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### Author Topic: The Tesla Project  (Read 238608 times)

#### M@rcel

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 95
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #240 on: March 21, 2008, 10:45:00 PM »
@marcel
Charge both sides of a capacitor equally with the same potential at the same time, then disconnect one side of the cap and discharge it to ground, you now have one plate of the cap charged and one discharged  (a potential difference). Connect the "charged" cap back in a circuit and discharge it to perform work. If BOTH plates of the capacitor are charged together it is One plate of a capacitor, there is no current flow persay, we are talking about Electrostatic induction.

An interesting idea, but unfortunately in the world of physics it does not work like this. both sides of a capacitor are trying to neutralize with one another, if you were to connect one side to ground, it would not discharge into it, rather it would stay the same. Try it for yourself, think about the physics of a capacitor, and why this would be so.

Your line of thought in this area is flawed, what you are inducing in other objects through electrostatic induction is a polarity, that once brought out of the field will neutralize itself.
When both plates are charged with the same charge and the terminals are both disconnected, the charge has no way to go (if we ignore leakage). So no neutralization is possible. Connecting one terminal to ground would make that plate and ground equalize (in practice the plate would level it's charge with ground). When we disconnect this terminal from ground again, we have two differently charged plates.

Where is the flaw?

Why would we first want to discharge half of the charge (one plate) to ground? Why not use it by putting the load between the plate and earth?

#### quantum1024

• Newbie
• Posts: 47
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #241 on: March 22, 2008, 12:01:01 AM »
charging a body was never the problem--- producing a way to discharge it to perform work was.Now you know what the secondaries are for.

This is exactly what i was going to say a week ago, and couldn't get it down into words.
So if i read correctly, i can take my now impulse currents coming from a cap and discharge point and drive a coil which then drives the load. yea, but this is classic Tesla, am i missing something? help.

edit: I tried this in every fashion, nope, can't really run my load very well. even under resonance. no go.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2008, 02:09:07 AM by quantum1024 »

#### wattsup

• Hero Member
• Posts: 2606
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #242 on: March 22, 2008, 02:05:31 AM »
@AC

I'm still confused. Even with a secondary, if the cap is shorted and connected to the two wires of the secondary, isn't this like having all four wires connected together.

See diagram below. I would really like to understand this.

#### innovation_station

• Hero Member
• Posts: 5134
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #243 on: March 22, 2008, 02:07:31 AM »
OK.  I agree.

Do you care to talk about these opposites?

hi grumpy

i do have something to make you think about that pattend

what is G? in the pattend

hummm

kinda looks important.....  in fact i think i have seen that symble .....    many places  no?

ist

Id have to say the motor is pretty important seeing its obviouslly the timing mechanism/and used in his circuits as a source of high inductance.as well the motor  windings are hooked to the primary transmitting coil.

well this needs much talk .... as i can see

also in that pattend i have another question where is the VACUME TUBE?!?!?!?!

IST

#### armagdn03

• Sr. Member
• Posts: 441
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #244 on: March 22, 2008, 06:56:08 AM »
@marcel
Charge both sides of a capacitor equally with the same potential at the same time, then disconnect one side of the cap and discharge it to ground, you now have one plate of the cap charged and one discharged  (a potential difference). Connect the "charged" cap back in a circuit and discharge it to perform work. If BOTH plates of the capacitor are charged together it is One plate of a capacitor, there is no current flow persay, we are talking about Electrostatic induction.

An interesting idea, but unfortunately in the world of physics it does not work like this. both sides of a capacitor are trying to neutralize with one another, if you were to connect one side to ground, it would not discharge into it, rather it would stay the same. Try it for yourself, think about the physics of a capacitor, and why this would be so.

Your line of thought in this area is flawed, what you are inducing in other objects through electrostatic induction is a polarity, that once brought out of the field will neutralize itself.
When both plates are charged with the same charge and the terminals are both disconnected, the charge has no way to go (if we ignore leakage). So no neutralization is possible. Connecting one terminal to ground would make that plate and ground equalize (in practice the plate would level it's charge with ground). When we disconnect this terminal from ground again, we have two differently charged plates.

Where is the flaw?

Why would we first want to discharge half of the charge (one plate) to ground? Why not use it by putting the load between the plate and earth?

you started out with two  charged plates, and you end with two charged plates.............this is not hard. have you measured the potential difference before and after?

#### quantum1024

• Newbie
• Posts: 47
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #245 on: March 22, 2008, 07:21:37 AM »
ummmm.....I think i'm going to have to rethink my controller and find materials that do not disintegrate. it eat my copper plates and is munching it's way directly towards the extra bonus points lane. LOL. not even pac-man was this much fun!!!

#### quantum1024

• Newbie
• Posts: 47
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #246 on: March 22, 2008, 08:39:39 AM »

So what is "G" ??

Tesla says in "experiments with alternate currents of high potential and high frequency-1892"...

G is an ordinarily constructed alternator, supplying the primary P  of an induction coil, the secondary S  of which charges the condensers or jars C C.  The terminals of the secondary are connected to the inside coatings of the jars, the outer coatings being connected to the ends of the primary p p of a second induction coil.  This primary p p has a small air gap a b.

#### Gustav22

• Full Member
• Posts: 181
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #247 on: March 22, 2008, 09:39:43 AM »
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,3972.msg84312.html#msg84312
you did not use N for secondary and M for primary consistently. This confused me a bit, initially.
For example here:
.... one plate of a capacitor as a whole, the primary N is the other plate ...
And you also talk about "the secondaries" as if there were several of them.

However, I think the posting is very important, so you might want to revise it a bit and make it even more clear.
Thank you for the explanation contained in it.
I will try to rephrase the part, which I think I understood and I will start out from your question

.... I wonder what might happen if as the the primary M potential started to rise and peak the secondary was disconnected? ...

As far as I see this is exactly what happens in teslas circuit.

Secondary N is an open circuit which has 2 ends (P). Each of these ends represents a plate of a capacitor.
You call this arrangement a "shorted capacitor".

Ok, if what you describe happens,
i.e. when primary (M) is at max. potential and secondary (N) is open circuit,
secondary N would get charged (as a whole). This is where your example applies, with the red balloon charging the blue one.
Where would the charges for the secondary come from? Well, form "radiant energy", or to put it in other words, from the "thin air"  between plates (P). This would lead to ozone production between the two plates (P),
probably much like Stan Meyer produced fractured water or "Hydroxy" !?

And yes, after the secondary N got charged in this way, N as a whole could be viewed as a charged capacitor plate, with the primary (M) representing the other charged plate, to complement it.

Is this the proper understanding of what you are saying?
« Last Edit: March 22, 2008, 04:45:02 PM by Gustav22 »

#### am1ll3r

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 59
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #248 on: March 22, 2008, 02:01:09 PM »
ummmm.....I think i'm going to have to rethink my controller and find materials that do not disintegrate. it eat my copper plates and is munching it's way directly towards the extra bonus points lane. LOL. not even pac-man was this much fun!!!

@quantum1024
Hey there I have been using a small piece of copper pipe with electrical tape for the insulated pieces mounted to my motor that came out of an old HO train. The contacts are the pieces of the train that rested against the wheels. It actually works pretty good and to change the make and break points all I have to do is add or remove tape.

#### quantum1024

• Newbie
• Posts: 47
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #249 on: March 22, 2008, 02:24:03 PM »

@am1ll3r
ohhhhhh!!!! Thats Nice!  i'll try that. I was thinking about it already last week when i made the first model. but then I was already committed into the first model and went ahead with it.

do you have a control on the motor? I was thinking of using a 555 timer as a pwm motor controller at 12vdc. for spectacular effects I use solder wick, more contacts per mm surface area. but for load control, a single contact works nice. either way - I love the Colors!

#### innovation_station

• Hero Member
• Posts: 5134
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #250 on: March 22, 2008, 03:22:53 PM »

@am1ll3r
ohhhhhh!!!! Thats Nice!  i'll try that. I was thinking about it already last week when i made the first model. but then I was already committed into the first model and went ahead with it.

do you have a control on the motor? I was thinking of using a 555 timer as a pwm motor controller at 12vdc. for spectacular effects I use solder wick, more contacts per mm surface area. but for load control, a single contact works nice. either way - I love the Colors!

hey guys

where do you all think my no control tpu came from ......??

you all arnt gonna make me post the pattend and explain how it is possible to achive a no control motor / timeing unit...eh??

may i suggest you all study ....

i have scoped the wave and discovered some time ago how it is controled

also when this device is exposed all the hows and whys then i think you all just
may be blowen away as i was a bout 4 months ago......

best of luck  i have done my best on less than a shoe string budget .....

enjoy

and i gave it away  for no cost    and you all know what it makes me feel good    to do this !!

so i saw my children yesterday for the first time in a long time....  it sure reminds me of what LOVE is....

so i showed BLYSS my latest dwg and she says daddy build a dirt bike daddy just give it a push she says....

LOVE THIS IS WHAT IT IS ALL ABOUT.....

IST

#### quantum1024

• Newbie
• Posts: 47
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #251 on: March 22, 2008, 04:22:30 PM »
No i won't ask you that, just the patent number, no explanation required. and if this is the automatic
magnetic quench circuit, i have already read that.

#### M@rcel

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 95
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #252 on: March 22, 2008, 04:24:41 PM »
so i saw my children yesterday for the first time in a long time....  it sure reminds me of what LOVE is....

• Hero Member
• Posts: 1317
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #253 on: March 22, 2008, 04:26:18 PM »
@armagdn03
Quote
An interesting idea, but unfortunately in the world of physics it does not work like this
We have a winner!    If we divided the whole we would have two halves because we are dealing with surface charges thus surface area of a charged body. This seems to be the case in everything we build , we are always losing something in the process through every step we make. I can't say I believe what I posted to any extent but there is a paradox somewhere in my ramblings, the properties of high voltage open possiblities far removed from low voltage current we are used to dealing with. I have been thinking on this whacky capacitor theory for a while and damned if I can find a way to make it work.
Best Regards

#### quantum1024

• Newbie
• Posts: 47
##### Re: The Tesla Project
« Reply #254 on: March 22, 2008, 05:14:04 PM »
@allcanadian --> damned if I can find a way to make it work.

edit: I know what you mean, scratching your head on a problem for days even weeks.

@all
take time for the moment and think rapid inductive collapse of a transformer! no caps anywhere in the circuit. then think about the quick disruptive discharge, visualize it. now picture a load on the secondary. what will it do. picture each disruptive discharge and how it effects the load and the transformer. now go and build it.

Experiment 1
step 1: do the following. find a transformer, any type of power transformer will do (try different types). get a battery 12vdc, and tap one of the coils on the transformer rapidly (one lead tapped one lead held in place). I would start with the primary or lowest resistance reading. continue tapping rapidly and see if you can reach a point where you notice something interesting, like an increase in the output spark. Connect a load (lightbulb 7-20 watts- play here.) on the other side of the transformer. PLAY. two-three parts and thats it. nothing fancy. enjoy.

Step 2: now add a neo magnet to one of the poles of the battery, and again begin tapping rapidly. note the intensity of the arcs as you do this. this is called magnetic quenching.

So here we have the basics:

1) rapid inductive coil charging
2) rapid inductive collapse creating disruptive discharges
3) and magnetic quenching

report findings! what did you see? what happened?

« Last Edit: March 23, 2008, 09:59:51 AM by quantum1024 »