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Author Topic: Free Energy Forever?  (Read 5166 times)

Offline decalibrated

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Free Energy Forever?
« on: January 03, 2011, 04:19:35 AM »
Achievable free energy

My idea, I am sharing with you all
In hopes that someone can make use of it

My Layman's theory about how energy can be produced by harnessing
the tide around the world, into a planetary energy grid

of course, I could be completely wrong + an idiot
the way I see it.. better than doing Nothing : D


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Free Energy Forever?
« on: January 03, 2011, 04:19:35 AM »

Offline quantumtangles

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Re: Free Energy Forever?
« Reply #1 on: May 08, 2011, 11:07:37 PM »
If by over-unity we mean obtaining greater energy output than input from isolated or closed systems, I do not think this is possible.

Isolated systems do not allow mass or energy to pass through the system boundaries. It follows that obtaining over-unity from an isolated system must be impossible because if we ever got any energy at all from the system, we would know for sure that it was not an isolated system in the first place.

Turning to closed systems. They allow energy to pass in and out of the system boundaries, but not mass. I do not think closed systems will ever allow us to get more energy output than input. That would be akin to having $100 dollars to spend, but claiming you had $200 dollars to spend. Nothing may stop you making the claim, but as a matter of fact it would not be true.

More specifically, if the total energy in a closed system is x, you can never obtain x+1 energy from a closed system because without mass being allowed to enter and leave the system boundary, the system is tantamount to a black box which can never give more output than there was initial input.

Inefficiencies (arising for example from friction and heat loss) will mean the output will be much less than the initial energy in the black box.

So closed systems cannot lead to 'over-unity' for that reason.

Open systems are a different 'matter'. They allow both mass and energy to pass in and out of the system boundaries. Nothing in the laws of thermodynamics prohibits a system providing more energy output than internal energy input (provided there is external energy input from the environment).

So if external energy provides an energy surplus, open systems can yield more energy than that consumed internally in keeping the system going, but this can only happen because mass can move in and out of the system boundaries.

This raises the interesting question: Can energy be converted from one form to another in the absence of mass?

In any event, open systems such as hydroelectric turbines and wind turbines generate useful electricity (because external energy can enter the system from the environment and mass can flow in and out of the system boundaries.

This allows to us get more energy out of the system than the initial internal energy of the system.

The key is that external energy and mass could flow in and out of the system.

If this is what is meant by overunity, then we know it is possible because such machines work. But if by over-unity we mean that isolated or closed systems can output more energy than their initial internal energy, I respectfully suggest this is incorrect.