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Author Topic: Being Decent To Each Other  (Read 24506 times)

Offline Omnibus

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #15 on: November 12, 2007, 01:26:22 AM »
Now, look who's giving opinions--the biggest offender. As for the magnet motors, these are the most promising. Remember, in this area (SMOT being part of it) it has been conclusively proven for the first time that CoE can be violated. No other area has so well expressed, rigorous scientific evidence to that effect. No wonder why the tensions are higher here. In addition, here's the first promising application of SMOT for continuous production of energy from nothing--@xpenzif's motor. Exciting times.

Lisa, in this house, we obey the laws of thermodynamics!
See, the thing is, you don't even know exactly what you're talking about. You've heard this and are repeating it without deeper knowledge of it. You should know that laws of thermodynamics aren't disobeyed in most cases even with this discovery. What we are talking now is about one very special case which, of course, is enough to overthrow the general validity of CoE. However, technical thermodynamics or chemical thermodynamics remain as we know them. Those who have taken courses in these disciplines, take chemical thermodynamics, for instance, know that in the very introduction a statement is made that all observations will be in absence of magnetic fields. Of course, in the future the exception may become the rule because efforts will be redirected into exploring what now is the exception. For obvious reasons. As of today and foreseeable future, however, not to worry, chemical thermodynamics will still govern basic education in, say, chemistry.

First of all, lighten up.  That was a Simpsons reference.  It does not demand a fully thought-out rebuttal.

Next, the First Law of Thermodynamics states, "The increase in the internal energy of a system is equal to the amount of energy added by heating the system, minus the amount lost as a result of the work done by the system on its surroundings."  See, no room for energy out of nothing.
That's because, as I said, regrettably, your knowledge in these matters is only marginal. This can be improved, I'm not saying it can't but as of today it's in a sorry state. Now, regarding the definition you gave. That's an expression of the 'transformation' part of the principle of CoE. This part I've never said has been violated and, as a matter of fact, I'm using exactly this part in my analysis. In the US the 'principle of conservation and transformation of energy' is uttered, to simplify life, as 'principle of conservation of energy' but, as I said, it really has two sides. In sciences nowadays said principle is mostly applied having in mind its 'transformation' aspect. And it holds good, as I already said. This is in fact what you have cited and no one has any quarrel with it. It's interesting to take a look at Lomonosov's works who very well may be the true discoverer of that principle. You'll see there that still in those days the principle was presented and recognized with its two sides.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2007, 01:47:22 AM by Omnibus »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #15 on: November 12, 2007, 01:26:22 AM »

Offline nightlife

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #16 on: November 12, 2007, 01:37:25 AM »
 Respect, what exactly is that? Respect is an assumption of good faith and competence in another person or in the whole of oneself. Depth of integrity, trust, complementary moral values, and skill are necessary components.

 Please keep this in mind the next time you disagree with someone. Try to just agree to disagree and or help them out if know of a better way.

 I have noticed that magnetic motors are the hardest and in most cases, the most impossible motors to get people to believe that they can and or do work.
 I have personally came across a few that can work if they just changed and or added a couple things. You all would not believe how close a couple of these members are to achieving over unity using just permanent magnets.
 
 I have figured out a way to achieve over unity using electronic magnets and now thanks to a few others here, I now can do it using permanent magnets. Please don?t make fun of people or call them names because you don't agree with them, you would be surprised by what others can learn from others mistakes and if you chase people away by being disrespectful to them, then we will have less people making mistakes that some others can figure out and perfect them to actually work.

 Remember this as well as the fact that disrespect is what is hurting mankind more then anything else.

Offline Omnibus

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2007, 01:42:54 AM »
In the end ideas and concepts will stand or fall on their own merit. Lets address them directly not by attacking personally that individual that proposes them. What do we accomplish by insults and namecalling and implying that a person is incompentent or without merit.
We are all ignorant of different things.
Change is hard!

This is very idealistic and the world would've been a much better place if indeed ideas and concepts will stand or fall on their own merit. This is never so. There has always been a fierce battle between ideas in Science and, unfortunately, many of the ridiculously wrong ideas such as the "theory" of relativity have taken over because those forces supporting it were waging a more efficient, ugly, better financed, meaner battle to install that "theory" while the forces who saw its flaws have been meek and naive as you are, waiting for this stupidity to collapse on its own. It will never happen without fighting it. The "theory" of relativity is an example of one of the most incorrect ideas Science has accepted in its realm of doctrines and still there are quarters in which it persists, let alone that taxpayers are paying millions upon millions for stupid experiments to verify it, something that will never happen. There have been other errors in the Sciences, many of them rightfully rejected, others still persisting in one form or another. For instance, it has already become obvious that another deeply ingrained idea, that of CoE as a general principle, also doesn't stand the scrutiny of the scientific method. Enemies of the scientific method are plenty. Opportunists seeing that it pays more to be conservative and be blind to the facts are abundant. Among these, little minds who don't even know what they're talking about but pretending to discuss science are also standing in the way. It's a mess. And the scales are overwhelmingly inclined towards the status quo. It's safer there. Therefore, someone must take measures and try to fight for reason to be reinstated in these matters. That's inevitable.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2007, 01:42:54 AM »
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Offline Omnibus

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2007, 01:46:27 AM »
Respect, what exactly is that? Respect is an assumption of good faith and competence in another person or in the whole of oneself. Depth of integrity, trust, complementary moral values, and skill are necessary components.

 Please keep this in mind the next time you disagree with someone. Try to just agree to disagree and or help them out if know of a better way.

 I have noticed that magnetic motors are the hardest and in most cases, the most impossible motors to get people to believe that they can and or do work.
 I have personally came across a few that can work if they just changed and or added a couple things. You all would not believe how close a couple of these members are to achieving over unity using just permanent magnets.
 
 I have figured out a way to achieve over unity using electronic magnets and now thanks to a few others here, I now can do it using permanent magnets. Please don?t make fun of people or call them names because you don't agree with them, you would be surprised by what others can learn from others mistakes and if you chase people away by being disrespectful to them, then we will have less people making mistakes that some others can figure out and perfect them to actually work.

 Remember this as well as the fact that disrespect is what is hurting mankind more then anything else.
Are you going to surprise us as @xpenzif did? Go ahead, post a video. As for respect, ignorance, especially arrogant ignorance must never be respected.

Offline bastonia

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2007, 01:46:40 AM »
@billmehess,

Thank you bringing these issues to light. 
 
In addition my personal feelings of watching these "like minded" battle it out,  is that they choose to discourage vs encourage.  This line of banter has "encouraged" me hold my thoughts, ideas, and concepts to myself, and I will probably continue this line of thought until this board becomes civilized.

As for the comment that things fall apart only at the magnet motor issues ... which is not the case, ...

Take a lesson from "everyone's grandmother" and "If you don't have something nice to say don't say it!"


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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2007, 01:46:40 AM »
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Offline Omnibus

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #20 on: November 12, 2007, 01:54:55 AM »
@billmehess,

Thank you bringing these issues to light. 
 
In addition my personal feelings of watching these "like minded" battle it out,  is that they choose to discourage vs encourage.  This line of banter has "encouraged" me hold my thoughts, ideas, and concepts to myself, and I will probably continue this line of thought until this board becomes civilized.

As for the comment that things fall apart only at the magnet motor issues ... which is not the case, ...

Take a lesson from "everyone's grandmother" and "If you don't have something nice to say don't say it!"


Not so. Your grandmother is wrong. She may be right for the every day social contacts. She's wrong, however, if she also meant it when Science is being discussed. When you see injustice, incompetence, stupidity, arrogant stupidity, confront it. That's a must. If you're withholding ideas because of fears that you'll be attacked, you aren't convinced enough in these ideas.and you won't be able to defend them properly. The best then is to do what you're doing, withhold them. Believe me, it isn't a useful discussion to throw in just any idea that comes to mind. You have to think it through carefully before posting, out of respect for the other participants. Same applied to a criticism. Just to say you reject something for the sake of rejecting it is really bad style of conducting a scientific discourse, to put it mildly.

Offline billmehess

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #21 on: November 12, 2007, 01:57:52 AM »
I believe bastonia's post is the core of the discussion, he is holding back his contribution until the forem become "civilized". Because of the fear of belittling I wonder how many more people like him are out there.
Egos are not important here, there are certain individuals in this forem (actually there is quite a number of them)  that I consider to be "elder statemen" . Let them come forward in a spirit of teaching and cooperation.

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #21 on: November 12, 2007, 01:57:52 AM »
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Offline Omnibus

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #22 on: November 12, 2007, 02:02:11 AM »
I believe bastonia's post is the core of the discussion, he is holding back his contribution until the forem become "civilized". Because of the fear of belittling I wonder how many more people like him are out there.
Egos are not important here, there are certain individuals in this forem (actually there is quite a number of them)  that I consider to be "elder statemen" . Let them come forward in a spirit of teaching and cooperation.
This isn't a church, my dear. I'm telling you this once more. I understand your good intentions. You're good man. But this will never happen. This is the essence of things. The more important the topic the more the tensions get into high pitch.

Offline bastonia

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #23 on: November 12, 2007, 02:05:36 AM »
@Ominibus,

Fine... you and your kind are solely responsible for destroying the positive energy that once was on this site,  and all others members who have come out to learn about over-unity for the first time and you cut them down until they have no desire to continue or experience, to learn and grow on the path themselves.

The road to success takes many different roads.  There isn't just one.  If everyone takes the same road ... then there will be no new discoveries for all the journeys will become the same.

Congratulations,  by squashing so many you have doomed yourself and everyone else.


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #23 on: November 12, 2007, 02:05:36 AM »
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Offline shruggedatlas

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #24 on: November 12, 2007, 02:09:10 AM »
In the end ideas and concepts will stand or fall on their own merit. Lets address them directly not by attacking personally that individual that proposes them. What do we accomplish by insults and namecalling and implying that a person is incompentent or without merit.
We are all ignorant of different things.
Change is hard!

This is very idealistic and the world would've been a much better place if indeed ideas and concepts will stand or fall on their own merit. This is never so. There has always been a fierce battle between ideas in Science and, unfortunately, many of the ridiculously wrong ideas such as the "theory" of relativity have taken over because those forces supporting it were waging a more efficient, ugly, better financed, meaner battle to install that "theory" while the forces who saw its flaws have been meek and naive as you are, waiting for this stupidity to collapse on its own. It will never happen without fighting it. The "theory" of relativity is an example of one of the most incorrect ideas Science has accepted in its realm of doctrines and still there are quarters in which it persists, let alone that taxpayers are paying millions upon millions for stupid experiments to verify it, something that will never happen. There have been other errors in the Sciences, many of them rightfully rejected, others still persisting in one form or another. For instance, it has already become obvious that another deeply ingrained idea, that of CoE as a general principle, also doesn't stand the scrutiny of the scientific method. Enemies of the scientific method are plenty. Opportunists seeing that it pays more to be conservative and be blind to the facts are abundant. Among these, little minds who don't even know what they're talking about but pretending to discuss science are also standing in the way. It's a mess. And the scales are overwhelmingly inclined towards the status quo. It's safer there. Therefore, someone must take measures and try to fight for reason to be reinstated in these matters. That's inevitable.

If correct, your ideas are revolutionary.  As you know, I have my doubts, but you are right in that I am not qualified to rigorously evaluate them.  At any rate, they are unfortunately being largely uheard.  This is a fringe forum which I am sure not too many serious scientists visit.  I think you would gain alot more traction if you got some validation from your peers.  I am sure it would also give you much satisfaction. 

I have no idea if you are even interested in this, but I venture to guess you might be, seeing as how diligently you defend your positions against all comers.  Surely there is somewhere you can be heard?  Perhaps the University at which you work has a venue for you to be published?  If you won over even a small section of the mainstream, that is that many more more people who may be motivated in making the SMOT work in a productive fashion and validate your ideas.  Your views on Einstein's theory would be heard as well.

Offline Omnibus

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #25 on: November 12, 2007, 02:17:50 AM »
@Ominibus,

Fine... you and your kind are solely responsible for destroying the positive energy that once was on this site,  and all others members who have come out to learn about over-unity for the first time and you cut them down until they have no desire to continue or experience, to learn and grow on the path themselves.

The road to success takes many different roads.  There isn't just one.  If everyone takes the same road ... then there will be no new discoveries for all the journeys will become the same.

Congratulations,  by squashing so many you have doomed yourself and everyone else.


You'd better read again what I told you. It contains the answer to this post as well.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #25 on: November 12, 2007, 02:17:50 AM »
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Offline nightlife

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #26 on: November 12, 2007, 02:20:59 AM »
Omnibus, "Are you going to surprise us as @xpenzif did?

 I am not here to surprise anyone, I am here to learn of new ways to solve our energy crises. I have found a few ways so far and I come back here every once in a while to see if there are any new ideas that I think could work.

 The only true cure we have at this time is by way of using magnets. We must stay away from using any alternative fuel because we need those things for our planets survival.

 Magnets are the only thing we should even consider using as a energy source.

Offline Omnibus

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #27 on: November 12, 2007, 02:27:47 AM »
In the end ideas and concepts will stand or fall on their own merit. Lets address them directly not by attacking personally that individual that proposes them. What do we accomplish by insults and namecalling and implying that a person is incompentent or without merit.
We are all ignorant of different things.
Change is hard!

This is very idealistic and the world would've been a much better place if indeed ideas and concepts will stand or fall on their own merit. This is never so. There has always been a fierce battle between ideas in Science and, unfortunately, many of the ridiculously wrong ideas such as the "theory" of relativity have taken over because those forces supporting it were waging a more efficient, ugly, better financed, meaner battle to install that "theory" while the forces who saw its flaws have been meek and naive as you are, waiting for this stupidity to collapse on its own. It will never happen without fighting it. The "theory" of relativity is an example of one of the most incorrect ideas Science has accepted in its realm of doctrines and still there are quarters in which it persists, let alone that taxpayers are paying millions upon millions for stupid experiments to verify it, something that will never happen. There have been other errors in the Sciences, many of them rightfully rejected, others still persisting in one form or another. For instance, it has already become obvious that another deeply ingrained idea, that of CoE as a general principle, also doesn't stand the scrutiny of the scientific method. Enemies of the scientific method are plenty. Opportunists seeing that it pays more to be conservative and be blind to the facts are abundant. Among these, little minds who don't even know what they're talking about but pretending to discuss science are also standing in the way. It's a mess. And the scales are overwhelmingly inclined towards the status quo. It's safer there. Therefore, someone must take measures and try to fight for reason to be reinstated in these matters. That's inevitable.

If correct, your ideas are revolutionary.  As you know, I have my doubts, but you are right in that I am not qualified to rigorously evaluate them.  At any rate, they are unfortunately being largely uheard.  This is a fringe forum which I am sure not too many serious scientists visit.  I think you would gain alot more traction if you got some validation from your peers.  I am sure it would also give you much satisfaction. 

I have no idea if you are even interested in this, but I venture to guess you might be, seeing as how diligently you defend your positions against all comers.  Surely there is somewhere you can be heard?  Perhaps the University at which you work has a venue for you to be published?  If you won over even a small section of the mainstream, that is that many more more people who may be motivated in making the SMOT work in a productive fashion and validate your ideas.  Your views on Einstein's theory would be heard as well.
I'm in the process of doing this. Just a remark--don't consider that because it's a fringe forum it's no good. Any forum is good where there are advances. Believe me, more interesting science is done in forums like this than in most of the so-called research universities. Look at the publications in the peer-reviewed journals. They overwhelmingly are doing nothing else but polluting the environment with nonsense printed on paper which has come as a result of destroying the forests of the world. Environmentalists, I think, should take a serious look at that. History repeats itself--didn't I tell you that the most important discoveries in Physics were made by non-physicists. Same now--the most important developments occur outside of the academia in what you call fringe forums and groups.

Offline Omnibus

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #28 on: November 12, 2007, 02:30:38 AM »
Omnibus, "Are you going to surprise us as @xpenzif did?

 I am not here to surprise anyone, I am here to learn of new ways to solve our energy crises. I have found a few ways so far and I come back here every once in a while to see if there are any new ideas that I think could work.

 The only true cure we have at this time is by way of using magnets. We must stay away from using any alternative fuel because we need those things for our planets survival.

 Magnets are the only thing we should even consider using as a energy source.
That's good that you think so but what exactly are you basing your firm conviction on? Why are you hiding it? Show it to us. Maybe you've done something we've never seen before. See what happened with @xpenzif, a guy no one paid too much attention to before he came up with his motor.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2007, 02:57:02 AM by Omnibus »

Offline billmehess

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Re: Being Decent To Each Other
« Reply #29 on: November 12, 2007, 02:51:44 AM »
Believe it or not this post was not all about Omnibus. He is a bit of a hard case but I guess that is his charm and cross to bare.
This was a general post for all members if one choses not to participate and others do then it has great value and hopefully some good will come from it. The advancement of knowledge and the sharing of ideas is the core value of this forum and the views of any one person should and cannot be the governing criteria. Again we all have to defend our positions but it is how we defend those positions that determine there and our value.

 

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