option.

Offline amigo

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #350 on: September 27, 2008, 02:53:12 AM »
@wattsup

Sorry you see my post as a tirade...I am aware I have not named names, and for a reason. I do not wish to hijack the thread or start a flame-war. Not sure if you got the gist of what I said but what boils my noodle is those (allegedly) "in the know" people. :)

Maybe you have noticed, maybe not, but there are patterns throughout the FE community with people trying to make legends of themselves with various claims of alleged accomplishments. What makes things worse is that they are reinforced but others who repeat like parrots "Well, so and so has done it" and it almost becomes a mantra, or proof undeniable, yet it is unsubstantiated.

Long story short, there are many of us who do not need to go through the "12 step program" to get sober, we have been sober for a long time now. Instead of being spoon fed with some quasi-mystical nonsense and puzzles that should pertain to some higher knowledge that's just around the corner when you solve it (usually there's another puzzle after you solved the first one), let's see those claims out in the open.

All I'm saying is spill out the beans and have others evaluate it and replicate it. Credit will be given where credit is due, no one can dispute the truth - truth stands on its own. That's it. :)

Offline Grumpy

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #351 on: October 01, 2008, 03:51:53 PM »
@ Amigo,

I agree entirely.  Many who speak of Tesla's patent haven't even read them and just assume that secrets are hidden within.

I read the Ozone patent and there is nothing in there that aludes to overunity or self-sustained operation in any way, shape, or form.  The device is a cleverly efficient adaption of a disruptive discharge coil.

If anyone has anything that shows that this device is other than an Ozone Generator that runs off an external source of energy - then, please, enlighten us.

Offline sparks

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #352 on: October 01, 2008, 06:16:09 PM »
      Say instead of producing ozone we are cracking water.   We start with a charged capacitor and discharge into an inductor to create an oscillation of current.   The inductor is the primary in a tesla transformer.  Would we get more energy stored in the form of hydrogen gas then invested in charging the capacitor if we rectify the secondary pulses?
      If instead of cracking water we charge a capacitor:  would it be possible to charge the second capacitor to an energy level in excess of the first capacitor stored energy?  Again rectifying the pulses.
       Is a capacitor able to transfer energy from the electrolyte into the electrical circuit?

Offline allcanadian

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #353 on: October 01, 2008, 10:37:37 PM »
@Amigo
Quote
Long story short, there are many of us who do not need to go through the "12 step program" to get sober, we have been sober for a long time now. Instead of being spoon fed with some quasi-mystical nonsense and puzzles that should pertain to some higher knowledge that's just around the corner when you solve it (usually there's another puzzle after you solved the first one), let's see those claims out in the open.
All I'm saying is spill out the beans and have others evaluate it and replicate it. Credit will be given where credit is due, no one can dispute the truth - truth stands on its own. That's it.
My children have similar thoughts, all they know is that they want and when they get what they want then they want more. Personally I do not subscribe to that kind of nonsense, there is no satisfaction in a job well done, no insight nor understanding, no problem solving ability is developed and it does not build character nor independance, sometimes you have to get your hands dirty to succeed.

@Grumpy
Quote
I read the Ozone patent and there is nothing in there that aludes to overunity or self-sustained operation in any way, shape, or form.  The device is a cleverly efficient adaption of a disruptive discharge coil.
If anyone has anything that shows that this device is other than an Ozone Generator that runs off an external source of energy - then, please, enlighten us.
Tesla's ozone patent is an ozone generator, it is also the foundation for a technology which can extract energy in excess of that supplied to power the circuit.
Some people have said the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. We could say the same thing about the assumptions made by people about some of Tesla's patents, If you want to rely on the perspective of using conventional current to do your work then you are delusional if you think you will ever come out ahead. Tesla's ozone patent is similar to a DC/DC converter in that it will raise the potential of the source but I have yet to see any conventional converter match the efficiency of Tesla's patent which I have built and tested. The problem is not producing currents of high potential/high frequency, the problem is that nobody has a clue as to how the output could be utilized. Consider the quality of current produced on the secondaries in a mechanical perspective, high potential ensures the current has high energy we could see this as a high pressure/ low volume flow compared to a low pressure/high volume flow which is very inefficient. High frequency ensures a minimum forward velocity(current) thus minimal friction. The forces are in oscillation back and forth with minimal forward motion but energy is still transfered. Tesla wants to transfer the high potential energy from the secondaries with almost no losses----- but transfer it where? --and for what reason?
LOL, Im pretty sure Grumpy is just provoking people so someone will give out the answer, maybe it is time to move forward. ;D
I have to go to work for a while, I will give you some the anwers I have found in a couple hours.

Offline Grumpy

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #354 on: October 01, 2008, 11:58:08 PM »

Tesla's ozone patent is an ozone generator, it is also the foundation for a technology which can extract energy in excess of that supplied to power the circuit.


can you elaborate on this?

Offline allcanadian

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #355 on: October 02, 2008, 02:55:39 AM »
@All
I think there are many people here who have built and experimented with tesla's Patent 568177 and most if not all have been left with one single question-----Why? What is the purpose? They might say "I have currents of high potential and frequence now what?". My understanding came only after I understood the nature of what I was dealing with, that is what qualities does this current have in relation to other currents. I think I outlined the qualities well enough in my last post and I think we should be familiar with Tesla's ozone patent so we will take the next step ---- utilization of the currents in the secondaries.
To take the next step we need to put aside EM induction and concentrate on Electrostatic Induction. Here is a good link to the general process-----http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrostatic_induction . At this link there is a picture of an electroscope which I have posted here, a (+) charged wand is brought near the electroscope charging the upper conductor ( - )negative. Next a potential difference(charge seperation) occurs in the electroscope conductor, if the (+) foil leaves inside the electroscope are grounded then the electroscope conductor could be said to have a "net" negative charge, making the wand and electroscope a capacitor. I see this a little different, the (+) charged wand produces a ( - )negative field around itself as all forces must balance, the electroscope enters the negative field and is charged negatively producing the charge seperation.
In the circuit below (lower right) we have Tesla's Patent 568177, the secondaries L2 have high potential/high frequency currents alternating, that is one end of the secondaries will be charged positive then negative and back to positive repeatedly at a high frequency and high potential. In the one instance shown, one end of the secondaries L2 is positive, I see this positive end as expanded electrons. The capacitor C2 is connected to the positive secondary L2, the diode only allows potential to flow in one direction so the positive plate of C2 will never be charged negative. I am using electron flow notation (negative flows to positive) so all of this may seem confusing, think of negative as tightly packed electrons(compressed) and positive as loosely packed electrons(expanded)---- each flows to the other equally. Now think of the electroscope, the positive plate of C2 is the wand and the negative plate of C2 is the top of the electroscope. In order for the forces to balance in C2 electrons must flow through ground through the battery (B2) charging it and into the negative plate of C2, the battery (B2)charges because its potential is 12 volts and the potential at C2 is thousands of volts. If there was no ground you would only have a charge seperation in the circuit but you would not have a "net" charge on the negative plate of C2, just like in the electroscope example. We should understand that the only current flow is from ground to the negative plate of C2, the positive plate of C2 has no current it has a "static" charge not unlike a statically charged balloon might have. When the capacitor C2 has equalized its charge on both plates the DPDT relay switches over and the high potential on C2 charges the battery (B2) again ;D. L2 must then recharge the positive plate of C2 with potential. The battery has been charged twice and all you have done is charge one plate of a capacitor on C2. You may have figured out that there could be many capacitors at the position where capacitor C2 is as well the circuit outlined by the red box could be replicated many times over on one end of the secondary L2. The secondary L2 also has two ends :o, each having a changing potential as such both ends can be utilized. I believe this process is what many inventors have refered to as using potential only, no current as current will only discharge the source of the potential. There is also an issue of electrical inertia in the battery (B2) which must be considered in the timing of this circuit, but things get a little complicated so there is no need to confuse the issue at this point. This is the only explanation I have for what I have seen in my circuits, the battery B2 charges and is equalized periodically with the other battery B1 and both charge.
Regards
AC

Offline sparks

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #356 on: October 02, 2008, 05:36:17 AM »
      Once we get the voltage high enough and the pulse short enough the energy represented by the electron orbital and angular momentum is now in a seperate inertial frame than the neucleus.  Air is now ionized and the oxygen molecule has been oxidized in the spark gap.  And e=mc2  kicks in when we consider the mass of the oxygen atom losing the mass of the electrons.  These three observations should be enough see that  energy is being transferred into the electrical system from the mass between the capacitor plates.  No majic,  just transfer of a little bit of energy very quickly into an energy flow system.   It's pretty much like each atom becoming a series connected battery!

Offline Ren

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #357 on: October 02, 2008, 10:13:03 AM »
Hmmm. AC thanks for the info. I hate to say it but I see so many links to what Bedini talks about. Anyway, enough of that.

I have built a rough replica finally, with the parts I could afford and/or build myself. I was amazed to see the microwave cap on the secondaries almost instantly shoot over 1000v (max on my meter) at the right level of tune. Mosfet circuit may not be ideal, but it makes for some easy tinkering. Awaiting a scope and more accurate meter for more details.

I think I will re-read your latest post, and then read it again. And then again.

Offline otto

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #358 on: October 02, 2008, 11:13:39 AM »
Hello all,

you all have to understand that we have 2 various kinds of energies, to say so.

1. our classical, we use it and its well understood

2. I will call it Aether energy

its working with high voltages and low currents and is "made" with kicks, as we say in the TPU thread.
Of course, this energy we can also convert into a usefull energy.

I have nothing more to say on this.

Otto

Offline allcanadian

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Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #359 on: October 02, 2008, 02:49:16 PM »
@Ren
Quote
Hmmm. AC thanks for the info. I hate to say it but I see so many links to what Bedini talks about. Anyway, enough of that.
I think this is what Bedini has been doing all along whether he knows it or not. His Bifiliar coil under the influence of the inductive discharge becomes electrically charged as a capacitor would. As well I have found that a battery will slowly charge to some extent by simple charging one terminal of the battery with high potential because a battery is a capacitor. If one set of plates is charged the other set will seek to balance itself with them, but its only source of energy is the space surrounding the plates.
I should have stated this is not my invention, it is not even my idea. At the beginning of this thread Erfinder said he could charge any number of capacitors with this circuit--- and he told us how to do it. He also mentioned something about charging a shorted capacitor, I take this to mean a capacitor with the leads connected together----How do you charge a capacitor with the leads connected together? I would charge the capacitor with shorted leads then unshort them and connect one lead to ground leaving me with a charged capacitor.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2008, 03:54:00 PM by allcanadian »