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Author Topic: Nathan Stubblefield Earth battery/Self Generating Induction Coil Replications  (Read 1325091 times)

Offline Pirate88179

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #120 on: November 18, 2007, 06:52:28 AM »
@ akashh:

I think we have shown results thus far that put this beyond pure galvanic reaction.  How far beyond is up to debate.  If it were just galvanic than the closer the electrodes, the better the power which has not been the case for me.  Plus, when it rains, my voltage drops and I get much better as the ground dries out.  If you read in the earlier posts about the old telegraph stations, their "electrodes" were hundreds of miles apart, how would pure galvanic reaction apply to this?

If you look at my video I posted earlier, you can see my electrodes are about 4 feet apart.  I have not tried 5 feet yet but 4 feet was better than 3 feet, etc. Another point to consider, if just galvanic then why would an alignment of n/s on the meridian make any difference at all? (Which it clearly did for me)

Don't think for a moment that I claim to know all of what this is about, I don't.  But, I am gathering information along the way that will help me to decide what it isn't.  Do I think that galvanic reaction plays a part in all of this?  Yes, I do, which is why I purchased the carbon rod.  I did get some smaller voltages off of two copper pipes once they were aligned on the n/s meridian but not as much as I am getting now.  I am not totally sure of this but if you made a regular battery with two copper electrodes I don't think it would have any voltage.  there is so much more here than we know right now.

I like your suggestion of the coil to step up the voltage but, and here is my ignorance showing, will that not cut the amps proportionately as in Ohm's law?  If not, this would be the way to go...also a series hookup of multiple electrodes to add the voltages and the amps is something I intend to explore.  Keep us posted of your efforts once you begin. there are possibly a lot of variables here and we need a lot of people experimenting to make some sense of this.

@ George:

Good luck with your efforts, keep us posted.  I'll try to leave a few volts in the earth for you. (grin)

Bill

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #120 on: November 18, 2007, 06:52:28 AM »

Offline hansvonlieven

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #121 on: November 18, 2007, 10:04:37 AM »
I think we have shown results thus far that put this beyond pure galvanic reaction.  How far beyond is up to debate.  If it were just galvanic than the closer the electrodes, the better the power which has not been the case for me.  Plus, when it rains, my voltage drops and I get much better as the ground dries out.

G'day Bill,

You are absolutely right, galvanic action has little, if anything, to do with it. There are forces here at work that are at present poorly understood. Stubblefield and some others knew this. For some reason they were not allowed to mention these phenomena in their patents. There are at least two patents that allude to it, I will cover this in my paper.

I am in two minds as to how I should proceed from here. This looks like a fairly lengthy inquiry and I don't know if I should post my findings in dribs and drabs as it were or if I should wait until the paper is finished before I post.

Posting in bits and pieces has the advantage of outside input, bits and pieces as they occur is very frustrating for the reader.

I leave it to you guys, whatever you want me to do, you've got it.

Hans von Lieven


Offline FreeEnergy

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #122 on: November 18, 2007, 10:21:20 AM »
it don't matter, post whatever you have now and whatever you post later we can always compare ;)

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #122 on: November 18, 2007, 10:21:20 AM »
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Offline hansvonlieven

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #123 on: November 18, 2007, 10:42:34 AM »
Nathan B. Stubblefield   1860 - 1928



It was many years ago when I first came across Nathan Stubblefield?s patent for an ?Earth Battery?.  This was in the days before the internet,  when looking up patents was a time and money consuming business and all you got was the patent. I cannot remember exactly why I purchased it, the most likely reason being that it was cited in another patent I was researching at the time. I didn?t know who Stubblefield was and what he had done other than acquire a patent.

So I took the patent at face value. It didn?t make sense.

It describes a device which uses a copper coil wound together with an iron coil side by side which is immersed in water. So far so good. The water as an electrolyte would cause the iron and copper to react with each other creating a galvanic element capable of generating electricity. Next he tells us that the copper wire must be insulated! From the iron wire! He also states that insulating the iron wire has no detrimental effect on the operation of the device.

There is no way a galvanic action can take place between insulated wires, no matter what the electrolyte.

And if that is not enough he tells us that one can put a secondary coil over the contraption and extract power from it.

This is impossible. A galvanic cell produces direct current ( DC ). You can wind as many coils as you want around a battery and no current will flow in that coil. It needs to be either an alternating current ( AC  ) or a pulsed DC do induce a current in this coil.

Even at that stage I had a drawer full of patents of unworkable and impossible devices which had been sanctioned by patent examiners and I decided it was one of those and disregarded it.

A few days ago Localjoe brought Stubblefield up in a discussion on earth batteries and I vaguely remembered the patent and my reaction to it.

Years ago, when I discovered that I could retrieve any patent I needed at the touch of a button through the internet I had discarded two filing cabinets full of patents, so I could not look the patent up in my own records. This was fortuitous.

In order to retrieve the patent to refresh my memory I had to do a search on Stubblefield. This for the first time gave me some knowledge about the man.

To my surprise he was not the kind of backyard idiot patenting an impossible device he thought would work based on ignorance of the underlying scientific principles as I had assumed, but a man of considerable achievement and learning.

He was also a close friend of Tesla and a contemporary of Keely.

The clincher came when I read this:
Nathan Stubblefield took out a patent for the earth-battery, except, the patent-office demanded he call it "Earth Battery", Stubblefield wanted to call it "Electro-magnetic Induction Amplifier".  (Source Wikipedia)

This explained a number of things.

I believe what happened is that the USPTO rejected his original application and forced a number of changes. By having to call it a battery he now had to make it look like one in order to get his patent.

This is why there are two contradictory descriptions of the device in the same patent.

He complied with the requests but left the real idea behind the device in place, hence the confusion.

That the device worked, of that there is no doubt.

He ran massive installations of electrical equipment on these batteries as the only power source for years, he operated a whole local telephone system on it. There are photographs of his various devices, I even found a photograph that shows his ?earth batteries?.

So what was he doing and how did the device work?

Stay tuned for the next exciting episode.

Hans von Lieven

Sorry guys, but you wanted it this way  ;D





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Offline tishatang

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #124 on: November 18, 2007, 11:20:06 AM »
Hi all,

This is a subject close to my heart.  I am not in a position now to do any experiments, but I am enclosing a link to a related subject, underground antennas.  This is by Gerry Vassilatos  who wrote about Stubblefield in his book  "Lost Science".

It seems telluric currents are biodynamic.  That is, they respond to our mental attention.  Here is the link:

http://www.borderlands.com/newstuff/research/ground-ant.htm

It is rather long, but a good read into the nature of underground currents and how they respond to our wishes.  Here is a short quote:

                       "OBSERVATION 3
There are other effects one notices, especially when tuning faint stations with ground antennas. It seems that tuned stations actually become stronger in the act of being heard, a bizarre effect requiring fine order readjustments. Indeed, continued reception of faint stations evidence definite auto-magnification effects. Obtained only through the use of analogue (variable capacity) tuning systems, the tuning process seemingly magnifies the strength of any faintly received signal. One may thus begin with a signal "granule", and end with a booming volume. Such entuned signal growth only occurs with continued attentive reception, a remarkable phenomenon in which receivers literally draw and automagnify signals on demand of the listening site. This strange connective "supply-response" function does not occur without human agency however. In absence of the human "recipient", no such amplification occurs, a curiosity which will find numerous skeptics and critics. But try the experiment for yourself.

Tune a weak station and leave the room. The signal fades away. Walk in again and quickly tune the signal. Walk away once more. The signal fades. Once more, tune the signal and walk back from the receiver. With very minor waverings, the signal strength will remain unchanged...until you walk directly before the receiver. Stay this time. Tune the signal and wait. You will literally hear the signal gradually rising in volume. The faint signal will gradually, almost perceptibly, grow in strength for you as you remain in the room. Now tune the signal carefully, rocking the dial to the left or right of center. Each readjustment raises the signal strength, until the volume is strong. Periodic minor adjustments will reveal a remarkable volume magnification, one which can reach enormous and fixed volume levels. This observation takes time and patience. With such patience, one can thus literally obtain a "signal bonfire" from a "signal spark". We have observed a signal increase while attentions are being focussed on the signal, with a subsequent complete fade back to faintness after the recipients have been removed.

Why can you tune such a weak station, periodically making "fine adjustments", and obtain a signal magnification? Tuning a weak signal through a ground antenna, and then observing the manner in which that signal actually "grows" in strength for a human recipient, is a demonstration of radionic significance. The same has been observed when radionic currents are selected through tuning instruments, and allowed to stimulate a biomonitored plant. The results are always the same, plant responses indicating the gradual increase of radionic current strength. Unlike aerial currents, ground signals are more intensely radionic in nature. They actively seek to infuse appropriate bio-organismic "capacities". Ground currents enter the receiver and are there entuned. The receiving circuit projects an infusive and thready auric radiance which floods the listening space until its natural saturation has been reached.

Those who are in the listening space add an additional absorptivity, a capacity to allow a continued projection of auric emanations. This continued projectivity into proximal recipients produces several characteristic attributes. Recipients who possess an innate desire, an emotional response for the signals, produce sudden surges in the reception strength. When attention is strongly focussed on some faint signal, then it will grow. The ground emerging signals will therefore intensify for you and those with you in a room, pouring into the listening space and being thus articulated among human "capacities". As radio signals are loaded with the articulation of human attention, the signal will grow more rapidly. It has recently been observed that the very same signal, when later left unattended, will fade back into the crashing background. Desirous attempts made to relocate and raise the same signal are not unsuccessful. The absence of appropriate numbers in the human recipients will modify the rapidity of signal growth. The humanly guided tuning process which engages such signals actually entunes the recipients in a radionic manner.

The refinement and entunement of such signals are very obviously a radionic phenomenon of the deepest significance. Entuned magnification effects are therefore radionic entunement effects, the magnification of human articulations by human recipients. Neither electrical nor radio currents possess the articulate nature capable of exhibiting such a detailed biodynamic function. We have previously demonstrated this phenomenon with biomonitored plants, an effect which experimenters may easily reproduce. The implications of this strange effect are enormous for the theoretician. They compel the examination of every notion of radiosignal causality. The only researcher who has treated this effect is Eric Dollard, whose excellent work describes "energy reciprocation" between Tesla impulse transmitters and receivers.

The fact that signals may be drawn from ground on human demand, and automagnified by human presence, should provoke heated debate. How can one explain the veritable control of a distant transmitter by a small receiver? In a biodynamic sense, we are not required to address distant transmitters, since ground currents automagnify with regularity. The additional energy which feeds radionically entuned and capacity-demanded ground signals is sourced within the great subterranean depths."

*********

I think Stubblefield had a strong mental connection with these forces.  I suggest experimenters be patient and leave their projects buried over a longer period of time and mentally suggest the voltages grow to a more usable level.  Nothing to lose by using some extra will power.

It might be worth trying a variable capacitor out of an old radio in some sort of tank circuit to fine tune the AC component of the output?  That would be similar to the experiments within the referenced article.

Hope this helps,
Tishatang



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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #124 on: November 18, 2007, 11:20:06 AM »
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Offline akashh

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #125 on: November 18, 2007, 12:27:58 PM »
@hans:  Thanks for the insights into the Stubble field patent.  Please do keep you posts coming since this seems to be a 'hot' topic.  Let's keep up the energy. 

In the stubblefield coil, you are right that the insulated copper doesn't make sense.  And more so when he states that the battery is electrolytically activated with water - what effect would that have other than shorting out the iron coil?  It would seem that the iron coil closely follows the copper one to take maximum flux from it - would that then interact with the central bolt? 

Offline Localjoe

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #126 on: November 18, 2007, 06:18:30 PM »
Double post see below

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #126 on: November 18, 2007, 06:18:30 PM »
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Offline Localjoe

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #127 on: November 18, 2007, 06:18:37 PM »
@Tisha Tang Um would that have anything to do with our bodies being good radiation absorbers since theres a lot of water in us?   And i have read up on the geomancy topic, i just feel it would distract this frourm, from its inital goal untlil the later stages of testing with a working device  when were hunting in different areas for current density. But for now most of us are using rods and maybe just endeavoring with the transformer avenue.(Some earth battery patents show plates directly connected to small transformers and or electromagnetic induction coils.

 @ Hans V, thanks for the input, I really respect your input and your generation talking the time to help our up and coming one.  Most anything I have found on the stubblefield cell shows people stopping at the bimetal winding, now either they didn't look at the patent close enough and wind the secondary around it like it says or some of the info is dissinfo out there because it would not seem to be anything more than a weird thermocouple unless the power came off that secondary coil. The steel and copper wraps under  i think keep some kinda pulse train going from the steel getting mildly magnetized and the copper inducting that flux and then i dunno from there, but there has to be some effect so as the copper transfers its flux back to the steel wire and keeps cycling.  So by having two bimetals such as these, the copper and steel interacting, it  must be creating a rotating magnetic field there fore the secondary could provide polarized ac or pulsed dc , or as the patents says word for word " Secondary Current" .  This is the logic structure im working from when i build the stubblefiled plug.  I've been real busy doing computer work around town so i haven't posted any results lately but i have a spreadsheet here with plenty of fields that im going to put the data in so whatever you want to post is fine im just going through all the pages in the forum organizing the data so we can compare. Earlier in the thread Hans, I posted a basic measurement request from the experiments and whatever folks have the equipment to provide readings for is appreciated.   ;D

Offline hansvonlieven

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #128 on: November 18, 2007, 06:48:16 PM »
G'day localjoe and all,

I know the idea has been bandied around that the Stubblefield coil is a sort of thermocouple. This cannot be with these specifications. In a thermocouple the dissimilar metals have to be in metallic contact with each other, something the patent states explicitly to avoid!

Hans von Lieven

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #128 on: November 18, 2007, 06:48:16 PM »
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Offline Pirate88179

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #129 on: November 18, 2007, 07:33:58 PM »
Hello all:

Here are some quick pictures.  The "close-ups" I attemped in the video did not work out so well. I shot it using the video mode on my digital still camera, not the best set-up.  the first should be a picture of the magnesium fire starter block in the ground on the south end.  The next is the carbon rod at the north.  The third is the led/capacitor setup.  These should be more clear than the video.

@Hans:

Yes, by all means, publish your info as you write it/obtain it.  This will give us all more to think about and experiment with while you are continuing to research.  I very much look forward to reading your input.

Right now, I am trying to learn more about coils and their operation and functions.  A point I see cropping up again and again is the "priming the pump" technique of inputting some energy into the earth which attract/produces/releases a lot more energy.

@Stefan:

I put in a plug for this website on my youtube video.  I didn't think you would mind.

Bill

Offline Localjoe

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #130 on: November 18, 2007, 08:27:32 PM »
Hans your right about the thermocouple i wasen't thinking clearly but i did read that one end of each steel and copper should be exposed in the ground ... I couldnt find what it said to do with the other two ends on top ... now if we connected those ends on top to the plates or rods were using .. take bill's example with the magnesium and the carbon.  The initial voltage induced by the rods goes through the coil then the two ends on the bottom in the earth might complete the circuit making an electromagnet. This could be way off but getting the results were getting now with just simple things and realizing that it is polarized ac or pulsed dc then feeding that into this bimetal coil should make a rotating magnetic feild if the ends in the earth are shorted.  Now after realizing i can run a battery in series with the ground rods we've been using and still get the power out on the other side it would be safe to say that two metals such as iron and copper  can form a link or path in the ground.  I feel that once we understand how the rotating magnetic feild is created in the primary bimetal coil it will be a little more obvious how this plug works and should be easier to understand.   

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #130 on: November 18, 2007, 08:27:32 PM »
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Offline hansvonlieven

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #131 on: November 18, 2007, 09:26:19 PM »
Stubblefield continued:

Before we analyse Stubblefield?s device we must digress here for a moment, for any analysis would not be complete unless we looked at the precursor of the idea.

In 1875 James Chapman Bryan patented an Earth battery which is similar in concept to Stubblefield?s. It is certain that Stubblefield was aware of the patent since he had to list it as ?prior art? in his patent application.

Modern patents list all prior art that had been quoted, on the old patents this is not the case. Nevertheless the requirement to disclose prior art was a requirement then as it is now.

What is here of immense interest to me is that Bryan was a resident of Philadelphia when he applied for his patent. It is certain that Bryan was aware of Keely?s work. I doubt that there would have been any person that did nor know about Keely in Philadelphia in 1875, during these years Keely was big news and his activities were regularly reported.

There are any number of patents on earth batteries, all relying on a galvanic action. Only two of these patents are different in character. Bryan?s and Stubblefield?s.

So what are these differences?

In the other patents two dissimilar metals were buried in the ground which were connected to insulated wires. The moisture in the ground acts as an electrolyte and a direct current develops between the different metals. I will not explain here how galvanic action works, I assume that the readers here in the forum are familiar with it.

The important part is that the resultant current is DC !

DC when connected to a coil generates a magnetic field. THIS FIELD IS STATIC !

As long as the current flows the field exists, when the current is withdrawn the field collapses. We call this an electromagnet.

All other patents accept this as given, Bryan?s and Stubblefield?s DO NOT !


(http://www.keelytech.com/overunity/earthbatteries.gif)


The obvious difference between these devices and the standard approach is that here we have SECONDARY COILS !

Both Bryan and Stubblefield are clearly expecting an oscillating field of some sort that energises these secondary coils. So where are these oscillations coming from? Not from any galvanic action, that is certain.

To analyse this we must have a look next at Keely and Leedskalnin.

This will be discussed in the next exciting chapter  :D

Hans von Lieven


EDIT Sorry guys, forgot to attach Bryan's patent. Here it is:

Offline Localjoe

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #132 on: November 18, 2007, 10:37:49 PM »
Hans i don't know if you saw it but i took a freq reading and i posted results some depths were 40 hz some were 60. How would DC give a freq reading? Thats what brought me to the conclusion that using the rods we have as the power source would create a rotating magnetic field as opposed to a static dc one.  Now on the topic of the secondary copper coil wound around the whole plug i know there were reports of it having dc output but his patent and other places refer to the output of this cell as secondary current. We do know that some power tools will run off dc and other assorted ac items so maybe somebody got confused along the lines and called it dc when in essence it was polarized ac or pulsed dc.  I could be wrong but after reading all the postings here on this forum and evaluating some of the likeness and differences this conclusion seems logical.
                                                           

Offline hansvonlieven

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #133 on: November 18, 2007, 10:44:52 PM »
Exactly my point Joe,

If the device was dependent on pure galvanic action there should be no oscillations. There aren't any in a galvanic battery. So where are they coming from? This is what we are trying to determine.

Hans von Lieven

Offline Localjoe

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Re: Earth battery expermients
« Reply #134 on: November 18, 2007, 11:50:54 PM »
@Bill I just saw your video. Awesome man , the same thing happened when i measured amperage, try taking a resistor inline and the measure it meaning positive to resistor then + probe to other side of resistor and - probe to - ground electrode i think that will give you a more stable current measurement.  Again great work, folks are really starting to take an interest. ;D
                                                                                           Joe     

 

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